Derren Brown - Conducting An Orchestra By Thought Part 2

[classicaddict2010]

whoa!!!

amazing!

[janeswurld]

4:38 hahahah shes all like cocky darren brown

[DreamerHind]

Do you suppose there could be something written on the paper Derren is holding that is perhaps invisible or hard to discern, but is actually there nevertheless?

[computersolutions164]

Possibly yes but then the "running order" of the guesses that Derren makes would have to be known by Robin in advance, but yes it is possible. The guess woyuld also have to be known by the orchestra. But by looking at him when he was conducting they would "know" when they were playing the correct piece.

[solopaola]

At 2:11 he says "you might want to play scales", and the Ode to Joy would probably be the first piece that comes to mind when playing scales (and which any musician knows), so there was a very high probability that some musician would start playing that, with the others following in the way you described.

[Reinocerous25]

I don't think all of the musicians were just playing scales. there were mainly long tones to begin with.

[332546]

@Reinocerous25 yeah but just because you dont play scales fast doesnt make it not a scale, i do my scales starting with whole notes do through every speed up till 32nd notes

[pdingwell]

As a musician, I know Ode to Joy is not a scale. And why would one think of that while playing scales. Also it is Derren who tells them to play scales, and he has no knowledge of what the conductor has chosen.

[Chris45215]

@solopaola WTF?

There's a decent probability that one of the musicians will do a bit of Ode to Joy, as its a popular piece (in fact, it is the most popular piece in western music), and the conductor can make eye contact with whoever is playing it to encourage them to play louder, and the rest of the instruments catch on to it.

If you're doing scales, you would hit Adagio For Strings much earlier than Ode To Joy.

[atomicmrpelly]

Wondering what key it was meant to be in?! Surely if you're conducting the LSO you know what key Beethoven's 9th is in!!!

[computersolutions164]

Normally it is played in G for a violin and C for a guitar

[atomicmrpelly]

Violins and guitars are in the same key???

[computersolutions164]

I think guitars are strung differently

from E to E normally.

[atomicmrpelly]

Guitars and violins and pianos are all concert pitch instruments, trust me!

I've just checked it and it's in B.

[computersolutions164]

actually i have just researched this and founf that "nobody really actually knows for sure what key is was supposed to be in".

Thats the official line from the original French Manuscripts.

It works in "C", which is dead easy to play though. What is your musical background ?

[atomicmrpelly]

Right I'm gonna get the score from the library!

[computersolutions164]

Just played it on the piano it is definately in the key of C, which would make sense as the piano guitar version would be written in the key of C too.

Whether that was what Beethoven actually intended is open to question. I just looked at the original French Essay about it and it does mention "C" too

[atomicmrpelly]

"The Symphony No. 9 in D minor, Op. 125 "Choral""

That's the very first line of the Wikipedia article on the symphony.

I've got the score, that's in D as well!

[computersolutions164]

I would not pay too much attention to Wiki if I were you. i'd ask a musician.

[atomicmrpelly]

Sorry, I know Wikipedia is untrustworthy but I am a musician! And as I said I have the score in front of me and it too says 'in D minor' and if you turn to the page with the famous Ode to Joy then it is very clearly in D!

[computersolutions164]

It just seems odd to me that the original French Manuscripts and everything written about it at the time, and essays about the piece since, would suggest that Beethoven did not actually know what key it was actually in and I'm a musician too. seems odd to me thats all.

[332546]

@atomicmrpelly yeah but i can play it in Bb

F

D

and B

its just changing the key

[atomicmrpelly]

Right, good point.

[fredb3]

This song is not about Derren at all. Think about the experiance of the conductor he knows what he is listening for he can recognise the differing intruments he can just look toward the people playing who are playing the right sort of notes the person next to the player who is getting it right.

then then the people around notice that reconisable sound that the conductor is looking at and play along with it and before you know it a song emerges.

This is classical conditioning.

I'll explain

[fredb3]

To us this is just noise. concentrate enough and you can recognise each instrument, pick one out and that is a conductors job.

he is so experianced he can do it quickly and picks out the instrument getting the notes right

the musicians know robin well and pay close attention to him.

and when the one getting it right twigs that he is looking to him the musician plays louder and the musicians around him will notice and the sound will spread

derren just tells the orchestra how to see the cues :)

[Mugicla]

Didnt you just repeat aceshakazu

[fredb3]

elaborated upon the other comments aswell: classical conditioning not NLP

and aceshakazu

[atomicmrpelly]

OMG people are obsessed with saying that Derren Brown isn't impressive and doesn't use 'NLP'. Who cares about NLP?! This is impressive, your descriptions are fine, but it relies on one of the musicians deciding to play Ode to Joy from the start!

[computersolutions164]

Correct based on their interpretation of what the conductor is trying to tell them with his hands restrained..

[aceshakazu]

WHilst the orchastra is quitly playing someone in the group plays the right tune the conductor then looks at the player with his eyes open showing his correct signal, the player then gets more confident and starts playing louder the rest pick up on it and slowily all start playing

[selfreflectionII]

I am assume DB influenced the conductor to choose this piece and maybe influenced the orchestra to play it too

The the melody they played (in this key) uses just these 5 notes

D, E, F sharp, G, A

He may not have even needed to influence them much to play it because by starting with 'tuning up and playing scales' (as instructed) the melody was likely to happen naturally due to the strings section's open tunings (compare with melody)

Violin G, D, A, E

Viola, Cello C, G, D, A

Bass E, A, D, G

[computersolutions164]

Correct I sort of arrived at this conclusion after speaking to my piano teacher about it.

[selfreflectionII]

OK so that must be it then ! ... I think in that case he must have done ground work before this clip starts when chatting casually with the conductor to implant 'Ode to Joy' in his mind - something he says and/ or does at the start of this clip must then be the trigger to make him think of it as if it popped into his mind ....

[akaCharlieG]

this is genius

he's just a mentalist who can use NLP and psychology

[lestep]

The piece is very simple. The melody is a lolly-pop melody. I can't think of a classical piece with a simpler main theme.

Impressive all the same. I agree with DSLupus below that NLP seems to be somewhat of a red herring.

[computersolutions164]

I think there are elements of NLP that do work and bits of it that are two general to work. Perhaps you should look at another technique Derren uses FACS (Facial Action Coding System) developed in the 20's

[lestep]

Rightio thanks for the tip.

[josscrowcroft]

that's crazy i was saying to my friend "it's beethoven 9, i know it..."

then it happened >:/ lol

[computersolutions164]

If you stop and think about it for a moment when you tap your foot to a tune, that you visualise in your head, without actually humming the tune. Have you ever noticed that the person sitting next to you also starts to think of exactly the same tune. I'm going to see Derren in April I'll ask him !

[OpusIra]

Is this guy a NLP expert or something?

[computersolutions164]

Yup !

[DSLupus]

The way I hear it, Derren actually doesn't believe NLP to be anything more than a pseudoscience. He uses it as a red herring, something he's rather notorious for.

[AquaEffector]

that was beautiful! thanks for posting that!

[computersolutions164]

No problem - thanks

[Aqlor]

i can understand most of derren's videos but this..too hard for me

[computersolutions164]

What do you find hard about it then ?

[willjj]

of his best performances

[kljuse616]

amazing.. great video

[computersolutions164]

Thanks !