"No distinction seems to be more obvious than that between spiritual and temporal matters. Yet whenever they have been made objects of Legislation, they have clashed and contended with each other, till one or the other has gained the supremacy."
[James Madison in a letter to Thomas Jefferson Oct-Nov 1787]
and what is current american religiosity worth? American exceptionalism, aggressive wars, torture, an imperial presidency, contempt for the poor and manifest crimes all done while invoking the name of God.
do i have to spell it out that such relgion is worthless? read St James in the Bible
Such blasphemies God Himself will not leave unpunished, for true relgion is not the rubber stamp of a state, but its fiercest critic
@Strefanasha Well "true religion" is rare by your definition since religion is always being practiced and preached by the politicians and statesmen and especially military people -soldiers, officers.. and the most militant in any society are usually religious and religion is always invoked to support wars
@S2Cents yes indeed. it, true religion, is rare, the Bible actually says so; and that preached by politicians and soldiers over there (here in new zealand we are not so cursed) is as false as it gets
The separation of church and state had only a purpose of not having a Church Of England or similar state religion, in the USA. The words "separation of church and state" have been misrepresented as having NO connection of govt to religion, which is not what the founders thought should happen. Evidence of the founders intention can be understood by their having public funding of Christian missionaries to the indians.
@bill0756 "As the government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian Religion..." John Adams, treaty of tripoli 1797
Did the founders ask the slaves or the indentured whites or the poor or the indigenous peoples what kind of government God wanted? I don't think so. Dig it up and start over.
LOL John McCain! Is this the same McSame who came back from SE Asia and then ditched his wife after she was disfigured a car accident, so 30 days later (30 days) he could marry his trophy wife? Same wife who just happened to be an heiress to a AZ brewing fortune. That "family values" John McSame? I guess it is OK for christians to TRADE UP every once in awhile.
I liked Zeus fairy tale a lot more than mr. Jesus bread and white creator, and his invisibel father, at least he could send rays... Let's make a comeback! THUMBS UP FOR ZEUS!!!
If the founding fathers wanted this to be a Christian nation, why didn't they write it in the Constitution? It seems like they would have made it clear so we wouldn't have to argue about it.
History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes.
-Thomas Jefferson Dec. 6, 1813
You say you are a Calvinist. I am not. I am of a sect by myself, as far as I know.
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Ezra Stiles Ely, June 25, 1819
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here."
--Patrick Henry
(Revolutionary General; Legislator; "The Voice Of Liberty"; Ratifier of the U.S. Constitution, Governor of Virginia)
The founders repeatedly insisted that America was founded on the Bible, the laws of GOD, and the gospel; and NOT on a religion.
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded NOT by religionists, but by Christians; NOT on RELIGIONS, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here."
There are THREE models of Government competing for WORLD DOMINANCE & every American WILL live under ONE of them:
1. Communist "under man" model: Humans rulers decide & dole out your rights or liberties if any and you have NO "unalienable rights" cuz what the Gov gives the Gov can take away.
2. Sharia: Islamic model where the Qu'ron IS the Constitution.
3. Bible-based Under GOD model: GOD ALONE grants your rights & freedoms power resides in WE PEOPLE, we're sovereign & the Gov is OUR SERVANT.
Out the 3 Government models competing for world dominance, only TWO of them stand a realistic chance.
1. Sharia /Islam model
2. America's unique "Under God" Christian model
We live in a world of THEISTS. Most people in the world are THEISTS. Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus & people pray to flying spaghetti monsters. Human have always been THEISTS & always will be. SECULARISM does only ONE thing for society and laws. It opens the door for, enables and strengthens the ISLAM model. See Europe
Regarding The God of the Declaration: "The Law of Nature stands as an eternal rule to all men, legislators as well as others. The rules that they make for other men's actions must . . . be conformable to the Law of Nature, i.e., to the will of God. Laws human must be made according to the general laws of Nature, and without contradiction to any positive law of Scripture, otherwise they are ill made."
@Mr88playmaker NO THEY DID NOT, stop trying to change history to the way you see fit Washington,Jefferson,Franklin did not Believe. in the bible just as many other founding fathers did not.
also in the Military under you phrase "god" that means ANY GOD that can mean Flying Spaghetti Monster for all they care.
Correct. Anybody can have whatever god they want except that the Military Code of Conduct specifies "God" (proper noun) and not "god" as in money, secularism, atheism, self, materialism, or Budda or Alah or Zeus for that matter).
The God of the Christian Bible is your sole, legal granter of rights and liberties. Were He replaced by Alah, Zeus or any other god America's structure of Government would change accordingly and you'd have no unalienable rights. It's about GOVERNMENT.
The founders repeatedly insisted that America was founded on the Bible, the laws of GOD, and the gospel; and NOT on a religion.
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded NOT by religionists, but by Christians; NOT on RELIGIONS, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here." --Patrick Henry
Tripoli Treaty: "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
The Treaty of Tripoly was NOT written by an American. It was WRITTEN BY the ARABS (Islamic MUSLIMs) during a confrontation between Americans and Muslim Pirates (thugs/ thieves/terrorists). The Arabs wrote the Treaty, it was translated into English for Congress' consideration, Congress signed it, then REPLACED it OMITTING that section. To date, the Arabs have NO RECORD or any Treaty containing the phrase they had demanded from Congress.
Moreover, America's Treaty of Paris, which WAS in fact written by the AMERICANS (NOT Arabs oversees) begins with the line "In the name of the most Holy Trinity" (ie: In the name of The father, The Son and The Holy Spirit).
America was NOT founded on RELIGION. It was founded BY Christians, founded ON the Gospel of Christ, structured on the LAWS of GOD, & God was made our sole legal granter of right & liberties. There exist NO legal document that states your rights come from elsewhere.
The Treaty of Tripoli was written by americans Joel Barlow and Joseph Donaldson, and ratified unanimously, with article 11, by the senate and signed, with article 11, by John Adams. The US Federal State was not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion. And whether some slave-owners did not understand logic or that there are no such thing as deities is irrelevant to the FACT that there is as much evidence for deities as there is for Harry Potter. Christianity is made up.
"Religion is the basis and Foundation of Government."
--James Madison (Father of The Constitution)
"Before any man can be considered as a member of civil society, he must be considered as a subject of the Governor of the Universe. And to the same Divine Author of every good and perfect gift [James 1:17] we are indebted for all those privileges and advantages, religious as well as civil, which are so richly enjoyed in this favored land."
"We have no government armed in power capable of contending in human passions ubridled by morality and religion. Our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other."
-- John Adams
(Signer of the Declaration Of Independence; One [of two] signers of the Bill Of Rights; 2nd President of the United States of America)
“Now all acts of legislature apparently contrary to natural right and justice, are, in our laws, and must be in the nature of things, considered as void. The laws of nature are the laws of God; whose authority can be superseded by no power on earth. A legislature must not obstruct our obedience to Him from whose punishments they cannot protect us. All human constitutions which contradict His [God’s] laws, we are in conscience bound to disobey.”
Ben Franklin describing the America to the French: "Bad examples to youth are more rare in America, which must be a comfortable consideration to parents. To this may be truly added, that serious religion, under its various denominations, is not only tolerated,but respected and practised. Atheism is UNKNOWN there; infidelity rare and secret; so that persons may live to a great age in that country without having their piety shocked by meeting with either an Atheist or an Infidel."
"Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen."
By the way, the old, major Universities were in fact founded by CHRISTIANS for the express purpose of educating people in the Bible so that they could understand the Constitution and make good leaders.
Speaking of education:
"Education is useless without the Bible."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America" \ Legislature )
Speaking of the Father Of Public Education in America:
"The religion which has introduced civil liberty is the religion of Christ and his apostles, which enjoins humility, piety and benevolence; which acknowledges in every person a brother, or a sister, and a citizen with equal rights. This is genuine Christianity , and to this we owe our free constitutions of government."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America" \ Legislature )
@Mr88playmaker go to ANY Top University in the world and tell every Leading scientists s that the "Lord God" is real and the bible is 100% truth.
They will laugh at you, what is your response to that? your going to come back and tell me your smarter then one of the top 10 scientists in the world?
The Founding fathers all agreed that the most important part of education was learning the Bible early on in school. They stressed that every American should know his Bible because the Bible is the foundation upon which the whole structure (USA) rests.
"Our citizens should early understand that the genuine source of correct republican principles is the Bible, particularly the New Testament, or the Christian religion."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America" \ Legislature )
"The Christian religion… is the basis, or rather the source, of all genuine freedom in government. I am persuaded that no civil government of a republican form can exist and be durable in which the principles of Christianity have not a controlling influence."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America")
@Mr88playmaker still going on about Jefferson lol. doesn't change the fact what he said, his actions showed what he thought. he was not AT in favor of having Religion taught at Virginia college. he asked Thomas pain to come back to the USA and keep writing what he wrote.
Thomas Pain went to France cause a bunch of Nutty Christians wanted to kill him.
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): :"Thomas Pain went to France cause a bunch of Nutty Christians wanted to kill him." (END QUOTE)
Your beloved new found hero, your so called "Thomas Paine" had ZERO to do with the Declaration, ZERO to do with the Constitution, ZERO to do with the Federalist Papers....ZERO, ZERO...ZERO.
There was a guy named "ROBERT" Paine who was a player in the founding of the nation but NO "Thomas" Paine. The guy YOU'RE talking about was a guy NOT even liked by the founders.
@Mr88playmaker It wasn't till the 1950's that Christians started adding things to the Government like, "one nation under God"?
Webster molded the KJV to correct grammar, replaced words that were no longer used, and did away with words and phrases that could be seen as offensive. changed the bible=changing history.
kind of like how the NKJV does today calling "manmasters" kidnappers.
