typical of Graf retards. Wimbledon is only one of the 4 grand slams tournaments. Graf won Wimdledon 91 and 92, Seles won Australian Open, Roland Garros and U.S. Open in 91 and 92. (6 titles to 2) She also won Australian Open 93 to Graf. Why is so difficult tu understand?
Wimbledon 92 final is only a match!!!. It does not mean nothing. Graf lost to Sanchez V. Roland Garros 1991 Semifinal 6-0 6-2 !!!!!!!
Seles was dominating the game including Graf for three years man yr posts are trying and so easy to pick through in fact u sound much like that hoffhiem dude u are probably him..7 slams out of 8 played for Monica , a 4 to 3 Seles head to head with graf and most importantly a 3 to 1 in slam finals against steffi....Seles was the clear and undisputed number one tennis player when she was stabbed she was the next player to win like steffi was and that changed the history of the game forever just
In the 12 months before the stabbing Graf had been 80-7 win/loss and Seles 58-5.
Graf was SO close in the rankings to Seles that she took over the #1 spot against just 5 weeks after the stabbing.
BTW, Seles was not dominating in the THREE years before the stabbing. She was #1 for about 2 years only, with Graf interrupting even that on 2 occasions. And - Graf won the 2 most important tournaments during Seles's reign. Wimbledon 1991 and Wimbledon 1992.
People who comment that Seles was 'dominating' Graf from 1991-93 are re-writing history. Look at the facts before posting biased nonsense. Steffi played Seles five times during the 1991-93 period: Steffi won three of those matches. During that period Steffi won 70 games, and Seles won 54. It's patently clear Seles fan like to re-write history rather than base their appallingly inaccurate opinions on fact. The above facts are based on their head-to-head matches.
Also before whenen seles started to play she lost but also won a lot of matches with seles and then Steffi had a lot of problems with her body and her family.
I think that graf is the best player more than seles this is my opinion
Also before whenen seles started to play she lost but also won a lot of matches with seles and then Steffi had a lot of problems with her body and her family.
I think that graf is the best player more than seles this is my opinion
Here are the facts Whitney drug abuser Houston fan. Your beloved Venus "other sister" Williams and Seles are second tier champions in history. Atleast Seles has an excuse. Venus has none except lack of talent. She is only the 3rd best player of her own time behind not only her sister but little Henin. Court 24 slams Graf 22 slams Wills 19 slams Martina Chris 18 slams Serena 13 slams Lenglen King 12 slams Connolly Seles 9 slams Mallorey 8 slams Henin, Goolagong, Bueno, Venus 7 slams
And talking about Seles being able to beat Graf 6-0, 6-0 shows what a fool you are. You know what Seles's easiest win over Graf was in all 10 of their pre stabbing matches? 6-3, 6-4. Graf actually had a 6-4, 6-3 win, 6-2, 6-1 win, and a 6-1, 6-0 win. And while Seles dominated in 91 and 92 her most lopsided win over Graf was 10-8 in the 3rd, LOL! Yet here you are like the blind retard you are talking about a 6-0, 6-0 win if she were fitter and not even realizing what a moron you look like.
@russianskatingfan you are an idiot scores dont tell the whole picture.most of those matches were when seles was 15.thats like saying chang was better than sampras when chang beat sampras 6-0 6-0 at the french open in 89.chang beat sampras many times from 88 through 90 leading up to the us open.right before sampras won it.and seles didnt grunt in the 92 wimb final which affected her game.seles dominated graf right before she was stabbed winning 6-2 in the 3rd set easily.8 aces to grafs 1.
@jayfey77 typical of Seles retards. Lots of excuses, few if any valid points. Most of Graf-Seles matches were not when Seles was 15, only 3 of them were. Seles got destroyed in the Wimbledon final since she was shit on grass, and her making the final there at all was a fluke, which is why she never came close to making it back again.
Seles and her fate attract a lot of losers. They can relate to her because they think that she was shafted the same way they were. And that they of course have excuses for their failures in life the same way as Seles.
so according to the experts who were watching that 1992 wimbleodn final, the non-grunting controversy affected Monica and she wasn't herself. There you go idiot.
@whfan007 So where is the quote of anyone saying Seles would have won Wimbledon 1992 if she grunted. I see NONE idiot. It is already pathetic enough you Seles losers put every loss she had the remaining 10 years down to the stabbing (how retarded is that) but you even make excuses for all the losses she had had before that. Didnt grunt, had an affair with Donald Trump, was too fat, was too thin, cry me a river. 0 Wimbledons, 9 slams, #10 player all time, the end.
Dick Enberg: "It's like someone who's been always chewing gum playing basketball, and they say, 'Okay, shoot your free throws, but I'm just going to take your gum away. Don't think about it, though!'"
Bud Collins: "Yeah, it's ex post facto, and I think it's very unfair.
to Yevshif, you are discussing very calm, good, also I like Tennis. Totally Agree Graf a. Seles both were great players. Yes the stabbing was a tragedy. It is something different to been ill or been attacked, Steffi was also ill or distracted sometimes, but not attacked. If Monica was only ill, then we would have been much easier on it. But it was a attack. to Hoffenheim08 come on, it is so easy to speak about that Graf was better, after Graf won so many games after psycho stabbed Monica.
Monica won 8 of the 9 grand slams before she got stabbed. And steffi is so fucking annoying because she does not even realize that monica was out of shape. She thinks in her mind that she is better than monica, but in reality monica would have won all of the slams that steffi won after the stabbing.
1. Monica did not win 8 of the 9 grand slams before the stabbing. How is that even possible when she always failed to win Wimbledon.
2. Steffi was way past her prime at the time of this match, much more than Monica was. She was 30, had major knee surgery, was soon retired.
3. Monica would win all the slams up until 1999? Including all Wimbledons and all slams next generation players like Hingis, Davenport, and Venus. Keep dreaming girl.
@TripleAxel1991 if... would have.... blah, blah.... if my auntie had balls she would be my uncle. Reality is Steffi 22 GS, Seles 9. On the H2H Steffi is 9-5. One Gold Medal vs none. Seles fans love to speculate on "what would have been". History only counts FACTS not suppositions or assumptions.
Graf is incredible. She's won 7 Wimbledons and 6 French Opens - and theyr're the two slams she's won the most times. Grass and Clay. Only Borg's done that - but he doesn't have the 9 hard court slams Graf has along with that odd Grass-and-Clay combo.
both players played the game so uniquely, today almost all female players do the same, especially the eastern european ones, they are mostly lookalikes yet not even close to the level these two played
I think they compare well to roger and rafa in this matter
Alles was hier geschrieben wird ist pure Eifersucht auf Steffi Graf. Sie ist und bleibt die beste Tennisspielerin aller Zeiten! Und alle kranken Seles-Fans seien getröstet. Man sah doch in den Jahren als beide wieder gespielt haben, wer von beiden die Spiele gewann! - Steffi nämlich!
Monicas Schicksal zieht diese üblichen "was-wäre-wenn"-Loser enorm an. Menschen, die auch in ihrem eigenen Leben unzufrieden sind und immer anderen die Schuld an ihrem Versagen geben.
I'm really not a fan of either player. Seles was dominating Graf before the stabbing. THATS WHY SHE GOT STABBED! Remember?? We fail to realize, that the stabbing was the most tragic event in sports history. If that never happened to Seles, she would have more slams than your beloved Steffi Graf.... Let's have Steffi stabbed and see what would have happen?
