;) Isn't that supposed to be "low draw down" method? I do this kind of work all the time. The pros to sampling this way is it's "more scientific" and there's less water to dispose of, but in my opinion bailing a well up to 3 casing volumes and waiting for a 90% recovery makes for a better sample. Although, bailing 3 well volumes out of a deep well sucks
yes the drawdown is supposed to be 10 cm or less, so low draw down may be a better term. I am old school too and would prefer to bail 3 well volumes; plus you only need an $8 bailer. This is also what I used to do.
@Backyardmech1 I started out using a bailer in Georgia. I am in Florida now and I use the low flow sampling procedure. I like it better. When using a bailer you stress the aquifer so much that it pulls contamination into the well via high turbidity. The low flow is designed NOT stress the aquifer. The result is lower turbidity and a more accurate result from the lab. turbidity is the main cause of high concentrations in groundwater when sampling for VOC's and/or Metals.
in Canada it is the sampler's choice, this site already met CL/AW and I was sampling for a 0.01 ppb benzo(a)pyrene drinking water standard, i.e. groundwater is okay to touch at this site.
A LaMotte 2020 is just an instrument with a 10mL vial you fill up and place in the device to measure turbidity. I use it in conjunction with the YSI 556 or a Hana 9828.
The Hana 9828 is a neat muloti-parameter probe in the sense it only has a 100 mL flow through cell.
Had an issue with a YSI 556 this morning and was down for the day. If you ever see a -9.99 deg C, a negative cond. and a -99.9% DO you have a bad cable!!!
Yes it would have dumped the tubing water back into the well, but I pumped three well volumes after this anyway so it would have been pumped back out as purge water. Yes the drawdown is supposed to be less than 1/3 a foot or 10 cm. These were actually standpipes completed into gravel / sand so there was little drawdown, but we are also supposed to pump at about 200 ml per minute max. I use a 1 lite bottle to measure this so I adjust till I get 5 min to fill it for 200 ml per minute.
That's what I use to do also. Then I just bought a graduated 500 mL cylinder and just use it. If you get one get the napthelene. They don't break as easy.
BTW, the job site I'm on right now...if I pumped 3 well volumes on some of these wells I'd be pumping over 1500 liters! So we only do 1 tubing volume and then wait for stablization on this site.
And from what I've read, low flow purging isn't just about the low flow but about draw down in the well. We use 0.3 ft. but I think it's 0.1 m. for the rest of the world.
I have had wells that I was flowing at 0.1 L a minute and still had greater than 0.3 ft. of draw down in the well which technically violates low flow purging protocol. Going to have to go pull out my Puls and Barcelonia and read up.
I am really curious, is a "LaMotte 2020" a peristaltic pump type? I have only used this geopump for low flow sampling. And thanks for the comments! Have a good Sunday. I am sitting here scaling pictures for figures for a Stage 1 presently, have a great day!
You do know that when you opened up your pump to show the rotating wheels you dumped all the water in the tubing back down the well right? If we did that we would have to start all over again for turbidity if you were actually measuring for it. We use a LaMotte 2020 for turbidity because I hate turbidity sensors in flow through cells.
Glad you liked it Eddie. Are you doing oilfield or related cleanups? I did a few Stage 2's in Ft. St. John a few years back. If you or your outfit needs personnel I am available on about a half time basis. Have a good day eddie!
Low flow sampling seems to be a little different in the USA. We have a compressor that hooks up to a car's battery. From the compressor, an air line is connected to a regulator with QED being a common brand. These two items seem to be combined into one "box" in your case. The cylinder your probe goes into is very stubby compared to most of the set ups I have seen. However your YSI and Solinst water level meter are very familiar to us in the states.
Groundwater is very shallow in southern BC generally allowing us to just use a peristaltic pump which is only good to about 30 feet or less groundwater depth. Your setup with a compressor will probably draw water from 80 too 100 feet or more. I am old fashioned and much prefer sampling with a bailer or Waterra tubing, its faster and less expensive. Groundwater sampling with these new low methods is only to minimize silt content.
