this guy is not a hero kids u see what players get suspended and fines for nowadays? this dude would have got ejected from the nhl for both the kariya and lindros hits (blatant headshots dont even fucken think about arguing cause ive seen it a million times so dont tell me im blind this n that blah blah) bottom line is he wasnt always clean with his hits love how he doesnt say i never meant to end his career or apoligize "its a great game" right beside that cunt messier.
@gadeela "this guy is not a hero kids u see what players get suspended and fines for nowadays?" REALLY? That's like saying many great heads of state, military heroes of world history and characters in the bible would be charged, indicted and possibly executed for what they did. You can't blame an individual for the era that they lived. "Hate the game, don't hate tha playa!" :-)
@lkadubic dude shut the fuck up, i dont hate the player, he is a good player, but some of his hits (i.e. kariya and lindros) were complete bullshit, characters in the bible would be charged? what the hell are you talking about regardless you can argue all you want but when the human head is the first thing to move on a late hit, it is not clean.
To those that think the NHL is trying to go nancy, your wrong...Bettman states endlessly the agenda is to eliminate the head injuries while maintaining the physical aspect...Violence does sell... if athletes were invincible, the NHL would allow weapons on the ice but in reality its becoming too easy to eliminate a player from the game...A true fan of the game appreciates the great moments in hockey which the skilled players provide, who unfortunately are the main targets of these injuries.
This guy played by the rules and his hits were beautiful ...But knowing what we know now about brain injuries, and seeing these great players not being able to stand, I cant help but respect what the league is TRYING to eliminate from the game. As frustrating as it is seeing guys being suspended for TRYING to throw clean checks...Honestly, as much as I respect Stevens, Id rather of watched a healthy Lindros career..or any great player for that matter. GET RID OF THE HARD PLASTIC EQUIPMENT!
Stevens will..in the future....be remembered with embarrassment...that no one had the sense to stop this out of control gorilla from destroying some of our best players.
He certainly made many games not worth the admission..
@thegermsattack1 yeah. good point...see how popular golf is now that Tiger is pretty much out....well its the same thing as when Stevens systematically took out most of the main guys who made hockey worth watching....
As stated already...Scott Stevens is an embarrassment.....now irrelevant..just a sad remainder of of "idiot" days in hockey..
..and why move to Europe....NHL no longer tolerates any of the hits Stevens routinely dished out anyway....now they give 10 game suspensions for those..
How do you think they came to doing that?..maybe after losing millions in lost revenues when key players spent more days in recovery then on the ice.
..the problem with the NHL is that we were not able to measure the impact of concussions on players..and most did not come forward even if clearly not fit to play.
..the macho code,..you played..or were ridiculed by team-mates and management.
I was involved in the study of concussions sustained in Tier II Jr. hockey players in BC, by local University in 2004 and after 1-2..their (reaction times were already slowing).
It is only now we have the tools (MRI) to face up to this.
I am willing to exchange ideas that may differ from yours but we both have a point to make.
Remember, today MRI's are showing us horrendous things not seen in the 80's. Today's players do not need to pay a heavy price like athletes who, for example took steroids just to compete.
Its not how hockey was born anyway.
50 year old players drooling and demented is what the future holds for many of them.
Peoples physiology was not designed to take a hit from someone going 30 mph and crashing your head against the boards....(helmets are only a minor protection against a 225lb body going at that speed..or as is the case with Stevens..he usually came around his defenseman as a screen and met your speed with his...absolutely and inevitably producing a concussion almost every time he pulled off a "Steven's " type hit..
Watched an awful lot of hockey including Gretzky in minor hockey and Junior.
In the process watched a lot of ghastly injuries as well.
Example: In 1980 I watched a rookie...Norman Levier / Boston wheeled past me on a stretcher after a head-shot in Vancouver by Marc Crawford, He went up against the glass and his helmet took a pretty good jolt against it..
When I saw him he was pale as a ghost (cerebral hemorrage).
@toekneeeyeoweme He hit players when they weren't looking and most vulnerable and caused some brain injuries I'm sure. Should he be envied for ending careers? Is this what hockey is about? Trying to cause the greatest injuries? After their careers these players have to live with brains injuries for the rest of their lives. People here worship this guy for inflicting these injuries? There are some very sick individuals here.
@varsume That was a different era. Of course we know much more about head injuries now than we do now but that's irrelevant. He played the game cleanly. He took very, very few elbowing penalties and earned mythical, legendary status for ending that whiny coward of a player Lindros.
@pavyowns7 It's ok to knock any player out as long as it's done cleanly, which is what Stevens did. The fact that Lindros was a whiny primadonna only made it more satisfying...
@toekneeeyeoweme he wasn't whiny about it maybe he was just frustrated for getting like his 5th serious concussion he was a way better hockey player than Stevens also.
@pavyowns7 No, he was whiny...he cried about everything beginning with the team that drafted him. I'm sure he was frustrated but hey, that's life sometimes...As for being a better player, he was certainly gifted but lacked the heart and chin for the era he played in. His teammates didn't respect him. Stevens was a man who will be forever remembered for his heart and Lindros will be merely an afterthought.
@varsume So if a player isn't looking they get a free pass to the net? Should defenders stop defending because another player is playing stupid hockey?
So quick. You're sitting in mommy's basement awaiting the next reply? Nice homophobic comeback. I bet you're also a racist asshole who used to beat his wife before she wised up and divorced your sorry ass. You're a sad little fuck of a man and a total waste of my time, this will be the last I respond to your bullshit.
Last great open ice hitter = end of the dead puck era in the NHL. Take Stevens out of the clutch and grab era of hockey and off NJ's horribly boring trap style game and he'd be lucky to be crack the top 6 of any modern day NHL team. How'd big bad Stevens do in the Olympics? Pointless in '98 and cut from '02 gold winning team (I think Hockey Canada might know a thing or two eh?). Good riddance Stevens and that horrible era of hockey.
@horseshoes100 Your a fucking dick.... clutch & grab? Shut the fuck up you retard... You talk about the trap & it being horribly boring & why is that douchebag because it worked for The Devils & they have 3 Cups to prove that it worked.... yes you probably forgot that many other teams also used the trap after the Devils - yes back when defense was still being played in the game.... You can have your Cindy Crosby figure skater style hockey you fucking faggot...
@horseshoes100 Yeah that's right he's in the Hall Of Fame & who the fuck cares about stats in the goddamn Olympic's anyway you queer... You have to be the biggest douche on this thread talking about stats in the Olympics..... LMAO.... What a retard...
@horseshoes100 I just checked your channel your 19 years old? What the fuck do you know about anything in hockey you dipshit... Good Riddance to some 19 year old dick who doesn't know shit...
@ogrebattle22763 - Another Internet Warrior. Do the insults make you feel tough while you're (and it's "you're" not "your" retard) trolling in your mommy's basement? It's funny how Stevens' fans have such a huge bromance with him that they take things so personally. I'm not 19 (who enters personal info on youtube?) but who cares, my 9 yr old niece is more mature than you. You don't care about the Olympics because you are probably an American piece of shit, how'd you like Cindy's golden goal?
@horseshoes100 . Yeah & your another internet retard.... Talking about stats from the Olympics? LOLOLOLOLOLOL...You really are the biggest douchebag on this thread... Do the insults make me feel tough no dick they just describe you perfectly.... you don't know shit your a pansy faggot from CANADUH.... lolololol... fucking queer...
What does that have to do with anything? You're talking about Cindy's golden goal? I feel bad for Canada, they had that pussy score one of their most historic goals...
@77HeIix Are you fully or just partially retarded? Americans don't care about Olympic hockey because you haven't won gold since NHLers started playing and you're pissed off and petty about losing. Who care's who's name was on the back, there was a maple leaf on the front. I am not even a fan of Crosby but how is he a pussy? What a trite, petty and jealous little comment. Typical ignorant American.
@horseshoes100 l0l Stop talking shit on America bud, stop thinking you're all high and mighty because you're from Canada. It doesn't matter where the fuck you're from, you can be a fan of hockey you dumb fuck.
@77HeIix "I feel bad for Canada", "Crosby is a pussy"? Then you call me high and mighty? It's a little late to take the moral high ground you dumb fuck.
@horseshoes100 I feel bad that Crosby (the pussy) scored such a historic goal for their country? That's why I feel bad for you.
Again, you're a fucking fag who likes to sit behind his computer and start fights on youtube. You're not fucking better than anybody just because you're from fucking Canada, you need to stop fucking thinking that.
@88BigEtrain You have to be kidding me greatest player of the 90's. Did you only get Flyers games where you are from? What about Lemieux (5 100+ pt seasons despite not playing a full season), Or Yzerman (4 straight 100+ pt seasons). Hell I will even bring up Selanne because not only was he great in the 90's but he is STILL playing. Yes, you do have to put your head down, it is a given. He just always had his head down and if he was as strong as you say he was, he would still be playing.
