COPPER ACETYLIDE EXPLOSIVE (synthesis)

[SaboeMC]

Actually its copper I chloride not copper II chloride...

Copper II chloride does not woork for this reaction

[demnlordd666]

nice I didnt know it was that simple. I have no use for it but that is coo. woulda been nice to see a slow mo

[mmohq]

I just created this with chemicals I found around my house... Given that I happened to have some Copper and Hydrocloric acid lying around to make the Copper(I) Choride.. Gotta love Wikipedia, lol xD

[TenAmperes]

I can't make CuCl and can't order it either. I can't order nitric acid, but I can make nitric acid. So I can only make expensive silver acetylide.

[334683171014]

@TenAmperes there's plenty of places to order 70% nitric acid, dudadiesel, elemental scientific, united nuclear, terrace packaging (is the cheapest), refining chemicals inc, then of course you can make it. You just have to look around, overall it would be cheaper i think to get the 70% then if you need 95-100 you can dehidrate it in the distillation apparatus.

[spotlightman1234]

I'm confused. Is cuprous acetylide more or less sensitive than silver acetylide? please answer!?

[Basco36]

@spotlightman1234 cuprous acetylide is less sensitive than silver

[RC4209]

@Basco36 Did you use dihydrate? I assume it from coloring of compound.

[spotlightman1234]

@spotlightman1234 thank you, it's just that for some reason on the wikipedia page it said that it was more sensitive so I wasn't sure.

[spotlightman1234]

ATTENTION: in this video He uses coper (I) chloride (Cu2Cl2). It appears that he is using coper (II) chloride but that is only because his Cu2Cl2 is very old and partially oxidized. copper (II) chloride cannot be used for this synthesis

[randyclar747]

So is this shit more potent than TATP or no?

[robzep]

Maybe someone has already posted this, but Cu2Cl2 (also written as CuCl and called cuprous chloride) is not the same thing as copper (II) chloride, which would be CuCl2 or cupric chloride.

Yes, it matters.

[darrylportelli]

@robzep thank you!!!

Having a different oxidation state means its a different compound reacting differently

in this experiment he used CuCl2 since copper(II) compounds have colured compounds (in this case green) whilst Cu(I) USUALLY have have white compunds like CuCl because of a full d-orbital ( I said usually because there are exceptions like the red Cu2O)

[kenndined]

here you can see it explode :Dyoutube.com/watch?v=ghIoTW10­qwc

[98JMA]

It says on your reagent bottle 'Cu2Cl2' , and you say in the video 'CuCl2' . . . .which oxidation state of copper is used??

[SeasOfRefuge]

@98JMA

It's gotta be copper (I) chloride, Cu2Cl2.

[spotlightman1234]

will copper sulphate work? if not will sodium and sulphate contamination be a problem?

[explosivefreak666]

@spotlightman1234 .Disolve 4gr.copper sulphate in 10 ml water. Ad a 5gr. solution of NAOH in H2O to that. Now filter the white pow.(cop. hydroxide). Disolve in water, and bubble acetylene through it. Done.

[spotlightman1234]

@explosivefreak666 um ok... i have a few problems with your description first of all Copper hydroxide is not a white powder it is blue to blue green (depending on the hydrate). second Copper hydroxide is not soluble in water. also to be a smart ass the correct amounts are 4 grams of Copper (II) sulfate and 1.3 grams Sodium hydroxide. were you perhaps trying to tell me how to prepare copper hydroxide then to dissolve the Cu(OH)2 in aqueous ammonia?

[chemicalwarfare224]

are u supposed to use copper(I) chloride or copper(II) chloride?

[rgmcall]

I have a couple questions will household ammonia work also can you just drop the calcium carbide in the CuCl2 solution or does it have to be bubbled through?

[NitroChemist]

synthesen.forumup.ch

[sentothegreat]

wow i cant beleave they actually let yall put this on here... an they wonder why america always be under attack

[explosivefreak666]

@sentothegreat .You'r so full of shit, matie.

[artman40]

Anticopper is more explosive.

[funchemistrydemos]

@artman40 if you mean "antimaterial" copper : Lol

[artman40]

@funchemistrydemos Yup. I meant that one. Too bad we're not gonna get that anytime soon.

[ampeyro]

shock detonated explosive that can easily be made by anyone and with green flame, could be beter?

[FLStudioSongs]

PROFESSOR xD

[TheChemFamou5]

@FLStudioSongs haha very funny....NOT! 