You are right ... the fact that Monica was stabbed was a tragedy ... If Monica was not stabbed probably she would have won much more slams. But you can't blame Steffi for some stupid / crazy fan ... BTW: till Monica was stabbed Steffi already won 12 GS titles and Golden slam. It is more than Henin, Williams sisters , etc. If she would retire at beginning of 1993 she still would have been one of best players ...
@yevshif graf had 2 grand slams at age 18 seles had 7do the math.who was on there way to winning more grand slams.seles got stabbed when she was just entering her peak and dominating graf.
I am a fan of both players. I think Monica was the best ball striker of the game. And I love watching Steffi pounding those forehands. But a lot of fans always talk about head to head records. When it's Steffi and Monica, they always point out that Monica led 3-1 in slam finals before the stabbing though their slam record at that time was 3-3. So Monica was the better player.
But when it's Graf and Navratilova, Martina is better because she has a 5-4 edge in slam meetings although Steffi won 3 out of the 5 slam final meetings between them. That's why I I always base it on overall head to head records regardless of the importance of the event. Each player favors a certain surface. Graf was the best player I have seen across any surface and she (and for that matter, Martina) found ways of beating younger, more powerful players when then she was past her prime.
When it's Graf and Navratilova, Steffi is better because she has 22 slams and Navi only 18, because Steffi has the Grand Slam and Navi doesn't, and because Steffi has 8 years as year-end #1 while Navi has only 7.
# of slams and #1 of years as #1 - what is more important?
I was just pointing out the fact that people always look at Seles' 3-1 advantage over Graf in Slam finals before the stabbing, then forget that Graf has a 3-2 advantage over navratilova in the same comparison.
@lodaniel08 Here's some scientific fact for you, let's see how you answer this: Those loud grunts some tennis players make when hitting the ball could actually have a negative effect on their opponents by distracting them and slowing their reaction time, scientists said Friday.- Agence France-Presse
@lodaniel08 yes because a deranged pyschopath thinks something we should all go along with it. Great logic. And since Seles wasnt good enough to win slams after she was barely 22 her fanatics like you (haha at your BS at not being a Seles fan btw) simply use the stabbing which happened years earlier as an excuse when in reality Seles simply wasnt good enough.
@lodaniel08 Seles was dominating at the time of the horrendous stabbing just like Steffi was dominating before, but to say that "she would have had more slams.." is sheer speculation.
For you to be talking about the stabbing in a a 99 match shows how delusional you are. Seles's would never have been #1 still at this point, and as I said Graf was even further past her prime than Seles by now yet being better still beat her.
@lodaniel08 Seles fans should seriously stop blaming everything to the stabbing incident. It only makes Seles look as though she did not have the character to weather life's adversity. As they say, when life gives you lemons, make lemonades.
"Dominating"??? what a funny word! Do you understand English? Dominating? go to Webster to check it, ok? Here is the truth: H2H before 1993/4: Graf 6:4 leading. In 1991&1992 when Seles was No.1, Graf beat her 3:1, even in Wimbledon 6:2, 6:1, sweeping the so-called No.1 like trash..... You understand what means Dominating now?
Stabbing is just a tragedy. But if Seles could not use her powerful ugly roaring (94dB noise) to bother other players on purpose, she was nothing... Look at 92 Wimbledon, without roaring what happened?! If WTA did forbid her roaring when she came out to the court, could she win so many GS? When everybody was used to roaring, you had seen how she got beaten, just like what happened in Miami open 2000. Is this the way to be one of the best play sin the world?
come on,seles never had a real chance against the great and glorious steffi graf...no technique,no fitness,no personality:that´s what seles is/was...with or without that stupid stabbing
@fordrmani wimping out of Wimbledon 91 with a fake injury certainly helped that stat. Who can blame her when we see what was waiting for her at Wimbledon if she ever was lucky enough (or unlucky enough) to get far enough to face Graf there the next year though.
I'm really not a fan of either player. But I saw'll your comment, and I felt that I had to remind of something. Seles was dominating Graf before the stabbing. THATS WHY SHE GOT STABBED! Remember?? You fail to realize, that the stabbing was the most tragic event in sports history. I assure you that if that never happened to Seles, she would have more slams than your beloved Steffi Graf.... She was never the same player. Let's have Steffi stabbed and she what would have happened? hmmmmm?
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
That motherf#ucker who stabbed monica now walk the street and have a normal life? I cannot believe it! And also there is any connection between him and Graf circle?(her father x ex?)
I'm really not a fan of either player. But I saw'll your comment, and I felt that I had to remind of something. Seles was dominating Graf before the stabbing. THATS WHY SHE GOT STABBED! Remember?? You fail to realize, that the stabbing was the most tragic event in sports history. I assure you that if that never happened to Seles, she would have more slams than your beloved Steffi Graf.... Let's have Steffi stabbed and see what would have happen? You're a moron!
to yevshif any way either i love seles or you love graf we both love tennis and thanks alot for your great effort favour to upload these great matches that i enjoyed alot and thanks for reading my comments and for replying them and that your replies are moderat and are not containig any bad words to me
You are right we both love tennis :) And lets agree to disagree regarding Steffi and Monica. Have a great day :) I will post soon additional Steffi vs. Monica matches (US Open 1996, 1995).
to yevshif thank you again very much you are a kind and civilized person and iwant to say that i enjoyeyed also your other matches of graf agaist hingis and sanches that you uploaded beside i love seles i love good tennis and these are great matches and remember that graf appeared befoer seles and from 87 to 90 she was my favourit player and she is the player who made me love tennis i do not hate her she ia a class peson i wanted only to say my veiw thanks again and have happy time
waiting for the us open wehre graf screwed seles actually i think it was 1996.... graf had seles' number post stabbing..... and seles although had a slight edge in grandslam finals pre stabbing still lost a lot to graf back then
graf is a usual player graf won only when there is no compition in year 1987, 88 89 graf won alot becouse there were not good players evert and navratilova were above 30 years and when seles appeared she control the game and graf become a very usual player and lost alot and when seles was stabed by graf fan graf won again in 1993 , 94 95 96 and when hingis , williams, davenport apear in 1997 graf disappear again graf wasnt the best but was very very lucky and seles is the best of all time
When you are better then others you can say that there is no competition :) I would like to remind you that Graf was injured most 1997. In last part of 1998 and first half 1999 she proved that she is still at the very top.
1996, graf was very strong, and if she didn't get injured, she could have won 25 grand slum, and hingis wouldnt have been #1 that easily. monica was strong, but she was always defeated by hingis because monica's tennis was too old fashion.
seles not graf should have been the player of 90s if seles was not sttabed on hamourg 1993 and graf career would be very pale in comparison to seles this is not my opinion only or seles fan opinions this is the opinion of all tennis profissional and experts
but hingis and williams sisters and henin beside davenport were playing at the same time this means tat the compitition is very hard imagin that graf was from thear generation and played with them from her begining to her retirement could she make her great career and won 22 grand slam of course i do not think so
ganter parch this criminal man who stabbed seles not only stopped seles career but also prevent us from her most powerful and beutiful tennise i hate him h feel as if he stabed me not seles only and becouse of him i hated all german people becouse this man was not served any kind of punichment from hos goverment
graf have the greatest career in tennis 22grand slam titles and before seles was stabbed seles completely dominted graf from 1990 to april 1993 seles won 8 grand slam titles and graf won only 2 titles so i realy wonder and ask my self alot if seles was not stabbed how many grand slam titles could she win 26 or 28 or 30 grand slam titles can any one anse me
From beginning of 1990 till April 1993 Steffi won 3 grand slam titles. In this period Seles and Graf met 7 times, Seles won 4. I would not call it completely dominating. It was close in most matches although Seles was better in most times.
correction. seles' year was 1991-1993. graf was still the queen in 1990, but signs of her slum were showing. graf only made it to 4 finals 1991-1993(pre-stabbing), and won 2 of 4 slam finals.
graf was not at her best 1991-1992,seles was at her prime. graf was losing to players she had dominated, whereas seles' real rival was graf. before the stabbing, graf leads seles 6-4. oh yeah, seles' 1st grass title was after the stabbing. graf is still the better player.
the saddest part for me as a Seles fan is not only seeing Monica playing like a shadow of her former self, moving badly, hitting badly, basically 10% of pre-stabbing. BUT it's also seeing Graf having her coach being there in the stands, while Monica had lost her father/coach. I can only imagine if Monica had her long time coach with her and wasn't stabbed, while Steffi was stabbed and had lost her coach/father, Monica would have won 6-0, 6-0.
