Ed Schultz Talks to Dr. Margaret Flowers About Single-Payer and "The Table"

[ExtendingMiracles]

The corporatocracy will keep ignoring the people until they rise up against them. These sons of bitches are too powerful. People need to get organized and take this seriously. One thing people need to remember: Resistance (and the personal cost of it) is NOTHING compared to what they are gonna do to us. No one is safe in a corporatocracy.

[crifoter69]

@ExtendingMiracles Total gospel truth. Power cedes nothing without a DEMAND.

[terpis]

Now lookit..the 'pragmatists' 'played ball' and pushed single payer right out of the discussion, in favor of a pre-compromised, never clarified (i.e. asking to be gutted) "public option".

Now the public option has become a degraded bargaining chip, the 'team member' that designated to fall on the 'compromise' grenade.

For what? To wind up w/ a shit bill that solves nothing for the populace.

We need a wave of primaries. And support for "CHANGE CONGRESS".

/watch?v=cH5Omm8D2BQ

[nohealthcare62]

I PAID BCBS of Tennessee $7500@17years I used it one time in the 17th yr.I had Vulava cancer The OBGYN gave me VIOXX for pain and then we got down to LIQUID Narcotics I had to FIGHT 6 Mo.s to get the cancer removed then I was dropped .They said 2 weeks later they would never cover cancer in me again !

[igd93]

Noam Chomsky cites polls to the effect that 80% of the US population have favored single payer for more than 20 years. But the Corporate types won't make enough money on the deal, so it "has no political support". Money talks, the voter walks.

[ngern]

All the more reason to believe that "money talks" in America and that the majority who are old and poor will never be heard from until these crooks who call themselves politicians and health care companies are taken out of power.

[Spytheweb]

Healthcare will take a dollar over your life. Many Americans think they have health insurance because they pay 500+ a month. Get really sick and file a claim, get cancer and see if you have healthcare? They employ full time people who's job it is to deny claims. Movie with good info is "Sicko" and PBS' "Sick around the world". Why do the Japanese people pay $100.00 for a MRI and American people pay $1,500.00 for the same thing? The Americans are being ripped off! Hospitals don't have price lists

[dmurdah]

Americans feel the need to be creators and pioneers...that's part of what is holding back the process...people feel uncomfortable following others models because they have a massive inferiority complex (thats why u have a giant penis as a monument)...but this is only a small part of a bigger problem which is the corporations have all the money and single payer(government paid) healthcare destroys everything theyve created: pharm, insurance, salaries..etc

[ngern]

PRIDE. We in the U.S. encourage pride in ourselves. Yet, pride is one of the seven deadly sins that plaque the human soul. As long as pride is in our hearts, we will never learn from others; either individually or as a nation.

[thequietkid10]

You people are so naive. Yeah the big bad corporations are the only thing between us and this utopia that is single payer healtcare. LOL.

What about the libertarians, Republicans, the most popular cable news channel in America, and talk radio? Are they going to ignore this?

They're already shredding the Canadian model as slow, inefficient, and unfair. Further more why should we pay for other peoples healthcare? This isn't a B rated movie this is real life?

[lisabob22]

for your information the Canadian system is better than ours and it cost about half as much. Before they went to single payer not for profit the canadian system was horrible, now it isn't perfect but works better than ours. If you want to talk about unfair health care look at the American Healthcare system it is the most unfair in the world and the most expensive

[thequietkid10]

I didn't say I agreed with them, I'm just saying that there is more opposition to Health Care reform then the "health care lobby" and "astro turf protesters" It's an ideological struggle, more then anything.

[GRAYR189]

Of course health care professionals favor "reform": look at the vast amount of taxpayer money they stand to gain access to! And isn't it intruguing that this Senate committee is run by Democrats (who are so concerned with the poor and the "everyman") Oh, and BTW, for those of you in favor of this: How do you like your employer-provided benefits being taxed as income? Isn't it fun getting a raise without seeing any more money, and then being taxed on the extra amount?

[ngern]

GRAYR189, you have no idea about what's going on in the U.S. right now. I suggest you get more informed by trying to be not so short-sighted.

