1987 Buick Grand National vs. 2008 Porsche Cayman S

[orange70383]

The GN is the better looking car.

[MultiParasite]

Wow, everyone would rather have an old car cheaply made of plastic, with no brakes, with a seat soaked of the sweat of a fat Texan dude named Bob. Great car, just hope you never have to brake or steer.

[MrUnknownnoone]

@MultiParasite Those cars are all metal bodies and as far as steering or braking are you serious? Rear disc brake conversion kit about $1000 bucks a little bit of labor the car will stop fine. Steering the G-Bodies came with a close ratio steering box that car turns fine. As for bob is sounds like he drives a pos civic...not a GN...

[MultiParasite]

@MrUnknownnoone

I was just joking and provoking a bit, I'm sure the Buick is Hot. I just don't the reason to have it rather than a Porshe.

[jcbspence]

@MultiParasite honestly have you ever driven an old car. Its a culture a group a love of these cars. Have you ever seen a porsche on a dragstrip, a gnx is a reliable drag car.

[Sean8654]

I'd take the Porsche....sell it...buy a GN, then use rest of money to go on vacation.



[GodschildJCE]

id take the gnx and give my gf the porshe haha

[DetectiveMuffin101]

I'll take the buick over most things.

[GNFAN1987]

Uh yeah......... get me the keys for the GNX please and someone cover that Cayman up, it's embarrassing. - LOL

[59cumminskid]

goodbye heAD GASKET



[p10ghost]

Wtf? dyno drag racing? lol

[1994GuitarPlayerPL]

GNX is much better, I love old cars, just like this one:)

[Seandude23]

thats an exciting drag race...not!

[enjoywhite1]

wtf is this thanks for wating my time...

[V8Fan4ever]

Porsche is very ugly, road test of that car in top gear doesnt look. Buick for me, its goes like stink and looks so nice. Real sleeper.

[MarvinSanti]

Even though that is a GN and not a GNX I'll still take oi over the Cayman every time...

[daviddicus]

The gnx is such a bad ass car. But at the end of the day I'd rather have a porshe key handing on the key hook.

[naynay71]

let them loose!

[Ten0fSwords]

Porsche for me. More fun in twisty mountain roads.

[Snortemup]

@Ten0fSwords I understand your point but these cars are built for totally different reasons.

[Domman56]

@Ten0fSwords actually those old grand national's still could handle pretty well. If you know how to drive your old american car they are still fun through the twisties

[adokenk3nnbasil]

Grand National any dayy...

fukk porshe

[71CommodoreGSE]

@scott93257 The Cayman is still the best handling car in it's class. I love the GN, but saying that the Porsche sucks is one of the most idiotic things I've heard yet. Grow up.

[scott93257]

@71CommodoreGSE

I'll take the GN any day... The Porsche is a better handler....And it doesn't suck like I said it did...Don't know what was going through my head when I wrote that... yeah that was idiotic...therefore comment has been removed.

[Mysterio2276]

@71CommodoreGSE - Still, you can't deny that the Buick will carry five in comfort, costs much less per hp, and if it were a GNX, would give the Cayman a run for its money in the handling department. Personally, I think the Buick has more style.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 Cayman is one of the best handling production cars out there. No GM car will ever out handle a Cayman. It's got mid engine, rwd and nearly perfect weight balance.

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - I don't know about that. I know Porsche has great handling, but either one modified and all bets are off. Stock against stock, I would be inclined to agree with you. But I think the GNX would give the Cayman a run for its money, curves or no curves.

[goodinsrt8]

@71CommodoreGSE Porshe sucks. no syle and no soul. nothing beats old school American muscle.

[71CommodoreGSE]

@goodinsrt8 No soul? Drive one, get your eyes opened. And now shut up.

[goodinsrt8]

@71CommodoreGSE Why would I down grade to such a piece of shit?

[71CommodoreGSE]

@goodinsrt8 I don't think you could possibly downgrade, given that you currently own a Geo Metro.

[goodinsrt8]

@71CommodoreGSE i dont own a metro.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@goodinsrt8 Do the doors on a Cayman bend because the hinge is way too fucking weak so hold this massive ass door? No... Does Porsche need a turbo to get LS3 power? No... Is porsche #1 on the Nurburgring? Yes...

[goodinsrt8]

@MangoSmoothie16 what does door hinges have to do with anything?

[MangoSmoothie16]

@goodinsrt8 the quality of the car. why the fuck cant gm make a lighter door or a stronger hinge?

