Wind Farm in My Backyard: ScienCentral Report

[normanmj]

Those things are ugly as fuck.



[ryoukiddinme1]

If we do need the turbines and they are green....or so thats what Im told (however they are down alot and still require backup energy and they do take hughs amounts of oil to keep running and they do cause health issues and they do kill wildlife)....I believe they should only be put up on govenment properties.....not by peoples homes,this is a no brainer....people dont get sick and the government only has its self to pay

[mphello]

Who the fuck blames hippies for lack of wind power, when it's hippies who have lobbied for wind turbines? What's next: blame Jews?

I say: take all the fucking overbreeding conservaturds: take away ALL their homes, water, air, because they sure have done, are doing, and will do that to everyone else.

[EmMarieCharbs]

Yes, wind energy is expensive to install relative to its energy output. But what you have to ask yourself is, "What is a greener future worth to me?" I feel like people put up the same arguments as people trying to lose weight. Overweight people say, "Oh, its so much work, keeping fresh produce around is expensive, I like my life as its been, etc." Property values don't have to drop and the noise doesn't have to bother you. We created this mess, now we have to live with the consequences.

[venturen]

Do you know that when these guys come out to the wind farm they turn the pitch off so they are quiet to "show" how quiet they are? Please tell me where the energy comes from when the wind doesn't blow? Also where is all the extra money going to come from to build the thousand upon thousand of these you need for just one normal energy plant?

[venturen]

329 MegaWatts is a joke...they run about 10% of the time so that is 32 Mega watts and the cost is $8 million per wind turbine and that is 200 winds turbines at a total cost of 1.6Billion. that only produces 10% of the time so lets multiple that times 9 times that is $20 billion dollar for 329 Mega Watts. Here how quick he talks...and giving that old man $20K he would be happy. Wind is a JOKE!. It is a TAX/Rate Scam. Every 5-8 years the transmission fail...so there is lots of maintenance! SCAM!

[superraider408]

@venturen i don't know about you but i would much raver get my electricity from that then something that is the main destroyer of the earth.

[venturen]

@superraider408 Do you realize that the USA gets 1%of its electric from oil? Do you realize that wind turbines are intermittent and you need other sources of electricity for the many hours of every day that wind doesn't blow. What do you propose to electrify your Grandmother life support? Wind Turbines are pure and simple a scam! You want real CO2 FREE energy then there is really only one source that is there 24/7/365.that is Nuclear. Do you realize the the US Navy is run on NUCLEAR for decades

[illn0r]

@venturen Co2 free? sure nuclear doesn't emit much CO2 itself, but its carbon footprint is still bigger then CO2 FREE.

lets not even forget about the huge amounts of high radiation waste we burry in the ground for our great great great grandkids to deal with down the road.

i can really see why wind energy is such a bad thing being that its profitable, not as expensive as solar and one of the cleanest out there. it all makes sense now that you replied.

[venturen]

@illn0r France generate 78% of their power by nuclear each year and all their spent rods are in ONE building. Because they process it down, as opposed to the USA which chooses leave it in bulkier form...because we are worried terrorists might get it....yes silly I know. Solar and wind need HUGE amounts of land to generate any power and as you guess solar doesn't work at night and wind doesn't work when there is no wind. Wind kills lots of raptors. You still need the old power plants. Very Costly

[minitrueful]

Wind Power is a Scam. Explain to me how - HOW - wind farms keep us from using any additional crude oil?

[Northwesley]

@minitrueful I'm not a supporter of IWTs but I don't the tech is a scam. But I do think the Big Wind industry and their subsidization partners in government are scamming taxpayers. Every energy production mode has impacts/costs/strengths/weakne­sses. But Wind proponents go around saying "500ft tall structures with 120mph blades the size of Boeing 747s don't kill birds" or "there is no noise" or "anyone who get's sick from noise is a wacko" etc. etc. That's all b/s.

[bannor99]

@Northwesley I've posted it elsewhere but it bears repeating - bird deaths by wind farms are miniscule compared to other causes, such as pesticides, buildings, transportation and cats. Check the US Fish and Wildlife mortality report; the difference between turbines' impact and any one of the other causes is a factor of 1000

[Northwesley]

@bannor99 Respectfully, so what. Would you build a 500ft/50 story building a mile away from a wildlife preserve? Would you build it if you knew there was a chance that the building would be in the path of some species at risk? Of course not. The point is, Big Wind says "our structures don't kill birds". Of course they do. The real question is how many? What kind? and Is there anything that can be done about it? If not, should the IWT be sited elsewhere?

