Gold standard debunked - Interview with Byron Dale part 2 of 3

[cfweho]

@theByron... I obviously don't know what I'm talking about, I said frac reserve banking is a vertical transaction... (it's really a horizontal transaction, and govt spending as money creation is a vertical transaction). So thanks for good info, I had no idea that the govt had to borrow dollars before it can create the dollars to begin with. Hey... Hold on a second, that doesn't make any sense?

[AComfortableHammock]

@farhadekoohkan Bank issued "competing currencies" will compete with interest rates. Even 1% interest on gold/silver/oil/platinum/cocon­uts will create at least one victim as MORE DEBT is always owed than money in circulation. Interest is the problem, not paper.

[cfweho]

This is really BS....Money is not created by loans. It is created by federal government spending.

First, understand that money is just a medium of exchange, an IOU. Second, we need money to operate our economy in a complex society. I think the world population is now 7 Billion people.

when a bank makes a loan it shows a debit... at the same time that deposit is a credit. It is a Vertical transaction that nets to zero. Money creation from a fractional reserve banking system is a myth.

[TheByronDaleChannel]

@cfweho If the government created money by spending then why does the government have to borrow before it can spend? -Tom

[Quinvarius]

This guy thinks he can debate gold's role as money away with illogical statements. What a clueless moron. This guy shouldn't be giving anyone advice on anything. I bet he writes bad checks all day and night on no balance because he thinks they are as good money. He has the financial understanding of a teenage girl.

[durhamdf]

@Quinvarius what makes gold money? Because people assign value to it, just like with a fiat currency like the dollar. There are very few practical uses for gold, it is used for jewlery and trinkets and a tiny bit is used for high end electronics. But the price of gold has doubled in the last 3 years despite the fact that jewlery trinkets and high end electronics are all demanded LESS! It is a piece of metal, it has no inherent value

[durhamdf]

@Quinvarius what makes gold money? Because people assign value to it, just like with a fiat currency like the dollar. There are very few practical uses for gold, it is used for jewlery and trinkets and a tiny bit is used for high end electronics. But the price of gold has doubled in the last 3 years despite the fact that jewlery trinkets and high end electronics are all demanded LESS! It is a piece of metal, it has no inherent value.

[Quinvarius]

@durhamdf Gold is the only reason we have a modern concept of money. Every now and then people get fooled into using paper by their government and they always lose everything. You keep pretending that the dollar is anything other than credit born of a debt that will never be paid and see where that gets you. Gold fits the definition of money. The dollar does not. The real question is why on earth do you think the dollar is money?

[durhamdf]

@Quinvarius what gives gold any inherent value? Everything on the planet that isn't a crucial input is only given wealth because people have faith in it. Yes gold money has been around much longer so the faith that it stores value is more ingrained. I gauruntee you that gold will fall in value once companies start spending their record treasury holdings and the economy turns around. It is the definition of a bubble, it has doubled based on nothing other an increased demand b/c of uncertainty

[durhamdf]

@Quinvarius what gives gold any inherent value? Everything on the planet that isn't a crucial input is only given value because people have faith in it. Yes gold money has been around much longer so the faith that it stores value is more ingrained. I gauruntee you that gold will fall in value once companies start spending their record treasury holdings and the economy turns around. It is the definition of a bubble, it has doubled in 3 yrs. based only on increased demand b/c of uncertainty

[durhamdf]

@Quinvarius (contd)...The dollar has value because people have faith that it is valueable just like gold. What can you do with gold that makes it valuable? You can't eat it or drive your car with it. All you can do is make jewlery and trinkits and to a tiny extent use it in high end electronics. And what the hell are you talking about, why is the dollar "credit born of debt". Can you explain that giberish?

[Quinvarius]

@durhamdf The dollar is in the most massive bubble that ever existed. It isn't money. It is a unit a unpayable debt for which there will be no demand in a default or a printing binge. Stop assigning it a value against gold. It has no value against gold. Gold is money. Gold is used in our banking system and by our government's as money because it is a permanent indestructable store of wealth. Gold's role is as money and it is why we have a concept of money.

[durhamdf]

@Quinvarius how is the dollar "unpayable debt"? The dollar isn't a promise any more... it is just money. Can you go to the store and buy a soda with a flake of gold? What makes gold valuable? You have yet to answer this question. It has no inherent value other than what we have placed on it IN DOLLAR FIGURES!

