@OtomoTenzi Then we are looking at two VERY different Genesis versions. The Genesis version is simply LOUDER, not better. SNES version has way better quality. And they move at pretty much the same speed. Also the 6 button controller was better for Street Fighter, not for Mortal Kombat.
Since I'm wearing headphones, I can tell how the SNES port utilizes the stereo as a fighter falls on one side of the screen. Despite the muffled, but superior sound, I prefer the SNES port. It's like people were beginning to grow lazy with most Genesis/Mega Drive ports after the Super Nintendo's relatively bad start was coming to an end. What happened??
I wish this guy would have put the arcade in there as well to really show which is a closer port. Being a huge MK fan the SNES is the clear winner cleaner sound and graphics, the gen version has been struck with laryngitis again.
@sandroace Yeah, it's like after the first MK on SNES, which was a huge, censored JOKE (all thanks to Nintendo of America), it seems like SNES got gradual revenge on the Genesis/Mega Drive--starting with Mortal Kombat II. Despite the first but ridiculous MK port on SNES, the SNES--in my opinion--had the better soundtrack in all three ports, even though I LOVE MK2's soundtrack on the Genesis/Mega Drive.
@SuperMario811 Agreed. Visually and Audibly the SNES was far superior in all ports particularly 1 and 2. The only down fall in part 1 was the obvious lack of blood and sluggish gameplay, but still looked and sounded miles better than it's Genesis counterpart.
I grew up with both SNES and Genesis systems...I'd have to say that the SNES version sounds (and looks) a little cleaner/superior. The Genesis sounds a bit 'scratchy.' In the case of MK3, SNES is what Genesisn't
super nintendo is great but it doesn't follow the standart trend music wise snes has a generic fluffy muffled sound that only can sound good with itrested and good comnposers behind it,genesis is just chiptune and beyond like the c64 it's shit oh i meant sid chip or the awesome nes music etc.
super nintendo is great but it doesn't follow the standart trend music wise snes has a generic fluffy muffled sound that only can sound good with itrested and good comnposers behind it,genesis is just chiptune and beyond like the c64 uit's shit chip or the awesome nes music etc.
@SegaFanatic5188 Oh yeah, the instrument set thing. I'd say that varies from game to game, particularly on the SNES, what with the use of samples and all. It's sort of an extra factor that isn't an issue for the FM synth-only Genesis (except for what to do with the one channel that it does have for samples, which is usually used for drums).
genesis version is better.i'm not beeing a fanboy but the music in the snes version is so wrong and so off,like the only thing i hear in the snes version is bass.
Oh really ? Check 0:49-0:53 , If you don't know what he's saying you'll never understand it.Still think that SNES version has better and clear voice ?Apart of that , they look the same.
Megadrive finish him to Snes.... fatality :) i have snes and genesis versions... genesis have more graphic details, better sound (incredible right?? but is true)...
I'm surprised, the Genesis and SNES versions actually look pretty similar here. As usual, the Genesis has better sound, but the SNES has slightly more details.
@nooblet911 No, on this particular game the Yamaha does sound better than the SPC Chip.
Some games sound better on SPC and some sound better on Yamaha, this is one of them in my opinion. The SPC versions of these tunes sound too mono toned and the guitars are nowhere near the same standard.
@Alevamltd I love how you make that sound like an advantage. And yet, each of the SNES's channels is capable of 16-bit sampled sounds. Of the Genny's ten, only six are actually FM channels and only one of those six could be used for sampled sounds. The only argument Genny fans have in the musical tech department is that the SNES sound is more compressed ("muffled", as they like to say). Virtually every other sound advantage goes to the SNES. It's just technically superior in that area.
....of course, composition trumps all, and the Genesis has some great music, but the SNES sound was more versatile. That much is not an opinion, but a fact. It is why different SNES soundtracks are more successful with different styles (orchestral, jazz, ambient, whatever) whereas Genesis music tends to work better when an electronic and/or rock'n style is used (to take advantage of the FM sound).
@Alevamltd Ha ha, that's okay. Some people might prefer the NES sound, the C64, or other distinctive chiptune sounds. I just felt like it wasn't fair to state that "more channels = superior sound" in this case. I mean, most Genesis soundtracks don't even use all ten channels, as the four channels associated with the TI PSG chip were present largely because the Master System had them.
