This new design allows the boat to remain level and on the optimum design point for a longer period of time, almost continuously in fact since the rigger weight is relatively small, thereby reducing overall hull drag and increasing efficiency throughout the stroke.
There is possibly a marginal speed advantage to this design for hydrodynamical reasons. A rowing hull is designed to be in it's most efficient state whilst running straight and level. In a standard boat this state occurs in reality for a very small period of time since the rower is shifting their weight forwards and backwards in the hull in order to row. (I will assume that the boat is laterally balanced) This shift in weight generates increased drag.
Looks pretty awesome, have to admit I'd love to try one of those on the water. I think maybe the reason for the ban may be something to do with the fact I can imagine the recovery phase may take a bit less energy in a boat like that as you are pulling a rigger+blades towards you rather than using your legs to pull your body forward. Of course having not used such a boat my comment may well be a load of bull.. Still though, awesome boat. =]
Hi, I'm a masters rower who has and not will race. I look at rowing as a fitness thing. Are there plans or other boat manufactures that make a sliding rigger boat? It can be as banned as it can be, but I would like to row one. I am looking to purchase a boat and one like that would be the best. Any ideas? Thanks. Paul
RedHead - It makes the sport too expensive? LOL Have you looked at the price of equipment? It's an expensive sport no matter how you slice it. Though what you say has been promoted as one of the reasons for the banning, the real truth is not as easy to find. Most likely it just has to do with tradition rather than anything more conspiratorial. Rowers are a funny bunch, eager to hop onto new fads in an instant but clinging to dogma and tradition as if their lives depended on it. Just Smile
for real, the sliding rigger was banned by FISA because it would be too costly to have it across the board. for all crews to have the fair advantage, it would have to be ultra accessible and it's not. it's a much faster system; kudos to dr. nolte for inventing it.
for real, the sliding rigger was banned by FISA because it would be too costly to have it across the board. for all crews to have the fair advantage, it would have to be ultra accessible and it's not. it's a much faster system; kudos to dr. nolte for inventing it.
for real, the sliding rigger was banned by FISA because it would be too costly to have it across the board. for all crews to have the fair advantage, it would have to be ultra accessible and it's not. it's a much faster system; kudos to dr. nolte for inventing it.
@PaulVideoS They banned it because it was obvious better then the traditional boats. Every club that could not just afford to swap all their boats for sliding rigger boats would loose. It would not just be buying one new boat, every boat would need sliding riggers. That would mean richer clubs would win more races, and sports should be about performance not money.
Peter somebody (A German) won the world champs in 1981 in a sliding rigger boat built by empacher. They were banned shortly afterwards. Try telling him they don't go faster.
Sorry, but let us not lose our center of gravity.... it is the erg which (tries to-) simulate(s) what it feels like being on a boat, not the other way round! :^)
Do you draw the rigging into your body with your feet or something, i know on an erg this can lead to strains in the upper quads because they arnt used to the pull action loading and generally arnt strong enough to deal with the volume of repititions, correct me if im wrong?
and they let him race against regular skulls? that seems really unfair. I definately wouldn't race against anyone in a boat like that; it's a definate advantage.
No, the Sliding rigger is banned from competition. No one really knows exactly why, many explanations have been given, and your concern is one of them, however the "speed advantage" has not been proven conclusively, and even Marcel says that he can row his regular boat faster. There are many opinions on both sides of the issue, adn the debate rages on.
Because your bodyweight doesn't move relative to the boat, there is far less variation in boat speed throughout the cycle of each stroke. Less variation allows the same average speed with a significant decrease in energy requirements. First patented in the mid 1800's, quickly banned from competition because of the clear advantage.
Actually a very good concept... The rower does not move in the boat only the rig... Therefore the weight of the rower doesn't counteract the momentum of the boat as he comes towards the catch.. I have heard they were banned because poorer countries couldn't afford the technology when they were first developed not sure this is true but they were used in the 1982 World championships but nowthey aren' seems plausible..
Surely the best way of developing a sliding rigger is one that keeps moves in accordance with the seat to keep the blades as close to a right angle from the boat as possible, so that there is reduced slip in the spoon during the drive phase? Marcel's boat looks like a bit of a fad to me, you get the same feedback from how the boat is gliding through the water, you don't need some sliding rigger to tell you your finishes and catches are clean.
if the rigger moves with the seat you wouldnt have any leg drive. that's a f'cking terrible idea.
the design you can see is quicker than current singles, despite what the poster might say. the winning times were in the 7min ranges in the 80s, but times have moved on since then.