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - Okay, dumbass... Door hinges tend to wear more when you drive the car a lot. Add to that the fact that most people don't lubricate such things, which accelerates wear. You're comparing apples ('08 Porsche) to oranges ('87 Buick) again. Show me a 25-year-old Porsche with normal mileage that still has showroom-quality fit and finish, that has not had something repaired of the sort. And I'd bet the Buick would fare a lot better in a side-impact than that beer-can Porsche.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 My dad owned the car in the late 80's. It wasn't old. It was his moms before his. I actually have a 1987 Porsche 944S in my garage. It's not show quality but the paint has held up pretty damn well. All it needed was a new exhaust and belts. 120k miles. No work at all was ever done except the usual. Oil, brake pads, and belts. My dad also worked in a body shop. A guy came in with a Grand National. This was mid 90's. It needed repainted. not even 10 years old and needs new paint.

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - Your "fixed this on the GN" remark proves that you don't know what you're talking about. GN and T-type are mechanically identical. I've said most people don't lubricate door hinges. When the door is used more than the engine, of course the hinge will wear out. As to the Porsche, 120k is low for any 87 model. Yes, GM did have issues with clearcoat peeling the first few years they were used. Yours is garaged. Put any car in the sun and see how long the paint lasts.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 I meant the 87 GN fixed the turbo issues from the early 80's t type.Changes made included a special Garrett T-3 turbocharger with a ceramic-impeller blowing through a more efficient and significantly larger capacity intercooler with a "CERMATEL (Ceramic/Aluminum) coated" pipe connecting the intercooler to the engine. In 86 they added the intercooler, right?

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - There were no turbo issues to "fix from the T-type", you idiot. Every T-type built from 84-86 had a mechanically identical sister GN. The intercooled 86-87 setups simply helped power by cooling the boosted intake charge. Your attempt at specs is a direct pull from Wikipedia about the GNX, NOT the GN. The GNX was not a "fix", it was a special edition. Nice try, but if you have to quote Wikipedia, you don't know WTF you're talking about.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 there was a problem to fix. the early t types had turbo cooling issues. The turbo on my dads seized up because there was poor cooling and oil flow.

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - Once again, you prove you're an idiot. Turbo Buicks were built 4 years before the T-type name, and 5/7 before they got FI/intercooling. I know people who have owned all of these variations without issue. Per year, the T-type/GN have the same components, and turbos require warm-up/wind-down time. Short trips and not letting the turbo wind-down before shutoff WILL kill the bearings in the turbo, but that's not the car's fault. So STFU. Don't blame GM for what you don't know.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 tell me... Why dont i hear of Porsche 930's cooking turbos?

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - There you go comparing apples to oranges again. I couldn't tell you, because I don't know anything about Porsche 930s. But then, I'm not the one talking shit about a car that every comment I make proves I know nothing about, either. My guess would be that they are driven by people that know to give the required warm-up and wind-down time. Tell me... Why don't I hear your fabricated turbo issue story from TR owners or see it corroborated... ANYWHERE?

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 How is it apples to oranges? Its a turbo 6 of the same era.

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - Which proves what? NOTHING. I don't hear of TRs cooking turbos either. ONE MORE TIME. I've found NOTHING ANYWHERE to back up your BS about turbo problems in ANY Turbo Buick, T-type included. It's not GM's fault your grandma only made short trips and didn't let the turbo warm up or wind-down. GNs are NOT a "fixed" T-type, as you have claimed, and quoting Wikipedia on the GNX to try to back up your BS only proves your stupidity. But please, continue. It's quite entertaining. :)

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 i still would like to know how the 930 vs GN(X) is apples to oranges... care to explain?

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - You just are not going to be satisfied until you make a complete ass of yourself, are you? They aren't the same car, for one. GNs and 911/930s were aimed at completely different markets. Secondly, TRs seat up to 6 in comfort, can a 944/930/911 do THAT? Thirdly, '87 GNs stickered for around $18k, WELL equipped. GNXs were just under $30k. '87 Porsche 911s stickered for around $50k, I'm certain the 930 was higher than that... for a glorified six-cylinder Volkswagen. STFU.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 Glorified VW? Explain what parts a 930 and any VW have in common.

