if only christians stuck to doing good deeds (like jesus meant them to) and not saying stupid bullshit (like the church wants them to), the world would be a much MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH better place.
I have a question about the chair argument was the chair not created from wood? Is it not possible to believe that as the bible says man was created from the say with a breath placed upon sand from the breath of GOD?
The pledge as we know it today was actually written in 1892 and accepted as the national pledge in 1942, and was changed several times, the most recent being under god in 1954. During our second red scare, and in fact the original salute to the flag was not the hand over heart, but a gesture similar to a salute to hitler.
I am not being angry just making sure that history is known.
Well explain this, when the big bang happened there was no carbon produced and if I'm right we have carbon. So what up bitches? Ha? Get shot the fuck down punk asses who can't answer this.
When a star is near the end of it's life and is running out of Hydrogen, the Hydrogen particles bond to form Helium, and then Oxygen, and Carbon and heavier elements.
Once a star starts producing Iron, it explodes....shooting all that matter back out into the Universe.
Hence, everything you see around you owes it's existence to an exploding star.
I like this one better, a lot more realistic, and has anyone on YouTube seen Stephen Hawking's documentary on the proof god is not real. Watch it, it would change the way you think.
What happens if God made the universe with in the system? I know the Bible says God created the universe and earth in six days but if he just spoke and things came to be but God in the Bible,also made the laws of physics so when you thing about it bit of matter could have been there and God put it in place. To me its like this God has a lego box and he has all the peaces there so all he did is put things together. So i think people just need to stop arguing over this and relax
I find problems with the accused "equivocation fallacy," being that it's reasonable credible that the universe had an "initial" state, and throwing out the possibility that we're asking bad questions (e.g. What does the edge of the universe look like?) It's fair to say if something came from "nothing," what event caused it?
It just doesn't actually mean much..."Well if you don't know what caused the universe, your belief is as good as mine!" - which ignores all the discovered evidence...
@Kakaiohic and then go on to make millions of dollars selling what people without the proper knowlegde and reasorses could not make (every single electronic device anyone owns)
And evolution is a fact. Any Christian running around talking about evolution doesn't exist needs to look up Madagascar, there's about 15 species of a bunch of animals that evolved due to not a lot of predators OR humans.EVOLUTION ONLY MEANS CHANGE, BUT THEY HAVE TO BE CREATED FIRST IN ORDER TO CHANGE INTO ANYTHING.Christians say ok well God created everything but didn't evolve anything, that's a lie,if He can create then He can evolve stuff obviously. Atoms WERE created then evolved to planets
You can play games all you want, all this stuff came from somewhere, it has a crazy amount of order, even one atom has a crazy amount of order, each subatomic particle has purpose to keep the thing existing.The fabric of space even clumps things together, BUT planets don't hurl into the suns constantly, because of what's in dark matter.Either God created everything, OR it created itself, which means that leaves you worshipping, because you know you didn't create it.So too bad you didn't create.
@Lisa5656ify actually,it didnt create itself, you're thinking the wrong way, you're thinking about time before there is time. You see, everything came into existence after the big bang, including space & time. Just like there's no such thing as "the earth's edge" time before the big bang doesnt exist. I am a bit confused as to how the prebigbang singularity came to be... but I'm no physicist. Also, that black matter thing you said is wrong.
@Blackspidy619 Well duh it's here, so it was created OR it created itself.there's too much design and purpose for it to have no intelligence involved in it.It's intelligent design everywhere you look because we study it on a daily basis, will always study what God has created.TIME BEFORE TIME?Your teenie mind won't be able to understand, because time was CREATED as long as all this sutff. What is existence outside of time? your mind can't even think of it, cause you ain't God and created nada.
@Lisa5656ify why would this "god" care about us and our planet? we're not the center of the universe we're not the largest planet we're not even the only inhabitable planet, we also destroy our planet... why did he make a species that cheats, rapes and kills itself on a day to day basis.
@Lisa5656ify as to design and purpose, humanity lacks a lot of it, there are still some "leftovers", of things that the body doesnt need anymore (like wisdom teeth). And it has been product of Billions of years of things that had traits that made then stronger, living and reproducing over an extended lifespan. There are natural forces that do give a kind of design, but all you see here would have become that regardless of there being a deity.
@Blackspidy619 And yes I'm right about dark matte,r dark matter exists, face it, now you can't see all the stuff that's i there either, but you can detect it.The Holy Quran already detected it, says jinns, that which has weight but you cannot collide with it.THAT is the definition of dark matter.It's 99% of what exists, and you and your universe are only 1%, why should you believe in the angels and God's throne and all the other stuff God made in dark matter?Why should the 99% believe in you?
@Lisa5656ify I know dark matter exists, and that it consists most of the universe, but it does not keep the earth away from the sun, dark matter is only mass, it is of unknown components, but its there, it can be observed because of its gravitational effect on the galaxies' rotation. Hell, a God could be in there, but it doesnt seem likely.
Also, what keeps the earth from going into the sun is the speed at which it goes around the star (I'm talking about centrifugal force).
@Blackspidy619 there is time before the big bang acording to all major physics thoeries at the moment. but yes you're right about the dark matter thing, this other guy is obviously full of shit.
@scotchy1786 I though I heard there was no time before the big bang from a steven hawking conference here on youtube... although I might be wrong, I'm gona google it.
First of all nice video. Second is you know the other video was a little violent for a god believer. Would god want you to blow up a atheists head? Hypocrites! but then again most of god believers are.
What's sad is if you can understand this video, you never would have believed what the original video said in the first place. The worst part about dumb people is they're too dumb to know how dumb they are.
@mimi1girl2dempsey3 Well aren't you just superior to everyone, oh silent and Zen outsider. We lowly and inferior peasants should all stop for a minute and appreciate your deep and meaningful contribution to this conversation.
@ToothpickMcBrainy I just nod and smile, then change the subject as to not confront or argue with either side. All are allowed their opinions. But still comical to see both sides arguing. Which side winning right now?
@mimi1girl2dempsey3 let's not kid ourselves, the athiests are winning (the scientifically minded ones anyway). since you cannot logically argue against a way of thinking that is based on never fully believing anything and basing any "faith" in evidence.
@mimi1girl2dempsey3 Atheist and theist describes all of mankind. So you just called yourself blind and are probably clueless about your own beliefs and the definition of words.
Ah yes, the american fad of trying to say you're atheist without offending anyone. Do you believe in a god? Yes: you're a theist, no: you're an atheist. If you don't think a god can be proven or disproven then you're agnostic, but that is not a middle ground between theist and atheist. It's an entirely different concept. A theist can be agnostic or gnostic, and an atheist can be agnostic or gnostic.
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You know what fuck it. If you're an atheist just stop using money because it says in god we trust and stop living in the U.S. because the main laws came from the 10 Commandments.
That's right fuck atheists people were never fish and there was no random explosion. If you can go the fuck away and make another big bang happen that would be fucking amazing, but until then just keep being assholes like usual.
@DaSuperTacos i have not been assholish at all good sir, just explaining things i know of in the sciences community, and as i said, not atheist, but with your close mindedness it may turn me away because of the way you act, all true, hard science is objective to the very core, if you can write up a journal of your data, and someone else can pick it up and do the same thing with the same results then it stays a theory and backed by the works, but if someone does not get the(cont)
@DaSuperTacos (cont)same results,then that person did it wrong and it was subjective science, and the data was tampered with just so he can support his/her hypothesis
@DaSuperTacos also sir, religious freedoms, church separated from state, so what if we have god we trust on the money, they had a right for freedom of religion to do so, ya, they did it, also most religions that i studied and practiced, most main streams have 1 god, while if i remembered correctly, 3 had many
I love how you are so insecure and sensitive that our mere existence sends you into hysterics.
The main laws didn't come from the 10 commandments. It is hilarious that you think so. 4 of the commandments are about worshiping that specific God, which are DIRECTLY contradicted by the first amendment which allows for the worship of any God or no God.
I thank you honestly for making this video. When I first saw the original my thoughts were very similiar. You put it excelent.
Since Einstein or at least Hawking mankind should be so much more educated about this stuff, but christianity still achieves to keep their people dumb. False logic is their strongest weapon in this cause and you disarmed it easily.
You will probably never meet me, but you made yourself a friend in germany.
I kind of made a video dealing with their insecurities and psychological reasoning... at least a little bit. It has a lot to do with their view of reality, if their beliefs were wrong it would mean that they actually don't know what reality is, and this would scare the shit out of most people. You and I don't have such fears (mostly) because our reality is backed up by evidence, and any change in that reality would be backed up by further evidence.