@tbiggity gotta put pavel bure the Russian rocket if your going to put in the finnish flash man the old canucks vs jets rivarly finnish flash vs Russian rocket was awsome
@4JRimmer lol stevens will be remembered as the great open ice hitter who played excellent defense and won himself a few stanley cups and norris trophies while leading the league in plus minus on several occasions. only you and some other select few will be hating on him
As a life long Flyers fan I must say that Scott Stevens and the New Jersey Devils are one of the toughest, cleanest and most legendary clubs of all time. They haunted me in the 90's but looking back, what a hell of a group of players and Stevens was fucking awesome. Anyone that ever says that wasn't a clean hit is just a moron.
@Snyder2112 All the people who say that Stevens' piece of garbage hit was clean are not only morons,but also out of touch with the facts and with the present.I say it again,only those who enjoy careers being ruined and seeing players going through terrible and miserable times perhaps for the rest of their lives after their head was deliberately targeted,think that Stevens is almost a hero and a great hitter.He's neither,in fact just for that hit on Lindros I call him a piece of shit.
@MAXIMONT Yeah,he certainly was all that,no doubt.But,you don't seem to be able separate that from what we are talking about-the hit on Lindros.And he's a phony asshole who intended to finish Lindros' career.Simple as that.
@MAXIMONT Yeah,if you happen to be traded to the right team,you can be just a fighter,incapable of anything more,and you'll probably win the Cup too.(Mccarty,Parros,Grimson etc.).Stevens is somebody who isn't even invited to hockey panels concerning hitting and headshots,because he'd look like a deer in the headlight and silly.Nobody wants to hear his bullshit comments that his hits are perfectly o.k.Nobody involved in the game wants them,just Stevens does.I think his concussion messed him up.
@MAXIMONT Yeah,good for McCarty.Nothing more,nothing less.He can have his rings.Besides that moment,I almost forgot that he....Ah,forget it he tried hard to keep his NHL job.I respect that.
Here's some more information you didnt know: Lindros came into the NHL a year BEFORE McCarty, and played only TWO more career games than him. McCarty has just 8 fewer career playoff points than Lindros, too. Throw in McCarty's Cups, his heart, and his devotion to his team, I don't think any of McCarty's Wings teams wouldv'e traded McCarty for Lindros, straight up. Erica had some pretty regular season highlights, but his teammates hated him and he wilted when it mattered most.
@LtSykes He makes things up to make Lindros look terrible and make players such as Darren McCarty almost as good as Lindros.So don't worry about his comments too much.
@MAXIMONT Yeah,that sounds like Mccarty is up for HHOF induction.Don't try so hard to make Lindros look terrible and others better than him.You're doomed to failure.Yeah,sure there were some players who didn't like him such as that ungrateful loser Desjardins,who Lindros had stood up for when he was done to something Lindros didn't like etc.But other than that your info is a second hand,second rate.
@justinhottiebieber23 Yeah,tell me about it.The Legion of Doom couldn't be outplayed.Unfortunately,the line couldn't solve the goaltending situation and the play of the rest of the team.That was a job to do for the management of the Flyers.That hit is one of the biggest pieces of shit you could've ever seen.Stevens is so phony and insincere that it screams out loud.
@rothshield317 Calling Stevens a hitter is very inaccurate,calling him the best hitter ever is an insult to "clean"hitting in hockey.The best hitter ever is Lindros,period.Multi-dimensional hitter,anywhere on the ice,open hits,along the boards,shoulder to shoulder,bone crunching,boards rattling,glass shaking hits.Just about everything that Stevens wasn't capable of.
@MAXIMONT Again,winning the Stanley Cup = luck,everything going right and the team's way.Nothing else.He didn't win Conn Smythe,sure,but that doesn't mean anything at all,really.Such a player can have a one terrific play-offs and then fades away for the rest of his career.I'm not aware of the fact that Lindros isn't respected by the people involved in business of hockey.A nonsense.
@MAXIMONT By that logic,Mario,Wayne and other greats would've won the Cup at least every other season.As far as I remember Wayne hadn't won the Cup after he left the Oilers,Mario-one Cup-everything went right that year,simple as that,no other Cup since.Jeremy Roenick-wasn't lucky enough to get one either.That's the way it goes.
The reason why people watch professional sports is so they can see great players competing. There are some great players in the NHL. The really great players elevate their teams above the rest. That is why Gretzky has 5 Cups, Lemieux has TWO(not one), Jagr has two, Messier has 6, Lidstrom has 4, Niedermayer has 4, Stevens has 3, Sakic has 2, and, not coincidentally(meaning that luck was not a factor), Lindros has ZERO.
yeah..thats why Tony Esposito....Vick Hatfield...Jean Rattelle...Gilbert Perault.......just to name a few..never won one..
How many did Gretzky win in LA?...Messier in Vancouver?..Stevens in Washington..Jagr in Washington ?...Jagr in Rangers?......
Your argument point no sense..
As an owner..and you land a Gretzky or a Lemiux..you know its your shot so you stack the team..trade away future...do whatever you have to..(including trading draft picks etc.)...
Great examples, idiot. I'm sorry that those players didn't win their 16 Stanley Cups in enough different cities to please you.
Actually, the Stanley Cup teams that Gretzky, Messier, Stevens, Lemieux and Jagr were on were mostly built on draft picks. Trading away the future rarely works. Secrets out: you're wrong!
@MAXIMONT I see.Gretzky won no Cups after he left Edmonton,Jagr won two as a 18 and 19 year old rookie and thanks to Mario,then nothing,Messier is the only one having been able to win the Cup after leaving the Oilers dynasty.The others were mere contributors to the team overall effort starting with the managements's right moves all the way through goaltenders and ending with 4th line players and no major injuries to the star players at the most important moments.So,yes,luck is involved.
You ought to learn a bit more about hockey before making more idiotic comments. Jagr had 37 points in the playoffs during PITs two Cup runs. Gretzky is the greatest player ever. The others are each Hall of Famers and multi-Champions. Lindros has NOTHING on them!
Too bad Lindros isnt still on the flyers...he'd be perfect in that verizon commercial in which the flyers go 82-0. I love seeing that commercial during playoffs that the flyers have already been eliminated from.
You threw down a definitive statement about the great players making the team around them..WIN the cup...do you remember that you goofy lemur!?
Now when you cant respond to the point made about Gretzky not winning the Cup again when traded..you conveniently forget your..position on this..and resort to just stating the fucking totally obvious..bbla..bla bla Gretzky was a great player pablum
@MAXIMONT Ever heard of Lemieux and Francis?Because those two were the reason Jagr won his two Cups.Not bad teammates to have around.After that,Jagr didn't win a single one.And he is a pretty good whiner when he's played against physically.He hates that.Gretzky is the greatest ever based on statistics.But the greatest player ever overall without any weaknesses in his game is Lindros.Others could only dream of the things Lindros was capable of.Lindros=Flyers,Flyers=Lindros,forever.
@88BigEtrain Ever hear of Bobby Orr? Far better all around player than Lindros ever could be. HE had no weaknesses. Lindros couldn't take a hit, that was his weakness.
@Horganshwag55 Yeah,heard of him.And the era Orr played in?Ever watched it?Put Orr in 90s and he would be half effective.He had nothing on Lindros in overall game and you know it.And don't even get me started on physicality in the game of his era.No comparison.Lindros couldn't take a hit?You weren't sober when you were writing that.Totally ludicrous statement.
@toekneeeyeoweme Is that all you have to say?I thought so,ran out of comments that make sense and are to the point hence this teenager like comment.Maybe you should take that hard look in the mirror.
@88BigEtrain Lindros is the greatest player overall ever? Come on, you can't honestly believe that. Lindros was good sure, but greatest overall ever? That is insane, especially the "without any weakness part". All players have some sort of weakness, even Gretzky. Lindros had two HUGE weaknesses, Skating with his head down and a complete inability to take a hit.
@tbiggity Well,you made me laugh with your comments.Lindros wasn't just good,he was great and in 90s the most dominant player in the game.You need to watch the highlights more carefully because then you couldn't come up with such a ludicrous comment about him not being able to take a hit.His core was so strong and his stability on skates was out of this world,period.Every forward has his head down,because it's simply necessary thing to do to be able to control the puck,that's not a weakness.
good on you stevens, the hall of fame obviously looks good on you. retired number by your team as well and 3 cups. crybaby Erica Lindros will fade into history as the coulda-should-woulda with more concussions than stanley cup finals games played.
@st393736 He can have his 3 Cups,I don't envy them.The bottom line-Lindros gave me so much entertainment for my spent money that I will be absorbing all the flood of his great plays for the rest of my life.Stevens' garbage hits are the thing of the past and that's why you don't see him being a part of discussions about such kind of hits.He'd look like an idiot,because he still thinks, in his own world,that such a hit is perfectly o.k.Well,he has to be quiet in front of players and keep distance.
@88BigEtrain HAHAHA, you DON'T envy him? for reaching the pinnacle of any NHL player's career THREE TIMES? oh my god, find me a single player who chooses to play in this league to "entertain" fans over engraving their name on the stanley cup, or better yet, go ask lindros what he would rather have, entertain you or win the cup. the players don't care about you, me or anyone else. Lindros won't be remembered by your great grand-children cause there is no hall of the good or hall of the very good.
