I wonder if my approach to the "Yes, but" game is a bit too aggressive. Usually, I follow through with a mix of Parent/Rescuer and Adult responses, depending on the circumstance, and if my opposition falls into Persecutor stance, I'll shove them out of it and take that place for myself by calling out the entire game in an incredibly jarring, direct way. It usually involves words such as "irredeemably manipulative attention-seeking," thus tossing them into a more receptive Child/Victim state.
It's videos like this which endear me to the internet so much. I love listening to, and reading the thoughts of people more experienced than I. To have such an accessible forum for this at my fingertips makes me ecstatic I live in the era I do.
I also feel i should continually thank you for your impeccable delivery of raw, beautiful knowledge. It's the least I can do.
Thank you very much. Very informative and extremely well produced videos on TA. I'm also very grateful that you've put "Recommended TA texts" in your video description.
Possibly this has been addressed here, but how do you keep from going into an infinite regress, examining every aspect of every action you and others do? How do you consider the transactions while keeping a flowing and natural relationship with your partners?
By the way, you've been an intense influence on my life. I find myself referring to your work in discussions often.
@porrophagus It could get immobilising couldn't it — the potential for endless analysis. Speaking personally, I've found it's come naturally with experience/practice. Like juggling — especially like juggling with two significantly different weights, where at the start the heavy one gets more attention. Eventually, with practice, the body finds its equilibrium. I've found the same to be true of information processing when it comes to juggling acting and observing.
Ive found that in everyday life its best to analyse the self more than others. When practiced in this kind of thing (such as working as a counsellor) and just paying attention others reactionary behaviour is often quite obvious, but not so obvious from the self. Ive known a few psychologist who could do with taking on what they tell their clients.
Over analysing the self does have its own problems though, and as you've said Theramin, a balance needs to be found.
One of the most amazing things about the human mind, and about consciousness in general, are that infinite regresses collapse into a solid mental object. For example:
I am aware. I am aware that I am aware. I am aware that I am aware that I am aware...
This leads to an infinite regress, but we are not actually confused by it. We understand the implication and can complete the circle instead of drawing an unending spiral. The collapsed form of "I am aware..." is:
It's funny, without ever knowing about this- I had noticed this tendency.
I would play B and try to help people with their problems (I honestly do have a sincere want to help people) but the more often these rounds of suggestions were met with hositility rather than receptiveness, the more I came to realize that most people really had to reach for answers themselves. If I suggested things, more often than helping, I'd only be opening myself to abuse. That's no help, and no fun.
@CounsellingResource Thank you. I think TA has some incredibly valuable thinking tools to offer — even when I'm not using TA terms explicitly with clients, it informs my relationship dynamic/responses hugely.
Games seem to not occur in the Adult state, so I'm guessing the way to beat them is to respond in an adult state, to change their state.
I think they will continue to change their state, but if they don't go into an Adult state, then the solution would be to change into Negative Parent (probably controlling) as they will likely already be embarrassed by your already more mature state, and thus, you are now the one the parent and they are the child.
I think one of the widest examples of these games can be found in tiny comment wars on Youtube.. I think this is due in part to the fact that comments here are just text and the reader can unknowingly project whatever kind of emotional tone onto the comment that their current state wants to here.. it also makes me wonder if by posting this am I being an adult or am I seeking some kind of parental recognition
9:21"I'm sure it might seem difficult, but give it a go", seems like the adult thing to say. The encouraging nature of it seems like it's at an adult level. "I'm sure it might seem difficult, but give it a go, you know you're smart enough to do it" would seem more like the encouraging parent. What do you think?
@TheraminTrees Thank you for this series of videos. Because of them I have started reading the books you suggested in an attempt to identify and curtail my games as well as gracefully exit stressful situations with family members.
I have "Games People Play" but I couldn't quite categorize some games I find myself repeating. Is there another book you could recommend?
I need help! I'm playing the "why don't you, yes but" game practically every day with a friend. She just pulls me in seemingly needing advice, but rejects everything. What do I do? Cause I know she's actually feeling down. Or wait. Maybe I'm the one playing a game where I try to help someone who isn't really seeking it? I'm so confused. Please help me!!!
@Fiskepudding127 There was a game listed in "Games People Play" by Eric Berne called "I was only trying to help" Where someone's advice is continually rejected and the payoff is a feeling of bewilderment at the ingratitude of the person on the receiving end of the advice. It is very possible that your friend is playing "yes but". The exit listed in the book for "yes but" is "That is a tough one, what do you think you should do?" but also states that for the most part the game is harmless.
Hello! I doubt I'll get a reply to this question but here goes anyway!
This series was really interesting and I'm wanting to learn more. In the video you describe discounting as when someone puts something down in a general way rather than a personal way (That painting is rubbish). Someone very close to me does this kind of thing to me all the time. I'm wondering how I should handle it. Anyone willing to help or point me in the right direction?
Hi Theramin! I have a question. In my classes in social psychology my teacher sad that transactional analysis distinguishes between two levels of analysis:functional and structural, and in the literature I couldn't find an explanation..what does that mean?
And also in the child ego state, according to him, there are 4 aspects: Adapted,Rebellious,Free and Little professor. I've always thought that there are only Adaptive and Free child.. are the both statements true?
I think it's becoming very apparent that when theists try to constantly mislabel Atheists as "Belief in no god". I've recently been involved in that debate, and no matter how many times I explained that we define ourselves as "A-Theist" or "Without belief in gods" the person I'm arguing with continuously asserts that "Theism" is a "Position held that god does exist" or something to that effect.
This to me sounds like a controlling adult to rebellious child ego state. Is there a game for this?
@Nightmare060 I guess if there's a game going on here, it might be clearer when the switch happens. They could just be ignorant about atheism's scope — and holding on to faulty definitions they've learned. The fact is 'lack of belief' is an accepted dictionary definition, for the reason you point out: the 'a-' part signifies 'against' OR 'without' — eg 'amoral'. Their refusal to let this info in is suggesting some unaware position like controlling Parent.
@TheraminTrees From my experiences, the theists constantly cite their sources as places such as online dictionaries or "Dictionaries of philosiphy" as well as pushing the genetic fallacy to prove that their defanition is correct excluding all others. So a controling parent would seem to fit the bill quite nicley.
