David Talbot - "The Hidden History of the Kennedy Years"

[bucknorm]

It was the Cubans no it wasn't the Cubans, Oswald was in Mexico City no Oswald was not in Mexico City, Bobby and Jack wanted Fidel dead up until Jack died no that is not true. JIm Garrison was right on the money no Jim Garrison was a nut. It was the CIA and the Mob no it was not the Cia or the Mob. I can't take it anymore, we'll never know the truth.

[aaronsdavis]

Awesome book, read it and make your own judgements...but 3 things to remember: You dont need "official" backing from the whole of each agency; a few from the CIA here, a few from the FBI there; friends who have had multi-agency careers. The US was an utterly divided country from '60-'68; civil war was at least possible... And an extremely proffessional assassination is not likely to leave hard evidence behind. But the scale of the job is such that circumstancial evidnence: abundant.

[TerryDavid57]

America's last free and independent President was Kennedy. All the rest have been puppets. John-John had indicated he was going to reveal to the world who the insiders were that murdered his father through his popular mag George. Short time later a surface-to-air missle takes his private plane down off Martha's Vineyard. Wake up people, our government is corrupt. The Wall St Banksters have shaken us down for 26+ Trillion. We have the best government money can buy!

[starmanskye]

ALL of the SS agents involved dispute that Kennedy told them to ride in the follow-up car. Kennedy had NEVER interfered with or countermanded SS protocol. He was one of the best-natured, easy-going, gracious presidents they ever served -- So Talbot's premise that Kennedy gave them orders to ride in the following car is bullshit, tending to invalidate all of his comments.

[Zoidborg1]

i believe this eye witness account... it is damming to the FBI (witness doctoring)... but changes nothing, there is still no evidence of another shooter, no bullets, no casings, no visual witnesses.

the idea that almost the whole FBI is involved in a conspiracy to overthrow the government, and nobody let the secret out before hand... is absurd

we have all heard sounds eco from the wrong direction, it sounds very convincing

[TheFrogger15]

@Zoidborg1 Please remember that when you talk about the "Whole F.B.I" in 1963, you're talking about just one man-J. Edgar Hoover who hated the President.

[mcmchugh99]

So JFK was hit twice from the front, in the throat and in the head, then once from behind.  Connolly was hit from behind by another shot, as he always testified. Then at least one othet shot missed the limo totally.

[willyjhopuky]

america would be a shining light to the world if he had lived. instead of hated aaround the world.

[CCHEEK11]

"We can annihilate Russia and should make that clear to the Soviet government," Dealey lectured Kennedy. But unfortunately, he continued, "The general opinion of the grass-roots thinking in this country is that you and your administration are weak sisters. We need a man on horseback to lead this nation, and many people in Texas and the Southwest think that you are riding Caroline's tricycle."

Hmmm...where was JFK shot again?

[CCHEEK11]

As the president idly chatted with the newspaper businessmen, Dealey stunned the gathering by haranguing Kennedy directly to his face, reading from a five-hundred-word statement that he suddenly whipped from his pocket in which he berated the commander-in-chief as if he were an errant copy boy.

[CCHEEK11]

In October, while hosting an off-the-record luncheon with a group of Texas newspaper publishers in the White House, Kennedy was curdely confronted by the reactionary publisher ot the Dallas Morning News, E.M. (Ted) Dealey.

[steveforsane]

Funny, that over 80-90% of witnesses state TSBD, except the 10 % are considered the experts...Kennedys themselves suprressed the truth...Bobby Kennedy was terrified what the investgation into the death of his brother would reveal regarding the urgy unlawful behavior of the Kennedy administration!

[nicenonya3]

@steveforsane There were shots from the DALTEX and Grassy Knoll,and maybe even someone shooting from the TSBD

[dave777blaster]

America has been on a slide into the third world ever since the coup of 1963.

"the stench of truth" is so thick I can smell it right up here in Canada.

One only needs eyes to see and ears to hear

the truth is all around America today

from the 24 trillion stolen to prop up foreign owned banks to illegal wars and the constant lying to the American people.

Who are left in the dark because the lies now are 50 years deep.

911 and more 911 will come because Americans take it all lying down.

[Mafiososupersikwitit]

Yup Oliver Stone made a movie on it "JFK"

[cdddraftsman]

Oliva went further and wrote in an e-mail that Mellens description of Murgado as having been part of RFKs brain trust was BS, and spelled it with capital letters. When asked again about Murgado in light of Talbots book, Oliva repeated that he had never heard of Murgado until I brought up his name in 2005.