Abraham Lincoln's famous "Under God" was intentionally added to the money during the Cold War when communists were threatening a takeover from within our borders (see: Communist Goals For America uncovered by Congress only a few years later). A peoples' worldview (religion or lack thereof) will determine their model / form of Government. The Communist's MAIN obstacle for complete takeover is GOD. They must transfer us from an "under God" model of Gov to an "under man" model.
"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."
—Nikita Khrushchev (on the demise of America)
"We will bury your grand-children without firing a shot" -Khrushchev (on turning the West communist from within).
“My object in life is to dethrone God and destroy capitalism. We are ruthless and ask no quarter from you. When our turn comes we shall not disguise our terrorism. The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.”
— Karl Marx (Father of Communism, atheist, humanist, political economist & sociologist)
You should be thankful that our founders structured our model of Government so that GOD alone is your sole legal granter of rights and liberties.
You may personally hate God --and that's bad for you & for society -- but the ONLY reason you are free is because our founders did NOT trust in men, so they made sure that your rights and liberties were OFF LIMITS to the tyrannically inclined power-hungry hands of sinners (men)
"If thou wouldst rule well, thou must rule for God, and to do that, thou must be ruled by him....Those who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants."
“The guiding principle and prayer of this Nation has been, is now, and ever shall be ‘In God We Trust.’"
--John F. Kennedy
"We can not read the history of our nation without reckoning with the place the Bible has occupied in shaping the advances of the Republic. Where we have been the truest and most consistent in obeying its precepts we have attained the greatest measure of contentment and prosperity."
"America was born a Christian nation. America was born to exemplify that devotion to the elements of righteousness which are derived from the revelations of the Holy Scripture."
"The foundations of our society and our Government rest so much on the teachings of the Bible that it would be difficult to support them if faith in these teachings would cease to be practically universal in our Country."
"Without God there could be no American form of Government nor an American way of life. Recognition of the Supreme being is the first--the most basic--expression of Americanism."
"Every thinking man, when he thinks, realizes that the teachings of the Bible are so interwoven and entwined with our whole civic and social life that it would be literally-I do not mean figuratively, but literally impossible for us to figure what that loss would be if these teachings were removed. We would lose all the standards by which we now judge both public and private morals; all the standards towards which we, with more or less resolution, strive to raise ourselves."
“America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its PATRIOTISM, its MORALITY and its SPIRITUAL LIFE. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within.”
— Joseph Stalin (Dictator & Russian political leader of the USSR)
“Give me your four year olds, and in a generation I will build a socialist state.” “Destroy the family, you destroy the country.”
— Vladimir Lenin (Communist Dictator of the USSR who lead the Bolshevik Revolution)
@Mr88playmaker Thomas pain inspired American you dumb shit., you also forgot to comment on the University comment :) knew you would avoid that.
but it's nice that you try to prop up the Founding Fathers,who did not take one from the bible granted. as statted no matter how much you bring him up saying "nice" things about the bible, HE WAS NOT A CHRISTIAN. Thomas Jefferson had a Bible,the Koran and a Number of other books in the white house.
@Mr88playmaker Michael Moore? Paine's book are very good books, hell Jefferson was a big fan of them,
but lets get back to the real topic which a few people have already told you..Most the Founding Fathers were not Christian. but yet you keep trying to tell us that's not true but history says other wise.
Michael Moore is a retard...only a retard would ever bring him up in a topic.
I simply do not believe that your communist model of Government is a good idea for Americans. I prefer having God as our sole legal granter of rights and liberties. Placing us into an "under man" rule of Government might satisfy your PERSONAL contempt for God and our nation;s Christian heritage BUT you would surely be the first to REGRET making the exchange once the new form of Government were installed.
When you say you want God out of Government, ye know NOT what ye ask.
PS; The real American motto as composed by the founding fathers temselves was not the current one, but the following: "E Pluribus Unum", "Out of many, one.". Referring to the states being united.
The founding fathers specifically clarified that "God" had no place in the government, and I applaud them for it.
@Mr88playmaker David Humphreys, Joel Barlow and Joseph Donaldson negotiated the treaty, and after writting a treaty representing the US Federal State, translated it into english. The Sentate UNANIMOUSLY ratified the US version WITH article 11, and John Adams SIGNED the US version WITH article 11. The US Federal State was not, in ANY sense, founded on the christian religion.
To say that religion is "bigger now" in America than it ever has been is to say that there are more Christian Americans "on the books" than there has ever been. This may be true, but let's not forget our growing population. There are far more Americans -in general- than there ever has been. Statistics show that, per-capita, agnosticism is actually the fastest growing belife pattern in the United States. Traditional religions have maintained the same average that they have always held.
@Mr88playmaker: You should really take some sort of government class because you have a rather awful misunderstanding of US law. I would reply to your individual claims but it appears you've flooded the entire comment section with them.
It is clear that America was founded as a Christian nation as our founding fathers made it ILLEGAL for NON-Christians to serve in Government. They made it ILLEGAL for atheists to hold public office (or be heard in a courtroom for that matter) AND it is STILL -- according to a number of State Constitutions across the Country TODAY - illegal for atheists to serve in Government.
"Separation of church and state" does NOT appear in the U.S. Constitution. It DOES appear in the Russian Constitution. Separation of church & state was introduced in the U.S. in the 1960s by the communists, in accordance with the "Communist Goals for America" which supports the Marxist doctrine (and agrees with our founding fathers) that the FOUNDATION of American's freedom is GOD & religion; and that by removing Christianity, America's free institutions of Gov are dismantled & the US will fall
Our Founders insisted that the preservation of our rights and freedoms RELY on GOD as Supreme Ruler.
The enemies of America KNOW that they MUST make us one nation under MAN.
“My object in life is to DETHRONE God and destroy capitalism” “we are ruthless and ask no quarter from you. When our turn comes we shall not disguise our terrorism.” “The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.”
— Karl Marx (Father of Communism, atheist, humanist, political economist & sociologist)
The Communists have been indoctrinating Americans to "hate God" and "Turn against religion." Young people especially, who have NO idea how our free institutions of Government are structured, actually think (they've been taught) that there is something secular about being the first nation in human history conceived in liberty and NOT ruled by man. The "hate on God" campaign is not about making them "free-thinkers" it's about taking AWAY ALL of their FREEDOMS, including what they can think.
"Religion is the basis and Foundation of Government."
--James Madison
(Father of the U.S. Constitution)
"The future and success of America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of God upon which this Constitution is founded.”
--James Madison
Remember, Congress used the State Capitol building as a CHURCH for 150 years. The signers of the Constitution, all of Congress, every President, everyone, worshiped in the State Capitol building.
By law, no American's rights & liberties are granted by humans. We are a nation founded on our DISTRUST in man. It's why our rights are unalienable. Communists know that the key to our destruction is in removing our official, legal, SOLE granter of rights (GOD) from the collective mind, and thus from our "Under God" structure of Government. That way, into the hands of men we go.
Marxists are ONLY interested in replacing our Granter with what our founders call TYRANNY.
Not true. Franklin believed in a Creator who governs in the affairs of men & he prayed to him. Jefferson believed Jesus was the Christ and only had a problem wrapping his head around 'The Trinity.' Thomas Paine had ZERO to do with the Declaration or the Constitution or any of it. He was a DEIST who believed in a CREATOR who created the universe and left it to itself. It is STILL, today, ILLEGAL in most of the U.S. 50 states for an ATHEIST to serve in Government.
@Mr88playmaker False. do you even bother reading history? Franklin thought there was a god for every star.
Thomas Paine was a atheist you dumb ass. read his book age of Reasoning which you never have.
Franklin Support Paine 100% on that book so did Thomas Jefferson.
ILLEGAL!? ya don't ever comment. on this subject again! The Constitution clearly states no Religion will be allowed in the Government and No Religious Test shall be given either. by the way Deist is not a Religion.
Franklin had Congress pray for Divine wisdom and guidance from God, for four hours per day, each day, before commencing to work on the Constitution.
The U.S. State Capitol building was used, by Congress and every sitting US President, as the nation's 1st "Super Church" building for our country's 1st 150 years. A special seat was allocated for US President and Chairman of the American Bible Society Thomas Jefferson. Jefferson never missed a single church worship service at the State capitol.
Thomas Paine had NOTHING to do with the Declaration or Constitution. You won't find his signature anywhere. He was a DEIST --as Franklin had been in his youth-- believing in a CREATOR but NOT a religious man.
Paine knew that in America, by law our rights & freedoms are granted by God alone (not human Gov.) He agreed with Franklin that a nation will either be ruled by God or by tyrants. when the French attempted to teach Creation minus the Crearor, Paine ripped into them worse than anybody.
@Mr88playmaker Funny. cause the president at the time,Abraham Lincoln was not a Christian! also more then 1 moto was on U.S Money back in those days. there was a lot more then just "In God we Trust" wasn't official till the 1950's.
'Paine knew that in America, by law our rights & freedoms are granted by God alone"
are you retarded!? Paine's Book explained how Science and History should always be taught over Religion!
"It is fit and becoming in all people, at all times, to acknowledge and revere the Supreme Government of God; to bow in humble submission to His chastisement; to confess and deplore their sins and transgressions in the full conviction that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom; and to pray, with all fervency and contrition, for the pardon of their past offenses, and for a blessing upon their present and prospective action.
@Mr88playmaker Thomas Jefferson said nice things about Alah to the Muslims too, your point? or did you forget that first country to see the USA as a country was Muslim Country? name of that country by the way is Morocco
Supreme Government of God? USA is not Israel and since when does a GOD need a Government? ya.... that right there hurts you. you your self think god runs a Government..thus meaning God is not perfect.. careful how you word your words.
