"You must still feel guilty or you would not be trying to defend your position/feelings from some scripture book that was written by man for man."
Or perhaps he's in part simply showing why so MANY others should feel guilty for exploiting that book to justify their OWN personal disgust and intelerance.
is it natural as nature intended? You must still feel guilty or you would not be trying to defend your position/feelings from some scripture book that was written by man for man.
@HerosComment Intention requires an intender I.E. a conscious entity, demonstration of which is needed before appeals to nature's intention can be justifiably made.
Regarding the defence of homosexuality, it is more the countering of arguments against homosexuality that is relevant. It is the job of the "condemner" to demonstrate guilt, not the condemned to disprove it.
LGBT people are mistreated due to negative views about them so it is unsurprising they might want to refute those views.
Definitely like this one, very true and an eye opener!! People that read the bible are so quick to judge, but the fact is most have no clue what it really reads. Remember it was written 183883838838 years ago and mainly written for that time.
No gays are going to heaven! You straight people need to stop over poulating! By the way, you straights were the ones to bring gay people in the world so shut up already dammit!
@biruss my apologies for taking so long to respond, i looked for the post you responded to but can't seem to find it. But let me just post off the top of my head and see if I am close. Romans 26-28 clearly describes homosexuality and the result of it between the person and God. Look i didnt Write the bible, i can't edit it to make it say what I want it to say. Nor can you or anyone else. the fact of the matter is homosexuality is sin, so is adultery and lying.
. those who keep doing those things won't inherit God's kingdom, not my rules. all Christians are supposed to do is tell you about it. It's up to you or whoever to take that information and act upon it. After it leaves our hands it is out of our control and its up to you. If people want to continually try to distort the Word of God to make what ever sin they are in acceptable, then its your problem. Add enough perfume to a pile of dung and eventually it will smell good.
@superman1273 In 1 Corinthians 11:14-15 Paul asserts that gender-appropriate hair lengths can be determined by looking at nature, about which he is clearly wrong. Male hair grows just as long as female hair, which can be seen from Sikh men for instance. His alleged suggestion that homosexuality is wrong because it is against nature therefore doesn't hold much weight.
Romans 1 appears to be a criticism of paganism anyway, rather than homosexuality.
Doth not even nature itself - The word nature (φύσις phusis) denotes evidently that sense of propriety which all men have, and which is expressed in any prevailing or universal custom. That which is universal we say is according to nature. It is such as is demanded by the natural sense of fitness among people.
So in essence Paul was saying that the general order and custom of the people was for women to have long hair and men short.
@superman1273 You simply seem to be slapping on an interpretation to make the bible say what you want. If something were universal (gender-specific hair length), there would be no need for Paul to even mention it in such a way.
Human order and custom is pretty much by definition an artificial augmentation/modification of nature and so anything but natural.
I aim to refute that Romans is a divine condemnation of homosexuality in multiple ways, which won't fit in to 500 characters.
@Jamieishere1 Really, so i am now making the bible say what i want it to say lol. Ok Though Paul was converted, Paul preached from a Jewish understanding which did give regulations on hair length as Paul was clearly a Jew, and discussed it accordingly. And The Apostles preached to the Romans about their sins, amongst them was definitely homosexuality, Romans 1:26-27, is clear and apparently you are the one trying, unsuccessfully, to make the bible say what you want it to.
@Jamieishere1 Instead of assuming that I am saying something and making your claim, read it more closely, I gave you references. I will try to slow down a little so you can keep up.
@Jamieishere1 Also if your trying to prove your argument by saying Paul was wrong, I would try different means. As for romans 1 the word nature and natural come from 2 different words, the first means instinctive and the other is the same as the 1 Corinthians 11, though there are several different meanings behind the word. You really need to study Greek to understand what I am talking about. . one word means a of things. I haven't the time or space to do that with you.
@blessedchild2 I'm not saying it's untrue but man did write the bible. I mean you get everything from a book written by man himself so how do you know that some things talked about is right? And how do you know that there isn't things in there that are forged and were never told to the people who wrote it. If different people wrote the bible how did it all come together? I believe in god and I am gay
i feel sorry for u because inside u want to fight christianity to make urself feel better chrisitiany is not the only religion that hates homosexuality. we do not hate u as a person we hate the act. we have all sinned and many of us will go to hell including good christians but that does not justify the gay act. homosexual is also mentioned in the new testament. The act of sex by gays was seen as 'disgusting' to God. i did not write the bible please take that up with God, he is still ur father.
@idaman12345 my heart breaks for u my lost brother the devil has u in his tight grip. may God in heaven have mercy on u. father in heaven please have pity on my brother he has lost his way and the devil has captured him father please release him from the stronghold of the devil to your glory in jesus name i pray amen.
@idaman12345 i will continue to pray. i want u to rest assured that in whatever trouble u r in for the rest of ur life u will be in my prayers. one day u will feel the comfort of God and u will remember this. u will see.
@blessedchild2 Well, you probably don't follow all the other sayings in the bible including all the famous odd ones given as examples above such as no growing two crops in one field (as just an example), so why follow the homophobic one? Yes, I see you may benefit having a book to refer your morals to but aren't there some things in it that just don't make sense? I mean you use your reasoning to overcome the rather strange ones/ignore them yet continue to say that homosexuality is 'wrong'...
@dillondownie christians follow the new testament. homosex is in both the old which is the foundation of our faith and the new which is the clarification. you cannot talk ur way into my head. i care about everyone but i dont have to accept their way of life. why should i accept ur beliefs when u cannot accept mine. u have a long way to go if u think that the world will truly accept ur life style. people may pretend to but in their homes they r praying that such things dont come to their families
@blessedchild2 you could accept it for what it is for it has little to do with you for one, and what I was wondering is why you jump on the anti-gay bandwagon that other Christians join without going all out with all the other 'immoralities' going on today, why choose that over say... not wearing polyesters as it says in Leviticus ''You shall not.. wear a garment upon you of two kinds of material mixed together.” this is unless you aren't wearing anything as such which i doubt.
@dillondownie u must live a painful pathetic life. i do not wish to be like you. i hate the act u do in the dead of night and now in the light of day. i find the whole process disgusting and smelly considering where u put it. i feel sorry for u and for mankind. real christians will never accept it just like the other major religions and culture will not no amount of talking will change that. May God save of us all. u can tell me God does not exist. HE EXISTS TO ME.
@blessedchild2 Well I love how you seem to hate me for being a hetrosexual now. what are you, asexual? oh wait did you think I was gay? That was very arrogant of you to think that only gay people are against the intolerance they have put towards them. And I wont say that god doesn't exist, I just find it difficult to believe that he would have such foolish followers like you, who pick and choose what to believe and discard the rest including common sense and rationality.
@blessedchild2 There is no "gay act". There is love and relationships and sex, neither of which contain any "acts" which are unique to gay people. The video poster is "fighting" Christianity not to make themselves feel better but to counter claims made to justify mistreatment (via legislation or otherwise) of LGBT people.
There are religions that don't hate homosexuality though it's irrelevant what religions or people think anyway. What's relevant are their justifications.
Wow! This is an awesome video. This young man needs to continue to educate. Shed some light ...... If you know it, speak up loudly and clearly ... as you have done. Kudos!
@RetroVintageChic86 When the order wasn't His but the Chruch's. God created homosexuals. Why would anyone want to choose a life in which they could even be senteced to death in some places? People like Ellen have done a lot more for this world, expressing unconditional love to people who arn't even from their country. Last year Ellen paid for a project that brought water supply to an entire village near Calcutta. Think of the many more Ellens we'd have if there was no hatred in this world.
Actually, he did say our Lord had not advised him in at least one situation regarding widows and the unmarried in 1 Cor. 7:20 admitting he was merely rendering his OWN judgement on the situation.
"Also, the word arsenokoites is used again in 1 tim 1:10. Paul here, is using the same word, meaning the same thing...homosexuals."
A scarcely used term combining the words "man" and "bed" doesn't neccessarily mean a sexual setting. it's like saying the word...
And your last greek word, arsenokoites.You are twisting it drastically."
This is the accusation of many gay Christian opponents when confronted by alternate views and interpetations. "The word means a male engaging in sexual acts with another male."
It's Paul's OWN fusion of the Greek terms "man" and "bed." That's the only thing certain. It's had MANY definitions throughout the melenia. Martin Luther defined it as a matturbator. ONLY Paul could know with any certainty how he meant it.