[cdddraftsman]

So here we have a typical tenent of conspiracy lore , start out quick and insert people who were never there to prop up tenuous and non-existent connections to various Kennedy 'Brothers' , fill in the gaps with Kennedy admirers who would like nothing better to do but to obscure the fact that LHO demised the much vaunted and much undeserved myth of Camelwhatever in 8.9 seconds of his one hour lunch break !

Discusting .

[cdddraftsman]

You're telling me that you spent money , by purchasing or going to the library and actualy wasted your time reading such rubbish ?

AFTER 45 YEARS OF HOAX'S IN THE GREAT JFK ASSASSINATION TRAGEDY CONSPIRACY RIP-OFF OF AMERICA ?

HOW FOOLISH CAN YOU BE ?

[BukowskiPineapple]

I said earlier that I went to the library to read it. I'm sure if writing in caps is making any of your points any more coherent.

But the ability to write coherently is linked to the ability to think about things. You've shown you are nothing but a cut and paste artist.

You just google a book and then find nonsense critiques of this book and then paste huge chunks from this site on here.

Pasting text is not the same as understanding the complexities of book length argument.

[cdddraftsman]

Murgado is not instrumental to Talbots tale, but he is exceptionally useful. Through him Talbot buttresses the notion that hard-line Cuban exiles hated President Kennedy, presumably to the point where they were motivated to kill him. Murgado, elaborating on the tale he first told Mellen, was so alarmed by the murderous talk in Miamis exile community

[cdddraftsman]

that he approached RFK and offered to keep an eye on the most dangerous exile elements for the attorney general. Murgado told Talbot how he and two other prominent Cuban exiles met with RFK. I was thinking we have to keep a sharp look on our Cubans, the ones that were hating JFK, Talbot quotes Murgado as saying. I was afraid that one of our guys would go crazy. Bobby told us to come up with a plan and do it . . . . He was fanatic about his brother, he would do anything to take care of him.

[cdddraftsman]

So here we have this liar and charliton Murgado telling a tall tale to some 2nd rate conspiracy writer and then everyone spinning their looms to make the guy creditible and "exceptionally useful" for Talbots fantasy . This is from a writer who spent 4 decades being a expert in the area's in interest .

Sorry but this is typical of conspiracy yarns : The more you find out about the characters involved the less you know about the truth .

[cdddraftsman]

Washington Decoded is famous for getting to the bottom of spuriously concoted non-sense , with some of the best writers in the country contributing to it's content .

"Political language is designed to make lies sound truthful . . . and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind".

George Orwell, 1946

[BukowskiPineapple]

Go read the book and stop pasting nonsense you merely mass copied on here.

How ironic that a mormon who's never even read Orwell quotes him about idiots who talk pure wind. :))))))))

[cdddraftsman]

In 63, Murgados alleged surveillance work led him to N.O. , of all places, where he came across a curious gringo named LHO.

Are we really supposed to find this bunkum credible? To believe Murgado is to believe that RFK preferred to entrust his JFKs security to an obscure Cuban exile rather than the U.S. Secret Service. More to the point, Murgado is a former building inspector for the city of Miami who plead guilty in 1999 to accepting bribes in return for zoning favors

[cdddraftsman]

In place of confirmation Talbot suggests that Murgado should be believed because his story has not been refuted.

Talbots credulous use of Murgado can also be applied to Talbots use of unproven assertions allegedly made by E. H. Hunt, the recently deceased former CIA officer Talbot supplies information that was not even directly propagated by Hunt, but comes from his long-estranged son, St. John Hunt, a meth addict for 20 years, meth dealer for 10 of those years, and 2x convicted felon.

[cdddraftsman]

"the complexities of book length argument"

If it takes a whole book to explain the complexities of an argument that itself is a disclaimer against conspiracy .

ALL OTHER ASSASSINATIONS HAD VERY SIMPLISTIC EXPLANATIONS AS TO MOTIVE !

You just defeated yourself with your silly excuses .

[045781]

Kenneth ODonnell and Dave Powers were preasured into lying about were the shots came from.

FBI was acting on orders of that prevert Hoover to say it was LHO.