[mexicanexalted]

The needs of the many, out weigh the needs of the few.

Vulcan Proverb

They have universal health care in Star Trek, why can't we?

[mexicanexalted]

I wouldn't compare Kucinich to David Duke, I'd compare him to... Ross Perot, a little weirdo, who makes some sense... but shouldn't be in charge.

[nohealthcare62]

Dennis Kucinich is the Bravest Man in America , it was the Zionists who stopped Kucinich in Nevada do you know what company that was ? I do because I am not a simpleton as you (U'R "Ned and The First Reader" ...)The Wise will understand ...lol...

[mexicanexalted]

I'd be prefectly fine when the UFOs take the old and feeble away... until I myself become old and feeble. :(

I like Kucinich, He's a progressive amoungst a pack of lobby dems. But he would not have been able to beat McCain, you must realize that.

[palkom13]

spot on analysis

[nohealthcare62]

Kucinich was not INVITED to the Nevada Debates Because Obama is really afraid of Kucinich ..He had no money to get a office and Obama had Oprahs money and Speilbergs ..

[jkerouac02]

Obama was afraid of Kucinich? I like Kucinich for the most part, but Kucinich, even if he had Obama money, he'd have about the same shot of being elected President as David Duke.

[mexicanexalted]

We all know that once the Star Trek years come around, everyone will get along, petty differences on Earth will be solved, and we will focus on the real threats to humanity, Romulans & Klingons.

Why can't we just start now... instead of this petty bickering that gets us no where.

Bones wouldn't turn down Kirk because he doesn't have insurance. Conservatism needs to die once and for all. Progressive thinking is the way of the future.

Nerd rant over :)

[SunLogic1973]

Record a Single Payer message for Baucus or the White House at night:

Call 1-800-578-4171 & press 0 for the White House or 1 for Baucus - during day direct connects to their offices.

You record it at night and they will put the message in their Que and forward it during office hours to their offices.

[sincerityproductions]

support single payer healthcare hr676 message me for link to sign petition

[nohealthcare62]

HR676 Universal Health Care for all . org and John Conyers who wrote it and just call and email the White House and others LIKE BIDEN ! WH2024561414 call daily everyday And start yelling at the White House comment line operators who dont give a care about you or me ..

[17R3W]

Thanks for posting this,

I know ED is a big fan of yoursm but I didn't even know he was on your radar.

I'm sure he'd be happy to know that he is.

Are you ever gonna do his show?

[johnrussellCD5]

Yes, I have been listening to ED. I am happy to see someone who is NOT mincing words on this most important issue.

The insurance/HMO industry working in concert with pliant legislators is intent on giving us something with the title Health Care Reform, but it will be in name only and totally lacking in substance.

I would enjoy the opportunity as a working health care professional to appear with Ed on his show if he were to invite me. Thanks for your efforts as well. J R

[johnrussellCD5]

Debbie Stabenow IS FOS! Visit john russell for congress usual punctuation mark followed by the usual C the O and then the M and click on health care. The "HOW" has been described here for the past 3-4 years now.

Stabenow calls the Finance Comm hearing "unfortunate." There was NUTHING "unfortunate" about it! The powers that be understand that if they blatantly EXCLUDE then the protesters will come and this will harm credibility of SingPayerHealth Advocates. This was TOTALLY PLANNED!

[johnrussellCD5]

THE DEMOCRATS as Stabenow presenting herself as a PRIME example of such are just as BOUGHT AND PAID FOR as the Republicans! THIS IS JUST A "LEAGUE" WITH THE DEMS VS THE REPUBS as a mere diversion from the fact that both "TEAMS" are working for the same set of BENEFACTORS!

BOTH "TEAMS" as is witnessed here are working for Corporate America. In this case the health INSURANCE Division!

[johnrussellCD5]

Senator Stabenow... Protector of Insurance Companies and HMO's!

John Russell, MS/ARNP,MBA/HCSM

[johnrussellCD5]

Senator Stabenow: We do NOT want National Health INSURANCE... We are advocating for A National Single Payer Health Care Plan... Whereby we the citizens CHOOSE whether we want to KEEP our company health insurance coverage or opt for the National Medicare for ALL Alternative.