[bannor99]

@Northwesley I haven't found denials of bird deaths; some of the farms have been co-operative with researchers. Feel free to point out contrarian facts. The kindest things to do for birds would be to ban pesticides, confine cats and severely restrict logging in the Boreal forest. That should save the lives of 1 BILLION birds in a year or two. There are likely methods to make birds avoid towers; it seems bats dodge radar emitters - I haven't found any data on actual testing.

[Northwesley]

@bannor99 Its a pleasure to debate this with you. (Sincerely) Once again, we're talking about a specific hazard and its impact on birds (and bats). Don't change the subject ;-) . I, once again, want a reasonable and open disclosure about all the impacts of any introduction of significant technology into my backyard (rural Ontario). I really don't get that from Big Wind. There are some studies going on re: bats and that certainly seems to be a much bigger impact than bird kill.

[Northwesley]

... and to continue on the subject of wildlife impact. I think we all know that bats are killed by explosive decompression of their lungs when they fly behind the blades. What astonishes me is the absence of an ongoing database that the industry could and should publish. There is a big argument in Wolfe Island sites about the volume of bat kills. Some of the residents are claiming they have tabulated thousands of bats killed. The company says (I think) a few dozen. ???

[Northwesley]

Do you want to have a go at the impact on property value? That's my favourite one.

[PrecisionFit]

I love how the windmills aren't even turning in most of the footage. < 30% folks - thats how much of the time they actually produce.

[HomeWindTurbines7]

Friends and subscribers welcome. My home wind turbines just won a Green Design Contest. Look at the videos, neighborhood friendly windpower.

[scottyg001]

ooh yea, and the wind mills need WIND! not diesel generators to power them......

[nakazatoGTR]

@scottyg001 THEY STILL have diesel generators when turbines are shut down to dangerous wind conditions and no wind situation. can you prove that wind is very constant that no single second that winds die down....

troll.

[scottyg001]

hmmmm... I didnt see any generators at the wind farm where I hauled them too... I hauled windmills all over the west coast....those windmills will turn in a 3 mph breeze....

[Northwesley]

@scottyg001 Oh man. Do some research, If you install IWTs into the grid, one of three things MUST be done. a) Energy storage to store the variable energy produced by the turbines until it is needed by the grid or b) shut down the IWTs when the energy is not needed for demand beyond base supply or c) co-generation to provide stable supply from the facility. One of these three MUST happen. In North America and Europe a) is not very common (if at all), b) and c) is used to stabilize supply.

[scottyg001]

these windmills dont make any noise.... they dont make a sound.... ,so try again youwindmill haters.....

[nakazatoGTR]

@scottyg001 really? yeah its so easy to fake a video nowadays, you can shoot a video of a turbine and with help from greenpiss propaganda experts, you can mute a video.

go get your greenpiss propaganda paycheck.

[jeka100]

I will take little wind like noise overs unbreathable stinking smog that slowly kills your body and ruins your organs. Now all we need is electric stations who are powered from these turbines to charge up our electric cars

[tombofrog]

Why the hard hat?

[nickdom62]

Wind farms need diesel generators to power the generator. They have to make a magnetic field to move the electrons through the windings somehow. Don't they?

[jeka100]

what?

[tom13erry]

The oil industry has you by the balls and you think the wind companies are out to screw you?! LOL Read A Book. That pooor farmer, he must hate getting CA$H for no effort involved. Lawn mowers are much louder. Lets make them illegal! lol No matter how good anything is there is almost always a majority of paranoid people that are SURE its a conspiracy against them. This is the worst kind of ignorance bc it spreads to more, gullible, misinformed, paranoid people that always seek out negativity.

[jeka100]

I was near by the thing its like laundry machine but from 100 m from it its quiet

[Northwesley]

@tom13erry Do a little research. Check out the relationship both partnerships/ownerships that exist between "Big Wind" companies and the oil and gas industry. Wind turbines are a huge asset for oil/gas because in most places, co-generation is being built to provide stability of supply beside large IWT plants. You're confused - its actually wind/oil/gas vs nuclear. That is the real global competition between the big corporations.