@Slashenaar Well it's an important difference to define since the person making a positive claim should have the burden of proof. You make a good point about potentially becoming the correcting parent, but the discussion was something that was brought up, and so when talking about our respective positions it's important to have an accurate definition of what that position actually is.
@Nightmare060 This makes sense represented more as a parent -> <- parent situation to me. what need of yours is being (or attempting) met, the need to be understood, or approved of by the theist? I'm asking why do you need them to understand the difference?
@Slashenaar Burden of proof is a big reason to clarify ones position on the existence of god(s). I can be a bit stubborn when trying to argue a point that I don't feel is being represented properly, although these days I walk away from these situations considerably more than I used to.
What I like about TA, is that it is a simple enough theory that's accessible to ordinary people who are not formal students of psychology, yet have an interest in relationship dynamics. I'm loving your series on this compelling subject!
@TheraminTrees It reminded me of the music from a game named "Fable", so I wondered if this was taken from that, or if this was someone else. I like it though :) Is there somewhere I could download it?
Great video btw. Last year year I attended a course in conflict management, where we learnd about the Drama Triangle, and how it worked in practice. I like how this videos explain this situation through the usage of the "parent", "adult" and "child" mentalities. Are there more videos about this?
—Yes, this is the second part of a series. I've not heard of 'Fable'. But then my gaming essentially extends to 3 Super Mario Wii titles — although the orchestral score for that game is spectacular. The music in this video is an original piece that appears in full in another video called 'Transactional Analysis series music'.
this video is so great. i know some people will say its just one theory, but coming from having no awareness of this stuff to watching this series, which adequately describes some relationships in my life that need fixing immediately, this is a god-send.
sad, though, when family members force you to unplug. What then???
I really like this one best. It's helped me realize how I get myself caught up in these games in my own personal life. And now I realize sometimes I'm the one starting games and I don't really want to subject people I love to things that are such a waste of our time, life's short enough. But I've been really analyzing my own behavior lately and am learning much more about what's going on below the surface here. Really appreciate this whole series, Thanks!!!
Also that 'slippery feel' where someone pretends to be your friend but isn't is a surefire way to irritate me and make a quick enemy out of me.
(Or more likely to make me stop dealing with you.) I don't like people who screw around. I don't like liars. I don't tolerate them around me. And I can afford to eject them from my world, and thus I do.
I've never thought of the whole "I'm OK..." thing as a suggestion that we should adopt the position that everyone is 'OK' and stick with it, because, obviously, some people are always going to rub us the wrong way. Rather, "I'm OK, you're OK" makes a good default position for interacting with others because it does not promote needy behavior ("I'm not OK, you're OK") or condescending behavior ("I'm ok, you're not ok"), etc. that can draw us into games.
Beeing kind of a modern 'prodigal son' with ' P- ' in a proximity controlled social env., i combed trough the internet & libraries to find methods to cope with my surroundings. Your Videos where one of those findings who helped me evaluate a lot of the theory i read & understand my social contacts. So thanks for that :)
Question: Is there a relation between the willingness to change your state (i.g.: From (A) to (P)) & the social proximity of the 2?
@TheraminTrees I don't like the video because it feels like a salesman's pitch rather than a discussion of ideas. TA is one interpretation of behavior.
This series is incredible. . Really, beyond excellent. I just wish I'd found it earlier, while growing up with two relatives who display high levels of Borderline and narcissistic personality traits. But I can certainly use the information here in dealing with them now. And for that I can't thank you enough for putting this all together.
@bunnygotfree Thanks bunnygotfree. It's funny you should mention narcissistic traits. I've just been dealing with a narcissist of unexpected proportions — proportions that only fully revealed themselves when all other alternatives were unsuccessful and it came time to unplug. It was like a psychotic break. I think narcissists are a minefield of games — exacerbated by their denial of flaws/responsibility. I wish you well!
@TheraminTrees - I can certainly relate to that. My experience with a narcissist of unparalleled proportions stretches my entire life span. It's so interesting to me now how I grew up falling for almost all of these games, and how the dynamic of that relationship has changed since I was able to remove myself from his warped reality - to finally realize it was him all along, not me. It's amazing, how powerful these games are. This series will definitely change people's lives for the better! -BGF
@wamerocity Thanks wamerocity. TA's metaphors gave me a lot of thinking tools for conceptualising how I interact with people — so I thought I'd share them ;8)
This is so fascinating: Personally it hits me like a moment of good literature, making me reassess, see things in a new and inspiring way.
TA also seems like it might be a good way to reveal the psychology of characters in fiction. I can see these ideas wandering into a lecture to help students understand characters' interactions and, thus, overall themes. Especially with the "games" idea, my mind is a buzz with stories where characters use these interactions. Very cool stuff.
@tinySpectacle 'TA also seems like it might be a good way to reveal the psychology of characters in fiction.'
—Hey Lo ;8) I thought I'd replied to this! I wanted to say I can completely see the value to literature that you highlight — a way of analysing characters/interactions from the readers' point of view, as well as constructing them from the writers' side. As you say, especially with the split gamey stuff and those juicy ulterior motives.
Something similar to this happened to me yesterday. Someone was egging me on, and at first I tried to defuse the situation calmly, but I reached my breaking point (I hadn't gotten a lot of sleep in the past 3-4 days). I yelled at him, but even though my outer behavior was exhibiting a "parent" ego state, my inner reasons for doing so were distinctly "adult". Indeed, in the process of yelling at him, I logically deconstructed his arguments and intellectually embarrassed him in front of everyone.
You know, it always impresses me how there are always a few fucking morons who will dislike anything made by anyone who is intelligent enough to destroy their beliefs and arguments.
Seriously, fuck off you ignorant pathetic bitches. There should be a merit system; where you have to give a reason for not liking the video, and if it isn't valid, then you get demerits for having a retarded opinion.
Interesting ideas!! I'll have to pay more attention now to these types of games and use the tools you have given to deal with them! :-) I'm enjoying this series! I'll be checking back often so I don't miss it! xoxoxoxo
Perhaps you could reiterate what the acronym TA stands for - Transactional Analysis - in each video for dullards like myself that needed to look at your trailer again to remind ourselves of its meaning.