[cdddraftsman]

Why would they be pressured when their was already 50 people who had also reported (erroneously) that shots had come from there ?

a) Fact : No one saw a shooter anywhere else in DP except the TSBD .

b) Fact : No weapons , or shell casings were found anywhere else except the TSBD .

c) Fact : No one has ever been identified as a shooter except LHO from the TSBD .

[045781]

Why would ODonnell and Powers lie about being pressured into lying ?

a) Fact: Ed Hoffman saw the shooter

behind fence.

b) Fact: A Mauser rifle was found in TSBD proof of a plot to JFK

c) Fact: Mac Wallace identified as shooter in TSBD

[OneVoiceMore]

@cdddraftsman I love your fact-free facts. Not only did Ed Hoffman clearly and repeatedly report he saw a RIFLEMAN at the Grassy Knoll, those CLOSEST to the GK show a much higher percentage of witnesses who said GK than your distorted 10%.

Wow, no other weapons were found? Gosh, that must mean there WERE none. Your logic rocks. By that logic, since no weapons were found at OJs crime scene...there was no weapon!

Fact: At least three men I've heard of were reported to be the shooter. You lose.

[cdddraftsman]

@OneVoiceMore "Not only did Ed Hoffman clearly and repeatedly report he saw a RIFLEMAN at the Grassy Knoll"

Not only did Eddy retract his story the day he told it to the FBI, his own father said that he was prone to making things up because of his disability, and apologised to the FBI for his son wasting their time on what he could not of possibly seen from his supposed vantage point.

[cdddraftsman]

@OneVoiceMore "Factoid: At least three men I've heard of were reported to be the shooter. You lose"

Does many assassins mean that one probably dood it? Or does it indicate a weakness in your theory? If I said their have been 35 people implicated on the knoll does that mean it's a slam dunk that at least one dood it? NO ! In any criminal investigation having equal evidence for mutiple shooters is A STRONG INDICATION THAT THE INVESTIGATION IS F****D UP ! TOTALLY ! NO Q ABOUT IT !

[OneVoiceMore]

@cdddraftsman Oh, fuck sake. You're a red herring shill. Three guys fired, but you suggest that the two who didn't actually fire the fatal shot are somehow innocent?

And again, your logic is weak. I'm a little mystified at how bored I am to take you seriously, since clearly, you REALIZE there was a conspiracy, and have become very skilled at taking multiple positions to controvert individuals.

If you openly state "I BELIEVE OSWALD ACTED ALONE", I'll leave you to your coma.

[cdddraftsman]

@OneVoiceMore "I'm a little mystified"

OK I'll give you the dumbeddown version and my condolences that your quest for a higher education was not succesful at the same time. Don't waste time expressing belief system generated leftwing tripe. It wasn't successful in the 60's, I lived through it and didn't find it amuzing in the slightest. YOU ARE BORING, YOU BORE PEOPLE TO DEATH with you stewpidity and obnoxious malicious gullibility. In short do everyone a favor AND DROP DEAD.

[OneVoiceMore]

@cdddraftsman You've been owned, slave. Back of the bus with your 'edewcation'. Good lord. You misspell words while insulting someone's intelligence. You refer to YOUR LONE-ASS SELF in the first-person PLURAL. You didn't LIVE through the 60s. You put your head up your ass. You can't pull the age card on a VN vet, you sorry poser wannabe. You want me dead? Come get some. We'll see how it plays out, TALKER.

[cdddraftsman]

@OneVoiceMore "We'll see how it plays out, TALKER"

* Your implied answer indicates the JFK Con-Spiracy Hoax is just a game to you.

"You want me dead? Come get some"

* I really couldn't imagine a person who was born 'anencephaly' doing any worse than you're doing now. Do those stewpid pills really work that well? Just curious.

[OneVoiceMore]

@cdddraftsman Your dosage seems excessive. I'll cut back on it when I dose myself.

Nap time for you, pet.

[OneVoiceMore]

@cdddraftsman Sorry for your loss of temper and self-control. I'll use kid gloves with you from now on., since you get all butt-hurt when someone deals it back out at your sorry listless ineffectual self.

Hey, if I BORE you, here's a thought: Go home, practice shutting the fuck up all day, come back tomorrow, and demonstrate what you've learned.

Otherwise, a reasonable person might just get the impression that I'm at least interesting enough for you to INCESSANTLY respond to me.

Get it, kid?

[cdddraftsman]

@OneVoiceMore "when someone deals it back out at you"

I'm still waiting.

Tic-toc-tic-toc ......