Please don't forget that Steffi and Monica head to head is 10:5, so I disagree with you. In Australia 1999 (a few month earlier) Monica beat Steffi is straight sets. Why can't you enjoy a match between two great players without finding excuses why someone won/lost. I think it is a great match and both players played in high level. It is much more interesting than most of modern women tennis matches.
3 of those wins were in 1989 when Monica was 15 years old who won only 1 title, and 4 wins were after the stabbing when Monica was a shadow of her former self and losing the close important matches to everyone. Yet between 1990-1993 when Monica was on top of her game she had the edge 4-3 including 3-1 in grandslam finals, and she was only getting stronger. In life, you have to ANALYZE stats, especially when it comes to Seles & Graf.
My only point was that both are great players and each deserves a respect. According to your previous reply Monica is in a different level than Steffi. This is not true ... You can't say that Monica ever blew Steffi off court.
yes, agreed, it seems that when monica was at her prime, she led steffi just by 1 victory. when steffi was at her 1st prime (1988-89) she led seles 3-0. steffi's 2nd period of dominance 1995-1996, she led seles 2-0. but then again steffi fans (yours truly) will argue that steffi wasn't at her best when monica was at her prime, and selesfans would argue the same when graf was at her prime.
but can selesfan tell me why seles never achieved the Golden Slam like graf did? why seles never won wimbledon, or an olympic gold? so the arguement will never stop on who's better, but history don't lie. so, for the sake of tennis, y'all selesfans should just make peace with FACTS and HISTORY. peace
I think Steffi was in her prime in 1988 and 1996. During Monica was #1, Steffi wasn't as strong as she was in 1988 & 1996, but she still defeated her or had 3 set much against Monica. People who say "what if seles hadn't been stabbed" believe that she could have maintained her best tennis forever, but it's impossible.
@whfan007 yes Monica can beat Steffi 6-0, 6-0 which is why she never came close to that kind of score against Graf. In fact the only one capable of close to that kind of score between the two is Graf on Seles as Graf has killed Seles 6-2, 6-1 and 6-1, 6-0 at the sports biggest event- Wimbledon. And the former humiliation during Seles's all time peak, ROTFL! And Graf was 30 and nearly retired here. If Seles was 10% then Graf was 2% of her former best and Graf still wins.
@russianskatingfan oh please, take off 30 pounds off Seles and add 30 pounds to Graf, then we can talk. The Graf lunatic turned Monica into a depressed cow addicted to food, she doesn't even look like an athlete in this match, the fact that she was able to compete with Graf (who was playing top level tennis) is already a statement on what the real Monica would have done if she had never been attacked by a Graf fan.
@whfan007 as for Seles at Wimbledon, that 1992 match all the experts have said that Monica was obviously bothered by the non-grunting, wasn't herself, didn't have energy, and that the match would be different. She has been playing like that all her life and all of a sudden she's supposed to change the way she's always played, nobody could beat her so they had to bring her down somehow.
@whfan007 Seles fanatics never run out of excuses, lol! Seles was shit on grass which is why she only made it past the quarters there once her whole career, why she got humiliated by Graf both times they played there even while as the dominant #1, and why she wimped out of Wimbledon with a fake injury while #1 in 1991. Goodday.
@russianskatingfan Chris Evert: "And you know, Dick, talking about the grunt, you keep talking about it. And it is a major issue here. I think it's just too bad that the players, Martina, Tauziat, they couldn't have complained to Monica to her face, you know. Not on the court, not in a big match. "Bud Collins: "No fire at all from Monica, and I think it's because she's trying to restrain herself."
@russianskatingfan Dick Enberg: "Monica tried to deter her grunting, and people say, 'Well that shouldn't make any difference.' What do you think?" Chris Evert: "I think it's taken away that firepower behind her shots. This is not the same Monica Seles that we've seen all year. And something's different, and it's been a distraction for her. She's thinking about, 'Oh, I can't grunt,' instead of thinking about hitting the ball hard and placing it. It has an effect on her, and it's been negative
@whfan007 the fact you act is if this match was still Graf at the peak of her own career is already proof what a delusional retard you are. Graf was 30, coming back from major knee surgery, was soon to retire, and was a shadow of the player she was from 87-96. In the last year she had lost to nobodies like Appelmans, Halard, Kournikova, Serna, Sugiyama which she would beat blindfolded in her prime. Seles was past her prime, but Graf was even more past hers and Graf still on 2 of their last 3.
@whfan007 take 30 pounds off Seles, add 30 pounds to Graf, but also make Graf 5 years younger to be Seles's age and take away her major knee surgery and Graf would probably win in straight sets. After all Graf 30 pounds overweight would probably still outrun even a fit Seles on the court, especialy with more youth and without surgery.
By the way I remember now seeing you on another video saying Graf was more in her prime than Venus at Wimbledon 99, more proof what a fool you are.
@russianskatingfan a successful foot surgery, she's moving as great as ever, so it's irrelevant. and yes in 1999 venus was still not the same player as 2 years later, she was still bashing the ball everywhere and not a force in grandslams... graf never faced the williams sisters when they became grandslam champions, she met them when they were still young and finding their games. NEXT!
@whfan007 1999 Venus won 6 titles and performed well on all surfaces including clay which she is usually dog shit on. 1999 was at worst Venus's 4th best year ever after only 2000, 2001, 2002. 1999 was overall Graf's 12th best year ever. Venus was 19, 2 years older than when Graf first became #1. Graf is 30 the same age Venus is now a has been who cant even beat Pironkova at her beloved Wimbledon. Who was closer to their prime, idiot.
the fact you continue to insist Graf was at her best in 1999 shows what a retard you really are. Graf in 1999 was losing to Halard, Sugiyama, Frazier and even nearly lost to clay court klutz Davenpork on clay the round before. Yet in your desperate and pathetic arguments to build up second tier champions like Seles and Venus as being better than Graf you lie and invent a myth Graf was at her best this year while still beating them. Haha loser.
@russianskatingfan sorry, but Graf in 1999 at least at the FO and WB was better than 1988 Graf, go watch, her shots have more depth, her decisions are better, more experience, etc. In 1988 Graf would never beat someone like Venus, not in a million years.
@whfan007 Omigod 1999 Graf better than 1988 Graf. READ THAT EVERYONE, SOMEONE SAID THAT, HAHAH! Everytime I think you cant get any dumber you show you can. So the Graf that won the Golden Slam would have been losing matches to Julie Halard, Maiu Serna, Ai Sugiyama, and Amy Frazier. Oh and best of all the Graf that won the Golden Slam would never beat Venus, the same Venus who lost to Sonja Jeyaseleen and Barbara Schwarz. Please quit already and stop making a fool of yourself.