Thomas Jefferson along with The Father of The Constitution James Madison, and original chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court, founding father John Jay and the others, all prescribed Christianity as THE preferred religion of and for all Americans. Not only does our Country's very Mission Statement (The Mayflower Compact) specify this but the drafters & signers of the Declaration & U.S. Constitution stress this repeatedly to no end. Hence all 50 State Constitutions recognize GOD.
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE) "recognize God? god of what?" (END QUOTE)
The God of the Christian Bible: Creator of heaven and earth, to whose LAWS all people are naturally and inescapably subject to. (see: Blackstone and Locke on "Nature's God.")
America is the 1st nation in human history that guaranteed individual rights and liberties BECAUSE unlike in the rest of the world, in America your rights & liberties are granted and secured ONLY by GOD, NOT by men. Jefferson warned us to retain as granter.
Without GOD we would be placed (r foolishly place ourselves) under tyranny i.e. an "under man" model of government as opposed to our safe and secure "under God model.
"God who gave us life and liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are a gift of God?"
"Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen."
@Mr88playmaker Holy shit! Jefferson didn't want Religion taught at the Virginian University... do you not understand this!? he was not a Christian he said it him self countless times.
Hell after all your telling me it's Illegal for a non-Christian to serve in the Government!? guess what there are thousands of people in the Government are! but hey...you want to support slavery then go right ahead
ha! As President, Thomas Jefferson signed bills which appropriated financial support for Christian chaplains in Congress and in the armed services.
April 10, 1806, Jefferson signed the Articles of War, in which he: "Earnestly recommends to all officers and soldiers, diligently to attend divine services."
Thomas Jefferson was also the Chairman of THE AMERICAN BIBLE SOCIETY! According to Jefferson it was his all time highest, most important role in all his service to America!
@Mr88playmaker atheist is incapable of making an valid oath!?Bullshit. pure crap. go tell that to a few U.S Marines who are ahiest see hat happens. it's called being a American
(QUOTE) "go tell that to a few U.S Marines who are ahiest see hat happens. it's called being a American" (END QUOTE)
The official U.S. Military Code of Conduct (Article Six) states: “I will never forget that I am an American, fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and in the United States of America.”
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): "Hell after all your telling me it's Illegal for a non-Christian to serve in the Government!?" (END QUOTE)
I said that still, today, in most Sate Constitutions, it is ILLEGAL for an atheist to hold a Government office.
For hundreds of years, an atheist was NOT allowed to testify in a U.S. Court of law because an atheist is incapable of making an valid oath. Likewise, atheists were denied any involvement with Government. Look it up and you'll see that not much has changed.
@Mr88playmaker Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): "Thomas Jefferson said nice things about Alah to the Muslims too, your point?" (END QUOTE)
I too say nice things about Muslims and Hindus and Deists and sometimes even atheists from time to time. What "point" would that make? That I'm a Muslim-Hindu-Deist.atheist? No. Of course not.
"Almighty God, Who has given us this good land for our heritage; We humbly beseech Thee that we may always prove ourselves a people mindful of Thy favor and glad to do Thy will. Bless our land with honorable ministry, sound learning, and pure manners. Save us from violence, discord, and confusion, from pride and arrogance, and from every evil way. Defend our liberties, and fashion into one united people, the multitude brought hither out of many kindreds and tongues" --Thomas Jefferson (see prt2)
"Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen."
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): :USA is not Israel and since when does a GOD need a Government?" (END QUOTE)
Look a dollar bill and note the Israeli Star Of David drawn out in little stars, above the head of the eagle.
"The highest glory of the American Revolution was this; it CONNECTED in ONE indissoluble BOND the principles of civil GOVERNMENT with the principles of CHRISTIANITY."
"Now all acts of legislature apparently contrary to natural right and justice, are, in our laws, and must be in the nature of things, considered as void. The laws of nature are the laws of God; whose authority can be superseded by no power on earth. A legislature must not obstruct our obedience to Him from whose punishments they cannot protect us. All human constitutions which contradict His [God’s] laws, we are in conscience bound to disobey.”
"The fundamental basis of this nation's law was given to Moses on the Mount. The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teaching we get from Exodus and St. Matthew, from Isaiah and St. Paul. I don't think we emphasize that enough these days. If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally end up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in the right for anybody except the state."
"No free government now exists in the world, unless where Christianity is acknowledged, and is the religion of the country. Christianity is part of the common law. Its foundations are broad and strong and deep. It is the purest system of morality and only stable support of all human laws."
"The morality of the country is deeply ingrafted upon Christianity, and not upon the doctrines or worship of other religions. In people whose manners are refined, and whose morals have been elevated and inspired with a more enlarged benevolence, it is by means of the Christian religion."
"Religion must be considered as the foundation on which the whole structure rests. In this age there can be no substitute for Christianity; the great conservative element on which we must rely for the purity and permanence of free institutions."
-- House Judiciary Committee, 1854
"The great vital and conservative element in our system is the belief of our people in the pure doctrines and divine truths of the gospel of Jesus Christ."
"Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest of our Christian nation, to select and prefer Christians for their rulers."
--John Jay (Founding Father; President of Congress; very FIRST/original Chief Justice of the United States Supreme Court)
@Mr88playmaker Hell Thomas Jefferson wanted Science also taught over Religion and not have Religion taught at Virgina College.
He rejected the superstitions and mysticism of Christianity, that is stated by Jefferson him self.
Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
Priests...dread the advance of science as witches do the approach of daylight and scowl on the fatal harbinger announcing the subversions of the duperies on which they live.
-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to Correa de Serra, April 11, 1820
Ya.... what was that about Jefferson Being a Christian and loving god? ya.. get off the Bullshit and READ history. I can't stand the fact that your so dumb to such things.
Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because if there be one he must approve of the homage of reason more than that of blindfolded fear.
Three practical reasons why the Communists had the Pledge of Allegiance removed from the U.S. classrooms.
(1) Pledge is an oath of allegiance (see document "Communist Goals for America")
(2) Pledge states that America is a Republic (communists need to convince Americans that it's a Democracy)
(3) Pledge acknowledges GOD who is our sole legal granter of rights and liberties (Communists need to turn America secular and, consequently, as such, placed under a "rule of man" form of Government)
If you ask an average American today what the purpose of the Constitution is, he has no idea that it is essentially a means by which we the people RESTRAIN Government from encroaching on our God given rights and liberties. The document begins "WE the People" and then goes on to BIND and CHAIN the hands of Government. That's all. That's what the Constitution is.
The 1st Amendment does NOT restrict anybody but lawmakers,
The problem lately is that COURTS are LEGISLATING from the bench.
For this reason the U.S. Constitution restricts Congress from making a LAW. Congress is the legislative branch. The 1st Amendment restricts Congress, and Congress ALONE form making a law regarding any one of the establishments, either good or bad. Whether in favor of or against.
This ensures "Freedom of Religion". That means that NOBODY, not you, not me, not Congress, not the President is restricted from religious expression in Government or outside of Government.
“America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its PATRIOTISM, its MORALITY and its SPIRITUAL LIFE. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within.”
— Joseph Stalin (Dictator & Russian political leader of the USSR)
“Give me your four year olds, and in a generation I will build a socialist state.” “Destroy the family, you destroy the country.”
— Vladimir Lenin (Communist Dictator of the USSR )
MAYFLOWER COMPACT: "Having undertaken, for the Glory of God and advancement of the Christian Faith...a Voyage to plant the First Colony in the Northern Parts of Virginia, do by these presents solemnly and mutually in the presence of God and one of another, Covenant and Combine ourselves together into a Civil Body Politic, for our better ordering and preservation and furtherance of the ends aforesaid…at Cape Cod, the 11th of November...Anno Domini 1620."
when america was foundet, it liberated itself from the british crown. Like all Royals in all countries, the british royal family claimed to be put into place by god.
To free themselves from this belief, america was founded with a freedom of religion, meaning, that whatever religion you believe in, is your personal choice and the state itself will not prefer one religion over another.
anyone claiming that america is a christian nation, obviously lacks of knowledge of american history.
"As the government of the united states of america is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Musselmen; and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitian nation..." - Treaty with Tripoli, drafted in 1796 under George Washington and signed by John Adams in 1797. Eat this you fundamentalists
"Art. 11: As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on Christian religion; so it has in itself no character or enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility of Mussulmen..." - Treaty of Tripoli, 1797
@SexyMelon MAYFLOWER COMPACT: "Having undertaken, for the Glory of God and advancement of the Christian Faith...a Voyage to plant the First Colony in the Northern Parts of Virginia, do by these presents solemnly and mutually in the presence of God and one of another, Covenant and Combine ourselves together into a Civil Body Politic, for our better ordering and preservation and furtherance of the ends aforesaid…at Cape Cod, the 11th of November...Anno Domini 1620."
@VeritasEstLibertas History (Plymouth =/= Founding of America), constitution (First Amendment) and comprehension (Lots of "God" =/= Any mention of anything being established on Christian faith) and other epic fails.
US was the first bright light for humanity in being not openly founded on religious bigotry, persecution, separation and egotism, but freedom of religion. Even though its modern inhabits are doing their damn best to drag it down to the dark ages, you can't rewrite history.
@SexyMelon The Mayflower Compact was the first written constitution in a land that would become the United States of America; thus, the Mayflower Compact was the constitutional foundation of this country. You can re-write history all you want, but the facts are the facts, and the facts prove that this country was founded by Christians for the "Glory of God" and the "advancement of the Christian Faith."