Acronyms are fine but risk the teacher slipping into jargon and the learner losing the plot - so to speak.
Theramin... Each of these videos are eye opening for me in MANY relationships. From casual acquaintances, to my relationship with my parents and significant others, even to my peers, elders, and teachers.
Thanks TT, I'm enjoying the re-working of the original videos. =)
I'm very interested to hear the comments on online gaming - I'm a Games Designer and social interaction in multiplayer games formed the core of my dissertation, due to my interest in both gaming and psychology. (Though I might have mis-interpreted your comment to nemo3590)
mm I think would be a good idea to add some examples of what a game is beyond "why don't you, yes but" game, so the viewers could more closely relate it to their personal experiences.
1of2 This is exactly what I needed to hear today. I was explaining exactly this but with a good cop bad cop variable injected into the game. The owner of the Lab was tryn to instill fear as a strict abusive parent & the Lab foreskin was the parent that was tryn to help us out of "our invintory lab supply Problem". The owner was "So upset,Angry & disapointed that he could not talk to us in person" & could only write a Hate filled letter . I told my co-workers that nothing was at stake except.....
.... For the owners ability to recognize his neglect of the theft & gross miss use of supplies that we all have worned him of. This all came from the 2 office managers that he placed too much power & trust in due to his lazyness which alowed them both to embezzle over $250,000 by creating business credit cards for our department only to make fake orders to line their own pockets. Now we are to fing sequencers & supplies that don't exist.
@nemo3590 The first two are a reworking of the old three with some new emphases, and I wanted to extend the series to include some comment on online gaming and the TA of religion.
This seems really useful! I'm not very experienced with socializing but I know I've fallen into some of the gimmicks you describe. I'll definitely check out that book you mentioned. :3
Why don't you put a more "searchable" title to this kind of videos? I mean, just the keywords are not enough and this way looks like you don't want your video to be located at all... and they are far from good...
I was thinking about the "Why don't you/yes but" game, and I think it has another posible switch: a crossed transaction, with both at parent. The "rescuer" gets offended by the other's discount, and responds negatively.
@ZebaSzp Absolutely — another kind of Switch! In theory any combination of V, P and R Switches are possible. Like A rescuing B, feeling sorry for them going to all that fruitless effort: 'Aw .... well, you tried.'
It seems like a lot of thought has been put into how the information in the videos is presented. The branching out of information presented is handled elegantly. It makes the flow of the video easy to follow. Well done!
Very well done. It`s interesting how by spending a bit of time working on yourself you can see your own faults and those in others as well. BUT the important thing is to realize that we all have issues and no to take it so personally; often times they aren`t doing it on purpose and don`t even realize what they are doing. That is what helps me. Another great video.
if i asked someone to help me, and they said well what do you think you should do, id say i dont have a scoobies, what do you think. maybe it is to affirm to yourself that there is no solution as you and your frind both cant come up with something you have not already thought of. not a game tho.
@kendrawhisp 'if i asked someone to help me, and they said well what do you think you should do, id say i dont have a scoobies, what do you think'
—And I'd say, 'I don't know'. If you wanted my help, I'd expect you to give me at least some input on what you'd already tried, etc. Without that I'm in danger of wasting my time going through a ton of Yes, buts.
im not sure its as simple as some game where someone is wanting to have their inaction justified and ego boosted. perhaps the person has already thought of these suggested solutions and wants someone to come up with a solution that they have never thought of, and when that isnt possible frustration can set in and you feel like telling someone to do one, but you don't mean to put them down, you just feel fucked, and that anger is momentarily expressed. Then you apologise.
@kendrawhisp The video isn't saying these are always the dynamics in a scenario where A constantly rejects B's 'help'. The video is just showing an example of when it is. Let's face it, sometimes B will hit on the solution. Sometimes A will bring B up to speed on what they've already tried. But when it's a constant pattern between two people, the video suggests looking at whether a game's being played.
@dashxdr These first 2 videos cover and extend the old 3 videos. They felt ropey in terms of production — hideous noise on the mic. Plus I wanted to emphasise some new points. Then wanted to extend the series.
Thanks for your response. I never noticed the mic noise. These new videos certainly are pretty.
Lately I've been trying to figure out what the payoff is for making YouTube videos. I personally can't work up the motivation to make more. YouTube seems to entertain but not educate...
@thebluishrosette Thank you thebluishrosette ;8) I'm off here for a few days, so the next one will have a slightly longer gap, but then hopefully back to a weekly schedule for the remaining two.
I've seen this sort of thing with many people. You get those who either try to take responsibility for absolutely everything, and people who try to pawn responsibility for things on to you at every opportunity.They have tricks they employ to get that result, most of which could be seen as attempts to affirm parent or child status respectively. Parent and child seem to correspond to dominant/submissive roles, too, which is the way I always thought about it before I saw your first vid on TA..
Great video! Motivates me to have a look inside my copy of "Games People Play" again and more thoroughly. Thank you.
I have a question though. Isn't it necessary for us to sometimes take, for example, a nurturing parent position to maintain relationships? To be a friend and "caring"? The way I understood that position, people often take turns assuming it in a friendship/friendly relationship.
@foolnwhat Something I hoped would come through in this video in particular is the value the positive aspects of controlling, nurturing, adapted and free styles of being. If we were Adult all the time, we'd be missing out on so much.
Is the "Ian Stewart" in your description the same one who co-authored "Figments of Reality" with Cohen and the series "The Science of Discworld" with Cohen and Terry Pratchett?
@Mordain607 yes that is but its an unstable state. Also it ruins relationships. THere are other things you could do as well like end the game as you begin to see that your ideas arent helping you can ask what were the other ideas that he had to the problem this way he is the one that will have to give the ideas or admit that he had none. In this way you dont end up looking ignorant and depending how you take it you can turn it so you end up looking supportive.
Hmmm... I'm not sure in that situation. The guy asking for help is clearly being an arse. I've tried to help him and he responds with ungrateful sarcasm.
@Mordain607 you have no idea how funny this is. (our conversation is the mirror of yes but conversation. You asked if there is a way. I tried to respond with help you said YES BUT the guys is a jerk so it wont work.) What do you think would be an improvement to asking him what solutions he has for the problem?