@DaSuperTacos You do know that "In God We Trust" was added to our money between 1957 - 1966 right? and that the founding fathers wanted religion and god to have no part of our founding due to the fact that it was part of the reason why we separated from Britain and their religious pressure? Even our nations pledge of allegiance didnt have under god added until 1954. So there was a lot of time between 1776 and then, hard to say our constitution is based on this.
In God we trust wasn't on our money until the 1950's, wasn't in the pledge until the civil war (i might have those reversed but whichever), we were never monkeys or fish; we share a common ancestor with them.
Also, I'll quote Thomas Jefferson here, "The United States is in no way founded upon the Christian religion."
As far as the law, do you need an infinitely tough father figure to tell you not to go around murdering? That doesn't sound healthy.
@DaSuperTacos The god we trust on money was done in the past century by religious nuts. The US laws, and all laws for that matter, have exactly nothing to do with the commandments in the bible. In fact the bible itself is woefully inadequate to be the law or even moral guidance for a first century society, let alone a 21st century one.
@DaSuperTacos...Stop swearing at them and repent for that. You (or me) are not going to get away with slander. Get right with God...and I will see you in heaven. Love.
But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away
@DaSuperTacos when we do we'll be sure to move all the atheists to earth-2 and leave all the religious people on earth-1. As for giving you the recipe... HELL NO. We'll let you keep on thinking 'God' did it all. And anyone who goes atheist on you after we've left we'll be sure to cherry pick them from you, go all Matrix and that kinda stuff. :P
@DaSuperTacos even if you do, you won't have the energy to do so to create anything, there for, all you would have is just a box full of gas and dust with a vacuum, by the way not atheists, but just answering your question also, we made mini bangs in the atom smasher in Texas :D
@DaSuperTacos not enough energy to keep it from expanding infinitely, its basically stays there for a moment and then poof turning into another form of matter, and don't look at me, i am not a physicist, i am only a biologist, i only know the basics of physics, and i don't work on atomic structures, only DNA over here at University Irvine of California, only reading science journals, real sciences journals, with data and everything not nutcase subjective science
If i took some gas and dust and put it in an area where there is absolutely nothing else like an oxygenless box do you think one day it will randomly explode and there will be a little universe in there?
This is very funny cause it makes everyone look like a huge jack ass, ignorant fucktard ... unless you know ... have a brain, there are smart creationalist and smart aithiest ... sadly they are not the majority
You see ... Religion helps but christianity is lame and makes about as much sence as ... well i have no metaphor good enough ... MOVING-ON ... this is why i think the Vikings had it right, it is m0ar logical at any rate ... i actually recently converted to Ancient Norse and my life has never ben better
@k87jury actually, your beliefs are also based of faith, too, believe it or not. The universe is observable and so is God through the Bible and His creations. The universe is
Religion never claims to try and disprove science. The Bible contains a ton of scientific refences (round earth, ocean treanches, ocean currents, etc....) We need to overcome this streotype.
For example, the middle east use to be the center of all science in the world, then Fundie Islam began t rise and fight science. Now look at the Middle East.
@k87jury Creationism doesn't tell kids evidence doesn't matter. It is a specific term about how things began. It's not about evidence, because neither these creationist, nor you, are ever going to know how things begin. I've never met a single person in the states who was a Christian that was against science. Because scientifically showing how something works, doesn't null what or whom, created it and those principles.
Religion will never destroy science. It's not the boogeyman.
Plus show me a creationist website that says ''science is evil and the devil'' and then maybe i can take your posts seriously. Also, show me a website that talks about torturing kids who accept evolution.
Hell. You know hell right. Hell is the place you go if you don't accept Jesus. When you tell a kid he will go to hell, that is threatening him with torture.
@k87jury And this is where your argument falls flat. Yes, I do know many that disagree with evolution...of man. That is, which is totally crazy I'm sure, that people do not accept ape to human evolution based on preliminary research and 'similarities' to then conclude 100% factual conclusions on said topic. I do not speak for bible, how it relates time, but very few will tell you "science is evil". This is a major reason why people scratch their head at insane Atheists.
@k87jury Religion didn't win in the middle east. It's no secret some religions are worse than others i.e., Scientology, extremist Islam ect.. In our infinite stage of civilizations, I'd hardly call the Middle East lost. It's only a matter of time before reform occurs via the young people wanting change. It will happen like it has before, intellectual revolutions progress fast with technology.
Everyone has a right to believe in something. Just as you can claim their against science.
Dude, 800 years ago they were the center of all science and learning in the world. Look where they are now!!!
And they teach that the earth and universe are 6,000 years old, men can live in fish, every animal was on a boat, and that essentially EVERY FIELD OF SCIENCE IS WRONG!!!! What else do you need to do to convince you that they are against science.
@xKenseixX Understand the creation claim is a specific claim from scripture. These claims are demonstrably inaccurate, so says science. Creationism is /not/ science, and therefore advocating it is telling kids/anyone that evidence does not matter.
Saying that we don't know how life began (which we may never know) is not the same as saying that biblical creationism may be true - it is not.
@Arcexey Science does not disprove a creator. I'm not even Christian and I find your analysis pretty silly. Showing how the earth was formed, and those properties, does not null anything. Showing the principles on how plants grow and acquire energy, does not magically void how it got there, what properties were in place to begin that lifeform. Just as the big bang, it shows the principles, not the underlying question of what caused that, how did it come to exist, ect..
@xKenseixX "Science does not disprove a creator." - I agree. I never ever said it did.
"Showing how the earth was formed, and those properties, does not null anything." - Yes it does, it nulls the specific bibical creation account in the bible. This doesn't mean that life couldn't have been created by god in another way. Perhaps god started evolution. However, the account according to the bible - that all life began at once - is just demonstrably WRONG. This does not god does
@Arcexey What confused Atheist like yourself seem to never be able to grasp is that most people accept 1. Their belief on what created the universe and 2. The scientific principles we as humans have observed and discovered to be true. These two are not enemies or contradiction. The man making a wheel, does not null the principles that were already there to begin with. I grew up in a Christian home, Im not Christian. I can make up my own mind. Atheists such as yourselves need some hobbies outside
@xKenseixX not exist, it has nothing to do with that. We do not know how life began, and we do not know how the universe was created (or it if needed to be created).
I'm not disagreeing with you there and I never did, I don't understand why you called me confused. The only thing I said to you is that biblical creationism doesn't care about evidence, and why. And now all of a sudden I'm confused and need a hobby.. what the fuck, dude?
so you made a generalization on a radical religion to define all religions? Excuss me, but rejecting a few scientific THEORYS does not mean christianity is out there to destroy science.
No it isn't. All science does is investigate the universe and gather evidence and etc. It is just a so happens that religion is wrong on so many things.
@WintersHowling The earth is not round. The Bible is not even kinda right in saying the earth is round.
Anyone, in any century BC could've known there were currents, and that passage is very vague. As is the Jonah one about 'bottom of mountains.' You can attribute scientific discovery to vagueness in any book.
Notice you didn't include the other 'scientific references,' like the earth having edges and four corners and ends and water being held up in the stratosphere.
@WintersHowling I used your exact words. I have my ideas, but what is "You have obviously never studied hebrew..." supposed to mean (other than a response dodge)?
Also, if you accept 99.9% of science (things you enjoy, like fast cars and medicine and computers) but then reject the exact same science when it comes to what disproves biblical claims, you are undermining science and attempting to discredit it.
Haha, I like how you (k87jury) didn't acknowledge and argue against the point of the original video. That is, where did everything come from? Who gives a shit about thermodynamics' laws here and there and everywhere?
I love how you couldn't be bothered to watch and understand the video.
I love how, even after I explained in detail why the creationist's position that the law of cause and effect implied that matter had to be caused to exist was shown to not be true and a part of an equivocation fallacy,
I love how you embrace your ignorance. It makes me all warm inside.
@k87jury Again, you're missing the point, where, did, everything, come, from? It doesn't matter that the original video's author didn't understand thermodynamics, it doesn't matter that you pointed out this fact. What matters is that nobody knows how everything came into being. And that was the fundamental point he was making. I don't know if you intentionally ignore this, or maybe you're just so satisfied with your own rhetoric that you CAN'T acknowledge it.
@skofuzen How does 'How to make an Atheist's Head Explode' translate to ''We don't know where everything came from.' If that is the point, why create this gigantic strawman? It is /already/ a common atheist position that we don't know where the matter came from. It's the original author's contention (refuted by k87jury in this video) that the Big Bang requires a cause, which then leads to the atheist response (and first topic of this video), why then does god not require a cause? It
@skofuzen isn't like atheists are first saying god needs a cause, and then the original author, in his humility, points out this would also mean the universe needed a cause, and suggests we all settle on 'we don't know.'