If the rigger moved with the seat and your feet were fixed, there would most definately be leg drive! If you imagine a bow mounted wing rigger, which is in some way connected to the seat, you would still have the seat on the slide and there would most definately be leg drive.
agreed. I think someone made a prototype of this, but I can't remember where. There isn't much incentive for developing radical new technologies in rowing since they will almost always be banned from competition. Kinda like cycling tech in the tour de france...
False, the rigger and the seat have to be stationary relative to each other. In traditional boats they are both fixed to the shell, in the slidding rigger system they are attached to each other and the seat is fixed to the shell.
@couss94 one of those two has to be stationary, in this case it is the seat-normally its the boat. The benefit to the stationary seat is that your bodyweight stops causing large oscilations in speed. A smooth ride like that takes much less energy than one were you have to re-accelerate the boat every stroke. They don't necessarily go faster, but it is much easier to go faster longer here than it would be in a traditional boat.
Wouldn't you be throwing even MORE weight (body + riggers!) around with your clever idea? That somewhat takes away the point of using sliding riggers. But clever to think about the angle advantage.
btw this was in response to Coik85's comments. Don't know why yt does'nt show this.
Another comment on sliding riggers: wouldn't the greater length of the stroke cause less lift (that arises from the slight angle of the blade) than in regularly rigged boats? (Assuming the total work applied is the same in one stroke, which is not evident if one stroke would take you further in a sliding rigged boat, which would enable you to use more power in one stroke, because ie a 2k would take less strokes)
Schade, dass es die Rollausleger nicht mehr gibt... Die Boote/das Boot (1x) war schon um einiges schneller, da der Körper sich im Boot nicht hin und her bewegte. Aber die damaligen Entwicklungs- und Herstellungskosten machten das Boot teuer. Da es sich nicht alle kleine Nationen und Ruderer leisten konnten und daher ein signifikanter Wettbewerbsvorteil entstand, hat die FISA Empacher verboten, diese Boote für den Wettkampf herzustellen.
I'd imagine that the specialized hardware that must be nearly custom made increases the cost. That said, I've never seen the price for a sliding rig boat so was unaware that they were significantly more expensive, so it's just a guess based on market principles.
I believe that it is a currently manufactured boat, and he uses it to train specific aspects of his technique, though I'm not sure what those aspects might be. Would be great to know.
BTW - There really does not seem to be any actual evidence that the Sliding Riggers produced a large adavantage in overall speed. The time for the winners before they were banned were in the 7:00 range in perfect conditions.
your an idiot i'm afraid, they were banned by FISA because they were too fast and the relative cost alienated developing rowing nations. the worst rowing concept in the whole world, i'd say was aluminium boats.
yes, "hey were banned by FISA because they were too fast" exactly my point. I shouldn't of used stupid but that was the main thing I thought about when watching this....
I love it.
ironoarsman 8 months ago
Sliding rigger means the boat pitches less as the main bulk of weight ( you) is stationary so the stern and bows stay level.
srsly101 8 months ago
I think sliding rigger is retarded
poretobatido 1 year ago
This new design allows the boat to remain level and on the optimum design point for a longer period of time, almost continuously in fact since the rigger weight is relatively small, thereby reducing overall hull drag and increasing efficiency throughout the stroke.
18gbrown 1 year ago
There is possibly a marginal speed advantage to this design for hydrodynamical reasons. A rowing hull is designed to be in it's most efficient state whilst running straight and level. In a standard boat this state occurs in reality for a very small period of time since the rower is shifting their weight forwards and backwards in the hull in order to row. (I will assume that the boat is laterally balanced) This shift in weight generates increased drag.
18gbrown 1 year ago
Looks pretty awesome, have to admit I'd love to try one of those on the water. I think maybe the reason for the ban may be something to do with the fact I can imagine the recovery phase may take a bit less energy in a boat like that as you are pulling a rigger+blades towards you rather than using your legs to pull your body forward. Of course having not used such a boat my comment may well be a load of bull.. Still though, awesome boat. =]
anthonymeyza 1 year ago
is it faster than a normal rigger?
Leonisgoed 1 year ago
Hi, I'm a masters rower who has and not will race. I look at rowing as a fitness thing. Are there plans or other boat manufactures that make a sliding rigger boat? It can be as banned as it can be, but I would like to row one. I am looking to purchase a boat and one like that would be the best. Any ideas? Thanks. Paul
pgbardotz 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
So does this make u faster.