In any case, I love me some Genesis soundtracks as well. SoR2's is GODLY good.
@megavolt67 There are engines for the Genesis that give an additional PCM channel. SNES has it's perks, it's great at Orchestral stuff, ambient stuff and things like that, but Genesis kicks it's but when it comes to rock and techno style stuff.
And if ROM size permitted, they could have just streamed a prerecorded track through that one PCM channel. Take a look at this if you don't believe me: watch?v=oKsUAywSyEg
@SegaFanatic5188 I've heard that argument before, and I still don't agree. Sega fans use it to suggest that the difference between the two is purely matter of preference. Fact is, SNES has some very good rock and techno stuff lke Megaman X and Super Aleste. Basically, while the Genesis is pretty bad at just about anything BUT rock and techno, the SNES can do almost anything very well. It just tends to get recognized more for the orchestral-style scores that accompany its RPG lineup.
@megavolt67 Also, if you want me to recommend more rock'n and/or techno-ish type scores for the SNES, just ask. It's not incapable of putting out really good stuff in that department by any stretch of the imagination. Unfortunately, most Sega diehards haven't heard much SNES music beyond the Nintendo and Square stuff (not that that stuff isn't great, but it does tend to leave out the more rock'n stuff, except for FF Mystic Quest [which is another good rock'n SNES soundtrack, btw]).
@megavolt67 Just how most SNES diehards haven't heard much Genesis music outside of Sonic and the bad ports like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat.
There are plenty of great soundtracks on the Genesis. Some of which are easily overlooked. For example Sonic 2 alone has at least 3 good examples of Orchestral and big band sounding tracks with Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone.
Both systems have good and capable audio chips. They are just two different approaches to sound.
@megavolt67 Just how most SNES diehards haven't heard much Genesis music outside of Sonic and the bad ports like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat.
There are plenty of great soundtracks on the Genesis. Some of which are easily overlooked. For example Sonic 2 alone has at least 3 good examples of Orchestral and big band sounding tracks with Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone.
Both systems have good and capable audio chips. They are just two different approaches to sound.
@megavolt67 Just how most SNES diehards haven't heard much Genesis music outside of Sonic and the bad ports like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat.
There are plenty of great soundtracks on the Genesis. Some of which are easily overlooked. Sonic 2 alone has at least 3 good examples of Orchestral and big band sounding tracks with Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone.
Both systems have good and capable audio chips. They are just two different approaches to sound.
@SegaFanatic5188 You should watch my top ten Genesis tracks video, lol. Sinking Old Sanctuary is one of my all time favorites. And yet, that's more a compositional achievement than something which benefitted from the Genesis synth's thrashy and metallic sound. Anyway, it's a fact that the SNES sound hardware is more advanced, despite your stubborness. And if you want some comparisons where the SNES actually outrocks the Genesis, try Rock 'n Roll Racing and Spiderman/X-Men Arcade's Revenge.
@megavolt67 I never understand this. Do NES fans also maintain that its sound is "different but equal"? I hope not. A great soundtrack is a great soundtrack regardless of the sound limitations (SoR2 is in my all-time top five, for example), and I would certainly take the soundtrack of Megaman 2 over many that were introduced on more advanced sound hardware, but facts are facts, people. No one is denying the distinctive sound of chiptunes on different consoles, but that's something different.
@megavolt67 It depends what you are comparing it to really. With the SNES and Genesis, SNES has a more advanced chip but it's limited severely by memory and other constraints. This causes us to end up with sounds that are muffled, warbly and just plain awful sounding at times. Since Genesis doesn't have to rely on samples it's not nearly as limited in this. Since it's synthesized in real time we get clean and crisp sounds. However it's limited by the limitations of FM Synthesis.
@SegaFanatic5188 That's just it. The FM limitation means more to the actual music and what kind of styles will (techno) or won't (orchestral) work so well. That's more of a limit to the art than sound quality. Samples can sound like anything, whereas FM synth will always sound thrashy and chunky. From Turtles in Time to Chrono Trigger, the SNES did different styles better. I like some Genesis soundtracks a great deal, but it's obvious to most that the SNES had the bigger instrument set.
@megavolt67 Hyperstone Heist sounds much closer to the Arcade than the SNES port of Turtles in Time. And the Arcade sounds the best out of all of them. And you aren't getting the whole point of memory limitations. Not only does it limit the quality of samples but it also limits the number of different samples and instruments you can have at one time.
