How to Make an All Grain Yeast Starter - 2 Litres

[Yourbassfan]

Your correct @Idhare1974. Dry yeast have enough of a cell count to simply just pitch. Thats why a lot of homebrewers use it. I like a lot of videos on youtube and has helped me for great info, however you have to filter and collect the correct information. I feel there should be a knowledge screening on youtube. Lol! Thats why it weirdbeer. Did get some good info on your stir plate Fo. Thanks and Cheers!

[ldhare1974]

I thought you should only ever rehydrate dry yeast .

[synthdood]

I think that you can check conversion with Iodine after 10-15 mins in the oven. If it comes out red, then mashing is done. If it's black, put it back in the oven. This way you don't have to wait an hour.

[woodsie33]

Lookign forward to seeing the out come of your AG Fo. Lead the way. Looking into AG myself aiming for this summer. Keep teaching man. The more different way I see the better for me.

Keep up the great work man always on the look out for new vid's

[weirdbeer]

@woodsie33 Thanks buddy

[dcostell]

Nice job, Fo. I've been taking the easy path with Wyeast's 'slap' packs, but I would like to give this a shot sometime soon. I think you were missing a few things in your steps, namely, a mask, basement, and skin cream. Also, this should have been done over the course of 12 videos rather than one short convenient video. (j/k)

[bmeyer44]

@dcostell hahahhahhaha

[immolateus]

Nice vid Fo! I had to do something like this last year when I ran out of DME...I couldn't get to the local brew store and was brewing several batches so I had to "grow" extra yeast to split between batches. Turned out well....time consuming to mash a starter...but I think its kinda fun, so I didn't mind too much

[bmeyer44]

FO.....clean your oven!!! LOL

good video

[weirdbeer]

@bmeyer44 HAHA! Thanks for pointing that out! GRRRR! I'm a bachelor, give me a break! BTW I want to try No Chill in the future that way I can steal some wort from the Kettle and cool it down to use as a 24 hour starter to pitch the next day. Did you adjust your hopping schedule when you did it?

[bmeyer44]

@weirdbeer yeah the 60 min addition was done at 40 min, the 15 min done at like 5 min and the arouma was done overnight in the hop bag, then pulled out the next day. I really liked the method and with the cool temps, it works ideally.

[weirdbeer]

@bmeyer44 Cool. yeah thats what I've been reading! I'll be doing this for sure in the future. Not sure when . . .

[ZaBuDaB]

Fo no need to make a starter for any dry yeast,liquid yeast absolutely, if your wort is above og 1.045, 1 pack dry 11g+ has around 2-2.5B cells, liquid has 1B cells. have a look/read John Palmer's free site(how to brew . com) 2 cups extra light dry malt extract for my 2L starter, you want a og around 1.040 for 1 liq. yeast, you'll end up with 3B cells+/-, pitch for beers og 1.05-1.70 anything bigger, i make 3+L starter or pitch liq. yeast cake from smaller beer, never reuse dry yeast BREW ON !

[faroutadventures]

@ZaBuDaB What is the down side of reusing dry yeast?

[ZaBuDaB]

@faroutadventures........ dry yeast is not as stable as liq. it has more wild yeast from it being dehydrated..

dry yeast is cheap and their is no real reason to repitch/reuse a yeast cake from a pack of dry..

liq. yeast can be reused 2-5 times.. i've heard of home brewers using it more then 5 times.. i don't, 5+gal of bad beer is not worth it to me..

BREW ON !

[weirdbeer]

@ZaBuDaB Thanks! I know you're not supposed to need a starter but I've had trouble with some stuck fermentations in the past. I made my first All Grain last week and really didn't want it to get stuck so I made up this starter to ensure a really active fermentation. Call me paranoid if you want but this was fun to make anyway!

[ZaBuDaB]

@weirdbeer ... what temp did you pitch dry yeast and what temp was the room you fermented in ?