@OatSharpener Thanks. TA's metaphors've transformed my relationship into a vastly drama-free zone. I'll admit drama used to feel 'exhilarating' to a degree — that heightened state, with more at stake. But the stuff it blocked — the genuine intimacy, fun, love, laughter — that's since come through shows the thinness of drama like nothing else.
These videos are brilliant! Thanks!
cunnockmcchungler 2 days ago
I like Transactional Analysis because it explains why everyone goes around acting like stuck up bitches.
VolcanicPenguin 1 week ago
I wonder if my approach to the "Yes, but" game is a bit too aggressive. Usually, I follow through with a mix of Parent/Rescuer and Adult responses, depending on the circumstance, and if my opposition falls into Persecutor stance, I'll shove them out of it and take that place for myself by calling out the entire game in an incredibly jarring, direct way. It usually involves words such as "irredeemably manipulative attention-seeking," thus tossing them into a more receptive Child/Victim state.
cryptess 1 week ago
It's videos like this which endear me to the internet so much. I love listening to, and reading the thoughts of people more experienced than I. To have such an accessible forum for this at my fingertips makes me ecstatic I live in the era I do.
I also feel i should continually thank you for your impeccable delivery of raw, beautiful knowledge. It's the least I can do.
karadan100 1 week ago
@karadan100 Thank you kindly — much appreciated ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 week ago
The conclusion is: don't play games; punch noses instead.
MomoTheBellyDancer 1 week ago 4
@MomoTheBellyDancer LOL save time wouldn't it ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 week ago 2
Do you have a degree in psychology by any chance? I would love to see more videos like these.
LucidCatnap 1 week ago in playlist transactional analysis
@LucidCatnap Thanks. And yes, I have a degree in psychology and anthropology.
TheraminTrees 1 week ago
Thank you very much. Very informative and extremely well produced videos on TA. I'm also very grateful that you've put "Recommended TA texts" in your video description.
SlagarNZ 1 month ago
This is fascinating.
gracii92 1 month ago
thanks again TheraminTrees!
skiddywinkle 3 months ago
Possibly this has been addressed here, but how do you keep from going into an infinite regress, examining every aspect of every action you and others do? How do you consider the transactions while keeping a flowing and natural relationship with your partners?
By the way, you've been an intense influence on my life. I find myself referring to your work in discussions often.
porrophagus 4 months ago
@porrophagus It could get immobilising couldn't it — the potential for endless analysis. Speaking personally, I've found it's come naturally with experience/practice. Like juggling — especially like juggling with two significantly different weights, where at the start the heavy one gets more attention. Eventually, with practice, the body finds its equilibrium. I've found the same to be true of information processing when it comes to juggling acting and observing.
TheraminTrees 4 months ago 2
@TheraminTrees
Ive found that in everyday life its best to analyse the self more than others. When practiced in this kind of thing (such as working as a counsellor) and just paying attention others reactionary behaviour is often quite obvious, but not so obvious from the self. Ive known a few psychologist who could do with taking on what they tell their clients.
Over analysing the self does have its own problems though, and as you've said Theramin, a balance needs to be found.
RippdUb 2 months ago in playlist Introduction to Psychology : Jasper 1
@TheraminTrees What book is this video based on? I would like to research it further.
SavageDogg38 1 month ago
@porrophagus
One of the most amazing things about the human mind, and about consciousness in general, are that infinite regresses collapse into a solid mental object. For example:
I am aware. I am aware that I am aware. I am aware that I am aware that I am aware...
This leads to an infinite regress, but we are not actually confused by it. We understand the implication and can complete the circle instead of drawing an unending spiral. The collapsed form of "I am aware..." is:
I am.
rkyeun 2 months ago
This is really useful. Cheers for makung this Theramin :)
StuartG001 6 months ago
It's funny, without ever knowing about this- I had noticed this tendency.
I would play B and try to help people with their problems (I honestly do have a sincere want to help people) but the more often these rounds of suggestions were met with hositility rather than receptiveness, the more I came to realize that most people really had to reach for answers themselves. If I suggested things, more often than helping, I'd only be opening myself to abuse. That's no help, and no fun.
PurpleGhost 6 months ago
Exactly how educated are you in the matter of psychology and human behaviour?
I´ve seen plenty of people discuss these topics on this site, but you somehow seem like more of an authority on the matter than most people.
Kabitu1 6 months ago
@Kabitu1 I did a degree in psychology along with several years of postgrad courses — about to start another 2-year course in September.
TheraminTrees 6 months ago 9
Excellent series of videos on Transactional Analysis.
I recommend them to my students
CounsellingResource 7 months ago
@CounsellingResource Thank you. I think TA has some incredibly valuable thinking tools to offer — even when I'm not using TA terms explicitly with clients, it informs my relationship dynamic/responses hugely.
TheraminTrees 7 months ago
Games seem to not occur in the Adult state, so I'm guessing the way to beat them is to respond in an adult state, to change their state.
I think they will continue to change their state, but if they don't go into an Adult state, then the solution would be to change into Negative Parent (probably controlling) as they will likely already be embarrassed by your already more mature state, and thus, you are now the one the parent and they are the child.
Or, any state could work, that looks easiest.
ManlySlut 7 months ago
Yeah, I need to stop falling for the "cons" projected upon me and just "unplug" more.
KIRKADELIK 8 months ago
I think one of the widest examples of these games can be found in tiny comment wars on Youtube.. I think this is due in part to the fact that comments here are just text and the reader can unknowingly project whatever kind of emotional tone onto the comment that their current state wants to here.. it also makes me wonder if by posting this am I being an adult or am I seeking some kind of parental recognition
robman8855 8 months ago
9:21"I'm sure it might seem difficult, but give it a go", seems like the adult thing to say. The encouraging nature of it seems like it's at an adult level. "I'm sure it might seem difficult, but give it a go, you know you're smart enough to do it" would seem more like the encouraging parent. What do you think?
christo930 9 months ago
i just had epiphany. with your videos. lol. this is some good stuff keep up the work.
blaze7810 10 months ago
@TheraminTrees Thank you for this series of videos. Because of them I have started reading the books you suggested in an attempt to identify and curtail my games as well as gracefully exit stressful situations with family members.