@whfan007, if that were true she wouldn't have retired in 1999. Sorry, but your argument is complete bullshit. Of course she wasn't better at the age of thirty than she was at the age of 19. No chance in hell. Argue whatever you want about the depth of her shots or her decisions but she was clearly a player who had reached the end of her career in 1999, not someone at the top of her game. Transport Venus circa 1999 back to 1988 and no doubt Graf wins at least 7 of 10 matches against her.
What a wonderful match and the conditions were brutal. With Henin gone from the womens game nobody has a clue how to play on clay anymore. Seles, Graf, Sancez Vicario and Sabatini all knew how to play on clay in the previous generation and there were some epic battles between all of them on the clay of Roland Garros. If one of them was in this generation they'd clean up.
That's not necessarily true. graf and Seles had imensly close battles and it was down to a point here and point there in most of them. Sure at that time Seles was winning those points but that doesn't mean that she would have continued to win them. All I know is tennis was robbed of an incredible rivalry.
@Hoffenheim08 how is 6-2 in the 3rd set tough?you are an idiot.seles dominated graf in 93 8 aces to grafs 1.seles was entering her prime and you know it.it was the first time seles every outaced graf in a match because she was entering her prime.and then the stabbing.
86 vs. 78 on points played is quite tough. Considering that Seles made 7 more aces and Steffi one double fault more Seles made exactly the same number of points in rallies. That on Seles's best and Steffi's worst surface!
Yes, Steffi and Seles were about even on slower surfaces but Steffi so superior on faster surfaces. Pre-stabbing Steffi won 8 of 8 sets against Seles on grass, fast HC and indoor carpet!
6-0, 6-1, 6-4, 7-5, 6-4, 6-3, 6-2 and 6-1 were the results of those 8 sets!!
@Hoffenheim08 seles made 8 aces to grafs 1.seles beat her 6-3 in the 2nd set and 6-2 in the 3rd set.it wasnt close if graf was so dominant before seles was stabbed she would have won 3 grand slams a year and the masters every year like seles was doing.seles wasnt in her prime for those matches u named u dumbass.only one time did they play where seles was in her prime and that was 93 ao.thats why seles had 8 aces to grafs 1.
I think it was a great match with two old veterans gunning it out old style. Neither played their best tennis by far but the level was consistently high throughout the whole match apart from a few hiccups from both along the way. Would have been a great final in itself but who knew what was to come....!!!
I have never seen Monica moving so badly like in this whole match. :-( Im wondering why Graf did not win in 2 sets. Monica wasnt playing her best at all.
typical of Graf retards. Wimbledon is only one of the 4 grand slams tournaments. Graf won Wimdledon 91 and 92, Seles won Australian Open, Roland Garros and U.S. Open in 91 and 92. (6 titles to 2) She also won Australian Open 93 to Graf. Why is so difficult tu understand?
Wimbledon 92 final is only a match!!!. It does not mean nothing. Graf lost to Sanchez V. Roland Garros 1991 Semifinal 6-0 6-2 !!!!!!!
kingwillbe 1 month ago
Seles was dominating the game including Graf for three years man yr posts are trying and so easy to pick through in fact u sound much like that hoffhiem dude u are probably him..7 slams out of 8 played for Monica , a 4 to 3 Seles head to head with graf and most importantly a 3 to 1 in slam finals against steffi....Seles was the clear and undisputed number one tennis player when she was stabbed she was the next player to win like steffi was and that changed the history of the game forever just
bryguy0111 3 months ago
@bryguy0111
In the 12 months before the stabbing Graf had been 80-7 win/loss and Seles 58-5.
Graf was SO close in the rankings to Seles that she took over the #1 spot against just 5 weeks after the stabbing.
BTW, Seles was not dominating in the THREE years before the stabbing. She was #1 for about 2 years only, with Graf interrupting even that on 2 occasions. And - Graf won the 2 most important tournaments during Seles's reign. Wimbledon 1991 and Wimbledon 1992.
Hoffenheim08 3 months ago
People who comment that Seles was 'dominating' Graf from 1991-93 are re-writing history. Look at the facts before posting biased nonsense. Steffi played Seles five times during the 1991-93 period: Steffi won three of those matches. During that period Steffi won 70 games, and Seles won 54. It's patently clear Seles fan like to re-write history rather than base their appallingly inaccurate opinions on fact. The above facts are based on their head-to-head matches.
Maolseachlainn1 3 months ago
Sorry but Steffi Graf is better she is the best.
Also before whenen seles started to play she lost but also won a lot of matches with seles and then Steffi had a lot of problems with her body and her family.
I think that graf is the best player more than seles this is my opinion
superbobo2009 8 months ago
Sorry but Steffi Graf is better she the best.
Also before whenen seles started to play she lost but also won a lot of matches with seles and then Steffi had a lot of problems with her body and her family.
I think that graf is the best player more than seles this is my opinion
superbobo2009 8 months ago
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
And talking about Seles being able to beat Graf 6-0, 6-0 shows what a fool you are. You know what Seles's easiest win over Graf was in all 10 of their pre stabbing matches? 6-3, 6-4. Graf actually had a 6-4, 6-3 win, 6-2, 6-1 win, and a 6-1, 6-0 win. And while Seles dominated in 91 and 92 her most lopsided win over Graf was 10-8 in the 3rd, LOL! Yet here you are like the blind retard you are talking about a 6-0, 6-0 win if she were fitter and not even realizing what a moron you look like.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@russianskatingfan you are an idiot scores dont tell the whole picture.most of those matches were when seles was 15.thats like saying chang was better than sampras when chang beat sampras 6-0 6-0 at the french open in 89.chang beat sampras many times from 88 through 90 leading up to the us open.right before sampras won it.and seles didnt grunt in the 92 wimb final which affected her game.seles dominated graf right before she was stabbed winning 6-2 in the 3rd set easily.8 aces to grafs 1.
jayfey77 5 months ago
@jayfey77 typical of Seles retards. Lots of excuses, few if any valid points. Most of Graf-Seles matches were not when Seles was 15, only 3 of them were. Seles got destroyed in the Wimbledon final since she was shit on grass, and her making the final there at all was a fluke, which is why she never came close to making it back again.
russianskatingfan 5 months ago
@russianskatingfan
Seles and her fate attract a lot of losers. They can relate to her because they think that she was shafted the same way they were. And that they of course have excuses for their failures in life the same way as Seles.
Hoffenheim08 5 months ago
so according to the experts who were watching that 1992 wimbleodn final, the non-grunting controversy affected Monica and she wasn't herself. There you go idiot.
whfan007 1 year ago
@whfan007 So where is the quote of anyone saying Seles would have won Wimbledon 1992 if she grunted. I see NONE idiot. It is already pathetic enough you Seles losers put every loss she had the remaining 10 years down to the stabbing (how retarded is that) but you even make excuses for all the losses she had had before that. Didnt grunt, had an affair with Donald Trump, was too fat, was too thin, cry me a river. 0 Wimbledons, 9 slams, #10 player all time, the end.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
Dick Enberg: "It's like someone who's been always chewing gum playing basketball, and they say, 'Okay, shoot your free throws, but I'm just going to take your gum away. Don't think about it, though!'"
