Penn unfortunately so many of our world leaders or some celebrities do buy into this idea that people are cattle. They do not want people to think for themself that is why religion has been such a major tool of the political.
After all an Atheist can not be president since in order to be president one must be connected to these secret societies. And that means a stupid god belief. It is sad but true. If you make another channel or another site let me know I love hearing your opinion.
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People who believe that you have to tell the masses what to think are the same people who believe the government is the answer to all our problems. It is not a stretch to go from "benevolent government parenting" to "telling the masses what to think". Think for yourself isn't just a cute phrase to tell teenagers who all look/act/smell alike, it's something to practice for your ENTIRE LIFE. Think. Don't accept without questioning. Be yourself and not what someone tells you to be.
ibitarians are FAR too simplistic, and take NO account of all the things that ARE being done FOR them, BY the government which "by in large" sees to it that it's done correctly, FOR YOUR BENEFIT. You really want to spend YOUR life seeing to it that, roads, sewer, refuse disposal, police, heathcare, EVERYTHING, is done and done right, all by yourselves?? Tell me you're gonna do all that AND have a meaningful life on top of it all, and I'll get out a mirror and show you a self-deluded fool.
No. I don't believe that I can or would do even a fraction of that myself. I believe that if those services were opened up to competition, profit seeking individuals and companies would compete to provide those services.
And they would do it better and cheaper than their government counterparts. You know, like private fire departments, private ambulance companies, private refuse disposal companies, and private defense contractors already do...
For profit schools were largely a nightmare, most of the large ones like Edison went bankrupt, but still I see the them touted as "the answer" to crumbling underfunded public schools. : P And WHO sites, builds and manages those landfills, GOVERNMENT, payed by your tax dollars with public hearings given over new sites. Those refuse collectors sponge profit, Gov. pays the big bucks there! Finally, mentioning defense contractors and saving in the same sentence just proves to me your an idealog.
Oh, and one other thing, break out your copy of brown-field sites in the United States, and realize that not even 5% of the cost to clean up these sites could be pulled, kicking and screaming from the companies responsible for the contamination in the first place. No well funded government, no clean up! Yeah, "for profit" is the way to get EVERYTHING done best!! PTTTHT! : P
If you look at my comment, you'll see that I stuck to my own opinion and easily verifiable facts. (e.g. Private waste companies and private defense contractors exist and operate at a profit.)
You then respond with a depth of argument that can't be contained in a couple 500 character comments. For instance, since you can't cite any references, I have to take all of your myriad "facts" at face value. Being able to state whatever you want as fact is a bad way to argue. Hope you have a nice day.
You can't accept an argument based on facts you don't already know!!? Fine, then at least explain the concept of how taking profit from a set amount of proceeds serves to make anything MORE efficient and cost effective than taking NO profit out? Either we're talking the fifth quarter of the pie here or someone isn't being very upfront with the details about what you're NOT getting for your money to cover this difference. That's a pretty simple notion for you, isn't it?
The Haliburton and other Defense contractors issues being swept under the rug can't serve as proof, but it should at least raise serious doubts. I just find it hard to fathom a world where profit motivation, without regulation and over-site, would lead to anything besides massive corruption. The financial markets were offered a bit less regulation and the results were a global melt down, with Nobel economist Joseph Stiglitz declaring that the idea of free market economies is a failed concept.
Clearly I mis-worded my previous attempt to cut this short. What I am saying is the quoting facts and figures w/out substantiating references is an easy way to bully your way through an argument. If you want to have a debate on that level we need to take it elsewhere.
As to your other point. Chevy makes cars. Toyota makes cars. It is essentially the same product. And yet, Toyota makes more per car sold than Chevy (GM). streamlined process with less waste and superior innovation produces profit.
Also, try looking up the American Mail Company. In the 19th century, they challenged the USPS's monopoly on first class parcel delivery and managed to make a profit, by, among other things, cutting waste, reducing prices, and inventing the postage stamp. Eventually they were forced out of business trying to fight the various legal battles brought against them by the USPS and the Fed. Gov't.
I will do that, and assuming you aren't just blowing smoke (a reasonable assumption here I think) , I'll concede there are benefits to focusing on systems and streamlining, and that the bully tactic to compete, as practiced in this case by the Gov. are extremely counterproductive. Unfortunately what enforcement mechanisms exist to fend against such practices between rivals, outside what most Libitarians call "waste", a robust regulatory system? Free market mechanisms don't really address this.
@RainbowMonkeeMittens "Unfortunately what enforcement mechanisms exist to fend against such practices between rivals, outside what most Libitarians call "waste", a robust regulatory system?"
Looks like someone got lost somewhere along the way... this run on sentence goes nowhere! Nowhere I say! and how did it become a Question all of a sudden?
Toyota v. Chevy. A fine case in point for your position to be sure, but is this really a commonly practiced case of market success? Salary management and work culture such as seen at Toyota would be unacceptable within many corporations here in the west, and as we've seen, "other" less beneficial means to compete were instead employed. Market forces can also precipitate very poor decision making. You may claim "hey, the winner take all", but don't dismiss how socially disruptive that is.
it's quite simple, When you let people, who's own funds depend on what they're doing with others work with others funds, they do a lot better than democratic bureaucrats that get paid to do nothing other than tell people how to do something they have never done before successfully, for the most part at least. It is ridiculous to pay people as much as we do to set laws for us. They really, constitutionally have no right setting in place at all period.
When you think of all the horrible things people and companies try to get away with even WITH regulation and oversight, and you want to do away with it all together? You're as bad as the communists. Assuming people have the best intentions, no greed, no dishonest intentions, then sure, that system work great, AND no one gets left out in the cold, but you're both dreaming about a would which doesn't and never will exist, so why SHOULD anyone listen to you Libetarians either?
Man, how can you be so shortsighted, and so self absorbed!? You honestly believe that everyone can do everything for themselves, and THAT would make them happy?! Spending all their time replicating effort? Believe systems of efficiency are worthless because of a few kinks!? One tiny sample, how much do YOU know about securing heathcare, and how much of your life did you spend understanding what little you DO know! You are dreaming for the nightmare of a dissolved society, and that IS nuts!
Dont you think they're would still be issues like segregation if we weren't told what to do i mean i definitly believe in human freedoms ,strongly but you gotta admit the majority of the people you know are idiots and say the stupidest things i mean if more people thought like bem003us people would know jesus is just a story/metephor
Why am I not surprised that Larry King, and apparently many Americans, believe they need someone to tell the masses how to think. Not them of course, but the ignorant masses. The degree of arrogance and conceit it takes to believe such a thing, let alone voice it on national television is astonishing. Meanwhile, his elitist guests, with the exception of Penn, apparently concur. If I were as superior a human being as Larry King or James Carville, I wouldnt need someone to tell me how to think.
Penn is right in that the masses need not be told what to think, but when the individual is morally right and the masses (group) is morally wrong, it is necessary for government to reinforce the voice of the individual and allow them to speak (1st amendment). I also believe in the individual, but to a limit. People can be stupid, scared, angry animals, especially in groups acting with a "herd" mentality. This can obviously not be discussed with 500 characters, which is part of the problem today.
Edwards-You're bringing up the strawman of Limbaugh- I disagree with Limbaugh on many, many things, and even Penn on a few things. You espouse a typical elitist attitude- "The people are too dumb, so we must enslave them to make them productive". There's no evidence to support otherwise? Why is it that the most prosperous societies are capitalist societies? Because government doesn't fuck with them.
I agree with Penn to a certain extent, but I think he's perhaps being a bit naieve about the average intelligence level currently operating in the West.
I'd be interested to hear his thoughts regarding the recent decision in Texas to reintroduce the teaching of YEC, something he has ridiculed (rightfully so) on his own show.
The reason larry said that is because G.W. Bush was hired by us....twice. Larry was probably just expressing the opinion that we deserve competant representation in the white house and it isnt enough to have the right man or woman for the job, you have to make people understand that politicians like Bush are ruining our country....as far as the "individual", the standards of an individual don't matter when its a popularity contest that determines whether they get the job.
My biggest and most fundamental disagreement with Penn is that he is basically optimistic about humanity, and what he calls "The Individual", and I am not.
To think like he does, you have to believe that the average person is intelligent, competent, and responsible, and I can't. Not in the face of so much evidence to the contrary.
Thank you! Every time I listen to Penn and libertarians in general talk, I just don't see why they think individual people are that smart. You see people fucking up all the time, ruining their own lives and the lives of others, and it's not the government's fault they did it.
People who think Libertarians are too optimistic about the individual don't really understand what we're getting at. Failure seems to be a huge taboo these days, but I'd argue that it is an integral and essential aspect of true individual freedom. I've never once heard Penn say that given freedom nobody would fuck up, so anyone calling him overly optimistic is drawing conclusions out of thin air.
I think the idea that "somebody has to tell the masses how to think" is what drives a large percentage of journalists and opinion makers like Larry King.
This is the reason media bias exists. I think most people go into journalism to fulfill a desire to communicate "the truth" to everyone.
Just watched the CNN interview; Seems like Mr. King had a moment of complete honesty there; a Freudian slip so to say. Either that, or they're just getting bolder.