I have "Games People Play" but I couldn't quite categorize some games I find myself repeating. Is there another book you could recommend?
lepeke 11 months ago
I need help! I'm playing the "why don't you, yes but" game practically every day with a friend. She just pulls me in seemingly needing advice, but rejects everything. What do I do? Cause I know she's actually feeling down. Or wait. Maybe I'm the one playing a game where I try to help someone who isn't really seeking it? I'm so confused. Please help me!!!
Fiskepudding127 11 months ago
@Fiskepudding127 There was a game listed in "Games People Play" by Eric Berne called "I was only trying to help" Where someone's advice is continually rejected and the payoff is a feeling of bewilderment at the ingratitude of the person on the receiving end of the advice. It is very possible that your friend is playing "yes but". The exit listed in the book for "yes but" is "That is a tough one, what do you think you should do?" but also states that for the most part the game is harmless.
lepeke 11 months ago
Excellent presentation!! Keep it up look forward to many more!...hint hint...Please!
Have a good one, mate cheers again!
Christopholaes 1 year ago
Hello! I doubt I'll get a reply to this question but here goes anyway!
This series was really interesting and I'm wanting to learn more. In the video you describe discounting as when someone puts something down in a general way rather than a personal way (That painting is rubbish). Someone very close to me does this kind of thing to me all the time. I'm wondering how I should handle it. Anyone willing to help or point me in the right direction?
GermyJer 1 year ago
Hi Theramin! I have a question. In my classes in social psychology my teacher sad that transactional analysis distinguishes between two levels of analysis:functional and structural, and in the literature I couldn't find an explanation..what does that mean?
And also in the child ego state, according to him, there are 4 aspects: Adapted,Rebellious,Free and Little professor. I've always thought that there are only Adaptive and Free child.. are the both statements true?
Thank you in advance!
Ana
AHA983 1 year ago
I play this game with my therapist. >:)
I'm so lonely.
Tummyboxx 1 year ago
I think it's becoming very apparent that when theists try to constantly mislabel Atheists as "Belief in no god". I've recently been involved in that debate, and no matter how many times I explained that we define ourselves as "A-Theist" or "Without belief in gods" the person I'm arguing with continuously asserts that "Theism" is a "Position held that god does exist" or something to that effect.
This to me sounds like a controlling adult to rebellious child ego state. Is there a game for this?
Nightmare060 1 year ago
@Nightmare060 I guess if there's a game going on here, it might be clearer when the switch happens. They could just be ignorant about atheism's scope — and holding on to faulty definitions they've learned. The fact is 'lack of belief' is an accepted dictionary definition, for the reason you point out: the 'a-' part signifies 'against' OR 'without' — eg 'amoral'. Their refusal to let this info in is suggesting some unaware position like controlling Parent.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
@TheraminTrees From my experiences, the theists constantly cite their sources as places such as online dictionaries or "Dictionaries of philosiphy" as well as pushing the genetic fallacy to prove that their defanition is correct excluding all others. So a controling parent would seem to fit the bill quite nicley.
Nightmare060 1 year ago
Comment removed
Slashenaar 7 months ago
@Slashenaar Well it's an important difference to define since the person making a positive claim should have the burden of proof. You make a good point about potentially becoming the correcting parent, but the discussion was something that was brought up, and so when talking about our respective positions it's important to have an accurate definition of what that position actually is.
Nightmare060 7 months ago
@Nightmare060 This makes sense represented more as a parent -> <- parent situation to me. what need of yours is being (or attempting) met, the need to be understood, or approved of by the theist? I'm asking why do you need them to understand the difference?
Slashenaar 7 months ago
@Slashenaar Burden of proof is a big reason to clarify ones position on the existence of god(s). I can be a bit stubborn when trying to argue a point that I don't feel is being represented properly, although these days I walk away from these situations considerably more than I used to.
Nightmare060 7 months ago
What I like about TA, is that it is a simple enough theory that's accessible to ordinary people who are not formal students of psychology, yet have an interest in relationship dynamics. I'm loving your series on this compelling subject!
penning2u 1 year ago
I love the new animation.
manion2000 1 year ago
I AM A TA TEACHER AND WONDER IF YOU EVER DO ONE THAT DEALS
WITH SCRIPTS TRAGIC ONES AND BANAL ONES????
momohimmy 1 year ago
who is playing the music in the intro?
AnDr3W91 1 year ago
@AnDr3W91 It's me.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
@TheraminTrees It reminded me of the music from a game named "Fable", so I wondered if this was taken from that, or if this was someone else. I like it though :) Is there somewhere I could download it?
Great video btw. Last year year I attended a course in conflict management, where we learnd about the Drama Triangle, and how it worked in practice. I like how this videos explain this situation through the usage of the "parent", "adult" and "child" mentalities. Are there more videos about this?
AnDr3W91 1 year ago
@AnDr3W91 'Are there more videos about this?'
—Yes, this is the second part of a series. I've not heard of 'Fable'. But then my gaming essentially extends to 3 Super Mario Wii titles — although the orchestral score for that game is spectacular. The music in this video is an original piece that appears in full in another video called 'Transactional Analysis series music'.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
I think I might be addicted to your videos.
Damn, I gotta stop working on psychological issues and check in to rehab.
Emessaine 1 year ago
this video is so great. i know some people will say its just one theory, but coming from having no awareness of this stuff to watching this series, which adequately describes some relationships in my life that need fixing immediately, this is a god-send.
sad, though, when family members force you to unplug. What then???
bigbossmatt 1 year ago
Comment removed
EpistemicFusion 1 year ago
Well, that's what I get for commenting before watching the whole thing.! :P
EpistemicFusion 1 year ago
I really like this one best. It's helped me realize how I get myself caught up in these games in my own personal life. And now I realize sometimes I'm the one starting games and I don't really want to subject people I love to things that are such a waste of our time, life's short enough. But I've been really analyzing my own behavior lately and am learning much more about what's going on below the surface here. Really appreciate this whole series, Thanks!!!
CANDOKNOWHOW 1 year ago
I've read "Games People Play." Your structuring of explaining ego states and games have made my reading easier.
dmicker23 1 year ago
Understanding this concept is really hard.... :P
TheRealCadaver 1 year ago
I guess I hover between a semi-arrogant position (I'm okay, you MIGHT be okay, but lets see first.) (I'd call this more of a REALIST position.)