@VeritasEstLibertas Plymouth was one of numerous Brittish colonies, and it in no way, shape, or form had any constitution of its own, and the document you cite mentions absolutely nothing to the capacity of that colony, less of all what was to become United States, to be founded on any religion.
@VeritasEstLibertas "this country was founded by Christians for the "Glory of God"
Sorry, not even what you quoted says anything like this. But then it's not the document the country was founded on: what it is founded on is the Constitution and Bill of Rights, and they establish separation of church and state in the very first amendment.
US was founded by religious and non-religious people alike fleeing religious persecution. And you're trying to bring it back. For shame.
@VeritasEstLibertas "Russia was founded in 1993, with the adoption of its constitution."
That's retarded. And Russia has what to do with this?
"Plymouth did have a constitution: the Mayflower Compact."
What part of "Compact" did you misread as "constitution" exactly?
Plymouth was one of many British colonies. The compact is a written contract between crew members establishing the colony's allegiance to King of Britain.
@SexyMelon Using your "logic," Russia was founded in 1993. Just because you are etymologically challenged, does not mean that a word lacks a specific meaning.
@VeritasEstLibertas What would be accurate to say is that American colonies to become the States of America were founded by Christians, by a country with Christianity as enforced state religion.
United States as we know it, founded by the - you'd think - appropriately named "founding fathers" - many of whom were agnostic, deist, atheist *as well as* Christian and highly devout - is established on freedom of religion among other values, not religious segregation as practiced before.
Actually what I wonder is why Americans care so much about how or why their country was founded. I mean these founding fathers also kept slaves, so you know... who cares? Society now is very different then a century or two ago anyway. With different problems.
Why not just see which country deals with what issue the most effectively and try their system?
I mean on religion for example it's very simple. Theocracies like Saudi Arabia and Mauritania, or the Christian Dark Ages in Europe are/where HORRIBLE places to live. And on top of that America has at least a tenth, and probably well over a tenth of people that are not Christians. Which is AT LEAST 30 million people. And the christians are divided in all these different sects.
So a fundie theocracy would CLEARLY be a HORRIBLE idea.
I'm not an american, but I have read the US constitution, and I don't see any of the ten commandments written in it, nor do I see a single mention of a guy named Jesus.
@CodaCola Also, The US was founded as a constitutional republic, and the concept of republic was first implemented by Greek and Roman Pagans, NOT christians.
If the US was really founded as a christian nation, it would be closer to a totalitarian monarchy, which is what most christian nations were during the first 1500+ years of christianity's existence.
Just heard Prof. Wills on Commonwealth Club podcast on new book Bomb Power - what a GREAT speaker and what important information he is speaking on. I had to look him up on You Tube to learn more about him. This was great too, and def. inline with what I've learned from my history classes.
Don't be. Congressman Forbes is, unfortunately, misled. All of the "evidence" he presents in defense of America's "Judeo-Christian" heritage is ambiguous at best. Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, George Washington, and several other of America's founding fathers were initiates in the mystery school ( ancient science) of religion.
elbethere: every time a fed. judge rules against a community, city, or state in public prayer, Christmas or Easter celebrations, or any other religious celebration they are violating the 1st amend. Read the 1st amend. again very carefully. It says "congress shall make no law". It doesn't say anything about any private group.
You are incorrect. The interpretation of the Constitution to state and local law is a product of the 19th century. As for the idea of "that statement" keeping government out of religion, how do you do that without keeping religion, as important a thing it is in daily lives and decision making of the people, out of government? Jefferson's letters, from which the statement comes, clearly illustrate his intentions and meaning in drafting the establishment clause.
The Establishment Clause goes on to say that there shall be no law establishing religion nor of prohibiting free exercise thereof.
It also means that if a community wants to have a day of prayer that is endorsed by the local government, that same government had better allow all religions equal access and expression of their own religious views. And this issue does not begin to address the issue of non-religious Americans.
elbethere: it was liberal judges who, in the early 20th cent., took Jefferson's private letter out of context and turned the 1st amend. upside down to meant the exact opposite of what the founders meant.
elbethere: That statement was meant to keep the fed. gov. out of religion. It was meant to keep the fed. gov. from creationg a national religion. No where in that statement does it say religion shall not participate in government decisions. BTW, no where in that statement are the words "sep. of church and state".
pbirv: there is no mention of "separation of church and state" in the Constitution. That never stopped liberal judges from creating it out of thin air.
BTW, every state constitution mentions God. It was left up to the states to decide religous matters.
Its in the establishment clause to the first amendment. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
Who cares whether or not the founding fathers (last I checked, Jefferson and Madison were two of them) intended for there to be a "wall of seperation" b/w church and state. The FACT is that that is how it was interpreted, which should show you that THAT is what was deemed to best serve the country. You see, we INTERPRET our constitution to serve the changing needs of our society. If it were really up to the founding fathers, we'd still have slaves, disenfranchised women, etc. PROGRESSIVE!!!
America was created by people escaping from christians. Most of Columbus sailors were jews desparate to get out of Spain. They came here in a ship named after a Jewish mother. Their hemp sails filled with the sacred wind blowing over the face of the deep. God made a new world so people could escape from christians. But if they behave themselves and keep their hands off other peoples reproductive functions they are welcome here too. Otherwise go back to whatever hell they crawled out of. ICXCNIKI
"No distinction seems to be more obvious than that between spiritual and temporal matters. Yet whenever they have been made objects of Legislation, they have clashed and contended with each other, till one or the other has gained the supremacy."
[James Madison in a letter to Thomas Jefferson Oct-Nov 1787]
jfsfrnd 6 months ago
and what is current american religiosity worth? American exceptionalism, aggressive wars, torture, an imperial presidency, contempt for the poor and manifest crimes all done while invoking the name of God.
do i have to spell it out that such relgion is worthless? read St James in the Bible
Such blasphemies God Himself will not leave unpunished, for true relgion is not the rubber stamp of a state, but its fiercest critic
Strefanasha 6 months ago
@Strefanasha Well "true religion" is rare by your definition since religion is always being practiced and preached by the politicians and statesmen and especially military people -soldiers, officers.. and the most militant in any society are usually religious and religion is always invoked to support wars
S2Cents 5 months ago
@S2Cents yes indeed. it, true religion, is rare, the Bible actually says so; and that preached by politicians and soldiers over there (here in new zealand we are not so cursed) is as false as it gets
Strefanasha 5 months ago
Given what Jesus said about the Way, that it was strait, narrow and few there are who find it. there is NO such thing as a christian country.
when countries made up their minds to be christian the result was religious abomination, legislated hypocrisy, and ultimately inquisitions.
The religious right is dangerous, beingheretical, and their lies must be refuted, including their historical revisionism
Strefanasha 6 months ago
The separation of church and state had only a purpose of not having a Church Of England or similar state religion, in the USA. The words "separation of church and state" have been misrepresented as having NO connection of govt to religion, which is not what the founders thought should happen. Evidence of the founders intention can be understood by their having public funding of Christian missionaries to the indians.
bill0756 7 months ago
@bill0756 "As the government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian Religion..." John Adams, treaty of tripoli 1797
iron100159 6 months ago
@iron100159
EXACTLY, so understanding ALL of the information and context, it is obvious that:
1) the govt of the US is NOT founded on any religion
2) that the founders supported state funding of Christian missionaries
3) that today, using selective out of context representation of history, those wanting no connection between religion and state manipulate history.
the treaty of tripoli was dialogue to diffuse hostility.
atheists in Canada generally have no problem funding Catholic schools.
bill0756 6 months ago
@iron100159 And was passed unanimously by Congress.
chodaboy51500 3 weeks ago
But look at how religion has turned out in this country.
TheDano1947 7 months ago
Way to mispronounce Andrew Carnegie...dumbass.
SadegoGG 8 months ago
Did the founders ask the slaves or the indentured whites or the poor or the indigenous peoples what kind of government God wanted? I don't think so. Dig it up and start over.
Moussafoster 8 months ago
more stories in new-muslims . com
learnislam00 9 months ago
LOL John McCain! Is this the same McSame who came back from SE Asia and then ditched his wife after she was disfigured a car accident, so 30 days later (30 days) he could marry his trophy wife? Same wife who just happened to be an heiress to a AZ brewing fortune. That "family values" John McSame? I guess it is OK for christians to TRADE UP every once in awhile.
clintonplaza 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I liked Zeus fairy tale a lot more than mr. Jesus bread and white creator, and his invisibel father, at least he could send rays... Let's make a comeback! THUMBS UP FOR ZEUS!!!
Southparkateer2 11 months ago
If the founding fathers wanted this to be a Christian nation, why didn't they write it in the Constitution? It seems like they would have made it clear so we wouldn't have to argue about it.
TheEmilio16 1 year ago
History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes.
-Thomas Jefferson Dec. 6, 1813
You say you are a Calvinist. I am not. I am of a sect by myself, as far as I know.
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Ezra Stiles Ely, June 25, 1819
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
America has not founded, in any sense, on the Christian religion.
Religion is based on the fear of death.
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago 2
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here."
--Patrick Henry
(Revolutionary General; Legislator; "The Voice Of Liberty"; Ratifier of the U.S. Constitution, Governor of Virginia)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker The US Federal State is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
@qwertypoiu4321
The U.S. is not founded on "religion."
The founders repeatedly insisted that America was founded on the Bible, the laws of GOD, and the gospel; and NOT on a religion.
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded NOT by religionists, but by Christians; NOT on RELIGIONS, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here."
--Patrick Henry
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
There are THREE models of Government competing for WORLD DOMINANCE & every American WILL live under ONE of them:
1. Communist "under man" model: Humans rulers decide & dole out your rights or liberties if any and you have NO "unalienable rights" cuz what the Gov gives the Gov can take away.