You are living in fantasy land, just another lame attempt to twist the words of the Bible around to justify your sinful lifestyle. You may have convinced yourself and other gays but you haven't changed the true word of God. Obviously you have gone too far for mortal people to change your mind, but God still loves you and He still means what he says in the Bible, Lord please have mercy on your soul.
@harmonycostal Why is it that you listen to preists in churches so readily but listening to another mortal is plain unforgivable by you? Priests are human too. Nobody said their interpretation of the bible was the right one. Its kind of like Shakespear. The meaning's would have completely different meanings now as compared to then. The use of language changes from time to time. Just like 50 years ago pussy would have meant cat but now it means something different.
@IndiaJacob I'm not taking a priest word for it, it's written plain and simple in the Bible and the Bible has not changed and never will, so your theory about words meaning different things now than they used too, well the Bible still means the same thing that it did 2000 years ago. If you read what it says about homosexuals in the Bible and you get that it means something different than what it actually says, then you are fooling no one but yourself.
@harmonycostal then what do you say about the bible telling you to beat you disobedient children, or stone your 'impure' wife to death?? How come we don't take these meanings to the literal sense? Think about that and don't let me know because i'm completely tired and worn out from debating this topic. The very reason i came here was because it was supposed to be made easy but obviously it isn't for many naive, conservative bigots.
@IndiaJacob I'm not trying to offend you or pick on you, just standing up for what the bible says, please read the bible searching for the truth and don't look for errors in it, cause there aren't any, don't try and mix up other verses to discredit the ones you don't want to live by and as far as stoning your wife or beating your children, i think you already know the answers. God Bless you, and unless you want to further this discussion (not a debate) I'm done and will leave you alone.
@harmonycostal "and don't look for errors in it, cause there aren't any"
You would almost have to be retarded to not question the accuracy of a politically motivated translation put forth by a 300 year old English monarch. The existence of multiple translations with multiple "liberties by the translators" proves this fact. In this age of information your deliberate ignorance is inexcusable.
@clubindiana4 word :D BTW. Isn't it weird that i'm only seventeen and i still have arguments good enough to make a 54 year old think twice? Such is the stupidity of conservative jerks.
@clubindiana4 your reply makes no sense at all, it's funny how you people who are out to try and prove a point use all this fancy talk to prove yourselves, and no i didn't understand what you said and i don't think you did either, you just heard it from another of your gay buddies. If you had been auditioning as a play write for a Shakespeare scene, your replay might have been useful, otherwise your lack of knowledge which i guess would be "deliberate ignorance" is inexcusable.
@harmonycostal "fancy talk to prove yourselves"........do you mean the use of factual information when you say "fancy talk"? Pleading ignorance only works with your quasi-christian brethren.
@clubindiana4 The only true statement that you guys have made in this entire discussion is when the retard in the video says "gays are going to hell". And that is so true, because if you turn your life over to the Lord and repent you are not gay anymore, you have been delivered, but if you think that you can be saved and still be gay, then you are just gay and "gays are going to hell" aint that what he said at the start of video? Yep I think it was.
@harmonycostal Thats nice....having trouble staying on point? One more time....when you say "fancy talk to prove yourselves" are you referring to the use of factual information?
"The only true statement that you guys have made in this entire discussion is when the retard in the video says "gays are going to hell". "
I believe when anyone says such a thing with conviction, much UNlike the individual in the vid, that person is at LEAST as much in need of forgiveness as the non-Christian, agnostic or athiest for second guessing our Lord on matters of ultimate judgement.
Did pretend Jesus tell you that gays are going to pretend hell? Get serious you twat.....there is no hell.......if there were we would have already opened a U.S. Embassy there and utilized thye unlimited energy potential of the eternal fire!
Can you imagine how many miles per gallon my SUV would get with just a few drops of HELL FIRE?
the only thing required to enjoy intimacy with another person is to be HUMAN...human nature is much more complex and variable and subject to circumstances than absolute notions about orientation can cover...no str8 dude is absolutely str8 and no gay dude is absolutely gay..only gay propaganda deals in absolutes,trying to pigeonhole and restrict and confine dudes,quarantine us, into one unbearably tight pickle jar..it's intellectually dishonest and intellectually arrogant bullshit...go ur own way
let's cut to the chase here...is homosexuality born or made?..is heterosexuality born invincible or can it be altered by life experiences?..if gay is ok,then why can't it be a free choice like everything else is a choice?..i am bi because i like it,the male and female genders are equally attractive to me,just for different reasons...i was introduced to gay intimacy when i was 9 by my 19 yo neighbor dude...i was introduced to str8 sex when i was 6 by my late teen baby sitters...it's just life
Christians harp on homosexuality because it is now so apparent that it is not really all that evil. No one can choose who they fall in love with. Deep down, we all know that. But, because the argument advocating gay rights is always more logical and researched than the Christians' anti-homosexuality contention, they cling to those few passages for dear life, desregarding a ton of other rules and regulations listed in the Bible.
"Christians believe homosexuality is a sin and that's their right, deal with it. If you don't like it, find a religion that advocates homosexuality."
It is the right of those Christians who believe so just as it is for those Christians who do not.
@KnightOwl2006 If you followed the scripture exactly as it was written then you can't eat shellfish, you can stone your daughter if she ever was unfaithful to her husband, you can beat your disobedient children to death, etc etc. Explain to me why the line 'when a man lies with another man, it is an abomination' is taken in the literal sense and not the aforementioned? When people can't understand something they project hatred towards it. Eg. I hate Chemistry because i don't understand it.
@IndiaJacob Shellfish ARE a great health risk. Following this Levitical rule only brings blessing. Unfaithfulness and disobedience AREN'T desirable, and they don't bring blessing. Why would one think to hide behind them?
@MorganMarvinson There is a huge difference between something being a helath risk and something being a sin. If any health risk should be a sin it should be smoking but that's a completely different matter. I'm not hiding behind unfaithfullness and disobedience or anything for that matter. I'm following what i think can be a progressive force in this world. You on the other hand are hiding behind prejudice and bigotry, which aren't desireble not only by Christians but humanity itself.
@IndiaJacob "I'm not hiding behind unfaithfullness and disobedience or anything for that matter." Your denial does not square with your post. Just because you follow "a progressive force" to not kill someone for eating shellfish, being unfaithful to husband or being disobedient to parents, doesn't make these things good, nor does it make good what God has called an abomination. You ARE indeed hiding. I am sorry you feel so compelled.
@MorganMarvinson So what your saying is that i should allow people to commit sucide for eating shellfish, be murdered for being unfaithful to their husband or being disobedient to parents? I'm not in denial. Trust me i'm not. I was in denial for a long time in my life untill i realized there was nothing to deny. You're the one denying the fact that there is nothing wrong with being gay because you're too scared to even look at something another way, a way the majority doesn't look at it as.
@IndiaJacob You aren't listening. No no one is talking about suicide or murder. Yet God condemns shellfish, unfaithfulness, disobdience--and, yes, homosexuality. Regarding denial: the first step toward recovery is to get out of denial, for God does not encourage homosexuality. It has many perils for the individual and for society at large. I am sorry that you are caught up in it, but I cannot help you over the Internet. There are people who can help you if you seek them out.
@MorganMarvinson First i don't need help. HA. Second this discussion or debate stops here because lets face it neither of us our going to change our views. If there is one thing i've learnt from all my disussions over the internet, it's that you (as in 'you' in general) can't change peoples ideologies over it. I'm just going to have to accept the fact that there are different opinions out there and i'll have to lve with that. Hope you do the same . Peace out.
"... you are hiding behind prejudice and bigotry ..." What did you find in my post to say that I am hiding? My stating that shellfish aren't healthy? My stating that unfaithfulness and disobedience aren't desireable and that they do not bring a blessing?
@MorganMarvinson Its not what's in your post but rather what your post symbolises. Prejudice because you are only looking at something from one angle. I have looked at this matter from all angles and i'm figting for what i think is right. BTW how can you say somehing that is unhealthy can be considered as a sin. If you can look at the verse "eating shellfish is an abomnation" as "eating shellfish is unhealthy(not a sin)" then you are interpretting the word abomination in a diff. way aren't you?
@MorganMarvinson Bullshit.......in our current state of overpopulation childbirth is even less necessary than shellfish. Riding in a car is HARDLY a necessary risk.......after all....Jesus supposedly walked, didn't he?
@clubindiana4 "Bullshit ..." Apparently you live where you are required to walk around the droppings of cattle and can get everywhere you need to go on foot. I live in America; it is different here.
Overpopulation is one thing; having NO human childbirth would eventually mean the end of the race. Shellfish are totally optional.