Where we pay a progressively priced fee based on our income with a cap on the MAX that ANYONE would pay. The poor would be subsidized and EVERY patient would be a PAYING patient!

John Russell, MS/ARNP,MBA/HCSM

[johnrussellCD5]

Where I work, case managers tell me that the numbers of "self pay" patients are increasing dramatically, threatening hospital/health care provider financial viability.

What IS a "self payer?" A patient without health insurance, without any means to pay their bills.

Company provided health insurance that Senator Stabenow is so "concerned" about harming is quickly becoming an anachronism!

[Textynn]

Baucus and apparently Obama work for the likes of Bill Mcquire CEO of UnitedHealth Group who is worth over 1.6 BILLION DOLLARS. Our leaders believe that people like Bill Mcquire's ability to make a fortune LARGER than the GNP or many countries is more important than a 50 million and growing pool of suffering uninsured. Our leaders think Americans deserve the debt slavery inflicted on them by the Medical Insurance Industrial Complex. If you get too sick to pay, you can die. Simple!

[Textynn]

Sen Baucus also voted against Helping Families Save Their Homes Act of 2009. He is the leashed and collared pet of the elite.

[Textynn]

Thanks Big Ed. Don't stop now. More more more on this exclusion.

[morality101]

I recall the Energy Task Force headed by Dick Cheney before the Iraqi war, in which a map of the Iraqi oil fields was spread out in secret meetings for the oil company representatives to plan over. The same is happening here with the health care industry. Secret, closed meetings held by our government for the benefit of health care industries to plan and decide how to divide up the citizen population to extract the most profit from, and how to organize and control their resources (you and I).

[Benjamin6420]

im just disgusted by this

[jona95822]

I am sad to see this happening, but I am not surprised. Americans should stop living "the dream of democracy" and accept and start fighting "the nightmare of the dictatorship that really exist." Don't even talk about democracy anymore...Think about the fact that "only two pre-approved" candidates are the options given to americans to choose from. The fate 250,000,000 in the hands of 2 easily corruptable suckers...What do you call that?

[garyupyours]

You are so right.

[nohealthcare62]

Why cant WE BUY Drugs that are sold Over -the-counter in Canada but we need a Dotors permission ...Non narcotics too ..USA is communism

[Textynn]

Good Job Big Eddie. Looking good. Thanks Big Guy.

[dogismyth]

is schultz a jewbag like Franken and Madow...all of which have moved on from Air America. These guys all have big mouths, but they do nothing to help the situation.

I don't have a problem with a single payor. If the gov can't do it, that's because its corrupt and braindead. That's the stupidest excuse I hear nowadays.

everyone deserves medical care, if our gov is getting free care. They surely don;t earn it or deserve it. So why is it different than anybody else.

[sdkee]

So we're arguing over whether to choose fascism (pharma and insurance companies get goodies from the government, we all get raped by law) or socialism (government provides all health care with DMV-like levels of efficiency and humanity).

Can we maybe talk about the third option which is to just get the government out of the way altogether?

[coombsy1989]

Not being funny but in the UK we have socialised healthcare. A little thing called the NHS. It's been working efficiently for the last 60 or so years. And while yes you pay for health care in tax, you are able to go private with healthcare. Your system in the USA leaves hundreds of thousands of people without health care when they need it most.

Which do you think is better?

[sdkee]

From what I've heard from friends in the UK, what you have is something like this: You get sort of half-crappy health care for "free" (paid by tax). This is of such poor quality that most people with the option will choose to go to a private practitioner and so effectively pay 1.5X. They say they'd rather have either 100% socialized or 100% privatized because it ends up just being a tax to them.

As for the 60 year bit, didn't Thatcher make some pretty big changes?

[coombsy1989]

I don't know about where your friends live but around my area the system works. The thing is by having a system that's 100% privatised all that happens is that those that need it the most, the elderly etc. cannot afford health insurance and end up not getting medical attention.

And as for half-crappy there is no other country in the world where I could get hit by a car, get taken to hospital and not have to worry about the bill afterwards.