[Quinvarius]

@durhamdf Unlike gold, Dollars are created from nothing when people borrow from a bank or when the government borrows from the Fed. Banks don't loan out deposits. They create money from debt. If they create too much money, the dollar loses value. If loans are not paid back, there is no demand for the dollars and they lose value. That is why gold holds it value in inflation and deflation. That is why gold has always been used as the bedrock of the international banking system.

[Quinvarius]

@durhamdf And yes. I can go anywhere on the planet and spend my gold on anything I want or need. The whole world recognizes gold as money.

[durhamdf]

@Quinvarius Ok try to go to your local 7-11 drop a flake of gold on the counter and ask for a pack of cigarettes...see what happens

[BRYAN351]

@durhamdf both you and Quinvarious make good points, but neither of you has the complete picture. You both need to go watch Bill Still's classic documentary "THE MONEY MASTERS" on YouTube. It will clear up a lot of questions for you.

[theoriginalanomaly]

Again sorry for the redundancy, I'll stop watching now... but 1:32 makes no sense either. He cannot think for a minute that dollars would be done with and gold would be money. I don't about you but I have never used a dollar to buy a dollar. Why would someone want to buy gold with gold? Money is used to buy things that are needed/desired. But you cannot buy money. You trade things you produce for money to buy from someone else who has produced something you want/need.

[morrismosseri]

Mr Dale I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what money is. The notion of how do you get more gold if dollars was valued in gold shows your ignorance. Gold is the valueholder, we get more gold by trading our produced goods for more gold. There is no such thing as the world running out of gold, if there was a scarcity each ounce of gold would be worth more. I hope you take some time to understand yourself before making silly videos showing your lack of understanding.

[adriansrfr]

There are three types of money:

Commodity money- gold, silver, copper, etc

Fiduciary money- paper money backed by commodities

Fiat money- debt money. Easy to counterfeit through inflation. Can only be enforced through the power of the gun and the illegalization of real money (the former two types of money).

[adriansrfr]

What moron would sell his gold for federal reserve notes (monopoly money), if the government didn't force this upon people?

[dave997]

the medieval tally stick system lasted succesfully for 600 years, google tally stick money system. People adopted it because the king demanded his taxes be paid with them

[PhilosophyMeditation]

Could we use some other material besides metals to make money i na new monetary system? Like plastic or rubber?

[adriansrfr]

The four primary characteristics of money are: (1) durability (fruits would fail this test), (2) divisibility (diamonds fail this for they depreciate when divided), (3) transportability (oil would probably be impracticable), and (4) noncounterfeitability (plastic or rubber may possibly fail this test)

[Danster82]

We should wipe the debts because although its true the debt represents people assets and savings 95% of all those assets are consolidated into the hands of a few criminals some middle class have savings and will lose out but in general individuals. company, governments basic the world is in debt so I opt for wiping the debt at the expense of those we are in debt to.

Restart with money creation given back to government and then use micro loaning via the internet for the new economy.

[gunthaarz]

Money does not represent gold. Money represents a loaf or bread or the work painting your house or the production of the paint. each can change one commodity for the other. Gold is not necessary. Fiat money works if its created to represent work being done and not being loaned with interest from a bank connected to the FED. if money is based on debt to the FED then we can never pay back the loan because we need more money (with debt) from them to pay the previous debt to the FED. Money is WORK

[adriansrfr]

"Money does not represent gold." Of course not! Who would say this? This would be like saying animal does not represent a cat. Of course it doesn't because a cat is a representation of an animal. In the same vein, gold is a representation (or at least can be) a representation of money.

Fiat money can work, but it is incredibly and efficiently corruptible.

If money=work, then how much are you willing to pay for a hole in the desert? There was work done, right?

[adriansrfr]

"Pearls are not valuable because men dive for pearls.

Men dive for pearls because pearls are valuable."

Money is a MEDIUM OF EXCHANGE

[BlueSkies360]

This makes me think... may be loans themselves are a problem? Nobody should expand their business beyond their means. Nothing on Earth is so urgent that can't wait for 3 months or a year or 5 years until money accumulates.

[TheByronDaleChannel]

The problem is that all money is created as interest bearing loans. There is no money until someone has borrowed it. How can we save money if the only way we can get any is by borrowing it into exsistance?

[adriansrfr]

Commodity money and/or fiduciary money. Say no to fiat money!

[StopTheRobbery2]

@BlueSkies360

Credit is what makes a country great..

It gives people with no or little money the option to start a business and do something great for their community.