We both know this isn't about childbirth, riding in a car, or the advisability of eating the trash-collectors of the sea. Obviously you really don't want to hear this.
You know what sucks! Is that he only used parts of verses for the non gay side. Read it all buddy it's more logical to weigh evidence when it's ALL there.
Listen, just because someone can use the Bible in a multitude of different arguments and support opposing sides of a debate does not give you the right to denounce someone else's intelligence or make a gross generalization stating that the other side is "closed-minded" and "didn't learn what they're talking about." There is SO MUCH MORE to the Bible than what is just written. There has to be historical context and such, and this video did a good job of that. Just listen to what he says.. please?
Christ advocated heterosexual marriage yet such in and of itself is no prohibition of same gender unions. Those who use this advocacy to claim such are probably presuming too much on Christ's behalf.
I don't think people like you realize how dumb you sound.
againn, *sigh*
apparently, well, obviously, no gay has ever heard of Jewish tribal laws...or Jesus...or the New Testament...or, Old Testament vs New Testament...or, Jesus' teachings...or, what exactly CHRISTIANITY IS. *sigh*
The worst part is you people are so incredibly closed-minded and biased that you would operate confirmation-bias and completely ignore any, even secular, lesson on the Bible, etc.
Im a man, I became a born again believer then I met the man I now live with. I've never felt loved so much because of this guy. Sure we have made love tenderly now and again. There is more to life than sex and we have a loving relationship. Everyone who knows us has seen this and have commented on how happy we are, even the guys who use to laugh at gays have seen the difference and respect me. I haven't changed my character by being with a man. I've still got a soft heart and do my best. Paul
@7JesusChristIsLord7 The entire bible is written with metaphores and symbolical meanings. What he meant was a bond between two people who love and care for each other. How can any type of productive love be wrong? Can you just imagine the amount of peace in the world had you haters not been so hateful? Seriously you are SO incredibly close-minded, and you will NEVER think to actually LEARN about what you're talking about.
No matter how you feel unless you feel that equal rights is wrong you can say nothing about same sex couples wedding and if you have something against equal rights well maybe you should move. END OF STORY:))
2) After all my bible does say its alright to stone and kill people if its for god although I don’t because its against the law and the law is based on the constitution but wait the constitution says that everyone should have equal right whether they believe in the bible or not so shouldn’t it be ILLIGAL TO FORBID them the right to wed. YES.
I’m just really tired of hearing I’m a Christian (aka a little bitch that cant think for myself) and my bible (book of god even though god didn’t write it) says that what you are doing in your private life is wrong even though it also says its non of my business and I’m sinning by judging you and taking away your rights
@BootleggingGhost Can you think for yourself? Do you realize the laws of the OT were given to the Jews by God, the chosen people, and then (many of) those laws almost completely disregarded by Jesus creating the radical sect of Judaism (Christianity)? Did you know that's why He was (ultimately) crucified? Oh wait, OR did you even know that Jesus was crucified in the first place? Wait, did you even know Judaism and Christianity were inter-related? Wait, no, you didn't? Wow.
No, no, no... you are wrong! Just to mention one fallacy: Thieves are bad to the eyes of the good guys only because thieves get together with other thieves and they see each other as equal. A thief understands the reason why another thief is that way and encourage each other to do more bad things! Just like gay people... "who, knowing the ordinance of God, that they that practise such things are worthy of death(sin), not only do the same, but also consent with them that practise them." Rm1.32
... "who, knowing the ordinance of God, that they that practise such things are worthy of death(sin), not only do the same, but also consent with them that practise them." Rm1.32."
Good point,
The rest of the vid however shows VERY well how scripture has been misunderstood and misinterpeted. These discrepancies have been left to stand unaddressed for SO long that too many can view them ONLY as opposition to homosexuality when whey may very well NOT be so.
@gugglevideos Being a thief hurts someone in the long run. Stealing is in and of itself an act against someone else that could hurt someone intentionally. Thieving, murder, and rape are not the same as homosexuality because no one gets hurt. It may infringe on what you believe, but at the end of the day you go home, alive, unharmed, and with all your possessions intact. In other words, this is a bad analogy. Homosexuality does not hurt anyone.
In that case, let's accept beastiality and say it's O.K., cuz it doesn't hurt anyone. Or necrophilia, it doesn't hurt anyone either? Why do you choose to accept ones, but te others? Sounds like a hypocricy.
To the Guy in the video. About Homosexuality as a sin also says in the New Testament. Besides, gay perverts cannot produce kids, cuz that's not the way God created people for.
@LUK77ACH Well, my argument was that acts like murder, rape, and theft inflict harm. Bestiality and necrophilia do inflict harm. Its one person doing something without the consent of another. You are making the same argument that my original comment talks about. A bad analogy.
YOU brought up bestiality and necrophilia, not me. And then YOU said that I accept those things. But I don't. That was an assumption on your part. Why don't you try again? No assumptions this time.
@Elementsorcerer4 Disagreed. Why? Cuz it oesn't inflict harm to none of the victims. Some beasts like having sex with humans, and the dead people, how can you harm them? Or, was it your joke? It doesn't make sence. One person doing is only in necrophilia, in bestiality, sometimes beasts included, too. So, no rush in making descisions.
@LUK77ACH But animals do not give consent, therefore it is one person acting upon an impulse knowing full well that it could cause harm. Very much like rape. There are laws in place for such things. By the way, do you know from experience that some animals like having sex with humans? Please tell me how anyone can possibly know that, at all? Talk about not making sense. And as for the other thing, if your mother died and someone had sex with her body would you NOT consider yourself a victim?!
@Elementsorcerer4 Rape is different. Dead person cannot feel hurt. And the one that is acting upon dead doing that knowing that it will not hurt, you are such a bagger. There are laws in place against homosexuality and always have been. Answere me, can two women, or two men make children? I talk from seeing things, but you now from screwing each other.))) Anyone can possibly know seeing animal poping up on those women happily. No, I would not consider myself, but her a a victim, Common sence.
@LUK77ACH You know, I really wonder about the intelligence of people who bring up the children argument. Guess what, homosexuals know they can't make children. Its a bad argument, just like your analogy. You have some very strange ideas. Thats why I called you the TROLL. Anyone who thinks like this needs to take a look around and realize that everything is not so black and white. If this is how you really think you are making any kind of sense, then I feel sorry for you.
@Elementsorcerer4 Everyone who calls black is white has wierd perceptions. TROLL is you and it is obviouse. In my country gays are banned and is and always were queers. And I was not talking only about kids, but animals and dead, but you keep switching the subject. And the fact you cannot make kids shows that this is the way God created people. And as of you, I'd be sorry for yourself, cuz you, not me going to hell. And stop bringing your sexlife into social life. That's so wrong, that's so gay
@LUK77ACH I am done with this conversation. Respond if you wish, but I refuse to continue if you are going to keep accusing me of beliefs that are not my own. Especially if you are going to resort to name calling because your argument is lacking basic logic.
in the last verse it mentions fornicators and many people believe that is fine , so....just because people think its fine it means its ok to fornicate? I don t get the poiint
"The first dissuasion was about old testament law, the new covenant didn't apply back then so it didn't come up."
Actually it is a discussion about what the Bible as a whole says about homosexuality. And the best place to begin in any book is usually at or at least near the beginning. :) "I also love how the supporters of gay rights are trying to flame his argument. Calm down."
VERY good advice for Christians on BOTH sides of this issue to just take a step back now and then.
You guys are stupid. The first dissuasion was about old testament law, the new covenant didn't apply back then so it didn't come up.
I also love how the supporters of gay rights are trying to flame his argument. Calm down.
To make this simple, be who you are. Gay or straight you are what you are, if others don't like it they aren't worth your tine anyways and your probably better off in different company anyways.
"We live under the new covenant. That is why we do not sacrifice animals to God anymore, Christ became the sacrifice for us,..."
So a farmer who plants two different seeds in his field must pray to Christ for forgiveness since he violates Lev. 19:19? Must a woman do the same if she grabs her husban's attacker by the groin since she violates Deuteronomy 25:11-12? Such laws make up much of the reason Christians DO live under a NEW Covenant.
Might wanna educate yourself a little bit on the old covenant law in Scripture before you make yourself look like a fool like you already have. We live under the new covenant. That is why we do not sacrifice animals to God anymore, Christ became the sacrifice for us, might wanna study Biblical Theology a little buddy!
this is so ignorant and completely stupid... Paul or not... the bible in its ENTIRETY is INSPIRED of GOD. I have no problem with putting homosexual people with thieves or any other willing sinners. Do I hate you? No. I surely don't hate thieves as people, I hate the act of stealing. Do i associate with no? A DOUBLE NO. I associate with whose who don't try to lower God's standard for their own personal agenda. its disgusting really.