And if I may be as bold to answer for k87jury -> We don't know where the matter came from, and since we'd be asserting the laws of physics existed "pre" Big Bang, we don't accept that matter needing to come from somewhere is even a valid question to begin with.
@Arcexey TL;DR; We don't know, but we're still going to string together one thousand words, wait for you to reply, and attack every point you make.
I'm Christian. I believe in God. I don't believe in Noah's ark, I don't believe the assorted silly stories which were written by Jesus' apostles. I just believe Jesus died for my sins and that is it. I welcome science, I never oppose it. So I pray ( :p) one day we can learn where all this energy and matter came from.
@skofuzen That a god would create asinine laws and then sacrifice himself to himself to forgive you of those sins seems like the silliest story of them all. But sigh... if there was to be a sin, I'd say it's ridiculing someone for merely thinking about existence, The Big Bang, and wondering if/where the matter came from. But the original author's intention is argumentative - let's make that clear. That said, I really hope we find out more about the 'pre' Big Bang in my lifetime,
@Arcexey There's a lot to be said about the benefits of an established moral and ethics code in societies, i.e. Christianity in Europe. But I won't go into a whole discussion regarding those, let's just say atheists have painted a very different picture of Christianity than what it actually was.
As to the reason I follow Christianity is simple because I was born into it, and I'm attracted to the values and spiritual aspect of Christianity, as well as the fact that it is part of my heritage.
@skofuzen I don't believe Christianity because I am first and foremost concerned with what is true and real in this world, and not deterred by heritage or what I /want/ to be true (attracted to spiritual aspect). If you don't go around preaching or voting based on your spiritual beliefs (souls/abortion) then we're good as gravy. And if the 'established moral and ethics code' comes from Christianity (the bible) then it must include slavery and the mistreatment of women. If it doesn't,
@skofuzen then you are just falsely attributing those morals to Christianity - you have built up this image in your mind of Christianity (the doctrine) being good and caring, and you attune your actions to it. And by 'you' I mean you/or Europeans. Since there is nothing intrinsically good about Christianity (that isn't weighed down by its bad), there's no difference than saying the established ethics code in Europe is derived from [insert whatever here].
@Arcexey Indeed. We may never truly know how everything came into being. But in light of the issues the western world are faced with, that is probably #19214 on the list of things to worry about, I'm sorry to say.
@Arcexey I think many atheists, like yourself, fail to realize that Christianity formed itself to fit the people which lived in Europe. We didn't enslave women. We didn't mistreat women. We had a marriage contract, the woman produced children in exchange for the labour which the man offered. Despite what feminazis may tell you, if a husband was found to beat or mistreat his wife. It was likely that very, very extreme measures would be taken against him.
@skofuzen You have to realize that the people formed the moral and ethics codes, not the religion. <-- I'm with you here. It is people that do good, and show natural altruistic qualities. In essence, the Christian doctrine is pro-love, pro-helping and also pro-slavery, pro-misogyny. So when you find a society that is influenced by a group people that are Christians, it is not Christianity playing the role in setting down the good values and moral codes, it is just people - that also
@skofuzen happen to be Christians. We can't see a society abandon slavery and attribute it to Christianity - because the doctrine or essence of Christianity is pro-slavery. As I said, this is people that bring those values. And they also happen to be Christians.
What this gets down to, and why I disagree that religion isn't bad, is that there isn't a single act that religion can do in the name of good that a secular society cannot do. But there certainly is bad.
@Arcexey Christianity isn't pro-slavery. That's a lie. Christianity is the reason the excessive and widespread thralldom in Scandinavia ended. And before you talk about the african slave trade, you have to realize that the slave traders were jewish, and the jewish religion is very open to slavery. The plantation owners too, were more often than not jewish.
And secularism can only divide the people of a nation against each other, and weaken that nation to outsiders, i.e. Europe & America.
@skofuzen I'll try to put it as simplistically as I can. The Christian doctrine - what is written in the Holy Bible - vehemently supports slavery. (Exodus 21, Leviticus 25:44-46 among many others.) The religion of Christianity is the worldviews expressed in The Bible.
In order for you to say, 'Christianity is the reason slavery was abolished,' you have to show what, in the Christian doctrine, would be the motivation for these anti-slavery morals. When you try to find that motivation
@skofuzen in the Bible, what you find is the opposite: tons and tons of pro-slavery passages, explicitly describing how to buy slaves, how to punish them, what types of slaves to own.
The doctrine of Christianity, i.e. Christianity itself - cannot abolish something it supports. But that doesn't mean regular people, like you, who are also Christians, can't be anti-slavery.
I don't really care about what group did what in history, you have to show causation between
@Arcexey Firstly, you are talking about the old testament, you know, the one jews adhere to. Secondly, Christians adhere to the new testament, and theologians are in frequent debates whether or not the new testament condemns slavery. And this certainly doesn't constitute "tons" of pro-slavery passages.
Let's just say that the new testament can, to some degree, support slavery, but ultimately, it was used to condemn it. Courtesy of God fearing Christian men.
@skofuzen Adherence has nothing to do with it. Christianity gets its morals from god and from the Bible does it not? Does the Christian god not explicitly endorse slavery? Is god wrong about slavery? Also, you had better adhere to the old testament, Jesus orders you to: Matthew 5:18-19 John 10:35 Luke 16:17 Is Jesus and Yahweh not the same person? And if you don't adhere, I'm guessing you aren't concerned in the least with the 10 Commandments?
@Arcexey You are so wrong. The old testament is what jews practised before Christ, and still do. The new testament is what happened after the messiah, Jesus Christ came, and taught his disiples of the evil ways of the jewish religion, that they were the children of Satan. In other words, any Christian should distance himself from judaism, because Jesus held them in contempt, and so did Martin Luther, the man from which my denomination grew. In other words, anything you see in the old testament -
@Arcexey - is what any good Christian will NOT do. Even though it is the same God, it's a new message, and new directions on how to live and prosper. In other words, "Judeo-Christian" is the biggest joke in the world, and I cringe every time I hear someone say it. And whenever you hear someone bad mouth Christians, they are quoting the jewish part of the bible. So direct your scorn and judgement where it's warranted. Look up "Israel slave trade".
@skofuzen I don't care about your interpretation or what your church tells you. Show me where in the bible it says everything you have just typed. I showed you exactly how Jesus said 'EVERYONE' needs to follow those rules less they be judged least.
"In other words, anything you see in the old testament -is what any good Christian will NOT do."
In other words, I had better not see you or Christians agreeing with or following ANY of the 10 Commandments.
@Arcexey I don't know how I can be much clearer than this; the old testament is "history", Christians aren't supposed to adhere to it. Doing so, and teaching Christians according to the old testament is heresy. There's a lot of different Christians in the world, if you're American, there's probably a lot of judeo-Christian non-sense floating around, which would make most American Christians heretics.
@skofuzen You can be 'much clearer' by showing me /why/ Christians don't have to 'adhere' to the old testament laws. Show me where it exactly says that in scripture! And reconcile why Jesus is saying that EVERYONE needs to obey Moses's laws (as I linked you in my quotes). And again, this must mean that you don't adhere to the 10 Commandments.
@Arcexey Many people today hold the bible to be the literal word of God. I don't. I disregard the old testament, and I only adhere to Jesus Christ himself, and what he said. The apostles wrote their "scripture" years and years after he was crucified. In addition to that, while Christ approved some mosaic law, he didn't command us to adhere to them. Of course by this I mean, I only adhere to what the apostles wrote which Jesus himself had said, not their opinions later in life.
@skofuzen wow, you are going to have to explain to me how your passage comes close to the topic at hand. Also, are you putting Paul's word above the passages that I gave you - that Jesus actually said?
"Of course by this I mean, I only adhere to what the apostles wrote which Jesus himself had said," "For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished." I mean, is that not black and white, clear as day?
@skofuzen "It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." Does Jesus not specifically scold those who break the laws Moses dictated, does he not say, clearly, the scripture cannot be broken?
Also, you did not begin to link where or why only jews would have to adhere to these laws.
@skofuzen "while Christ approved some mosaic law, he didn't command us to adhere to them. " He approved only some? "not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law" "Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments" "than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." Those are very powerful, specific words, man.
@Arcexey It's impossible to come to a clear understanding of these laws. I only brought up what Paul had written because you asked for it. When we begin to dissect everything we write here, it's going to be an endless back and forth bickering. I'll just tell you how I live my life as a Christian.
I try to do as little bad as I can, and as much good as I can.
@skofuzen I think the bible can be interpreted in any way you wish, but that doesn't mean some interpretations aren't more valid than others.
I do agree it'll be an endless back and forth.
