After listening for Coltrane for over forty years, I find this the most bold expression of a standard. Mcoy's opening really blew me away, especially with his searing up-tempo intro!
Another musician whom I've seen over the past twenty years, in our area (New York) Sal Giorgiani, smokes like Trane...is a wunderkind, worth listening to.
@KingIchigo Congratulations, there's a world to discover. About the description: ss=soprano saxophone, p=piano, b=bass and d=drums. I was too lazy to type it all out, I sure hope you don't mind.
Terms like "Free Jazz" can be confusing.Elvin said that he had an almost telepathic relationship with Coltrane and as this quartet progressed Elvin was playing almost as one with Coltrane.However Elvin preferred working in a 4/4 context and "Ascension" is not free but is in 4/4 time and has a chord sequence.Total "freedom" came with Rashied Ali on drums . A duo album called "Interstellar Space" is an example.I believe Albert Ayler inspired Trane towards playing totally "free" music.
It's amazing to hear how great McCoy is playing in this bebop-like solo before he ditched it and went to pentatonics and 4th stacks...
Some of this sounds like Jarrett did 20 years later with his standards trio. It's also odd to hear Trane keeping the time instead of Elvin who is doing lots of free washes of sound. Hmmm., I wonder if ELVIN influenced Trane to go totally free in the next couple of years?
@radiokid2 I don't think so. Elvin quit the band and was replaced by Rashied Ali because he didn't like Trane going 'totally free'. But of course he was one hell of a musician, whithout whom Trane's development probably wouldn't be so crazy fast, just getting better and better.
@jlhyz2 Yes, he did. However, I don't think Ascension is very noteworthy if you look at the direction Trane was going - after all, he quickly abandoned the big band idea and returned to a smaller one (4, 5 men). With that Late Quartet he played till his dead, and Elvin Jones was part of that no more.
Listen to Live at Village Vanguard around 1963 and you hear the Dolphy influence- it's the conceptual liberation of incorporating bird sounds and other totally atonal things that Coltrane got from Dolphy. Atonal, isolated fragments of sound with no ostensible relationship to the tune's tonality. I had musician friend who roomed with Dolphy in '64 or '63, he said he had a brain tumor and my friend's theory was his brain tumor promoted the bird-oriented, a-tonal approach.
@techman6 wow. I love Dolphy. Did your friend mention anything else about him? Like what music he liked listening to at the time? What he used to practice? (I know he used to practice with the birds!) What about his temperament and habits, like his ordinary daily activities? Sorry, I'm really nosey...
@jazzmunky I have long since lost touch with my friend. I understand he still lives in North Carolina and occasionally plays concerts, Mr. Ray Codrington. You would have to contact him.
Nice discovery for me. I have been digging the Classic Quartet for let me see, the last 31 years, and missed this one somehow. John Coltrane "Afro Blue- Impressions" is the mother load from European tours of the time. Coltrane had pushed bebop to the limit and was trying to find a way out of the box. Modalism was the answer, but it almost rendered the emotions bottled up by bebop unmanageable. Coltrane left the linear change-running paradigm shortly after this period. What great art this is.
Sorry, that's dead wrong. Avant-Garde refers to music (or art in general) that pushes boundaries. In French it literally means "vanguard." Free Jazz is a type of Jazz that does not rely on chord changes, or prearranged melodic statements. Free Jazz refers to complete and total improvisation. Fusion is a terms for when jazz fuses with other genres. However the term fusion has nothing to do with whether its "free"
True, the three do overlap sometimes, but they are not really related.
@Paiste01 Trane is famous for both his early bebop works and his later free jazz. This song is from his Classic Quarter period, which is in the middle of those. I would not like to call it either bebop nor avant-garde. It's just another well known jazz standard, sounding to me like it didn't take much effort for him to play it at all.
@leetomboulian It's awesome to view a discussion on these phenomenal artist...I'm happy I found a form to share my love for jazz, John Coltrane..McCoy Tyner or Red Garland.I'm more familiar with McCoy Tyner's like
@DajaWaja Sure he did. He could have mastered any instrument if he wanted to. He also played bass clarinet, percussion and bells, though he's not as famous for that of course.
@DajaWaja Try for instance the My Favorite Things version on Live at the Village Vanguard again (I put it on YouTube). Somewhere in the middle of the song there's a duet between Trane on bass clarinet and Pharoah Sanders on flute. It's avant garde, I hope you like that kind of music.
@bopbee3 I actually believe this was Red Garland, in a class we recently analyzed this tune, and the instructer said it was Red
Also, even though Red never bops-out which would lead you to believe that this is McCoy, at the end of his solo listen to all the chords he plays, that is very Red Garland in my opinion
@queperknuckle I think this could be one of the only sax solos i've ever heard over this!? You should check the bass and piano solos on the billy cobham version tho... those are also niiiiiiice.