[bannor99]

@Northwesley Who, specifically, is "Big Wind"? Vestas? Enercon? GE? Siemens?

It's nowhere near as clear-cut as you make it. Chevron is huge in geothermal; GE has nuclear and oil divisions as well as wind; Siemens is eyeing the nuclear market again and Areva is nuclear and wind. These are energy companies - they'll diversify to keep the bottom line growing. I would prefer that all power generation operate without subsidy but it's so entrenched, it would take years to level the field

[Northwesley]

@bannor99 Thank you supporting my point. My point exactly. It seems that most posters, who aren't as well-read as yourself, believe that the Big Wind companies are somehow fighting the evils of Big Oil/Gas. As you've pointed out they one and the same. And when an IWT facility requires co-generation as many of the European sites do, its often sister companies that engage in that. Profit is the game - NOT GHG reduction b/c as is becoming painfully obvious, IWTs do not result in lower emissions.

[Northwesley]

@bannor99 I also use the term "Big Wind" to highlight that the industry that is using our tax dollars to put up thousands of IWTs (@22% efficiency) is different than the "little wind" companies that are selling demand reduction wind mills with battery storage to farmers and landowners. Whole different business. P.S. Its hard to determine partnership/ownership relationships between these corps. Easy to take that out of public view. But, I think you'll agree... very few that are Nuclear&Oil.

[SaveWesternOHIO]

@tom13erry

Fist, wind energy does not replace crude oil. Second, oil companies often invest in wind energy since oil companies earn a profit for which they wish to pay no taxes. Finally, you seem to vilify oil companies. What do you think your life would be like without oil? Isn't it a valuable resource whose price is determined in the free market - a foundation of American society?

[tom13erry]

WOW. I cant believe how paranoid people are that theyre being conned. There are two sides to this fence- pro wind "green people" and theres the anti-wind conventional power advocates. Guess whos richer? The oil company owners/investors/politicians. Oil companies will do anything to protect their profits. The less oil and coal used the better. Not only for the environment- but for the price. Wake up!

[capacitiveleak]

sure sure... and the wind industry is no different. the solution is nuclear. your windmills can't supply anywhere near the power needed. but what I have seen you "green" wind smiths do around here is strip thousands of acres of forest land. funny though... I thought trees converted CO2 into O... guess we don't need that anyway... especially considering the scientists backing global warming are turning out to be liars and frauds, manipulating data so people like you take our taxes.

[vicsflick]

Oil spills are really cool looking in the ocean. baa humbug to your rich oil

[jimjean04]

wow,Funny stuff. Like watching the Tobaco companys do a video on the wonders of Nicotine. Keep up the great propaganda.

[nakazatoGTR]

you talk as if you greenpissers dont do the same.

go live the green hypocrite life.

[jimjean04]

Wow, now Im confused. I thought it was the green folks supported your assertions. Thank you for aknowleging this is propaganda.

[nakazatoGTR]

sour graping crap.

come on, you cant disprove that turbine splat bats and birds, cause the bends in some bats, cause noise induce health risks in humans.

yeah greeners can post birds flying around wind farms, but they cant prove those same birds can live at those wind farms.

[jimjean04]

not real sure about the "green" stuff I just know a total scam when I see one. These are Tax farms. Ripping us all off with incredibly dubious technology. Make people feel good while they are used by wind companys and politicians.

[caribousteaks]

Wind has many problems. Turbines kill birds and bats. They use oil. They are, to many, unsightly. Germany Spain Ireland and the UK all have huge problems with them due to the intermittent power issue. Base load power still needs to be maintained by more consistent power sources. So at the end of the day wind is only a subsidized side show to more reliable coal and nuclear and gas power. Granted upgrading the national grid would help but still not make wind a useful base resource.

[MikeHuntagape]

put one in front of obamas mouth

go green

[genericsoul]

stupid hippies piss me off! some want green energy but don't want windmills...i'm from cape vincent where it's a big issue currently...i say put em' up....if they don't work we'll get drunk and throw stuff at em'

[Xdust3]

@genericsoul 321 megawatts???? haha, omg, these people are pathetic.

Face facts, there are NO alternative energy sources. 321 Megawatss, is NOTHING.