To avoid this.. just don't attribute the abolition of slavery (in any country) to Christianity.
And don't say that doing as little bad as you can and as much good as you can is somehow derived from the doctrine of Christianity, or from your god. Because, as I showed, your god promotes slavery.
@skofuzen I think the bible can be interpreted in any way you wish, but that doesn't mean some interpretations aren't more valid than others.
I do agree it'll be an endless back and forth.
To avoid this, just don't attribute the abolition of slavery (in any country) to Christianity.
And don't say that doing as little bad as you can and as much good as you can is somehow derived from the doctrine of Christianity, or from your god. Because, as I showed, your god promotes s lavery.
@skofuzen In other words, I'm sure you're a very good person and you mean well and you'd help at the drop of a hat. But your god wouldn't, because he clearly endorses slavery. So don't say those morals, those values (which are awesome and I applaud that you're willing to help when so many don't) come from God/ come from Christianity.
@Arcexey All these laws are too tedious and difficult to explain and understand, and ultimately, breaking one or two won't damn you to hell, not believing in God and accepting Jesus Christ as your saviour, will damn you to hell. Trying to explain everything in the bible will just lead you into a quagmire of confusion and frustration, because if there's one thing theologians can agree on, it is that the bible can support virtually any viewpoint.
Then wow does your God suck at conveying a message. I mean seriously, this is the work of an infinite being who wants us to know us, and the best it can do is a disheveled piled of pages where you have to disregard most, and then cherry pick what ever you want from the rest.
If you know how bad it is, then why hold it as holy? Or good? Or believe anything in it?
"Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;"
This clearly shows that after Jesus Christ's ascension to heaven, he created a split between the old ways of the old testament, and the beginning for the new testament. In other words, we aren't obligated by God to adhere to the old laws.
@skofuzen Good argument you two are having. Makes for a fun read, and while you're both making some valid, and some not so valid, arguments, most importantly this is't full of the sort of capslocked trolling that permeates every other facet of the Internet. A welcome sight.
@Arcexey Also, atheists really have to stop quoting the old testament. It's ironic that you cloak yourself in a profound sense of superior knowledge, yet you don't know that Christians adhere to the new testament.
ITS IN YOUR HOLY BOOK!!!!!!!!!! IT IS YOUR GOD!!!!
It isn't superior knowledge that we feel smug about. It is the fact that we are not in such a state of delusion that you hold a book and God to be holy but then just pretend most of it doesn't exist.
@skofuzen secularism and dividing people in a nation. I really don't see how not being religious has anything to do with being 'weakened to outsiders.' I also don't really understand what that means. If we're following this properly, and all nations are secular, wouldn't other nations then be weak as well? Wow my Captcha is 'cocless.' lol.
@Arcexey Another thing atheists get wrong, is the thousand and one different social and ethics codes which are still in the bible, which Europeans in the real world, didn't adopt. Wife battery, enslavement and other assorted horrors remained in the middle-east, and they perished in, for example Scandinavia, which prior to Christianity, was full of slavery (thralldom). -
@Arcexey - You have to realize that the people formed the moral and ethics codes, not the religion. And much of the ethics and morals from the middle-east which was in the bible, was basically done away with, quietly, by Europeans to fit their culture and human traits.
@Arcexey The other benefit of religion is the hive-mind it creates. It gives you an effective population with similar morals, and it strengthens it to a degree which was absolutely necessary for it to develop. Today, everyone has a different opinion. This has weakened us, substantially. But THAT, is a subject I'm not in the mood to discuss right now. Suffice it to say, religion is not bad. And the extremes of Christianity has been replaced with the extremes of political correctness and feminism.
if only christians stuck to doing good deeds (like jesus meant them to) and not saying stupid bullshit (like the church wants them to), the world would be a much MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH better place.
Blackspidy619 19 hours ago
I have a question about the chair argument was the chair not created from wood? Is it not possible to believe that as the bible says man was created from the say with a breath placed upon sand from the breath of GOD?
scottvfly 22 hours ago
oh how i love smart people :D
jhartguitar 1 day ago
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@philippides
Both were actually inserted in the 50's.
The pledge as we know it today was actually written in 1892 and accepted as the national pledge in 1942, and was changed several times, the most recent being under god in 1954. During our second red scare, and in fact the original salute to the flag was not the hand over heart, but a gesture similar to a salute to hitler.
I am not being angry just making sure that history is known.
Innatechaplain 1 day ago
Very, very funny, and eloquently put. *clap clap*
thegreatestoffools 1 day ago
VIDEOOOOO FAILLLLLLLL. lol I'm amazed at what people post, and claim its intelligent lol
tanner1300 1 day ago
@tanner1300 TROOOOOLLL FFAAAAIIIIL it's funny how stupid peaple call smart people stupid
Blackspidy619 19 hours ago
@Blackspidy619 I know right? You're so awesome! I love you bro
tanner1300 16 hours ago
Well explain this, when the big bang happened there was no carbon produced and if I'm right we have carbon. So what up bitches? Ha? Get shot the fuck down punk asses who can't answer this.
DaSuperTacos 1 day ago
@DaSuperTacos
Ughhhhhhh
Carbon comes from Supernovae.
When a star is near the end of it's life and is running out of Hydrogen, the Hydrogen particles bond to form Helium, and then Oxygen, and Carbon and heavier elements.
Once a star starts producing Iron, it explodes....shooting all that matter back out into the Universe.
Hence, everything you see around you owes it's existence to an exploding star.
Even you.
NYCujo79 1 day ago
I love you man
DariousFlores 1 day ago
I like this one better, a lot more realistic, and has anyone on YouTube seen Stephen Hawking's documentary on the proof god is not real. Watch it, it would change the way you think.
Ormaximus 2 days ago
What happens if God made the universe with in the system? I know the Bible says God created the universe and earth in six days but if he just spoke and things came to be but God in the Bible,also made the laws of physics so when you thing about it bit of matter could have been there and God put it in place. To me its like this God has a lego box and he has all the peaces there so all he did is put things together. So i think people just need to stop arguing over this and relax
AnthonyRthegreat 2 days ago
Badly animated man who can still airquote? This video is awesome.
BrashOfKhaamph 2 days ago
I find problems with the accused "equivocation fallacy," being that it's reasonable credible that the universe had an "initial" state, and throwing out the possibility that we're asking bad questions (e.g. What does the edge of the universe look like?) It's fair to say if something came from "nothing," what event caused it?
It just doesn't actually mean much..."Well if you don't know what caused the universe, your belief is as good as mine!" - which ignores all the discovered evidence...
dragontips 2 days ago
Debate me, or Hate me, either you'll be pwned.
HateCrimesDivision 3 days ago
Wow. He's a lot skinnier in stick figure form. LOL
I know ... I know ... Cheap jab.
But very good video! I wish you would have more clearly explained what a logical fallacy is and the equivocation fallacy specifically.
UniversalPotentate 3 days ago
And that's why nerds get beaten every single day.
Kakaiohic 3 days ago
@Kakaiohic and then go on to make millions of dollars selling what people without the proper knowlegde and reasorses could not make (every single electronic device anyone owns)
Blackspidy619 2 days ago
And evolution is a fact. Any Christian running around talking about evolution doesn't exist needs to look up Madagascar, there's about 15 species of a bunch of animals that evolved due to not a lot of predators OR humans.EVOLUTION ONLY MEANS CHANGE, BUT THEY HAVE TO BE CREATED FIRST IN ORDER TO CHANGE INTO ANYTHING.Christians say ok well God created everything but didn't evolve anything, that's a lie,if He can create then He can evolve stuff obviously. Atoms WERE created then evolved to planets
Lisa5656ify 3 days ago
@Lisa5656ify Did you see them evolve?
DaSuperTacos 3 days ago
@DaSuperTacos
Have we witnessed evolution first hand. Yes. Yes we have. That is kind of why it is funny when you deny it.
k87jury 3 days ago
You can play games all you want, all this stuff came from somewhere, it has a crazy amount of order, even one atom has a crazy amount of order, each subatomic particle has purpose to keep the thing existing.The fabric of space even clumps things together, BUT planets don't hurl into the suns constantly, because of what's in dark matter.Either God created everything, OR it created itself, which means that leaves you worshipping, because you know you didn't create it.So too bad you didn't create.
Lisa5656ify 3 days ago
@Lisa5656ify actually,it didnt create itself, you're thinking the wrong way, you're thinking about time before there is time. You see, everything came into existence after the big bang, including space & time. Just like there's no such thing as "the earth's edge" time before the big bang doesnt exist. I am a bit confused as to how the prebigbang singularity came to be... but I'm no physicist. Also, that black matter thing you said is wrong.