2. Sharia: Islamic model where the Qu'ron IS the Constitution.
3. Bible-based Under GOD model: GOD ALONE grants your rights & freedoms power resides in WE PEOPLE, we're sovereign & the Gov is OUR SERVANT.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Out the 3 Government models competing for world dominance, only TWO of them stand a realistic chance.
1. Sharia /Islam model
2. America's unique "Under God" Christian model
We live in a world of THEISTS. Most people in the world are THEISTS. Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus & people pray to flying spaghetti monsters. Human have always been THEISTS & always will be. SECULARISM does only ONE thing for society and laws. It opens the door for, enables and strengthens the ISLAM model. See Europe
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Wow. you are a religions nut,
heck I bet you think the earth is a few thousand years old too.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
Heck, I'll bet you are a Darwin nut who thinks that fish turn into monkeys, monkeys turn into Negroes, and Negroes turn into white people.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
Regarding The God of the Declaration: "The Law of Nature stands as an eternal rule to all men, legislators as well as others. The rules that they make for other men's actions must . . . be conformable to the Law of Nature, i.e., to the will of God. Laws human must be made according to the general laws of Nature, and without contradiction to any positive law of Scripture, otherwise they are ill made."
--John Locke Two Treatises on Government
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
“Man will ultimately be governed by God or by tyrants.”
--Benjamin Franklin
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker NO THEY DID NOT, stop trying to change history to the way you see fit Washington,Jefferson,Franklin did not Believe. in the bible just as many other founding fathers did not.
also in the Military under you phrase "god" that means ANY GOD that can mean Flying Spaghetti Monster for all they care.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
Correct. Anybody can have whatever god they want except that the Military Code of Conduct specifies "God" (proper noun) and not "god" as in money, secularism, atheism, self, materialism, or Budda or Alah or Zeus for that matter).
The God of the Christian Bible is your sole, legal granter of rights and liberties. Were He replaced by Alah, Zeus or any other god America's structure of Government would change accordingly and you'd have no unalienable rights. It's about GOVERNMENT.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker The US Federal State is not, in any sense, founded on the CHRISTIAN religion.
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
@qwertypoiu4321
The founders repeatedly insisted that America was founded on the Bible, the laws of GOD, and the gospel; and NOT on a religion.
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded NOT by religionists, but by Christians; NOT on RELIGIONS, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here." --Patrick Henry
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Tripoli Treaty: "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
@qwertypoiu4321
The Treaty of Tripoly was NOT written by an American. It was WRITTEN BY the ARABS (Islamic MUSLIMs) during a confrontation between Americans and Muslim Pirates (thugs/ thieves/terrorists). The Arabs wrote the Treaty, it was translated into English for Congress' consideration, Congress signed it, then REPLACED it OMITTING that section. To date, the Arabs have NO RECORD or any Treaty containing the phrase they had demanded from Congress.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Moreover, America's Treaty of Paris, which WAS in fact written by the AMERICANS (NOT Arabs oversees) begins with the line "In the name of the most Holy Trinity" (ie: In the name of The father, The Son and The Holy Spirit).
America was NOT founded on RELIGION. It was founded BY Christians, founded ON the Gospel of Christ, structured on the LAWS of GOD, & God was made our sole legal granter of right & liberties. There exist NO legal document that states your rights come from elsewhere.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
The Treaty of Tripoli was written by americans Joel Barlow and Joseph Donaldson, and ratified unanimously, with article 11, by the senate and signed, with article 11, by John Adams. The US Federal State was not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion. And whether some slave-owners did not understand logic or that there are no such thing as deities is irrelevant to the FACT that there is as much evidence for deities as there is for Harry Potter. Christianity is made up.
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
@qwertypoiu4321 (QUOTE): "The Treaty of Tripoli was written by americans Joel Barlow" (END QUOTE)
It was TRANSLATED by Barlow. The original was written in ARABIC!!
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Religion is the basis and Foundation of Government."
--James Madison (Father of The Constitution)
"Before any man can be considered as a member of civil society, he must be considered as a subject of the Governor of the Universe. And to the same Divine Author of every good and perfect gift [James 1:17] we are indebted for all those privileges and advantages, religious as well as civil, which are so richly enjoyed in this favored land."
--James Madison (Father of The Constitution)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Freedom is not a gift bestowed upon us by other men, but a right that belongs to us by the laws of God and nature."
--Benjamin Franklin
"The future and success of America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of God upon which this Constitution is founded.”
--James Madison (Father of The Constitution)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"We have no government armed in power capable of contending in human passions ubridled by morality and religion. Our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other."
-- John Adams
(Signer of the Declaration Of Independence; One [of two] signers of the Bill Of Rights; 2nd President of the United States of America)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
“Now all acts of legislature apparently contrary to natural right and justice, are, in our laws, and must be in the nature of things, considered as void. The laws of nature are the laws of God; whose authority can be superseded by no power on earth. A legislature must not obstruct our obedience to Him from whose punishments they cannot protect us. All human constitutions which contradict His [God’s] laws, we are in conscience bound to disobey.”
--George Mason (Father of the Bill Of Rights)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Ben Franklin describing the America to the French: "Bad examples to youth are more rare in America, which must be a comfortable consideration to parents. To this may be truly added, that serious religion, under its various denominations, is not only tolerated,but respected and practised. Atheism is UNKNOWN there; infidelity rare and secret; so that persons may live to a great age in that country without having their piety shocked by meeting with either an Atheist or an Infidel."
--Ben Franklin
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The Bible is the cornerstone of liberty."
--Thomas Jefferson
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Bible is the Cornerstone of Liberty!? rofl hahaha
your trying to quote someone who was against have Religion taught in college lol. WAKE THE FUCK UP.
more people have died because of Religion then anything else. Liberty my ass.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
"Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen."
--Thomas Jefferson
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
By the way, the old, major Universities were in fact founded by CHRISTIANS for the express purpose of educating people in the Bible so that they could understand the Constitution and make good leaders.
Speaking of education:
"Education is useless without the Bible."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America" \ Legislature )
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Speaking of the Father Of Public Education in America:
"The religion which has introduced civil liberty is the religion of Christ and his apostles, which enjoins humility, piety and benevolence; which acknowledges in every person a brother, or a sister, and a citizen with equal rights. This is genuine Christianity , and to this we owe our free constitutions of government."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America" \ Legislature )
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker go to ANY Top University in the world and tell every Leading scientists s that the "Lord God" is real and the bible is 100% truth.
They will laugh at you, what is your response to that? your going to come back and tell me your smarter then one of the top 10 scientists in the world?
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
The Founding fathers all agreed that the most important part of education was learning the Bible early on in school. They stressed that every American should know his Bible because the Bible is the foundation upon which the whole structure (USA) rests.
"Our citizens should early understand that the genuine source of correct republican principles is the Bible, particularly the New Testament, or the Christian religion."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America" \ Legislature )
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The Christian religion… is the basis, or rather the source, of all genuine freedom in government. I am persuaded that no civil government of a republican form can exist and be durable in which the principles of Christianity have not a controlling influence."
--Noah Webster ("The Father Of Public Education in America")
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The constitutional freedom of religion [is] the most inalienable and sacred of all human rights."
--Thomas Jefferson
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker still going on about Jefferson lol. doesn't change the fact what he said, his actions showed what he thought. he was not AT in favor of having Religion taught at Virginia college. he asked Thomas pain to come back to the USA and keep writing what he wrote.
Thomas Pain went to France cause a bunch of Nutty Christians wanted to kill him.
THE USA IS NOT founded on the Christian Beliefs
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): :"Thomas Pain went to France cause a bunch of Nutty Christians wanted to kill him." (END QUOTE)
Your beloved new found hero, your so called "Thomas Paine" had ZERO to do with the Declaration, ZERO to do with the Constitution, ZERO to do with the Federalist Papers....ZERO, ZERO...ZERO.
There was a guy named "ROBERT" Paine who was a player in the founding of the nation but NO "Thomas" Paine. The guy YOU'RE talking about was a guy NOT even liked by the founders.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker It wasn't till the 1950's that Christians started adding things to the Government like, "one nation under God"?
Webster molded the KJV to correct grammar, replaced words that were no longer used, and did away with words and phrases that could be seen as offensive. changed the bible=changing history.
kind of like how the NKJV does today calling "manmasters" kidnappers.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
Abraham Lincoln's famous "Under God" was intentionally added to the money during the Cold War when communists were threatening a takeover from within our borders (see: Communist Goals For America uncovered by Congress only a few years later). A peoples' worldview (religion or lack thereof) will determine their model / form of Government. The Communist's MAIN obstacle for complete takeover is GOD. They must transfer us from an "under God" model of Gov to an "under man" model.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Now consider what your adversaries have said:
"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."
—Nikita Khrushchev (on the demise of America)
"We will bury your grand-children without firing a shot" -Khrushchev (on turning the West communist from within).
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
“My object in life is to dethrone God and destroy capitalism. We are ruthless and ask no quarter from you. When our turn comes we shall not disguise our terrorism. The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.”
— Karl Marx (Father of Communism, atheist, humanist, political economist & sociologist)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
You should be thankful that our founders structured our model of Government so that GOD alone is your sole legal granter of rights and liberties.
You may personally hate God --and that's bad for you & for society -- but the ONLY reason you are free is because our founders did NOT trust in men, so they made sure that your rights and liberties were OFF LIMITS to the tyrannically inclined power-hungry hands of sinners (men)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"If thou wouldst rule well, thou must rule for God, and to do that, thou must be ruled by him....Those who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants."
--William Penn
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The rights of man come not from the generosity of the State but from the hand of God."