"After all, they're too dumb to think for themselves aren't they?"
Yes, unfortunately. A good chunk of the population is too dumb to think for themselves. Libertarians have an overly optimistic view of the individual, which has NO evidence to support it.
No, sorry. Lots of people sleepwalk their lives in ignorance, which gives the appearance of laziness/stupidity, but that's the fault of the big government notion in the first place. And it's funny how everybody assumes that everbody else is irresponsible! Remember that human beings existed without state health care for 99% of our time on this planet, and the biggest slaughters, massacres and genocides occured in the time of the organised centralised state. Let's take control of our own lives...
Organised centralised state???? LOL I'd love to see the definition on that one! Just about any government right down to the municipal fits that description.
ok, Penn, how is individual freedom of thought effected negatively by socialized healthcare? It would stand to reason that it would give people who had less more choice in their healthcare concerns. I beleive in the same freedoms you do, but not only for the wealthy.
Yeah, individual healthcare... Buy our own MRI machine or pay 5k to use one. In Australia it is practically free and we still have one of the strongest economies left standing.
Of the 11 AA ranked banks left in the world we have 4 of them.
"Socialism" and big government have ruined us... yeah right
Humans are not absolutely moral or correct. And to think that they, as a group, will choose the best option is absurd. Most of the world is not Atheist, yet Atheism is the truth. We ELECT leaders because it is better to put intelligent people in charge than risk having a popular vote or a random group selected from the public. Furthermore, many people do not form their own ideas. For many people, ideas are provided, and they pick those that are entertaining and fit their initial schema.
Having someone to tell the masses how to think is an espousal of monarchy. Democracy is the antithesis of that. As the lessons of history fade from the consciousness of society, the mistakes of history are once again repeated. Study the history of the late Roman republic if you want to find out what Deja Vu is all about.
The tragedy of human nature is that wisdom and experience are not inherited but must be earned anew by each generation.
"Having someone to tell the masses how to think is an espousal of monarchy. Democracy is the antithesis of that."
That sounds very nice in theory, and if you only apply it to government, it's probably even correct. Ask the millions of "dittoheads" out there, how much their independant thought is really worth! Hell, ask them if they disagree with Limbaugh on ANYTHING!
If the ideas and policies that that Limbaugh promotes are so demonstrably wrong, then how about addressing them and explaining their shortcomings instead of whining about the supposed lack of intelligence on the part of his listeners.
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large groups...
And more antisocial one-liners that sum this video up... :P
Plus, Larry King is an asshole, but he's right... The majority in this country are so intellectually and emotionally sensitive that they HAVE TO be instructed how to live (MTV, Nickelodeon, Disney, Mainstream Media), and would turn into a babbling puddle of crying mucous if they didn't have said instruction...
You need to learn about the wisdom of crowds. Go look it up, seriously. It is the basis of market economies, true democracies, and every other successful institution or approach to a problem that is based upon each individual making choices and acting independently of others.
Percentage of death is 100%. Penn is great. I bet he'd be mean to me in person, but I love the act, the Libertarian stuff, the Bulls**t Show, etc. It'd be worth the derision to listen to what he has to say.
Right you are, valcaron, but i guess I have been trained to self censor. Free speech is dying in America, and I may be helping that happen. Forgive my non-honest typing.
People have different wants in life. Some want to get up and make something, anything of their life, and some want to go to work in the day and make enough to feed the kids and get drunk. The first lot we are more likely to meet the second lot dont want to have to bother with all the decision making and progression of life.
It was an eye opener to find that the second lot do exist. We have factory floors full of them. These are "the masses" that Larry King is talking about.
It doesn't matter who Larry King or you think "the masses" are. It doesn't matter if those individuals who make up the masses think of themselves as a speck in a mass of mindless drones. Each person has 42,048,000 minutes worth of experiences and thoughts and feelings and when you say things like "someone has to tell the masses what to think" you've just marginalized everyone in favor of yourself, one of the masses.
I agree. Telling them how to think is wrong. However "the masses" don't want to bother with finances and careers and paperwork and so on. They want someone to take that out of their hands so that they can get on with what they want in life. Having talked to them they don't have a clue about how to fill in a tax return or how much the interest on their store card actually means.
I am not saying anyone is better than any one else. I am saying people want different things in life.
I'm feeling American right now. So here it goes. -It must be great having Sony as your sponsor or distributor thing, anyone heard of bluray?? Sony's where the money's at. Penn probably invented bluray. Think about it.
Ok so here's the deal many conservatives are against nanny state but still wanna tell people how to live and interfere in thier lives especially in America. I am referring to the religious right though I guess they are a dying breed
Mini-archic libertarians are useful for debates. If you have a libertarian on your side in a debate you are guaranteed to win. There brand of realism and skepticism is useful criticism, but they never offer any fucking solutions. All they say is the "free market will take care of it" . Libertarians are simply good at mental masturbation. For these reasons, I consider myself a libertarian.
I am absolutely shocked that Larry King would say that. I know that it is an underlying assumption behind all the Left and Right versions of big Government and the Nanny State, but I always assumed most people weren't aware that the belief was there. (People are often unaware of all aspects of their own beliefs.) Stating it so blatantly seems to go against all American orthodoxy.
Nanny state sucks, In New Zealand where I live we just got rid of our old Nanny State authoritation Left Wing government at our last election in '08, Life is so much better when you don't have the government telling you how to live.
I fully believe we should have full free health care and education at the collegiate, graduate and post graduate level.
We already take care of our own health care, we are forced to in this capitalistic society.
It is ironic that all of these wishy washy liberals are jumping on the healthcare bandwagon after decades and decades of non commitment in order to maintain campaign fodder, much like legal merijuana.
I dont like the means but I hope to meet the ends.
The average American is already in debt the day they are born. I don't understand how you think it's possible for the individual to take care of themselves in your current private health care system, VERY few people can afford an average health care bill. So you're assumption that people can take care of themselves in this regard is wrong.
In the same way the everyone cannot afford to protect themselves from thieves and such, so we have a consensus that police are needed....
Rugged individualism worked really well on the American frontier, mostly because you were miles away from anyone else. But as soon as those frontiersmen got neighbors, it became much more collective. Why? Because there is advantage in working as a group. Groups can accomplish what individuals cannot.
We put way too much stock in the individual in America. Times have long since changed.
He's not saying that we shouldn't rely on eachother and associate with eachother. He's simply arguing that we should all be "individuals" in an intellectual sense. Too much agreement between people leads to herd mentality. It feeds itself and eventually becomes a rationalization. Yes groups can accomplish what individuals cannot, but when groups try to compel individuals it becomes analogous to a bear dancing with an ant. The ant will realize it's a bad idea long before the bear does....
Penn keep on doing what you do, and speaking truth, if that makes you the enemy then embrace it. Someone has to stand for the truth, for logic and reason because left and right seem incapable of it.
You're totally right Penn as usual, but the more that people in areas of any power (like Larry King) say and think that there are masses to control, the more you'll have masses that will form to be controled. For so many people, it's easier to just follow along then to think about either side, that's why we only have two main parties in our government, it's easier for people to just vote for the 'side' they're on then to understand what each and every person could bring to the table and do.
Mr. Jillette, thank you for saying what needs to be said amidst a cloud of conflation in our media. I almost weep when I hear the doublespeak these days.
I'm by no means an atheist, but that is irrelevant. Keep on keeping on, stalwart voice!!!
P.S. Penn you're starting to sound like a pussy. Quit apologizing for your views, it's every other A-hole who should be a apologizing, especially silly old elitist codgers in suspenders.
Yes, yes forced taxation is the answer. You should have an obligation to people you don't know because you're a selish asshole who'd rather let people die than part with 5 cents.
I think you should redo your math. Also your thinking people are going to die anyway. My "forced" Donation is not going to help or harm either way. You people really have lost your minds.
I'm 22 years old and instead of having a normal life I'm consistently paying medical bills for a very rare condition. I'm starting an (overpriced) drug that costs some $400k per year indefinitely. I am also unemployed because there are no jobs available, and I'm not sitting on millions. I can not take care of this on my own...
problem is will this actually help or hurt you. The Government may decide that your not worth the money due to certain things. Surely you realize that not every one or every condition will be taken care of it would bankrupt this country. I agree for free health care for those who need it but honestly I' am not that weak that I need somneone else to run my affairs. Nor do I want it.
...on pragmatism though, I would like to say I don't think anyone should reject simply "what works", but there should be conditions, ie "what works" for society as a whole but screws me individually might not meet those conditions
Penn, I love your stage performances and witty banter, aswell as your ability to speak your mind rationally and sometimes revolutionary.
However, in this day and age, it would take 10 Penn and Tellers to even come CLOSE to matching the stage tricks and slight of hand of the federal government, and those who seek to cut a slice of the country for themselves.
Its a shame too, considering they dont take a page from you guys, and show us how it was done without their conscience getting in the way.
i think someone needs to introduce larry king to at least two writings... "Self-reliance" by Emerson, and "Resistance to Civil Government" by Thoreau.
Liberals think that most people are stupid children and need to be managed.Its disrespectful...theres gotta be an instinct behind this behavior(mothering?)