You didn't refute what I said. It's all in the FBI documents, for those willing to do real research and not just puppet and regurgitate JFK con spiracy manure.

[cdddraftsman]

@OneVoiceMore "but you suggest that the two who didn't actually fire the fatal shot are somehow innocent?" Do you have any evidence that two 'other' shooters fired? NO! Any gun recovered? NOO! Any shell casings? NOOO! Any fiber evidence? (Please no YT butt hair samples) NOOOO! Anything at all? NOOOOO!

[starmanskye]

@cdddraftsman -- Pathetic, blindly repeating bland lemming shill-swill lacking even a minimal grasp of the evidenciary, testiment and circumstantial proof of massive coordinated cover-up, tampering and fabrication designed to implicate Oswald the FBI informant, CIA asset, anti-Marxist patsy as the designated fall-guy; Read Dr. Mary's Monkey for background on Dallas 1963 Nov. FACT: The wt. mass of bullets/fragments observed striking curb, found in the Limo, Conally & JFK is MORE than in 2 shots.

[cdddraftsman]

@OneVoiceMore "those CLOSEST to the GK show a much higher percentage of witnesses who said GK than your distorted 10%"

No doubt taken from Conspiracy Literature which has been proven to constitute the largest body of fraudulent work ever created on any one given subject.

"Wow, no other weapons were found? Gosh, that must mean there WERE none"

Well unless the Apple Dumpling Gang disposed of it how did you expect the supposed GK assassin to get rid of it?

[cdddraftsman]

Author David Talbot ought to the the sort of sober and serious person we would expect a member of the mainstream media to be on the assassination, but alas he isn't. Veteran journalist Don Bohning, who long reported on Talbot's prime suspects in the Miami Cuban community, finds Talbot's book Brothers to be pretty much another buff book, with credulous acceptance of suspect witnesses and a very selective use of the documentary record.

[BukowskiPineapple]

How do you find his book ? Have you read it ?

I'm not sure why you're mentioning witnesses in relation to Talbot's book. His book doesn't deal with the mechanics of the assassination.

It's a detailed look at the workings of Kennedy's government. It contains many interviews with members of JFK's administration and with former CIA agents.

These interviews form the basis for Talbot's theory that the CIA killed JFK.

It's a solid book. Worth a read.

[cdddraftsman]

"There were things that should have been done differently. There were mistakes made. But I know of no facts that have been brought to light which would call for a reassessment of the conclusion.

I'm fundamentally satisfied with the findings of the Warren Commission Report."

Senator Edward M. Kennedy

[xjeffgordon24]

arther STFU, stop trying to sound like you know what your talking about, your just saying what you saw on tv (JFK inside the target car)

[BukowskiPineapple]

LBJ,Richard Nixon, JFK special adviser at the United Nations, William Attwood; F.B.I. Senators Richard Russell (a Warren Commission member), and Richard Schweiker and Gary Hart (both of the Senate Intelligence Committee); seven of the eight congressmen on the House Assassinations Committee and its chief counsel, G. Robert Blakey; Frank Mankiewicz, Larry OBrien, Kenneth ODonnell, Walter Sheridan and ( comment continued below)

[colster4life]

Great book! Too many negative forces like the CIA, Union busters, Cuban exiles for the Kennedys to make their wishes become reality!

[atheismyes]

Book is fake. Read Bugliosi's RECLAIMING JUSTICE instead. Besides, Oswald was left-wing. Clay Shaw, David Ferrie, Guy Bannister were all completely innocent. Randi rules!

[arther1045]

talbot if the shots came from the grassy knoll it wouldn't have taken the side of JFKs head off. Do you know anything about entrance and exit wouldn't. JUst another conspiracy hack.

[arther1045]

this clip is just more conspiracy nut foollishness. Yes Talbot we know different witesses heard different things. Just like the survivors of the titalnic argued about wether the ship broke in half or not. O donnel and powers opinion of where the shots came from hold no more weight then other witnesses and most heaed 3 shots from the TSBD. But this idiot Talbot thinks what he is saying is important. Let me guess all of what he is saying cam out after the people in question were dead and couldn't

[karenlynn533]

I just have to wonder why Bug is a switch hitter. Edgar Allen Poe was a excellent writer, but it was mostly horror. November 22,

1963 to many was horror filled.

Yes, bug deserves the spotlight for changing his mind about the murder of the kennedy's. I hope he can rest easy knowing he cheated us and himself from the truth.