--John F. Kennedy
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
“The guiding principle and prayer of this Nation has been, is now, and ever shall be ‘In God We Trust.’"
--John F. Kennedy
"We can not read the history of our nation without reckoning with the place the Bible has occupied in shaping the advances of the Republic. Where we have been the truest and most consistent in obeying its precepts we have attained the greatest measure of contentment and prosperity."
--Franklin D. Roosevelt
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Even Woodrow Wilson understood these truths:
"America was born a Christian nation. America was born to exemplify that devotion to the elements of righteousness which are derived from the revelations of the Holy Scripture."
--Woodrow Wilson
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The foundations of our society and our Government rest so much on the teachings of the Bible that it would be difficult to support them if faith in these teachings would cease to be practically universal in our Country."
--Calvin Coolidge
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Without God there could be no American form of Government nor an American way of life. Recognition of the Supreme being is the first--the most basic--expression of Americanism."
--Dwight D. Eisenhower
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Every thinking man, when he thinks, realizes that the teachings of the Bible are so interwoven and entwined with our whole civic and social life that it would be literally-I do not mean figuratively, but literally impossible for us to figure what that loss would be if these teachings were removed. We would lose all the standards by which we now judge both public and private morals; all the standards towards which we, with more or less resolution, strive to raise ourselves."
--Theodore Roosevelt
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
“America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its PATRIOTISM, its MORALITY and its SPIRITUAL LIFE. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within.”
— Joseph Stalin (Dictator & Russian political leader of the USSR)
“Give me your four year olds, and in a generation I will build a socialist state.” “Destroy the family, you destroy the country.”
— Vladimir Lenin (Communist Dictator of the USSR who lead the Bolshevik Revolution)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Thomas pain inspired American you dumb shit., you also forgot to comment on the University comment :) knew you would avoid that.
but it's nice that you try to prop up the Founding Fathers,who did not take one from the bible granted. as statted no matter how much you bring him up saying "nice" things about the bible, HE WAS NOT A CHRISTIAN. Thomas Jefferson had a Bible,the Koran and a Number of other books in the white house.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
Go read Blackstone and Locke. Paine was a guy who wrote ZERO in the way of law or Government documents.
Next you'll claim that Michael Moore inspired the invention of the light bulb because, like Paine, he too he wrote a book nobody liked.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Michael Moore? Paine's book are very good books, hell Jefferson was a big fan of them,
but lets get back to the real topic which a few people have already told you..Most the Founding Fathers were not Christian. but yet you keep trying to tell us that's not true but history says other wise.
Michael Moore is a retard...only a retard would ever bring him up in a topic.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
I simply do not believe that your communist model of Government is a good idea for Americans. I prefer having God as our sole legal granter of rights and liberties. Placing us into an "under man" rule of Government might satisfy your PERSONAL contempt for God and our nation;s Christian heritage BUT you would surely be the first to REGRET making the exchange once the new form of Government were installed.
When you say you want God out of Government, ye know NOT what ye ask.
You don't think deep
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Where in the Bible does God give us democracy and freedom?
ProgressiveInAmerica 11 months ago
@ProgressiveInAmerica
If I'm not mistaken the later book talks about electing leaders.
And freedom is a vague term.
ivlfounder 10 months ago
@Mr88playmaker
Read the first amendment, comrade.
PS; The real American motto as composed by the founding fathers temselves was not the current one, but the following: "E Pluribus Unum", "Out of many, one.". Referring to the states being united.
The founding fathers specifically clarified that "God" had no place in the government, and I applaud them for it.
- Do svidaniya.
TheFacelessActivist 8 months ago
@Mr88playmaker David Humphreys, Joel Barlow and Joseph Donaldson negotiated the treaty, and after writting a treaty representing the US Federal State, translated it into english. The Sentate UNANIMOUSLY ratified the US version WITH article 11, and John Adams SIGNED the US version WITH article 11. The US Federal State was not, in ANY sense, founded on the christian religion.
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
To say that religion is "bigger now" in America than it ever has been is to say that there are more Christian Americans "on the books" than there has ever been. This may be true, but let's not forget our growing population. There are far more Americans -in general- than there ever has been. Statistics show that, per-capita, agnosticism is actually the fastest growing belife pattern in the United States. Traditional religions have maintained the same average that they have always held.
firebuilder71 1 year ago
If god wanted us to think he would have given us a brain & a conscience. But it's quite obvious that in his infinite wisdom he gave us neither.
Gods were invented by primitive peoples to sooth their ignorance & fear - some things never change...
BTW - Mark Twain was a genius!
samecrap 1 year ago 2
Garry is my great uncle.
momomonkiluv 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker: You should really take some sort of government class because you have a rather awful misunderstanding of US law. I would reply to your individual claims but it appears you've flooded the entire comment section with them.
jansenvs76 1 year ago
It is clear that America was founded as a Christian nation as our founding fathers made it ILLEGAL for NON-Christians to serve in Government. They made it ILLEGAL for atheists to hold public office (or be heard in a courtroom for that matter) AND it is STILL -- according to a number of State Constitutions across the Country TODAY - illegal for atheists to serve in Government.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Separation of church and state" does NOT appear in the U.S. Constitution. It DOES appear in the Russian Constitution. Separation of church & state was introduced in the U.S. in the 1960s by the communists, in accordance with the "Communist Goals for America" which supports the Marxist doctrine (and agrees with our founding fathers) that the FOUNDATION of American's freedom is GOD & religion; and that by removing Christianity, America's free institutions of Gov are dismantled & the US will fall
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Our Founders insisted that the preservation of our rights and freedoms RELY on GOD as Supreme Ruler.
The enemies of America KNOW that they MUST make us one nation under MAN.
“My object in life is to DETHRONE God and destroy capitalism” “we are ruthless and ask no quarter from you. When our turn comes we shall not disguise our terrorism.” “The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.”
— Karl Marx (Father of Communism, atheist, humanist, political economist & sociologist)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
The Communists have been indoctrinating Americans to "hate God" and "Turn against religion." Young people especially, who have NO idea how our free institutions of Government are structured, actually think (they've been taught) that there is something secular about being the first nation in human history conceived in liberty and NOT ruled by man. The "hate on God" campaign is not about making them "free-thinkers" it's about taking AWAY ALL of their FREEDOMS, including what they can think.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Religion is the basis and Foundation of Government."
--James Madison
(Father of the U.S. Constitution)
"The future and success of America is not in this Constitution, but in the laws of God upon which this Constitution is founded.”
--James Madison
Remember, Congress used the State Capitol building as a CHURCH for 150 years. The signers of the Constitution, all of Congress, every President, everyone, worshiped in the State Capitol building.
Sep of church & state was invented the 1960s.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
By law, no American's rights & liberties are granted by humans. We are a nation founded on our DISTRUST in man. It's why our rights are unalienable. Communists know that the key to our destruction is in removing our official, legal, SOLE granter of rights (GOD) from the collective mind, and thus from our "Under God" structure of Government. That way, into the hands of men we go.
Marxists are ONLY interested in replacing our Granter with what our founders call TYRANNY.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker FALSE. Majority of the Founding Fathers..were not Christians nor did the Believe in the bible.
Washington Didn't, Jefferson ,Thomas Pain,Benjamin franklin, etc etc etc
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
Not true. Franklin believed in a Creator who governs in the affairs of men & he prayed to him. Jefferson believed Jesus was the Christ and only had a problem wrapping his head around 'The Trinity.' Thomas Paine had ZERO to do with the Declaration or the Constitution or any of it. He was a DEIST who believed in a CREATOR who created the universe and left it to itself. It is STILL, today, ILLEGAL in most of the U.S. 50 states for an ATHEIST to serve in Government.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker False. do you even bother reading history? Franklin thought there was a god for every star.
Thomas Paine was a atheist you dumb ass. read his book age of Reasoning which you never have.
Franklin Support Paine 100% on that book so did Thomas Jefferson.
ILLEGAL!? ya don't ever comment. on this subject again! The Constitution clearly states no Religion will be allowed in the Government and No Religious Test shall be given either. by the way Deist is not a Religion.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
Franklin had Congress pray for Divine wisdom and guidance from God, for four hours per day, each day, before commencing to work on the Constitution.
The U.S. State Capitol building was used, by Congress and every sitting US President, as the nation's 1st "Super Church" building for our country's 1st 150 years. A special seat was allocated for US President and Chairman of the American Bible Society Thomas Jefferson. Jefferson never missed a single church worship service at the State capitol.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Thomas Paine had NOTHING to do with the Declaration or Constitution. You won't find his signature anywhere. He was a DEIST --as Franklin had been in his youth-- believing in a CREATOR but NOT a religious man.
Paine knew that in America, by law our rights & freedoms are granted by God alone (not human Gov.) He agreed with Franklin that a nation will either be ruled by God or by tyrants. when the French attempted to teach Creation minus the Crearor, Paine ripped into them worse than anybody.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Comment removed
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
The French have had almost 20 constitutions in the time we have had only ONE.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Funny. cause the president at the time,Abraham Lincoln was not a Christian! also more then 1 moto was on U.S Money back in those days. there was a lot more then just "In God we Trust" wasn't official till the 1950's.
'Paine knew that in America, by law our rights & freedoms are granted by God alone"
are you retarded!? Paine's Book explained how Science and History should always be taught over Religion!
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
"It is fit and becoming in all people, at all times, to acknowledge and revere the Supreme Government of God; to bow in humble submission to His chastisement; to confess and deplore their sins and transgressions in the full conviction that the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom; and to pray, with all fervency and contrition, for the pardon of their past offenses, and for a blessing upon their present and prospective action.