[sdkee]

Their complaint isn't about the bill, but the quality and service.

One example: I have a Scottish friend living in the US whose father has rheumatoid arthritis. He's gonna have the guy flown out here for surgery because he and his dad do not trust the UK system to do it right.

I'm not standing up for the all of the US system, but I don't see the problem as being one of who pays. The expense is from pharma patents, restrictions on who is allowed to do work, lawsuits, and legal mandates.

[beltanebabe55]

Works fine where I am as well. We have some of the best health care in the world and our doctors are more concerned about their patients because they don't have to worry about who foots the bill. As you say in an accident all that can be done to save you is done and no bill to pay. What was talked about in this video is totally unfair. Why are Americans so frightened of change? It's strange. If you haven't seen Michael Moores "Sicko" watch it, it's an amazing film.

[GuinnevereB]

People here in the US are so programmed to wig out when they hear the word 'socialism' that it's pathetic. They equate socialism with Stalinism, and Stalin was no more a socialist than Gee Dubya Bush. But Bush had a bit of that old Stalinist spirit in him. More than a bit.

Well, socialism simply means that we all take care of each other, and we care more about human beings than about profits... gasp! I just spoke heresy against the national religion: capitalism! Gitmo, here I come!

[Textynn]

Socialism is a dirty word if it helps the people. But there's nothing wrong with socializing loses to the public for the precious elite. And they are never expected to socialize the profits. Socialize the losses, Privatize the profits.

[GuinnevereB]

Something truly ugly is happening in this country, but the propaganda machine keeps telling us that We're Number 1!

Well, this nation has followed the path of greed and aggression since it was founded: murder, theft, lying "peace treaties" that only held until Washington felt the time was right to attack, and outright genocide against First Nations. For a start.

We're tottering at the brink of the same cliff that the Roman Empire tumbled over, God help us. I think it'll get uglier.

[Richardgwm]

Ed Schultz is a god.

[garyupyours]

Nothing is going to change until we take are country back from the rich and the ruling class. Off with their heads and democracy will return. Not untill americans wake up and see the deck is stack against them and over throw these vile corrupt mother fucking whores, will things change.

[bpartoens]

The USA has become an oligarchy. We bailed out too big to fail banks with tax payers money. By not allowing Single Payer supporters a seat at the table more money will go to the for profit health insurers and pharma that don't care about patients, just their share holders. Take away health care insurance from our elected officials. They work for us(even though they receive "donations" from concerned companies) and they are not listening to us. Take away their health care, maybe they'll listen.

[GuinnevereB]

The catch is that THEY have the votes in chamber and they'll never punish themselves. WE have to do that, and they'd better learn to listen to us if they know what's REALLY good for them. Taking bribes is addictive, and the saying is, "money talks, bullshit walks," but they don't realize that their constituency has the real power. They'd better learn really fast.

[pongman]

Why is anyone shocked by this? You can't have health care reform if the invitation is only going out to the people who don't want health care reform. I don't know one CEO of any insurance, pharmaceutical, hospital corporation that is willing to give up his salary of millions-billions of dollars for healthcare reform. Lol, would you?

[beltanebabe55]

Yep and why would they (Pharma co's) want to give up the strangle hold they have on you charging far more in US for drugs etc than they can get away with anywhere else. I think in "Sicko" an asthma inhalor was about $120 dollars they are less than a quarter of the price here (UK) and we don't have to pay anything other than a small prescription charge here unless you are unemployed or have a long term medical condition then it's free. It must be hell to be a diabetic and poor in US you'd die!

[pongman]

Yes I totally agree which begs the question why do we have a Dept. of Defense if everyone inside the country is dying from lack of health insurance? It's like having the best burglar alarm system for your house but the people, the house and the things inside have no value.

[beltanebabe55]

Couldn't have put it better myself and to be honest even though I know that you are being shafted in US I have to try and bite my tongue because I am English and as such feel rather better off and get attacked by some for saying so. Have to say it ....oh no I am in trouble now! Your dept of defence isn't, it's more like a department of "lets spread this lie of democracy and bomb them into accepting it"......sorry.