This doesn't sound like McCoy on piano. It sounds more like Red Garland. I know it doesn't make sense, since the quartet was already formed by then. Maybe McCoy was out of action?
@dramione454 I know Garrison and Jones weren't with Trane at all times, but I believe Tyner never left the band. Also this fast playing style really is like Tyner I would say.
@Praguedive I actually believe this was Red Garland, in a class we recently analyzed this tune, and the instructer said it was Red
Also, even though Red never bops-out which would lead you to believe that this is McCoy, at the end of his solo listen to all the chords he plays, that is very Red Garland in my opinion,
Also, some should start a jazz site where people can just talk about this stuff, wouldnt that be great?
@dramione454 As far as Jazz piano is concerned, Oscar Peterson & Art Tatum have permanently spoiled/ruined me. I just can't really get into Jazz piano playing. (if not done by them). To me it's obviously an essential part of most Jazz compositions, but 1 relegated to "background noise". It's not that "dislike" it, I am just indifferent to it. The being said, I have to make an exception for this piece. It is phenomenal. I also like Dave Brubeck.
@dramione454 I'm pretty sure it's McCoy too with the emphatic, attacking, staccato-like improv characterised by melodic thematic lines. Red would sound more legato IMO and stick to more broken diminished chords.
What's the most amazing is the way he just can't help chorusing even when taking the theme again, about one or two minutes before the end. I never couldn't stop listening to this, after more than 16 years. Coltrane's not the boss. He is God in a land of freedom!
What's the most amazing is the way he just can't help chorusing even when taking the theme again, about one or two minutes before the end. I never couldn't stop listening to this, after more than 16 years. Coltrane's not the boss. He is God in a land of freedom!
After listening for Coltrane for over forty years, I find this the most bold expression of a standard. Mcoy's opening really blew me away, especially with his searing up-tempo intro!
Another musician whom I've seen over the past twenty years, in our area (New York) Sal Giorgiani, smokes like Trane...is a wunderkind, worth listening to.
padleynj 3 hours ago
0:18
mainstreamrevolution 5 days ago
@KingIchigo Congratulations, there's a world to discover. About the description: ss=soprano saxophone, p=piano, b=bass and d=drums. I was too lazy to type it all out, I sure hope you don't mind.
Praguedive 1 month ago
so i love music when i'm stoned...i wonder what this will be like?
XspeakerXforXmarsX 1 month ago
@XspeakerXforXmarsX how was it?
LyricallyBlessedTV 1 month ago
@LyricallyBlessedTV MINDOPENING O.O it's right up there with fantasia on my list of things to do when baked out ur mind.
XspeakerXforXmarsX 1 month ago
Terms like "Free Jazz" can be confusing.Elvin said that he had an almost telepathic relationship with Coltrane and as this quartet progressed Elvin was playing almost as one with Coltrane.However Elvin preferred working in a 4/4 context and "Ascension" is not free but is in 4/4 time and has a chord sequence.Total "freedom" came with Rashied Ali on drums . A duo album called "Interstellar Space" is an example.I believe Albert Ayler inspired Trane towards playing totally "free" music.
davesolomon53 2 months ago
It's amazing to hear how great McCoy is playing in this bebop-like solo before he ditched it and went to pentatonics and 4th stacks...
Some of this sounds like Jarrett did 20 years later with his standards trio. It's also odd to hear Trane keeping the time instead of Elvin who is doing lots of free washes of sound. Hmmm., I wonder if ELVIN influenced Trane to go totally free in the next couple of years?
radiokid2 3 months ago
@radiokid2 I don't think so. Elvin quit the band and was replaced by Rashied Ali because he didn't like Trane going 'totally free'. But of course he was one hell of a musician, whithout whom Trane's development probably wouldn't be so crazy fast, just getting better and better.
Praguedive 3 months ago
@Praguedive Actually i think elvin Jones played on john Coltrane's Ascension album which is probably his most "free" album. I might be wrong though.
jlhyz2 2 months ago
@jlhyz2 Yes, he did. However, I don't think Ascension is very noteworthy if you look at the direction Trane was going - after all, he quickly abandoned the big band idea and returned to a smaller one (4, 5 men). With that Late Quartet he played till his dead, and Elvin Jones was part of that no more.