[hmsixsixsix]

@BlueSkies360 no, the problem is allowing a private entity to create the money to lend out of THIN FUCKING AIR and then expect to get payed back with interest.

[honestann]

All debts contracted since 1913 are in terms of the counterfeit, unconstitutional FederalReserveNotes. Therefore, all debts are owed by the counterfeiters - the owners of the central banks. Therefore, to pay off ALL debts contracted since 1913 can be honestly settled the following way:

#1: take and sell all property of every owner of ever central bank.

#2: pay off all debts by paying the owed parties newly printed FederalReserveNotes AND that property.

#3: abolish FederalReserveNotes.

[TheByronDaleChannel]

Where would the money come from to purchase all that property?

After you abolish the FRN's, are you going to continue to allow Bank Credit to be our form of money?

[OgeronimonominoregO]

Demagoguery.

This guy should use DIRT for his monetary system, because there's certainly ENOUGH of it!

But if prices rise, then we'll have to import dirt from Mars. And where are we gonna get the money to do that?

We'll have to use water to tide us over. We need trillions of "dollars", so we'll make a "dollar" be equal to 1 ocean. Oh no! We only have 5 oceans on earth! Only $5 for everyone on earth? Oh no!

We'll have to go to Europa to find ENOUGH water!

God, help us! We're doomed!!!!

[TheByronDaleChannel]

Dirt....Sounds like a good idea to me. We'll take that dirt, and use it to build roads and bridges, and then monetize the production of that infrastructure, and actually pay the people who do the production, free of debt.

-Tommy

[OgeronimonominoregO]

Since you will give Congress an infinite supply of fiat money to spend as they will, how much will it cost to build a road?

Let me rephrase: How much is Chris Dodd willing to pay for a road in his district when it doesn't cost him or anyone else (supposedly) anything at all? How about a trillion to "stimulate" the local economy? Hey, it would be good to be the contractor for Dodd's project! Where do I apply?

I'll hire a lobbyist!

Power to the people! Free at last! Finally, a just system!

[TheByronDaleChannel]

Chriss Dodd wouldn't be the one setting the cost. From my understanding, all transportation projects would still go through a normal bidding process, purely at the local level, where We The People's voices can be spoken directly to the people who run our local governments.

[OgeronimonominoregO]

They bid projects in FRNs and get paid in the new "dollar"? I thought he said it was impossible to have two currencies at the same time?

What is the definition of this "dollar"?

Where does Congress get the authority to issue it?

When you subsidize something at no cost, don't you get more of it?

What is the limit of new projects to be funded?

What is the cost to the real economy of producers who are barred from issuing money based on their production?

[OgeronimonominoregO]

And what prevents Barney Frank from expanding the definition of "infrastructure" in order to benefit everyone with this free font of money? Why limit to roads and bridges?

How will you know that projects are in demand when then there is no market mechanism? Will you put in 200 bridges in Pittsburgh when the real demand for them is only 20? More bridges means more money to "stimulate" the local economy. Why would any politician limit the number of projects since there is NO COST?

[gunthaarz]

Do you pretend that money is not being wasted in useless production in the current system? think of the billions and billions of plastic TOYS that are being made in china, bought by US citizens and then thrown into landfill each year. thats economy. are you saying that you want to regulate and decide for everyone what is useful production? Great. Good idea too. Just dont think you can blame useless spenditures on the system. Vote for the right guys then if you dont want to spend money on weapons

[OgeronimonominoregO]

"Do you pretend that money is not being wasted in useless production in the current system?"

No.

"are you saying that you want to regulate and decide for everyone what is useful production?"

No.

[lomocan]

@OgeronimonominoregO

"This guy should use DIRT for his monetary system, because there's certainly ENOUGH of it!

But if prices rise, then we'll have to import dirt from Mars. And where are we gonna get the money to do that?

We'll have to use water to tide us over. We need trillions of "dollars", so we'll make a "dollar" be equal to 1 ocean. Oh no! We only have 5 oceans on earth! Only $5 for everyone on earth? Oh no!"

Beautifully put lmao Communists & socialists never stop day-dreaming.

[bbburton]

This guy simply ignores the exchange of goods and services that "money" facilitates. He talks like gold is the commodity that is exchanged without the presence of other goods and services.

[OgeronimonominoregO]

I wouldn't buy a used car from this guy.

I initially thought he was ok but mistaken. Now that I see he's just a demagogue making absurd claims over and over, ripping through each one like a cheap salesman trying to close a sucker on a raw deal.