Aaaeendrew 1 year ago
thats pretty cool a slidding rigger
oomblah 1 year ago
RedHead - It makes the sport too expensive? LOL Have you looked at the price of equipment? It's an expensive sport no matter how you slice it. Though what you say has been promoted as one of the reasons for the banning, the real truth is not as easy to find. Most likely it just has to do with tradition rather than anything more conspiratorial. Rowers are a funny bunch, eager to hop onto new fads in an instant but clinging to dogma and tradition as if their lives depended on it. Just Smile
PaulVideoS 1 year ago
@PaulVideoS
for real, the sliding rigger was banned by FISA because it would be too costly to have it across the board. for all crews to have the fair advantage, it would have to be ultra accessible and it's not. it's a much faster system; kudos to dr. nolte for inventing it.
japrufrockslovesong 1 year ago
@PaulVideoS
for real, the sliding rigger was banned by FISA because it would be too costly to have it across the board. for all crews to have the fair advantage, it would have to be ultra accessible and it's not. it's a much faster system; kudos to dr. nolte for inventing it.
japrufrockslovesong 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
for real, the sliding rigger was banned by FISA because it would be too costly to have it across the board. for all crews to have the fair advantage, it would have to be ultra accessible and it's not. it's a much faster system; kudos to dr. nolte for inventing it.
@PaulVideoS
japrufrockslovesong 1 year ago
@PaulVideoS They banned it because it was obvious better then the traditional boats. Every club that could not just afford to swap all their boats for sliding rigger boats would loose. It would not just be buying one new boat, every boat would need sliding riggers. That would mean richer clubs would win more races, and sports should be about performance not money.
BigDamm211 10 months ago
There is no forward check, so it has to be faster.
crewchamp13 2 years ago
Peter somebody (A German) won the world champs in 1981 in a sliding rigger boat built by empacher. They were banned shortly afterwards. Try telling him they don't go faster.
Burningpoodle 2 years ago
Is it just me, or is he flying?
skatekid25 2 years ago
does a boat with a sliding rigger go quicker than a normal sliding seat boat?
BrooksieLad95 2 years ago
Yes. They are also not legal in most rowing competitions.
jilletreffers 2 years ago
Does anyone know where so see those empacher sliding rigger?
tfvandaalen 2 years ago
This would simulate what it feels like to be on a RowPerfect
manlikeswitcher 2 years ago
Sorry, but let us not lose our center of gravity.... it is the erg which (tries to-) simulate(s) what it feels like being on a boat, not the other way round! :^)
theSculler 2 years ago
is the seat stationary?
poopypoppyops 2 years ago
Yes, the seat is fixed to the boat. The rigger and foot stretcher are attached and ride on a rail system.
PaulVideoS 2 years ago
Do you draw the rigging into your body with your feet or something, i know on an erg this can lead to strains in the upper quads because they arnt used to the pull action loading and generally arnt strong enough to deal with the volume of repititions, correct me if im wrong?
robinfisichella 2 years ago
Comment removed
jakeLVRC 3 years ago
i tried it out... its weird to use but u go freakin fast with hardly any pressure, after the catch the boat speed doent change at all its fkn great
chewbacca1442 3 years ago 2
and they let him race against regular skulls? that seems really unfair. I definately wouldn't race against anyone in a boat like that; it's a definate advantage.
KyoheiTakano 3 years ago
No, the Sliding rigger is banned from competition. No one really knows exactly why, many explanations have been given, and your concern is one of them, however the "speed advantage" has not been proven conclusively, and even Marcel says that he can row his regular boat faster. There are many opinions on both sides of the issue, adn the debate rages on.
PaulVideoS 3 years ago
Because your bodyweight doesn't move relative to the boat, there is far less variation in boat speed throughout the cycle of each stroke. Less variation allows the same average speed with a significant decrease in energy requirements. First patented in the mid 1800's, quickly banned from competition because of the clear advantage.
musicman2690 2 years ago
@PaulVideoS they banned it because it made the sport to expensive
redhead2256 1 year ago
@PaulVideoS My guess would be because it's a lot easier to keep a boat set this way since you're not quite shifting your weight on the boat.
Singe125 1 year ago
@PaulVideoS why don't they just make the slidding rigger a sub division...
L0ngLiveMetallica 1 year ago
wouldn't this take away from challenge of learning to not throw your weight around?
Gavreeli 3 years ago
His last name *is* Hacker, so he clearly must pwn his competition with his rigger hacks, of course.
mothflavour2 3 years ago
loool yeah bro
manlikeswitcher 3 years ago
Actually a very good concept... The rower does not move in the boat only the rig... Therefore the weight of the rower doesn't counteract the momentum of the boat as he comes towards the catch.. I have heard they were banned because poorer countries couldn't afford the technology when they were first developed not sure this is true but they were used in the 1982 World championships but nowthey aren' seems plausible..
eoghan55 3 years ago
Surely the best way of developing a sliding rigger is one that keeps moves in accordance with the seat to keep the blades as close to a right angle from the boat as possible, so that there is reduced slip in the spoon during the drive phase? Marcel's boat looks like a bit of a fad to me, you get the same feedback from how the boat is gliding through the water, you don't need some sliding rigger to tell you your finishes and catches are clean.