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - I am referring to early air-cooled VW. Porsche actually introduced the Volkswagen (People's car) in 1939. Electronics on newer models may be a problem, but the engines and transmissions are swappable between the two. I know an air-cooled VW guy who put a turbo-charged Porsche flat-six engine in a '70 Beetle. Don't believe me? Look at the engine/trans arrangement of ANY '39-'73 Beetle and tell me it's not the same.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 Yes, the arrangement is the same. A few parts are the same. Most are not. VW never had an air cooled flat 6. Going by your logic, I can say the GNX is a glorified gran prix. Something to be proud of right there

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - You just NEVER shut up, do you? VW never had an air-cooled 6 like Porsche, but that doesn't mean one's not based on the other. GM's G-bodies (and others) do share many basics, I never said they didn't. You started this, badmouthing GM, then proved that you didn't know jack shit about TRs. Yet you still talk shit, getting off the original argument, which was BS that you made up in the first place. I just bet you are the PRIDE of your drama club... TROLL.

[goodinsrt8]

@MangoSmoothie16 what the hell does that have to do with anything. My 69 firebird's doors shut just as crisp as any porshe

[MangoSmoothie16]

@goodinsrt8 thats in 69. they fucked shit up mid 70's. They're almost back.

[Mysterio2276]

@goodinsrt8 - I wouldn't worry about mangosmoothie goodin... they are just a typical euro-snob loudmouth that condemns American cars because they are American, whether they know what they're talking about or not. Personally, I think they just have nothing else to keep them occupied LOL

[goodinsrt8]

@Mysterio2276 lol, i personally dont like euro cars. or new american cars for that matter. No new cars have any style or personality in my opinion.

[Mysterio2276]

@goodinsrt8 - Me either, for the most part, with the exception of the new Challenger and Mustang. I kinda like the '04 GTOs, but that doesn't count, it's not a new car anymore, and I'm not even sure if Holden is still building the Monaro on which it was based. Like most kids, the Countach and Testarossa were on my wish list in '89. But I'm not into $1000 oil changes and $3000 brake jobs.

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - Does the GN have an LS3? No. You're comparing apples to oranges... and a built non-turbo Buick V6 is actually quite potent. Research where the Grand National name comes from and you will see what I am talking about.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@Mysterio2276 I'm comparing the Cayman to GM. My dad had a t-type. He said it was a piece of shit. The turbo cooling system was fucked up. Yes, I know they fixed that on the gn. He said the doors were way too heavy and the hinges bent if you were parked on a slant. He said it wasnt very fast. You could get to 60 pretty quick but then it had no pull.

[Mysterio2276]

@MangoSmoothie16 - The GN still does not have an LS3, so it's pointless to compare it to one. It's obvious neither you nor your dad know what you're talking about. The only real difference between a GN and a T-Type is small suspension upgrades and black paint. All intercooled Turbo Regals (with the exception of the GNX) came with the same components from the factory. Hence, there was nothing to "fix" "on the GN".

[DEC0Y0CT0PUS]

@goodinsrt8 Except everything else on the road... Dont get me wrong I love muscle cars. But honestly for day to day living and actually performance racing (not drag racing, Im talking about skillfull stuff) I would have a Porsche all day. Any muscle car (with exception of the vette) would get smoked on a circuit by any sports car that is european. Face it. America builds great fucking engines. But sucks predominantly everywhere else. I use to be how you were, then I drove lots of car varieties.

[goodinsrt8]

@DEC0Y0CT0PUS i have driven a large variety, and new cars are a huge waist of money. And day to day living, muscle cars will out perform anything new.

[DEC0Y0CT0PUS]

@goodinsrt8 Im gonna have to respectfully disagree on this one. Newer cars have way better MPG's/ astronomically better handling/ more features (airbags, seatbelts, better sound equipment, fully electric seats/mirrors, CD players, even cassette playes), ALOT better for day to day ( How can you say that a long loud car with no ABS/traction control/ or any electronic aids really are better?). And also you can get new cars serviced anywhere and fairly cheaply. But i see your side if you love muscle

[Mysterio2276]

@DEC0Y0CT0PUS - I have to respectfully disagree with you on the MPG part of that statement. I had an 88 Ford EXP that got 41 mpg highway, an '88 Buick Park Ave that got 37 mpg highway, and a 92 Chevy Cavalier that got 36 mpg highway. I have also personally seen an '89 Regal get 40 mpg highway, and a '92 V8 Camaro get 30 mpg highway. For all Chevy's boasting of a new 30 mpg V6 Camaro, they were doing it 20 years ago with a 5-liter V8.