[pongman]

I see your point. It should be the Department of Offense. It appears to me they do more offense then defense.

[beltanebabe55]

Yes, they do but shhh don't let anyone know you have noticed you could end up in Gitmo. Peace and love to you

[GuinnevereB]

Indeed yes; the inhaler is $120.00 in the US, less than a quarter of that (around $30.00USD) in the UK, and in Cuba? Try $0.15...or was it FIVE cents instead of fifteen? We're living under fascism, folks. People went to war to stamp it out, many, many people died to rid Europe of the scourge of fascism, meanwhile the Bush family, the Rockefeller family and several other 'Fine Old Families' were busy smuggling it home. So now it's here, triumphant, like an infestation of cockroaches. Disgusting.

[beltanebabe55]

Yes GuinnevereB it was 5 cents. I wish we could change the way things are but I fear there is nothing we can do now. These people who have so much faith in a system that cares nothing about them will defend that system and cry "democracy" untill the day they die from lack of health care and a system that would see them die rather than lose power and money. Blees you for knowing the truth and having the courage to speak it. If you need help, ever let me know. My spare room in UK is yours. NHS.

[GuinnevereB]

Thanks, I appreciate your kindness and your insight!

[thequietkid10]

right lets keep them out and reform the health care system like we did in the early 90s......

oh wait, that didn't happen because the insurance and pharmaceutical companies went to the public (Harry and Louise) and torpedo that idea.

[pongman]

President Obama needs to destroy the health care system as it is now and start over like he did Chrysler and GM.

[nohealthcare62]

Thats what I said & We need a Lotto for HEALTH CARE like EDUCATION ...If you are sick how can you go to school .If mom or Dad gets sick who pays the bills ? Cant get health care unless you live under a bridge in a Card-board box !

[ozne64]

why we always got to reinvent the wheel all the time? why don't we go and see in other countries what works and what don't? i mean we pay commissions to study stupid shit but we won't study other countries health care system?

[Hereticbooks]

ozne, the british health care system is fantastic...I've seen it first hand. And as for this Max Baucus, I've voted for him 3 times since I've lived in Montana....he'll be getting a call from me on Monday....mark my words!

[Hereticbooks]

I hate the idea of these corporate pricks looking into my health care and making decisions for me...this of course...if I actually had health insurance, which at this time I don't.

[GuinnevereB]

Here's an idea: PLEASE DON'T VOTE FOR THAT FASCIST OINK ANYMORE; PLEASE! You voted for him three times, and he's stabbed you ... and everyone else ... in the vitals. Instead, why not recall the pig; give the bastard the boot, I say!

[marceloyanez111]

fuck you baucus

[policeeatdoughnuts]

i hate Republicans(and democrats who take lobbying money and have normal folk arrested)

Screw you Mr. Baucus you can go to hell as far as I'm concerned maybe if your loved ones become terminally ill you'll wake up and smell the coffee

we need more politicians like Obama and Claire McCaskill

[biguy617]

Actually McCaskill is not much better. If you read her voting record, you will see she is a bought and paid for democrat. We need more senators like Bernie Sanders and Maybe Jeff Merkley.

[ViraIVideos]

Keep kicking single payer out, and we'll just shout louder.

Single payer is the way to go, it's only a matter of time before it happens.

[jkerouac02]

Whether you support single-payer or not, you should support the reforms that the Obama admin comes out with. Their plan would cover many people not covered, undercovered, or struggling to pay for HI now. Its a big improvement. So don't oppose it just because it isn't single-payer. Maybe someday we'll have single-payer but realistically its just not going to happen at least for at least 5 years and probably much longer.

[ViraIVideos]

It's people like you who don't understand the true power of the Human spirit, that say things are not realistically possible.

If Bill gates had your attitude we wouldn't be talking here right now on this computer.

If people had your attitude we would never have had America.

If people had your attitude we'd never have Amnesty International.

Stop being so pessimistic, and believing that change is not possible now; because it is.