In my experience dissolved metals are significantly lower in conncentration with low flow sampling, as are LEPH and BTEX values. I heard on oil company consultant boast at a conference once "I can make a 1000 ppb LEPH groundwater sample pass the 500 ppb standard with low flow sampling". Does your compressor / QED setup volatilize the sample?
At pine environmental in Burnaby BC, it a rental! They are great too, good service! I have used the pump to mix and inject organo-sulphur as well - it is slow but very rugged and works well in the pouring rain, which is the usual BC weather! I gather you're in the business or you wouldn't recognize it! Have a good one!
There's another company we rent from that has even better pumps that the Geo. Ashted has the older MasterFles pumps with internal battery that rather good but Field Environmental has a newer typ pump similar to the MasterFlex Pump that is newer in design and just awesome! I've gone all day sampling without the battery dying on me.
All day on one battery! This would rock. I did some 10 wells one day and we borrowed a car battery to finish off, we could charge the batteries fast enough. I'll google "Field Environmental"
;) Isn't that supposed to be "low draw down" method? I do this kind of work all the time. The pros to sampling this way is it's "more scientific" and there's less water to dispose of, but in my opinion bailing a well up to 3 casing volumes and waiting for a 90% recovery makes for a better sample. Although, bailing 3 well volumes out of a deep well sucks
Backyardmech1 1 year ago
yes the drawdown is supposed to be 10 cm or less, so low draw down may be a better term. I am old school too and would prefer to bail 3 well volumes; plus you only need an $8 bailer. This is also what I used to do.
RockinJoeDavis 1 year ago
@Backyardmech1 I started out using a bailer in Georgia. I am in Florida now and I use the low flow sampling procedure. I like it better. When using a bailer you stress the aquifer so much that it pulls contamination into the well via high turbidity. The low flow is designed NOT stress the aquifer. The result is lower turbidity and a more accurate result from the lab. turbidity is the main cause of high concentrations in groundwater when sampling for VOC's and/or Metals.
STuckerHSA 1 year ago
in Canada it is the sampler's choice, this site already met CL/AW and I was sampling for a 0.01 ppb benzo(a)pyrene drinking water standard, i.e. groundwater is okay to touch at this site.
RockinJoeDavis 1 year ago
in florida we use Gloves as we samp.... daaaaa
jwalker154 1 year ago
A LaMotte 2020 is just an instrument with a 10mL vial you fill up and place in the device to measure turbidity. I use it in conjunction with the YSI 556 or a Hana 9828.
The Hana 9828 is a neat muloti-parameter probe in the sense it only has a 100 mL flow through cell.
Sweep1001 3 years ago
I will look all this up! Sounds like you are very informed.
RockinJoeDavis 3 years ago
YSI now offers a lower volume flow cell for the 556. Lowers the displaced volume to about 200 mls.
lauraking22 2 years ago
Had an issue with a YSI 556 this morning and was down for the day. If you ever see a -9.99 deg C, a negative cond. and a -99.9% DO you have a bad cable!!!
Sweep1001 3 years ago
Could be the cable or it could be moisture in your c/t port.
lauraking22 2 years ago
Yes it would have dumped the tubing water back into the well, but I pumped three well volumes after this anyway so it would have been pumped back out as purge water. Yes the drawdown is supposed to be less than 1/3 a foot or 10 cm. These were actually standpipes completed into gravel / sand so there was little drawdown, but we are also supposed to pump at about 200 ml per minute max. I use a 1 lite bottle to measure this so I adjust till I get 5 min to fill it for 200 ml per minute.
RockinJoeDavis 3 years ago
That's what I use to do also. Then I just bought a graduated 500 mL cylinder and just use it. If you get one get the napthelene. They don't break as easy.
BTW, the job site I'm on right now...if I pumped 3 well volumes on some of these wells I'd be pumping over 1500 liters! So we only do 1 tubing volume and then wait for stablization on this site.