--Abraham Lincoln
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Thomas Jefferson said nice things about Alah to the Muslims too, your point? or did you forget that first country to see the USA as a country was Muslim Country? name of that country by the way is Morocco
Supreme Government of God? USA is not Israel and since when does a GOD need a Government? ya.... that right there hurts you. you your self think god runs a Government..thus meaning God is not perfect.. careful how you word your words.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
Thomas Jefferson along with The Father of The Constitution James Madison, and original chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court, founding father John Jay and the others, all prescribed Christianity as THE preferred religion of and for all Americans. Not only does our Country's very Mission Statement (The Mayflower Compact) specify this but the drafters & signers of the Declaration & U.S. Constitution stress this repeatedly to no end. Hence all 50 State Constitutions recognize GOD.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker recognize God? god of what? water? god of thor? not even the States label "LORD God" in anything it just says GOD.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE) "recognize God? god of what?" (END QUOTE)
The God of the Christian Bible: Creator of heaven and earth, to whose LAWS all people are naturally and inescapably subject to. (see: Blackstone and Locke on "Nature's God.")
America is the 1st nation in human history that guaranteed individual rights and liberties BECAUSE unlike in the rest of the world, in America your rights & liberties are granted and secured ONLY by GOD, NOT by men. Jefferson warned us to retain as granter.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The Bible is the cornerstone of liberty."
--Thomas Jefferson
Without GOD we would be placed (r foolishly place ourselves) under tyranny i.e. an "under man" model of government as opposed to our safe and secure "under God model.
"God who gave us life and liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are a gift of God?"
--Thomas Jefferson
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Thomas Jefferson was definitely not a Christian lol
10trojan10 1 year ago
"Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen."
--Thomas Jefferson
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Cutting up the Bible doesn't seem to religious to me
10trojan10 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Holy shit! Jefferson didn't want Religion taught at the Virginian University... do you not understand this!? he was not a Christian he said it him self countless times.
Hell after all your telling me it's Illegal for a non-Christian to serve in the Government!? guess what there are thousands of people in the Government are! but hey...you want to support slavery then go right ahead
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950
ha! As President, Thomas Jefferson signed bills which appropriated financial support for Christian chaplains in Congress and in the armed services.
April 10, 1806, Jefferson signed the Articles of War, in which he: "Earnestly recommends to all officers and soldiers, diligently to attend divine services."
Thomas Jefferson was also the Chairman of THE AMERICAN BIBLE SOCIETY! According to Jefferson it was his all time highest, most important role in all his service to America!
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker atheist is incapable of making an valid oath!?Bullshit. pure crap. go tell that to a few U.S Marines who are ahiest see hat happens. it's called being a American
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
Comment removed
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
(QUOTE) "go tell that to a few U.S Marines who are ahiest see hat happens. it's called being a American" (END QUOTE)
The official U.S. Military Code of Conduct (Article Six) states: “I will never forget that I am an American, fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and in the United States of America.”
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): "Hell after all your telling me it's Illegal for a non-Christian to serve in the Government!?" (END QUOTE)
I said that still, today, in most Sate Constitutions, it is ILLEGAL for an atheist to hold a Government office.
For hundreds of years, an atheist was NOT allowed to testify in a U.S. Court of law because an atheist is incapable of making an valid oath. Likewise, atheists were denied any involvement with Government. Look it up and you'll see that not much has changed.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
10trojan10 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): "Thomas Jefferson said nice things about Alah to the Muslims too, your point?" (END QUOTE)
I too say nice things about Muslims and Hindus and Deists and sometimes even atheists from time to time. What "point" would that make? That I'm a Muslim-Hindu-Deist.atheist? No. Of course not.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Almighty God, Who has given us this good land for our heritage; We humbly beseech Thee that we may always prove ourselves a people mindful of Thy favor and glad to do Thy will. Bless our land with honorable ministry, sound learning, and pure manners. Save us from violence, discord, and confusion, from pride and arrogance, and from every evil way. Defend our liberties, and fashion into one united people, the multitude brought hither out of many kindreds and tongues" --Thomas Jefferson (see prt2)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
part 2 (continuation of Jefferson's prayer)
"Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen."
--Thomas Jefferson
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Dogmeat1950 (QUOTE): :USA is not Israel and since when does a GOD need a Government?" (END QUOTE)
Look a dollar bill and note the Israeli Star Of David drawn out in little stars, above the head of the eagle.
"The highest glory of the American Revolution was this; it CONNECTED in ONE indissoluble BOND the principles of civil GOVERNMENT with the principles of CHRISTIANITY."
--John Q Adams
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Now all acts of legislature apparently contrary to natural right and justice, are, in our laws, and must be in the nature of things, considered as void. The laws of nature are the laws of God; whose authority can be superseded by no power on earth. A legislature must not obstruct our obedience to Him from whose punishments they cannot protect us. All human constitutions which contradict His [God’s] laws, we are in conscience bound to disobey.”
--George Mason (Father Of The Bill Of Rights)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The fundamental basis of this nation's law was given to Moses on the Mount. The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teaching we get from Exodus and St. Matthew, from Isaiah and St. Paul. I don't think we emphasize that enough these days. If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally end up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in the right for anybody except the state."
--U.S. President Harry S. Truman
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"No free government now exists in the world, unless where Christianity is acknowledged, and is the religion of the country. Christianity is part of the common law. Its foundations are broad and strong and deep. It is the purest system of morality and only stable support of all human laws."
-- Pennsylvania Supreme Court, 1824
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"The morality of the country is deeply ingrafted upon Christianity, and not upon the doctrines or worship of other religions. In people whose manners are refined, and whose morals have been elevated and inspired with a more enlarged benevolence, it is by means of the Christian religion."
-- United States Supreme Court, 1811
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Religion must be considered as the foundation on which the whole structure rests. In this age there can be no substitute for Christianity; the great conservative element on which we must rely for the purity and permanence of free institutions."
-- House Judiciary Committee, 1854
"The great vital and conservative element in our system is the belief of our people in the pure doctrines and divine truths of the gospel of Jesus Christ."
-- House Judiciary Committee, 1854
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest of our Christian nation, to select and prefer Christians for their rulers."
--John Jay (Founding Father; President of Congress; very FIRST/original Chief Justice of the United States Supreme Court)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Hell Thomas Jefferson wanted Science also taught over Religion and not have Religion taught at Virgina College.
He rejected the superstitions and mysticism of Christianity, that is stated by Jefferson him self.
Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
-Thomas Jefferson, Notes on Virginia, 1782
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Time for the NAIL in the Coffin!
Priests...dread the advance of science as witches do the approach of daylight and scowl on the fatal harbinger announcing the subversions of the duperies on which they live.
-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to Correa de Serra, April 11, 1820
Ya.... what was that about Jefferson Being a Christian and loving god? ya.. get off the Bullshit and READ history. I can't stand the fact that your so dumb to such things.
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
@Mr88playmaker Come on! try and change HISTORY NOW!
Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because if there be one he must approve of the homage of reason more than that of blindfolded fear.
-Thomas Jefferson,, August 10, 1787
Dogmeat1950 1 year ago
Three practical reasons why the Communists had the Pledge of Allegiance removed from the U.S. classrooms.
(1) Pledge is an oath of allegiance (see document "Communist Goals for America")
(2) Pledge states that America is a Republic (communists need to convince Americans that it's a Democracy)
(3) Pledge acknowledges GOD who is our sole legal granter of rights and liberties (Communists need to turn America secular and, consequently, as such, placed under a "rule of man" form of Government)
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
If you ask an average American today what the purpose of the Constitution is, he has no idea that it is essentially a means by which we the people RESTRAIN Government from encroaching on our God given rights and liberties. The document begins "WE the People" and then goes on to BIND and CHAIN the hands of Government. That's all. That's what the Constitution is.
The 1st Amendment does NOT restrict anybody but lawmakers,
The problem lately is that COURTS are LEGISLATING from the bench.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of a religion or prohibit the free exercise thereof."
Take the test:
Question: A teacher wears a cross necklace to school. Unconstitutional?
Answer: No, because she's not Congress.
Question: Congress holds church services in the State Capitol building, Unconstitutional?
Answer: No, Because Congress has not made a LAW, and Congress enjoys freedom of religion.
For 150 yrs, Congress held church services in the State Capitol building.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
For this reason the U.S. Constitution restricts Congress from making a LAW. Congress is the legislative branch. The 1st Amendment restricts Congress, and Congress ALONE form making a law regarding any one of the establishments, either good or bad. Whether in favor of or against.
This ensures "Freedom of Religion". That means that NOBODY, not you, not me, not Congress, not the President is restricted from religious expression in Government or outside of Government.
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
Christian Gov. model vs. Atheist Gov. model:
“America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its PATRIOTISM, its MORALITY and its SPIRITUAL LIFE. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within.”
— Joseph Stalin (Dictator & Russian political leader of the USSR)
“Give me your four year olds, and in a generation I will build a socialist state.” “Destroy the family, you destroy the country.”
— Vladimir Lenin (Communist Dictator of the USSR )
Mr88playmaker 1 year ago
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MAYFLOWER COMPACT: "Having undertaken, for the Glory of God and advancement of the Christian Faith...a Voyage to plant the First Colony in the Northern Parts of Virginia, do by these presents solemnly and mutually in the presence of God and one of another, Covenant and Combine ourselves together into a Civil Body Politic, for our better ordering and preservation and furtherance of the ends aforesaid…at Cape Cod, the 11th of November...Anno Domini 1620."
VeritasEstLibertas 1 year ago
when america was foundet, it liberated itself from the british crown. Like all Royals in all countries, the british royal family claimed to be put into place by god.