All this bitching over NOTHING energy. A simple coal plant in PA is 5 Gigawatts. 5 THOUSAND tims what these loosers are bitiching about.

[eyeisgreen]

keep the oil/coal/gas going. burn em all. Then what? ethanol hydrogen biodiesel and wind/wave might not seem so 'get rich quick' then. or saddle up the horses maybe.

[aaronfeziow]

SHUT THE FUCK UP ALL OF YOU!!!!!!! wind turbines are exelent reliable, and your all perfetic stupid lowlifes, complaining about something what dosnt even make noise anyway, if they make noise that means theres something wrong with them, what would you rather have wind turbines which are great for the planet, or powersation what are bad for the planet? DICK HEADS

[BimboBaggins]

Wind turbines aren't "great for the planet". The fact is when wind turbines are in place, nature can't move back in. Studies show that industrial wind turbines (above) produce significant, low-frequency sound. Animals can't tolerate being near them. All they do is take huge swaths of land away from nature, create pollution from the concrete and iron ore that is mined to build them, and they still have to be backed up by another (usually fossil fuel burning) power plant. You're being fooled.

[noonalisa]

so when coal power plants are in can nature move back in?

[WockneysRedBarrel]

The "studies" you mentioned. Can you give me any references for them?

[nakazatoGTR]

dont act like your a hypocrite.

i ask you can you live right next to a turbine?

[nakazatoGTR]

reliable?

how come wind farms need diesel generators when there is no ind?

how come there are incidents of wind turbine fires,gear failures, even catastrophic collapse?

yes, another greener who scares itself to death.

[a1mint]

The Sun creates weather, which causes the wind.

The Earth picks up only a tiny iensy tiensy bit of the energy that the Sun puts out.

It's unbelievable how much energy the Sun has put out and continues to put out.

We have something like that on a (much) lower scale way deep underground, the core of the earth. We should tap in to that !

[plsanswerthequestion]

This is for the guy in the video that said "it keeps our taxes low".

Maybe it keeps yours low. I hope you feel good about stealing from your fellow Americans because WE are paying for these things with our tax dollars.

[MatthewLyonsVT]

WE are paying for every energy producing power plant in the country. If its Nukes, they have received huge subsidies from the federal gov't that WE pay for. Same for coal, natural gas and hydro.

So what's your point?

[acidtrashy]

Because this is more about being seen to be green and meeting polticians targets than deploying realistic solutions to our energy needs. The output of wind is terrible and it's more expensive than coal or gas. It also requires fossil fuel backup. It's neither cheap, clean or environmentally friendly. It's a giant scam.

[strawberryseason]

acidtrashy, you put it perfectly.  This industrial "wind" boom is nothing more than another get-rich quick scheme on the part of investors, and they have gotten politicians to do their bidding in terms of mandating the energy portfolio targets. These turbines do much damage to the land and also drive away wildlife with their low-frequency sounds. They are ruining formerly beautiful areas. And our tax dollars are funding this travesty!

[acidtrashy]

Such a shame they don't let facts get in the way.

[plsanswerthequestion]

MatthewLyonsVT-I'm against all subsidies. We don't need yet another one.

[strawberryseason]

plsanwserthequestion: You are absolutely right. Each turbine costs $2.7 million, of which, the taxpayers pay 2/3.

[hardyoak]

These turbines are destroying the beautiful New York landscape and diminishing property values. They are as high as a 25 story building, and look like creatures from War of the Worlds. I do not favor nuclear, but these wind turbines are not on a scale that makes them combatible with the environment. Frankly we need to ask ourselves, at what psychic cost do we use air conditioning? It's the major energy hog and unneccesary. If it requires these horrible turbines, then we need to rethink it.

[SaveWesternOHIO]

That's a forty story building, not 25. And the land sprawl per unit of dependable capacity is horrendous:

WIND: 4 mW capacity credit per square mile of impact..

NUCLEAR: 6,000 mW capacity per square mile of impact..

WIND = ENVIRONMENTAL RAPE

[SaveWesternOHIO]

The opening comment is typical of the misleading propaganda by the wind industry. The gentleman makes no mention of the annual capacity factor (around 30%) or the guaranteed capacity rating (around 6 to 8%, and still highly theoretical) of the noisy, visually unsettling complex. The sprawl factor of such industrial units is 2,600 times that of efficient, reliable, compact, safe, abundant and affordable nuclear energy.