[goodinsrt8]

@DEC0Y0CT0PUS I service my 69 firebird for free (plus the cost of parts). And the dealership charged me $90 for an oil change on a 300 srt8 that i had. My firebird has a 400 and a 3 speed tranny and gets mid 20s for mpg and rapes any other daily driver. It might just be me, but i have had way better luck with old school muscle.

[DEC0Y0CT0PUS]

@goodinsrt8 I think if you love them you can live with them. I just like to watch videos of them and see them in movies (I guess im not that hardcore) rather than actually own one. I dont think anyone is wrong when they say they think its great to have one, but i would say more than 80% of the American public would not want one when offered a muscle car opposed to something more practical. And with muscle cars I have heard that sevicing is more of a do it yourself. Not many would want to.

[Mysterio2276]

@goodinsrt8 ^5, dude.... very well put. I've noticed largely that new cars, especially European cars, are for those who have more money than brains.... :)

[CLA82529]

i would take both then sold the porsche to a rich idiot so i can get the money to tuned the grand national XD

[zman6033]

the GNs are bad ass but when they drop the turbo 6 in the trans am it was EPIC

[SavageSS2010]

Theres NO comparing these 2 cars.. One is totally gay and typically driven by eurofags and the other is the legendary Grand National.

[taz275]

GNX ftw, im savin up for a grand national now :D

[gto413ojodeagua]

fuck a porshe

[Joerotty]

That GN still looks meaner and sexier than the new Trophy car of a Porsche.

If I had the cash for that Porsche I would buy a GNX instead.

[DrBIeed]

Its an 1987 Buick GN (Not a GNX or 86 GN or prior) because it has the black grille. If it were an 86 or earlier the top of the grille would be chrome. Definitely not a T-Type unless its a GN clone.

[vfIskullangel]

Porsche can't fuck with the GN!.

[jylp4u]

if thats a gnx, it's worth way more and is way more rare.. under 600 of them in the world

[scwhockey41]

547.....

[jylp4u]

yeah

[lilchamp513]

and my dad owns one lol they're raw and his only has 16,000 miles on it talk about a cash crop but his stubborn ass only brings it out once or twice a year pisses me off... but I love when he does.

[Mysterio2276]

@jylp4u - Not a GNX - It has T-tops, the GNX didn't even have a moonroof.

[jylp4u]

@Mysterio2276 not true. There was one with t tops but it was stolen in 1988. That's not a gnx because it doesn't have the body kit. Only a few people know about the only one with t tops because it was the last one ever made and you would've had to been around here back then to know the guy that had it. He only had it for a few months before it was stolen. Sad to say but it was never recovered and never seen again.

[Mysterio2276]

@jylp4u - While cars that shouldn't exist still do (Witness the 1970 Mercury Syclone Spoiler II), there are many TR myths, and it's simply too easy to build a "GNX" clone when so few can tell the difference. The only GNX I've heard of that shouldn't exist is a prototype built and titled as an '86. Even non-TR hardtops will stress and crack the body on the passenger B-pillar, that's why all 547 GNXs were hardtop. Many an 11-second GN has lost T-tops from the body flex that comes with that option.

[jylp4u]

@Mysterio2276 The gnx I'm telling you about came from asc mclaren and all the paperwork and documentation from asc mclaren came with it INCLUDING A NUMBER. I know just about everything there is to know about the turbo regal, including the stress cracks you still get with the hard top and I know how to stop them. We have owned them when they were new and currently own 5 turbo regals, so I'm not new to them.

[Mysterio2276]

@jylp4u - No offense intended, but if you have owned TRs and not new to them, then you can obviously see my point about the myths and how easy it is to build a clone that will fool most people. Did the one you speak of actually have a VIN#? And what was the "GNX" # of the car?

[jylp4u]

@Mysterio2276 yeah, I see your point but the gnx body kit didn't exist back then and all gnx start off as a normal gn sent from gm to asc, so all gnx will have HP in the vin just like the gn. I don't remember the number, it was a long time ago. But there is no doubt it was a real gnx. So if you see one with t tops, ask if its a clone then if they say no, ask if it has a clean title, if not, that's the car. Yup it was like a ghost car lol oh well at least we can tell its story.

[jylp4u]

@Mysterio2276 and how that car came to be can be explained, the guy got a gm with t tops and took it to asc and paid in full to convert his brand new gn into a gnx and they did it and gave him the documents to prove it and gave the car a number. Not long after that, the car was stolen and never seen again.