@st393736 Obviously,that's the goal of every player.But only fortunate ones are able to win the Cup.Are you telling me that Bourque,Jagr,Fleury(Theo) or even your Stevens weren't fortunate to win one?I don't think so.But they'd be able to tell you,don't listen to me.I've never heard players to say they were fortunate enough to win the Cup and that it happens quite often to get into the Stanley Cup final.Your last sentence-a great joke!
Bourque had to ride coattails in colorado to get one. That's different. Jagr is one of the greatest players the NHL has seen and him and Fleury(no Jagr, but still a very good player) were huge contributors on their championship teams.
The NHL draft isnt a raffle. Players dont get drafted arbitrarily. Believe it or not, at the professional level, skill is what determines champions.
@MAXIMONT Bourque won his Cup literally in his final season by being traded to the right team.Nothing more,nothing less.Jagr was a great player,but wasn't able to do anything without Mario or Francis,which again confirms what applies to Lindros as well-not good enough teammates,a different set of circumstances.Fleury won his Cup,just like Jagr,very young,and hadn't won any other since then.Skill matters,but without playing a physical,tough,grinding kind of game,and luck you don't have a chance.
First, Bourque hand-picked the team he OK'd the trade to.
So you're saying players need good teammates to win? Very insightful. The mid to late 90's Penguins were loaded, but were out-performed in the playoffs(twice by the Devils '95 and '01:)
Was Lindros tough and physical? cause he never had a chance.
@MAXIMONT Well,you just confirmed my point.No matter how loaded your team may be,it won't guarantee anything.Lindros' Flyers were never deep enough,because Clarke never got the right pieces of puzzle together.97 Stanley Cup final clearly demonstrated,which team had a depth and which didn't."Was Lindros tough and physical" is a question you're asking me?If it is,the answer is yeah,Lindros was the toughest and most physical player in history of the game.
Thats laughable. When you're given eight concussions by smaller men, you are not the toughest, nor most physical player in the history of the game. Or was that just bad luck, too?
@MAXIMONT Wow,your comment has no sense at all.If you go after somebody's head in full head and hit it in full speed,and with that hard plastic pad that you have on there you can have the size of Martin St. Louis,and I guarantee you that will get knocked out unconscious.All those losers who targeted Lindros' head needed their few moments of fame.I mean,honestly,when you mention name Stevens,the first thing that comes to mind is his head targeting hits.Pretty pathetic.
I just watched a discussion panel on TSN called "Concussions: A Crisis on Ice"...in response to the recent Crosby injury and a few others.
The panel of about 12 ex-Players, Coaches and Reporters.
They showed the effect a high hit has on the brain and all agreed that perhaps the best hockey tournament ever held in terms of quality of hockey was in Vancouver BC last year during the Olympics.
Then they ran a 2 minute reel of hits just last year.
Every one of them looked like a Scott Stevens hit!
Well..I think Scott Stevens has lost relevance in today's game...it is no longer necessary to study him... as almost any hit he made would be considered a penalty...if not now...pretty much by next year....
Certainly skilled...Scott Stevens will be considered an impressive dinosaur..who....while it was allowed...ruled the blueline.....but just like guys with no helmets and goalies with no masks...he will drift into the early.. somewhat "exciting " but really dumb days of the NHL.
That's ridiculous. You want to say how stupid they were for not having helmets 20+ years ago? There were less concussions back then, more scoring; it was what faggot Bettman wants todays NHL to be, except that jackass doesn't know how to achieve that. Overexpansion and pussy rule changes aren't the way.
I was a Director of research funding at our Faculty of Applied Sciences..precisely attempting to determine how many concussions in hockey go undetected..we had a small van with various reaction testing equipment and two researchers that went around an entire province testing players at the Tier II Junior A level...the results were absolutely shocking.
The reason there were fewer concussions in the 80's is because they were not diagnosed!!!
ok, Shakespeare, here's why I DO know what I speak of:
Concussions were down back then for several reasons. First, the size of the average player was considerably smaller than he is today. Secondly, and NHL announcers have said as much at various times, before helmets, players were less likely to go near a guy's head.
Nobody is denying that concussions exist, so whats your point?
You really do not know what you are talking about.
It is a PROVEN fact that the there was under-reporting of concussions in most major league sports
...for one..we did not have the equipment (MRI / CAT Scans etc.) available for diagnosis and as a second point..only major concussions showed up if at all..the micro-fissures (that likely killed Probert) were not detectable until only a couple of years ago.
Size has nothing to do with it?! That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You think that if Scott Stevens was 5'3 130lbs, he'd have been handing out concussions like he did? Absolutely not.
Furthermore, NHL announcers are well-qualified to speak on the goings-on of hockey, past and present, given the facts that A. It is their job to cover the NHL in great detail, and B. They likely played in that era.
Bobbys drug habits took a greater toll on him than the NHL.
Come on..seriously.. we are talking about NHL holistically..so yes on the average players were smaller and they were hitting"proportionately " smaller players..with same results....is that so hard to grasp??...it was all the same except on a slightly smaller scale..(your point makes absolutely no sense.)
There were hundreds of concussions! Announcers can comment all they want on hockey but not on the diagnostic tools..We are only now understanding the irreversible damage done!
Maybe you should apply some of those sciences you research, because your grasp of physics is piss-poor. There is a certain level of strength, force, and speed required to give a man a concussion. Smaller, slower, weaker men are not able to reach those levels, regardless of the size of their opponents.
This is why you're not studying concussions in Pee-Wee hockey.
@MAXIMONT I honestly cant believe you are still arguing this...and for your info..they are studying concussions at every level including pee wee.
Having said that...knowing what you know now...and you ran into a 25 year old Muhammad Ali...knowing whats ahead of him..would you still encourage him to keep going?
Well today we know whats ahead of some of these guys...are we supposed to keep quiet?
Come on..you sound intelligent enough..you know every discussion today is about this issue..
I think Muhammad Ali is proud of being one of the greatest boxers of all time and a cultural icon. I don't think he'd do anything differently. Being the greatest(at anything) sometimes comes with a price. I definitely don't think he'd listen to some pencilneck who's afraid of jaywalking tell hiim to reconsider his legendary life.
You must share some genetic material with a neanderthal...I am sure...your idiotic pride in a destroyed human being shuffling down the street no recognizing his grand children..not being able to talk..constant pain (as my dad had parkinsons..so I know what hell it is..)
Yes of course he is proud..at least that.but it came at too high a price..moron.
Even Romans eventually stopped the gladiator fights because it was too stupid even for them!...but I am sure you would have disagreed!
Shit happens, man. That's life. You can be a bitch and be the boy in the plastic bubble, or you can strap on a pair and experience life. Different occupations come with different hazards. Typically, the riskier jobs come with greater rewards(ie: fame, money, Stanley Cups).
Raise your kids to be pussy librarians if you want. Just stop pissing and moaning and trying to ruin a great sport.
...thank you for giving me the platitude that I have the ability to ruin a great sport..didnt know I could do that..
But you know what..the Olympics were great, this years playoffs were great so far...so were last years..
..all without the sick spectacle of a limp body or two...of a great player sliding down the ice unconscious....courtesy of Mr. Stevens...looking to maim...at the very least..
..I guess another playoff year ruined for you..right!
I honestly still cant believe that you equate a players willingness to suffer a "life-long" injury that will get worse with time...as something to be admired..and to say...boy that guy is tough.
I think most of the players are sick and tired of the banging and the crashing...
My brother played in the NHL for 11 years and as a defenseman he took some heavy hits...knees he can accept he says but he sure would like to have the hits to the head back.
@zeroceiling good one, u make no sense...why r u so obsessed with this guy, why dont u just come out and say it, you would pay to have eric lindros in your bed right now.....is zero ceiling supposed to pertain to Lindros? because i think he did have a ceiling, and he hit his head on it and got a concussion
@zeroceiling think i posted twice,how many posts did u make on here? i know you have a lot of extra time on your hands so why dont you take the next few hours to count
Its also interesting...we have players that are in HOF due to their play in a specific time period....but I do believe that if Scott Stevens played today....A) he would never come close to being in HOF....I think without those hits he would be an NHL calibre average defenseman who would not see much ice time on the power-play or even penalty kill as he was not amazingly fast and his stamina was OK but not exceptional...his contribution would now be considered "good steady defenseman"..thats it..
dude, the guy had years when he was over +50 in plus/minus. That is insane. He was a great all around defenseman, even without the hits. Take a look at the stats, he scored 70 points in a season he was asked to be more offensive.
@zeroceiling you could say the same about gordie howe if he were a player today. The game is always changing. 60 years in hockey future they will say the same thing about Gretzky. There is a reason that they are celebrated for THEIR time in NHL. Think about 50 goals in 50 games. Who does that know a days? Why not? Because the game has changed.
It seems to me that ...if Scott delivered his hits at half the speed he still would have stopped the guy in his tracks and the guy would have lost the puck..
in hockey terms ..job done..this was not moderate punishment...this was more like...hey If I have a chance I will kill you...your first time or your tenth time..
