the solution to health care is the ability for the a person to find a policy that they can afford (buying insurance from other states) that also they are comfortable with the benefits and that the insurer will pay and not deny the claime , the other is pre existing conditions which is a seperate issue , doctors charge exorbitant amounts because insurance only pay a percentage of the bill , caps must be put on everything as far as proceedures and tests go,
They protest only when somebody molest their wealth that is not even a person that is fat capitalist animal trying to preserve his big house and car. Stop consuming all the energy in the world stop starting wars the world is fucking tired of you.
If there is a better way we should go for it. Real people are suffering every day. As a progressive I fight for them. I am like most of you, well off with plenty of private health care. But I recognize that the system as it currently stands does not meet the needs of everyone. If there is a way to do so we should. Free markets are not the be all end all. Government can and does work.
if they pass this health care plan, do you think for one minute that we won't be taxed for everything that they concider unhealthy activity. Sking could be concidered a health care activity. If you say.. aww come on that's rediculus.. Well all I have to say is, YOU JUST WAIT TILL THE GOVERNMENT STARTS GETTING INTO YOUR EVERYDAY LIFE. kINDA LIKE HOW THE WAR ON DRUGS GOT THEM INTO OUR BANK ACCOUNTS
Have you researched this more than listening to talk radio? You are making some pretty out there claims and you don't seem to understand what the health care bill is all about. I encourage you to do more research on both sides of the argument not just one.
jrjones529, changing the whole system is not a better way. Any government option will do as government always does, run it's program at a deficit. That will end up running the private plans that most are happy with out of business, end in rationing for all with a government that will be as dismissive toward those who complain as they are to those currently protesting. Government does not work well. Social Security is a Ponzi scheme. Medicare is subsidized by cost shifting to private carriers.
This isn't a Dem or GOP issue. The GOP spent us to the edge of the cliff. The Dems are tripling down. First stimulus trillions, then, healthcare,then cap and trade. We have no way of repaying the debt we are placing on our children and grandchildren. Where are the adults? Currently, the uninsured get care. It is done inefficiently but at least it is limited to the uninsured. Fix that without taking us all down a road we will never recover from. We are not worker bees for a ruling class.
next post. I believe we should use the system that works best to help the most people based on each issue. The private free market does not, in all it's invisible wisdom and glory, do a good job helping the disadvantaged, and for that I believe there is a proper role for government. With the plans being discussed you will keep your private insurance if yuou don't want to switch, but others will now also be covered who previously were not. Good for all.
I'm not losing the good coverage I have because of the 11% of the lazy that refuse to work for their own, and then refuse to fill out a little paperwork to get free healthcare.
Your comment exemplifies why the left is losing the healthcare debate. 80% of the country is satisfied with their healthcare. They dont support HR3200 because they have legitimate concerns about rationing, waitlists and losing their current healthcare coverage.
Instead of defending the bill, the left calls Americans asking questions about the bill racists, terrorists, Nazis, KKK members and un-American. You just used the words ignorant and fool.
LandofDaFree people can be satisfied with what they have and unsastisfied with millions of others being denied treatment. I have fantastic health care but so do people in France, Canada, and everyother industrialized nation except us that offers single-payer or some form of it. Time the US catches up. As for rationing, where are their concerns about the rationing that already happens now? Many of the loudest people at these rallies are racist. The signs speak for themselves.
jrjones529, if there is rationing by a company now, there are other choices. When we go to single payer, there is no place else to go. If a company is ripping off the public by overcharging or offering poor service, there is room for another company to come in and take their customers. jrjones529, when you say this is racism you tell every black child that anyone against government control really just hates them. That is an irresponsible charge.
cmpm439 single payer is government run insurance it is not subsidized by private insurers. At least not the kind I'm in favor of. many of your concerns, such as that employers will force people to switch, may be addressed in the final bill. statistically equality is shown to increase the quality of life and standard of living. who can say the civil rights movement was a bad thing? a government program means citizens vote for the options they want, and the overseers are accountable to the...