Penn, I think the problem is that many of these people do not have a love for individuals. Not on any level. Personal, intellectual, or otherwise. The fact that they are so limited to trying to meet conventional norms instead of going for what is really right and good is strong evidence of that.
It's really easy for one of life's big winners to think the game is great the way it is. But why do you think life has to suck so hard for people who just try to work regular jobs? The rich wouldn't be rich if they didn't have poorly paid people doing all the work for them.
thats not true, my grandad has a successful roofing company, and is rich, no one did shit for him, he started with his dads 2 seat pickup truck and a bag of tools, he worked for what he has
yyeah, sorry pal. im sure theres some out there who get verrry bad karma and the like, but when some people get a handout, everyone does...alot of people who shouldnt have things handed to em. and that isnt the democracy I was born, raised and taught in.
You have to tell the masses how to think. That is truly scarry because so many are willing to be told how to think. You say there are 300,000,000 diff opinions but think about it. How many people are followers? How many people truly believe Obama will save us? SCARRY. Penn, you are getting people to think for themselves. I thank you for that!! Keep it up. Good Day!!!
I love how you said "it's perfectly moral to hope anything you want". I've felt very strongly on this point, but so many people seem to disagree with me. I think if the average person searched their feelings they'd realise how much sense it makes, but people are so caught up in seeming moral, that if they hear someone explicitly say they hope something bad happens to somebody else, their immediate response is to act outraged, even though hoping doesn't make something any more likely!
The phrase "someone has to tell the masses how to think" scares the ever-loving crap out of me... It could be meant in some VERY dark and scary ways. I like to think Larry King isn't going to be our next overlord, but after phrases like that, I'm a little nervous.
It worries me that everyone in the media think that way. that they think "the masses" can't or shouldn't figure things out for themselves. it is disturbing to me that they feel they should tell us how to think and feel.
As Larry King is such a central player in the media, and thus is one of the people who DOES tell the masses how to think, or does his very best to influence them, I'd be quite suprised if he didn't hold that view, to be honest.
Yes, if individuals can take care of their own healthcare, if they can afford it. But woah to that Larry King comment about the masses needing someone telling them how to think. I consider myself Liberal, but not that far left.
And the fact that Larry King, one of the most watched people in American media, came out with that statement should raise some red flags to people about how biased our media is.
Sadly I think most in the media share is opinion." Screw truth and objectivity, lets tell them how they should think about this."
Scary thing is that Larry just admits it like that.
all news media has an agenda..fox news wants you to think conservative and cnbc and cnn try to make u think liberal..thats why i dont watch the news...i get most of my news from the internet...i dont like to think the news station im watching is trying to make me think a certain way...so i dont watch it
The problem is not individuals, it's masses. As you, Penn, and you, people who will read my comment, probably noticed, we're quite stupid while in a group. Not necessarily a few friends, but a big group.
And, most of the time, the leader of the group is the craziest of the bunch.
It's sad, but I think it's only the fear of being rejected by other people that makes us act like that.
Health care costs are 15% of the USA GDP. Some examples from public health care systems: Japan 5%
Canada 10.6%
Australia 8.8%
France 11.2%
If public health care is so inefficient, why are they spending less and receiving more care? Other measures such as per capita spending yield similar disparities.
"If public health care is so inefficient, why are they spending less and receiving more care? "
Several reasons. First, because the level of care in the US is much better than in any of the nations which you've listed. Second, because the US right now has the worst possible systems - socialized medicine for the poor, while everyone else competes in the free market. They need to pick one and stick with it. I'd go with pure capitalism, but either one would be better than what they have now.
"The level of care in the US is much better than in any of the nations which you've listed"
We have lower lifespans and higher infant mortality rates than all countries listed. The level of care per dollar is much lower than that of the countries I have listed.
"I'd go with pure capitalism"
The open market of health care would deny millions coverage to drive up profits. Insurance would only be given to the healthiest individuals to keep rates low, etc. Such a market would fail if it existed.
"We have lower lifespans and higher infant mortality rates than all countries listed."
Which has to do with how statistics are gathered, and not with how effective the medical system is. Infant mortality statistics, in particular, are very misleading due to how infant mortality is defined. Do some research.
"The level of care per dollar is much lower than that of the countries I have listed."
I've already acknowledged that, and explained why. Thanks for agreeing with me.
In Cuba they abort problem fetuses to avoid a higher mortality rate. Hows that for better mortality rates? And how could insurance companies stay in business if they do not serve enough people to cover overhead? Most firmsdto not exist catering to a select few but instead the whole market. I wish more people bothered to study economics before they claim "such a market would fail."
I realize many people believe that infant mortality and life expectancy are irrelevant.
Regardless, the USA is not "much better" than countries with national health care in other health care indicators such as breast cancer mortality rate, cervical cancer mortality rate, heart attack fatality rate, etc
"Most firmsdto not exist catering to a select few but instead the whole market. "
Firms already in this pseudo free market deny people everyday due to high risk from preexisting health issues
Why hasnt Mcdonalds stopped serving food for low prices? And why does Walmart have low prices? hmm
"Most firmsdto not exist catering to a select few but instead the whole market."
Coverage is denied to people every day. Then an emergency room treats someone who is near death instead of when the treatment was most appropriate. This added cost is passed onto the consumer.
because dumbass, Mcdonald and Walmart buy bulk product at huge discounts and pass it on to the consumer you and I. Where healthcare cost so much because of the Insurance Industry and the Federal, State and Local Governments negotiating discount prices for the service the doctor provides. So the doctor has to make money in the deal in order to stay in business therefore over priced his/her service to make a profit of of the insurance and Government health care.
"Better service for the few doesn't mean the nations' system is better off.
Care for all no matter the quality is a better system than better service for the few."
That's idiotic. According to that logic, the medical system of an African tribe in which everyone gets to have the Witch Doctor shake his rattle at them is superior to the US medical system.
"A corporation making a profit is a different story, and you know it."
No, it's not. Even if it were, doctors aren't corporations. Since we were discussing the medical system, I'm not sure why you're going off on a tangent.
"... is the equivalent of a system payed for by the tax payer. Than the only idiot here is you."
HAH. Way to make our education system look like a joke.
Free tip: making grammar and spelling mistakes while calling someone an idiot makes you look REALLY stupid.
The last words of someone who has lost an argument and has nothing left to say; "Free tip: making grammar and spelling mistakes while calling someone an idiot makes you look REALLY stupid. "
I didn't realize this was English class. I'm sure you know what I meant, and if you didn't, as I'm sure might have been the case. Then I suggest you enroll yourself in an accredited college and learn something.
"The last words of someone who has lost an argument and has nothing left to say ..."
No, dumbass - those would be the closing words of someone who's just finished decimating your argument, and is enjoying a laugh at your expense.
"I'm sure you know what I meant"
Yeah, I knew what you meant. Unsurprisingly, though, YOU managed to miss MY point. Don't worry, though - more intelligent people than you are laughing right along with me.
"To make a profit off an illness is despicable, at best."
And this comment is even stupider. Profit is the driving force behind most human endeavor. If it wasn't for those evil doctors looking to make a profit, you wouldn't HAVE access to health care.
Any of you idiots who think that free health care is some sort of a human right, go out into the middle of a forest, and break your leg. See whether mother nature provides for you.
I live in Canada, and yes people make salaries based on their positions.
A corporation making a profit is a different story, and you know it.
Don't try to feed me your bullshit.
I'm not arguing it's a human right, but it's something every decent tax-paying citizen should desire. If you want police, and education, why not health care?
I have a special disdain for Anarchists of all stripes, through and through, left and right alike.
They are the epitome of the pipe dreaming idealism that I despise so much, the sort that prefers ideological romantism to actually improving things in the real world.
Libertarian Party lectures people about individuality, and then they go on to say that they should be at the helm of government. The are such hypocrite.
If you are investing at all in the idea of government then you believe in forcing innocent peoples lives at the point of a gun. Listen to a Libertarian's excuses for government. In the end they sound just like any fascist or communist.
Libertarians know the government is evil and they choose it anyway. What does that say about them?
It would appear that Larry is thinking the way that someone told him to!
The god tells the Pope, the Pope tells the president, the president tells the congress, and the congress tells us. I think Larry may have something there!! It looks like that's what is going on now.
Most of the problems in society that I can see, I mean literally that I can see in my neighborhood with my friends, it has to do with someone telling whole lot of people whats best for them, in the neighborhood example, the person making statement of course as always does not live in the neighborhood and in fact has no need to say anything. It's a certain type of person that want's to control others, and then there are others who want to stop them from being controlled.
Sadly, Penn's individualism is laughed at. "You have to have someone to tell the masses how to think." Wow. We don't all feel that way, Penn. Trust me on that.
Individuals taking care of their own health care? Individuals can't even take of having a credit card, balance their check book or even take care of their own retirement...So why would you even think they are capable of this?