[weoponmakerpro]

it looked like a pretty bright explosion is it possible to make a flash bomb

[animatemasta]

you like making things that blow up! lol xD, anyway, thanks for the info :D

[jody4403363881]

I would be lazy and use acetylene from a bottle. lolz

[alphao4132]

why doesnt anyone talk on these things as if they are trying to hide themselves from the FBI or something... an ip trace is prolly easier than voice analysis.

[jarhead2966]

@alphao4132 change your ip adress, its very easy, but it probably doesn't do shit, they could still trace you old one back to you. another solution is dont fuck around with explosives, learn how to make them and keep the chemicals on inconspicuously on hand and only use it when the shit hits the fan and there are no laws anyway. who knows, it might be the way soon too with the way its going

[thomas242007]

nicely done but wish you hadnt used glass

[imgeek1337]

can you use copper sulfate

[GingleGangle1]

Hey, I had Silver acetylide. It wasn't shock sensitive(

[antiswattt2]

silver and copper isnt the same.. i read in a book about the compound.. the copper one was under the ''fun explosives'' tells a bit about how useful it is q: also i think it was blowing up if a crystals broke :O

[Peterditaa]

not true. its very very insensitive and alot stronger than TATP or something similar.

I shot a projectile from an airrifle filled with Copper acetelyde and it did nothing. But when you expose it to heat it reacts in a very explosive way: it almost undergoes deflagration in very very small amounts, 100 mg will explode quite violently

[antiswattt2]

ya like TACS, Mg and Ferrocerium 5:4:1 (: really loud.. my first big test of it gave me headache from 20 meters away, about 0.5 gram.. anyways i cant get calcium carbide.. ATM :(

[tim0090]

@antiswattt2

look on ebay and there are other ways to make it!

[dasgemuse]

i bet the room you did that in smelled like ass.

[wattapassa]

acetylene doesnt smell very bad. it has a very slight onion smell, but its only if your fucking snorting it.

[dasgemuse]

um, i use it on a daily basis for cutting, and yes, it smells like shit..

[Peterditaa]

Is it now copper (II) as he says in his additonal subtitles or is it coprous chloride (copper (I) chloride?

[wattapassa]

its copper (II) chloride, look at the colour

coprous chloride is a brownish colour

[Peterditaa]

copper (I) chloride is perfectly white, but it may change its colour due oxidation to copper (II) chloride by gettin green.

coprous oxide is brown.

on the bottle it says: Cu2Cl2 which is the same as CuCl which would be copper (I) chloride.

but actually the synthesis does also work with copper (II) chloride, but the final product is hardly different in strenghts and is sensitive.

[mV33rs]

Because for me copper (I) chloride is hard to get, is it possible to use a copper (I)/(II) chloride solution? The only way I know how to make copperchloride is with HCl, H2O2 and copper. But you will get a mix of both chlorides?

[Peterditaa]

well i was asking myself the same questions. acutally you can easily make copper (I) chloride out of copper (II) chloride.

i was doing some experiments on making copper acetylide today: for some sort of reason the experiment is not really reliable. sometimes it produces highly explosive copper (I) acetylide sometimes its something in between and sometimes you just get some stuff looking like shit and burning slower than blackpowder. ill PM you.

[InfinitiveNothing]

How does one prevent the decomp of copper acetylide? Every time i make the stuff, it becomes very impure by the time its dry. Am i missing something?

[HazMatLabz]

Correction, hydrogen would not make copper hydride, but probably some of weird combo of chlorides or copper salts.

[antiswattt2]

hey.. plz somebody answer.. is it possible to use some other explosive gas like hydrogen? (: and anybody knows where to get copper chloride? :S

[HazMatLabz]

Ok i'll answer. No, you cannot use hydrogen. This synthesis is making acetylide not hydride. And hydrogen is not explosive, just very flammable.

[antiswattt2]

well.. ok (: i saw in a book.. that you can detonate acetylene under high pressure (: with a ring of explosives (primary?) around the canister.. damn .. i need calcium carbide and copper chloride (where??) so i guess ill stick with TATP.. i can get the stuff for that.. the calcium carbide is so much impossible to get in denmark when youre under 18 D=

[Peterditaa]

idiot. thats all i can say. You want to make explosives? Go and learn something about chemistry. No really, stupid questions like yours are both dumb and annoying.

[antiswattt2]

guess where i will learn chemistry... in school i get to.. dissolve salts in water.. then recrystallize them as i do myself alot.. so nothing new in that

[douro20]

Acetylides are quite unique in the way they decompose. Copper acetylide, for instance, decomposes into pure copper and carbon. The same thing goes for silver acetylide.

[wattapassa]

how come you need ammonia?