..to the people. We vote them in and vote them out. if everyone is involved, rich and poor, the system will work. obama has said time and again the system will pay for itself. deficits won't happen if we chose to fund the programs properly. as to the racism comments, I stick by them. your side has a systemic problem. I'm a white guy from the conservative south, I am very aware of what is going on in the minds of many of those people. I am not accusing you of racism you seem very rationale
jrjones, if everyone is involved in housing, we will have no more homeless. Are you next in for government housing for all? Maybe 500 square feet per person supplied by the government? Nothing could be more basic than a roof over our head. If we all get the same house it would also be equal. Is there something different about health care not to give options? Stick to your racism claim if you wish. Just be aware it is as hurtful to spread a rumor about a racist as it is to actually be one.
cmpm439 idealistically, which means it is unattainable, I am for equality to the point that there is no more suffering. At that point you can have as much money and as big a house as you want.. Doesn't mean we'd all have the same size house in some boring, homogenized society. but to answer your question, i'm in favor of providing a roof for all. one step at a time. i'm not spreading any rumors.
jrjones529, we both agree with the goal of no more suffering. I don't doubt that the best way to achieve that is to let the free market expand job creation, let competition keep bad businesses in check, let free trade pull the third world into a market ( supply and demand based) expansion. It certainly is rumor based to say that health care opponents are racist. It is no different than telling the neighborhood that you believe one of your neighbors is a rapist without proof. It hurts everyone.
well i'm glad we agree on one thing! of course i think the markets have their place but i argue that government does also. i am against unnecessary government, however. i agree with you that calling people out without proof is harmful, however my observations are based on what i've seen and heard with my own eyes and ears (not what somebody else has told me). my conclusion is based on my observations.
Racists? The people attending these townhalls are representative of the majority of this country that opposes the government overhaul of healthcare that Congress and Obama are trying to force upon us. There had nothing to do with race..
You lose all credibilty when you call people who disagree with your racists without cause. You're not worth listening to.
Majority of the country? Absolutely not. Why then do 73% of the American public support health reform? Yes, they are white, and maybe represent a majority or slight plurality of white Americans, but not the American majority. Racism is a problem and I stand by that. I've seen enough Nazi swasitkas and racial innuendo, in addition to my own personal experience growing up in right wing America to know what's really beneath the surface.
73%? Are you kidding me? Actually more people disagree with it putting it at 57% of people say they dont want it and BTW everyone Obama approval rating is at 49% so STFU libs!
I think Czar Obama has divided this country more! He thinks he is above everybody and he is so out of touch! The worst part is when I voted for this czar I thought things would be different from when we had Bush, but now I miss him, aleast Bush knew what freedom was!
Right or left its all the same, don't you see?...they're trying to make us so dependent on the government that we will be more of modern day slaves. I wish you luck blind sheep... 73%? ha!! good 1
jrjones529, anti trust laws were established to keep a company from gaining an unfair advantage that would drive other businesses out of the market. Large businesses will purposely undercut other small business prices, selling their product at a loss until all others fail. This is what will happen with a government option that will run at a deficit. There will be no private insurance at that time, just as Obama and many other prominent Democrats have laid out in past speeches. Bad for most.
cmpm439 if there is a better way and people flock to it why would you be against that? isn't that what choice is all about? i'm a single - payer advocate so I have no problem with your concern coming to fruition. a system designed for poor people is a poor system. government monopoly = choice by accountability.
Businesses would flock to that plan because it would be cheaper....initially. The government can run a plan at a deficit for a period of time, just as they have run social security and medicare at a deficit. Employees would not have the choice if the employer decides to go to the government option. It is a mischaracterization to say people would flock to it because it is better. Poor people do not have to stay poor in America. Equalizing at a lower level for the sake of equality hurts everyone.