Deaths? Wind facilities 41, nuclear plants ZERO.

[Mechanisttm]

One word for ya, chernobyl !!!

[SaveWesternOHIO]

Chernobyl's technology and regulation have NOTHING to do with any nuclear reactors in North America. You are comparing apples and orangutans. The NRC is so successful in its safety regulations there has never been an INJURY at a north American nuclear facility. If you are afraid of nuclear power, then perhaps you also believe aliens are about to attack?

[WockneysRedBarrel]

I agree Chernobyl induced hysteria about nuclear power is unjustified. But however unjustified it is the fact is the public believe it and therefore nuclear power is tainted by it.

You clearly have a vested interest in nuclear and a chip on your shoulder about wind. I think both have their place. Even if wind generates little (I disagree) it can make a contibution. Energy use is increasing but resources diminishing and therefore all options, including nuclear and wind, should be on the table.

[LordMcgyvr1]

You are right.

[glassroots1]

property are the ONLY ones in that town that recieve power from the turbines and they are the only ones that dont have to pay high taxes. The ones that dont join the "cult" are the ones who get higher taxes...believe me I know first hand. I own a 100,000 dollar property where there is a brand new wind farm recently installed and I paid 10,000 dollars in taxes last year. 10% of the property value. BS!!!! Fuck the wind farms...SOLAR and NEUCLEAR power is the best!!!

[Drukstylz]

...its not just about you, its a global issue.

[glassroots1]

its not so much the turbines.....its where they are putting them AND HOW they go about doing it...changing zoning laws, paying people off to agree with them, there is so much that people ARENT told its not even funny. They make noise alright, they do alot more things that are not good then they are good that they dont tell you. Its sad to see how this ocuntry turns their back with a littlemoney in their pocket. Its ridiculous, it really is. And the one who have the turbines on their

[sirjimalott]

so you would rather pay higher taxes?? I have been off the grid for years, I have not paid electric in years.. why fight progress.

there is no noise!!! and why do these companies charge the customers for electric??

[EscapeHatchery]

So, self-promoting jerks say wind farms are wonderful, and the YouTube trolling imbecilles believe it!

Utterly disgusting site. Note that the moron babbles about carbon dioxide as a pollutant . . . hillbilly morons is the source of the "wonderful" opinion?! Spare me!

[asphix1976]

Dam the 2 in my yard have killed countless bugs I feel so bad. That was a joke.

[okin4418]

i want one

[JJO5478]

Build More!!!!

[SaveWesternOHIO]

Yes, not wind power! Yes, I would much rather have a reactor in my back yard. For 1 GW at 80% dispatchable capacity in exchange for a 100 acre campus vs. 5, 2.5 MW windmills at 25% available (not dispatchable) capacity on the same 100 acres? You bet. Subsidy should be paid based on measured reduction in (real) poisons like NOX, not to power generated by weather conditions with inverse relationship to demand. Many theses have been done with invalid preconceptions. Welcome to a useless club!

[acidtrashy]

It isn't an inverse relationship to demand. There is no relationship to demand.

[AndrePas]

I'm doing my thesis on wind-powered turbines.  Though all of my research I have found very little negative reports on WPT. The only negative ones I find are from hippie environmentalist who are just bored and like to argue. I think all of you should grow up and do something useful with your time and read scientific reports on wind-powered turbines.

[jasbcor]

How about doing some calculations to see how many turbines and how much it will cost to meet the mandatory renewable energy requirements? Answer: 100's of thousands of windmills costing 100's of billions of dollars.

[carbonfiber00001]

They are not windmills If your going to talk shit do it right douche

[monkeyman1140]

We blow 100 billion dollars in 6 months in iraq.

[jasbcor]

ok, using your math: $100B/2.5mil = 40K 2MW turbines = 80GW capacity = 80GW *.25 production capacity factor = 20GW of intermittent seasonal power. Or $100B buy 15-20GW of poor quality power.