To free themselves from this belief, america was founded with a freedom of religion, meaning, that whatever religion you believe in, is your personal choice and the state itself will not prefer one religion over another.
anyone claiming that america is a christian nation, obviously lacks of knowledge of american history.
liquidminds 1 year ago
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"As the government of the united states of america is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Musselmen; and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitian nation..." - Treaty with Tripoli, drafted in 1796 under George Washington and signed by John Adams in 1797. Eat this you fundamentalists
pricardo333 1 year ago
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scribd (dot) com/nb812
DreamsofMajesty 1 year ago
"Art. 11: As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on Christian religion; so it has in itself no character or enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility of Mussulmen..." - Treaty of Tripoli, 1797
SexyMelon 1 year ago
@SexyMelon MAYFLOWER COMPACT: "Having undertaken, for the Glory of God and advancement of the Christian Faith...a Voyage to plant the First Colony in the Northern Parts of Virginia, do by these presents solemnly and mutually in the presence of God and one of another, Covenant and Combine ourselves together into a Civil Body Politic, for our better ordering and preservation and furtherance of the ends aforesaid…at Cape Cod, the 11th of November...Anno Domini 1620."
VeritasEstLibertas 1 year ago
@VeritasEstLibertas History (Plymouth =/= Founding of America), constitution (First Amendment) and comprehension (Lots of "God" =/= Any mention of anything being established on Christian faith) and other epic fails.
US was the first bright light for humanity in being not openly founded on religious bigotry, persecution, separation and egotism, but freedom of religion. Even though its modern inhabits are doing their damn best to drag it down to the dark ages, you can't rewrite history.
SexyMelon 1 year ago
@SexyMelon The Mayflower Compact was the first written constitution in a land that would become the United States of America; thus, the Mayflower Compact was the constitutional foundation of this country. You can re-write history all you want, but the facts are the facts, and the facts prove that this country was founded by Christians for the "Glory of God" and the "advancement of the Christian Faith."
VeritasEstLibertas 1 year ago
@VeritasEstLibertas Plymouth was one of numerous Brittish colonies, and it in no way, shape, or form had any constitution of its own, and the document you cite mentions absolutely nothing to the capacity of that colony, less of all what was to become United States, to be founded on any religion.
SexyMelon 1 year ago
@SexyMelon You are ignorant of the facts. Plymouth did have a constitution: the Mayflower Compact.
VeritasEstLibertas 1 year ago
@VeritasEstLibertas "this country was founded by Christians for the "Glory of God"
Sorry, not even what you quoted says anything like this. But then it's not the document the country was founded on: what it is founded on is the Constitution and Bill of Rights, and they establish separation of church and state in the very first amendment.
US was founded by religious and non-religious people alike fleeing religious persecution. And you're trying to bring it back. For shame.
SexyMelon 1 year ago
@SexyMelon Using your thinking, Russia was founded in 1993, with the adoption of its constitution.
VeritasEstLibertas 1 year ago
@VeritasEstLibertas "Russia was founded in 1993, with the adoption of its constitution."
That's retarded. And Russia has what to do with this?
"Plymouth did have a constitution: the Mayflower Compact."
What part of "Compact" did you misread as "constitution" exactly?
Plymouth was one of many British colonies. The compact is a written contract between crew members establishing the colony's allegiance to King of Britain.
No shit they were Christian.
SexyMelon 1 year ago
@SexyMelon Using your "logic," Russia was founded in 1993. Just because you are etymologically challenged, does not mean that a word lacks a specific meaning.
VeritasEstLibertas 1 year ago
@VeritasEstLibertas "Using your "logic," Russia was founded in 1993."
No thanks. Go read what the comment said and stop making stupid strawmen.
"Just because you are etymologically challenged"
Since the discussion has nothing to do with etymology, I'm going to call this a case of genuine irony.
SexyMelon 1 year ago
@VeritasEstLibertas What would be accurate to say is that American colonies to become the States of America were founded by Christians, by a country with Christianity as enforced state religion.
United States as we know it, founded by the - you'd think - appropriately named "founding fathers" - many of whom were agnostic, deist, atheist *as well as* Christian and highly devout - is established on freedom of religion among other values, not religious segregation as practiced before.
SexyMelon 1 year ago
Actually what I wonder is why Americans care so much about how or why their country was founded. I mean these founding fathers also kept slaves, so you know... who cares? Society now is very different then a century or two ago anyway. With different problems.
Why not just see which country deals with what issue the most effectively and try their system?
Shavarnarak 1 year ago
@Shavarnarak
I mean on religion for example it's very simple. Theocracies like Saudi Arabia and Mauritania, or the Christian Dark Ages in Europe are/where HORRIBLE places to live. And on top of that America has at least a tenth, and probably well over a tenth of people that are not Christians. Which is AT LEAST 30 million people. And the christians are divided in all these different sects.
So a fundie theocracy would CLEARLY be a HORRIBLE idea.
Shavarnarak 1 year ago
He who has an ear to hear let him or her hear!
brotherfrank62 1 year ago
I'm not an american, but I have read the US constitution, and I don't see any of the ten commandments written in it, nor do I see a single mention of a guy named Jesus.
CodaCola 1 year ago
@CodaCola Also, The US was founded as a constitutional republic, and the concept of republic was first implemented by Greek and Roman Pagans, NOT christians.
If the US was really founded as a christian nation, it would be closer to a totalitarian monarchy, which is what most christian nations were during the first 1500+ years of christianity's existence.
CodaCola 1 year ago
It's true, in the 1700's there were less people going to church less often.
yuothineyesasian 1 year ago
Just heard Prof. Wills on Commonwealth Club podcast on new book Bomb Power - what a GREAT speaker and what important information he is speaking on. I had to look him up on You Tube to learn more about him. This was great too, and def. inline with what I've learned from my history classes.
sciencebabe 1 year ago
They were infidels, whats wrong with that?
shane4896 1 year ago
TO ANY ONE WHO SEE THIS VIDEO PLEASE TYPE AND SEARCH RANDY FORBES!!!
the reason why i ask this is because congressman Forbes says the exact Opposite of what Mr. Wills is saying, and im a little Confused
DethMetalNinja1 1 year ago
Don't be. Congressman Forbes is, unfortunately, misled. All of the "evidence" he presents in defense of America's "Judeo-Christian" heritage is ambiguous at best. Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, George Washington, and several other of America's founding fathers were initiates in the mystery school ( ancient science) of religion.
BrutusBlackest 1 year ago
The separation of church and state clause in the constitution is word magic. Its there to illicit a particular thought pattern.
BrutusBlackest 1 year ago
There are more churches here than any other nation, and more people that call themselves christians that are for many whom do not imitate the christ.
SpringChatty 1 year ago
Jesus Christ has returned. I AM.
IAMJESUSmovie 2 years ago
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ArcticCatAndy 2 years ago
elbethere: every time a fed. judge rules against a community, city, or state in public prayer, Christmas or Easter celebrations, or any other religious celebration they are violating the 1st amend. Read the 1st amend. again very carefully. It says "congress shall make no law". It doesn't say anything about any private group.
blessedvic 2 years ago
You are incorrect. The interpretation of the Constitution to state and local law is a product of the 19th century. As for the idea of "that statement" keeping government out of religion, how do you do that without keeping religion, as important a thing it is in daily lives and decision making of the people, out of government? Jefferson's letters, from which the statement comes, clearly illustrate his intentions and meaning in drafting the establishment clause.
elbethere 2 years ago
The Establishment Clause goes on to say that there shall be no law establishing religion nor of prohibiting free exercise thereof.
It also means that if a community wants to have a day of prayer that is endorsed by the local government, that same government had better allow all religions equal access and expression of their own religious views. And this issue does not begin to address the issue of non-religious Americans.
bumbul81 2 years ago
elbethere: it was liberal judges who, in the early 20th cent., took Jefferson's private letter out of context and turned the 1st amend. upside down to meant the exact opposite of what the founders meant.
blessedvic 2 years ago
elbethere: That statement was meant to keep the fed. gov. out of religion. It was meant to keep the fed. gov. from creationg a national religion. No where in that statement does it say religion shall not participate in government decisions. BTW, no where in that statement are the words "sep. of church and state".
blessedvic 2 years ago
stevenstreets: nice speech. Still didn't answer my question. Where did you learn that people were fleeing Europe because of Christian persecution?
blessedvic 2 years ago
pbirv: there is no mention of "separation of church and state" in the Constitution. That never stopped liberal judges from creating it out of thin air.
BTW, every state constitution mentions God. It was left up to the states to decide religous matters.
blessedvic 2 years ago
Its in the establishment clause to the first amendment. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
elbethere 2 years ago
Who cares whether or not the founding fathers (last I checked, Jefferson and Madison were two of them) intended for there to be a "wall of seperation" b/w church and state. The FACT is that that is how it was interpreted, which should show you that THAT is what was deemed to best serve the country. You see, we INTERPRET our constitution to serve the changing needs of our society. If it were really up to the founding fathers, we'd still have slaves, disenfranchised women, etc. PROGRESSIVE!!!
sartrekk 2 years ago
Worth watching: America's Heritage is NOT Christian: True or False?
TheRationalthinker 2 years ago
... please watch: AMERICA IS NOT A CHRISTIAN NATION: TRUE OR FALSE?
TheRationalthinker 2 years ago
America was created by people escaping from christians. Most of Columbus sailors were jews desparate to get out of Spain. They came here in a ship named after a Jewish mother. Their hemp sails filled with the sacred wind blowing over the face of the deep. God made a new world so people could escape from christians. But if they behave themselves and keep their hands off other peoples reproductive functions they are welcome here too. Otherwise go back to whatever hell they crawled out of. ICXCNIKI
stevenstreets3 2 years ago