Eventually a single payer system will no longer be subsidized by private insurers (as medicare now is to the tune of $1500- $1800 per family per year). Add a time when the deficit reaches an unsustainable level and health care will have to be rationed. It also pulls another 20 percent of private industry into the public sector. Add energy to the public sector and there won't be much left to us. I can't imagine anyone wanting to give their choices up for a single choice decided by politicians.
I appreciate your comment and concern and you seem informed to your point. Unfortunately we disagree on the effectiveness of government. I believe it can be used to help people who are suffering needlessly and you believe it never works. Government is like anything else, it is run by people. There can be good government and there can be bad government. Same with corporations. See next post
Based on some of her podcasts, I believe Dana Loesch may be part Native America. Whatever her ancestry, she doesn't use ethnic identity to decide what she believes in. The great thing about America is that we are not forced into any kind of racial or ethnic box.
Why are you so upset? Why do you feel the need to spam videos with your caps lock and internet sarcasm?
It would be best for you to not subscribe so violently to partisan politics. Try thinking for yourself for a change. It may get you somewhere other than being a starstruck idiot who will ingest whatever The O deposits into your grimy little hands.
Lol its funny that unions and the white house accuse these "angry mobs" as being paid off or led to oppose these things when in fact there are so many events to site where they themselves have loaded questions or thugs or have paid off others to do things for them. It's LOL.
Reform of problems with Healthcare yes. Government in anyway in control of it NO! Lets look at their efficiently run bankrupt entitlements and how well they are run and managed. They are horrible!!! First fix Medicare and Medicaid that will take care of the elderly and poor. Add Medicaid provision for unemployed. Then lets talk about real reform to drive down costs by allowing for interstate competition, tort reform, pre-existing, and rx drugs. No Gov. run!!!
Explain to me the misinformation you are referring to, please. I do want to know where you are coming from. this is supposed to be a discussion so lets leave pity out of it. why do you support big insurance over community based health care? Why is it okay for ins cos and big pharma to control this debate? again I state i'm a disabled vet and use the VA system, a government funded socialized medical system and it works, so why wouldn't it be good enough for those who cant afford private ins?
I'm going to my Town Hall meeting on August 10th with my Senator, and I am an average person. I am not in favor of Universal Health Care, the Cap and Trade Tax or more government control. My anger is not manufactured.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
Here is the link to 'the guy'
watch?v=A2Mo9d-dqB8
look, if this guy isn't a paid shill I don't know what is. His organization is a front for corporations involved in the debate. people watch too much FOX news and ignore reality.
its funny, greta and FOX couldn't find any corporate shills at these events, yet Maddow has pictures of their buses and personnel handing out signs and such. Whose bullshitting who here? Go watch the vid, watch maddows whole series and tell me something isnt rotten.
Guess what? I watched Rachel Maddow tonight live so I don't need to follow your link.
There are thousands of people attending these townhalls all over the country. 99.9% of them have no idea who that guy is. A majority of the country is now opposed to the government takeover of healthcare.
All they are doing is asking their representatives questions about the bills before Congress - the problem is the they're either getting terrible answers or no answers at all.
That is my point exactly. the people being whipped into a frenzy do not know who the real behind the scenes players are. They are falling for the lies of big pharma and big insurance. Can you honestly say that big corporations invovlement on the conservative side of this debate (if you want to call it that) are going to provide you with lower cost care? does it not bother you that more money is spent on exuecutive salaries than on the care itself? I would like civil replies only.
The statists are the ones being "whipped into a frenzy" by the White House and the media. They are the ones slapping (Tampa) and physically attacking people attending the meetings (6 union thugs arrested in St. Louis last night)
The people asking their representatives are concerned because they know what is in the bill. This bill will make healthcare worse, not better.
More money is spent on executive salaries than healthcare itsself? That's about 100000000% factually incorrect.
Loving the Sopranos theme at the end there! Seriously, the notion that the Tea Parties are just a partisan movement is flawed and stupid. The ironic thing is that most of the people spreading these rumors were out protesting Bush a few years ago. Double standard much?
And if these are "paid mobs" then I want my paycheck, because I never got one.