There are interviews with composers of the era who praise the Genesis because it allowed for more freedom than the SNES. Explain that one.
@SegaFanatic5188 I have both games and the SNES version sounds considerably better to me. Its got more oomph.
The memory limitations are why the samples are compressed, but again, that's a clarity issue. Ultimately, it didn't stop composers from crafting superior soundtracks like Front Mission, Live-A-Live, Castlevania IV, Plok!, Tactics Ogre, TMNT Tournament Fighters, Mystic Ark, Star Fox, etc. There's a great artistry and variety that the Genesis cannot match. It's just the truth.
@SegaFanatic5188 I'm not sure where else you want to go with this. I've heard a great deal on both consoles and I'm 100% sure that the musical legacy of the SNES is greater than that of the Genesis. When you think of the best Genesis soundtracks, there's just no escaping that the rock and techno ones are the most memorable (Thunderforce, Sonic series, etc). Even with its RPGs, it's Phantasy Star IV that most folks point to, and its for the many rock/techno highlights. It is what it is.
@megavolt67 Oh, and I wouldn't mind seeing or reading some of those interviews you're talking about, if you've got links. We may disagree on the specific comparison here, but I do feel that the limitations of the chiptune days forced composers to be more creative sometimes. I recall Yuzo Koshiro (who I feel is the guy that got the best out of the Genesis) saying something about how he preferred the chiptune days because he felt that the music back then fit the games better.
@megavolt67 The one interview that comes to mind is actually one with Yuzo Koshiro. He specifically mentions how the memory limitations of the SNES limited the number different samples and instruments they could have at one time and that they had to design an engine that streamed the samples off the cart in real time as they were needed. He then goes onto say that while there were limitations for the Genesis they weren't nearly as restricting. I can send you a link to it if you'd like.
@SegaFanatic5188 Sure, go ahead. I can see why Koshiro might have a soft spot for the Genesis. Revenge of Shinobi and SoR really put him on the map, and as I think I mentioned before, I hold the SoR2 soundtrack in the highest regard. The FM synth meshed with the house/techno style perfectly in that one.
Anyway, if what you say about is true, then it is an irony of a sort that many VGM fans consider Actraiser to be his best effort. Critics tend to have different opinions than creators.
@megavolt67 He states in the Interview that SoR2 and Actraiser are his best works. But he states that the SNES was much more limiting to work with because of memory constraints. They had to stream samples in off the cart to get around it as the way the system was set up by default they couldn't have all the instruments they wanted at once. You only have 64KB of memory on the SNES for audio, and since it relies on samples that fills up very quickly.
@SegaFanatic5188 Thanks for the link. He says that the Genesis has similar memory restrictions (he's asked about it directly), but that the sound chip is simpler to work with, which isn't exactly the same as "allowing more freedom". Just that it's a less complicated matter. Clearly, other SNES composers were also able to work around the memory issue, as indicated by the many great-sounding soundtracks to come. I've already mentioned many, and if you haven't heard them, do check them out.
@megavolt67 Genesis did have those limitations as well, but since you weren't relying on samples you don't run into them as quickly. Since on the Genesis you generate your own sounds in real time the memory limitations don't get it your way as much,
There are some great soundtracks on the SNES, but there are also some bland and generic sounding ones that tend to use the same instruments, which to me sound almost like Kazoos since they are so compressed.
@SegaFanatic5188 The end result makes the limitations irrelevant, at least when compared to the Genesis. In the end, soundtracks like Gun Hazard simply blow away the great majority of music on the Genesis in terms of sound and composition. We're going in circles here and you haven't refuted the most important fact, which is that the more varied music was produced on SNES.
And yes, some SNES music sounds generic, just like some Genesis music sounds tinny or like nails on a chalkboard.
@SegaFanatic5188 I grew up with both the SNES and Genesis. I've also got five years on you, and as far as I can tell, it's pretty obvious that I've heard more SNES music and maybe even more Genesis music. Stop harping on the same points and realize that the SNES produced more grand soundtracks that continue to be remembered more often to this day. Part of it is the inexperience that many folks have with the Genesis, but part of it also the greater versatility of a sample-based soundchip, the
@SegaFanatic5188 (cont.) near exclusivity (on SNES) of incredibly talented developers known for their great music (because of the composers they had), like Capcom, Konami, Rare, and Square. And part of it is the emphasis of the Genesis on sports and action games. If you know RPGs, you know that the soundtracks tend to be more diverse stylistically and contextually because the stories and gameplay cover a greater range of content. There's just many reasons why SNES won/wins out musically.