Bud Collins: "Yeah, it's ex post facto, and I think it's very unfair.
whfan007 1 year ago
to Yevshif, you are discussing very calm, good, also I like Tennis. Totally Agree Graf a. Seles both were great players. Yes the stabbing was a tragedy. It is something different to been ill or been attacked, Steffi was also ill or distracted sometimes, but not attacked. If Monica was only ill, then we would have been much easier on it. But it was a attack. to Hoffenheim08 come on, it is so easy to speak about that Graf was better, after Graf won so many games after psycho stabbed Monica.
Sepir29 1 year ago
@Sepir29
Getting publicly humiliated, ridiculed and investigated by the authorities because of your father's behaviour isn't easy either.
Seles at least had all the public support you can imagine after the stabbing.
Hoffenheim08 1 year ago
TripleAxel1991 is actually a Tonya Harding fan. I guess that says it all, ROTFL!!
raichmaneuvers 1 year ago
Monica won 8 of the 9 grand slams before she got stabbed. And steffi is so fucking annoying because she does not even realize that monica was out of shape. She thinks in her mind that she is better than monica, but in reality monica would have won all of the slams that steffi won after the stabbing.
TripleAxel1991 1 year ago
@TripleAxel1991
You think Seles was out of shape in 1999 due to a minor stab wound received in 1993?
Can it get any dumber on youtube ... ?
Hoffenheim08 1 year ago
@TripleAxel1991 you idiot
rexus82 1 year ago
@TripleAxel1991 So much fail, where to even begin.
1. Monica did not win 8 of the 9 grand slams before the stabbing. How is that even possible when she always failed to win Wimbledon.
2. Steffi was way past her prime at the time of this match, much more than Monica was. She was 30, had major knee surgery, was soon retired.
3. Monica would win all the slams up until 1999? Including all Wimbledons and all slams next generation players like Hingis, Davenport, and Venus. Keep dreaming girl.
raichmaneuvers 1 year ago
@TripleAxel1991 if... would have.... blah, blah.... if my auntie had balls she would be my uncle. Reality is Steffi 22 GS, Seles 9. On the H2H Steffi is 9-5. One Gold Medal vs none. Seles fans love to speculate on "what would have been". History only counts FACTS not suppositions or assumptions.
Bostero3771 1 year ago
@Bostero3771 Steffi vs Monica h2h 10-5
yevshif 1 year ago
Seles LOSERRRR
Graf ist the best. Seles cant beat more Graf 1995 - 1999 withdraw 1999 QF Ausopen.
dfreund1981 1 year ago
Graf is incredible. She's won 7 Wimbledons and 6 French Opens - and theyr're the two slams she's won the most times. Grass and Clay. Only Borg's done that - but he doesn't have the 9 hard court slams Graf has along with that odd Grass-and-Clay combo.
shirgen6 1 year ago
both players played the game so uniquely, today almost all female players do the same, especially the eastern european ones, they are mostly lookalikes yet not even close to the level these two played
I think they compare well to roger and rafa in this matter
thorium222 2 years ago 2
Alles was hier geschrieben wird ist pure Eifersucht auf Steffi Graf. Sie ist und bleibt die beste Tennisspielerin aller Zeiten! Und alle kranken Seles-Fans seien getröstet. Man sah doch in den Jahren als beide wieder gespielt haben, wer von beiden die Spiele gewann! - Steffi nämlich!
Abercreed 2 years ago 5
Monicas Schicksal zieht diese üblichen "was-wäre-wenn"-Loser enorm an. Menschen, die auch in ihrem eigenen Leben unzufrieden sind und immer anderen die Schuld an ihrem Versagen geben.
Hoffenheim08 2 years ago
eben!
lao1978 2 years ago
@Abercreed
toll geschrieben. Graf-Rulez
dfreund1981 1 year ago
I'm really not a fan of either player. Seles was dominating Graf before the stabbing. THATS WHY SHE GOT STABBED! Remember?? We fail to realize, that the stabbing was the most tragic event in sports history. If that never happened to Seles, she would have more slams than your beloved Steffi Graf.... Let's have Steffi stabbed and see what would have happen?
lodaniel08 2 years ago
You are right ... the fact that Monica was stabbed was a tragedy ... If Monica was not stabbed probably she would have won much more slams. But you can't blame Steffi for some stupid / crazy fan ... BTW: till Monica was stabbed Steffi already won 12 GS titles and Golden slam. It is more than Henin, Williams sisters , etc. If she would retire at beginning of 1993 she still would have been one of best players ...
yevshif 2 years ago 2
@yevshif graf had 2 grand slams at age 18 seles had 7do the math.who was on there way to winning more grand slams.seles got stabbed when she was just entering her peak and dominating graf.
jayfey77 5 months ago
1) Seles dominated Graf by losing 3 of the last 5 matches before the stabbing (2 of the 2 two-setters)?
2) The planes of AC Torino and Man United crashing was more tragic. As were Hillsborough Heyssel and Bradford.
3) Steffi would have played again within 2 months.
4) You are one of those idiots who sadly are spreading across the internet more and more ...
Hoffenheim08 2 years ago
I am a fan of both players. I think Monica was the best ball striker of the game. And I love watching Steffi pounding those forehands. But a lot of fans always talk about head to head records. When it's Steffi and Monica, they always point out that Monica led 3-1 in slam finals before the stabbing though their slam record at that time was 3-3. So Monica was the better player.
rinor28 2 years ago
Seles was more successfull in 1991/92. Because Graf was in a slump due to well-known personal reasons.
Hingis was more successful than Graf in 1997.
So?
Hoffenheim08 2 years ago 2
But when it's Graf and Navratilova, Martina is better because she has a 5-4 edge in slam meetings although Steffi won 3 out of the 5 slam final meetings between them. That's why I I always base it on overall head to head records regardless of the importance of the event. Each player favors a certain surface. Graf was the best player I have seen across any surface and she (and for that matter, Martina) found ways of beating younger, more powerful players when then she was past her prime.
rinor28 2 years ago 3
When it's Graf and Navratilova, Steffi is better because she has 22 slams and Navi only 18, because Steffi has the Grand Slam and Navi doesn't, and because Steffi has 8 years as year-end #1 while Navi has only 7.
# of slams and #1 of years as #1 - what is more important?
Hoffenheim08 2 years ago 3
I was just pointing out the fact that people always look at Seles' 3-1 advantage over Graf in Slam finals before the stabbing, then forget that Graf has a 3-2 advantage over navratilova in the same comparison.
rinor28 2 years ago
4-2.
Steffi won FO 87, Wim 88, Wim 89 and USO 89.
Hoffenheim08 2 years ago
Oh, yeah. Sorry. Forgot about USO 89.
rinor28 2 years ago
Comment removed
Hoffenheim08 2 years ago
Steffi would have come back
again
for a guy who bases ther arguments on facts i find it hard that you make such statements
hypocritical is the word that springs to mind
olaraay 2 years ago
@lodaniel08 Here's some scientific fact for you, let's see how you answer this: Those loud grunts some tennis players make when hitting the ball could actually have a negative effect on their opponents by distracting them and slowing their reaction time, scientists said Friday.- Agence France-Presse
bomb692001 1 year ago
@lodaniel08 yes because a deranged pyschopath thinks something we should all go along with it. Great logic. And since Seles wasnt good enough to win slams after she was barely 22 her fanatics like you (haha at your BS at not being a Seles fan btw) simply use the stabbing which happened years earlier as an excuse when in reality Seles simply wasnt good enough.
raichmaneuvers 1 year ago
@lodaniel08 Seles was dominating at the time of the horrendous stabbing just like Steffi was dominating before, but to say that "she would have had more slams.." is sheer speculation.