"I have no problem with putting homosexual people with thieves or any other willing sinners."
Just as many have no problem putting Christians with those like Jim Jones or David Koresh. Neither is right.
"I associate with whose who don't try to lower God's standard for their own personal agenda. its disgusting really."
The question is wheather gay Ghristian advocates are "lowering God's standard" or if many gay opponents are subjectively making their OWN disgust part of that standard.
AJH, You're willfully confusing innate characteristics like homosexuality with chosen criminal behavior, which is a dishonest & ignorant tactic, but intellectually limited people like yourself are wont to take that route when you fail to produce any rational argument to justify anti-minority prejudice. You lack the ability to comprehend that God's standard is far beyond your ken. He is not a bigot, just because you choose to be.
Dallas offers his take and and that of others on Old and New Testament passages in reference to homosexuality. In the end, the individual Christian must decide the answer to the question: "What Would Jesus Do?"
To the reader: The arguments presented here are not new and have been thoroughly dissected and refuted by Dr. James R. White, especially in regards to the Greek words (as Josh11185 attempts here), in his book "The Same Sex Controversy" and by Joe Dallas in various books, particularly "The Gay Gospel: How Pro-Gay Advocates Misread the Bible." Considering YouTube's inability to allow links, google the names of these men to find their perspective websites.
"You qualify as effeminate. You said it means soft (correct me if that isn't what you said)..." I think Josh stated the original Greek term in 1 Cor. 6:9 meant soft and could also mean a young male prostitute. I SERIOUSLY doubt it qualifies here.
."Or I don't want to be straight but woman was made for man(nature says that)..."
Paul had dubious ideas of nature too as the vid states when he said in 1 Cor. 11:13-15 that nature tells us long hair was a man's "disgrace" but a woman's "glory."
@clay56 And that is why every religion agrees completely on what the scriptures say. They are always so clear and precise. Never subject to human interpretation. If you have 5 million Christians asked to interpret any given scripture, you would have 6.5 million different answers. I think this Josh kid made his point. I hope i have made mine.
You qualify as effeminate. You said it means soft(correct me if that isn't what you said) but it's a general opinion women are soft and men are rough. So if you acting soft like that of a woman. Or I don't want to be straight but woman was made for man(nature says that) so when try to penetrate a man like you do a woman then he is put in a womans place thus putting him back in softness which makes him effeminate.
Oh is it? why? because the bible said so or because you don't like it? either way, it's not actuallywrong is it, I mean think about the stuff us straight people do, sick! Certainly looking at the straight community you can find pretty weirdo stuff going on, doesn't mean being straight's weird. Loving the same sex is just love, two consenting adults in love.
This guy is cute and smart. think im in love <3
iloope1 2 weeks ago
Now time to show these closed minded idiots what it really means.
MrZulu2065 1 month ago
I would love to use these when Christians claim the Bible is evidence but i could never remember all of them
TVShowPilots 1 month ago
Gosh i freakin love this video!!!!!!!!
parrotpainter 1 month ago
Marriage is derived from the church.
HerosComment 1 month ago
What is relevant, is not the government, it's "God" in this video.
HerosComment 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"You must still feel guilty or you would not be trying to defend your position/feelings from some scripture book that was written by man for man."
Or perhaps he's in part simply showing why so MANY others should feel guilty for exploiting that book to justify their OWN personal disgust and intelerance.
clay56 1 month ago
is it natural as nature intended? You must still feel guilty or you would not be trying to defend your position/feelings from some scripture book that was written by man for man.
HerosComment 1 month ago
@HerosComment Intention requires an intender I.E. a conscious entity, demonstration of which is needed before appeals to nature's intention can be justifiably made.
Regarding the defence of homosexuality, it is more the countering of arguments against homosexuality that is relevant. It is the job of the "condemner" to demonstrate guilt, not the condemned to disprove it.
LGBT people are mistreated due to negative views about them so it is unsurprising they might want to refute those views.
Jamieishere1 1 month ago
This guy is very smart! Eye opener!
jcblazing06 1 month ago
Being Bisexual is the best.
wrich1162 1 month ago
Good job highlighting the problems with the primary "clobber verses."
clay56 2 months ago
This is for cristians who read bible literally . When Jesus says "I'm the door", should we really think of an actual door?
turowat 2 months ago 2
Definitely like this one, very true and an eye opener!! People that read the bible are so quick to judge, but the fact is most have no clue what it really reads. Remember it was written 183883838838 years ago and mainly written for that time.
TheBadays 3 months ago
your actually kind of cute lol
dansci03 3 months ago
Nature is only evil because it is used to represent evil. Faunus = Baphomet.
mattgresh1 3 months ago
No gays are going to heaven! You straight people need to stop over poulating! By the way, you straights were the ones to bring gay people in the world so shut up already dammit!
padude64 4 months ago 7
There has to be a choice between the homosexual agenda and liberty. You cannot have both in the same society.
sensibleadult 5 months ago
Wow. this is so true it is not even funny.
TheTy5050t 5 months ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
My god, get a girlfriend you fag. You're just being gay to get attention, you selfish piece of trash.
TheLastAbacus 5 months ago
@TheLastAbacus kinda like how you're saying to get a girlfriend, flaunting being straight, you intolerant boor
Contessariley 5 months ago
@TheLastAbacus what makes you think hes gay, maybe hes just not a twat :) unlike you
coxianexpress1 5 months ago 3
@cmytsu My question to you is what is the truth on what is condemned?
biruss 5 months ago
@superman1273 well, if porneia covers all non marital sex, why add homosexuals?.. Porneia refers to as a harlot.
biruss 5 months ago
@biruss my apologies for taking so long to respond, i looked for the post you responded to but can't seem to find it. But let me just post off the top of my head and see if I am close. Romans 26-28 clearly describes homosexuality and the result of it between the person and God. Look i didnt Write the bible, i can't edit it to make it say what I want it to say. Nor can you or anyone else. the fact of the matter is homosexuality is sin, so is adultery and lying.
superman1273 2 months ago
. those who keep doing those things won't inherit God's kingdom, not my rules. all Christians are supposed to do is tell you about it. It's up to you or whoever to take that information and act upon it. After it leaves our hands it is out of our control and its up to you. If people want to continually try to distort the Word of God to make what ever sin they are in acceptable, then its your problem. Add enough perfume to a pile of dung and eventually it will smell good.
superman1273 2 months ago
but it is still dung
superman1273 2 months ago
@superman1273 In 1 Corinthians 11:14-15 Paul asserts that gender-appropriate hair lengths can be determined by looking at nature, about which he is clearly wrong. Male hair grows just as long as female hair, which can be seen from Sikh men for instance. His alleged suggestion that homosexuality is wrong because it is against nature therefore doesn't hold much weight.
Romans 1 appears to be a criticism of paganism anyway, rather than homosexuality.
Jamieishere1 1 month ago
@Jamieishere1 Barnes' Notes on the Bible
Doth not even nature itself - The word nature (φύσις phusis) denotes evidently that sense of propriety which all men have, and which is expressed in any prevailing or universal custom. That which is universal we say is according to nature. It is such as is demanded by the natural sense of fitness among people.
So in essence Paul was saying that the general order and custom of the people was for women to have long hair and men short.
superman1273 1 month ago
@superman1273 You simply seem to be slapping on an interpretation to make the bible say what you want. If something were universal (gender-specific hair length), there would be no need for Paul to even mention it in such a way.
Human order and custom is pretty much by definition an artificial augmentation/modification of nature and so anything but natural.
I aim to refute that Romans is a divine condemnation of homosexuality in multiple ways, which won't fit in to 500 characters.