Coik85 4 years ago
you kidding?
if the rigger moves with the seat you wouldnt have any leg drive. that's a f'cking terrible idea.
the design you can see is quicker than current singles, despite what the poster might say. the winning times were in the 7min ranges in the 80s, but times have moved on since then.
lankydave87 4 years ago
If the rigger moved with the seat and your feet were fixed, there would most definately be leg drive! If you imagine a bow mounted wing rigger, which is in some way connected to the seat, you would still have the seat on the slide and there would most definately be leg drive.
Coik85 4 years ago
agreed. I think someone made a prototype of this, but I can't remember where. There isn't much incentive for developing radical new technologies in rowing since they will almost always be banned from competition. Kinda like cycling tech in the tour de france...
jamesdl00 3 years ago
False, the rigger and the seat have to be stationary relative to each other. In traditional boats they are both fixed to the shell, in the slidding rigger system they are attached to each other and the seat is fixed to the shell.
musicman2690 2 years ago
the rigger and the seat dont have to be stationary you idiot they arent in a normal boat
couss94 2 years ago
@couss94 one of those two has to be stationary, in this case it is the seat-normally its the boat. The benefit to the stationary seat is that your bodyweight stops causing large oscilations in speed. A smooth ride like that takes much less energy than one were you have to re-accelerate the boat every stroke. They don't necessarily go faster, but it is much easier to go faster longer here than it would be in a traditional boat.
musicman2690 2 years ago
i know one has to move but i think he meant that bothhave to be stationary
couss94 2 years ago
Wouldn't you be throwing even MORE weight (body + riggers!) around with your clever idea? That somewhat takes away the point of using sliding riggers. But clever to think about the angle advantage.
jiin5993 2 years ago
btw this was in response to Coik85's comments. Don't know why yt does'nt show this.
Another comment on sliding riggers: wouldn't the greater length of the stroke cause less lift (that arises from the slight angle of the blade) than in regularly rigged boats? (Assuming the total work applied is the same in one stroke, which is not evident if one stroke would take you further in a sliding rigged boat, which would enable you to use more power in one stroke, because ie a 2k would take less strokes)
jiin5993 2 years ago
wait, you could just change the handle length or the span to overcome this, were it a problem. NM
jiin5993 2 years ago
Marcel pwns noobs. i saw him at a race last year. One of the best rowers of our time.
soygamer 4 years ago 2
Schade, dass es die Rollausleger nicht mehr gibt... Die Boote/das Boot (1x) war schon um einiges schneller, da der Körper sich im Boot nicht hin und her bewegte. Aber die damaligen Entwicklungs- und Herstellungskosten machten das Boot teuer. Da es sich nicht alle kleine Nationen und Ruderer leisten konnten und daher ein signifikanter Wettbewerbsvorteil entstand, hat die FISA Empacher verboten, diese Boote für den Wettkampf herzustellen.
rowingritchi 4 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
He needs to pick up the pace. Maybe the oars were too big for him.
johnlvs2run 4 years ago
I'd imagine that the specialized hardware that must be nearly custom made increases the cost. That said, I've never seen the price for a sliding rig boat so was unaware that they were significantly more expensive, so it's just a guess based on market principles.
PaulVideoS 4 years ago
what is it that makes them so much more expensive?
FiannaFlubert 4 years ago
I believe that it is a currently manufactured boat, and he uses it to train specific aspects of his technique, though I'm not sure what those aspects might be. Would be great to know.
BTW - There really does not seem to be any actual evidence that the Sliding Riggers produced a large adavantage in overall speed. The time for the winners before they were banned were in the 7:00 range in perfect conditions.
PaulVideoS 4 years ago
Is he trying and old or a new boat ?????
ALLDALI 4 years ago
sliding riggers are the worst rowing concept in the whole world...
cylashugh 4 years ago
your an idiot i'm afraid, they were banned by FISA because they were too fast and the relative cost alienated developing rowing nations. the worst rowing concept in the whole world, i'd say was aluminium boats.
crispinknill 4 years ago
yes, "hey were banned by FISA because they were too fast" exactly my point. I shouldn't of used stupid but that was the main thing I thought about when watching this....
djraimundo6 4 years ago
so how is a more stable and less of a rock on the boat the worst concept ever?
hotty198 4 years ago
unfair to people that dont have it.
djraimundo6 4 years ago