@SegaFanatic5188 So, can we end this now? If you prefer the Genesis sound, that's fine, but the whole level playing field thing you stubbornly keep shooting for? It's a pipe dream. Whatever advantages the Genesis had in sound were ultimately outweighed by the advantages the SNES had, and they should be. The SNES was released two years after the Genesis and it was only a matter of time until scores like DKC made people look at the Genesis and hear something dated. Everything's been said.
@megavolt67 That's just it though, the advantages weren't outweighed. In most cases it evened out in not only sound but other areas like graphics as well. This is why the SNES didn't completely dominate in the US and Europe. Gamers saw it didn't actually beat the Genesis in every aspect and this is why the Genesis not only sold equally with the SNES, but it actually outsold it for a few years.
@SegaFanatic5188 I was just talking about the music, and now you're bringing up the console war itself, which is a different discussion. If we're talking games, then of course I wouldn't claim that the SNES beats Genesis in every aspect. I'm not even saying that about the music. Just that the SNES bests it musically OVERALL. Also, I still own my original consoles along with 75 or so Genesis games and 100+ SNES games. I even have the early model Genesis with the best sound. Agenda much?
@megavolt67 It's not really an agenda, you just wouldn't believe the number of SNES fanboys that go on and on about how much the Genesis sucks yet their only experiences with either system are emulators that poorly reproduce Genesis audio and ones that remove the heavy filtering that SNES hardware does that results in sounds sounding muffled. I'm actually relieved that you still have both systems and know what they are supposed to sound like.
@SegaFanatic5188 Like many Sega diehards, you've got a chip on your shoulder when it comes to SNES versus Genesis debates. It makes your arguments very one-sided because you take the pro-SNES argument for granted. But generalizing the majority of SNES music as muffled isn't valid reasoning for leveling the field. People just don't say, Final Fantasy VI has a great soundtrack, but it's muffled, so Phantasy Star IV is on par. It's just not something that hurts the music like you claim it does.
@megavolt67 It's not the majority of all SNES music that's muffled, all of it is muffled because the system does that on it's own automatically.
Now, I like the SNES and the Genesis equally, and I view them as equals. However I take the Genesis side because in most Debates the Genesis is usually the underdog getting bashed by SNES fans.
Did I ever say SNES and Phantasy Star are equal in Sound tracks? No I didn't. I said the systems are even.
@megavolt67 SNES may have games that cover a wider range of genres but that doesn't mean it's best at everything. There are certain genres it excels at and others it does very poorly. The same can be said of the Genesis. This is why they even out in the end.
Oh, and one thing I suggest to you is to go back to your consoles before stating some things, because Emulators are not entirely accurate. For one a lot of Genesis emulators screw up sounds, and many SNES emulators improve the sound.
@megavolt67 How about you stop putting the SNES on a pedestal it doesn't deserve? The System has an advanced sound chip but it's severely limited by memory and other bottlenecks. Outside of Megaman and Super Street Fighter 2 most of Capcom's stuff on the SNES is plain bad. It's typical warbly muffled and over compressed samples that sound nothing like their original instruments. A lot of stuff on the SNES has this same issue.
@SegaFanatic5188 Techno, techno, techno. Rock, rock, rock. We know Koshiro is good. We know Technosoft is good. We know Genesis is good at thrash/electronica. You're not giving me anything we haven't turned inside-out already, and if you're still pushing the unsupported generalization about the SNES only being good at orchestral, then you haven't been paying attention to the examples of good non-orchestral stuff I've already mentioned. Should I mention ten or twenty more? Ugh.
@megavolt67 I've listened to the examples you've given to me, I'm not really impressed. In fact I can't help but imagine how it could probably be better if it was on the Genesis. SNES does great at creating realistic sounding instruments because it uses samples. It however falls short at doing techno and offworldly sounds. And in many cases brass and other instruments I think are done better on the Genesis. They sound cleaner and not as much like bad Midi like they do on the SNES.