Less government in healthcare may sound like it would lessen your costs but it would also raise your deaths..Who enforces and restricts drugs that may cure an infection but gives you cancer. Healthcare goes up because 1)its a business 2)malpractice insurance from lawsuits
I doubt the number is 10%, I doubt very much that you don't have a relative or a friend who racked up large credit card bills... I've had friends whose parents were a doctor and teacher and their son was a complete idiot when it came to money. How many people were taken by Bernie Madoff for billions, A person can be smart but people are stupid and to honestly think the world only has 10% stupid is naive. Heres a question why do I have to pay for schools when I have no kids and don't plan on it?
Should we have government own our credit card companies then? Do our banking for us? Handle our retirement? Perhaps they should own my favourite local restaurant in case it goes out of business. It's called a slippery slope.
Computers are a business, their costs go down. Cell phones are a business, their costs go down. Coffee is a business, but their costs do not rise beyond inflation. Healthcare, however, has had a steady increase in costs. Why is this? I would argue price fixing by gov't.
Wrong analogy, computers, cell phones are products not a business..Those products haven't went down in prices my 1st cell phone cost $150 and my latest cost $260 Its like buying a 2009 car for 20k in 2009 or buying a 2009 car in 2010 for 18K ,both or new but new incoming products drove the price down not private business.. Just like new technology will drive down the price for old tech. Everything costs more and continues to increase in value.. Houses, cars, food haven't went up for last 10 yrs?
I love how Penn admits in this video that he DOESN'T CARE ABOUT WHAT WORKS, he only cares about his dogma, no matter how unrealistic and ineffectual it is.
There you have it. That's why I have to laugh every time Penn talks about his "morals"... because they are not supposed to have any relation to the real world at all, they are just intellectual masturbation.
He doesn't care about actual consequences in the real world.
Yeah, Penn, caring about REALITY is pretty decadent, isn't it?
Perhaps you can explain how you can get moral value out of 'what works'?
Too many uninsured people? Too many sick people? Let's round them all up and ship them to Cuba, or cook them in ovens. Why not? It works! Problem solved! If this is your moral standard, then I implore you to find a better one.
And I'll try just once on this dogma thing. Dogma would be: Penn: 'Socialized medicine is bad. Why? Because I said so.' I've never heard Penn argue like this. He uses reason.
"Too many uninsured people? Too many sick people? Let's round them all up and ship them to Cuba, or cook them in ovens. Why not? It works!"
Let's take your strawman argument seriously for one second: what would be the best way to solve this issue, to genocide uninsured sick people, to expatriate them or to pay for their treatment?
Assuming you picked the latter, do you or don't you think the well-being of fellow humans is more important than not taxing the rich?
You're probably gonna come with the same BS Libertarian rationalizations, like "if the guv'ment didn't tax the riches, all medicines would magically become super cheap and all diseases would be magically be cured".
No. The truth is poor, uninsured sick people die and no one cares. Not the farmaceutical companies, not private citizens, not you and not me.
Between not taxing the rich and saving lives of poor uninsured people, I choose the latter.
1. Taxing the rich has nothing to do with the price of drugs... or very little. The price of drugs has a LOT to do with big government drug programs that fiddle with the price.
'not private citizens, not you and not me.'
2. New Rule: Don't tell me what I don't care about and I won't tell you what you don't care about. Apparently you want sick people to die. I can say that I do not.
Between not taxing the rich and saving poor people's lives I choose both.
I agree with your 1st statement but do you guys really think the president is raising the taxes on rich people? They will be paying the same amount as they did during the Clinton years, Bush simply gave them tax breaks and Obama is not renewing them.
Also comparing the 2 classes taxes...The poor person overall pays more of their salary to taxes, medicare,SS.. Let's say you make 200k, you pay SS up to 90k from 90k to 200k you don't pay anymore SS into it.. Also compare the deductions of a 200k
Fuck Larry King.
ChewToy89 3 months ago
Penn unfortunately so many of our world leaders or some celebrities do buy into this idea that people are cattle. They do not want people to think for themself that is why religion has been such a major tool of the political.
After all an Atheist can not be president since in order to be president one must be connected to these secret societies. And that means a stupid god belief. It is sad but true. If you make another channel or another site let me know I love hearing your opinion.
PastorIblis 1 year ago
Hi Penn fans. Penn Says videos have been discontinued, so you won't be seeing any new content on here. You can check out our Profile on our Channel Page for more info. We'll still be checking in, so hope to keep chatting with you all! Thanks!
pennsays 1 year ago
penn i love your laugh
macdaddye2k 1 year ago
u look like a monkey.... and sound like one
911Eli 1 year ago
People who believe that you have to tell the masses what to think are the same people who believe the government is the answer to all our problems. It is not a stretch to go from "benevolent government parenting" to "telling the masses what to think". Think for yourself isn't just a cute phrase to tell teenagers who all look/act/smell alike, it's something to practice for your ENTIRE LIFE. Think. Don't accept without questioning. Be yourself and not what someone tells you to be.
mechafenris 2 years ago 7
ibitarians are FAR too simplistic, and take NO account of all the things that ARE being done FOR them, BY the government which "by in large" sees to it that it's done correctly, FOR YOUR BENEFIT. You really want to spend YOUR life seeing to it that, roads, sewer, refuse disposal, police, heathcare, EVERYTHING, is done and done right, all by yourselves?? Tell me you're gonna do all that AND have a meaningful life on top of it all, and I'll get out a mirror and show you a self-deluded fool.
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
No. I don't believe that I can or would do even a fraction of that myself. I believe that if those services were opened up to competition, profit seeking individuals and companies would compete to provide those services.
And they would do it better and cheaper than their government counterparts. You know, like private fire departments, private ambulance companies, private refuse disposal companies, and private defense contractors already do...
StevewithUnited 2 years ago
For profit schools were largely a nightmare, most of the large ones like Edison went bankrupt, but still I see the them touted as "the answer" to crumbling underfunded public schools. : P And WHO sites, builds and manages those landfills, GOVERNMENT, payed by your tax dollars with public hearings given over new sites. Those refuse collectors sponge profit, Gov. pays the big bucks there! Finally, mentioning defense contractors and saving in the same sentence just proves to me your an idealog.
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
Oh, and one other thing, break out your copy of brown-field sites in the United States, and realize that not even 5% of the cost to clean up these sites could be pulled, kicking and screaming from the companies responsible for the contamination in the first place. No well funded government, no clean up! Yeah, "for profit" is the way to get EVERYTHING done best!! PTTTHT! : P
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
If you look at my comment, you'll see that I stuck to my own opinion and easily verifiable facts. (e.g. Private waste companies and private defense contractors exist and operate at a profit.)
You then respond with a depth of argument that can't be contained in a couple 500 character comments. For instance, since you can't cite any references, I have to take all of your myriad "facts" at face value. Being able to state whatever you want as fact is a bad way to argue. Hope you have a nice day.
StevewithUnited 2 years ago
You can't accept an argument based on facts you don't already know!!? Fine, then at least explain the concept of how taking profit from a set amount of proceeds serves to make anything MORE efficient and cost effective than taking NO profit out? Either we're talking the fifth quarter of the pie here or someone isn't being very upfront with the details about what you're NOT getting for your money to cover this difference. That's a pretty simple notion for you, isn't it?
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
The Haliburton and other Defense contractors issues being swept under the rug can't serve as proof, but it should at least raise serious doubts. I just find it hard to fathom a world where profit motivation, without regulation and over-site, would lead to anything besides massive corruption. The financial markets were offered a bit less regulation and the results were a global melt down, with Nobel economist Joseph Stiglitz declaring that the idea of free market economies is a failed concept.
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
Clearly I mis-worded my previous attempt to cut this short. What I am saying is the quoting facts and figures w/out substantiating references is an easy way to bully your way through an argument. If you want to have a debate on that level we need to take it elsewhere.
As to your other point. Chevy makes cars. Toyota makes cars. It is essentially the same product. And yet, Toyota makes more per car sold than Chevy (GM). streamlined process with less waste and superior innovation produces profit.
StevewithUnited 2 years ago
Also, try looking up the American Mail Company. In the 19th century, they challenged the USPS's monopoly on first class parcel delivery and managed to make a profit, by, among other things, cutting waste, reducing prices, and inventing the postage stamp. Eventually they were forced out of business trying to fight the various legal battles brought against them by the USPS and the Fed. Gov't.
StevewithUnited 2 years ago
I will do that, and assuming you aren't just blowing smoke (a reasonable assumption here I think) , I'll concede there are benefits to focusing on systems and streamlining, and that the bully tactic to compete, as practiced in this case by the Gov. are extremely counterproductive. Unfortunately what enforcement mechanisms exist to fend against such practices between rivals, outside what most Libitarians call "waste", a robust regulatory system? Free market mechanisms don't really address this.
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
@RainbowMonkeeMittens "Unfortunately what enforcement mechanisms exist to fend against such practices between rivals, outside what most Libitarians call "waste", a robust regulatory system?"
Looks like someone got lost somewhere along the way... this run on sentence goes nowhere! Nowhere I say! and how did it become a Question all of a sudden?
daPlumber702 1 year ago
Toyota v. Chevy. A fine case in point for your position to be sure, but is this really a commonly practiced case of market success? Salary management and work culture such as seen at Toyota would be unacceptable within many corporations here in the west, and as we've seen, "other" less beneficial means to compete were instead employed. Market forces can also precipitate very poor decision making. You may claim "hey, the winner take all", but don't dismiss how socially disruptive that is.