[DunkDaMan1]

I believe it's to ensure deprotonation of the ethyne to 'carbide' ions.

[metalheadrowi]

I did this experiment with copper(II)sulphate, but when you add the ammonia, tetramminecopper(II)sulphate is formed, and this compound won't dissolve. Is it necessary to use copper(II)chloride? But as you can see in the video, there's also a precipitate formed when you add the ammonia to the chloride...does it form tetramminecopper(II)chloride?

[howe094]

this won't work with copper sulfate. trust me.

[Peterditaa]

Tetramincoppersulphate is quite suluable in water and ammonia, i guess this is no problem.

[pyro57sapiens]

is it possible to use this in blasting caps?

[pyro57sapiens]

how strong is the ammonia solution?

[Peterditaa]

2Mols, as written on the bottle

[dbc616]

Nice green copper flame!

[Cerealkiffer]

Well, you used copper(II)chloride? That can`t be true. Watch my vide. I`ve prepared it with CuCl(I).

[jacubv]

that can be true

there are 2 forms of copper acetylide, I and II

i dont remember wich one is more sensetive

[Cerealkiffer]

copper(I)acetylide explodes while copper(II)acetyleide just deflagrates.

Watch my videos, I made both acetylides.

[howe094]

If you look at the bottle in his video it says Cu2Cl2, which is just a non empirical verison of CuCl. And anyways, i tried this with copper (II) chloride and i still got a very powerful explosive out of it.

[cobrasniper555]

I'm sorry, but I hate it when people test deflagration on a good watch glass. It hurts my soul. Haha. I went through a great deal of trouble getting my home lab put together and can't understand why people ruin some of their equipment. I personally use the bottom of soda cans to test detonation/deflagration. Anyhow, good synth! Keep it up!

[RobertJohnsonz]

would you be able to use different copper compounds in solution, such as copper nitrate?

[Basco36]

Im not sure, i only tried it this way.

[CarnalDiafragma]

I believe copper sulphate does work

[bustincapz]

very nice im a fan of chemistry since i was 9 (im 12 now (and already got scars from pyro)

[hedgehogbun]

Apparently you did not use proper protection, which is the first thing you learn in Chemistry.

[paronfisk]

@hedgehogbun Well this is street chem dude!!

[ampeyro]

@hedgehogbun and the first you forget

[Nargile666]

yes i saw a video and it was ignited by fuse

[jghaukland91]

will this ignite with a fuse

[Basco36]

I dont think it can

[antiswattt]

hm.. if you just use aluminium foil, the foil will glow red and get very hot.. and the flame is under the powder.. which means you wont have a fucked up glass thing next time (:

[potassiumperchlorate]

I synthesised some of this stuff today.

I bubbled C2H2 gas through the solution for 10 minuits. After a while no CuC2 was formed. But after filtrating the precipitate (low yield) the solution was stil verry bleu. What could be the problem?

[namestakin]

You don't really need a high ammonia concentration. I did it with regular clear household ammonia, as long as it's clear it will work. I mixed it with about .7g of copper chloride and used a syringe to obtain the blue tetraamine solution off the top. Only 15ml of it formed but it is still possible to do it with household ammonia.

[liquidgrain]

to collect the copper acetylide did you use a gravity filter or a vaccum filter.

please respond.

[Nargile666]

Which concentration is the best?

[Nargile666]

"The synthesis has to be performed very rapidly and the product must be washed thoroughly in anhydrous ethanol and vacuum desiccated if any reasonable yield is to be had. This particularly procedure employed a solution of Copper Chloride in dilute ammonia."

I read this on Powerlabs and i don't understand why it has to be performed rapidly.Can you explain it to me?

washing in ethanol is only fot faster drying am i right? concentrated ammonia solution is also proper or i must use dilute?

[thebenderman08]

where do you get all of these things?

[tproduction1]

can you do this with copper nitrate?

[Basco36]

no.

[bla287]

The problem is: You should not use Cu(II) compounds, because Cu(II) acetylide is much more dangerous than Cu(I) acetylide. But the only way to stabilize Cu(I) in aqueous solution is dissolving CuCl in ammonia, which should give a colorless solution. Blue indicates Cu(II).

[InfinitiveNothing]

Does it matter how concentrated the ammonia solution is? If so, how does its concentration affect the reaction?

[NH4NO3CH3NO2]

can there be a substitute for Copper Chloride?

[potassiumperchlorate]

Anny soluble copper (II) salt is sayd to be good enougth.

[potassiumperchlorate]

If you are smart enough to read some responces, you could reed thad CuCl2 is untable in a normal aquaes invoirement.