Even guys fighting..like Probert....would stop throwing as soon as the other guy lost his balance or went down...they often said they didnt want the guy to get hurt.
again does a game have to have a level of anhilation in it at the professional level..that guys and their kids & wives fear for their well being after the game is long gone?
It seems that we reached the "I honestly dont give a shit about the other guy" period way back during the Roman Gladiator Games and everything else started to move towards respecting the opponent.
Its one thing to hit a guy but to mangle his brain cells?..studies everywhere show the devastation..yet to come for some.
There have been 72 concussions this hockey year so far...
Do we really want to see hockey players walking around like Muhammad Ali??..
The speeds that today's conditioning, light equipment and blazing fast skates produce is astounding..
As mentioned I have a brother that played 11 years in the NHL with..of course the typical knee scars, facial cuts arthritis creeping in..but by far the most worrisome is the noticeable decrease in his mental sharpness...and he only had 2 moderate concussions.
It has been reported today that Robert Probert likely died of mini strokes and increased vulnerability to cerebral /cardiovascular issues because of the blows he received during his many many fights.
Well..for every 100 punches that Probert received..Stevens dished out one "super" hit that absolutely without question concussed the brain of the player..whether the hit was straight to the head with an elbow or even just a flying shoulder into the upper chest.
Lets pretend that knee on knee hits are legal..they are actually hard to execute without blowing out your own knee..so it actually takes skill to do it.
Now, they are illegal and everyone sees them as an attempt to injure and hate the perpetrator.
NHL outlaws them and fines are involved
A"super hit" that Stevens did a lot of, concusses the brain even when the head is not hit directly and.. inevitably -damage occurs.
So why do we accept these?..as these hits are no less an attempt to injure?
Knee-on-knee hits have a much higher rate of injury. NFL and NHL are handing out fines left and right trying to gay up the games so soccer moms will let their pussy kids watch and/or play footbal or hockey.
They are contact sports. Injuries are going to happen. Occupational hazard. There doesn't always need to be a villain to blame.
Oh poor Eric.... oh yes he was headhunted more then any other player during his time in the NHL oh boo hoo hoo.... the big brute carried himself like he was the greatest & commanded the salary of some superstar player but in the end wasn't good enough to carry his team or win anything so where is he GREAT? Where does his name deserve to be mentioned with the likes of some of the greatest players to ever play the game?
you really have no understanding of the game of hockey, do you?
NHL players are very fast. Thus, if they see you, they can avoid you. Therein lies the art of the open-ice hit.
Furthermore, defensemen usually try to force the puck carrier to the outside, where shooting angles are much worse. For a player to cut to the middle, he is going for a better angle at the risk of getting hit. When you skate with your head down, you make it easy for a legend like Stevens.
Theres an old saying that says "its better to stay quiet and let people think you're an idiot, than to talk and prove them right". you continue to prove me right.
Stevens retired with over 900 points, over 700 of which were assists.
The 2000 Devils were 2nd in the league in scoring. Led the league in '01, and were 10th and 12th in '03 and '95. They had no problem scoring.
Stevens was over +300 for his career. any angle you wanna take in this debate, you're wrong.
this guy is not a hero kids u see what players get suspended and fines for nowadays? this dude would have got ejected from the nhl for both the kariya and lindros hits (blatant headshots dont even fucken think about arguing cause ive seen it a million times so dont tell me im blind this n that blah blah) bottom line is he wasnt always clean with his hits love how he doesnt say i never meant to end his career or apoligize "its a great game" right beside that cunt messier.
gadeela 2 weeks ago
@gadeela "this guy is not a hero kids u see what players get suspended and fines for nowadays?" REALLY? That's like saying many great heads of state, military heroes of world history and characters in the bible would be charged, indicted and possibly executed for what they did. You can't blame an individual for the era that they lived. "Hate the game, don't hate tha playa!" :-)
lkadubic 1 week ago
@lkadubic dude shut the fuck up, i dont hate the player, he is a good player, but some of his hits (i.e. kariya and lindros) were complete bullshit, characters in the bible would be charged? what the hell are you talking about regardless you can argue all you want but when the human head is the first thing to move on a late hit, it is not clean.
gadeela 1 week ago
To those that think the NHL is trying to go nancy, your wrong...Bettman states endlessly the agenda is to eliminate the head injuries while maintaining the physical aspect...Violence does sell... if athletes were invincible, the NHL would allow weapons on the ice but in reality its becoming too easy to eliminate a player from the game...A true fan of the game appreciates the great moments in hockey which the skilled players provide, who unfortunately are the main targets of these injuries.
zeamon74 1 month ago
This guy played by the rules and his hits were beautiful ...But knowing what we know now about brain injuries, and seeing these great players not being able to stand, I cant help but respect what the league is TRYING to eliminate from the game. As frustrating as it is seeing guys being suspended for TRYING to throw clean checks...Honestly, as much as I respect Stevens, Id rather of watched a healthy Lindros career..or any great player for that matter. GET RID OF THE HARD PLASTIC EQUIPMENT!
zeamon74 1 month ago
Thank you Mr. Stevens!
toekneeeyeoweme 1 month ago
What a shame that Stevens isnt around to quickly take Crosby out of the game..now that hes back.
for the good of us all and to enhance hockey general...
....such a shame the moron is retired
Are some of you hockey purists finally realizing how long it takes to come back from a concussions?.....in Crosby's case it was 11 months.....
In some cases it's never...
Personally I would much rather not see a flash of a huge hit and the empty space it creates..as the player is removed from the game.
zeroceiling 2 months ago
Stupid whining baby among the background noise.....someone shoulda told Lindros to wait in the car.....
CynicJRH 2 months ago
shut that god damn baby up
mcsweeney24 2 months ago
.well...you see...the problem with Scott Stevens is......he's an idiot!
zeroceiling 3 months ago
Stevens will..in the future....be remembered with embarrassment...that no one had the sense to stop this out of control gorilla from destroying some of our best players.
He certainly made many games not worth the admission..
zeroceiling 3 months ago
@zeroceiling Go watch golf.
thegermsattack1 3 months ago 3
@thegermsattack1 yeah. good point...see how popular golf is now that Tiger is pretty much out....well its the same thing as when Stevens systematically took out most of the main guys who made hockey worth watching....
zeroceiling 3 months ago
@zeroceiling Go move to Europe and watch that finesse no hitting bs.
BAUERHOCKEY17 2 months ago
@BAUERHOCKEY17
As stated already...Scott Stevens is an embarrassment.....now irrelevant..just a sad remainder of of "idiot" days in hockey..
..and why move to Europe....NHL no longer tolerates any of the hits Stevens routinely dished out anyway....now they give 10 game suspensions for those..
How do you think they came to doing that?..maybe after losing millions in lost revenues when key players spent more days in recovery then on the ice.
...and years later...probably Parkinson's
zeroceiling 2 months ago
@zeroceiling NHL is selling out, they're making it more for the kids, finesse, less hitting, its retarded.
BAUERHOCKEY17 2 months ago
@BAUERHOCKEY17
..the problem with the NHL is that we were not able to measure the impact of concussions on players..and most did not come forward even if clearly not fit to play.
..the macho code,..you played..or were ridiculed by team-mates and management.
I was involved in the study of concussions sustained in Tier II Jr. hockey players in BC, by local University in 2004 and after 1-2..their (reaction times were already slowing).
It is only now we have the tools (MRI) to face up to this.
zeroceiling 2 months ago
@zeroceiling People like you ruin hockey.
BAUERHOCKEY17 2 months ago
@BAUERHOCKEY17
I respect you not swearing or name-calling.
I am willing to exchange ideas that may differ from yours but we both have a point to make.
Remember, today MRI's are showing us horrendous things not seen in the 80's. Today's players do not need to pay a heavy price like athletes who, for example took steroids just to compete.
Its not how hockey was born anyway.
50 year old players drooling and demented is what the future holds for many of them.
The evidence is very clear!
zeroceiling 2 months ago
@BAUERHOCKEY17
Peoples physiology was not designed to take a hit from someone going 30 mph and crashing your head against the boards....(helmets are only a minor protection against a 225lb body going at that speed..or as is the case with Stevens..he usually came around his defenseman as a screen and met your speed with his...absolutely and inevitably producing a concussion almost every time he pulled off a "Steven's " type hit..
Concussion...just a joke injury right?..
Well look at Ali today!
zeroceiling 2 months ago
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zeroceiling 2 months ago
People like me?
Watched an awful lot of hockey including Gretzky in minor hockey and Junior.
In the process watched a lot of ghastly injuries as well.
Example: In 1980 I watched a rookie...Norman Levier / Boston wheeled past me on a stretcher after a head-shot in Vancouver by Marc Crawford, He went up against the glass and his helmet took a pretty good jolt against it..
When I saw him he was pale as a ghost (cerebral hemorrage).
Never to walk again!
Ruined Hockey?..no Ruined life!