[Jerkerface]

typical availability for wind turbines in 95-98%. Your pf is retarded. power factor (pf) is a figure used in the generation stage, 2MW is output. thats what you get after pf correction. douche. A 2 MW wind turbine provides enough power for 3.5 average house holds in one hour of production. thats for spain though, even so one turbine powers (at 95% availability) 29.5K households. pretty poor quality. you are a factless retard. US household use about 1mw a year, thats still 17,000 houses per year

[jasbcor]

Calling people names doesn't make your argument stronger. Power is different from capacity factor. The fact is wind doesn't blow all the time. Don't argue with me, argue with the facts on the EIA website.

[Drukstylz]

The fact is, the wind will still blow when coal, and fuel are finished. This is about renewable energy sources. WIth time windpower will become more efficient. Dont forget the first windfarm was only opened in the 90's, so this is new technology.

[acidtrashy]

IT's not new technology. The technology is about as mature as it's going to be. Even if you could get 100% transmission effciency it doesn't change the fact that the wind doesn't blow all the time which is why the load factor is so pitiful.

[WockneysRedBarrel]

If its mature technology why are turbine sizes continually increasing. 5MW ones are offshore Scotland now and 6W ones in testing. This isn't the hallmark of mature technology.

Also even nuclear and coal are constantly developing. New supercritical boilers and carbon capture and storage testing for coal. New 3rd & 4th gen nuclear reactors being built - look at the Pebble Bed Reactor South Africa are making.

All technology will mature and develop almost endlessly - look at the car for proof.

[strawberryseason]

Wind grids need a conventional "shadow" capacity because wind is unreliable. Yes, the wind will still blow if other fuels are gone, but at that point the huge industrial turbines will not be relevant.  We would need smaller home-based turbines.

[acidtrashy]

The point nobody seems to address is the fact that the US doesn't have a national grid per se, it has interconnected sectors and intermittant power is very bad for small grids. Also because of the distances, due to remoteness, there are significant transmission losses. Some suggest up to 30%. The grid is an antique and would need to be completely replaced to accomodate the levels of wind theyre talking about. The only thing green about wind is the money.

[acidtrashy]

How's it working for you now? Found out what the load factors are?

[SaveWesternOHIO]

Don't listen

useless

electricity supply must match demand

listen to the grid operators They tell you the wind energy is redundant

Want to reduce poisons from settling on villages near coal plants?

toxins don't settle there on windy days

whole thing is a financial scam

ruins 30 to 700 times the natural landscape

per megawatt of production. Environmentalists? Anyone supporting this technology should be stripped of such a label.

[thebigdavester]

Oh no! Not wind power!!

Maybe you're rather have a reactor in your back yard.

[STORM6490MT]

So, if somebody was to just buy their turbines and own the land and the generators privately, would the hippies shut up about it?

[a1mint]

To my knowledge, Denmark has the highest amount of wind energy use at about 24%. That's a quarter of their energy coming from wind, that's amazing. However, they're on the water, and have lots of wind.

Still, a prime example and an inspiration for the rest of the world - especially North America!

[jellsmoor]

Did you know Denmark have stopped putting up windfarms because they dont work efficiently?

[a1mint]

Please back up your claim with something credible. Until then, your response is just hollow rhetoric.

[WindIsNotGreen]

All the false and misleading claims the wind industry makes for itself work to disguise the fact that it is only a nominal producer of electricity in the eastern US. Its primary purpose is to provide extraordinary tax and income sheltering opportunities for a few wealthy investors at the expense of average taxpayers and rate payers. On a per kilowatt hour basis, wind is the most heavily subsidized source of industrialized power in the nation.

[Museeip]

What!!!??? you're crazy. Why does Europe get nearly 30% of their electricity from wind if it's so bad? and actually ethonal is the most heavily subsidized source.

[merryhill07]

The only thing green in green energy is the money.When the government subsities stop so will the distruction across America. This is misuse of taxpayer dollars. All to go overseas to foreign investors. While the real problem fossil fuel could be better addressed.Not far from my house they are preparing for Industrial Wind Trubines, fifty acres of woods have been clear cut not even a twig is left. Amazing all for green energy!

[Museeip]

in the period between 1974 and 2002 the U.S. spent $267 billion on non-renewable sources of energy(mainly oil)research, compared to just $23 billion on all other renewable sources combined(wind, solar, biofuels, etc.). more of your tax dollars have gone to oil, like it or not, it's a fact. go see a coal mine if you want to see the distruction of our lands.

[alanhowitzer]

You keep posting the same thing on different videos.