Praguedive 2 months ago
Listen to Live at Village Vanguard around 1963 and you hear the Dolphy influence- it's the conceptual liberation of incorporating bird sounds and other totally atonal things that Coltrane got from Dolphy. Atonal, isolated fragments of sound with no ostensible relationship to the tune's tonality. I had musician friend who roomed with Dolphy in '64 or '63, he said he had a brain tumor and my friend's theory was his brain tumor promoted the bird-oriented, a-tonal approach.
techman6 3 months ago
@techman6 wow. I love Dolphy. Did your friend mention anything else about him? Like what music he liked listening to at the time? What he used to practice? (I know he used to practice with the birds!) What about his temperament and habits, like his ordinary daily activities? Sorry, I'm really nosey...
jazzmunky 2 months ago
@jazzmunky I have long since lost touch with my friend. I understand he still lives in North Carolina and occasionally plays concerts, Mr. Ray Codrington. You would have to contact him.
techman6 2 months ago
Nice discovery for me. I have been digging the Classic Quartet for let me see, the last 31 years, and missed this one somehow. John Coltrane "Afro Blue- Impressions" is the mother load from European tours of the time. Coltrane had pushed bebop to the limit and was trying to find a way out of the box. Modalism was the answer, but it almost rendered the emotions bottled up by bebop unmanageable. Coltrane left the linear change-running paradigm shortly after this period. What great art this is.
techman6 3 months ago
@Praguedive
Sorry, that's dead wrong. Avant-Garde refers to music (or art in general) that pushes boundaries. In French it literally means "vanguard." Free Jazz is a type of Jazz that does not rely on chord changes, or prearranged melodic statements. Free Jazz refers to complete and total improvisation. Fusion is a terms for when jazz fuses with other genres. However the term fusion has nothing to do with whether its "free"
True, the three do overlap sometimes, but they are not really related.
ethansimon94 3 months ago
What genre of jazz is this?
Paiste01 3 months ago
@Paiste01 Trane is famous for both his early bebop works and his later free jazz. This song is from his Classic Quarter period, which is in the middle of those. I would not like to call it either bebop nor avant-garde. It's just another well known jazz standard, sounding to me like it didn't take much effort for him to play it at all.
Praguedive 3 months ago
@Praguedive Thx for the quick reply, could you say "free jazz" equals or is a synonym for "avant-garde jazz"? I don't know the difference...Cheers
Paiste01 3 months ago
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230 people are going to beat the shit out of 1 person.
tlord29 3 months ago 4
It blows my mind how fast Trane changes register. The only other guy I can think of who does that is Dolphy.
Modes9 3 months ago
@Modes9 I agree, totally free. Coltrane and Dolphy played together and it is said that Coltrane was greatly inspired by Dolphy's playing.
stedaving 3 months ago
...and you must feel it!!!
claugabis 3 months ago
as usually - I cant belive how they played on such level - music is easy and beatiful - but only one condition - you must be genius
lokanta100 3 months ago
Very very fine !
Thanks
123must 3 months ago
wo...
DESMONDFOREVER 3 months ago
Undoubtedly McCoy Tyner...
atouchofroots 4 months ago
This is a Like by default :D
Blestyr 4 months ago
there is nothing like understanding crazy.
erniesullivan 4 months ago
The chords at the end of solo announcing Trane are clearly Tyner.
leetomboulian 4 months ago
@leetomboulian It's awesome to view a discussion on these phenomenal artist...I'm happy I found a form to share my love for jazz, John Coltrane..McCoy Tyner or Red Garland.I'm more familiar with McCoy Tyner's like
Autumn Serenade where there is a distinctive beat
shop4sue 3 months ago
coltrane played flute too?
DajaWaja 4 months ago
@DajaWaja Sure he did. He could have mastered any instrument if he wanted to. He also played bass clarinet, percussion and bells, though he's not as famous for that of course.
Praguedive 4 months ago 5
@Praguedive i'd love to hear him on bass clarinet, do you know any recording?
DajaWaja 4 months ago
@DajaWaja Try for instance the My Favorite Things version on Live at the Village Vanguard again (I put it on YouTube). Somewhere in the middle of the song there's a duet between Trane on bass clarinet and Pharoah Sanders on flute. It's avant garde, I hope you like that kind of music.