Blackspidy619 3 days ago
@Blackspidy619 Well duh it's here, so it was created OR it created itself.there's too much design and purpose for it to have no intelligence involved in it.It's intelligent design everywhere you look because we study it on a daily basis, will always study what God has created.TIME BEFORE TIME?Your teenie mind won't be able to understand, because time was CREATED as long as all this sutff. What is existence outside of time? your mind can't even think of it, cause you ain't God and created nada.
Lisa5656ify 3 days ago
@Lisa5656ify why would this "god" care about us and our planet? we're not the center of the universe we're not the largest planet we're not even the only inhabitable planet, we also destroy our planet... why did he make a species that cheats, rapes and kills itself on a day to day basis.
listenablesounds 3 days ago
@Lisa5656ify as to design and purpose, humanity lacks a lot of it, there are still some "leftovers", of things that the body doesnt need anymore (like wisdom teeth). And it has been product of Billions of years of things that had traits that made then stronger, living and reproducing over an extended lifespan. There are natural forces that do give a kind of design, but all you see here would have become that regardless of there being a deity.
Blackspidy619 2 days ago
@Blackspidy619 And yes I'm right about dark matte,r dark matter exists, face it, now you can't see all the stuff that's i there either, but you can detect it.The Holy Quran already detected it, says jinns, that which has weight but you cannot collide with it.THAT is the definition of dark matter.It's 99% of what exists, and you and your universe are only 1%, why should you believe in the angels and God's throne and all the other stuff God made in dark matter?Why should the 99% believe in you?
Lisa5656ify 3 days ago
@Lisa5656ify I know dark matter exists, and that it consists most of the universe, but it does not keep the earth away from the sun, dark matter is only mass, it is of unknown components, but its there, it can be observed because of its gravitational effect on the galaxies' rotation. Hell, a God could be in there, but it doesnt seem likely.
Also, what keeps the earth from going into the sun is the speed at which it goes around the star (I'm talking about centrifugal force).
Blackspidy619 2 days ago
@Lisa5656ify no one ever said dark matter didn't exist, you just explained what it did like a retard.
scotchy1786 1 day ago
@Blackspidy619 there is time before the big bang acording to all major physics thoeries at the moment. but yes you're right about the dark matter thing, this other guy is obviously full of shit.
scotchy1786 1 day ago
@scotchy1786 I though I heard there was no time before the big bang from a steven hawking conference here on youtube... although I might be wrong, I'm gona google it.
thanks for pointing it out :D
Blackspidy619 19 hours ago
Does the concept of God break the first rule of thermodynamics?
FedoraJames 3 days ago
@FedoraJames the concept of god creating things out of nothing does
scotchy1786 1 day ago
First of all nice video. Second is you know the other video was a little violent for a god believer. Would god want you to blow up a atheists head? Hypocrites! but then again most of god believers are.
LETSFINDTHEFACTS 4 days ago
mate, i love you
TheMightyVince 4 days ago
What's sad is if you can understand this video, you never would have believed what the original video said in the first place. The worst part about dumb people is they're too dumb to know how dumb they are.
ghostpsalm99 4 days ago
huhuhuh nurdy atheeist fatass huhuhuh
MrRedtubelover 4 days ago
@MrRedtubelover I don't think I've ever seen a comment that better disproved its own provenance.
(Translation into Retardese-YOU DONE FUCKED UP CLETUS)
ToothpickMcBrainy 4 days ago
@ToothpickMcBrainy Help me! Mah tongue done got stuckin mah cheek!
MrRedtubelover 4 days ago
@MrRedtubelover Poe's law, lol. I've seen comments that stupid before. My bad.
ToothpickMcBrainy 3 days ago
I love watching theists and atheists battle it out. It's like two blind men arguing about the color of the paint on the wall. Very entertaining.
mimi1girl2dempsey3 4 days ago
@mimi1girl2dempsey3 Well aren't you just superior to everyone, oh silent and Zen outsider. We lowly and inferior peasants should all stop for a minute and appreciate your deep and meaningful contribution to this conversation.
ToothpickMcBrainy 4 days ago
@ToothpickMcBrainy I just nod and smile, then change the subject as to not confront or argue with either side. All are allowed their opinions. But still comical to see both sides arguing. Which side winning right now?
mimi1girl2dempsey3 4 days ago
@mimi1girl2dempsey3 let's not kid ourselves, the athiests are winning (the scientifically minded ones anyway). since you cannot logically argue against a way of thinking that is based on never fully believing anything and basing any "faith" in evidence.
scotchy1786 4 days ago
@mimi1girl2dempsey3 Atheist and theist describes all of mankind. So you just called yourself blind and are probably clueless about your own beliefs and the definition of words.
LordKilmir 4 days ago
@LordKilmir umm agnostic maybe? might want to include that in your "all mankind" since it's one of the largest growing demographics
scotchy1786 4 days ago
@scotchy1786
Ah yes, the american fad of trying to say you're atheist without offending anyone. Do you believe in a god? Yes: you're a theist, no: you're an atheist. If you don't think a god can be proven or disproven then you're agnostic, but that is not a middle ground between theist and atheist. It's an entirely different concept. A theist can be agnostic or gnostic, and an atheist can be agnostic or gnostic.
LordKilmir 1 day ago
You beat me to it, I had the same idea to retort to this. I must say, bravo. Great video reply.
redeyeswolfc11 5 days ago
Lol this freakin hilarious
masterknaster 5 days ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
You know what fuck it. If you're an atheist just stop using money because it says in god we trust and stop living in the U.S. because the main laws came from the 10 Commandments.
That's right fuck atheists people were never fish and there was no random explosion. If you can go the fuck away and make another big bang happen that would be fucking amazing, but until then just keep being assholes like usual.
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos i have not been assholish at all good sir, just explaining things i know of in the sciences community, and as i said, not atheist, but with your close mindedness it may turn me away because of the way you act, all true, hard science is objective to the very core, if you can write up a journal of your data, and someone else can pick it up and do the same thing with the same results then it stays a theory and backed by the works, but if someone does not get the(cont)
rubenflonne 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos (cont)same results,then that person did it wrong and it was subjective science, and the data was tampered with just so he can support his/her hypothesis
rubenflonne 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos also sir, religious freedoms, church separated from state, so what if we have god we trust on the money, they had a right for freedom of religion to do so, ya, they did it, also most religions that i studied and practiced, most main streams have 1 god, while if i remembered correctly, 3 had many
rubenflonne 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos
I love how you are so insecure and sensitive that our mere existence sends you into hysterics.
The main laws didn't come from the 10 commandments. It is hilarious that you think so. 4 of the commandments are about worshiping that specific God, which are DIRECTLY contradicted by the first amendment which allows for the worship of any God or no God.
I am sorry the truth hurts you so much.
k87jury 5 days ago 22
@k87jury
I thank you honestly for making this video. When I first saw the original my thoughts were very similiar. You put it excelent.
Since Einstein or at least Hawking mankind should be so much more educated about this stuff, but christianity still achieves to keep their people dumb. False logic is their strongest weapon in this cause and you disarmed it easily.
You will probably never meet me, but you made yourself a friend in germany.
k3nny111 1 day ago
@k87jury
I kind of made a video dealing with their insecurities and psychological reasoning... at least a little bit. It has a lot to do with their view of reality, if their beliefs were wrong it would mean that they actually don't know what reality is, and this would scare the shit out of most people. You and I don't have such fears (mostly) because our reality is backed up by evidence, and any change in that reality would be backed up by further evidence.
TheArcticSage 1 day ago
@DaSuperTacos You do know that "In God We Trust" was added to our money between 1957 - 1966 right? and that the founding fathers wanted religion and god to have no part of our founding due to the fact that it was part of the reason why we separated from Britain and their religious pressure? Even our nations pledge of allegiance didnt have under god added until 1954. So there was a lot of time between 1776 and then, hard to say our constitution is based on this.
Pibbmasta 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos
In God we trust wasn't on our money until the 1950's, wasn't in the pledge until the civil war (i might have those reversed but whichever), we were never monkeys or fish; we share a common ancestor with them.
Also, I'll quote Thomas Jefferson here, "The United States is in no way founded upon the Christian religion."
As far as the law, do you need an infinitely tough father figure to tell you not to go around murdering? That doesn't sound healthy.
philippides 5 days ago 16
@DaSuperTacos talk about someone being buttfrustrated
Hey DaSuperTacos, the Holy Spirit sucks baby dicks!
ToothpickMcBrainy 4 days ago
@DaSuperTacos The god we trust on money was done in the past century by religious nuts. The US laws, and all laws for that matter, have exactly nothing to do with the commandments in the bible. In fact the bible itself is woefully inadequate to be the law or even moral guidance for a first century society, let alone a 21st century one.