[weirdbeer]

@ZaBuDaB 65 degrees pitching. 65 degree room

[ZaBuDaB]

@weirdbeer.. that's a low temp, nottingham will ferment as low as mid 50's but it will take allot longer for fermentation, faster you'll need to pitch 72-78f. and have a room temp around 68-72f. if your og is 1.060+ i'd pitch 2 packs of dry yeast, more yeast the better, starter for dry yeast is not really a good idea.

i brewed a smoke pale ale and used nottingham. fermented in my frig at 56f. it took over a month to finish. very clean taste from yeast at low temp, almost like a lager. BREW ON!

[weirdbeer]

@ZaBuDaB In the winter my basement gets pretty cold. The stick on thermometer read 65 degrees for the past few weeks. In the summer, its always 68-70 down there. Thats a little warmer than I usually like.

[faroutadventures]

@weirdbeer 65* That is a beautiful number for brewing. Fo is on to something. Brew on bro.

[faroutadventures]

@ZaBuDaB Really?

[JOMalone3113]

I am with Terp here...why go thru the trouble to make an AG starter? DME will do the exact same thing and it is much easier and less time consuming. I think this is a real waste of time and grain. It would be better to do a full 5 gallon batch of a very simple recipe (basically just 2-row) and then can it into 2L portions to use for future starters. (Jamil does this) I would think they would hold up for a pretty good while if canned properly. Just my 2c...

[bmeyer44]

@JOMalone3113 I don't keep DME around my house, so the all grain would be a better alternative for me, but I always use liquid yeast anyway!

I'm running with the little dogs ON the porch!!! LOL

[JOMalone3113]

@bmeyer44 That is cool, if you have no other option (I always keep DME around, incase you miss gravity on a batch, you can add it, or make a starter as well). but this seems like alot of effort for a "beer" that you are not going to drink, unless you are going to make a larger batch and store it for future uses...

[bmeyer44]

@JOMalone3113 I guess I'm just lazy. I just like the beer I brew and don't worry too much about my gravities...most of my beer run around 4-6%..which is just enough that I can drink two and not get too messed up....yeah, I'm a lightweight!! LOL

[JOMalone3113]

@bmeyer44 totally understand...lol I am too, but I love the process so I give a lot of beer away. I didnt worry much about them but since I am trying to brew more for competitions, I am more worried...

[bmeyer44]

@JOMalone3113 I never considered competing, but can understand having to be more careful if you do compete.

[weirdbeer]

@JOMalone3113 In this situation I needed my starter to get going on a Sunday and didn't have any Dry-Malt in the cupboard. No homebrew shops are open on Sundays around here so it was either do this, or don't make a starter. I made my first REAL all grain last week and really wanted to use a starter so I decided to mash one up. There is no argument that DME can work just as well, but when you're in a pinch this worked great for me.

[JOMalone3113]

@weirdbeer I dont disagree that it is possible, just think you might put that in the description so that people know that it was a last minute kinda decision. Question - How long did it take to make the wort for the starter before you even pitched?

Note - I am not trying to argue, I am just making the point that it is a little more effort than usually necessary for a throw away "beer"...

[weirdbeer]

@JOMalone3113 This took about 2 hours from start to finish including the 60 min mash. I don't know why you feel so strongly about this. If you look it up on YouTube you'll find a ton of yeast starter videos. There are many ways to do it. This is just one of them. Btw. This wasn't for a throw away beer. I used it in an all grain ed worts haus pale ale. Yummm.

[JOMalone3113]

@weirdbeer I am not strongly opposed, I just think in general it is a little wasteful (most of the time). I understand your situation and given the same circumstances I would have done the same...And you are right there are a ton of ways to do things w starters.

You say it isnt a throw away beer, but what did you do with the starter wort once you pitched? Did you pitch the whole thing? If so, that is cool, and I have no issues w that. (alot of people decant and pitch, thus the throw away)

[weirdbeer]

@JOMalone3113 Oh! Yeah I pitched the whole thing. The gravity of the starter was 1.05 and the gravity of the beer I pitched it into was 1.052 so thats close enough. The whole thing was active, why wouldn't I toss it in?

[JOMalone3113]

@weirdbeer Given the way you did this starter, I see no reason why you wouldnt toss it all in. but if you have a 2L starter going into a 5 gallon batch, if the starter wort is not exactly the same as the beer wort, you can pick up the flavors from the starter in the finished beer. I think Jamil's rule of thumb was 5%. As long as the starter was less than 5% of the total volume of the beer then you should be ok to dump it all in, otherwise decant and pour in the yeast after it ferments out.