Bostero3771 1 year ago
@lodaniel08 Steffi has always had a winning record vs Seles, at every phase.
1989-1990: Graf leads young Seles 3-2
1991-1993: peak Seles trails slumping Graf 3-2
1995-1996: peak Graf leads Seles 2-1
1998-1999: aging nearly retired Graf leads Seles 2-0
For you to be talking about the stabbing in a a 99 match shows how delusional you are. Seles's would never have been #1 still at this point, and as I said Graf was even further past her prime than Seles by now yet being better still beat her.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@lodaniel08 Seles fans should seriously stop blaming everything to the stabbing incident. It only makes Seles look as though she did not have the character to weather life's adversity. As they say, when life gives you lemons, make lemonades.
bomb692001 10 months ago
@lodaniel08
"Dominating"??? what a funny word! Do you understand English? Dominating? go to Webster to check it, ok? Here is the truth: H2H before 1993/4: Graf 6:4 leading. In 1991&1992 when Seles was No.1, Graf beat her 3:1, even in Wimbledon 6:2, 6:1, sweeping the so-called No.1 like trash..... You understand what means Dominating now?
amadeusmcallas 3 months ago
@amadeusmcallas
You don't understand, that is the so-called "Seles dominating" (eg. "Federer dominated Nadal in H2H by winning 8 of 25 matches against him").
Hoffenheim08 3 months ago
Stabbing is just a tragedy. But if Seles could not use her powerful ugly roaring (94dB noise) to bother other players on purpose, she was nothing... Look at 92 Wimbledon, without roaring what happened?! If WTA did forbid her roaring when she came out to the court, could she win so many GS? When everybody was used to roaring, you had seen how she got beaten, just like what happened in Miami open 2000. Is this the way to be one of the best play sin the world?
amadeusmcallas 3 months ago
come on,seles never had a real chance against the great and glorious steffi graf...no technique,no fitness,no personality:that´s what seles is/was...with or without that stupid stabbing
majesticgraf 2 years ago 2
that's why seles recorded a 55-1 in grand slam between 1991/92 and early 1993.
fordrmani 2 years ago
@fordrmani wimping out of Wimbledon 91 with a fake injury certainly helped that stat. Who can blame her when we see what was waiting for her at Wimbledon if she ever was lucky enough (or unlucky enough) to get far enough to face Graf there the next year though.
raichmaneuvers 1 year ago
I'm really not a fan of either player. But I saw'll your comment, and I felt that I had to remind of something. Seles was dominating Graf before the stabbing. THATS WHY SHE GOT STABBED! Remember?? You fail to realize, that the stabbing was the most tragic event in sports history. I assure you that if that never happened to Seles, she would have more slams than your beloved Steffi Graf.... She was never the same player. Let's have Steffi stabbed and she what would have happened? hmmmmm?
lodaniel08 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
That motherf#ucker who stabbed monica now walk the street and have a normal life? I cannot believe it! And also there is any connection between him and Graf circle?(her father x ex?)
championxeneixe 3 years ago
Oh, come on!
This small stab wound!!
Hoffenheim08 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I'm really not a fan of either player. But I saw'll your comment, and I felt that I had to remind of something. Seles was dominating Graf before the stabbing. THATS WHY SHE GOT STABBED! Remember?? You fail to realize, that the stabbing was the most tragic event in sports history. I assure you that if that never happened to Seles, she would have more slams than your beloved Steffi Graf.... Let's have Steffi stabbed and see what would have happen? You're a moron!
lodaniel08 2 years ago
Amazing game!!!, Steffi Graf and Monica Seles, are two great exponents of this sport. They are sensational.
Laurazelaya 3 years ago 3
to yevshif any way either i love seles or you love graf we both love tennis and thanks alot for your great effort favour to upload these great matches that i enjoyed alot and thanks for reading my comments and for replying them and that your replies are moderat and are not containig any bad words to me
keemoo1975 3 years ago
You are right we both love tennis :) And lets agree to disagree regarding Steffi and Monica. Have a great day :) I will post soon additional Steffi vs. Monica matches (US Open 1996, 1995).
yevshif 3 years ago
to yevshif thank you again very much you are a kind and civilized person and iwant to say that i enjoyeyed also your other matches of graf agaist hingis and sanches that you uploaded beside i love seles i love good tennis and these are great matches and remember that graf appeared befoer seles and from 87 to 90 she was my favourit player and she is the player who made me love tennis i do not hate her she ia a class peson i wanted only to say my veiw thanks again and have happy time
keemoo1975 3 years ago
waiting for the us open wehre graf screwed seles actually i think it was 1996.... graf had seles' number post stabbing..... and seles although had a slight edge in grandslam finals pre stabbing still lost a lot to graf back then
errolmiranda 3 years ago
US1996 and US1995 finals (Steffi vs. Monica) are uploaded ...
yevshif 3 years ago
graf is a usual player graf won only when there is no compition in year 1987, 88 89 graf won alot becouse there were not good players evert and navratilova were above 30 years and when seles appeared she control the game and graf become a very usual player and lost alot and when seles was stabed by graf fan graf won again in 1993 , 94 95 96 and when hingis , williams, davenport apear in 1997 graf disappear again graf wasnt the best but was very very lucky and seles is the best of all time
keemoo1975 3 years ago
When you are better then others you can say that there is no competition :) I would like to remind you that Graf was injured most 1997. In last part of 1998 and first half 1999 she proved that she is still at the very top.
yevshif 3 years ago
1996, graf was very strong, and if she didn't get injured, she could have won 25 grand slum, and hingis wouldnt have been #1 that easily. monica was strong, but she was always defeated by hingis because monica's tennis was too old fashion.
sbasian 3 years ago 14
@sbasian
Seles was fat, not her game being old fashion.
beavertown2006 1 year ago
seles not graf should have been the player of 90s if seles was not sttabed on hamourg 1993 and graf career would be very pale in comparison to seles this is not my opinion only or seles fan opinions this is the opinion of all tennis profissional and experts
keemoo1975 3 years ago
Till April 1993 Graf won 12 grand slam titles, and in 1988 she won 4 grand slam titles and gold Olympic medal. You can't say it is a pale career.
yevshif 3 years ago
Some additional statistics:
Martina Hingis - 7 grand slam titles
Venus Williams - 9 grand slam titles
Serena Williams - 9 grand slam titles
Justine Henin - 9 grand slam titles
Even is Steffi would have retired in April 1993 she would still be at the top with 12 grand slam titles.
yevshif 3 years ago
but hingis and williams sisters and henin beside davenport were playing at the same time this means tat the compitition is very hard imagin that graf was from thear generation and played with them from her begining to her retirement could she make her great career and won 22 grand slam of course i do not think so
keemoo1975 3 years ago
graf the player who made her great career by aknife, blood and destroying the life of an innocent person (seles)
keemoo1975 3 years ago
You cannot blame Steffi for what happened. The criminal did this, not Steffi.
yevshif 3 years ago
ganter parch this criminal man who stabbed seles not only stopped seles career but also prevent us from her most powerful and beutiful tennise i hate him h feel as if he stabed me not seles only and becouse of him i hated all german people becouse this man was not served any kind of punichment from hos goverment
keemoo1975 3 years ago
can any one answer me how many titles could seles win if she was not stabbed
keemoo1975 3 years ago
We can only speculate, you are right that probably Seles would have won more titles ...
yevshif 3 years ago
i can! seles would win LESS than graf. period! enough said!