[slowsand70]

David your book is for the dog's bathroom. Bugliosi is brilliant, something you will never be!! Reclaiming History was the best reviewed book of 2007, and won the Edger Allen Poe Award. You can't say the same for your book can you? You are pathetic, and will never be able to even touch Bugliosi's shoes!

[renduke]

Athe postted the Bugliosi video to this.

Athe continues to make up "facts" as he goes along and Bugliosi is so full of it, it's leaking out his ears.

IMO Oswald was in on it but part of a much larger picture.

[atheismyes]

Renduke, you are really paranois about me. I didn't post this video, altho I wish I did. Name one fact that I made up. Randi rules!

[karenlynn533]

WTG David, atleast you have the courage to speak out about it. I read Brothers, very well done!!!!! Bobby knew the truth. It was just to painful to look at it.

[atheismyes]

If Booby knew the "truth," as you put it, why did he have his chief investigator Sheridan expose Garrison as the fraud he was? Randi rules!

[karenlynn533]

Excuse me, but are you Bernhart Getz? I posted that comment five months ago. Charles Bronson thought Getz a slow learner. Hmmmmm. Bobby or Robert did know the truth, I wonder what you would have done in his shoes? Probably talk to Randi, huh?

[atheismyes]

No one will answer my question! If RFK believed in conspiracy, why did he have righthand man Walter Sheridan debunk Garrison? Randi rules!

[karenlynn533]

Seems like a lot of that was going around. I can't answer your question as to why Bobby asked sheridan to check out the Garrison investigation. I do know that he had his own ideas as to who did it and suffered at the thought that he might have caused it. It appears that Randi and yourself already know everything anyway. No need for an answer. Just one correction, he did not ask Sheridan to debunk the investigation, he wanted to know if there was anything to it.

[atheismyes]

He asked Sheridan to look into it. He told RFK Garrison's a total fraud. RFK issued strong statement supporting Sheridan. Garrison then used innuendo against RFK. What evidence is there that RFK had his own ideas about killing? Randi rules!

[karenlynn533]

It appears that your debunking theory was incorrect. Do you know what debunking means? The problem with Garrison and Bobby arose when a scheduled meeting didn't happen, because Garrison was to busy drinking and chasing skirts and never made the appointment. That did not sit well with Bobby. I don't remember any strong statement against Garrison from Bob kennedy. I am sure Randi can show us where that statement is or how it came about.

[atheismyes]

Where's your evidence that Garrison & RFK were to ever have a meeting? He asked Sheridan to look into it, Sheridan said total fraud & put it on TV, Garrison tried to arrest Sheridan, RFK backs Sheridan, Garrison accuses RFK of involvement in assassination!

[karenlynn533]

I think all you want is someone to argue with. it pleases you and gives you a high. Show me where this all happened. You prove it.

[atheismyes]

Everything I posted was in public domain: New Orleans and natl. press, NBC report, books by James Kirkwood, Rosemary James, Patricia Lambert on the Garrison hoax. Nothing I posted is top secret. Randi rules!

[arther1045]

rfk didn't believe there was a conspiracy. He said so many times and even during a press confernece during the 1968 campaign. Ted Kennedy also says there was no conspiracy..the nuts try to change this fact.

[BukowskiPineapple]

Read David Talbot's book, the whole point of his book is that right away RFK suspected his brother had been killed by a CIA conspiracy. He couldn't come out and say this, as without definitive proof he would come across as a whack job. He wanted to win the Presidency in '68 and then open the case again.

Talbot bases his claim on interviews with RFK's closest aides, AND with anonymous members of the Kennedy Clan. Talbot is one of the best journalists of this era .... try reading his book.

[arther1045]

even if it is true that RFK thought it was a conspiracy ( which is nonesense )so what. he didn't know anything more then anyone else. I know Teddy Kennedy to this day says Oswald did it alone. I guess RFK didn't tell Teddy about it. More conspiracu nonesense. Nothing provable just theories. Talbot is an idiot. But a rich one.

[BukowskiPineapple]

; the Secret Service agent Roy Kellerman, who rode with the president in the limousine; the presidential physician, Dr. George Burkley; ALL are on record as stating that they believed that JFK was killed by a conspiracy involving elements of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the CIA.

[arther1045]

buk so what. even if it is true which i doubt they don't know more then anyone else.