[weirdbeer]

@JOMalone3113 I actually did put in the description since the video went live that its more work than using DME. So were good.

[JOMalone3113]

@weirdbeer no worries bother, I am just trying to help... U do what you do and thats cool with me...

[faroutadventures]

@JOMalone3113 Did the Belgian Monks have a set of rules to follow when they started brewing? No. They experimented. WLP Labs are working on new strains of yeast as I write. Why critisize Fo for beiing innovative? He may be on to something. Steady 150* temps held in the oven may produce more enzyme activity. No one really knows what goes on in the beer making process. We may think we know everything, but we don't. Because Fo put more time and effort into his beer making, gives room for critique

[JOMalone3113]

@faroutadventures I am not knocking him for doing something he had to do at the time...I am simply stating that it is more effort than is normally necessary. The purpose of a starter is to get yeast into the reproductive phase and up the cell count...All you truly need is sugar water...DME has all the necessary enzymes needed in a starter...The monks probably did use a similar method back in the day, but that was bc they didnt have DME, and they also repitched alot, so no need for starter...

[faroutadventures]

@JOMalone3113 I say embrace his efforts and learn possibly new ways of brewing. Fo could be the next Belgian Monk.

[JOMalone3113]

@faroutadventures I am fairly certain he isnt belgian...but I am not criticizing...I had limited info based on the vid and wasnt aware of the fact he had no DME and that was the reason for the AG starter...but anyone would agree that the method show is a little wasteful and uses grain to produce a wort that is going to be thrown out...

[faroutadventures]

@JOMalone3113 "a little wasteful " ?? Sounds like a critique to me. Everyone has their own method of brewing. Fo has embraced a method that suits him. I like his style . He is unconventional. Maybe he has time to spare. Who's waste of time would it be? Or waste of grain? or whatever waste? That's your opinion. Let the beer speak for itself when he finshes it and ages it. It could be the beer of the century and everyone will be bowing down to the almighty FO, Brewmaster!

[JOMalone3113]

@faroutadventures Fo himself has stated that it def took more time and that most of the time he uses DME (he didnt have any on this day and decided to go with this) which given the circumstances is fine. Just making an AG starter isnt the most effective use of a brewers time, in my opinion. But like I have told him, I have no issues with how he did it, especially after he explained why it was done (which was the day and no DME on hand)... Why are you all of the sudden his defender?

[JOMalone3113]

@faroutadventures No one is attacking him, I was simply stating that this seemed to be a waste of time (when taken out of the context of just making a starter). I have respect for FO and what he does. He is branching out and trying new things, that is admirable. 

[terpsichoreankid]

Nice! Making an AG starter for your yeast must be like introducing a new girlfriend to your brand new sportscar... :-D About how long did it take you to prepare this starter? Most starters I have seen on YT are based with dry malt extract--so I'm really liking how you made it from scratch, all grain style. Have you noticed any flavor differences or propagation variances?

[weirdbeer]

@terpsichoreankid Haha! Nice analogy! I'd say this whole process from start to finish took about 2 hours including the 1 hour mashing time. DME should be just as good as this, and easier . . . but I had none around and it was a Sunday so no stores were open. As for flavor differences . . . I don't know this was my first time making this. But I used it and got a really active fermentation on my brew!!

[terpsichoreankid]

@weirdbeer Awesome!

[gabethegun]

I see you are getting deeper into the craft my young padawan. LOL j/k everyone! Fo knows alot more about homebrewing than I do! I'm getting better though. Cheers brother!!!!!!!!

[weirdbeer]

@gabethegun Haha. Thanks buddy. I think the beer I pitched this starter into will be my very best!

[JOMalone3113]

@weirdbeer this wouldnt be a bad idea if you were making a starter w very similar grain bill as the beer you were making...then you could just dump all the starter in w/o worry of messing with the flavor of the finished beer...

[Unclejona]

Nice AG Fo :)

[weirdbeer]

@Unclejona Thanks buddy!!