rexus82 2 years ago
graf have the greatest career in tennis 22grand slam titles and before seles was stabbed seles completely dominted graf from 1990 to april 1993 seles won 8 grand slam titles and graf won only 2 titles so i realy wonder and ask my self alot if seles was not stabbed how many grand slam titles could she win 26 or 28 or 30 grand slam titles can any one anse me
keemoo1975 3 years ago
From beginning of 1990 till April 1993 Steffi won 3 grand slam titles. In this period Seles and Graf met 7 times, Seles won 4. I would not call it completely dominating. It was close in most matches although Seles was better in most times.
yevshif 3 years ago
correction. seles' year was 1991-1993. graf was still the queen in 1990, but signs of her slum were showing. graf only made it to 4 finals 1991-1993(pre-stabbing), and won 2 of 4 slam finals.
graf was not at her best 1991-1992,seles was at her prime. graf was losing to players she had dominated, whereas seles' real rival was graf. before the stabbing, graf leads seles 6-4. oh yeah, seles' 1st grass title was after the stabbing. graf is still the better player.
rexus82 2 years ago 2
i would say technically graf is the all round better player
but seles maximised her talent aand potential and did one hell of a job and was not scared of graf.
olaraay 2 years ago
seles#both the most powerful and beutiful tennis i ever watched in men and women tennis
keemoo1975 3 years ago
It is impossible to argue, because taste is something very personal. I personally enjoy watching Steffi much more.
yevshif 3 years ago
the saddest part for me as a Seles fan is not only seeing Monica playing like a shadow of her former self, moving badly, hitting badly, basically 10% of pre-stabbing. BUT it's also seeing Graf having her coach being there in the stands, while Monica had lost her father/coach. I can only imagine if Monica had her long time coach with her and wasn't stabbed, while Steffi was stabbed and had lost her coach/father, Monica would have won 6-0, 6-0.
whfan007 3 years ago
Please don't forget that Steffi and Monica head to head is 10:5, so I disagree with you. In Australia 1999 (a few month earlier) Monica beat Steffi is straight sets. Why can't you enjoy a match between two great players without finding excuses why someone won/lost. I think it is a great match and both players played in high level. It is much more interesting than most of modern women tennis matches.
yevshif 3 years ago
whfan007 comment (I deleted it by mistake):
3 of those wins were in 1989 when Monica was 15 years old who won only 1 title, and 4 wins were after the stabbing when Monica was a shadow of her former self and losing the close important matches to everyone. Yet between 1990-1993 when Monica was on top of her game she had the edge 4-3 including 3-1 in grandslam finals, and she was only getting stronger. In life, you have to ANALYZE stats, especially when it comes to Seles & Graf.
yevshif 3 years ago
The only right answer!
Warriorroger 3 years ago
My only point was that both are great players and each deserves a respect. According to your previous reply Monica is in a different level than Steffi. This is not true ... You can't say that Monica ever blew Steffi off court.
yevshif 3 years ago
4-3 record when Monica was on her best (it looks close although in the big matches most of the time Monica was better):
1990-05-14 Berlin Clay F Seles 6-4 6-3
1990-05-28 Roland Garros Clay F Seles 7-6 6-4
1991-03-25 San Antonio Hardcourt F Graf 6-4 6-3
1991-04-29 Hamburg Clay F Graf 7-5 6-7 6-3
1992-05-25 Roland Garros Clay F Seles 6-2 3-6 10-8
1992-06-22 Wimbledon Grass F Graf 6-2 6-1
1993-01-18 Australian Open Hardcourt F Seles 4-6 6-3 6-2
yevshif 3 years ago
1990 Monica was not at her best.
Hoffenheim08 3 years ago
yes, agreed, it seems that when monica was at her prime, she led steffi just by 1 victory. when steffi was at her 1st prime (1988-89) she led seles 3-0. steffi's 2nd period of dominance 1995-1996, she led seles 2-0. but then again steffi fans (yours truly) will argue that steffi wasn't at her best when monica was at her prime, and selesfans would argue the same when graf was at her prime.
rexus82 2 years ago 4
both sides present good arguments
but as i have said before i doubt seles/graf are losing sleep over this- but just enjoying thier millions
olaraay 2 years ago 2
@olaraay
Of course Graf/Seles aren't losing sleep over this.
But that doesn't mean that we should sleep.
Hoffenheim08 1 year ago
but can selesfan tell me why seles never achieved the Golden Slam like graf did? why seles never won wimbledon, or an olympic gold? so the arguement will never stop on who's better, but history don't lie. so, for the sake of tennis, y'all selesfans should just make peace with FACTS and HISTORY. peace
rexus82 2 years ago 3
Rest of Steffi vs Monica history:
1989-05-29 Roland Garros Clay SF Graf 6-3 3-6 6-3
1989-06-26 Wimbledon Grass R16 Graf 6-0 6-1
1989-10-23 Brighton Indoor Carpet F Graf 7-5 6-4
1995-08-28 U.S. Open Hardcourt F Graf 7-6 0-6 6-3
1996-08-26 U.S. Open Hardcourt F Graf 7-5 6-4
1998-11-16 Chase Championships Indoor Carpet QF Graf 1-6 6-4 6-4
1999-01-18 Australian Open Hardcourt QF Seles 7-5 6-1
1999-05-24 Roland Garros Clay SF Graf 6-7(2) 6-3 6-4
yevshif 3 years ago
Er, Seles was stabbed 6 (!) years before this match ...
Hoffenheim08 3 years ago 4
I think Steffi was in her prime in 1988 and 1996. During Monica was #1, Steffi wasn't as strong as she was in 1988 & 1996, but she still defeated her or had 3 set much against Monica. People who say "what if seles hadn't been stabbed" believe that she could have maintained her best tennis forever, but it's impossible.
sbasian 3 years ago 2
@whfan007 yes Monica can beat Steffi 6-0, 6-0 which is why she never came close to that kind of score against Graf. In fact the only one capable of close to that kind of score between the two is Graf on Seles as Graf has killed Seles 6-2, 6-1 and 6-1, 6-0 at the sports biggest event- Wimbledon. And the former humiliation during Seles's all time peak, ROTFL! And Graf was 30 and nearly retired here. If Seles was 10% then Graf was 2% of her former best and Graf still wins.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@russianskatingfan oh please, take off 30 pounds off Seles and add 30 pounds to Graf, then we can talk. The Graf lunatic turned Monica into a depressed cow addicted to food, she doesn't even look like an athlete in this match, the fact that she was able to compete with Graf (who was playing top level tennis) is already a statement on what the real Monica would have done if she had never been attacked by a Graf fan.
whfan007 1 year ago
@whfan007 as for Seles at Wimbledon, that 1992 match all the experts have said that Monica was obviously bothered by the non-grunting, wasn't herself, didn't have energy, and that the match would be different. She has been playing like that all her life and all of a sudden she's supposed to change the way she's always played, nobody could beat her so they had to bring her down somehow.
whfan007 1 year ago
@whfan007 Seles fanatics never run out of excuses, lol! Seles was shit on grass which is why she only made it past the quarters there once her whole career, why she got humiliated by Graf both times they played there even while as the dominant #1, and why she wimped out of Wimbledon with a fake injury while #1 in 1991. Goodday.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
and no "expert" has said Seles would have won Wimbledon 1992. Only the ones from the Seles fan club who think they are experts, lol!