Yes. Everyone that asks their representative a question about the healthcare bill is a paid, Republican shill - even the ones that are registered Democrats, even the ones that are libertarians and never voted for a Republican in their life.
So why hasn't fox investigated the front groups for those already identified as lobbyists or former health care executives? I don't think for a minute that the majority of those going to these events aren't individuals. However there seems to be an abundance of those whose preferred method of decision making is via the availability heuristic. Those who've signed on to dozens of conservative groups and who watch FOX the majority of the time will parrot what they hear, hence the inane comments.
Pictures taken by the press and all. Do the Mob thing regularly much to my kids chagrin.
But I know we are being manipulated by corporate interests. When the gov screws you can work to get rid of them. When your ins co screws you you can die. PS frequent patient of a socialized medical program... It's called the VA.
So your reasoning is that if the gov't screws up your healthcare, it's easier to replace the government as opposed to just switching to a different insurance company?
Not every company is out to rob you of your money, in fact most of them aren't.
Basic economics state that free, informed exchanges between consenting parties will always create value for both parties. As a Business major I CANNOT stress this enough. It's why we're not still in the Stone Age.
can you saythe people that are showing up screaming that Obama wants to kill old people, and that government will ration healthcare (which corporations already do), can you say that they are well informed? Since we both go to college (engineering major with a minor in psych) certainly you can see the logical fallacy you provide in your response. we are not in the stone age because of mans inventive and creative nature and our higher brain function coupled with opposable thumbs. hit me back.
You're not getting the point. If an insurance company rations your healthcare, you can just go to another one, and the free market will kill off the 1st one. This will liquidate assets which will allow the GOOD companies to expand their coverage. If the government rations healthcare, you're fucked because you can't just pick a new government at will. You're worried about "big pharma" but not Big Government (which is hundreds of times larger and bureacratic)? Now that's a logical fallacy.
I'll tell ya, as soon as some folks who rarely if EVER goe out to these meetings, because they realize THIS IS IT. The left all of a sudden become 'INVESTIGATIVE REPORTERS'' looking into the backrounds of EVERYONE. the big O's new Minister of Propaganda puts out a "snitch" website for anything "fishy". well I smell something fishy. And its REALLY beginning to stink.
the solution to health care is the ability for the a person to find a policy that they can afford (buying insurance from other states) that also they are comfortable with the benefits and that the insurer will pay and not deny the claime , the other is pre existing conditions which is a seperate issue , doctors charge exorbitant amounts because insurance only pay a percentage of the bill , caps must be put on everything as far as proceedures and tests go,
jhunted7667 1 year ago
They protest only when somebody molest their wealth that is not even a person that is fat capitalist animal trying to preserve his big house and car. Stop consuming all the energy in the world stop starting wars the world is fucking tired of you.
lutherblissett3 2 years ago
Standard tactics of the left.
If anyone disagrees with your position, call them a racist.
boxant 2 years ago
If there is a better way we should go for it. Real people are suffering every day. As a progressive I fight for them. I am like most of you, well off with plenty of private health care. But I recognize that the system as it currently stands does not meet the needs of everyone. If there is a way to do so we should. Free markets are not the be all end all. Government can and does work.
jrjones529 2 years ago
if they pass this health care plan, do you think for one minute that we won't be taxed for everything that they concider unhealthy activity. Sking could be concidered a health care activity. If you say.. aww come on that's rediculus.. Well all I have to say is, YOU JUST WAIT TILL THE GOVERNMENT STARTS GETTING INTO YOUR EVERYDAY LIFE. kINDA LIKE HOW THE WAR ON DRUGS GOT THEM INTO OUR BANK ACCOUNTS
clayguy1 2 years ago
Have you researched this more than listening to talk radio? You are making some pretty out there claims and you don't seem to understand what the health care bill is all about. I encourage you to do more research on both sides of the argument not just one.