Google it.
zeroceiling 2 months ago
Hahaha I love how a Scott Stevens narrative on the Lindros hit broke down into a Canada/USA mud slinging match and Crosby roast. Way to go YouTube.
iangoblin71 3 months ago
mate im from england and crosbys goal was pathetic, he should not be remembered for that goal as the olympics is not the end of the world. grow up
ThePanthers91 3 months ago
@ThePanthers91 what the goal at the olympics? if so you are one retarded fuck
CrosbyIsKing 3 months ago
Stevens = Warrior
toekneeeyeoweme 4 months ago 7
@toekneeeyeoweme Stevens=Coward
lindrosboss 1 month ago
@toekneeeyeoweme He hit players when they weren't looking and most vulnerable and caused some brain injuries I'm sure. Should he be envied for ending careers? Is this what hockey is about? Trying to cause the greatest injuries? After their careers these players have to live with brains injuries for the rest of their lives. People here worship this guy for inflicting these injuries? There are some very sick individuals here.
varsume 1 month ago 3
@varsume That was a different era. Of course we know much more about head injuries now than we do now but that's irrelevant. He played the game cleanly. He took very, very few elbowing penalties and earned mythical, legendary status for ending that whiny coward of a player Lindros.
toekneeeyeoweme 1 month ago
@toekneeeyeoweme well ok since Lindros was whiny it's ok to knock him out? This is hockey not streetball.
pavyowns7 1 month ago
@pavyowns7 It's ok to knock any player out as long as it's done cleanly, which is what Stevens did. The fact that Lindros was a whiny primadonna only made it more satisfying...
toekneeeyeoweme 1 month ago
@toekneeeyeoweme he wasn't whiny about it maybe he was just frustrated for getting like his 5th serious concussion he was a way better hockey player than Stevens also.
pavyowns7 3 weeks ago
@pavyowns7 No, he was whiny...he cried about everything beginning with the team that drafted him. I'm sure he was frustrated but hey, that's life sometimes...As for being a better player, he was certainly gifted but lacked the heart and chin for the era he played in. His teammates didn't respect him. Stevens was a man who will be forever remembered for his heart and Lindros will be merely an afterthought.
toekneeeyeoweme 3 weeks ago
@varsume So if a player isn't looking they get a free pass to the net? Should defenders stop defending because another player is playing stupid hockey?
unklelemmy 4 weeks ago
Dirty fuck
xbroadstreetbullyx 4 months ago
So quick. You're sitting in mommy's basement awaiting the next reply? Nice homophobic comeback. I bet you're also a racist asshole who used to beat his wife before she wised up and divorced your sorry ass. You're a sad little fuck of a man and a total waste of my time, this will be the last I respond to your bullshit.
horseshoes100 4 months ago
Last great open ice hitter = end of the dead puck era in the NHL. Take Stevens out of the clutch and grab era of hockey and off NJ's horribly boring trap style game and he'd be lucky to be crack the top 6 of any modern day NHL team. How'd big bad Stevens do in the Olympics? Pointless in '98 and cut from '02 gold winning team (I think Hockey Canada might know a thing or two eh?). Good riddance Stevens and that horrible era of hockey.
horseshoes100 5 months ago
@horseshoes100 Your a fucking dick.... clutch & grab? Shut the fuck up you retard... You talk about the trap & it being horribly boring & why is that douchebag because it worked for The Devils & they have 3 Cups to prove that it worked.... yes you probably forgot that many other teams also used the trap after the Devils - yes back when defense was still being played in the game.... You can have your Cindy Crosby figure skater style hockey you fucking faggot...
ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 Yeah that's right he's in the Hall Of Fame & who the fuck cares about stats in the goddamn Olympic's anyway you queer... You have to be the biggest douche on this thread talking about stats in the Olympics..... LMAO.... What a retard...
ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 I just checked your channel your 19 years old? What the fuck do you know about anything in hockey you dipshit... Good Riddance to some 19 year old dick who doesn't know shit...
ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
@ogrebattle22763 - Another Internet Warrior. Do the insults make you feel tough while you're (and it's "you're" not "your" retard) trolling in your mommy's basement? It's funny how Stevens' fans have such a huge bromance with him that they take things so personally. I'm not 19 (who enters personal info on youtube?) but who cares, my 9 yr old niece is more mature than you. You don't care about the Olympics because you are probably an American piece of shit, how'd you like Cindy's golden goal?
horseshoes100 4 months ago
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ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
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ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
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ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@horseshoes100 . Yeah & your another internet retard.... Talking about stats from the Olympics? LOLOLOLOLOLOL...You really are the biggest douchebag on this thread... Do the insults make me feel tough no dick they just describe you perfectly.... you don't know shit your a pansy faggot from CANADUH.... lolololol... fucking queer...
ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 OHHHH C-A-N-A-D-U-H..... LOLOLOLOL.... you douche...
ogrebattle22763 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 Whoah lol, "American piece of shit"
What does that have to do with anything? You're talking about Cindy's golden goal? I feel bad for Canada, they had that pussy score one of their most historic goals...
77HeIix 4 months ago
@77HeIix Are you fully or just partially retarded? Americans don't care about Olympic hockey because you haven't won gold since NHLers started playing and you're pissed off and petty about losing. Who care's who's name was on the back, there was a maple leaf on the front. I am not even a fan of Crosby but how is he a pussy? What a trite, petty and jealous little comment. Typical ignorant American.
horseshoes100 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 l0l Stop talking shit on America bud, stop thinking you're all high and mighty because you're from Canada. It doesn't matter where the fuck you're from, you can be a fan of hockey you dumb fuck.
77HeIix 4 months ago
@77HeIix "I feel bad for Canada", "Crosby is a pussy"? Then you call me high and mighty? It's a little late to take the moral high ground you dumb fuck.
horseshoes100 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 I feel bad that Crosby (the pussy) scored such a historic goal for their country? That's why I feel bad for you.
Again, you're a fucking fag who likes to sit behind his computer and start fights on youtube. You're not fucking better than anybody just because you're from fucking Canada, you need to stop fucking thinking that.
77HeIix 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 I'm embarrassed for you right now...
buttkick22 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@horseshoes100 I'm embarrassed for u right now..
buttkick22 4 months ago
@horseshoes100 Dude, shut the fuck up. You're giving Canadians a bad rep how aboot you fuck off and shut you're dumb ass up.
ownedjoormom 4 months ago
@ownedjoormom - How ABOUT you improve YOUR grammar dumb ass?
horseshoes100 4 months ago
@88BigEtrain How many times did Lindros get 100+ pts or score 50 goals? Answer 1 and 0.
tbiggity 6 months ago
@88BigEtrain You have to be kidding me greatest player of the 90's. Did you only get Flyers games where you are from? What about Lemieux (5 100+ pt seasons despite not playing a full season), Or Yzerman (4 straight 100+ pt seasons). Hell I will even bring up Selanne because not only was he great in the 90's but he is STILL playing. Yes, you do have to put your head down, it is a given. He just always had his head down and if he was as strong as you say he was, he would still be playing.
tbiggity 6 months ago
@tbiggity gotta put pavel bure the Russian rocket if your going to put in the finnish flash man the old canucks vs jets rivarly finnish flash vs Russian rocket was awsome
Br3nd3n14 6 months ago
It's a discrace this player got selected into the hall of fame.... we will remember you as the rotten douce you are Scott Stevens
4JRimmer 6 months ago
@4JRimmer i know keep hating, there was never a problem with his clean open ice hits idiot
SteveO1887 6 months ago
@4JRimmer lol stevens will be remembered as the great open ice hitter who played excellent defense and won himself a few stanley cups and norris trophies while leading the league in plus minus on several occasions. only you and some other select few will be hating on him
BlindSoul96 6 months ago
Who was the dumbass who brought a baby here lol??
77HeIix 8 months ago
As a life long Flyers fan I must say that Scott Stevens and the New Jersey Devils are one of the toughest, cleanest and most legendary clubs of all time. They haunted me in the 90's but looking back, what a hell of a group of players and Stevens was fucking awesome. Anyone that ever says that wasn't a clean hit is just a moron.
Snyder2112 9 months ago
@Snyder2112 All the people who say that Stevens' piece of garbage hit was clean are not only morons,but also out of touch with the facts and with the present.I say it again,only those who enjoy careers being ruined and seeing players going through terrible and miserable times perhaps for the rest of their lives after their head was deliberately targeted,think that Stevens is almost a hero and a great hitter.He's neither,in fact just for that hit on Lindros I call him a piece of shit.
88BigEtrain 9 months ago
@88BigEtrain
Hero, Champion, Captain, Leader, Legend.
All of those are also oft-used words to describe Mr. Scott Stevens.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT Yeah,he certainly was all that,no doubt.But,you don't seem to be able separate that from what we are talking about-the hit on Lindros.And he's a phony asshole who intended to finish Lindros' career.Simple as that.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
@88BigEtrain
So what? mission accomplished.