Jamieishere1 1 month ago
@Jamieishere1 Really, so i am now making the bible say what i want it to say lol. Ok Though Paul was converted, Paul preached from a Jewish understanding which did give regulations on hair length as Paul was clearly a Jew, and discussed it accordingly. And The Apostles preached to the Romans about their sins, amongst them was definitely homosexuality, Romans 1:26-27, is clear and apparently you are the one trying, unsuccessfully, to make the bible say what you want it to.
superman1273 1 month ago
@Jamieishere1 Instead of assuming that I am saying something and making your claim, read it more closely, I gave you references. I will try to slow down a little so you can keep up.
superman1273 1 month ago
@Jamieishere1 Also if your trying to prove your argument by saying Paul was wrong, I would try different means. As for romans 1 the word nature and natural come from 2 different words, the first means instinctive and the other is the same as the 1 Corinthians 11, though there are several different meanings behind the word. You really need to study Greek to understand what I am talking about. . one word means a of things. I haven't the time or space to do that with you.
superman1273 1 month ago
@blessedchild2 I'm not saying it's untrue but man did write the bible. I mean you get everything from a book written by man himself so how do you know that some things talked about is right? And how do you know that there isn't things in there that are forged and were never told to the people who wrote it. If different people wrote the bible how did it all come together? I believe in god and I am gay
KTRAIN707 5 months ago
Dude, you're gorgeous.
roomcreeper 5 months ago
Burning a bull on an alter is a pleasing aroma. God was just saying he loves the smell of steak on a bbq pit. Ha the bible is still full of bull
BlueShreveport 6 months ago
great video ! good points, ill use them :)
ohmairose 6 months ago
we are all live in a planet called Earth with our own worlds along thoughts which made the living in it, full of confusion.
saffrocastier 6 months ago
Eat the fattest dick you can.
onebadgs400 6 months ago
@RetroVintageChic86 since There is no god how can we do that or that he says anything
idaman12345 6 months ago
i feel sorry for u because inside u want to fight christianity to make urself feel better chrisitiany is not the only religion that hates homosexuality. we do not hate u as a person we hate the act. we have all sinned and many of us will go to hell including good christians but that does not justify the gay act. homosexual is also mentioned in the new testament. The act of sex by gays was seen as 'disgusting' to God. i did not write the bible please take that up with God, he is still ur father.
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild there is no god
idaman12345 6 months ago
@idaman12345 i will pray for u
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild2 talking to yourself(which is what you do when you pray) is a sign of insanity f
idaman12345 6 months ago
@idaman12345 i will still pray for you .if my love for you to save you is insanity so be it. i will save u
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild2 so tell me what do I need saving from?
idaman12345 6 months ago
@idaman12345 my heart breaks for u my lost brother the devil has u in his tight grip. may God in heaven have mercy on u. father in heaven please have pity on my brother he has lost his way and the devil has captured him father please release him from the stronghold of the devil to your glory in jesus name i pray amen.
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild2 there is no devil or god, so how can the devil have me in his tight grip?
you need to get away from your local brainwashing cult (whatever religion you do belong to)
idaman12345 6 months ago
@idaman12345 i will continue to pray. i want u to rest assured that in whatever trouble u r in for the rest of ur life u will be in my prayers. one day u will feel the comfort of God and u will remember this. u will see.
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild2 Well, you probably don't follow all the other sayings in the bible including all the famous odd ones given as examples above such as no growing two crops in one field (as just an example), so why follow the homophobic one? Yes, I see you may benefit having a book to refer your morals to but aren't there some things in it that just don't make sense? I mean you use your reasoning to overcome the rather strange ones/ignore them yet continue to say that homosexuality is 'wrong'...
dillondownie 6 months ago
@dillondownie christians follow the new testament. homosex is in both the old which is the foundation of our faith and the new which is the clarification. you cannot talk ur way into my head. i care about everyone but i dont have to accept their way of life. why should i accept ur beliefs when u cannot accept mine. u have a long way to go if u think that the world will truly accept ur life style. people may pretend to but in their homes they r praying that such things dont come to their families
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild2 you could accept it for what it is for it has little to do with you for one, and what I was wondering is why you jump on the anti-gay bandwagon that other Christians join without going all out with all the other 'immoralities' going on today, why choose that over say... not wearing polyesters as it says in Leviticus ''You shall not.. wear a garment upon you of two kinds of material mixed together.” this is unless you aren't wearing anything as such which i doubt.
dillondownie 6 months ago
@dillondownie u must live a painful pathetic life. i do not wish to be like you. i hate the act u do in the dead of night and now in the light of day. i find the whole process disgusting and smelly considering where u put it. i feel sorry for u and for mankind. real christians will never accept it just like the other major religions and culture will not no amount of talking will change that. May God save of us all. u can tell me God does not exist. HE EXISTS TO ME.
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild2 Well I love how you seem to hate me for being a hetrosexual now. what are you, asexual? oh wait did you think I was gay? That was very arrogant of you to think that only gay people are against the intolerance they have put towards them. And I wont say that god doesn't exist, I just find it difficult to believe that he would have such foolish followers like you, who pick and choose what to believe and discard the rest including common sense and rationality.
dillondownie 6 months ago
@dillondownie So sad :(
blessedchild2 6 months ago
@blessedchild2 There is no "gay act". There is love and relationships and sex, neither of which contain any "acts" which are unique to gay people. The video poster is "fighting" Christianity not to make themselves feel better but to counter claims made to justify mistreatment (via legislation or otherwise) of LGBT people.
There are religions that don't hate homosexuality though it's irrelevant what religions or people think anyway. What's relevant are their justifications.
Jamieishere1 1 month ago
Comment removed
mahogonywhisper 7 months ago
Wow I love the video. Im so gonna take some notes and use it on my gfs mom. Ha ur Awesome!!
Lezgirls402 7 months ago
you are awesome!!!
LoveTheVoiceWithin 8 months ago
YouTube "Logical Reasoning (mind use) part 2"
3SpaceCadet 8 months ago
Wow! This is an awesome video. This young man needs to continue to educate. Shed some light ...... If you know it, speak up loudly and clearly ... as you have done. Kudos!
meghan42 8 months ago
"Pray about it, plead with God for understanding, thats that only way!"
Such is prettymuch all ANY Christian can do regardless of personal belief either in regard to "the gay debate" or any other.
clay56 8 months ago
out of context, queer
FlipFlibbo 8 months ago
@RetroVintageChic86 When the order wasn't His but the Chruch's. God created homosexuals. Why would anyone want to choose a life in which they could even be senteced to death in some places? People like Ellen have done a lot more for this world, expressing unconditional love to people who arn't even from their country. Last year Ellen paid for a project that brought water supply to an entire village near Calcutta. Think of the many more Ellens we'd have if there was no hatred in this world.
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
lol all though this guy is quoting scripture he doesn't understand the difference between the old and new testiment lol
cristosed 9 months ago
@cristosed why would you say that?
IndiaJacob 9 months ago
loooooooooooooooove this
maxdurrance 9 months ago
Part 2
"Chairman" is neccessarily referring to the word chair.
clay56 9 months ago
"Paul would never assume."
Actually, he did say our Lord had not advised him in at least one situation regarding widows and the unmarried in 1 Cor. 7:20 admitting he was merely rendering his OWN judgement on the situation.
"Also, the word arsenokoites is used again in 1 tim 1:10. Paul here, is using the same word, meaning the same thing...homosexuals."
A scarcely used term combining the words "man" and "bed" doesn't neccessarily mean a sexual setting. it's like saying the word...
clay56 9 months ago
"You are twisting the Bible, leading people astray, and God will hold you accountable."
OR perhaps he's straightening out what's been misunderstood and/or misinterpeted for centuries.
clay56 9 months ago
And your last greek word, arsenokoites.You are twisting it drastically."
This is the accusation of many gay Christian opponents when confronted by alternate views and interpetations. "The word means a male engaging in sexual acts with another male."
It's Paul's OWN fusion of the Greek terms "man" and "bed." That's the only thing certain. It's had MANY definitions throughout the melenia. Martin Luther defined it as a matturbator. ONLY Paul could know with any certainty how he meant it.
clay56 9 months ago
"Paul is not talking about male prostitutes. He is talking about anyone who is a sexual fornicator."
Seems more like assumption on Paul's part.
"The next word, does mean effiminate, and it pertains to men not acting like men, but rather women.
Also assumption since it does not specify
clay56 9 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"You are living in fantasy land, just another lame attempt to twist the words of the Bible around to justify your sinful lifestyle."
His case has Biblical backing whereas the charge of twisting has been thrown out with zero evidence.
clay56 9 months ago
You are living in fantasy land, just another lame attempt to twist the words of the Bible around to justify your sinful lifestyle. You may have convinced yourself and other gays but you haven't changed the true word of God. Obviously you have gone too far for mortal people to change your mind, but God still loves you and He still means what he says in the Bible, Lord please have mercy on your soul.
harmonycostal 9 months ago
@harmonycostal Why is it that you listen to preists in churches so readily but listening to another mortal is plain unforgivable by you? Priests are human too. Nobody said their interpretation of the bible was the right one. Its kind of like Shakespear. The meaning's would have completely different meanings now as compared to then. The use of language changes from time to time. Just like 50 years ago pussy would have meant cat but now it means something different.
