At the very least, Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld and Rice all lied. 1. About the evidence for going to war. There were never WMDs. 2. About torture. They said they did not torture. We now know they lied and that it was authorized. If Clinton can be impeached for lying why can't the Bush Admin? Torture is a war crime. They should be prosecuted. Is America the only nation that does not live up to these standards? How hypocritical is that?
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
What a freaking circle jerk this bunch of lawyers is. Get over it, nothing illegal was done, and no one is going to be accused of anything. The President and Congress are protected from legal action such as is being discussed. Additionally, if the Obama administration tried to do this, it would fracture the country completely along political lines. It could cause a violent reaction of some kind.
Are you crazy? In my half century, I've never known torture as being acceptable. How can you say nothing illegal was done? Torture is illegal by the standards of international law.
Which international law do you refer to? And what constitutes torture? The word "torture" is not to be used lightly. The U.N. convention against torture defines torture such that just being confined in a prison could be deemed to be torture. The Geneva Convention defines that its rules only apply to soldiers in an armed conflict, a soldier being defined as one who wears the uniform representing a nation in armed conflict - so the Geneva Convention does not apply here. So what rules apply?
Not to mention the fact that there are no laws governing this sort of thing in the U.S. I understand what you are saying and that your heart is in the right place. However this is not a simple issue. The one thing that runs rampant in this country today is a lack of trust between its people and the government. Politicians have capitalized on and fostered this distrust for political gain, especially liberal Democrats. They do it because it works. But let's not go overboard here.
The move for "change" is complete. Democrats hold all the cards now, mostly because of the politics of defeat which I outlined earlier. However, the President and his staff won't and should not be prosecuted. We don't need to cut off our nose to spite our face in this situation - it would just be stupidity to do so, and would accomplish nothing positive for the country. It would be pointless anyway because the President and congress are constitutionally protected from litigation.
Glennman, mistreatment of civilians is a war crime under the Nuremberg Conventions, to which the USA is signatory and thus bound under Article 6 of the US Constitution.
You talk like a Nazi and you should be ashamed of yourself.
"We're going to discover when the investigation is concluded that the Department of Justice itself is a major crime scene." It's comforting to know that we're putting our best people to work on restoring America. It's a new day!
there won't be prosecutions because there are members of congress who were briefed in on these matters and told they had a duty not to say anything about it.
Gretchen, while I think your observation is insightful about the inhibition of torture prosecutions by complicity by Democrats (Pelosi, Reid) in Bush's crimes, and the fact that extraordinary renditions involving torture were conducted under Clinton (Gore said "Of course it's illegal! That s why it's a covert op!"),
Why should ANY U.S. politician have to consult a legal team to determine whether torture is legal or not? That alone should prove these guys unfit for office.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
These unhinged loony lefties and their Bush Derangement Syndrome still fail to grasp that Bush protected their worthless asses from the Islamonazi threat and these unlawful enemy combatants which had absolutely no protection under the laws of war.
Bush gave the Islamonazi illegal enemy combatant detainees greater protections than legal combatant POWs are even provided under the laws of war.
Torture does not help anyone. One of the interrogators who helped catch Zarqawi said he thinks torture caused most of the American deaths in Iraq. If they were given better protection that POWs than they would have declared them to be POWs but they refused to do so.
Expect it means that DOJ/FBI, and sometimes the IRS have been used as punishers, or at least intimidators, of "enemies" long before Nixon and hasn't particularly stopped since.
Making, and keeping them non-partisan is difficult when they have to report to a partisan boss.
Why did you guys cut the video there? Mr. Horton was just stating that the department of justice is a crime scene - which is a rather bold comment! It looked like he was going to explain further? His mouth was opening just as you faded out.. Can you please explain his view on this? Thanks!
At the very least, Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld and Rice all lied. 1. About the evidence for going to war. There were never WMDs. 2. About torture. They said they did not torture. We now know they lied and that it was authorized. If Clinton can be impeached for lying why can't the Bush Admin? Torture is a war crime. They should be prosecuted. Is America the only nation that does not live up to these standards? How hypocritical is that?
keithwhitmer 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
What a freaking circle jerk this bunch of lawyers is. Get over it, nothing illegal was done, and no one is going to be accused of anything. The President and Congress are protected from legal action such as is being discussed. Additionally, if the Obama administration tried to do this, it would fracture the country completely along political lines. It could cause a violent reaction of some kind.