I think all primary explosives shoudn't be made by beginners. Metal picrates are still quite sensitive.

[chao129]

Why did you use an ammonia solution, why not water?

[lrodan]

how old r u guys

[potassiumperchlorate]

No I was just thinking:P

I think you could use also Cu(NO3)3, but copper(II) chloride is mutch cheaper so why should you use copper nitrate? And copper (II) chloride can be synthesised quite easely from HCl, H2O2 and copper.

[potassiumperchlorate]

CaC is calcium carbide not CaC2, copper carbide is CuC not Cu2C2.

Carbide ion is C2- and copper is Cu2+, the calcium Ion also has two elektrons to much.

C2H2 is a moleculair compound, copper and calcium carbide are IONIC compounds.

Copper acetylide sounds verry sensitive to me, althouth the synthesis doesn't look's verry dificult, I don't think it is an explosive for beginners.

[thejavagamer]

Looks like Wikipedia back you up on the sensitivity. Apparently it's MORE sensitive than Silver acetlyide.

[UAEchemist]

explosive for beginners or not, it is an unstable primary explosive, the best to primaries would be Azides and picrates, because they are much stable then acetylide and peroxides.

[TheFluorineMartyr]

Dearest potassiumperchlorate, I think it unwise to criticise others whilst not having everything correct yourself...

Calcium Carbide (Ethynide) - CaC2

Copper (I) Carbide (Ethynide) - Cu2C2

...and to be fair, Carbides are more organometallic than ionic ^^,

Regards,

Fm

[Sebbass69]

potassiumperchlorate, calcium carbide is definitely CaC2 - there are two versions of the anion carbide: C4- and C2 2-

As well, it's actually a very insensitive explosive - the wiki article is absolutely incorrect - Ag2C2 is far more sensitive and far more powerful....

[pbbehv]

it decomposes in water :P

[FOATE]

Why is an ammonia solution used to dissolve the copperchloride? C2H2 + 2CuCl → Cu2C2 + 2HCl, so there's no reaction with the ammonia, couldn't water work aswell? And how about dissolving Cu in HNO3 to form Cu(NO3)2, then bubble the C2H2 through. C2H2 + 2Cu(NO3)2 → Cu2C2 + 2HNO3 theoretically it should work, right?

[slateflash]

There is a reaction actually, forming tetraammine copper(II) chloride (dark blue solution), bt i'm not sure why that's done.

[BuiltCrazy]

Am I correct when I say that you added the calcium carbide with water to create acetylene? Thanks.

[FOATE]

yep, just water. CaC2 + 2 H2O → C2H2 + Ca(OH)2, C2H2 is acetylene, CaC2 is calcium carbide.

[BuiltCrazy]

does anybody know how this compares to ap in sensitivity?

[Jobbywl]

It is very insensitive compared to AP!

But always watch out it still is an primary and sensitive.

[Jobbywl]

What was your yield?

And what was your concentration of the ammonia solution?

I am planning to try this!

[BuiltCrazy]

you need to use a dilute ammonia solution

[dwerg2k]

Very nice :D

[pyrofreak1308]

hey

can you tell me, where you get your burner?

i need one too and i'm searching for a good one like yours

[InfinitiveNothing]

what happens to the ammonium chloride?

[TheFluorineMartyr]

Has anyone made cupric ethynide (lets keep it IUPAC) - CuC2? I hear it's a lot more sensitive.

[RobertJohnsonz]

Was that ammonium hydroxide that you add the copper chloride to?

[Basco36]

ya.

[RobertJohnsonz]

thanks =]

[norfdak377]

where did you get the copper chloride? and its coper (I) or (II)?

[Basco36]

I think it was II

[marmaladekamikaze]

Cuprous Chloride (which is printed on the bottle in the video is a compound in which Cu has a valency of I not II, Cupric(II) acetylide CuC2 is much more unstable than Cuprous(I) acetylide. The Cupric(II) variant is akin to Nitrogen triodine in sensitivity. So in short you'd probably be missing a finger if it was cupric chloride.

[BuiltCrazy]

How does using Copper(II) Chloride make it more sensitive than using Copper(I) Chloride?

[marmaladekamikaze]

When using Copper(II) Chloride you end up making CuC2, in which the bonds are more strained than in Cu2C2, which is the product when you use Copper(I) Chloride instead of Copper(II) salts.

[BuiltCrazy]

ok thanks

[Jaseoldboss]

@norfdak377; Water. Calcium carbide + water produces acetyline. This reaction was used in old carbide lamps.

[norfdak377]

what was that liquid in the flask you added the calcium carbide to?