[jkerouac02]

I don't think its possible at this point, but will be in the future. Americans have an extreme irrational fear of socialism. They've also been indoctrinated and instilled with fear about the prospect of a government-run healthcare like (gasp!) Canada's. Americans aren't willing to have a massive overhaul of the means of healthcare delivery at this point. A lot of people with health insurance (who are probably underinsured and don't know it) really don't give a shit about the 18000 that die every

[jkerouac02]

...year due to lack of insurance. Many don't care about the difficulties of the uninsurable or the dependence on their job for healthcare, so long as it doesn't affect them personally. Aside from that, changing the healthcare system requires legislation, which requires votes. Do you think anywhere near the required # of votes could be garnered for a single-payer system? Not to mention the President doesn't support it.

If you really want to get more people covered, Obama's plan will

[witchbippy]

Obama has in fact said in the past that he supports single payer. Poll after poll show that the majority of people in the U.S. want universal health care.

[jkerouac02]

I'm aware that Obama used to support single-payer, but he does not anymore. A majority of Americans may support it, but that doesn't mean congress does.

"The reason that they are not giving us single payer has nothing to do with costs or reason, don't you get it?! It's politics, that's it! It's GREED!"

I never said it had to with costs. And its partly what I was saying that its political. Stop assuming I believe certain things.

[jkerouac02]

...result in major improvements to the healthcare system. It will reduce cost, provide options for coverage for people with pre-existing conditions, increase portability, and it actually has a chance of being passed. Furthermore, supporting this reform in no way precludes further changes (such as a SP system) in the future.

I support single payer, but its not possible right now. This may sound pessimistic, but I see it was realistic. The pragmatic choice is to support the reform that might

[witchbippy]

More than 30% of every health care dollar is spent on administration rather than on care. By eliminating private insurance, a single-payer system would reduce administrative spending by roughly half (nearly $400 billion annually). These savings are enough to provide every American with comprehensive health insurance, without increasing total spending.

[jkerouac02]

"More than 30% of every health care dollar..."

This is a separate question. I'M NOT SAYING SINGLE-PAYER DOES NOT WORK. I actually think its a vastly superior healthcare system. But whether it works or not has absolutely NOTHING to do with whether Congress would pass it.

Why not try to refute the major claims of my argument, which are:

-SPHC legislation would not receive the required number of votes.

-After you guys fail at trying to get SPHC, you should at least support the Obama plan.

[jkerouac02]

...actually pass. Too often people become so ideological and idealistic that they reject more moderate proposals just because its not the best ideal choice...even if the ideal has a very low chance of happening. It can be harmful. Its like a child who asks his parents for $10, is offered a $5, and rejects it because its not a $10. I hope you're not one of those types of thinkers. Support the forthcoming Democratic plan to improve health care.

BTW, Bill Gates sucks. Mac 4 life.

[ViraIVideos]

No see the problem with the world is people settling for less than they can get.

You assume we can't get National Healthcare, and you play right into their hands.

You're the person who takes the first job offer they get, even if they know it won't pay the bills.

I'm the one who negotiates for a higher price.

Are you a female because we're learning women have trouble rejecting a proposal while men are willing to risk it if they know the proposal is bad. That's from my psychology class btw.

[jkerouac02]

I do assume we can't get a Single-Payer system. Why? B/c it is known that not nearly enough Senators support SPHC. For the HC system to be reformed, it requires legislation. Unless you guys can convince several Dems who strongly oppose SP to change their minds (including many paid a LOT by the industry), its LOGICALLY IMPOSSIBLE at the moment.

Explain to me how you guys will get around this inconvenient truth.

And either way, why not support the Obama plan when you guys fail to get SPHC?

[jkerouac02]

ViralVideos-

"Are you a female because we're learning women have trouble rejecting a proposal while men..."

No, I'm not a female. And I happen to hold degrees in Psychology, & I suggest you never try to apply what you learn there to life ever again, lest you fail miserably like you just did. That's not how correlational data about gender/race/etc. is applied Women are more likely to be liberal. How would you feel if I insisted that your politics were based on you being a women (if you were)?

[ViraIVideos]

Wow, you just insisted that nothing in psychology should ever be applied to real life.

The whole point of the question has to do with a bell scale, there are no blanket statements about Men OR Women, just a tendency to act a certain way.