IndiaJacob 9 months ago
@IndiaJacob I'm not taking a priest word for it, it's written plain and simple in the Bible and the Bible has not changed and never will, so your theory about words meaning different things now than they used too, well the Bible still means the same thing that it did 2000 years ago. If you read what it says about homosexuals in the Bible and you get that it means something different than what it actually says, then you are fooling no one but yourself.
harmonycostal 8 months ago
@harmonycostal then what do you say about the bible telling you to beat you disobedient children, or stone your 'impure' wife to death?? How come we don't take these meanings to the literal sense? Think about that and don't let me know because i'm completely tired and worn out from debating this topic. The very reason i came here was because it was supposed to be made easy but obviously it isn't for many naive, conservative bigots.
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
@IndiaJacob I'm not trying to offend you or pick on you, just standing up for what the bible says, please read the bible searching for the truth and don't look for errors in it, cause there aren't any, don't try and mix up other verses to discredit the ones you don't want to live by and as far as stoning your wife or beating your children, i think you already know the answers. God Bless you, and unless you want to further this discussion (not a debate) I'm done and will leave you alone.
harmonycostal 8 months ago
@harmonycostal "and don't look for errors in it, cause there aren't any"
You would almost have to be retarded to not question the accuracy of a politically motivated translation put forth by a 300 year old English monarch. The existence of multiple translations with multiple "liberties by the translators" proves this fact. In this age of information your deliberate ignorance is inexcusable.
clubindiana4 8 months ago
@clubindiana4 word :D BTW. Isn't it weird that i'm only seventeen and i still have arguments good enough to make a 54 year old think twice? Such is the stupidity of conservative jerks.
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
@clubindiana4 your reply makes no sense at all, it's funny how you people who are out to try and prove a point use all this fancy talk to prove yourselves, and no i didn't understand what you said and i don't think you did either, you just heard it from another of your gay buddies. If you had been auditioning as a play write for a Shakespeare scene, your replay might have been useful, otherwise your lack of knowledge which i guess would be "deliberate ignorance" is inexcusable.
harmonycostal 8 months ago
@harmonycostal "fancy talk to prove yourselves"........do you mean the use of factual information when you say "fancy talk"? Pleading ignorance only works with your quasi-christian brethren.
clubindiana4 8 months ago
@clubindiana4 The only true statement that you guys have made in this entire discussion is when the retard in the video says "gays are going to hell". And that is so true, because if you turn your life over to the Lord and repent you are not gay anymore, you have been delivered, but if you think that you can be saved and still be gay, then you are just gay and "gays are going to hell" aint that what he said at the start of video? Yep I think it was.
harmonycostal 7 months ago
@harmonycostal Thats nice....having trouble staying on point? One more time....when you say "fancy talk to prove yourselves" are you referring to the use of factual information?
clubindiana4 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"The only true statement that you guys have made in this entire discussion is when the retard in the video says "gays are going to hell". "
I believe when anyone says such a thing with conviction, much UNlike the individual in the vid, that person is at LEAST as much in need of forgiveness as the non-Christian, agnostic or athiest for second guessing our Lord on matters of ultimate judgement.
clay56 7 months ago
@harmonycostal "gays are going to hell"
Did pretend Jesus tell you that gays are going to pretend hell? Get serious you twat.....there is no hell.......if there were we would have already opened a U.S. Embassy there and utilized thye unlimited energy potential of the eternal fire!
Can you imagine how many miles per gallon my SUV would get with just a few drops of HELL FIRE?
clubindiana4 7 months ago
ewwww
tonykeywest00 10 months ago
the only thing required to enjoy intimacy with another person is to be HUMAN...human nature is much more complex and variable and subject to circumstances than absolute notions about orientation can cover...no str8 dude is absolutely str8 and no gay dude is absolutely gay..only gay propaganda deals in absolutes,trying to pigeonhole and restrict and confine dudes,quarantine us, into one unbearably tight pickle jar..it's intellectually dishonest and intellectually arrogant bullshit...go ur own way
KingDavid14218 10 months ago
let's cut to the chase here...is homosexuality born or made?..is heterosexuality born invincible or can it be altered by life experiences?..if gay is ok,then why can't it be a free choice like everything else is a choice?..i am bi because i like it,the male and female genders are equally attractive to me,just for different reasons...i was introduced to gay intimacy when i was 9 by my 19 yo neighbor dude...i was introduced to str8 sex when i was 6 by my late teen baby sitters...it's just life
KingDavid14218 10 months ago
Christians harp on homosexuality because it is now so apparent that it is not really all that evil. No one can choose who they fall in love with. Deep down, we all know that. But, because the argument advocating gay rights is always more logical and researched than the Christians' anti-homosexuality contention, they cling to those few passages for dear life, desregarding a ton of other rules and regulations listed in the Bible.
lynx755135 10 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"Christians believe homosexuality is a sin and that's their right, deal with it. If you don't like it, find a religion that advocates homosexuality."
It is the right of those Christians who believe so just as it is for those Christians who do not.
clay56 10 months ago
Christians believe homosexuality is a sin and that's their right, deal with it. If you don't like it, find a religion that advocates homosexuality.
KnightOwl2006 10 months ago
@KnightOwl2006 Not all Christians believe it is a sin. Only the ones with blind faith do. I don't follow Christianity. Rather I Follow Jesus Christ.
IndiaJacob 9 months ago
@IndiaJacob Or rather only the Christians who follow scripture as it's written and not just the parts they find convenient.
KnightOwl2006 9 months ago
@KnightOwl2006 If you followed the scripture exactly as it was written then you can't eat shellfish, you can stone your daughter if she ever was unfaithful to her husband, you can beat your disobedient children to death, etc etc. Explain to me why the line 'when a man lies with another man, it is an abomination' is taken in the literal sense and not the aforementioned? When people can't understand something they project hatred towards it. Eg. I hate Chemistry because i don't understand it.
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
@IndiaJacob Shellfish ARE a great health risk. Following this Levitical rule only brings blessing. Unfaithfulness and disobedience AREN'T desirable, and they don't bring blessing. Why would one think to hide behind them?
MorganMarvinson 8 months ago
@MorganMarvinson There is a huge difference between something being a helath risk and something being a sin. If any health risk should be a sin it should be smoking but that's a completely different matter. I'm not hiding behind unfaithfullness and disobedience or anything for that matter. I'm following what i think can be a progressive force in this world. You on the other hand are hiding behind prejudice and bigotry, which aren't desireble not only by Christians but humanity itself.
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
1/2
@IndiaJacob "I'm not hiding behind unfaithfullness and disobedience or anything for that matter." Your denial does not square with your post. Just because you follow "a progressive force" to not kill someone for eating shellfish, being unfaithful to husband or being disobedient to parents, doesn't make these things good, nor does it make good what God has called an abomination. You ARE indeed hiding. I am sorry you feel so compelled.
MorganMarvinson 8 months ago
@MorganMarvinson So what your saying is that i should allow people to commit sucide for eating shellfish, be murdered for being unfaithful to their husband or being disobedient to parents? I'm not in denial. Trust me i'm not. I was in denial for a long time in my life untill i realized there was nothing to deny. You're the one denying the fact that there is nothing wrong with being gay because you're too scared to even look at something another way, a way the majority doesn't look at it as.
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
@IndiaJacob You aren't listening. No no one is talking about suicide or murder. Yet God condemns shellfish, unfaithfulness, disobdience--and, yes, homosexuality. Regarding denial: the first step toward recovery is to get out of denial, for God does not encourage homosexuality. It has many perils for the individual and for society at large. I am sorry that you are caught up in it, but I cannot help you over the Internet. There are people who can help you if you seek them out.
God bless.
Morgan
MorganMarvinson 8 months ago
@MorganMarvinson First i don't need help. HA. Second this discussion or debate stops here because lets face it neither of us our going to change our views. If there is one thing i've learnt from all my disussions over the internet, it's that you (as in 'you' in general) can't change peoples ideologies over it. I'm just going to have to accept the fact that there are different opinions out there and i'll have to lve with that. Hope you do the same . Peace out.
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
2/2
@IndiaJacob
"... you are hiding behind prejudice and bigotry ..." What did you find in my post to say that I am hiding? My stating that shellfish aren't healthy? My stating that unfaithfulness and disobedience aren't desireable and that they do not bring a blessing?
MorganMarvinson 8 months ago
@MorganMarvinson Its not what's in your post but rather what your post symbolises. Prejudice because you are only looking at something from one angle. I have looked at this matter from all angles and i'm figting for what i think is right. BTW how can you say somehing that is unhealthy can be considered as a sin. If you can look at the verse "eating shellfish is an abomnation" as "eating shellfish is unhealthy(not a sin)" then you are interpretting the word abomination in a diff. way aren't you?