Praguedive 4 months ago
This is apparently Tyner,
very very nice ,his playing in this era.
bopbee3 5 months ago
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@bopbee3 I actually believe this was Red Garland, in a class we recently analyzed this tune, and the instructer said it was Red
Also, even though Red never bops-out which would lead you to believe that this is McCoy, at the end of his solo listen to all the chords he plays, that is very Red Garland in my opinion
MrExtraToastable 4 months ago
Isn't there someone humming in the background , during the first 4 minutes?
binoclard24 5 months ago
I think I'm willing to concede that it's McCoy! I just guess I'm imagining Red Garland at 2:35/2:45 & 4:25 with those "clipped" chords. Thanks.
dramione454 5 months ago
@dramione454 Oh, that's definitely McCoy Tyner. I'd bet at least three fingers on it.
polymath7 5 months ago
@polymath7 thats what i think, it becomes aparent at the end of his solo
MrExtraToastable 4 months ago
@MrExtraToastable sorry i misread, this is Definatly Red Garland
MrExtraToastable 4 months ago
@MrExtraToastable If you listen at 4:28 you can hear that this Tyner....
addeex1 4 months ago 5
@dramione454 OK I hear exactly what you mean. Aren't those ambiguous voicings cool and modern
custardapple777 5 months ago
Coltrane was a master at his craft. He had control over the instrument. It's amazing to hear such talent and skill. So charismatic!!!!!!!
wozniacki15 5 months ago
all the comments sucks.
MrKandamo 6 months ago 3
Damn another killin tune.
BashuUp 6 months ago
best autumn leaves solo ever, bar none
queperknuckle 7 months ago
@queperknuckle I think this could be one of the only sax solos i've ever heard over this!? You should check the bass and piano solos on the billy cobham version tho... those are also niiiiiiice.
Richirida 6 months ago
This doesn't sound like McCoy on piano. It sounds more like Red Garland. I know it doesn't make sense, since the quartet was already formed by then. Maybe McCoy was out of action?
dramione454 7 months ago
@dramione454 I know Garrison and Jones weren't with Trane at all times, but I believe Tyner never left the band. Also this fast playing style really is like Tyner I would say.
Praguedive 7 months ago
@Praguedive I actually believe this was Red Garland, in a class we recently analyzed this tune, and the instructer said it was Red
Also, even though Red never bops-out which would lead you to believe that this is McCoy, at the end of his solo listen to all the chords he plays, that is very Red Garland in my opinion,
Also, some should start a jazz site where people can just talk about this stuff, wouldnt that be great?
MrExtraToastable 4 months ago
@dramione454 This is definitely with Tyner, Garrison, and Elvin Jones. Trane is flyin'
shaktidas 7 months ago
@dramione454 As far as Jazz piano is concerned, Oscar Peterson & Art Tatum have permanently spoiled/ruined me. I just can't really get into Jazz piano playing. (if not done by them). To me it's obviously an essential part of most Jazz compositions, but 1 relegated to "background noise". It's not that "dislike" it, I am just indifferent to it. The being said, I have to make an exception for this piece. It is phenomenal. I also like Dave Brubeck.
gjc82071 6 months ago
@gjc82071 I have Transcribe a slow down program. Peterson & Tatum sound better at 70% to my ears.
custardapple777 5 months ago
@dramione454 I'm pretty sure it's McCoy too with the emphatic, attacking, staccato-like improv characterised by melodic thematic lines. Red would sound more legato IMO and stick to more broken diminished chords.
custardapple777 5 months ago
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What's the most amazing is the way he just can't help chorusing even when taking the theme again, about one or two minutes before the end. I never couldn't stop listening to this, after more than 16 years. Coltrane's not the boss. He is God in a land of freedom!
Pidouism 1 year ago
What's the most amazing is the way he just can't help chorusing even when taking the theme again, about one or two minutes before the end. I never couldn't stop listening to this, after more than 16 years. Coltrane's not the boss. He is God in a land of freedom!
Pidouism 1 year ago
Been a Trane fan for a while and I've never heard this. arrg so good.
n8dogg87 1 year ago
This is nothing like the Autumn Leaves most people know. It's better.
Johnymo 1 year ago 19
Probably the greatest soprano sax solo of all time.
That shit makes me weep.
CrandMackerel 1 year ago
@CrandMackerel
the soprano on chim chim cheree (nevermind the tune..it's just a vehicle) is heavy.
grwatanabe 1 year ago
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@CrandMackerel
the soprano on chim chim cheree (never mind the tune.. it is just a vehicle) is pretty heavy.
grwatanabe 1 year ago
fuck!!!!!!!!!! i want that fuckin' album man
peruanboy 2 years ago
I was expecting a deep rich tenor, but I was blown a away by the soprano. Coltrane was a boss, is a boss and will always be the boss.
anthrax1218 2 years ago 46
@anthrax1218
fuck U bruce springsteen is the boss
MrJihadjared 1 year ago
@MrJihadjared bruce springsteen is gay
MrAlfredocolon 1 year ago
@MrAlfredocolon agreed, fuck bruce springsteen, not the boss of me.
MrJihadjared 1 year ago
Immense
1S15FReud 2 years ago