In the previous post you were unable to come to the conclusion that Single payer was possible and we had to deal with what we had.

I simply used a bell curve analysis to guess what group would most likely agree with you.

The 21st century is amazing like that

[jkerouac02]

I said: "That's not how correlational data about gender/race/etc. is applied"

You said: "you just insisted that nothing in psychology should ever be applied to real life"

Are you fucking retarded? The rest of your post is partly nonsensical and I'm not going to waste my time correcting you on statistics and psychology. I mean really lol christ dude at least check wikipedia on a few of your ideas before pressing "Post Comment"

[witchbippy]

The reason that they are not giving us single payer has nothing to do with costs or reason, don't you get it?! It's politics, that's it! It's GREED!

[witchbippy]

BS-if it's not single payer, I am NOT supporting it. We could have single payer now, it's just that our congress and our president have been bought by the corporations and insurance and pharm. companies. IT'S CRAP! Anything less than single payer is unacceptable. Everybody in, nobody out! NO SURRENDER!

[jkerouac02]

witchbippy-

If they're bought off, how can we possibly get SPHC? They're sort of required for that, moron.

Why not accept this plan AND continue pressing for SPHC? This isn't a final decision on our system. Its an improvement. This will save many, many lives, and corrects many of the most serious flaws in our system!

Accepting this plan in no way whatsoever hurts the chances of getting SPHC later, and in fact, greatly improves it!I!!!

People with no logic or reason should be shot...

[ViraIVideos]

You side with the people who wanted states to grant Suffrage to women.

I side with the people who wanted the federal government to allow all women to vote.

Sure, having the states give women the right to vote wouldn't hurt, but eventually history showed that if you don't fight for the greater cause, you get nowhere.

Women got the vote because of people of people unlike you.

And we'll get single payer Health insurance because of people unlike you.

[jkerouac02]

Are you ever going to answer how you'll get around the fact that Congress won't pass single-payer health insurance? I get how you think we need SP, but unless you can explain to me how it is actually possible in the real world, rather than arguing its morally right, you need to support the Obama plan which does much of what universal healthcare would do. And frankly, I won't be able to afford health care in 2-2.5 years and will be fucked. SP would be nice, but I'll take what I can fucking get.

[ViraIVideos]

Lol, look at the optimism that shines in your eyes there :D

If we had your pessimism, the blacks would still be enslaved, women would not have the right to vote, and we'd be under the articles of confederation.

Change can happen, you have to be the change in the world that you want to see.

If everyone acted like you did, WE WOULDN'T GET ANYWHERE!

So back to my original point, grow up, get in the real world, and take a history class already.

Your grasp of history is very very weak.

[witchbippy]

Sure I'll answer your question. We keep pressure on congress. We protest. We vote out everyone that won't give us single payer. And vote out everyone who is voting for more funds for the war. Etc, etc. And we ignore people like you who say it can't be done and tell us we're morons and should be shot. We support a more direct democracy by signing the petition for NI4D. We don't give up and we keep fighting!

[witchbippy]

Those that say it cant be done should get out of the way of those doing it Chinese Proverb

[jkerouac02]

Going beyond is as bad as falling short.

Chinese Proverb

There's also a bunch about greed and moderation that would apply.

[bbbbmer]

Max Baucus is a front for insurance co's who continue to siphon off their pound of flesh from these very important healthcare services -- he should be put out to pasture and should step aside to allow single payer to move forward!!!

[ripgoku]

0 views ?

[WKaliberr]

shut the hell up

goku was a twat and piccolo was a green bastard

[ripgoku]

what the fuck are you talking about ?!?!?!?!?!?!

[upabittoolate]

he's an asshole. goku is a twat. vageta. ftw

[ripgoku]

man you are a retard really !!!!

you do know you are talking about a cartoon !!!!!

and this is video that has nothing to do with it. ah you are talking about my name !!! well it has nothing to do with whatever your retarded mind is thinking you dumb shit !!! now stop it !!!

[upabittoolate]

yes & goku is a twat, piccolo is a pussy.

[postboy08]

goku was bad ass SS4