jrjones529 2 years ago
jrjones529, changing the whole system is not a better way. Any government option will do as government always does, run it's program at a deficit. That will end up running the private plans that most are happy with out of business, end in rationing for all with a government that will be as dismissive toward those who complain as they are to those currently protesting. Government does not work well. Social Security is a Ponzi scheme. Medicare is subsidized by cost shifting to private carriers.
cmpm439 2 years ago
This isn't a Dem or GOP issue. The GOP spent us to the edge of the cliff. The Dems are tripling down. First stimulus trillions, then, healthcare,then cap and trade. We have no way of repaying the debt we are placing on our children and grandchildren. Where are the adults? Currently, the uninsured get care. It is done inefficiently but at least it is limited to the uninsured. Fix that without taking us all down a road we will never recover from. We are not worker bees for a ruling class.
cmpm439 2 years ago
next post. I believe we should use the system that works best to help the most people based on each issue. The private free market does not, in all it's invisible wisdom and glory, do a good job helping the disadvantaged, and for that I believe there is a proper role for government. With the plans being discussed you will keep your private insurance if yuou don't want to switch, but others will now also be covered who previously were not. Good for all.
jrjones529 2 years ago
I'm not losing the good coverage I have because of the 11% of the lazy that refuse to work for their own, and then refuse to fill out a little paperwork to get free healthcare.
garand 2 years ago
i refuse to debate you because you are an ignorant fool. yeah I went there.
jrjones529 2 years ago
Your comment exemplifies why the left is losing the healthcare debate. 80% of the country is satisfied with their healthcare. They dont support HR3200 because they have legitimate concerns about rationing, waitlists and losing their current healthcare coverage.
Instead of defending the bill, the left calls Americans asking questions about the bill racists, terrorists, Nazis, KKK members and un-American. You just used the words ignorant and fool.
That's not going to work.
LandofDaFree 2 years ago
LandofDaFree people can be satisfied with what they have and unsastisfied with millions of others being denied treatment. I have fantastic health care but so do people in France, Canada, and everyother industrialized nation except us that offers single-payer or some form of it. Time the US catches up. As for rationing, where are their concerns about the rationing that already happens now? Many of the loudest people at these rallies are racist. The signs speak for themselves.
jrjones529 2 years ago
jrjones529, if there is rationing by a company now, there are other choices. When we go to single payer, there is no place else to go. If a company is ripping off the public by overcharging or offering poor service, there is room for another company to come in and take their customers. jrjones529, when you say this is racism you tell every black child that anyone against government control really just hates them. That is an irresponsible charge.
cmpm439 2 years ago
cmpm439 single payer is government run insurance it is not subsidized by private insurers. At least not the kind I'm in favor of. many of your concerns, such as that employers will force people to switch, may be addressed in the final bill. statistically equality is shown to increase the quality of life and standard of living. who can say the civil rights movement was a bad thing? a government program means citizens vote for the options they want, and the overseers are accountable to the...
jrjones529 2 years ago
..to the people. We vote them in and vote them out. if everyone is involved, rich and poor, the system will work. obama has said time and again the system will pay for itself. deficits won't happen if we chose to fund the programs properly. as to the racism comments, I stick by them. your side has a systemic problem. I'm a white guy from the conservative south, I am very aware of what is going on in the minds of many of those people. I am not accusing you of racism you seem very rationale
jrjones529 2 years ago
jrjones, if everyone is involved in housing, we will have no more homeless. Are you next in for government housing for all? Maybe 500 square feet per person supplied by the government? Nothing could be more basic than a roof over our head. If we all get the same house it would also be equal. Is there something different about health care not to give options? Stick to your racism claim if you wish. Just be aware it is as hurtful to spread a rumor about a racist as it is to actually be one.
cmpm439 2 years ago
cmpm439 idealistically, which means it is unattainable, I am for equality to the point that there is no more suffering. At that point you can have as much money and as big a house as you want.. Doesn't mean we'd all have the same size house in some boring, homogenized society. but to answer your question, i'm in favor of providing a roof for all. one step at a time. i'm not spreading any rumors.