And a futile position, without being depressed about it. (The world sucks, I'm just not going to let it get me down much.)
I'm okay, you're okay is nonsense, some people aren't okay. In fact many aren't. Most people are kind of... ANNOYING.
I'm just not a people's person. It's true!
Shavarnarak 1 year ago
@Shavarnarak
Also that 'slippery feel' where someone pretends to be your friend but isn't is a surefire way to irritate me and make a quick enemy out of me.
(Or more likely to make me stop dealing with you.) I don't like people who screw around. I don't like liars. I don't tolerate them around me. And I can afford to eject them from my world, and thus I do.
Shavarnarak 1 year ago
@Shavarnarak
I've never thought of the whole "I'm OK..." thing as a suggestion that we should adopt the position that everyone is 'OK' and stick with it, because, obviously, some people are always going to rub us the wrong way. Rather, "I'm OK, you're OK" makes a good default position for interacting with others because it does not promote needy behavior ("I'm not OK, you're OK") or condescending behavior ("I'm ok, you're not ok"), etc. that can draw us into games.
urinferior1212 1 year ago
Very good work, research and explaining.
Beeing kind of a modern 'prodigal son' with ' P- ' in a proximity controlled social env., i combed trough the internet & libraries to find methods to cope with my surroundings. Your Videos where one of those findings who helped me evaluate a lot of the theory i read & understand my social contacts. So thanks for that :)
Question: Is there a relation between the willingness to change your state (i.g.: From (A) to (P)) & the social proximity of the 2?
dragomirlux 1 year ago
Amazing series of videos
cimmychonga 1 year ago
interesting, but like all these systems, artificial. One interpretation that works some of the time.
bandreification 1 year ago
@bandreification 'One interpretation that works some of the time.'
—This isn't clear. What one interpretation?
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
@TheraminTrees I don't like the video because it feels like a salesman's pitch rather than a discussion of ideas. TA is one interpretation of behavior.
bandreification 1 year ago
@bandreification 'I don't like the video because it feels like a salesman's pitch rather than a discussion of ideas.'
—Well, that's one interpretation — and, by the way, not accurate to my intentions at all.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
great video! thank you so much for sharing.
cherrybelly999 1 year ago
I don't understand why this video only has 8800 views, or why any 5 people would thumbs-down it.
airandfingers 1 year ago
This series is incredible. . Really, beyond excellent. I just wish I'd found it earlier, while growing up with two relatives who display high levels of Borderline and narcissistic personality traits. But I can certainly use the information here in dealing with them now. And for that I can't thank you enough for putting this all together.
bunnygotfree 1 year ago 22
@bunnygotfree Thanks bunnygotfree. It's funny you should mention narcissistic traits. I've just been dealing with a narcissist of unexpected proportions — proportions that only fully revealed themselves when all other alternatives were unsuccessful and it came time to unplug. It was like a psychotic break. I think narcissists are a minefield of games — exacerbated by their denial of flaws/responsibility. I wish you well!
TheraminTrees 1 year ago 2
@TheraminTrees - I can certainly relate to that. My experience with a narcissist of unparalleled proportions stretches my entire life span. It's so interesting to me now how I grew up falling for almost all of these games, and how the dynamic of that relationship has changed since I was able to remove myself from his warped reality - to finally realize it was him all along, not me. It's amazing, how powerful these games are. This series will definitely change people's lives for the better! -BGF
bunnygotfree 1 year ago
This is so so helpful!!! Thanks alot
reprimand33 1 year ago
Food for thought - seriously well done.
mikeyposter 1 year ago
thumbs up
saintpine 1 year ago
@saintpine Cheers saintpine
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
@TheraminTrees
I would like to translate your videos in Italian, unfortunately I don't have all that time.
Anyway you are doing a great job, excellent communication capabilities.
saintpine 1 year ago
Thank you for this. It's interesting and helpful.
Jma0322 1 year ago
thanks for the video. the series has helped me to figure out how i act.
jacewolf301 1 year ago
Your voice is so.... Calming:)
opielicker96 1 year ago
wow, great job TT!
MiViska 1 year ago
Link, again, you've made another EXCELLENT video. I've never heard of TA before, but find this incredibly fascinating. Great job.
wamerocity 1 year ago
@wamerocity Thanks wamerocity. TA's metaphors gave me a lot of thinking tools for conceptualising how I interact with people — so I thought I'd share them ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
07:49
I LOST THE GAME
Daruqe 1 year ago
what is the name of this series? Did you make this yourself? If so can you do analyses for Uproar and White Knight? Thank you very much!
7spqr7 1 year ago
I gotta read that book... I hadn't ever heard of TA before. Good video.
SmoothPinkWater 1 year ago
Epic Video. :D
MrBlamemeforit 1 year ago
Awesome, insightful well explained videos, you should do this full time!
5upercrab 1 year ago
This is so fascinating: Personally it hits me like a moment of good literature, making me reassess, see things in a new and inspiring way.
TA also seems like it might be a good way to reveal the psychology of characters in fiction. I can see these ideas wandering into a lecture to help students understand characters' interactions and, thus, overall themes. Especially with the "games" idea, my mind is a buzz with stories where characters use these interactions. Very cool stuff.
tinySpectacle 1 year ago
@tinySpectacle 'TA also seems like it might be a good way to reveal the psychology of characters in fiction.'
—Hey Lo ;8) I thought I'd replied to this! I wanted to say I can completely see the value to literature that you highlight — a way of analysing characters/interactions from the readers' point of view, as well as constructing them from the writers' side. As you say, especially with the split gamey stuff and those juicy ulterior motives.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
Fascinating series. If I could only sub to one YT channel right now, i dare say it would be TheraminTrees.
geordieppp 1 year ago
Something similar to this happened to me yesterday. Someone was egging me on, and at first I tried to defuse the situation calmly, but I reached my breaking point (I hadn't gotten a lot of sleep in the past 3-4 days). I yelled at him, but even though my outer behavior was exhibiting a "parent" ego state, my inner reasons for doing so were distinctly "adult". Indeed, in the process of yelling at him, I logically deconstructed his arguments and intellectually embarrassed him in front of everyone.
progrockcoffee 1 year ago
what is TA?
happyhippychick81 1 year ago
You know, it always impresses me how there are always a few fucking morons who will dislike anything made by anyone who is intelligent enough to destroy their beliefs and arguments.