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@russianskatingfan Chris Evert: "And you know, Dick, talking about the grunt, you keep talking about it. And it is a major issue here. I think it's just too bad that the players, Martina, Tauziat, they couldn't have complained to Monica to her face, you know. Not on the court, not in a big match. "Bud Collins: "No fire at all from Monica, and I think it's because she's trying to restrain herself."
whfan007 1 year ago
@russianskatingfan Dick Enberg: "Monica tried to deter her grunting, and people say, 'Well that shouldn't make any difference.' What do you think?" Chris Evert: "I think it's taken away that firepower behind her shots. This is not the same Monica Seles that we've seen all year. And something's different, and it's been a distraction for her. She's thinking about, 'Oh, I can't grunt,' instead of thinking about hitting the ball hard and placing it. It has an effect on her, and it's been negative
whfan007 1 year ago
@whfan007 the fact you act is if this match was still Graf at the peak of her own career is already proof what a delusional retard you are. Graf was 30, coming back from major knee surgery, was soon to retire, and was a shadow of the player she was from 87-96. In the last year she had lost to nobodies like Appelmans, Halard, Kournikova, Serna, Sugiyama which she would beat blindfolded in her prime. Seles was past her prime, but Graf was even more past hers and Graf still on 2 of their last 3.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@whfan007 take 30 pounds off Seles, add 30 pounds to Graf, but also make Graf 5 years younger to be Seles's age and take away her major knee surgery and Graf would probably win in straight sets. After all Graf 30 pounds overweight would probably still outrun even a fit Seles on the court, especialy with more youth and without surgery.
By the way I remember now seeing you on another video saying Graf was more in her prime than Venus at Wimbledon 99, more proof what a fool you are.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@russianskatingfan a successful foot surgery, she's moving as great as ever, so it's irrelevant. and yes in 1999 venus was still not the same player as 2 years later, she was still bashing the ball everywhere and not a force in grandslams... graf never faced the williams sisters when they became grandslam champions, she met them when they were still young and finding their games. NEXT!
whfan007 1 year ago
@whfan007 1999 Venus won 6 titles and performed well on all surfaces including clay which she is usually dog shit on. 1999 was at worst Venus's 4th best year ever after only 2000, 2001, 2002. 1999 was overall Graf's 12th best year ever. Venus was 19, 2 years older than when Graf first became #1. Graf is 30 the same age Venus is now a has been who cant even beat Pironkova at her beloved Wimbledon. Who was closer to their prime, idiot.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
the fact you continue to insist Graf was at her best in 1999 shows what a retard you really are. Graf in 1999 was losing to Halard, Sugiyama, Frazier and even nearly lost to clay court klutz Davenpork on clay the round before. Yet in your desperate and pathetic arguments to build up second tier champions like Seles and Venus as being better than Graf you lie and invent a myth Graf was at her best this year while still beating them. Haha loser.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@russianskatingfan sorry, but Graf in 1999 at least at the FO and WB was better than 1988 Graf, go watch, her shots have more depth, her decisions are better, more experience, etc. In 1988 Graf would never beat someone like Venus, not in a million years.
whfan007 1 year ago
@whfan007 Omigod 1999 Graf better than 1988 Graf. READ THAT EVERYONE, SOMEONE SAID THAT, HAHAH! Everytime I think you cant get any dumber you show you can. So the Graf that won the Golden Slam would have been losing matches to Julie Halard, Maiu Serna, Ai Sugiyama, and Amy Frazier. Oh and best of all the Graf that won the Golden Slam would never beat Venus, the same Venus who lost to Sonja Jeyaseleen and Barbara Schwarz. Please quit already and stop making a fool of yourself.
russianskatingfan 1 year ago
@whfan007
What Pennetta, Pironkova and Pavlyuchenkov did several times each a 88 Steffi might have achieved too, in a million years at least.
Hoffenheim08 1 year ago
@whfan007 >I don t think so Graf could beat Venus also in 1988 was really strong
superbobo2009 8 months ago
@superbobo2009, well obviously Graff could have beaten Venus in 1988, Venus was only 8 years old at the time.
P.S. In case you can't tell, yes I got what you meant and yes I am joking.
jdlund 8 months ago
@whfan007, if that were true she wouldn't have retired in 1999. Sorry, but your argument is complete bullshit. Of course she wasn't better at the age of thirty than she was at the age of 19. No chance in hell. Argue whatever you want about the depth of her shots or her decisions but she was clearly a player who had reached the end of her career in 1999, not someone at the top of her game. Transport Venus circa 1999 back to 1988 and no doubt Graf wins at least 7 of 10 matches against her.
jdlund 8 months ago
What a wonderful match and the conditions were brutal. With Henin gone from the womens game nobody has a clue how to play on clay anymore. Seles, Graf, Sancez Vicario and Sabatini all knew how to play on clay in the previous generation and there were some epic battles between all of them on the clay of Roland Garros. If one of them was in this generation they'd clean up.
mohawk393939 3 years ago
Graf would never win against monica , when monica didnt get stapped.
marple54 3 years ago
That's not necessarily true. graf and Seles had imensly close battles and it was down to a point here and point there in most of them. Sure at that time Seles was winning those points but that doesn't mean that she would have continued to win them. All I know is tennis was robbed of an incredible rivalry.
mohawk393939 3 years ago
When Seles was #1 pre-stabbing Graf won 3 matches (2 easy two-setters, 1 tough 3-setter), Seles won only 2 tough 3-setters.
Hoffenheim08 3 years ago 12
@Hoffenheim08 how is 6-2 in the 3rd set tough?you are an idiot.seles dominated graf in 93 8 aces to grafs 1.seles was entering her prime and you know it.it was the first time seles every outaced graf in a match because she was entering her prime.and then the stabbing.
jayfey77 5 months ago
@jayfey77
86 vs. 78 on points played is quite tough. Considering that Seles made 7 more aces and Steffi one double fault more Seles made exactly the same number of points in rallies. That on Seles's best and Steffi's worst surface!
Yes, Steffi and Seles were about even on slower surfaces but Steffi so superior on faster surfaces. Pre-stabbing Steffi won 8 of 8 sets against Seles on grass, fast HC and indoor carpet!
6-0, 6-1, 6-4, 7-5, 6-4, 6-3, 6-2 and 6-1 were the results of those 8 sets!!
Hoffenheim08 5 months ago
@Hoffenheim08 seles made 8 aces to grafs 1.seles beat her 6-3 in the 2nd set and 6-2 in the 3rd set.it wasnt close if graf was so dominant before seles was stabbed she would have won 3 grand slams a year and the masters every year like seles was doing.seles wasnt in her prime for those matches u named u dumbass.only one time did they play where seles was in her prime and that was 93 ao.thats why seles had 8 aces to grafs 1.
jayfey77 5 months ago
It was a very very windy day that Summer. A sublime match played by two greats in such conditions.
sebbyknight 3 years ago
I think it was a great match with two old veterans gunning it out old style. Neither played their best tennis by far but the level was consistently high throughout the whole match apart from a few hiccups from both along the way. Would have been a great final in itself but who knew what was to come....!!!
Menexpert 3 years ago
Monica made too many unforced errors in this match leading to her lose. :-(
However, she made a correct prediction before this match: the winner between Steffi and her would win the title that year.
JacquesHsu 3 years ago 2
I kept wondering why Monica wasn't hitting more down the line forehands on the return. Monica... :-(
RaleighNC306 3 years ago 2
I have never seen Monica moving so badly like in this whole match. :-( Im wondering why Graf did not win in 2 sets. Monica wasnt playing her best at all.
Melancholio74 3 years ago