[4ourthofjuly]

So if otherwise accomplished people working for the government believe there was a conspiracy, it means nothing? Yet we have to keep hearing people are "nuts" for believing in one? It kind of sounds like anyone who disagrees with you is "nuts".

[arther1045]

no anyone who could think there was a conspiracy in this case when all the evidence and logic points to Oswald alone is a nut.

[mafaldacrumbwitty]

Really dependable, anonymous members of the Kennedy clan.

[BukowskiPineapple]

It's clear from reading the book that Robert Kennedy and Jackie Kennedy believed that JFK was the victim of a coup by a powerful group of right-wingers.

Talbot presents a note that RFK had sent to the Moscow Attache in Washington, this note states that the peace initiative started by Kennedy will have to wait until RFK become the President.

Anyway, go to your library and read the book. It's a valuable historical document. Even if you disagree with some of it.

[hippymango]

I wonder have you spoken to RFK about what he believed? Did you know him personally? If not, then how could you have known what he believed?

[arther1045]

hippy what a dumb comment..there is a thing called the public record..Robert Kennedy said over and over he believd in the conclusion of the WC..He said it during a press conference one more time right before he died..

[mafaldacrumbwitty]

How could you?

[karenlynn533]

Oswald was crazy, Ruby was Crazy, Garrison was crazy, all CT's are crazy. Only the Warren Commission is the Gospel. I wish people would open their minds and think for themselves. It did not happen the way they are saying. I am not sure who was behind it, but it was not Oswald alone. NO WAY!

[atheismyes]

Garrison was kicked out of Natl Guard unit in 50s for mental illness. Ruby accused LBJ of planning to kill Jews. Oswald tried to kill Gen. Walker. Name ONE piece of evidence against Shaw/Ferrie/Bannister, who were found completely innocent in court.

[gosciu555]

he was shot in the head from behind. I've heard this from a military guy who also agrees it was a political hit.

[engemic]

Very interesting. The Warren Commission was a cover up. It's clear from witness after witness.

[karenlynn533]

I agree. even Earl Warren sis not want to be on the Commission. Johnson told him he had to be.

[a1g77luvvy]

wow changed his story what a damn tool.

[arther1045]

More conspiracy nut crap. Yeah David we all know some people thought that some shots came from the grassy knoll. This is nothing new. The two aids memory was no more important then anyone els at the grassy knoll. We have known for 44 years that people disagred big deal We know what the physical evidence showed. This is just another conspiracy hack making things see sinister.

[gosciu555]

the conspiracy theory conspiracy, they're trying make fun of people who look for the most obvious explanation, hehe.

[hippymango]

sounds like you're just spoiling for a fight

[arther1045]

here is what is happening.. i have read about the subject, and its a fact that Robert Kennedy said over and over that he believd the Warren Commision, There is no reason to believe he didn't, except for some idiot (Talbot ) wrote a book claiming he didn't despite all the vidence that he is wrong. I stat this and you give the silly retort that i didnt talk to JFK. I guess if your line of thining is correct then throw out all history books, nothing can be known if we didn't talk to someonme.

[hippymango]

Annoying you am I?

[BukowskiPineapple]

Listen I read this book in the library, I don't have it to hand to quote verbatim from it. Talbot is a credible journalist. He's not into sensationalism.

He quotes from a wide array of sources that RFK suspected that the CIA killed his brother.

Talbot produces a secret memo from RFK to Kruschev, RFK tells Kruschev that his brother's government has been overthrown by the CIA.

[BukowskiPineapple]

Post 2 of 2.

This is of course a startling claim. But Talbot is a very good journalist. The book has an extensive bibliography. Of course this doesn't in any way solidify his claims but it should surely garner him enough respect that you at least read his book before dismissing it.

It's a great book, it deals with the inner workings of JFK's government from 61 to 63. And it's a great insight to a period of great change in America.

[cdddraftsman]

At a speech at a California college, during his presidential campaign, when asked if he promised to reopen the investigation into his brothers death by reopening the WC archives , he said ? :

"I stand by the Warren Commission Report"

Senator Robert F. Kennedy

[cdddraftsman]

If his book doesn't deal with the mechanic's of the assassination then it's just another buff book . What other people's opnion about what other people feel and believe is not the point .

Lee Harvey Oswald Shot JFK AND HE DID IT ALL BY HIS LONESOME !

Any other conclusion his dishonest .

[BukowskiPineapple]

The book uses some great bread and butter research techniques to establish a link between Oswald and the CIA.