[Mysterio2276]

@jylp4u - Interesting. You saw a GNX that isn't supposed to exist, yet don't remember its number? "The body kit didn't exist back then" for "the last one ever made"? I've seen window stickers for GNXs. The option was only through GM, you couldn't just send a new GN to McLaren for it. If any new '87 GN buyer could do that, what was the point of GNXs having car #s, or being limited to 547? Marketing slogan was "A High-Performance Investment For The Fortunate 547." #547 is a hardtop, I've seen it.

[jylp4u]

@Mysterio2276 he paid in cash, money talks I guess lol, if I remember right, that option was $10,000 to $12,000. So not many even had that kind of cash and to spend it on a gn back then when it was still new before many knew about them like they do now, that would be rare and as far as I know, he was the only guy to do it. I can't tell you the number if I wanted to, I was way to little to remember, but that car I will never forget, I asked my dad about it to be sure. Hey, maybe he knows the #!

[MrBoolyman]

@jylp4u Buddy, you need to stop telling this story. It's complete BS.

[jylp4u]

@MrBoolyman why, because you said so or because I don't have any prof right now? Most think they were only hard top but very few know they there was a t top and astro roof gnx. I have prof of the astro roof gnx btw. Also you should take note of who the astro roof car belonged to.

[CREAM601769901]

@jylp4u True.. I have an "86 with ttops

[neres818]

it a 1984 buick T Type it looks just like my buick gn

[Mysterio2276]

@neres818 - Really no way to tell, honestly. Grille shells are interchangeable from 1984-1987, meaning an '84 grille could make an '87 look like an '84. All other front end pieces are the same except for GN / T-type badging. Some T-types came with chrome pieces, usually limited to the bumper though. The '84-86 TR grille had a single chrome bar down the center from the chrome "BUICK" strip at the top, the 87 was solid black. This car appears to be a T-top 1987 GN, not a T-type.

[workensmart]

I would rather have the Grand National over that crappy Gayman S.

[donwonjon420]

@workensmart Id like the gnx too however dont be so hard on german cars. The germans make damn good products. In all reality you cant even compare these two cars because they were designed for two different things. The gn was like the american bmw m5. A family car that can haul ass, where as the porsche was designed to be a track car and a midlife-crisis-mobile.

[workensmart]

@donwonjon420 I'm only hard on german cars because people that own them are so biased about cars from America, Japan ex. Yes Germans do make very nice cars but they are not the "best" cars on the road they break down just like every other car on the road.

[donwonjon420]

@workensmart Most failures with any car are component failures. To me it seems that most cars have these failures at about the same rate. The reason why I think a german car will spend more time in the shop than a toyota is because the german cars have more components. Statisticly the more parts you have the more that can go wrong. That doesnt make the toyota more reliable it just seems that way because it has fewer parts. American cars have given me trouble but the warrenty always fixed it.

[MangoSmoothie16]

@workensmart Crappy? You obviously dont know what quality is.

[workensmart]

@MangoSmoothie16 It is crappy. I want to drive my car not take it to the shop every month. I would not have got 80 thumbs up if what I said was wrong.

[Mysterio2276]

@workensmart - ^5 dude, that's telling them... LOL... MS didn't know when to shut up with me, either....

[ZRider3591]

burning coolant

[camaryn231]

Thats not a GNX and this vid could be more entertaining. GTA wheels on a GN, w/ t-tops. Thot it wld b a race:( Gn wouldnt be blowin smoke if the guy that owned it wasnt more worried about polishin it than if its runnin right<

[timbitski]

you're right - thats an 87 GN, not a GNX, upgrade's...Engen - who knows? No flares, no fender vents, stock 87 wheels - GN, and you can tell it's an 87 and not the much more rare 86' , which looks nearly identical b/c the trim around the grill is black and not chrome (86 is), and there's an emblem on the grill (86 doesn't have one). And...of course...a GNX didn't have a T-roof option...you're totally right - GN, not a GNX.

[randombk82894]

id take the gnx

[OriginalSamsquatch]

why are they even comparing these? its so pointless

[87TAGTABANDIT]

I think I'll take that GNX over the Cayman S

[Curveball]

@87TAGTABANDIT

That is not a GNX. It's a Grand National.

[Curveball]

@87TAGTABANDIT

It's a Grand National, not a GnX

[bosna17]

wooow im naked right now! I