[bla287]

Interseting reaction!

I have some questions: What happens with the hydrogen of the acetylene? Is there a redox reaction (copper is oxidized and hydrogen is reduced) with the ammonia as complexing agent for the by-product Cu(2+)? My guess:

2 Cu(+) + C2H2 + 4 NH3 --> CuC2↓ + [Cu(NH3)4](2+) + H2↑ ???

If yes, why do we see the blue Cu(II)-ammonia complex already at the beginning? Is it because of impurities in the Cu(I)-chloride?

Could someone post a correct reaction formulas? Thanks in advance!

[andreichikachika]

I think he knows what he is doing! start worrying about yourself for a change!

[GingleGangle1]

...a Chinese Beher? This chineses will take over the world!(

[Sebbass69]

does the concentration of the ammonia matter?

[Sebbass69]

So, how did you dessicate the powder without heating it??

[Basco36]

just with a fuse.

[cobrasniper555]

I think he means how to dry it out. I'm also interested in this as I just leave my product/s in the sun to dry. The leave it with a sodium sulfate desiccant.

[tommmmmmmmx]

hi you must be a teacher or a porfecer ???? what does your other half say about your lawn you have spild soooooooo much out there i love your vids there so cool

[youfuckingasshole69]

beautiful

[Basco36]

Thanks youfuckingasshole.

[derkozten]

hahaha, sound really funny those 2 words together... thanks youfuckingasshole.

And about Sebbass' question, I think only Cu(I) works, because Cu(II) doesn't precipitate acetylide. Fortunately, Cu(I) is easily made from Cu(II): just react Cu(II) solutions (like copper sulfate) with potassium iodide. This creates a Cu(I) precipitate, which is dissolved in amonnia and is then able to react with acetylene.

[Basco36]

ha, thats why I thanked him.

I dont remember which form of copper chloride I used, I guess it was copper(I) chloride.

[Sebbass69]

Thanks for the info - does it have to be potassium iodide, or can it be like potassium bromide? Are there any other salts that would work to make a Cu(I) compound from a Cu(II)??

[bla287]

@Sebbass69

The problem with Cu(I) is its standard potential:

Cu(+) + e(-) -> Cu +0,52V

Cu(2+) + 2 e(-) -> Cu +0,36V

So the disproportionation reaction

2 Cu(+) -> Cu(2+) + Cu

will most likely happen in an aqueous solution, unless you can stabilize the Cu(+) by lowering its potential, e.g. with a complexing agent (I cannot think of any ATM)

(PS I found the answer to my previous question now, the blue colour in the vid must have come from Cu(2+) which generated by dismutation of Cu(+))

[bla287]

And if you try to reduce a Cu(II) salt, let's say with iron, it will form elementary Cu in most cases (But I think you can somehow get Cu(I) chloride, by dissovling a Cu(II) compund in conc HCl and adding a mild reducing agent such as sulfite/SO2. The produced CuCl isn't soluble in water, so it won't dismutate)

[NieIs]

what percitipates? Copper (I) sulfate? But this does not exist... I think you have to use Copper (II) chloride and let it react with potassium iodide...

[Sebbass69]

I thought copper (I) chloride was a white powder and Copper (II) chloride was green?? Would copper (II) chloride work in this reaction?

[Basco36]

yeah, they both should work in this reaction.

This is copper II chloride I think, doesnt say on the bottle.

[derkozten]

hmmm... of course, you needed to make soluble the fairly insoluble Cu(I) ion by complexing it with ammonia.

Thanks for clearing my mind.

[derkozten]

Did you use copper (II) or copper (I) chloride?

Another question: did you acidify the solution, like in mabakken's demostration of Ag2C2?

[Basco36]

copper 1 chloride.

and no,I only dissolve the chloride in ammonia.

[gaurd5002]

i know cool :)  and of course silver acet ylide is going to be more expensive.

[nitrex]

yes, its part of the platinum metal group. You can say all Platinum groups are expensive.

[nitrex]

Cool lol, but your forgetting something. Not only is it like Silver Acetylide and less sensitive, but also its cheaper as well. Take it, Silver products and compositions are expensive.

[Basco36]

actually i read that copper acetylide is more sensative than silver acetylide, but it doesnt seem like it when i use the copper.

[nitrex]

Well like they say, experience is a much better hand then reading something which is theory. Thats why i tested my Negative X reaction and it didn't happen like everyone else's.

[Basco36]

what happend with yours that was different?

[nitrex]

Well i mis balanced a lot of ingredients, for example ammonium chloride was more then nitrate and Zinc. While the Zinc was the least from all of them.