You dont get to the top without stepping on some heads along the way. Especially if those heads are always looking down at the puck! haha
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT Yeah,if you happen to be traded to the right team,you can be just a fighter,incapable of anything more,and you'll probably win the Cup too.(Mccarty,Parros,Grimson etc.).Stevens is somebody who isn't even invited to hockey panels concerning hitting and headshots,because he'd look like a deer in the headlight and silly.Nobody wants to hear his bullshit comments that his hits are perfectly o.k.Nobody involved in the game wants them,just Stevens does.I think his concussion messed him up.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
@88BigEtrain
McCarty looked quite capable of a bit more when he was smoking the D and putting the nail in the '97 Flyers' coffin.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT Yeah,once in his career he had a moment like that.That makes anything but capable of similar plays.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
@88BigEtrain
Thats one more great Finals moment than Lindros ever had!
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT Yeah,good for McCarty.Nothing more,nothing less.He can have his rings.Besides that moment,I almost forgot that he....Ah,forget it he tried hard to keep his NHL job.I respect that.
88BigEtrain 7 months ago
@88BigEtrain
Here's some more information you didnt know: Lindros came into the NHL a year BEFORE McCarty, and played only TWO more career games than him. McCarty has just 8 fewer career playoff points than Lindros, too. Throw in McCarty's Cups, his heart, and his devotion to his team, I don't think any of McCarty's Wings teams wouldv'e traded McCarty for Lindros, straight up. Erica had some pretty regular season highlights, but his teammates hated him and he wilted when it mattered most.
MAXIMONT 7 months ago
@MAXIMONT Lindros's teammates did not hate him lol where the hell are you getting that from?
LtSykes 6 months ago
@LtSykes He makes things up to make Lindros look terrible and make players such as Darren McCarty almost as good as Lindros.So don't worry about his comments too much.
88BigEtrain 6 months ago
@MAXIMONT Yeah,that sounds like Mccarty is up for HHOF induction.Don't try so hard to make Lindros look terrible and others better than him.You're doomed to failure.Yeah,sure there were some players who didn't like him such as that ungrateful loser Desjardins,who Lindros had stood up for when he was done to something Lindros didn't like etc.But other than that your info is a second hand,second rate.
88BigEtrain 6 months ago
@MAXIMONT zzzziiinnnnggggg!
tbiggity 6 months ago
Dirty hitter planned that hit a mile away !!!! Ended a great career for a great player!!
justinhottiebieber23 9 months ago
@justinhottiebieber23 That's exactly right,man.
88BigEtrain 9 months ago
@88BigEtrain yea dude I loved watching him on the ice with LeClaire best hockey memories Dirty ass hit !!!!
justinhottiebieber23 8 months ago
@justinhottiebieber23 Yeah,tell me about it.The Legion of Doom couldn't be outplayed.Unfortunately,the line couldn't solve the goaltending situation and the play of the rest of the team.That was a job to do for the management of the Flyers.That hit is one of the biggest pieces of shit you could've ever seen.Stevens is so phony and insincere that it screams out loud.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
ultimate sneaky hitter...Mr. as long as they don't see me coming. What a prick.
rothshield317 9 months ago
@rothshield317 Calling Stevens a hitter is very inaccurate,calling him the best hitter ever is an insult to "clean"hitting in hockey.The best hitter ever is Lindros,period.Multi-dimensional hitter,anywhere on the ice,open hits,along the boards,shoulder to shoulder,bone crunching,boards rattling,glass shaking hits.Just about everything that Stevens wasn't capable of.
88BigEtrain 9 months ago
@88BigEtrain
like winning Stanley Cups, a Conn Smythe, and the respect of his peers?
MAXIMONT 9 months ago
@MAXIMONT Again,winning the Stanley Cup = luck,everything going right and the team's way.Nothing else.He didn't win Conn Smythe,sure,but that doesn't mean anything at all,really.Such a player can have a one terrific play-offs and then fades away for the rest of his career.I'm not aware of the fact that Lindros isn't respected by the people involved in business of hockey.A nonsense.
88BigEtrain 9 months ago
@88BigEtrain
Nothing else, huh? That's bad news for all those Hall of Famers who thought they were great champions.
"bad news guys, a bitter flyers fan thinks it was all luck." Only bad luck has kept philly from winning a Cup in the last 36 years.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago 2
@MAXIMONT By that logic,Mario,Wayne and other greats would've won the Cup at least every other season.As far as I remember Wayne hadn't won the Cup after he left the Oilers,Mario-one Cup-everything went right that year,simple as that,no other Cup since.Jeremy Roenick-wasn't lucky enough to get one either.That's the way it goes.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
@88BigEtrain
The reason why people watch professional sports is so they can see great players competing. There are some great players in the NHL. The really great players elevate their teams above the rest. That is why Gretzky has 5 Cups, Lemieux has TWO(not one), Jagr has two, Messier has 6, Lidstrom has 4, Niedermayer has 4, Stevens has 3, Sakic has 2, and, not coincidentally(meaning that luck was not a factor), Lindros has ZERO.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago 2
@MAXIMONT
yeah..thats why Tony Esposito....Vick Hatfield...Jean Rattelle...Gilbert Perault.......just to name a few..never won one..
How many did Gretzky win in LA?...Messier in Vancouver?..Stevens in Washington..Jagr in Washington ?...Jagr in Rangers?......
Your argument point no sense..
As an owner..and you land a Gretzky or a Lemiux..you know its your shot so you stack the team..trade away future...do whatever you have to..(including trading draft picks etc.)...
this is not a secret!!
zeroceiling 8 months ago
@zeroceiling
Great examples, idiot. I'm sorry that those players didn't win their 16 Stanley Cups in enough different cities to please you.
Actually, the Stanley Cup teams that Gretzky, Messier, Stevens, Lemieux and Jagr were on were mostly built on draft picks. Trading away the future rarely works. Secrets out: you're wrong!
MAXIMONT 8 months ago 3
@MAXIMONT
"The secret's out...I.m wrong....?".....who are Zoolander??
...come on you little monkey..just stop posting......it hurts to laugh now...
zeroceiling 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT I see.Gretzky won no Cups after he left Edmonton,Jagr won two as a 18 and 19 year old rookie and thanks to Mario,then nothing,Messier is the only one having been able to win the Cup after leaving the Oilers dynasty.The others were mere contributors to the team overall effort starting with the managements's right moves all the way through goaltenders and ending with 4th line players and no major injuries to the star players at the most important moments.So,yes,luck is involved.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
@88BigEtrain
You ought to learn a bit more about hockey before making more idiotic comments. Jagr had 37 points in the playoffs during PITs two Cup runs. Gretzky is the greatest player ever. The others are each Hall of Famers and multi-Champions. Lindros has NOTHING on them!
Too bad Lindros isnt still on the flyers...he'd be perfect in that verizon commercial in which the flyers go 82-0. I love seeing that commercial during playoffs that the flyers have already been eliminated from.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
Comment removed
zeroceiling 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT I must say it now
Maximont you are such a ignorant silly monkey....
You threw down a definitive statement about the great players making the team around them..WIN the cup...do you remember that you goofy lemur!?
Now when you cant respond to the point made about Gretzky not winning the Cup again when traded..you conveniently forget your..position on this..and resort to just stating the fucking totally obvious..bbla..bla bla Gretzky was a great player pablum
you pretentious ass....
zeroceiling 8 months ago
gayest comment ever.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT
I cant argue with someone that knows his subject!!
I guess this is your area...you KNOW gay...not that there is anything wrong with that.
zeroceiling 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT Ever heard of Lemieux and Francis?Because those two were the reason Jagr won his two Cups.Not bad teammates to have around.After that,Jagr didn't win a single one.And he is a pretty good whiner when he's played against physically.He hates that.Gretzky is the greatest ever based on statistics.But the greatest player ever overall without any weaknesses in his game is Lindros.Others could only dream of the things Lindros was capable of.Lindros=Flyers,Flyers=Lindros,forever.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
@88BigEtrain Ever hear of Bobby Orr? Far better all around player than Lindros ever could be. HE had no weaknesses. Lindros couldn't take a hit, that was his weakness.
Horganshwag55 7 months ago
@Horganshwag55 Yeah,heard of him.And the era Orr played in?Ever watched it?Put Orr in 90s and he would be half effective.He had nothing on Lindros in overall game and you know it.And don't even get me started on physicality in the game of his era.No comparison.Lindros couldn't take a hit?You weren't sober when you were writing that.Totally ludicrous statement.
88BigEtrain 6 months ago
@88BigEtrain Check the mirror, son. You've got some of Eric's jizz drippin down your chin.
toekneeeyeoweme 5 months ago
@toekneeeyeoweme Is that all you have to say?I thought so,ran out of comments that make sense and are to the point hence this teenager like comment.Maybe you should take that hard look in the mirror.
88BigEtrain 5 months ago
@88BigEtrain Haha you are so delusional...that or you're Eric's mom.
toekneeeyeoweme 5 months ago
@toekneeeyeoweme And there's the end of it for you....
88BigEtrain 5 months ago
@88BigEtrain Lindros is the greatest player overall ever? Come on, you can't honestly believe that. Lindros was good sure, but greatest overall ever? That is insane, especially the "without any weakness part". All players have some sort of weakness, even Gretzky. Lindros had two HUGE weaknesses, Skating with his head down and a complete inability to take a hit.
tbiggity 6 months ago
@tbiggity I agree with skating with head down as a weakness, but lindros was able to take plenty of hits that weren't at his head.