Seriously, fuck off you ignorant pathetic bitches. There should be a merit system; where you have to give a reason for not liking the video, and if it isn't valid, then you get demerits for having a retarded opinion.
ChairmanKiel 1 year ago
Interesting ideas!! I'll have to pay more attention now to these types of games and use the tools you have given to deal with them! :-) I'm enjoying this series! I'll be checking back often so I don't miss it! xoxoxoxo
GreatGig1 1 year ago
Perhaps you could reiterate what the acronym TA stands for - Transactional Analysis - in each video for dullards like myself that needed to look at your trailer again to remind ourselves of its meaning.
Acronyms are fine but risk the teacher slipping into jargon and the learner losing the plot - so to speak.
fidgaf 1 year ago 6
@fidgaf It says "Transactional Analysis" above the video. There are several other reminders in the blurb underneath the video.
brilyn 1 year ago
really good job. looking forward to some more.
anguyen198 1 year ago
Theramin... Each of these videos are eye opening for me in MANY relationships. From casual acquaintances, to my relationship with my parents and significant others, even to my peers, elders, and teachers.
Thank you.
Xechorizo 1 year ago
this enhances my self awareness. thanks.
meylina8 1 year ago
Thanks TT, I'm enjoying the re-working of the original videos. =)
I'm very interested to hear the comments on online gaming - I'm a Games Designer and social interaction in multiplayer games formed the core of my dissertation, due to my interest in both gaming and psychology. (Though I might have mis-interpreted your comment to nemo3590)
mriswithmoo 1 year ago
mm I think would be a good idea to add some examples of what a game is beyond "why don't you, yes but" game, so the viewers could more closely relate it to their personal experiences.
LukeGeoDude 1 year ago
Thank you.
IgnominiouZ 1 year ago
Very good :)
HiAdrian 1 year ago
can i have your brain pls, you can have mine, it's not in bad condtion, just needs a bit of a work out.
kendrawhisp 1 year ago
SPOILER: He's going to die in the series finale.
ChaoticSupernova 1 year ago
Really enjoyable - as always. Thanks.
WolfriksWorld 1 year ago
Can't wait for the next video.
legion696 1 year ago
1of2 This is exactly what I needed to hear today. I was explaining exactly this but with a good cop bad cop variable injected into the game. The owner of the Lab was tryn to instill fear as a strict abusive parent & the Lab foreskin was the parent that was tryn to help us out of "our invintory lab supply Problem". The owner was "So upset,Angry & disapointed that he could not talk to us in person" & could only write a Hate filled letter . I told my co-workers that nothing was at stake except.....
M1ST3RHYDE 1 year ago
2of2
.... For the owners ability to recognize his neglect of the theft & gross miss use of supplies that we all have worned him of. This all came from the 2 office managers that he placed too much power & trust in due to his lazyness which alowed them both to embezzle over $250,000 by creating business credit cards for our department only to make fake orders to line their own pockets. Now we are to fing sequencers & supplies that don't exist.
I need to email this to my co-workers, Thanks.
M1ST3RHYDE 1 year ago
I seem to remember you doing a series that is almost exactly the same to this one. Is this some sort of remake?
nemo3590 1 year ago
@nemo3590 The first two are a reworking of the old three with some new emphases, and I wanted to extend the series to include some comment on online gaming and the TA of religion.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
@TheraminTrees ...and when will those two topics be coming about?
FelipeFGM 1 year ago
Everybody should watch this video and think about themselves... Thank you, Theramintrees!
nmavrantzas 1 year ago
The last one I shared on facebook had a nice discussion with several people watching. I'm sure this one will as well.
Thank you TT for doing this work. Your videos are wonderful.
FergTubeAble 1 year ago
@FergTubeAble Thanks FergTubeAble! ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
Wow, this really gives some great tips to better balance everyday transactions with people.
Fantastic video.
IFloridaMotocrossI 1 year ago
This seems really useful! I'm not very experienced with socializing but I know I've fallen into some of the gimmicks you describe. I'll definitely check out that book you mentioned. :3
OutlawGrrl 1 year ago
I'm glad you're covering this series. Few other YouTube users make their videos with such intuitive visual displays.
OneCatholic 1 year ago
@OneCatholic Thanks OneCatholic ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
very interesting...look forward to the next
Tadeusz598 1 year ago
This may prove to be among the most valuable series on YouTube.
10/10
ProfessorPEARL 1 year ago 14
@ProfessorPEARL Thanks Professor ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
This is great. I'm really enjoying this series.
hilbert54 1 year ago 17
Helped a lot, thanks Theramin!
tomaselvis 1 year ago
Great series, I'm really finding it informative and helpful
rabbitpirate 1 year ago
@rabbitpirate That's great! Cheers ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
Why don't you put a more "searchable" title to this kind of videos? I mean, just the keywords are not enough and this way looks like you don't want your video to be located at all... and they are far from good...
.
Thanks.
T3mporal 1 year ago
Great video.
I was thinking about the "Why don't you/yes but" game, and I think it has another posible switch: a crossed transaction, with both at parent. The "rescuer" gets offended by the other's discount, and responds negatively.
ZebaSzp 1 year ago
@ZebaSzp Absolutely — another kind of Switch! In theory any combination of V, P and R Switches are possible. Like A rescuing B, feeling sorry for them going to all that fruitless effort: 'Aw .... well, you tried.'
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
It seems like a lot of thought has been put into how the information in the videos is presented. The branching out of information presented is handled elegantly. It makes the flow of the video easy to follow. Well done!
maxthelimitinfo 1 year ago
@maxthelimitinfo well said. I completely agree.
flaze3 1 year ago
@maxthelimitinfo Thanks Maxthelimitinfo. I do have reservations about the amount of info I'm trying to pack in, so that's valuable feedback.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
Very well done. It`s interesting how by spending a bit of time working on yourself you can see your own faults and those in others as well. BUT the important thing is to realize that we all have issues and no to take it so personally; often times they aren`t doing it on purpose and don`t even realize what they are doing. That is what helps me. Another great video.
Cheers!