There is the McCone / James Rowley Document that shows clearly that Oswald was not a communist but a trained CIA operative. He entered the CIA in 1957.

It's entirely possible the LHO carried out the assassination all on his own and that a coup still took place.

Who was Oswald working for ?

[cdddraftsman]

Oswald at the age of 18 entered the CIA ?

Hmmmm...?

Pretty stupid statement .

No experience , no savvy and the Russians themselves thought of him as a country bumpkin .

You can believe fantasy's like that I don't !

[cdddraftsman]

David Talbots book on John and Robert Kennedy, Brothers, has garnered almost as much attention as Vincent Bugliosis exhaustive book on the assassination of President Kennedy, Reclaiming History. Bugliosi staunchly defends the finding that

LHO, acting alone, killed the president, while Talbot is squarely in the camp of those who believe JFK was killed by conspiracy. Both books cannot be true, so which 1 is false? 2 major reviews of Talbots book, 1 in The NY Times & the other in The

[BukowskiPineapple]

it's not fantasy it's a CIA document. I don't have a problem with the idea that Oswald acted alone, but you have a serious issue with being able to deal with any fact that differs from that of the WC.

It's a simple mate, he was brought into the CIA in 57.

Google McCone / Rowley document.

And boiling down a book into 2 sentences that you got from some other guy who read it is just plain silly.

Can you think for yourself on any issue ?

Try reading some time.

[cdddraftsman]

won the Ca. primary, only to be mortally wounded minutes after his victory speech. Undoubtedly, this was a formative moment in Talbots life; unfortunately, he shows little evidence of having moved on from a 16-year-olds starry-eyed view of the Kennedys.

[BukowskiPineapple]

You talk of this thesis as if you are aware of the points which Talbot has built this thesis on. Yet you haven't even read the book !

You're sole reason for de-bunking his thesis is that as a teenager he worked on RFK's campaign.

This is gross stupidity. This is not how we evaluate arguments, this is how stupid people justify their ignorance.

By latching on to some irrelevant point that they believe allows them to draw any conclusion they want.

You're borderline retarded.

[cdddraftsman]

When it comes to the subject of Cuba and the Kennedys, Brothers is not only a disappointment, but strives to turn that history upside down. Talbot attempts to do this via a familiar tactic: he draws from the recollections of staunch Kennedy friends and insiders, with proven track records of bending the historical record so that it reflects kindly on the Kennedy brothers. But in a new twist, Talbot also dredges up on the most dubious sources imaginable to further his argument !

[cdddraftsman]

An example of the latter is Angelo Murgado Kennedy, a Bay of Pigs veteran who claims to have been close to Robert Kennedy. Had Talbot asked any of Murgados fellow veterans, he would have heard him described as a persistent liar, a charlatan, and a man with no credibility—and these are the printable comments. Murgados name first surfaced in Joan Mellens mind-numbing book, Farewell to Justice, in which she defended the indefensible persecution of Clay Shaw by an out-of-control

[BukowskiPineapple]

Again more nonsense. Murgado gets around 2 paragraphs in the book. He's a minor footnote to the whole thing.

You're rabidly frothing at the mouth to dismiss this book yet you haven't even read it.

At least Talbot actually went to the bother of researching his book , you seem content on making things up.

[cdddraftsman]

New Orleans prosecutor named Jim Garrison. Prior to Mellens 2005 book, Murgado had been virtually unheard of amongst the Cuban fighters identified in the rather robust literature about the Bay of Pigs.[5] Yet in Mellens book Murgado suddenly appeared as a member of the inner circle—he was part of RFKs intelligence brain trust on Cuba.[6] Curious about Murgados bona fides, right after Mellens book appeared I asked Erneido Oliva, the deputy commander of the Bay of Pigs brigade, & the

[cdddraftsman]

late Rafael Quintero, one of the first Cuban nationals to enlist in the brigade, about Murgado.Oliva and Quintero (who died in October 2006) were both known for having grown close to Robert Kennedy in the aftermath of the debacle. They told me then they had never heard of Murgado.

[BukowskiPineapple]

Listen buddy I don't know why but for some reason you think it's fine to post whole bits of information off another web-site on here and pass it off as you're own "research".

The site you're posting it off is pure nonsense, yet at least the first author went to the trouble of writing it down.

You're just a cut and paste retard. Are you even reading what you're pasting on here ?