jrjones529 2 years ago
jrjones529, we both agree with the goal of no more suffering. I don't doubt that the best way to achieve that is to let the free market expand job creation, let competition keep bad businesses in check, let free trade pull the third world into a market ( supply and demand based) expansion. It certainly is rumor based to say that health care opponents are racist. It is no different than telling the neighborhood that you believe one of your neighbors is a rapist without proof. It hurts everyone.
cmpm439 2 years ago
well i'm glad we agree on one thing! of course i think the markets have their place but i argue that government does also. i am against unnecessary government, however. i agree with you that calling people out without proof is harmful, however my observations are based on what i've seen and heard with my own eyes and ears (not what somebody else has told me). my conclusion is based on my observations.
jrjones529 2 years ago
Racists? The people attending these townhalls are representative of the majority of this country that opposes the government overhaul of healthcare that Congress and Obama are trying to force upon us. There had nothing to do with race..
You lose all credibilty when you call people who disagree with your racists without cause. You're not worth listening to.
LandofDaFree 2 years ago
Majority of the country? Absolutely not. Why then do 73% of the American public support health reform? Yes, they are white, and maybe represent a majority or slight plurality of white Americans, but not the American majority. Racism is a problem and I stand by that. I've seen enough Nazi swasitkas and racial innuendo, in addition to my own personal experience growing up in right wing America to know what's really beneath the surface.
jrjones529 2 years ago
73%? Are you kidding me? Actually more people disagree with it putting it at 57% of people say they dont want it and BTW everyone Obama approval rating is at 49% so STFU libs!
killerbeau95 2 years ago
I think Czar Obama has divided this country more! He thinks he is above everybody and he is so out of touch! The worst part is when I voted for this czar I thought things would be different from when we had Bush, but now I miss him, aleast Bush knew what freedom was!
chargers2566 2 years ago
Czar?
jrjones529 2 years ago
Right or left its all the same, don't you see?...they're trying to make us so dependent on the government that we will be more of modern day slaves. I wish you luck blind sheep... 73%? ha!! good 1
InternalNEternal 2 years ago
jrjones529, anti trust laws were established to keep a company from gaining an unfair advantage that would drive other businesses out of the market. Large businesses will purposely undercut other small business prices, selling their product at a loss until all others fail. This is what will happen with a government option that will run at a deficit. There will be no private insurance at that time, just as Obama and many other prominent Democrats have laid out in past speeches. Bad for most.
cmpm439 2 years ago
cmpm439 if there is a better way and people flock to it why would you be against that? isn't that what choice is all about? i'm a single - payer advocate so I have no problem with your concern coming to fruition. a system designed for poor people is a poor system. government monopoly = choice by accountability.
jrjones529 2 years ago
Businesses would flock to that plan because it would be cheaper....initially. The government can run a plan at a deficit for a period of time, just as they have run social security and medicare at a deficit. Employees would not have the choice if the employer decides to go to the government option. It is a mischaracterization to say people would flock to it because it is better. Poor people do not have to stay poor in America. Equalizing at a lower level for the sake of equality hurts everyone.
cmpm439 2 years ago
Eventually a single payer system will no longer be subsidized by private insurers (as medicare now is to the tune of $1500- $1800 per family per year). Add a time when the deficit reaches an unsustainable level and health care will have to be rationed. It also pulls another 20 percent of private industry into the public sector. Add energy to the public sector and there won't be much left to us. I can't imagine anyone wanting to give their choices up for a single choice decided by politicians.
cmpm439 2 years ago
I appreciate your comment and concern and you seem informed to your point. Unfortunately we disagree on the effectiveness of government. I believe it can be used to help people who are suffering needlessly and you believe it never works. Government is like anything else, it is run by people. There can be good government and there can be bad government. Same with corporations. See next post
jrjones529 2 years ago
Dana Loesch is a JEW and every breath she speaks is suspect.
kwazi6 2 years ago
WHAT????? Please explain that comment. According to you it's the Jews are the bad guys? That's boardering on profiling
Fringe111 2 years ago
Profiling is a proper and useful tool.