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
@IndiaJacob cont. So how come the verse "When a man lies with another man, it is an abomination" can't interpreted diiferently?
IndiaJacob 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@IndiaJacob "So how come the verse "When a man lies with another man, it is an abomination" can't interpreted diiferently?
1) It is common knowledge among biblical experts that the word "abomination" is an outright mistranslation.
2) The Mosaic Code that this scripture is quoted from was never aimed at christians to begin with, it is a guide for Jews.
clubindiana4 8 months ago
@MorganMarvinson "Shellfish ARE a great health risk."
So is child birth.......so is a car trip to church on Sunday. Your debate lacks ration.
clubindiana4 8 months ago
@clubindiana4 Eating shellfish is an unnecessary risk. Childbirth and riding in a car are not.
Do you just want to pick?
MorganMarvinson 8 months ago
@MorganMarvinson Bullshit.......in our current state of overpopulation childbirth is even less necessary than shellfish. Riding in a car is HARDLY a necessary risk.......after all....Jesus supposedly walked, didn't he?
clubindiana4 8 months ago
Comment removed
MorganMarvinson 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@clubindiana4 "Bullshit ..." Apparently you live where you are required to walk around the droppings of cattle and can get everywhere you need to go on foot. I live in America; it is different here.
Overpopulation is one thing; having NO human childbirth would eventually mean the end of the race. Shellfish are totally optional.
We both know this isn't about childbirth, riding in a car, or the advisability of eating the trash-collectors of the sea. Obviously you really don't want to hear this.
MorganMarvinson 8 months ago
"Read it all buddy it's more logical to weigh evidence when it's ALL there."
People often come to different conclusions upon reading it all. Besides, its pretty impossible to get the whole Bible read in a six minute vid.
clay56 10 months ago
You know what sucks! Is that he only used parts of verses for the non gay side. Read it all buddy it's more logical to weigh evidence when it's ALL there.
Leoplurodon909 10 months ago
"There is SO MUCH MORE to the Bible than what is just written."
Sounds like a good reminder to Christians of ANY and ALL points of view. :)
clay56 11 months ago
Listen, just because someone can use the Bible in a multitude of different arguments and support opposing sides of a debate does not give you the right to denounce someone else's intelligence or make a gross generalization stating that the other side is "closed-minded" and "didn't learn what they're talking about." There is SO MUCH MORE to the Bible than what is just written. There has to be historical context and such, and this video did a good job of that. Just listen to what he says.. please?
handmade27 11 months ago
Christ advocated heterosexual marriage yet such in and of itself is no prohibition of same gender unions. Those who use this advocacy to claim such are probably presuming too much on Christ's behalf.
clay56 11 months ago
*sigh*
I don't think people like you realize how dumb you sound.
againn, *sigh*
apparently, well, obviously, no gay has ever heard of Jewish tribal laws...or Jesus...or the New Testament...or, Old Testament vs New Testament...or, Jesus' teachings...or, what exactly CHRISTIANITY IS. *sigh*
The worst part is you people are so incredibly closed-minded and biased that you would operate confirmation-bias and completely ignore any, even secular, lesson on the Bible, etc.
7JesusChristIsLord7 1 year ago
good video
victoria911angel 1 year ago
Im a man, I became a born again believer then I met the man I now live with. I've never felt loved so much because of this guy. Sure we have made love tenderly now and again. There is more to life than sex and we have a loving relationship. Everyone who knows us has seen this and have commented on how happy we are, even the guys who use to laugh at gays have seen the difference and respect me. I haven't changed my character by being with a man. I've still got a soft heart and do my best. Paul
MrNobbysoham 1 year ago
Good video aside, you're very cute.
fruitcake0anon 1 year ago
What did Jesus (himself) say about Gays (homosexuality etc)?
mskydolphin 1 year ago
@mskydolphin Jesus stated that adultery was sex outside of marriage.
Jesus' definition of marriage was that of a bond between man and women.
All sexually active gays are adulterers.
You cannot be sexually active (via gay sex) and not be an adulterer.
So, there goes peoples' argument of "well, Jesus never said..."
Like honestly. (I'm not talking to you personally, dolphin, lol)
people are SO incredibly close-minded, and would NEVER think to actually LEARN about what they're talking about.
7JesusChristIsLord7 1 year ago
@7JesusChristIsLord7 The entire bible is written with metaphores and symbolical meanings. What he meant was a bond between two people who love and care for each other. How can any type of productive love be wrong? Can you just imagine the amount of peace in the world had you haters not been so hateful? Seriously you are SO incredibly close-minded, and you will NEVER think to actually LEARN about what you're talking about.
IndiaJacob 9 months ago
No matter how you feel unless you feel that equal rights is wrong you can say nothing about same sex couples wedding and if you have something against equal rights well maybe you should move. END OF STORY:))
BootleggingGhost 1 year ago
2) After all my bible does say its alright to stone and kill people if its for god although I don’t because its against the law and the law is based on the constitution but wait the constitution says that everyone should have equal right whether they believe in the bible or not so shouldn’t it be ILLIGAL TO FORBID them the right to wed. YES.
BootleggingGhost 1 year ago
@BootleggingGhost PS I'll give you a hint: New Covenant
7JesusChristIsLord7 1 year ago
1)
I’m just really tired of hearing I’m a Christian (aka a little bitch that cant think for myself) and my bible (book of god even though god didn’t write it) says that what you are doing in your private life is wrong even though it also says its non of my business and I’m sinning by judging you and taking away your rights
BootleggingGhost 1 year ago
@BootleggingGhost Can you think for yourself? Do you realize the laws of the OT were given to the Jews by God, the chosen people, and then (many of) those laws almost completely disregarded by Jesus creating the radical sect of Judaism (Christianity)? Did you know that's why He was (ultimately) crucified? Oh wait, OR did you even know that Jesus was crucified in the first place? Wait, did you even know Judaism and Christianity were inter-related? Wait, no, you didn't? Wow.
7JesusChristIsLord7 1 year ago
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@7JesusChristIsLord7 the Jews are the chosen people*****
7JesusChristIsLord7 1 year ago
No, no, no... you are wrong! Just to mention one fallacy: Thieves are bad to the eyes of the good guys only because thieves get together with other thieves and they see each other as equal. A thief understands the reason why another thief is that way and encourage each other to do more bad things! Just like gay people... "who, knowing the ordinance of God, that they that practise such things are worthy of death(sin), not only do the same, but also consent with them that practise them." Rm1.32
gugglevideos 1 year ago
... "who, knowing the ordinance of God, that they that practise such things are worthy of death(sin), not only do the same, but also consent with them that practise them." Rm1.32."
Good point,
The rest of the vid however shows VERY well how scripture has been misunderstood and misinterpeted. These discrepancies have been left to stand unaddressed for SO long that too many can view them ONLY as opposition to homosexuality when whey may very well NOT be so.
clay56 1 year ago
@gugglevideos Being a thief hurts someone in the long run. Stealing is in and of itself an act against someone else that could hurt someone intentionally. Thieving, murder, and rape are not the same as homosexuality because no one gets hurt. It may infringe on what you believe, but at the end of the day you go home, alive, unharmed, and with all your possessions intact. In other words, this is a bad analogy. Homosexuality does not hurt anyone.
Elementsorcerer4 10 months ago
@Elementsorcerer4
In that case, let's accept beastiality and say it's O.K., cuz it doesn't hurt anyone. Or necrophilia, it doesn't hurt anyone either? Why do you choose to accept ones, but te others? Sounds like a hypocricy.
To the Guy in the video. About Homosexuality as a sin also says in the New Testament. Besides, gay perverts cannot produce kids, cuz that's not the way God created people for.
LUK77ACH 10 months ago
@LUK77ACH Well, my argument was that acts like murder, rape, and theft inflict harm. Bestiality and necrophilia do inflict harm. Its one person doing something without the consent of another. You are making the same argument that my original comment talks about. A bad analogy.
YOU brought up bestiality and necrophilia, not me. And then YOU said that I accept those things. But I don't. That was an assumption on your part. Why don't you try again? No assumptions this time.
Elementsorcerer4 10 months ago
@Elementsorcerer4 Disagreed. Why? Cuz it oesn't inflict harm to none of the victims. Some beasts like having sex with humans, and the dead people, how can you harm them? Or, was it your joke? It doesn't make sence. One person doing is only in necrophilia, in bestiality, sometimes beasts included, too. So, no rush in making descisions.