LordKilmir 4 days ago
@DaSuperTacos It doesn't matter if you don't think evolution is true or not, because it is.
Take this: radiometric dating. RADIOMETRIC DATING. I expect a response.
MagneticPig 4 days ago
@DaSuperTacos hahahaha America = free country. Not really.
Christians are the cancer of America and the only reason why I shouldn't go there. Really, what a shame.
aartbastiaan22 3 days ago
@DaSuperTacos I really think you should read up a little about the constitution and history... You have a few things horribly wrong, lol
Ankoku15 2 days ago
@DaSuperTacos lol butthurt
fuckwhatyoufeel 2 days ago
@DaSuperTacos wow.. * queue music american idiot by green day *
joblagz 1 day ago
@DaSuperTacos wow, bro... way to do a shit job conveying God's love...
BoushoC 1 day ago
@DaSuperTacos Are you retarded? so i cant go to usa without that you retards come at me and beat me up with the bible?
FredGuyStudios 1 day ago in playlist Favorite videos
@DaSuperTacos...Stop swearing at them and repent for that. You (or me) are not going to get away with slander. Get right with God...and I will see you in heaven. Love.
crisgai1 1 day ago
And you would remove my first comment because you couldn't answer it (:
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos
I have never removed a comment.
k87jury 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos
I have never deleted a comment
k87jury 5 days ago
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But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away
BarbieBoy1997 5 days ago
@BarbieBoy1997 True if people stop following religion sooner or later this will happen. Our laws are pretty much based off the 10 Commandments.
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
Or... since you know how the big bang happened, can you do a mini bang and show us your mini universe?
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos when we do we'll be sure to move all the atheists to earth-2 and leave all the religious people on earth-1. As for giving you the recipe... HELL NO. We'll let you keep on thinking 'God' did it all. And anyone who goes atheist on you after we've left we'll be sure to cherry pick them from you, go all Matrix and that kinda stuff. :P
tjstevens74 5 days ago
@tjstevens74 Who said god did it? There is no one from our time that witnessed it..
Catholic- Ultimate being made everything
Atheistic- Shit just exploded
i was just raised in a catholic family so i respect my religion.
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos even if you do, you won't have the energy to do so to create anything, there for, all you would have is just a box full of gas and dust with a vacuum, by the way not atheists, but just answering your question also, we made mini bangs in the atom smasher in Texas :D
rubenflonne 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos no energy man made yet, we can make unlimited energy, harvesting it is another story
rubenflonne 5 days ago
@rubenflonne Since you and whoever made mini bangs in Texas shouldnt there be a mini universe or a little planet or a microscopic pebble?
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos not enough energy to keep it from expanding infinitely, its basically stays there for a moment and then poof turning into another form of matter, and don't look at me, i am not a physicist, i am only a biologist, i only know the basics of physics, and i don't work on atomic structures, only DNA over here at University Irvine of California, only reading science journals, real sciences journals, with data and everything not nutcase subjective science
rubenflonne 5 days ago
Okay so atheists..
If i took some gas and dust and put it in an area where there is absolutely nothing else like an oxygenless box do you think one day it will randomly explode and there will be a little universe in there?
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos fuck yeah!
Vekoma1261 5 days ago
@DaSuperTacos Just make sure you're in there with it... we need witnesses, ya know.
tjstevens74 5 days ago
@tjstevens74 haha funnay.
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
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@k87jury "1. First law of thermo, energy/matter CAN NOT be created/destroyed.
2.Matter/Energy exists.
3. Since it CAN NOT be created, it must have always been there in one form or another."
1. I know i had science in 3rd grade.
2. If it's always been there why couldn't have god always be there too.
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
Comment removed
DaSuperTacos 5 days ago
lol, geez so many atheists on youtube.
Xyclon87 6 days ago
May god show all the athiests the way to heaven in Jesus name AMEN!! : ) my good deed for the day
Debello36 1 week ago
This is very funny cause it makes everyone look like a huge jack ass, ignorant fucktard ... unless you know ... have a brain, there are smart creationalist and smart aithiest ... sadly they are not the majority
TropnevadNitsuj 1 week ago
You see ... Religion helps but christianity is lame and makes about as much sence as ... well i have no metaphor good enough ... MOVING-ON ... this is why i think the Vikings had it right, it is m0ar logical at any rate ... i actually recently converted to Ancient Norse and my life has never ben better
TropnevadNitsuj 1 week ago
oh fuck these long comments, like people r rlly gonna read it cos they think ur smart -.-
badyuff 1 week ago
I'm not religious.
And this was a terrible video.
gadzy 1 week ago
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@k87jury actually, your beliefs are also based of faith, too, believe it or not. The universe is observable and so is God through the Bible and His creations. The universe is
derf55509 1 week ago
@derf55509
So beliefs built on evidence is faith.... Cool story bro!
God is not observable through the Bible. God isn't observable everywhere. That is kind of the problem.
k87jury 1 week ago
Religion never claims to try and disprove science. The Bible contains a ton of scientific refences (round earth, ocean treanches, ocean currents, etc....) We need to overcome this streotype.
WintersHowling 1 week ago
@WintersHowling
Religion activaly attmpts to destroy science.
Creationism for example.
Telling kids that evidence doesn't matter.
For example, the middle east use to be the center of all science in the world, then Fundie Islam began t rise and fight science. Now look at the Middle East.
k87jury 1 week ago 3
@k87jury Creationism doesn't tell kids evidence doesn't matter. It is a specific term about how things began. It's not about evidence, because neither these creationist, nor you, are ever going to know how things begin. I've never met a single person in the states who was a Christian that was against science. Because scientifically showing how something works, doesn't null what or whom, created it and those principles.
Religion will never destroy science. It's not the boogeyman.
xKenseixX 1 week ago
@xKenseixX
Less then half of Americans accept evolution. That is a problem caused by religion.
If you haven't met these people, then you haven't walked into a church or watched television.
Creationism is the belief that the earth is 6,000 years old, Bible is true, and all of science is wrong and of the devil.
They enjoy lying to kids, and threatening them with torture if they don;t believe.
And look at the Middle East, that is an area where religion won against science.
k87jury 1 week ago 2
@k87jury
Plus show me a creationist website that says ''science is evil and the devil'' and then maybe i can take your posts seriously. Also, show me a website that talks about torturing kids who accept evolution.
WintersHowling 1 week ago
@WintersHowling
Answersingenesis
Jesus Camp.
Hell. You know hell right. Hell is the place you go if you don't accept Jesus. When you tell a kid he will go to hell, that is threatening him with torture.
k87jury 6 days ago
@k87jury And this is where your argument falls flat. Yes, I do know many that disagree with evolution...of man. That is, which is totally crazy I'm sure, that people do not accept ape to human evolution based on preliminary research and 'similarities' to then conclude 100% factual conclusions on said topic. I do not speak for bible, how it relates time, but very few will tell you "science is evil". This is a major reason why people scratch their head at insane Atheists.
xKenseixX 6 days ago
@xKenseixX
Except they do, they usually just call it evolution because they some how think all of science that goes against creationism is evolution but they do.
Christians who are not insane ignore the fundie Christians. Which there are ALOT of.
k87jury 6 days ago
@k87jury Religion didn't win in the middle east. It's no secret some religions are worse than others i.e., Scientology, extremist Islam ect.. In our infinite stage of civilizations, I'd hardly call the Middle East lost. It's only a matter of time before reform occurs via the young people wanting change. It will happen like it has before, intellectual revolutions progress fast with technology.
Everyone has a right to believe in something. Just as you can claim their against science.
xKenseixX 6 days ago
@xKenseixX
Dude, 800 years ago they were the center of all science and learning in the world. Look where they are now!!!
And they teach that the earth and universe are 6,000 years old, men can live in fish, every animal was on a boat, and that essentially EVERY FIELD OF SCIENCE IS WRONG!!!! What else do you need to do to convince you that they are against science.
k87jury 6 days ago
@xKenseixX Understand the creation claim is a specific claim from scripture. These claims are demonstrably inaccurate, so says science. Creationism is /not/ science, and therefore advocating it is telling kids/anyone that evidence does not matter.
Saying that we don't know how life began (which we may never know) is not the same as saying that biblical creationism may be true - it is not.
In other words:
-abiogenesis: maybe.
-non-biblical creation account: maybe.
-??????: maybe
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey Science does not disprove a creator. I'm not even Christian and I find your analysis pretty silly. Showing how the earth was formed, and those properties, does not null anything. Showing the principles on how plants grow and acquire energy, does not magically void how it got there, what properties were in place to begin that lifeform. Just as the big bang, it shows the principles, not the underlying question of what caused that, how did it come to exist, ect..
xKenseixX 6 days ago
@xKenseixX "Science does not disprove a creator." - I agree. I never ever said it did.