Jews are liars.
Did you know that judaism actually forbids jews to tell Gentiles the truth?
Lying is part of their religion.
kwazi6 2 years ago
Your religion must include making up false insults about other people...
TedinLasVegas 2 years ago
Based on some of her podcasts, I believe Dana Loesch may be part Native America. Whatever her ancestry, she doesn't use ethnic identity to decide what she believes in. The great thing about America is that we are not forced into any kind of racial or ethnic box.
cmpm439 2 years ago
I don't agree.
kwazi6 2 years ago
I am an avid TEABAGGER and a REPUBLICAN. Everyone in my TeaBagger group are Republicans. This prissy bitch is insulting to my TEABAGGING movement.
It is true that my first TEABAGGING was guided by an older republican though. But my actions now are independent. Like a sleeper cell.
Hannity11 2 years ago
Why are you so upset? Why do you feel the need to spam videos with your caps lock and internet sarcasm?
It would be best for you to not subscribe so violently to partisan politics. Try thinking for yourself for a change. It may get you somewhere other than being a starstruck idiot who will ingest whatever The O deposits into your grimy little hands.
HKBM45 2 years ago
you are liar.
arubberball 2 years ago
Watch Youtube video: The Health Care Bill: What they DON'T want you to know!
wethepeopleUSA2012 2 years ago 2
Lol its funny that unions and the white house accuse these "angry mobs" as being paid off or led to oppose these things when in fact there are so many events to site where they themselves have loaded questions or thugs or have paid off others to do things for them. It's LOL.
theaznfishy 2 years ago
theaznfishy, only one organization has contacted me to attend a healthcare event in August - Organizing for America.
Organizing for America is Barack Obama's political organization. If I attend the meeting I'll have to report myself for spreading "misinformation".
LandofDaFree 2 years ago
ummmm, what's a 'shill'??
TheRancherman61 2 years ago
Reform of problems with Healthcare yes. Government in anyway in control of it NO! Lets look at their efficiently run bankrupt entitlements and how well they are run and managed. They are horrible!!! First fix Medicare and Medicaid that will take care of the elderly and poor. Add Medicaid provision for unemployed. Then lets talk about real reform to drive down costs by allowing for interstate competition, tort reform, pre-existing, and rx drugs. No Gov. run!!!
ConservativeWatchdog 2 years ago 4
Explain to me the misinformation you are referring to, please. I do want to know where you are coming from. this is supposed to be a discussion so lets leave pity out of it. why do you support big insurance over community based health care? Why is it okay for ins cos and big pharma to control this debate? again I state i'm a disabled vet and use the VA system, a government funded socialized medical system and it works, so why wouldn't it be good enough for those who cant afford private ins?
trauts01 2 years ago
I'm going to my Town Hall meeting on August 10th with my Senator, and I am an average person. I am not in favor of Universal Health Care, the Cap and Trade Tax or more government control. My anger is not manufactured.
JaneHallNC 2 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Here is the link to 'the guy'
watch?v=A2Mo9d-dqB8
look, if this guy isn't a paid shill I don't know what is. His organization is a front for corporations involved in the debate. people watch too much FOX news and ignore reality.
its funny, greta and FOX couldn't find any corporate shills at these events, yet Maddow has pictures of their buses and personnel handing out signs and such. Whose bullshitting who here? Go watch the vid, watch maddows whole series and tell me something isnt rotten.
trauts01 2 years ago
Guess what? I watched Rachel Maddow tonight live so I don't need to follow your link.
There are thousands of people attending these townhalls all over the country. 99.9% of them have no idea who that guy is. A majority of the country is now opposed to the government takeover of healthcare.
All they are doing is asking their representatives questions about the bills before Congress - the problem is the they're either getting terrible answers or no answers at all.
