Nightwish - Ever Dream 19.09.09 Hartwall Areena

[TheSimdaxxx]

compare this to Hartwall in 2005 and your mouth will fall down . . .

[MargolottaLady]

@TheSimdaxxx If you compare this poor quality recording from a mobile phone with "corrected" DVD-version it definitely will ;). Yeah, Tarja is better singer, but Anette is also brilliant.

[irenikus777]

@MargolottaLady

I recorded Tarja with my cell phone on 2 different shows, her live performances are incredible.

At this moment technology is not good enough to modify the human voice that well, a trained ear would to not notice a difference.

The DVD version of End of Era does not have processed sound. It DOES indeed have good quality sound, because it was recorded professionally directly from the microphones.

[MargolottaLady]

@irenikus777 No, you misunderstood me ;). I've seen Tarja live and I think she is a great performer. But also saw Anette in 2009 and I think that films at youtube don't show her possibilities - even if I prefer Tarja and know she's technically better..

Music DVDs are always's got processed sound, in EoaE you can hear it, for example, at The Siren (if you listen to it carefully, you should notice it ;)).

[irenikus777]

@MargolottaLady

My ears never fail me but an example might be more objective.

Check out 2 amateur recordings from different concerts of Tarja singing the Siren, several months ago.

watch?v=j3fdUjZK8Dg

watch?v=3Xjk_p-yG4Q

Ignoring the bad quality sound, you'll see she sings identically, INCLUDING the famous 'not-human voice' powerbelting at 2:40.

I could write you the song note by note also, if you want.. she's singing the vocal part identically :)

[georg1187]

@irenikus777

Geez, you're right. I always thought that's a sound effect!

[irenikus777]

@georg1187

Yep. Here,another Siren performance from last week at Summerbreeze. Identical, including the pwb

watch?v=FJlYJJK0dNo&feature=re­lated



[HeartsEyes]

@irenikus777 Sorry, the End of an Era DVD was indeed edited as to Tarja's vocals.. only that it was done because of her throat illness that night, so I wouldn't use that as criticism against her.

As to the "powerbelting", how much do you know about belting? That is nowhere powerbelting that she does.. no criticism intended, because she's a classical singer, but it just isn't.

Also, a selection of videos that you made is nowhere more objective than your personal opinion. ;)

[irenikus777]

@HeartsEyes

Your statements are so ambiguous that I don't understand whether you are praising or trashing her.

I know as much about belting that I am teaching it. We are not only kids here you know

I was talking about the belting she does after the keyboard solo, which is a "power" belting meaning, the chords are forced to stretch and hit each other to produce that weird sound.

The selection of videos which I gave demonstrate everything, if you have what's needed to understand.

Simple as that.

[HeartsEyes]

@irenikus777 I was neither praising nor trashing her. That is possible. ;)

The question what you know about belting was really just a question, though I realize it may be understood as criticism, that was not my intention. I just wanted to know.

I know which part of the song you refer to, then please tell me, what is the difference between belting and powerbelting?

And I meant that of course you would select videos that prove your point. ;)

[irenikus777]

@HeartsEyes

I explained in the previous reply. Power belting involves straining of the vocal cords, so that in their tension to touch eachother and produce that mixed metallic sound. By many pretentious singers it's not even accepted and considered a certain way to injure yourself. Obviously it's not the case, as I showed Tarja does it everytime in Siren

Yourself can find examples in oriental religious music and some "black" music, I am busy and kind of tired of these discussions to be honest.

[HeartsEyes]

@irenikus777 What you explained in the previous reply is known to me as simply "belting", which is why I asked about the different term. Sorry if that already offends you, though I see no reason to pre-assume I had anything against that technique.

[irenikus777]

@HeartsEyes

Sorry, I might have been a bit aggresive. Lately every discussion on YT about Tarja or NW is transforming into a flame war.

Anyway.. the difference consists in that scratching intermittent sound. It's a bit more obvious here at 2:40

/watch?v=YxMEfZ4YMCY&feature=r­elated

Here at 4:10 is great example of skill. A rare coloratura technique (staccatissimo) used in an even more unusual way

/watch?v=YAM_iDe8Kt8&feature=r­elated

Pretty "kewl" no? :)

[HeartsEyes]

@irenikus777 "the difference" as in between belting and power belting? Sorry about the confusion.

And I do see what you mean with the staccatissimo in the second video, though I don't see belting there at all. ;)

The Siren part is probably a matter of taste.. ;) if you say so, I can respect it as skill, but I can find it nowhere beautiful (but which probably isn't the intention anyway?). Just me.

I do wonder though why we discuss 10th Man Down and The Siren under an Ever Dream video. xD

[irenikus777]

@HeartsEyes

10-th man down is a powerful and dark tune. The second part from which I gave the example is very ryhtmic and intense and that part of Tarja's is literally giving me the chills.

I gave it as an example of a technique having certain roots and purpose, but used differently in another purpose - same as the power/no power belting.

[irenikus777]

@HeartsEyes

Regarding the first two: belting means using throat muscle and chest voice to produce mid and high range notes.

You really cannot hear the difference? Meaning that in that vocalization from Siren, you really cannot hear EXTRA screeching/vibrating sounds in parralel?

No matter.. to answer your final question, this discussion about Siren started some time ago when somebody stated that Tarja in Siren sounds like that because her voice is processed/filtered.

I am off now, gn and gl.

[HeartsEyes]

@irenikus777 Just making sure that was the difference you were using the different terms for. I can hear it indeed, it's actually the part I don't really like. ;)

Yep, guess we cleared things up there, have a good one.

[12321marianne]

@HeartsEyes

You asked that lot of semi-retarded questions and concluded that you simply don't like it.

You know the expression 'throwing diamonds to the pigs'? You were crystal clear image for it.

[HeartsEyes]

@12321marianne No need to get offensive about a matter of taste.

[12321marianne]

@HeartsEyes

You don't need to get offended, it's simply a matter of taste ;)

[CraiglesBagels]

Oh my god

I would've loved to have seen them in Finland than the UK. Everything seems so better, the crowd, the songlist, Anette is amazing here.

[Ebonybitch91]

@CraiglesBagels

She was very good :) though I think, even if Ghost Love Score is my absolute favourite, Anette sounded just......IIIIIH at it D: XD

[mackolaszlo]

That's the spirit guys! I love how you sing along :)

[Ebonybitch91]

@mackolaszlo

XD Wish I could sing less loud........but who can, when it's Nightwish you are watching!? ;-)

[genpsi]

говно

[SeaKitten00]

@genpsi

Oh take a hike!!

[WaterArk]

I love how she's sung this song differently almost every time. I think this is one of my favorite versions <3

[LittleAngelic88]

Ja kvaliteten e ju inte den bästa..

Men låten e väl rätt bra ;)

[Ajaxxx15]

unless the quality, I can fully understand you loved this show so much...

most powerfull perf ever..