Papa
papasitoman 1 year ago
excellent work ;D
easytorememberme 1 year ago
if i asked someone to help me, and they said well what do you think you should do, id say i dont have a scoobies, what do you think. maybe it is to affirm to yourself that there is no solution as you and your frind both cant come up with something you have not already thought of. not a game tho.
kendrawhisp 1 year ago
@kendrawhisp 'if i asked someone to help me, and they said well what do you think you should do, id say i dont have a scoobies, what do you think'
—And I'd say, 'I don't know'. If you wanted my help, I'd expect you to give me at least some input on what you'd already tried, etc. Without that I'm in danger of wasting my time going through a ton of Yes, buts.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
@TheraminTrees LOL true
kendrawhisp 1 year ago
im not sure its as simple as some game where someone is wanting to have their inaction justified and ego boosted. perhaps the person has already thought of these suggested solutions and wants someone to come up with a solution that they have never thought of, and when that isnt possible frustration can set in and you feel like telling someone to do one, but you don't mean to put them down, you just feel fucked, and that anger is momentarily expressed. Then you apologise.
kendrawhisp 1 year ago
@kendrawhisp The video isn't saying these are always the dynamics in a scenario where A constantly rejects B's 'help'. The video is just showing an example of when it is. Let's face it, sometimes B will hit on the solution. Sometimes A will bring B up to speed on what they've already tried. But when it's a constant pattern between two people, the video suggests looking at whether a game's being played.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
really useful series, thank you theramin trees, i follow your videos...
AelfricLake 1 year ago
@AelfricLake Thanks Aelfric ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
These exact concepts appeared in other videos you've released something like a year ago. Same examples even.
dashxdr 1 year ago
@dashxdr These first 2 videos cover and extend the old 3 videos. They felt ropey in terms of production — hideous noise on the mic. Plus I wanted to emphasise some new points. Then wanted to extend the series.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
@TheraminTrees
Thanks for your response. I never noticed the mic noise. These new videos certainly are pretty.
Lately I've been trying to figure out what the payoff is for making YouTube videos. I personally can't work up the motivation to make more. YouTube seems to entertain but not educate...
dashxdr 1 year ago
Can't wait for the next one!
JaviFairground 1 year ago
Please hurry with part 3 :)
V0r4xiz 1 year ago
great stuff!
jmosler9 1 year ago
Thank you so much for making these videos. I can already see how they might help me in my work environment.
SuziePenguin 1 year ago
@SuziePenguin Work can be rife with games can't they — often with reduced capacity for unplugging! ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
Theramin Trees, you are AWESOME!!! I won't miss a video of yours. Keep up the good work. Please post the third video quickly :)
thebluishrosette 1 year ago
@thebluishrosette Thank you thebluishrosette ;8) I'm off here for a few days, so the next one will have a slightly longer gap, but then hopefully back to a weekly schedule for the remaining two.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
I've seen this sort of thing with many people. You get those who either try to take responsibility for absolutely everything, and people who try to pawn responsibility for things on to you at every opportunity.They have tricks they employ to get that result, most of which could be seen as attempts to affirm parent or child status respectively. Parent and child seem to correspond to dominant/submissive roles, too, which is the way I always thought about it before I saw your first vid on TA..
Barkspawn 1 year ago
Great video! Motivates me to have a look inside my copy of "Games People Play" again and more thoroughly. Thank you.
I have a question though. Isn't it necessary for us to sometimes take, for example, a nurturing parent position to maintain relationships? To be a friend and "caring"? The way I understood that position, people often take turns assuming it in a friendship/friendly relationship.
foolnwhat 1 year ago
@foolnwhat Something I hoped would come through in this video in particular is the value the positive aspects of controlling, nurturing, adapted and free styles of being. If we were Adult all the time, we'd be missing out on so much.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
you just gave this evil man a book to read, apologize to this world ^^
princeofexcess 1 year ago
Is the "Ian Stewart" in your description the same one who co-authored "Figments of Reality" with Cohen and the series "The Science of Discworld" with Cohen and Terry Pratchett?
commanderkruge 1 year ago
Comment removed
sciencemile 1 year ago
Meh... I'm pretty sure if I was having a conversation and I said "I THINK WE'RE IN A GAME" they'de probably think I was mental.
"WE HAVE TO DEFEAT THE GAME MASTER!"
Other than that, though, interestng stuff.
What I was wondering, though, is if there is a way to come back from the final response in that game, ie.
"You're a great help!"
"Shutup you idiot"
Mordain607 1 year ago
@Mordain607 yes that is but its an unstable state. Also it ruins relationships. THere are other things you could do as well like end the game as you begin to see that your ideas arent helping you can ask what were the other ideas that he had to the problem this way he is the one that will have to give the ideas or admit that he had none. In this way you dont end up looking ignorant and depending how you take it you can turn it so you end up looking supportive.
princeofexcess 1 year ago
@princeofexcess
Hmmm... I'm not sure in that situation. The guy asking for help is clearly being an arse. I've tried to help him and he responds with ungrateful sarcasm.
Mordain607 1 year ago
@Mordain607 you have no idea how funny this is. (our conversation is the mirror of yes but conversation. You asked if there is a way. I tried to respond with help you said YES BUT the guys is a jerk so it wont work.) What do you think would be an improvement to asking him what solutions he has for the problem?
princeofexcess 1 year ago
@Mordain607
How about "are you trying to play games with me"?
ionz75 1 year ago
@ionz75
Yeah, I guess. The other guy might be kinda' confused though.
Mordain607 1 year ago
Thank You Theramin, These are not only interesting but incredibly helpful.
OatSharpener 1 year ago
@OatSharpener Thanks. TA's metaphors've transformed my relationship into a vastly drama-free zone. I'll admit drama used to feel 'exhilarating' to a degree — that heightened state, with more at stake. But the stuff it blocked — the genuine intimacy, fun, love, laughter — that's since come through shows the thinness of drama like nothing else.
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
These videos have most info per second on youtube i've seen thus far.
MrWisePete 1 year ago 12
@MrWisePete Thanks MrWise!
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
Thanks for making the internet more informative.
slipcurve 1 year ago
@slipcurve Thanks slipcurve ;8)
TheraminTrees 1 year ago
i'm guilty of playing the fourth degree games.