LandofDaFree 2 years ago
That is my point exactly. the people being whipped into a frenzy do not know who the real behind the scenes players are. They are falling for the lies of big pharma and big insurance. Can you honestly say that big corporations invovlement on the conservative side of this debate (if you want to call it that) are going to provide you with lower cost care? does it not bother you that more money is spent on exuecutive salaries than on the care itself? I would like civil replies only.
trauts01 2 years ago
The statists are the ones being "whipped into a frenzy" by the White House and the media. They are the ones slapping (Tampa) and physically attacking people attending the meetings (6 union thugs arrested in St. Louis last night)
The people asking their representatives are concerned because they know what is in the bill. This bill will make healthcare worse, not better.
More money is spent on executive salaries than healthcare itsself? That's about 100000000% factually incorrect.
LandofDaFree 2 years ago
Loving the Sopranos theme at the end there! Seriously, the notion that the Tea Parties are just a partisan movement is flawed and stupid. The ironic thing is that most of the people spreading these rumors were out protesting Bush a few years ago. Double standard much?
And if these are "paid mobs" then I want my paycheck, because I never got one.
Otacon237 2 years ago 5
Thanks, Otacon.
Yes. Everyone that asks their representative a question about the healthcare bill is a paid, Republican shill - even the ones that are registered Democrats, even the ones that are libertarians and never voted for a Republican in their life.
LandofDaFree 2 years ago
So why hasn't fox investigated the front groups for those already identified as lobbyists or former health care executives? I don't think for a minute that the majority of those going to these events aren't individuals. However there seems to be an abundance of those whose preferred method of decision making is via the availability heuristic. Those who've signed on to dozens of conservative groups and who watch FOX the majority of the time will parrot what they hear, hence the inane comments.
trauts01 2 years ago
Krauts01, there is a very simple solution to your concerns: visit one of the "mobs", and see for yourself.
Get out of your ABC/CNN/NBC cave and talk to normal people. Make some friends. The sunlight will be good for you.
Otacon237 2 years ago 6
I have one helluva a tan. I have been the 'Mob'
Pictures taken by the press and all. Do the Mob thing regularly much to my kids chagrin.
But I know we are being manipulated by corporate interests. When the gov screws you can work to get rid of them. When your ins co screws you you can die. PS frequent patient of a socialized medical program... It's called the VA.
Go watch the video here
watch?v=A2Mo9d-dqB8
I live not far from Evansville.
trauts01 2 years ago
So your reasoning is that if the gov't screws up your healthcare, it's easier to replace the government as opposed to just switching to a different insurance company?
Not every company is out to rob you of your money, in fact most of them aren't.
Basic economics state that free, informed exchanges between consenting parties will always create value for both parties. As a Business major I CANNOT stress this enough. It's why we're not still in the Stone Age.
Otacon237 2 years ago
can you saythe people that are showing up screaming that Obama wants to kill old people, and that government will ration healthcare (which corporations already do), can you say that they are well informed? Since we both go to college (engineering major with a minor in psych) certainly you can see the logical fallacy you provide in your response. we are not in the stone age because of mans inventive and creative nature and our higher brain function coupled with opposable thumbs. hit me back.
trauts01 2 years ago
You're not getting the point. If an insurance company rations your healthcare, you can just go to another one, and the free market will kill off the 1st one. This will liquidate assets which will allow the GOOD companies to expand their coverage. If the government rations healthcare, you're fucked because you can't just pick a new government at will. You're worried about "big pharma" but not Big Government (which is hundreds of times larger and bureacratic)? Now that's a logical fallacy.
Otacon237 2 years ago
I'll tell ya, as soon as some folks who rarely if EVER goe out to these meetings, because they realize THIS IS IT. The left all of a sudden become 'INVESTIGATIVE REPORTERS'' looking into the backrounds of EVERYONE. the big O's new Minister of Propaganda puts out a "snitch" website for anything "fishy". well I smell something fishy. And its REALLY beginning to stink.
btwall60 2 years ago 3
Love your suggestion to report you to the brownshirts!!!
welovesarahpalin 2 years ago 3