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
it's quite simple, When you let people, who's own funds depend on what they're doing with others work with others funds, they do a lot better than democratic bureaucrats that get paid to do nothing other than tell people how to do something they have never done before successfully, for the most part at least. It is ridiculous to pay people as much as we do to set laws for us. They really, constitutionally have no right setting in place at all period.
daPlumber702 1 year ago
When you think of all the horrible things people and companies try to get away with even WITH regulation and oversight, and you want to do away with it all together? You're as bad as the communists. Assuming people have the best intentions, no greed, no dishonest intentions, then sure, that system work great, AND no one gets left out in the cold, but you're both dreaming about a would which doesn't and never will exist, so why SHOULD anyone listen to you Libetarians either?
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
Man, how can you be so shortsighted, and so self absorbed!? You honestly believe that everyone can do everything for themselves, and THAT would make them happy?! Spending all their time replicating effort? Believe systems of efficiency are worthless because of a few kinks!? One tiny sample, how much do YOU know about securing heathcare, and how much of your life did you spend understanding what little you DO know! You are dreaming for the nightmare of a dissolved society, and that IS nuts!
RainbowMonkeeMittens 2 years ago
Penn Jilette: You Only Want The Government to control less and less.
zacky89 2 years ago 3
As do I.
SithRage 2 years ago
Dont you think they're would still be issues like segregation if we weren't told what to do i mean i definitly believe in human freedoms ,strongly but you gotta admit the majority of the people you know are idiots and say the stupidest things i mean if more people thought like bem003us people would know jesus is just a story/metephor
Sinamatics 2 years ago 2
Why am I not surprised that Larry King, and apparently many Americans, believe they need someone to tell the masses how to think. Not them of course, but the ignorant masses. The degree of arrogance and conceit it takes to believe such a thing, let alone voice it on national television is astonishing. Meanwhile, his elitist guests, with the exception of Penn, apparently concur. If I were as superior a human being as Larry King or James Carville, I wouldnt need someone to tell me how to think.
ddgallion 2 years ago 3
Penn is right in that the masses need not be told what to think, but when the individual is morally right and the masses (group) is morally wrong, it is necessary for government to reinforce the voice of the individual and allow them to speak (1st amendment). I also believe in the individual, but to a limit. People can be stupid, scared, angry animals, especially in groups acting with a "herd" mentality. This can obviously not be discussed with 500 characters, which is part of the problem today.
bem003us 2 years ago
Edwards-You're bringing up the strawman of Limbaugh- I disagree with Limbaugh on many, many things, and even Penn on a few things. You espouse a typical elitist attitude- "The people are too dumb, so we must enslave them to make them productive". There's no evidence to support otherwise? Why is it that the most prosperous societies are capitalist societies? Because government doesn't fuck with them.
wvmcc82 2 years ago
I agree with Penn to a certain extent, but I think he's perhaps being a bit naieve about the average intelligence level currently operating in the West.
I'd be interested to hear his thoughts regarding the recent decision in Texas to reintroduce the teaching of YEC, something he has ridiculed (rightfully so) on his own show.
EuchridEucrow1 2 years ago
The reason larry said that is because G.W. Bush was hired by us....twice. Larry was probably just expressing the opinion that we deserve competant representation in the white house and it isnt enough to have the right man or woman for the job, you have to make people understand that politicians like Bush are ruining our country....as far as the "individual", the standards of an individual don't matter when its a popularity contest that determines whether they get the job.
sr038 2 years ago
My biggest and most fundamental disagreement with Penn is that he is basically optimistic about humanity, and what he calls "The Individual", and I am not.
To think like he does, you have to believe that the average person is intelligent, competent, and responsible, and I can't. Not in the face of so much evidence to the contrary.
LordOmberus 2 years ago 2
Thank you! Every time I listen to Penn and libertarians in general talk, I just don't see why they think individual people are that smart. You see people fucking up all the time, ruining their own lives and the lives of others, and it's not the government's fault they did it.
libertykillingcons 2 years ago
People who think Libertarians are too optimistic about the individual don't really understand what we're getting at. Failure seems to be a huge taboo these days, but I'd argue that it is an integral and essential aspect of true individual freedom. I've never once heard Penn say that given freedom nobody would fuck up, so anyone calling him overly optimistic is drawing conclusions out of thin air.
martiansuccessor 2 years ago
I think the idea that "somebody has to tell the masses how to think" is what drives a large percentage of journalists and opinion makers like Larry King.
This is the reason media bias exists. I think most people go into journalism to fulfill a desire to communicate "the truth" to everyone.
mmsayre 2 years ago
Just watched the CNN interview; Seems like Mr. King had a moment of complete honesty there; a Freudian slip so to say. Either that, or they're just getting bolder.
omegis13 2 years ago
Oh yeah, not to mention that a good chunk of the news media believes "Telling the masses what to think" is their job, not just merely informing them.
Call it the vision of the anointed. The press corps' arrogance astonishes me sometimes.
wvmcc82 2 years ago
Yes Penn, a lot of people in this country think the Proletariat needs a voice in the hands of the soft, cuddly hands of big government.
After all, they're too dumb to think for themselves aren't they?
People really need to read 1984
wvmcc82 2 years ago
"After all, they're too dumb to think for themselves aren't they?"
Yes, unfortunately. A good chunk of the population is too dumb to think for themselves. Libertarians have an overly optimistic view of the individual, which has NO evidence to support it.
johnedwards1968 2 years ago
No, sorry. Lots of people sleepwalk their lives in ignorance, which gives the appearance of laziness/stupidity, but that's the fault of the big government notion in the first place. And it's funny how everybody assumes that everbody else is irresponsible! Remember that human beings existed without state health care for 99% of our time on this planet, and the biggest slaughters, massacres and genocides occured in the time of the organised centralised state. Let's take control of our own lives...
ghedebrav 2 years ago
Organised centralised state???? LOL I'd love to see the definition on that one! Just about any government right down to the municipal fits that description.
johnedwards1968 2 years ago
ok, Penn, how is individual freedom of thought effected negatively by socialized healthcare? It would stand to reason that it would give people who had less more choice in their healthcare concerns. I beleive in the same freedoms you do, but not only for the wealthy.
lordkol666 2 years ago
That's just down right authoritarian.
Fuck that.
sittingbull09 2 years ago
Yeah, individual healthcare... Buy our own MRI machine or pay 5k to use one. In Australia it is practically free and we still have one of the strongest economies left standing.
Of the 11 AA ranked banks left in the world we have 4 of them.
"Socialism" and big government have ruined us... yeah right
yyuryyub 2 years ago 2
Humans are not absolutely moral or correct. And to think that they, as a group, will choose the best option is absurd. Most of the world is not Atheist, yet Atheism is the truth. We ELECT leaders because it is better to put intelligent people in charge than risk having a popular vote or a random group selected from the public. Furthermore, many people do not form their own ideas. For many people, ideas are provided, and they pick those that are entertaining and fit their initial schema.
jamesjohnsonjunior 2 years ago 2
Having someone to tell the masses how to think is an espousal of monarchy. Democracy is the antithesis of that. As the lessons of history fade from the consciousness of society, the mistakes of history are once again repeated. Study the history of the late Roman republic if you want to find out what Deja Vu is all about.
The tragedy of human nature is that wisdom and experience are not inherited but must be earned anew by each generation.
leereyno 2 years ago 2
"Having someone to tell the masses how to think is an espousal of monarchy. Democracy is the antithesis of that."
That sounds very nice in theory, and if you only apply it to government, it's probably even correct. Ask the millions of "dittoheads" out there, how much their independant thought is really worth! Hell, ask them if they disagree with Limbaugh on ANYTHING!
johnedwards1968 2 years ago
If the ideas and policies that that Limbaugh promotes are so demonstrably wrong, then how about addressing them and explaining their shortcomings instead of whining about the supposed lack of intelligence on the part of his listeners.
If the truth is on your side, speak up!
leereyno 2 years ago 7
Hi Penn:)
GreatestPotential 2 years ago
This is the fundamental difference between libertarian and anarchist thought and the thoughts of fascists, socialists, etc.
Individuals can think for themselves and don't require the forced input of their "leaders."
Fascists, socialists, and assorted Republocrats will tell you that everyone (except you, they like YOU) is stupid and needs to be told what to do.
Thanks, Larry King, for proving that the elites are out there and they are watching over us.
PHenry500 2 years ago 2
A person is intelligent... People are stupid. ;)
Never underestimate the power of stupidity in large groups...
And more antisocial one-liners that sum this video up... :P
Plus, Larry King is an asshole, but he's right... The majority in this country are so intellectually and emotionally sensitive that they HAVE TO be instructed how to live (MTV, Nickelodeon, Disney, Mainstream Media), and would turn into a babbling puddle of crying mucous if they didn't have said instruction...