Glennman8 3 years ago
Are you crazy? In my half century, I've never known torture as being acceptable. How can you say nothing illegal was done? Torture is illegal by the standards of international law.
Hereticbooks 3 years ago 5
Which international law do you refer to? And what constitutes torture? The word "torture" is not to be used lightly. The U.N. convention against torture defines torture such that just being confined in a prison could be deemed to be torture. The Geneva Convention defines that its rules only apply to soldiers in an armed conflict, a soldier being defined as one who wears the uniform representing a nation in armed conflict - so the Geneva Convention does not apply here. So what rules apply?
Glennman8 3 years ago
Not to mention the fact that there are no laws governing this sort of thing in the U.S. I understand what you are saying and that your heart is in the right place. However this is not a simple issue. The one thing that runs rampant in this country today is a lack of trust between its people and the government. Politicians have capitalized on and fostered this distrust for political gain, especially liberal Democrats. They do it because it works. But let's not go overboard here.
Glennman8 3 years ago
The move for "change" is complete. Democrats hold all the cards now, mostly because of the politics of defeat which I outlined earlier. However, the President and his staff won't and should not be prosecuted. We don't need to cut off our nose to spite our face in this situation - it would just be stupidity to do so, and would accomplish nothing positive for the country. It would be pointless anyway because the President and congress are constitutionally protected from litigation.
Glennman8 3 years ago
Glennman, mistreatment of civilians is a war crime under the Nuremberg Conventions, to which the USA is signatory and thus bound under Article 6 of the US Constitution.
You talk like a Nazi and you should be ashamed of yourself.
punxsutawneybarney 2 years ago
"We're going to discover when the investigation is concluded that the Department of Justice itself is a major crime scene." It's comforting to know that we're putting our best people to work on restoring America. It's a new day!
VigilantnotMilitant 3 years ago 2
yea thats a pretty powerful statement!
micahgee 3 years ago 2
there won't be prosecutions because there are members of congress who were briefed in on these matters and told they had a duty not to say anything about it.
My prediction.
GretchenDawntreader 3 years ago
Gretchen, while I think your observation is insightful about the inhibition of torture prosecutions by complicity by Democrats (Pelosi, Reid) in Bush's crimes, and the fact that extraordinary renditions involving torture were conducted under Clinton (Gore said "Of course it's illegal! That s why it's a covert op!"),
I think you are being unnecessarily defeatist.
punxsutawneybarney 2 years ago
Why should ANY U.S. politician have to consult a legal team to determine whether torture is legal or not? That alone should prove these guys unfit for office.
alnewberry 3 years ago 4
This comment has received too many negative votes show
These unhinged loony lefties and their Bush Derangement Syndrome still fail to grasp that Bush protected their worthless asses from the Islamonazi threat and these unlawful enemy combatants which had absolutely no protection under the laws of war.
Bush gave the Islamonazi illegal enemy combatant detainees greater protections than legal combatant POWs are even provided under the laws of war.
averageworkinggal 3 years ago
Oh, please. We had enough trouble getting Bush to even CHECK we had the right person!
Himechansexytightass 3 years ago 4
yes, a spelling mistake could cost some poor guy big!
amsoho75gr 3 years ago
Torture does not help anyone. One of the interrogators who helped catch Zarqawi said he thinks torture caused most of the American deaths in Iraq. If they were given better protection that POWs than they would have declared them to be POWs but they refused to do so.
americanmuslimgirl 3 years ago 3
Tell me how torture protects us.
cobwebhead 3 years ago 2
Bring back David Kurtz!
Hehehe.
MooseOfReason 3 years ago
As much as I love Obama and hate Bush, once Bush is out of office he will be untouchable
djphatd 3 years ago
Expect it means that DOJ/FBI, and sometimes the IRS have been used as punishers, or at least intimidators, of "enemies" long before Nixon and hasn't particularly stopped since.
Making, and keeping them non-partisan is difficult when they have to report to a partisan boss.
voyeurdug 3 years ago
TimTrim: I completely agree. This seems like a major editing error.
mmeyerdc 3 years ago
Why did you guys cut the video there? Mr. Horton was just stating that the department of justice is a crime scene - which is a rather bold comment! It looked like he was going to explain further? His mouth was opening just as you faded out.. Can you please explain his view on this? Thanks!
TimTrimT 3 years ago 2
i agree... maybe part 3 is coming?
TheDuckofLaw 3 years ago
I also totally agree.. I would really love to know what he meant by that!
Namari12 3 years ago