"Showing how the earth was formed, and those properties, does not null anything." - Yes it does, it nulls the specific bibical creation account in the bible. This doesn't mean that life couldn't have been created by god in another way. Perhaps god started evolution. However, the account according to the bible - that all life began at once - is just demonstrably WRONG. This does not god does
Arcexey 6 days ago
@Arcexey What confused Atheist like yourself seem to never be able to grasp is that most people accept 1. Their belief on what created the universe and 2. The scientific principles we as humans have observed and discovered to be true. These two are not enemies or contradiction. The man making a wheel, does not null the principles that were already there to begin with. I grew up in a Christian home, Im not Christian. I can make up my own mind. Atheists such as yourselves need some hobbies outside
xKenseixX 6 days ago
@xKenseixX not exist, it has nothing to do with that. We do not know how life began, and we do not know how the universe was created (or it if needed to be created).
I'm not disagreeing with you there and I never did, I don't understand why you called me confused. The only thing I said to you is that biblical creationism doesn't care about evidence, and why. And now all of a sudden I'm confused and need a hobby.. what the fuck, dude?
Arcexey 6 days ago
@k87jury
so you made a generalization on a radical religion to define all religions? Excuss me, but rejecting a few scientific THEORYS does not mean christianity is out there to destroy science.
WintersHowling 1 week ago
@k87jury I will say that it's indeed the other way around. Science is out to destroy religion.
MrMrjaymz 6 days ago
@MrMrjaymz
No it isn't. All science does is investigate the universe and gather evidence and etc. It is just a so happens that religion is wrong on so many things.
k87jury 5 days ago
@k87jury Oh, wow. You know, for not believing in God you sure act like him. *COUGH COUGH unlimitedknowledge COUGH COUGH*
MrMrjaymz 5 days ago
@WintersHowling The earth is not round. The Bible is not even kinda right in saying the earth is round.
Anyone, in any century BC could've known there were currents, and that passage is very vague. As is the Jonah one about 'bottom of mountains.' You can attribute scientific discovery to vagueness in any book.
Notice you didn't include the other 'scientific references,' like the earth having edges and four corners and ends and water being held up in the stratosphere.
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey
You have obviously never studied hebrew...
WintersHowling 1 week ago
@WintersHowling I used your exact words. I have my ideas, but what is "You have obviously never studied hebrew..." supposed to mean (other than a response dodge)?
Also, if you accept 99.9% of science (things you enjoy, like fast cars and medicine and computers) but then reject the exact same science when it comes to what disproves biblical claims, you are undermining science and attempting to discredit it.
Arcexey 1 week ago
Haha, I like how you (k87jury) didn't acknowledge and argue against the point of the original video. That is, where did everything come from? Who gives a shit about thermodynamics' laws here and there and everywhere?
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen
I love how you couldn't be bothered to watch and understand the video.
I love how, even after I explained in detail why the creationist's position that the law of cause and effect implied that matter had to be caused to exist was shown to not be true and a part of an equivocation fallacy,
I love how you embrace your ignorance. It makes me all warm inside.
k87jury 1 week ago 3
@k87jury Again, you're missing the point, where, did, everything, come, from? It doesn't matter that the original video's author didn't understand thermodynamics, it doesn't matter that you pointed out this fact. What matters is that nobody knows how everything came into being. And that was the fundamental point he was making. I don't know if you intentionally ignore this, or maybe you're just so satisfied with your own rhetoric that you CAN'T acknowledge it.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen How does 'How to make an Atheist's Head Explode' translate to ''We don't know where everything came from.' If that is the point, why create this gigantic strawman? It is /already/ a common atheist position that we don't know where the matter came from. It's the original author's contention (refuted by k87jury in this video) that the Big Bang requires a cause, which then leads to the atheist response (and first topic of this video), why then does god not require a cause? It
Arcexey 1 week ago
@skofuzen isn't like atheists are first saying god needs a cause, and then the original author, in his humility, points out this would also mean the universe needed a cause, and suggests we all settle on 'we don't know.'
And if I may be as bold to answer for k87jury -> We don't know where the matter came from, and since we'd be asserting the laws of physics existed "pre" Big Bang, we don't accept that matter needing to come from somewhere is even a valid question to begin with.
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey TL;DR; We don't know, but we're still going to string together one thousand words, wait for you to reply, and attack every point you make.
I'm Christian. I believe in God. I don't believe in Noah's ark, I don't believe the assorted silly stories which were written by Jesus' apostles. I just believe Jesus died for my sins and that is it. I welcome science, I never oppose it. So I pray ( :p) one day we can learn where all this energy and matter came from.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen That a god would create asinine laws and then sacrifice himself to himself to forgive you of those sins seems like the silliest story of them all. But sigh... if there was to be a sin, I'd say it's ridiculing someone for merely thinking about existence, The Big Bang, and wondering if/where the matter came from. But the original author's intention is argumentative - let's make that clear. That said, I really hope we find out more about the 'pre' Big Bang in my lifetime,
Arcexey 1 week ago
@skofuzen if that is even possible to ever fully understand. I don't believe it is.
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey There's a lot to be said about the benefits of an established moral and ethics code in societies, i.e. Christianity in Europe. But I won't go into a whole discussion regarding those, let's just say atheists have painted a very different picture of Christianity than what it actually was.
As to the reason I follow Christianity is simple because I was born into it, and I'm attracted to the values and spiritual aspect of Christianity, as well as the fact that it is part of my heritage.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen I don't believe Christianity because I am first and foremost concerned with what is true and real in this world, and not deterred by heritage or what I /want/ to be true (attracted to spiritual aspect). If you don't go around preaching or voting based on your spiritual beliefs (souls/abortion) then we're good as gravy. And if the 'established moral and ethics code' comes from Christianity (the bible) then it must include slavery and the mistreatment of women. If it doesn't,
Arcexey 1 week ago
@skofuzen then you are just falsely attributing those morals to Christianity - you have built up this image in your mind of Christianity (the doctrine) being good and caring, and you attune your actions to it. And by 'you' I mean you/or Europeans. Since there is nothing intrinsically good about Christianity (that isn't weighed down by its bad), there's no difference than saying the established ethics code in Europe is derived from [insert whatever here].
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey Indeed. We may never truly know how everything came into being. But in light of the issues the western world are faced with, that is probably #19214 on the list of things to worry about, I'm sorry to say.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen and yes, I'm sure we'll probably nuke ourselves or warm the planet before we learn the Universe's most darkest secrets!
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey I think many atheists, like yourself, fail to realize that Christianity formed itself to fit the people which lived in Europe. We didn't enslave women. We didn't mistreat women. We had a marriage contract, the woman produced children in exchange for the labour which the man offered. Despite what feminazis may tell you, if a husband was found to beat or mistreat his wife. It was likely that very, very extreme measures would be taken against him.
skofuzen 1 week ago
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@skofuzen You have to realize that the people formed the moral and ethics codes, not the religion. <-- I'm with you here. It is people that do good, and show natural altruistic qualities. In essence, the Christian doctrine is pro-love, pro-helping and also pro-slavery, pro-misogyny. So when you find a society that is influenced by a group people that are Christians, it is not Christianity playing the role in setting down the good values and moral codes, it is just people - that also
Arcexey 1 week ago
@skofuzen happen to be Christians. We can't see a society abandon slavery and attribute it to Christianity - because the doctrine or essence of Christianity is pro-slavery. As I said, this is people that bring those values. And they also happen to be Christians.
What this gets down to, and why I disagree that religion isn't bad, is that there isn't a single act that religion can do in the name of good that a secular society cannot do. But there certainly is bad.
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey Christianity isn't pro-slavery. That's a lie. Christianity is the reason the excessive and widespread thralldom in Scandinavia ended. And before you talk about the african slave trade, you have to realize that the slave traders were jewish, and the jewish religion is very open to slavery. The plantation owners too, were more often than not jewish.
And secularism can only divide the people of a nation against each other, and weaken that nation to outsiders, i.e. Europe & America.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen I'll try to put it as simplistically as I can. The Christian doctrine - what is written in the Holy Bible - vehemently supports slavery. (Exodus 21, Leviticus 25:44-46 among many others.) The religion of Christianity is the worldviews expressed in The Bible.
In order for you to say, 'Christianity is the reason slavery was abolished,' you have to show what, in the Christian doctrine, would be the motivation for these anti-slavery morals. When you try to find that motivation
Arcexey 1 week ago
@skofuzen in the Bible, what you find is the opposite: tons and tons of pro-slavery passages, explicitly describing how to buy slaves, how to punish them, what types of slaves to own.