- CK
CeeKayz0rz 2 years ago
You need to learn about the wisdom of crowds. Go look it up, seriously. It is the basis of market economies, true democracies, and every other successful institution or approach to a problem that is based upon each individual making choices and acting independently of others.
leereyno 2 years ago
Penn, you are a worthy role model.
batbawls 2 years ago
Penn has great perception into what is right.
pretorious700 2 years ago
its soo sad that people believe that. and that they would push it on t.v.? how many people think they need a leader now because of larry king?
andyrexik 2 years ago
i am told that i should think that this video is stupid, but i was never a good follower.
this video is great!
dothebedn 2 years ago
As a card carrying member of "the masses," I reserve the right not to be told by anyone else how I should think. Thanks, anyway, Larry.
wavymavy 2 years ago
Percentage of death is 100%. Penn is great. I bet he'd be mean to me in person, but I love the act, the Libertarian stuff, the Bulls**t Show, etc. It'd be worth the derision to listen to what he has to say.
captainarchernx01 2 years ago
This is YouTube, you won't get spanked by a nun for fully spelling out "Bullshit".
valcaron 2 years ago
Right you are, valcaron, but i guess I have been trained to self censor. Free speech is dying in America, and I may be helping that happen. Forgive my non-honest typing.
captainarchernx01 2 years ago
People have different wants in life. Some want to get up and make something, anything of their life, and some want to go to work in the day and make enough to feed the kids and get drunk. The first lot we are more likely to meet the second lot dont want to have to bother with all the decision making and progression of life.
It was an eye opener to find that the second lot do exist. We have factory floors full of them. These are "the masses" that Larry King is talking about.
Sp666ky 2 years ago
Well that's pretty elitist of you.
femmiefmme 2 years ago
It doesn't matter who Larry King or you think "the masses" are. It doesn't matter if those individuals who make up the masses think of themselves as a speck in a mass of mindless drones. Each person has 42,048,000 minutes worth of experiences and thoughts and feelings and when you say things like "someone has to tell the masses what to think" you've just marginalized everyone in favor of yourself, one of the masses.
petknitter 2 years ago
I agree. Telling them how to think is wrong. However "the masses" don't want to bother with finances and careers and paperwork and so on. They want someone to take that out of their hands so that they can get on with what they want in life. Having talked to them they don't have a clue about how to fill in a tax return or how much the interest on their store card actually means.
I am not saying anyone is better than any one else. I am saying people want different things in life.
Sp666ky 2 years ago
So people want to be told how to think on many issues?
(i'm not being mean spirited, just curious)
sample45 2 years ago
Some people don't want to think at all about such issues at all.
Though I think his suggestion of thought controle , was either badly phrased or he is the nutter that everyone is up in arms about.
Sp666ky 2 years ago
I'm feeling American right now. So here it goes. -It must be great having Sony as your sponsor or distributor thing, anyone heard of bluray?? Sony's where the money's at. Penn probably invented bluray. Think about it.
storytellerjack22 2 years ago
Ok so here's the deal many conservatives are against nanny state but still wanna tell people how to live and interfere in thier lives especially in America. I am referring to the religious right though I guess they are a dying breed
MusicJew158 2 years ago
"though I guess they are a dying breed " I hope so.
atheelogos 2 years ago
Mini-archic libertarians are useful for debates. If you have a libertarian on your side in a debate you are guaranteed to win. There brand of realism and skepticism is useful criticism, but they never offer any fucking solutions. All they say is the "free market will take care of it" . Libertarians are simply good at mental masturbation. For these reasons, I consider myself a libertarian.
TheNihilAdvocate 2 years ago
I am absolutely shocked that Larry King would say that. I know that it is an underlying assumption behind all the Left and Right versions of big Government and the Nanny State, but I always assumed most people weren't aware that the belief was there. (People are often unaware of all aspects of their own beliefs.) Stating it so blatantly seems to go against all American orthodoxy.
kittyprydekissme 2 years ago
Larry King is fucked up.
therugdoctoranimesux 2 years ago
Blah, blah, nanny state, blah, blah, liberals suck, blah, blah, let the free market decide who eats, blah, blah ...
freestuffffff 2 years ago 2
Nanny state sucks, In New Zealand where I live we just got rid of our old Nanny State authoritation Left Wing government at our last election in '08, Life is so much better when you don't have the government telling you how to live.
shreddakj 2 years ago
I fully believe we should have full free health care and education at the collegiate, graduate and post graduate level.
We already take care of our own health care, we are forced to in this capitalistic society.
It is ironic that all of these wishy washy liberals are jumping on the healthcare bandwagon after decades and decades of non commitment in order to maintain campaign fodder, much like legal merijuana.
I dont like the means but I hope to meet the ends.
Dejoblue 2 years ago
I watch this interview several times now and Larry King NEVER said that. WTF are you talking about?
fathead8489 2 years ago
Not everything said makes it to air. It's called Editing.
Eban11235 2 years ago
Actually, it's called "Larry King LIVE".
fathead8489 2 years ago
Penn,
The average American is already in debt the day they are born. I don't understand how you think it's possible for the individual to take care of themselves in your current private health care system, VERY few people can afford an average health care bill. So you're assumption that people can take care of themselves in this regard is wrong.
In the same way the everyone cannot afford to protect themselves from thieves and such, so we have a consensus that police are needed....
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
What is so different about paying police for protection and paying hospitals for health-care with taxes?
They are clearly both necessary, the health of a society has dramatic effects on it's economy, it's education, and it's overall success.
You think that people should have to pay for the ills they acquire while existing in your society?
Penn I think you need to go back and read John Locke's social contract, and really understand it.
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
The difference is the amount of money that is involved, governments can barely do what they are doing now.
akira117 2 years ago
You mean funding a war is more important? Of course they can do it... many countries have.
It's been done.
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
Excellent identification about the unwholesome nature of pragmatism.
jwoodswce 2 years ago
Rugged individualism worked really well on the American frontier, mostly because you were miles away from anyone else. But as soon as those frontiersmen got neighbors, it became much more collective. Why? Because there is advantage in working as a group. Groups can accomplish what individuals cannot.
We put way too much stock in the individual in America. Times have long since changed.
jergsden 2 years ago
He's not saying that we shouldn't rely on eachother and associate with eachother. He's simply arguing that we should all be "individuals" in an intellectual sense. Too much agreement between people leads to herd mentality. It feeds itself and eventually becomes a rationalization. Yes groups can accomplish what individuals cannot, but when groups try to compel individuals it becomes analogous to a bear dancing with an ant. The ant will realize it's a bad idea long before the bear does....
tkwelge 2 years ago
When I think of Larry King, the first thing I'll always think of is his Brando interview and how awful he (King) was.
sserpent21 2 years ago
Great video!!
"If everybody is thinking the same, sombody isn't thinking"
troybr79 2 years ago
penn wants to force taxation?
thisisfunah 2 years ago
"You don't need a weatherman
To know which way the wind blows..."
"Don't follow leaders
Watch the parking meters,,,"
morddas 2 years ago
"You have to have someone to tell them masses how to think"
This is a very scary statement, which, unfortunately is increasingly common to hear from the elite.
It's not just stupid, its downright dangerous.
freedom3001 2 years ago
penn I,v said it before ill say it again i love you
ragekage52 2 years ago
Penn keep on doing what you do, and speaking truth, if that makes you the enemy then embrace it. Someone has to stand for the truth, for logic and reason because left and right seem incapable of it.
LeGioNoFZioN 2 years ago
you do not need a voice to tell the masses how to think as long as the masses are fully informed of all facts.
louisanthony33 2 years ago
well on one hand, 2+2=4, regardless of free thought, so yes there is room for "my way or the highway" but even still, your right on.
medievalman86 2 years ago
You're totally right Penn as usual, but the more that people in areas of any power (like Larry King) say and think that there are masses to control, the more you'll have masses that will form to be controled. For so many people, it's easier to just follow along then to think about either side, that's why we only have two main parties in our government, it's easier for people to just vote for the 'side' they're on then to understand what each and every person could bring to the table and do.
lnthebackrow 2 years ago
Unfortunately, the 'masses' *want* to be told how to think. They don't care what they believe as long as everyone else believes it too.
rafaravioli 2 years ago
Mr. Jillette, thank you for saying what needs to be said amidst a cloud of conflation in our media. I almost weep when I hear the doublespeak these days.
I'm by no means an atheist, but that is irrelevant. Keep on keeping on, stalwart voice!!!
hijinx1980 2 years ago 2
P.S. Penn you're starting to sound like a pussy. Quit apologizing for your views, it's every other A-hole who should be a apologizing, especially silly old elitist codgers in suspenders.
dorbie 2 years ago
Wow, that old corpse Larry said that?What a sad fuck!
dorbie 2 years ago
Yes, yes forced taxation is the answer. You should have an obligation to people you don't know because you're a selish asshole who'd rather let people die than part with 5 cents.
dechha1981 2 years ago 2
I think you should redo your math. Also your thinking people are going to die anyway. My "forced" Donation is not going to help or harm either way. You people really have lost your minds.
jsh78mang 2 years ago
Someone has to tell the masses how to think? WTF???!!! What the hell kind of Fascist Authoritaria rhetoric is that?
dechha1981 2 years ago
I'm 22 years old and instead of having a normal life I'm consistently paying medical bills for a very rare condition. I'm starting an (overpriced) drug that costs some $400k per year indefinitely. I am also unemployed because there are no jobs available, and I'm not sitting on millions. I can not take care of this on my own...
minionsengage 2 years ago
problem is will this actually help or hurt you. The Government may decide that your not worth the money due to certain things. Surely you realize that not every one or every condition will be taken care of it would bankrupt this country. I agree for free health care for those who need it but honestly I' am not that weak that I need somneone else to run my affairs. Nor do I want it.
jsh78mang 2 years ago
I hate it when I accidentally "2 star" a video this good.
schulwitz 2 years ago
If you blow lightly into Larry King's left ear, a ploom of dust will emerge from the right.