LtSykes 6 months ago
@tbiggity Well,you made me laugh with your comments.Lindros wasn't just good,he was great and in 90s the most dominant player in the game.You need to watch the highlights more carefully because then you couldn't come up with such a ludicrous comment about him not being able to take a hit.His core was so strong and his stability on skates was out of this world,period.Every forward has his head down,because it's simply necessary thing to do to be able to control the puck,that's not a weakness.
88BigEtrain 6 months ago
@rothshield317
You realize that's how hitting works, right? If the puck-carrier knows you're going to hit him, he moves.
Are shooters being immoral and sneaky when they don't tell the goalie where they're going to shoot the puck?
MAXIMONT 7 months ago
yeah im sure thats genuine lol
DCnader 9 months ago
good on you stevens, the hall of fame obviously looks good on you. retired number by your team as well and 3 cups. crybaby Erica Lindros will fade into history as the coulda-should-woulda with more concussions than stanley cup finals games played.
st393736 9 months ago 2
@st393736 He can have his 3 Cups,I don't envy them.The bottom line-Lindros gave me so much entertainment for my spent money that I will be absorbing all the flood of his great plays for the rest of my life.Stevens' garbage hits are the thing of the past and that's why you don't see him being a part of discussions about such kind of hits.He'd look like an idiot,because he still thinks, in his own world,that such a hit is perfectly o.k.Well,he has to be quiet in front of players and keep distance.
88BigEtrain 9 months ago
@88BigEtrain HAHAHA, you DON'T envy him? for reaching the pinnacle of any NHL player's career THREE TIMES? oh my god, find me a single player who chooses to play in this league to "entertain" fans over engraving their name on the stanley cup, or better yet, go ask lindros what he would rather have, entertain you or win the cup. the players don't care about you, me or anyone else. Lindros won't be remembered by your great grand-children cause there is no hall of the good or hall of the very good.
st393736 9 months ago
@st393736 Obviously,that's the goal of every player.But only fortunate ones are able to win the Cup.Are you telling me that Bourque,Jagr,Fleury(Theo) or even your Stevens weren't fortunate to win one?I don't think so.But they'd be able to tell you,don't listen to me.I've never heard players to say they were fortunate enough to win the Cup and that it happens quite often to get into the Stanley Cup final.Your last sentence-a great joke!
88BigEtrain 9 months ago
@88BigEtrain
Bourque had to ride coattails in colorado to get one. That's different. Jagr is one of the greatest players the NHL has seen and him and Fleury(no Jagr, but still a very good player) were huge contributors on their championship teams.
The NHL draft isnt a raffle. Players dont get drafted arbitrarily. Believe it or not, at the professional level, skill is what determines champions.
MAXIMONT 9 months ago
@MAXIMONT Bourque won his Cup literally in his final season by being traded to the right team.Nothing more,nothing less.Jagr was a great player,but wasn't able to do anything without Mario or Francis,which again confirms what applies to Lindros as well-not good enough teammates,a different set of circumstances.Fleury won his Cup,just like Jagr,very young,and hadn't won any other since then.Skill matters,but without playing a physical,tough,grinding kind of game,and luck you don't have a chance.
88BigEtrain 9 months ago
@88BigEtrain
First, Bourque hand-picked the team he OK'd the trade to.
So you're saying players need good teammates to win? Very insightful. The mid to late 90's Penguins were loaded, but were out-performed in the playoffs(twice by the Devils '95 and '01:)
Was Lindros tough and physical? cause he never had a chance.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT Well,you just confirmed my point.No matter how loaded your team may be,it won't guarantee anything.Lindros' Flyers were never deep enough,because Clarke never got the right pieces of puzzle together.97 Stanley Cup final clearly demonstrated,which team had a depth and which didn't."Was Lindros tough and physical" is a question you're asking me?If it is,the answer is yeah,Lindros was the toughest and most physical player in history of the game.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
@88BigEtrain
Thats laughable. When you're given eight concussions by smaller men, you are not the toughest, nor most physical player in the history of the game. Or was that just bad luck, too?
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT Wow,your comment has no sense at all.If you go after somebody's head in full head and hit it in full speed,and with that hard plastic pad that you have on there you can have the size of Martin St. Louis,and I guarantee you that will get knocked out unconscious.All those losers who targeted Lindros' head needed their few moments of fame.I mean,honestly,when you mention name Stevens,the first thing that comes to mind is his head targeting hits.Pretty pathetic.
88BigEtrain 8 months ago
Cheap ass hit by a cheap ass player. If he threw that hit today he'd be suspended for the season
LeftTackle63 9 months ago
Who the fuck brought their baby...
77HeIix 10 months ago
is that Messier next to him?
kaulitzforlife 10 months ago
Scott douchebag Stevens!!
putrozza 10 months ago
I just watched a discussion panel on TSN called "Concussions: A Crisis on Ice"...in response to the recent Crosby injury and a few others.
The panel of about 12 ex-Players, Coaches and Reporters.
They showed the effect a high hit has on the brain and all agreed that perhaps the best hockey tournament ever held in terms of quality of hockey was in Vancouver BC last year during the Olympics.
Then they ran a 2 minute reel of hits just last year.
Every one of them looked like a Scott Stevens hit!
zeroceiling 10 months ago
@zeroceiling
should have been an instructional video.
MAXIMONT 10 months ago 2
@MAXIMONT
Well..I think Scott Stevens has lost relevance in today's game...it is no longer necessary to study him... as almost any hit he made would be considered a penalty...if not now...pretty much by next year....
Certainly skilled...Scott Stevens will be considered an impressive dinosaur..who....while it was allowed...ruled the blueline.....but just like guys with no helmets and goalies with no masks...he will drift into the early.. somewhat "exciting " but really dumb days of the NHL.
zeroceiling 10 months ago
@zeroceiling
'really dumb days of the NHL'?!
That's ridiculous. You want to say how stupid they were for not having helmets 20+ years ago? There were less concussions back then, more scoring; it was what faggot Bettman wants todays NHL to be, except that jackass doesn't know how to achieve that. Overexpansion and pussy rule changes aren't the way.
MAXIMONT 10 months ago
@MAXIMONT
You honestly know NOT..what you speak of.
I was a Director of research funding at our Faculty of Applied Sciences..precisely attempting to determine how many concussions in hockey go undetected..we had a small van with various reaction testing equipment and two researchers that went around an entire province testing players at the Tier II Junior A level...the results were absolutely shocking.
The reason there were fewer concussions in the 80's is because they were not diagnosed!!!
zeroceiling 9 months ago
@zeroceiling
ok, Shakespeare, here's why I DO know what I speak of:
Concussions were down back then for several reasons. First, the size of the average player was considerably smaller than he is today. Secondly, and NHL announcers have said as much at various times, before helmets, players were less likely to go near a guy's head.
Nobody is denying that concussions exist, so whats your point?
Hockey players take pride in being tough.
MAXIMONT 9 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@MAXIMONT
You really do not know what you are talking about.
It is a PROVEN fact that the there was under-reporting of concussions in most major league sports
...for one..we did not have the equipment (MRI / CAT Scans etc.) available for diagnosis and as a second point..only major concussions showed up if at all..the micro-fissures (that likely killed Probert) were not detectable until only a couple of years ago.
Dont take sports reporters as your source?
Hey..even Romans banned Gladiators!
zeroceiling 9 months ago
@MAXIMONT
Size of the player has nothing to do with it!.
Second...you say that "some reporters used to say something"....seriously..that is your solid source of medical info.
Concussions are an absolute tragedy..that is my point and they went unreported because we had crude MRI / CAT Scan equipment if available at all.
And yeah guys took shit if they indicated being unwell based on a concussion..and some cant even talk today...or you get a Bobby Probert.
This position is neanderthal...
zeroceiling 9 months ago
@zeroceiling
Size has nothing to do with it?! That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You think that if Scott Stevens was 5'3 130lbs, he'd have been handing out concussions like he did? Absolutely not.
Furthermore, NHL announcers are well-qualified to speak on the goings-on of hockey, past and present, given the facts that A. It is their job to cover the NHL in great detail, and B. They likely played in that era.
Bobbys drug habits took a greater toll on him than the NHL.
MAXIMONT 9 months ago
@MAXIMONT
Come on..seriously.. we are talking about NHL holistically..so yes on the average players were smaller and they were hitting"proportionately " smaller players..with same results....is that so hard to grasp??...it was all the same except on a slightly smaller scale..(your point makes absolutely no sense.)
There were hundreds of concussions! Announcers can comment all they want on hockey but not on the diagnostic tools..We are only now understanding the irreversible damage done!
zeroceiling 9 months ago
@zeroceiling
Maybe you should apply some of those sciences you research, because your grasp of physics is piss-poor. There is a certain level of strength, force, and speed required to give a man a concussion. Smaller, slower, weaker men are not able to reach those levels, regardless of the size of their opponents.