The doctrine of Christianity, i.e. Christianity itself - cannot abolish something it supports. But that doesn't mean regular people, like you, who are also Christians, can't be anti-slavery.
I don't really care about what group did what in history, you have to show causation between
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey Firstly, you are talking about the old testament, you know, the one jews adhere to. Secondly, Christians adhere to the new testament, and theologians are in frequent debates whether or not the new testament condemns slavery. And this certainly doesn't constitute "tons" of pro-slavery passages.
Let's just say that the new testament can, to some degree, support slavery, but ultimately, it was used to condemn it. Courtesy of God fearing Christian men.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen Adherence has nothing to do with it. Christianity gets its morals from god and from the Bible does it not? Does the Christian god not explicitly endorse slavery? Is god wrong about slavery? Also, you had better adhere to the old testament, Jesus orders you to: Matthew 5:18-19 John 10:35 Luke 16:17 Is Jesus and Yahweh not the same person? And if you don't adhere, I'm guessing you aren't concerned in the least with the 10 Commandments?
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey You are so wrong. The old testament is what jews practised before Christ, and still do. The new testament is what happened after the messiah, Jesus Christ came, and taught his disiples of the evil ways of the jewish religion, that they were the children of Satan. In other words, any Christian should distance himself from judaism, because Jesus held them in contempt, and so did Martin Luther, the man from which my denomination grew. In other words, anything you see in the old testament -
skofuzen 1 week ago
@Arcexey - is what any good Christian will NOT do. Even though it is the same God, it's a new message, and new directions on how to live and prosper. In other words, "Judeo-Christian" is the biggest joke in the world, and I cringe every time I hear someone say it. And whenever you hear someone bad mouth Christians, they are quoting the jewish part of the bible. So direct your scorn and judgement where it's warranted. Look up "Israel slave trade".
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen I don't care about your interpretation or what your church tells you. Show me where in the bible it says everything you have just typed. I showed you exactly how Jesus said 'EVERYONE' needs to follow those rules less they be judged least.
"In other words, anything you see in the old testament -is what any good Christian will NOT do."
In other words, I had better not see you or Christians agreeing with or following ANY of the 10 Commandments.
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey I don't know how I can be much clearer than this; the old testament is "history", Christians aren't supposed to adhere to it. Doing so, and teaching Christians according to the old testament is heresy. There's a lot of different Christians in the world, if you're American, there's probably a lot of judeo-Christian non-sense floating around, which would make most American Christians heretics.
skofuzen 6 days ago
@skofuzen You can be 'much clearer' by showing me /why/ Christians don't have to 'adhere' to the old testament laws. Show me where it exactly says that in scripture! And reconcile why Jesus is saying that EVERYONE needs to obey Moses's laws (as I linked you in my quotes). And again, this must mean that you don't adhere to the 10 Commandments.
Arcexey 6 days ago
@Arcexey Many people today hold the bible to be the literal word of God. I don't. I disregard the old testament, and I only adhere to Jesus Christ himself, and what he said. The apostles wrote their "scripture" years and years after he was crucified. In addition to that, while Christ approved some mosaic law, he didn't command us to adhere to them. Of course by this I mean, I only adhere to what the apostles wrote which Jesus himself had said, not their opinions later in life.
skofuzen 6 days ago
@skofuzen wow, you are going to have to explain to me how your passage comes close to the topic at hand. Also, are you putting Paul's word above the passages that I gave you - that Jesus actually said?
"Of course by this I mean, I only adhere to what the apostles wrote which Jesus himself had said," "For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished." I mean, is that not black and white, clear as day?
Arcexey 6 days ago
@skofuzen "It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." Does Jesus not specifically scold those who break the laws Moses dictated, does he not say, clearly, the scripture cannot be broken?
Also, you did not begin to link where or why only jews would have to adhere to these laws.
Arcexey 6 days ago
@skofuzen "while Christ approved some mosaic law, he didn't command us to adhere to them. " He approved only some? "not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law" "Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments" "than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." Those are very powerful, specific words, man.
Arcexey 6 days ago
@Arcexey It's impossible to come to a clear understanding of these laws. I only brought up what Paul had written because you asked for it. When we begin to dissect everything we write here, it's going to be an endless back and forth bickering. I'll just tell you how I live my life as a Christian.
I try to do as little bad as I can, and as much good as I can.
skofuzen 6 days ago
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@skofuzen I think the bible can be interpreted in any way you wish, but that doesn't mean some interpretations aren't more valid than others.
I do agree it'll be an endless back and forth.
To avoid this.. just don't attribute the abolition of slavery (in any country) to Christianity.
And don't say that doing as little bad as you can and as much good as you can is somehow derived from the doctrine of Christianity, or from your god. Because, as I showed, your god promotes slavery.
Arcexey 6 days ago
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@skofuzen I think the bible can be interpreted in any way you wish, but that doesn't mean some interpretations aren't more valid than others.
I do agree it'll be an endless back and forth.
To avoid this, just don't attribute the abolition of slavery (in any country) to Christianity.
And don't say that doing as little bad as you can and as much good as you can is somehow derived from the doctrine of Christianity, or from your god. Because, as I showed, your god promotes s lavery.
Arcexey 6 days ago
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@skofuzen In other words, I'm sure you're a very good person and you mean well and you'd help at the drop of a hat. But your god wouldn't, because he clearly endorses slavery. So don't say those morals, those values (which are awesome and I applaud that you're willing to help when so many don't) come from God/ come from Christianity.
Arcexey 6 days ago
@Arcexey All these laws are too tedious and difficult to explain and understand, and ultimately, breaking one or two won't damn you to hell, not believing in God and accepting Jesus Christ as your saviour, will damn you to hell. Trying to explain everything in the bible will just lead you into a quagmire of confusion and frustration, because if there's one thing theologians can agree on, it is that the bible can support virtually any viewpoint.
skofuzen 6 days ago
@skofuzen
Then wow does your God suck at conveying a message. I mean seriously, this is the work of an infinite being who wants us to know us, and the best it can do is a disheveled piled of pages where you have to disregard most, and then cherry pick what ever you want from the rest.
If you know how bad it is, then why hold it as holy? Or good? Or believe anything in it?
k87jury 5 days ago
@Arcexey
Ephesians 2:15
"Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;"
This clearly shows that after Jesus Christ's ascension to heaven, he created a split between the old ways of the old testament, and the beginning for the new testament. In other words, we aren't obligated by God to adhere to the old laws.
skofuzen 6 days ago
@skofuzen Good argument you two are having. Makes for a fun read, and while you're both making some valid, and some not so valid, arguments, most importantly this is't full of the sort of capslocked trolling that permeates every other facet of the Internet. A welcome sight.
thegreatestoffools 1 day ago
@Arcexey Also, atheists really have to stop quoting the old testament. It's ironic that you cloak yourself in a profound sense of superior knowledge, yet you don't know that Christians adhere to the new testament.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@skofuzen
ITS IN YOUR HOLY BOOK!!!!!!!!!! IT IS YOUR GOD!!!!
It isn't superior knowledge that we feel smug about. It is the fact that we are not in such a state of delusion that you hold a book and God to be holy but then just pretend most of it doesn't exist.
Double think much?
k87jury 5 days ago
@skofuzen secularism and dividing people in a nation. I really don't see how not being religious has anything to do with being 'weakened to outsiders.' I also don't really understand what that means. If we're following this properly, and all nations are secular, wouldn't other nations then be weak as well? Wow my Captcha is 'cocless.' lol.
Arcexey 1 week ago
@Arcexey But are all other nations secular as well? Also, nobody would immigrate to a poor secular country.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@Arcexey Another thing atheists get wrong, is the thousand and one different social and ethics codes which are still in the bible, which Europeans in the real world, didn't adopt. Wife battery, enslavement and other assorted horrors remained in the middle-east, and they perished in, for example Scandinavia, which prior to Christianity, was full of slavery (thralldom). -
skofuzen 1 week ago
@Arcexey - You have to realize that the people formed the moral and ethics codes, not the religion. And much of the ethics and morals from the middle-east which was in the bible, was basically done away with, quietly, by Europeans to fit their culture and human traits.
skofuzen 1 week ago
@Arcexey The other benefit of religion is the hive-mind it creates. It gives you an effective population with similar morals, and it strengthens it to a degree which was absolutely necessary for it to develop. Today, everyone has a different opinion. This has weakened us, substantially. But THAT, is a subject I'm not in the mood to discuss right now. Suffice it to say, religion is not bad. And the extremes of Christianity has been replaced with the extremes of political correctness and feminism.
skofuzen 1 week ago