Neilsama 2 years ago
If you want to suggest somebody is stupid your message is considerably weakened when you can't spell.
MartinJWillett 2 years ago
Oh, bite me. I misspelled plume. I noticed you don't know where to put commas.
Neilsama 2 years ago
Lol you got pwned.
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
Hey!, what the hell is wrong with Will Rogers?
PhilPoling 2 years ago
Good to hear...
...on pragmatism though, I would like to say I don't think anyone should reject simply "what works", but there should be conditions, ie "what works" for society as a whole but screws me individually might not meet those conditions
oober349 2 years ago
Penn, I love your stage performances and witty banter, aswell as your ability to speak your mind rationally and sometimes revolutionary.
However, in this day and age, it would take 10 Penn and Tellers to even come CLOSE to matching the stage tricks and slight of hand of the federal government, and those who seek to cut a slice of the country for themselves.
Its a shame too, considering they dont take a page from you guys, and show us how it was done without their conscience getting in the way.
SharpShooter78 2 years ago
a leader telling the masses how to think? isn't that what stalin and hitler wanted? what is happening to this country?
NoSweatJonny 2 years ago
...exactly what stalin and hitler wanted.
anonazero 2 years ago
i think someone needs to introduce larry king to at least two writings... "Self-reliance" by Emerson, and "Resistance to Civil Government" by Thoreau.
johnstall5350 2 years ago
Liberals think that most people are stupid children and need to be managed.Its disrespectful...theres gotta be an instinct behind this behavior(mothering?)
Thereminator101 2 years ago 2
Penn, I think the problem is that many of these people do not have a love for individuals. Not on any level. Personal, intellectual, or otherwise. The fact that they are so limited to trying to meet conventional norms instead of going for what is really right and good is strong evidence of that.
ncommons 2 years ago 3
It's really easy for one of life's big winners to think the game is great the way it is. But why do you think life has to suck so hard for people who just try to work regular jobs? The rich wouldn't be rich if they didn't have poorly paid people doing all the work for them.
bunnasoo2 2 years ago
thats not true, my grandad has a successful roofing company, and is rich, no one did shit for him, he started with his dads 2 seat pickup truck and a bag of tools, he worked for what he has
ChocoboTheftAuto 2 years ago
yyeah, sorry pal. im sure theres some out there who get verrry bad karma and the like, but when some people get a handout, everyone does...alot of people who shouldnt have things handed to em. and that isnt the democracy I was born, raised and taught in.
SharpShooter78 2 years ago
You have to tell the masses how to think. That is truly scarry because so many are willing to be told how to think. You say there are 300,000,000 diff opinions but think about it. How many people are followers? How many people truly believe Obama will save us? SCARRY. Penn, you are getting people to think for themselves. I thank you for that!! Keep it up. Good Day!!!
shananagans5 2 years ago 2
Larry King is a sheep just like the unfortunate majority of the public.
GuineaJay 2 years ago
I love how you said "it's perfectly moral to hope anything you want". I've felt very strongly on this point, but so many people seem to disagree with me. I think if the average person searched their feelings they'd realise how much sense it makes, but people are so caught up in seeming moral, that if they hear someone explicitly say they hope something bad happens to somebody else, their immediate response is to act outraged, even though hoping doesn't make something any more likely!
padraic2001eire 2 years ago
The phrase "someone has to tell the masses how to think" scares the ever-loving crap out of me... It could be meant in some VERY dark and scary ways. I like to think Larry King isn't going to be our next overlord, but after phrases like that, I'm a little nervous.
tybo09 2 years ago 2
It worries me that everyone in the media think that way. that they think "the masses" can't or shouldn't figure things out for themselves. it is disturbing to me that they feel they should tell us how to think and feel.
stodluke 2 years ago
As Larry King is such a central player in the media, and thus is one of the people who DOES tell the masses how to think, or does his very best to influence them, I'd be quite suprised if he didn't hold that view, to be honest.
Nuckpang 2 years ago
Yes, if individuals can take care of their own healthcare, if they can afford it. But woah to that Larry King comment about the masses needing someone telling them how to think. I consider myself Liberal, but not that far left.
RantyChris 2 years ago
Tell the masses how to think.
Sieg Hail! Sieg Hail! Sieg Hail!!!!
luxordeathbed 2 years ago
Penn is very wrong.
xxxDeadheartxxx 2 years ago
There are over 300million opinions in the United States, but only -I- am correct all of the time, IMHO. ;)
(that's a joke, don't get bent)
Bucknik 2 years ago
Larry King's statement is evil on so many levels.
And the fact that Larry King, one of the most watched people in American media, came out with that statement should raise some red flags to people about how biased our media is.
Sadly I think most in the media share is opinion." Screw truth and objectivity, lets tell them how they should think about this."
Scary thing is that Larry just admits it like that.
NYSeano 2 years ago
all news media has an agenda..fox news wants you to think conservative and cnbc and cnn try to make u think liberal..thats why i dont watch the news...i get most of my news from the internet...i dont like to think the news station im watching is trying to make me think a certain way...so i dont watch it
ProudAtheist90 2 years ago
The problem is not individuals, it's masses. As you, Penn, and you, people who will read my comment, probably noticed, we're quite stupid while in a group. Not necessarily a few friends, but a big group.
And, most of the time, the leader of the group is the craziest of the bunch.
It's sad, but I think it's only the fear of being rejected by other people that makes us act like that.
FrederickCross 2 years ago
Health care costs are 15% of the USA GDP. Some examples from public health care systems: Japan 5%
Canada 10.6%
Australia 8.8%
France 11.2%
If public health care is so inefficient, why are they spending less and receiving more care? Other measures such as per capita spending yield similar disparities.
dootdbc 2 years ago 3
"If public health care is so inefficient, why are they spending less and receiving more care? "
Several reasons. First, because the level of care in the US is much better than in any of the nations which you've listed. Second, because the US right now has the worst possible systems - socialized medicine for the poor, while everyone else competes in the free market. They need to pick one and stick with it. I'd go with pure capitalism, but either one would be better than what they have now.
c6gunner 2 years ago
"The level of care in the US is much better than in any of the nations which you've listed"
We have lower lifespans and higher infant mortality rates than all countries listed. The level of care per dollar is much lower than that of the countries I have listed.
"I'd go with pure capitalism"
The open market of health care would deny millions coverage to drive up profits. Insurance would only be given to the healthiest individuals to keep rates low, etc. Such a market would fail if it existed.
dootdbc 2 years ago
"We have lower lifespans and higher infant mortality rates than all countries listed."
Which has to do with how statistics are gathered, and not with how effective the medical system is. Infant mortality statistics, in particular, are very misleading due to how infant mortality is defined. Do some research.
"The level of care per dollar is much lower than that of the countries I have listed."
I've already acknowledged that, and explained why. Thanks for agreeing with me.
c6gunner 2 years ago
In Cuba they abort problem fetuses to avoid a higher mortality rate. Hows that for better mortality rates? And how could insurance companies stay in business if they do not serve enough people to cover overhead? Most firmsdto not exist catering to a select few but instead the whole market. I wish more people bothered to study economics before they claim "such a market would fail."
SSSLLLAAYYEEERRRR 2 years ago
Why hasnt Mcdonalds stopped serving food for low prices? And why does Walmart have low prices? hmm
fps0chris 2 years ago
I realize many people believe that infant mortality and life expectancy are irrelevant.
Regardless, the USA is not "much better" than countries with national health care in other health care indicators such as breast cancer mortality rate, cervical cancer mortality rate, heart attack fatality rate, etc
"Most firmsdto not exist catering to a select few but instead the whole market. "
Firms already in this pseudo free market deny people everyday due to high risk from preexisting health issues
dootdbc 2 years ago
Why hasnt Mcdonalds stopped serving food for low prices? And why does Walmart have low prices? hmm
"Most firmsdto not exist catering to a select few but instead the whole market."
Coverage is denied to people every day. Then an emergency room treats someone who is near death instead of when the treatment was most appropriate. This added cost is passed onto the consumer.
dootdbc 2 years ago
because dumbass, Mcdonald and Walmart buy bulk product at huge discounts and pass it on to the consumer you and I. Where healthcare cost so much because of the Insurance Industry and the Federal, State and Local Governments negotiating discount prices for the service the doctor provides. So the doctor has to make money in the deal in order to stay in business therefore over priced his/her service to make a profit of of the insurance and Government health care.
Chew on that one for a bit
kcanova 2 years ago
Better service for the few doesn't mean the nations' system is better off.
Care for all no matter the quality is a better system than better service for the few.