This is why you're not studying concussions in Pee-Wee hockey.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT I honestly cant believe you are still arguing this...and for your info..they are studying concussions at every level including pee wee.
Having said that...knowing what you know now...and you ran into a 25 year old Muhammad Ali...knowing whats ahead of him..would you still encourage him to keep going?
Well today we know whats ahead of some of these guys...are we supposed to keep quiet?
Come on..you sound intelligent enough..you know every discussion today is about this issue..
zeroceiling 8 months ago
@zeroceiling
I think Muhammad Ali is proud of being one of the greatest boxers of all time and a cultural icon. I don't think he'd do anything differently. Being the greatest(at anything) sometimes comes with a price. I definitely don't think he'd listen to some pencilneck who's afraid of jaywalking tell hiim to reconsider his legendary life.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT
You must share some genetic material with a neanderthal...I am sure...your idiotic pride in a destroyed human being shuffling down the street no recognizing his grand children..not being able to talk..constant pain (as my dad had parkinsons..so I know what hell it is..)
Yes of course he is proud..at least that.but it came at too high a price..moron.
Even Romans eventually stopped the gladiator fights because it was too stupid even for them!...but I am sure you would have disagreed!
zeroceiling 8 months ago
@zeroceiling
Shit happens, man. That's life. You can be a bitch and be the boy in the plastic bubble, or you can strap on a pair and experience life. Different occupations come with different hazards. Typically, the riskier jobs come with greater rewards(ie: fame, money, Stanley Cups).
Raise your kids to be pussy librarians if you want. Just stop pissing and moaning and trying to ruin a great sport.
MAXIMONT 8 months ago
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zeroceiling 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT
...thank you for giving me the platitude that I have the ability to ruin a great sport..didnt know I could do that..
But you know what..the Olympics were great, this years playoffs were great so far...so were last years..
..all without the sick spectacle of a limp body or two...of a great player sliding down the ice unconscious....courtesy of Mr. Stevens...looking to maim...at the very least..
..I guess another playoff year ruined for you..right!
..now go play some video games!
zeroceiling 8 months ago
@MAXIMONT
I honestly still cant believe that you equate a players willingness to suffer a "life-long" injury that will get worse with time...as something to be admired..and to say...boy that guy is tough.
I think most of the players are sick and tired of the banging and the crashing...
My brother played in the NHL for 11 years and as a defenseman he took some heavy hits...knees he can accept he says but he sure would like to have the hits to the head back.
massive head-shots are idiotic.
zeroceiling 9 months ago
@zeroceiling my brother was the emperor of the universe for 3,000 years....beat that...i can make shit up too
stevieray351 9 months ago 2
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zeroceiling 9 months ago
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zeroceiling 9 months ago
@stevieray351
Hey Stevie Ray...I think the possum's ready...
zeroceiling 9 months ago
@zeroceiling good one, u make no sense...why r u so obsessed with this guy, why dont u just come out and say it, you would pay to have eric lindros in your bed right now.....is zero ceiling supposed to pertain to Lindros? because i think he did have a ceiling, and he hit his head on it and got a concussion
stevieray351 9 months ago
@stevieray351
Look who is obsessed...I left this forum 6 days a go and you are right back at me again..
zeroceiling 9 months ago
@zeroceiling think i posted twice,how many posts did u make on here? i know you have a lot of extra time on your hands so why dont you take the next few hours to count
stevieray351 9 months ago
Its also interesting...we have players that are in HOF due to their play in a specific time period....but I do believe that if Scott Stevens played today....A) he would never come close to being in HOF....I think without those hits he would be an NHL calibre average defenseman who would not see much ice time on the power-play or even penalty kill as he was not amazingly fast and his stamina was OK but not exceptional...his contribution would now be considered "good steady defenseman"..thats it..
zeroceiling 10 months ago
@zeroceiling
dude, the guy had years when he was over +50 in plus/minus. That is insane. He was a great all around defenseman, even without the hits. Take a look at the stats, he scored 70 points in a season he was asked to be more offensive.
lassetjus 10 months ago
@lassetjus
point taken...you are right..I checked his numbers and he did put up some great totals...
zeroceiling 10 months ago
@zeroceiling you could say the same about gordie howe if he were a player today. The game is always changing. 60 years in hockey future they will say the same thing about Gretzky. There is a reason that they are celebrated for THEIR time in NHL. Think about 50 goals in 50 games. Who does that know a days? Why not? Because the game has changed.
keyrabuns69 10 months ago
It seems to me that ...if Scott delivered his hits at half the speed he still would have stopped the guy in his tracks and the guy would have lost the puck..
in hockey terms ..job done..this was not moderate punishment...this was more like...hey If I have a chance I will kill you...your first time or your tenth time..
Even guys fighting..like Probert....would stop throwing as soon as the other guy lost his balance or went down...they often said they didnt want the guy to get hurt.
Not Scott!
zeroceiling 10 months ago
again does a game have to have a level of anhilation in it at the professional level..that guys and their kids & wives fear for their well being after the game is long gone?
It seems that we reached the "I honestly dont give a shit about the other guy" period way back during the Roman Gladiator Games and everything else started to move towards respecting the opponent.
Its one thing to hit a guy but to mangle his brain cells?..studies everywhere show the devastation..yet to come for some.
zeroceiling 10 months ago
There have been 72 concussions this hockey year so far...
Do we really want to see hockey players walking around like Muhammad Ali??..
The speeds that today's conditioning, light equipment and blazing fast skates produce is astounding..
As mentioned I have a brother that played 11 years in the NHL with..of course the typical knee scars, facial cuts arthritis creeping in..but by far the most worrisome is the noticeable decrease in his mental sharpness...and he only had 2 moderate concussions.
zeroceiling 10 months ago
Scott Stevens is a 3 time Stanley Cup winner & Hall Of Fame Defensemen so all you haters out there can eat a fucking dick!
ogrebattle22763 10 months ago
It has been reported today that Robert Probert likely died of mini strokes and increased vulnerability to cerebral /cardiovascular issues because of the blows he received during his many many fights.
Well..for every 100 punches that Probert received..Stevens dished out one "super" hit that absolutely without question concussed the brain of the player..whether the hit was straight to the head with an elbow or even just a flying shoulder into the upper chest.
These players ARE affected for life!
zeroceiling 10 months ago
Lets pretend that knee on knee hits are legal..they are actually hard to execute without blowing out your own knee..so it actually takes skill to do it.
Now, they are illegal and everyone sees them as an attempt to injure and hate the perpetrator.
NHL outlaws them and fines are involved
A"super hit" that Stevens did a lot of, concusses the brain even when the head is not hit directly and.. inevitably -damage occurs.
So why do we accept these?..as these hits are no less an attempt to injure?
zeroceiling 10 months ago
@zeroceiling
Knee-on-knee hits have a much higher rate of injury. NFL and NHL are handing out fines left and right trying to gay up the games so soccer moms will let their pussy kids watch and/or play footbal or hockey.
They are contact sports. Injuries are going to happen. Occupational hazard. There doesn't always need to be a villain to blame.
MAXIMONT 10 months ago 2
What a liar.
mcleanartists 10 months ago
Oh poor Eric.... oh yes he was headhunted more then any other player during his time in the NHL oh boo hoo hoo.... the big brute carried himself like he was the greatest & commanded the salary of some superstar player but in the end wasn't good enough to carry his team or win anything so where is he GREAT? Where does his name deserve to be mentioned with the likes of some of the greatest players to ever play the game?
ogrebattle22763 10 months ago
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lanzova 10 months ago
@lanzova
you really have no understanding of the game of hockey, do you?
NHL players are very fast. Thus, if they see you, they can avoid you. Therein lies the art of the open-ice hit.
Furthermore, defensemen usually try to force the puck carrier to the outside, where shooting angles are much worse. For a player to cut to the middle, he is going for a better angle at the risk of getting hit. When you skate with your head down, you make it easy for a legend like Stevens.
hippy...
MAXIMONT 10 months ago
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lanzova 10 months ago
@lanzova
'no legend', huh? I disagree. So does the Hockey Hall of Fame.
MAXIMONT 10 months ago 4
@MAXIMONT absolutely no knowledge on the game of hockey. none.
brockerhoff 9 months ago
@lanzova
actually, hockey didn't want to be rid of Stevens, so they enshrined him in the Hall of Fame. Where LEGENDS go.
I'm sure plenty of guys hate Stevens-because he was better than them and he beat them.
MAXIMONT 10 months ago
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lanzova 10 months ago
@lanzova
Theres an old saying that says "its better to stay quiet and let people think you're an idiot, than to talk and prove them right". you continue to prove me right.
Stevens retired with over 900 points, over 700 of which were assists.
The 2000 Devils were 2nd in the league in scoring. Led the league in '01, and were 10th and 12th in '03 and '95. They had no problem scoring.
Stevens was over +300 for his career. any angle you wanna take in this debate, you're wrong.
MAXIMONT 10 months ago 2
@MAXIMONT
There is also an old saying:..dont get into an argument with an idiot..they will bring you down to their level and then pummel you with experience...
Devils ...was by most peoples opinion..the medieval dark age of hockey..cau