Sweep1001 3 years ago
And from what I've read, low flow purging isn't just about the low flow but about draw down in the well. We use 0.3 ft. but I think it's 0.1 m. for the rest of the world.
I have had wells that I was flowing at 0.1 L a minute and still had greater than 0.3 ft. of draw down in the well which technically violates low flow purging protocol. Going to have to go pull out my Puls and Barcelonia and read up.
Sweep1001 3 years ago
I am really curious, is a "LaMotte 2020" a peristaltic pump type? I have only used this geopump for low flow sampling. And thanks for the comments! Have a good Sunday. I am sitting here scaling pictures for figures for a Stage 1 presently, have a great day!
RockinJoeDavis 3 years ago
You do know that when you opened up your pump to show the rotating wheels you dumped all the water in the tubing back down the well right? If we did that we would have to start all over again for turbidity if you were actually measuring for it. We use a LaMotte 2020 for turbidity because I hate turbidity sensors in flow through cells.
And what were you samling for?
Sweep1001 3 years ago
Yes, I sampling for dissolved metals in groundwater, this site had chromium and arsenic exceedances.
RockinJoeDavis 3 years ago
hey this is great knowledge to pass on, I do some of this stuff for work, and other environmental projects in the north of bc.
eddiejr98 3 years ago
Glad you liked it Eddie. Are you doing oilfield or related cleanups? I did a few Stage 2's in Ft. St. John a few years back. If you or your outfit needs personnel I am available on about a half time basis. Have a good day eddie!
RockinJoeDavis 3 years ago
Low flow sampling seems to be a little different in the USA. We have a compressor that hooks up to a car's battery. From the compressor, an air line is connected to a regulator with QED being a common brand. These two items seem to be combined into one "box" in your case. The cylinder your probe goes into is very stubby compared to most of the set ups I have seen. However your YSI and Solinst water level meter are very familiar to us in the states.
marko8407 4 years ago
Groundwater is very shallow in southern BC generally allowing us to just use a peristaltic pump which is only good to about 30 feet or less groundwater depth. Your setup with a compressor will probably draw water from 80 too 100 feet or more. I am old fashioned and much prefer sampling with a bailer or Waterra tubing, its faster and less expensive. Groundwater sampling with these new low methods is only to minimize silt content.
RockinJoeDavis 4 years ago
In my experience dissolved metals are significantly lower in conncentration with low flow sampling, as are LEPH and BTEX values. I heard on oil company consultant boast at a conference once "I can make a 1000 ppb LEPH groundwater sample pass the 500 ppb standard with low flow sampling". Does your compressor / QED setup volatilize the sample?
RockinJoeDavis 4 years ago
Ha, I knew I saw a Pine ID on that GeoPump!
Please post more videos. I work on pressure transducers and sampling pumps. :)
Legodude522 4 years ago
At pine environmental in Burnaby BC, it a rental! They are great too, good service! I have used the pump to mix and inject organo-sulphur as well - it is slow but very rugged and works well in the pouring rain, which is the usual BC weather! I gather you're in the business or you wouldn't recognize it! Have a good one!
Rockin Joe - Hydrogeologist / Filmer
RockinJoeDavis 4 years ago
That looks like my 556 and GeoPump. Where did you get them?
reyno626 4 years ago
There's another company we rent from that has even better pumps that the Geo. Ashted has the older MasterFles pumps with internal battery that rather good but Field Environmental has a newer typ pump similar to the MasterFlex Pump that is newer in design and just awesome! I've gone all day sampling without the battery dying on me.
Sweep1001 3 years ago
All day on one battery! This would rock. I did some 10 wells one day and we borrowed a car battery to finish off, we could charge the batteries fast enough. I'll google "Field Environmental"
RockinJoeDavis 3 years ago
This battery is internal. Although you can hook up to a car battery if you run the internal battery down.
Sweep1001 3 years ago