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
"Better service for the few doesn't mean the nations' system is better off.
Care for all no matter the quality is a better system than better service for the few."
That's idiotic. According to that logic, the medical system of an African tribe in which everyone gets to have the Witch Doctor shake his rattle at them is superior to the US medical system.
Please, think a little before you comment.
c6gunner 2 years ago
If you think a witch doctor is the equivalent of a system payed for by the tax payer. Than the only idiot here is you.
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
"A corporation making a profit is a different story, and you know it."
No, it's not. Even if it were, doctors aren't corporations. Since we were discussing the medical system, I'm not sure why you're going off on a tangent.
"... is the equivalent of a system payed for by the tax payer. Than the only idiot here is you."
HAH. Way to make our education system look like a joke.
Free tip: making grammar and spelling mistakes while calling someone an idiot makes you look REALLY stupid.
c6gunner 2 years ago
The last words of someone who has lost an argument and has nothing left to say; "Free tip: making grammar and spelling mistakes while calling someone an idiot makes you look REALLY stupid. "
I didn't realize this was English class. I'm sure you know what I meant, and if you didn't, as I'm sure might have been the case. Then I suggest you enroll yourself in an accredited college and learn something.
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
"The last words of someone who has lost an argument and has nothing left to say ..."
No, dumbass - those would be the closing words of someone who's just finished decimating your argument, and is enjoying a laugh at your expense.
"I'm sure you know what I meant"
Yeah, I knew what you meant. Unsurprisingly, though, YOU managed to miss MY point. Don't worry, though - more intelligent people than you are laughing right along with me.
c6gunner 2 years ago
Mostly because the main problem with a private system is is HAS TO GENERATE A PROFIT.
A private entity's only goal is to make money, if it's not making money, it's not successful.
To make a profit off an illness is despicable, at best. The people defending it clearly don't have a clue of what they speak.
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
"To make a profit off an illness is despicable, at best."
And this comment is even stupider. Profit is the driving force behind most human endeavor. If it wasn't for those evil doctors looking to make a profit, you wouldn't HAVE access to health care.
Any of you idiots who think that free health care is some sort of a human right, go out into the middle of a forest, and break your leg. See whether mother nature provides for you.
c6gunner 2 years ago
I live in Canada, and yes people make salaries based on their positions.
A corporation making a profit is a different story, and you know it.
Don't try to feed me your bullshit.
I'm not arguing it's a human right, but it's something every decent tax-paying citizen should desire. If you want police, and education, why not health care?
BenjaminFranklin2u 2 years ago
Isn't that the whole point of religion, telling the masses how to think? Seems to me it is.
puzzhead67 2 years ago
jiggaboo904:
"Libertarians = Anarchists"
I have a special disdain for Anarchists of all stripes, through and through, left and right alike.
They are the epitome of the pipe dreaming idealism that I despise so much, the sort that prefers ideological romantism to actually improving things in the real world.
To me that's the real decadence.
TheSockWithNoName 2 years ago
Libertarian Party lectures people about individuality, and then they go on to say that they should be at the helm of government. The are such hypocrite.
If you are investing at all in the idea of government then you believe in forcing innocent peoples lives at the point of a gun. Listen to a Libertarian's excuses for government. In the end they sound just like any fascist or communist.
Libertarians know the government is evil and they choose it anyway. What does that say about them?
Cailwyn 2 years ago
It would appear that Larry is thinking the way that someone told him to!
The god tells the Pope, the Pope tells the president, the president tells the congress, and the congress tells us. I think Larry may have something there!! It looks like that's what is going on now.
DustyMay1944 2 years ago
i love the way you laugh xD
ya19375 2 years ago
Most of the problems in society that I can see, I mean literally that I can see in my neighborhood with my friends, it has to do with someone telling whole lot of people whats best for them, in the neighborhood example, the person making statement of course as always does not live in the neighborhood and in fact has no need to say anything. It's a certain type of person that want's to control others, and then there are others who want to stop them from being controlled.
UrinationNation 2 years ago
The masses don't think, they're pure activity guided by somehing.
liscraudjo 2 years ago
jiggaboo904:
"If I choose to be "antisocial I should be allowed"
No, you are not allowed to be a pathological agent in my society. Sorry.
If you don't the moral obligations living in a society entails, go live in the fricken woods by yourself.
TheSockWithNoName 2 years ago
you lefties are such control freaks....live and let live why don't you
Sixthick66 2 years ago
Sadly, Penn's individualism is laughed at. "You have to have someone to tell the masses how to think." Wow. We don't all feel that way, Penn. Trust me on that.
pitbull103 2 years ago
good video
IhaveTubes 2 years ago
Individuals taking care of their own health care? Individuals can't even take of having a credit card, balance their check book or even take care of their own retirement...So why would you even think they are capable of this?
Less government in healthcare may sound like it would lessen your costs but it would also raise your deaths..Who enforces and restricts drugs that may cure an infection but gives you cancer. Healthcare goes up because 1)its a business 2)malpractice insurance from lawsuits
funeralsong34 2 years ago
Who are these individuals you are talking about?
Me and most people I know can do all of what you mentioned.
Maybe I have competent friends, but I doubt they are any different then most individuals.
I know there are people out there than can't manage shit, but why should we base how our country runs on the bottom 10% of people?
lambedan 2 years ago
I doubt the number is 10%, I doubt very much that you don't have a relative or a friend who racked up large credit card bills... I've had friends whose parents were a doctor and teacher and their son was a complete idiot when it came to money. How many people were taken by Bernie Madoff for billions, A person can be smart but people are stupid and to honestly think the world only has 10% stupid is naive. Heres a question why do I have to pay for schools when I have no kids and don't plan on it?
funeralsong34 2 years ago
Should we have government own our credit card companies then? Do our banking for us? Handle our retirement? Perhaps they should own my favourite local restaurant in case it goes out of business. It's called a slippery slope.
Computers are a business, their costs go down. Cell phones are a business, their costs go down. Coffee is a business, but their costs do not rise beyond inflation. Healthcare, however, has had a steady increase in costs. Why is this? I would argue price fixing by gov't.
reefpirate 2 years ago
Wrong analogy, computers, cell phones are products not a business..Those products haven't went down in prices my 1st cell phone cost $150 and my latest cost $260 Its like buying a 2009 car for 20k in 2009 or buying a 2009 car in 2010 for 18K ,both or new but new incoming products drove the price down not private business.. Just like new technology will drive down the price for old tech. Everything costs more and continues to increase in value.. Houses, cars, food haven't went up for last 10 yrs?
funeralsong34 2 years ago
I love how Penn admits in this video that he DOESN'T CARE ABOUT WHAT WORKS, he only cares about his dogma, no matter how unrealistic and ineffectual it is.
There you have it. That's why I have to laugh every time Penn talks about his "morals"... because they are not supposed to have any relation to the real world at all, they are just intellectual masturbation.
He doesn't care about actual consequences in the real world.
Yeah, Penn, caring about REALITY is pretty decadent, isn't it?
TheSockWithNoName 2 years ago
Perhaps you can explain how you can get moral value out of 'what works'?
Too many uninsured people? Too many sick people? Let's round them all up and ship them to Cuba, or cook them in ovens. Why not? It works! Problem solved! If this is your moral standard, then I implore you to find a better one.
And I'll try just once on this dogma thing. Dogma would be: Penn: 'Socialized medicine is bad. Why? Because I said so.' I've never heard Penn argue like this. He uses reason.
reefpirate 2 years ago
reefpirate:
"Too many uninsured people? Too many sick people? Let's round them all up and ship them to Cuba, or cook them in ovens. Why not? It works!"
Let's take your strawman argument seriously for one second: what would be the best way to solve this issue, to genocide uninsured sick people, to expatriate them or to pay for their treatment?
Assuming you picked the latter, do you or don't you think the well-being of fellow humans is more important than not taxing the rich?
TheSockWithNoName 2 years ago
reefpirate:
You're probably gonna come with the same BS Libertarian rationalizations, like "if the guv'ment didn't tax the riches, all medicines would magically become super cheap and all diseases would be magically be cured".
No. The truth is poor, uninsured sick people die and no one cares. Not the farmaceutical companies, not private citizens, not you and not me.
Between not taxing the rich and saving lives of poor uninsured people, I choose the latter.
TheSockWithNoName 2 years ago
1. Taxing the rich has nothing to do with the price of drugs... or very little. The price of drugs has a LOT to do with big government drug programs that fiddle with the price.
'not private citizens, not you and not me.'
2. New Rule: Don't tell me what I don't care about and I won't tell you what you don't care about. Apparently you want sick people to die. I can say that I do not.
Between not taxing the rich and saving poor people's lives I choose both.
reefpirate 2 years ago 2
I agree with your 1st statement but do you guys really think the president is raising the taxes on rich people? They will be paying the same amount as they did during the Clinton years, Bush simply gave them tax breaks and Obama is not renewing them.
Also comparing the 2 classes taxes...The poor person overall pays more of their salary to taxes, medicare,SS.. Let's say you make 200k, you pay SS up to 90k from 90k to 200k you don't pay anymore SS into it.. Also compare the deductions of a 200k
funeralsong34 2 years ago