[cdddraftsman]

So it appears David Talbot was lying through his teeth about Murgado , a well known liar and charliton .

What else was he lying about ?

WHO THE FUCK CARES ?

When a judge catches a person lying in court the judgment goes to the other side immediately .

[BukowskiPineapple]

Lying ? What the hell have you been doing here for the past 35 minutes ?

All you've done is google talbot's name and then paste a load of nonsense of the first whack job site you came across.

And yet you stand by all of this as if you have some certain hard knowledge of the facts of Talbot's book.

All you've done is paste nonsense.

Again I say you have severe mental deficiencies. Go get help.

[cdddraftsman]

BukowskiPineappleHead appears to be another air-headed conspiracist who insists we listen to liars and charlitons , waste our time reading it voluminously , get out brains brainwashed by bullshit and then try to make up our minds .

Hmmmmm.....?

I think I'LL listen to veteran researchers who know what they're talking about .

AND WHO THE FUCK SAYS IT'S GOT TO BE MY OWN RESEARCH IN ORDER TO POST IT HERE ?

[BukowskiPineapple]

I don't agree with everything Talbot has said , but at least I've read it for myself. If you're going to argue the merits of someone's research you should at least be familiar with their research.

Otherwise you're being exactly what you just accused me of being. An empty air head ! Who roars and shouts opinions he obtained by perusing over some whack job web site.

It's the sign of an intelligent mind to hold an idea with which he might not agree with.

[cdddraftsman]

Washington Post, were both hedged and overly credulous, written as they were by authors who could not challenge Talbot based upon a superior knowledge of the facts. Washington Decoded thought it was time to subject Brothers to examination by an author, Don Bohning, w/expertise in some of Brothers subject matter. Bohning covered Latin America for The Miami Herald for almost four decades. His first-hand knowledge of the Cuban exile community, the CIA, and their anti-Castro activities

[cdddraftsman]

from the late 1950s into the late 1970s is probably unrivaled among American journalists. Before and after retiring, Bohning spent 10 years researching the U.S. governments secret war against Cuba, and in 2005 published a reliable and unsparing book about Washingtons fixation on Cuba from 1959 to 1965.

While Bohning does not address the assassination conspiracy issue head-on, it is reasonable to extrapolate that the defects he identifies in Brothers apply to the book as a whole.

[cdddraftsman]

David Talbot believes JFKs assassin. was a conspiracy. Talbots prime suspects are identified in Brothers opening pages: The CIA, Mafia and Cuba—Bobby [Kennedy] knew they were intertwined. The CIA had formed a sinister alliance with underworld bosses to assassinate Fidel Castro, working with mob-connected Cuban exile leaders. Consequently, immediately after the assassin. of JFK , AG RFK began hunting for the responsible party w/in this trio of possible culprits, according to Talbot.

[cdddraftsman]

A central thesis of Brothers is that Robert Kennedy only gave lip service to the U.S. governments official verdict. While publicly endorsing the Warren Commissions findings of a lone gunman, RFK believed the assassination was a conspiracy and quietly dedicated himself to identifying those responsible. This quest, in turn, helped fuel his 1968 presidential run, which ended tragically with his own assassination in June of that year. Talbot was a teen-age volunteer in that campaign in which RFK

[BukowskiPineapple]

You're here arguing about the merits of some book you've never even read for yourself. !

Do you realise the absurdity of your position ?

It beggars belief how anyone could end up in such a position.

Only someone with a fairly low IQ would begin to argue about something which they have no experience of.

[BukowskiPineapple]

This is the point of the reading things. You see the book is detailed look at the fact that Robert Kennedy believed deeply that a coup had taken place. He knew that he had to tread carefully and that he couldn't go against the WC without turning the country into civil war.

The book supports this argument with interviews from RFK's closest aides and confidants.

Try reading things even if you disagree with them.

Helps to know exactly what you're arguing against.

[luizstaudt]

Well, looks like Jack Ruby is the true hero out there, huh? So John Kennedy is been killed. Many people heard several shots. At least three, as I can see. Many people claimed the shots came from different positions... And then our great hero, Jack Ruby, he revenges the whole american people by killing the son of a bitch Lee Oswald... And then the whole history is gone. Oh, that's such a coincidence... And That Lee Oswald, such a great shooter, huh?

[MutantDealer]

1st to comment!

[johnlepo]

What an honor for you. Let me award you with the 'greatest waste of time' award. A hero to all men.