LUK77ACH 10 months ago
@LUK77ACH But animals do not give consent, therefore it is one person acting upon an impulse knowing full well that it could cause harm. Very much like rape. There are laws in place for such things. By the way, do you know from experience that some animals like having sex with humans? Please tell me how anyone can possibly know that, at all? Talk about not making sense. And as for the other thing, if your mother died and someone had sex with her body would you NOT consider yourself a victim?!
Elementsorcerer4 10 months ago
@Elementsorcerer4 Rape is different. Dead person cannot feel hurt. And the one that is acting upon dead doing that knowing that it will not hurt, you are such a bagger. There are laws in place against homosexuality and always have been. Answere me, can two women, or two men make children? I talk from seeing things, but you now from screwing each other.))) Anyone can possibly know seeing animal poping up on those women happily. No, I would not consider myself, but her a a victim, Common sence.
LUK77ACH 10 months ago
@LUK77ACH You know, I really wonder about the intelligence of people who bring up the children argument. Guess what, homosexuals know they can't make children. Its a bad argument, just like your analogy. You have some very strange ideas. Thats why I called you the TROLL. Anyone who thinks like this needs to take a look around and realize that everything is not so black and white. If this is how you really think you are making any kind of sense, then I feel sorry for you.
Elementsorcerer4 10 months ago
@Elementsorcerer4 Everyone who calls black is white has wierd perceptions. TROLL is you and it is obviouse. In my country gays are banned and is and always were queers. And I was not talking only about kids, but animals and dead, but you keep switching the subject. And the fact you cannot make kids shows that this is the way God created people. And as of you, I'd be sorry for yourself, cuz you, not me going to hell. And stop bringing your sexlife into social life. That's so wrong, that's so gay
LUK77ACH 10 months ago
Comment removed
Elementsorcerer4 10 months ago
@Elementsorcerer4 I have plenty of prooves, but you are spiritually deaf. As Jesus said, "they listen with their ears, but not hear."
LUK77ACH 10 months ago
TROLL!!!!
Elementsorcerer4 10 months ago
@Elementsorcerer4 You don't need to sign your cooments. I now you are a TROLL and always have known that.
LUK77ACH 10 months ago
@LUK77ACH I am done with this conversation. Respond if you wish, but I refuse to continue if you are going to keep accusing me of beliefs that are not my own. Especially if you are going to resort to name calling because your argument is lacking basic logic.
Elementsorcerer4 10 months ago
--)> There are no unbelievers after death.
WillysWoodPile 1 year ago
in the last verse it mentions fornicators and many people believe that is fine , so....just because people think its fine it means its ok to fornicate? I don t get the poiint
Arielcohen1980 1 year ago
no sé si estas en contra o no pk no entiendo nada pero me cago en tus muertos si tienes algo en contra y vas de listo, hijo puta!
tuquehablas 1 year ago
"The first dissuasion was about old testament law, the new covenant didn't apply back then so it didn't come up."
Actually it is a discussion about what the Bible as a whole says about homosexuality. And the best place to begin in any book is usually at or at least near the beginning. :) "I also love how the supporters of gay rights are trying to flame his argument. Calm down."
VERY good advice for Christians on BOTH sides of this issue to just take a step back now and then.
clay56 1 year ago
You guys are stupid. The first dissuasion was about old testament law, the new covenant didn't apply back then so it didn't come up.
I also love how the supporters of gay rights are trying to flame his argument. Calm down.
To make this simple, be who you are. Gay or straight you are what you are, if others don't like it they aren't worth your tine anyways and your probably better off in different company anyways.
lawlzxc 1 year ago
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"We live under the new covenant. That is why we do not sacrifice animals to God anymore, Christ became the sacrifice for us,..."
So a farmer who plants two different seeds in his field must pray to Christ for forgiveness since he violates Lev. 19:19? Must a woman do the same if she grabs her husban's attacker by the groin since she violates Deuteronomy 25:11-12? Such laws make up much of the reason Christians DO live under a NEW Covenant.
clay56 1 year ago
Might wanna educate yourself a little bit on the old covenant law in Scripture before you make yourself look like a fool like you already have. We live under the new covenant. That is why we do not sacrifice animals to God anymore, Christ became the sacrifice for us, might wanna study Biblical Theology a little buddy!
jasonmiddleton47 1 year ago
this is so ignorant and completely stupid... Paul or not... the bible in its ENTIRETY is INSPIRED of GOD. I have no problem with putting homosexual people with thieves or any other willing sinners. Do I hate you? No. I surely don't hate thieves as people, I hate the act of stealing. Do i associate with no? A DOUBLE NO. I associate with whose who don't try to lower God's standard for their own personal agenda. its disgusting really.
aJaeHustle 1 year ago
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"I have no problem with putting homosexual people with thieves or any other willing sinners."
Just as many have no problem putting Christians with those like Jim Jones or David Koresh. Neither is right.
"I associate with whose who don't try to lower God's standard for their own personal agenda. its disgusting really."
The question is wheather gay Ghristian advocates are "lowering God's standard" or if many gay opponents are subjectively making their OWN disgust part of that standard.
clay56 1 year ago 2
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AJH, You're willfully confusing innate characteristics like homosexuality with chosen criminal behavior, which is a dishonest & ignorant tactic, but intellectually limited people like yourself are wont to take that route when you fail to produce any rational argument to justify anti-minority prejudice. You lack the ability to comprehend that God's standard is far beyond your ken. He is not a bigot, just because you choose to be.
GodCreatesGays2 1 year ago
FANTASTIC! We shouldn't accept things at face value!
gekgeekgecko 1 year ago
Homosexuality is demonic influences.
GTCism 1 year ago
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"Homosexuality is demonic influences."
Many say the same about things like ignorance, intolerance and hatred.
clay56 1 year ago
Comment removed
dboydustin 1 year ago
You need to dig into the Hebrew roots. Torah is valid!
christinepro 1 year ago
It's not so much wheather or not the Bible is believed but HOW it is viewed by the individual believier.
clay56 1 year ago
'two'
Starsindarksuits 1 year ago
Dallas offers his take and and that of others on Old and New Testament passages in reference to homosexuality. In the end, the individual Christian must decide the answer to the question: "What Would Jesus Do?"
clay56 1 year ago
To the reader: The arguments presented here are not new and have been thoroughly dissected and refuted by Dr. James R. White, especially in regards to the Greek words (as Josh11185 attempts here), in his book "The Same Sex Controversy" and by Joe Dallas in various books, particularly "The Gay Gospel: How Pro-Gay Advocates Misread the Bible." Considering YouTube's inability to allow links, google the names of these men to find their perspective websites.
Churchmouse57 1 year ago
Brilliant Idid!
wbworkout 1 year ago
Brilliant Dude! :)
rjnovac 1 year ago
"You qualify as effeminate. You said it means soft (correct me if that isn't what you said)..." I think Josh stated the original Greek term in 1 Cor. 6:9 meant soft and could also mean a young male prostitute. I SERIOUSLY doubt it qualifies here.
."Or I don't want to be straight but woman was made for man(nature says that)..."
Paul had dubious ideas of nature too as the vid states when he said in 1 Cor. 11:13-15 that nature tells us long hair was a man's "disgrace" but a woman's "glory."
clay56 1 year ago
@clay56 And that is why every religion agrees completely on what the scriptures say. They are always so clear and precise. Never subject to human interpretation. If you have 5 million Christians asked to interpret any given scripture, you would have 6.5 million different answers. I think this Josh kid made his point. I hope i have made mine.
rjnovac 1 year ago
You qualify as effeminate. You said it means soft(correct me if that isn't what you said) but it's a general opinion women are soft and men are rough. So if you acting soft like that of a woman. Or I don't want to be straight but woman was made for man(nature says that) so when try to penetrate a man like you do a woman then he is put in a womans place thus putting him back in softness which makes him effeminate.
dboydustin 1 year ago
@dboydustin Maybe sleep on it, you sound confusedxx
Starsindarksuits 1 year ago
@Starsindarksuits lol, oh no there is no confusion. homsexuality(along with a number of other sins-no one greater than the other)is an abomination.
dboydustin 1 year ago
@dboydustin
Oh is it? why? because the bible said so or because you don't like it? either way, it's not actuallywrong is it, I mean think about the stuff us straight people do, sick! Certainly looking at the straight community you can find pretty weirdo stuff going on, doesn't mean being straight's weird. Loving the same sex is just love, two consenting adults in love.
Starsindarksuits 1 year ago 2