@SegaFanatic5188 Demon's Crest? Final Fight 3? Breath of Fire 1/2? Those aren't bad soundtracks by any stretch of the imagination. Again, you generalize and assert without solid reasoning and without good examples. I've given you the benefit of the doubt up to this point, but I'm just about done with you, "SegaFanatic". You're doing too good a job of representing your username.
@megavolt67 I've heard Final Fight 3's music, again nothing to write home about. Streets of Rage has it beat. It most the instruments are muffled and sound almost like kazoos.
You say I've ignored examples when I've mentioned perfect examples of the Genesis doing orchestral and big band stuff in some of it's most popular games and you still claim it can only do techno.
SNES can do other genres, but it has some it excels at. Just as the Genesis can do other genres but has some it excels at.
@SegaFanatic5188 You mentioned a couple of single TRACKS. And while a good melody can make it work out okay, it's not ideal. Ideal is SoR2, which has a style that matches the sound perfectly. But generalizing is safer for you since it obscures the truth. It's not even. The SNES is more competent at rock/techno that the Genesis is at orchestral. In fact, Super Aleste might be my favorite shmup score (it or Gate of Thunder), and it has a great otherworldly, techno-ish sound.
@SegaFanatic5188 Also, if you're unimpressed by soundtracks like Mystic Ark and Live-A-Live, then I don't know what to say. Poor taste? Lack of a musical ear? Fortunately, the majority of VGM enthusiasts would disagree with you. Consider it a courtesy that I'm still addressing someone who asserts the exact opposite and hasn't provided nearly enough reasoning for it. It's just that some of you Sega guys are so sure that everyone else got it wrong. The delusional arrogance draws me.
@megavolt67 Allow me to clarify, I am not really impressed with them as examples of rock and techno on the SNES. From what I've heard of ones like Mystic Ark the sound more along the lines of what we have in Final Fantasy, mixes of Orchestral and rock which would favor the SNES more mainly because of the orchestral portions.
And many of them are great compositions, but the instrument set does not do them justice. Starfox I think is a good example of this.
@SegaFanatic5188 And once again, are you going to tell me that Rock 'n Roll Racing doesn't sound good on the SNES? That it "stutters" somehow? That it's muffled? Everyone I've seen comment on it thinks that it sounds really good, and when you hear the Genesis version (which came out a year later), you can really tell that the composers attempted to reproduce the samples without much success. Or Bubsy, which is a variety of styles. That one sounds TERRIBLE on the Genesis.
@megavolt67 Turtles in Time does stutter and here's why. It's using Samples from an FM Synthesizer as instruments and as a result each note sticks out and doesn't smoothly transition. This is the SNES trying to fake FM Synthesis and it doesn't do it as well as the real thing for obvious reasons. It does an admirable effort though. Listen to the areas where a lot of notes are played very rapidly. On the Genesis and Arcade it's done smoothly, on SNES it stutters in between each note.
@SegaFanatic5188 But Hyperstone Heist sounds like utter garbage in comparison to Turtles in Time...
How on earth can people say that it sounds better when the instruments are lacking and the turtle voices are extremely muffled?
I like both consoles, and have to admit that I think it's funny that only SEGA fans so far have said that Hyperstone Heist is better regarding sound and music.
Just download emulators and compare. More like "Turtles in Grime: Hyperstone Shite!" Baaaad sound!
@Stigtrix First of all a lot of Genesis emulators are bad and inaccurate to the real hardware. The same can be said for SNES emulators. The most accurate ones, which still are not perfect, are Kega Fusion and bSNES.
Secondly compare SNES TiT to the Arcade version. You'll find it sounds nothing like it. Compare HH to the Arcade and you will find it sounds very similar. This is why the Genesis is considered better here.
@SegaFanatic5188 you're right in that the SNES version of Turtles in Time sounds nothing like the arcade version in terms of arrangements of the music, if anything for me it sounds way better. Listening to Neon Night Riders for both versions? No contest, SNES version kills it.
@IcedEarthaholic Listen to Sewer Surfin for all 3 versions. The Arcade kills both, but the Genesis version still sounds closer and better than the SNES version. Same for Alleycat blues, the boss battle music, and almost every other track. The Arcade is just the best sounding version.
@SegaFanatic5188 for you anyway, checked out both the arcade and Genesis versions, and while they are very cool, I will not deny that at all, for me the SNES version had most of the best arrangements. Prehistoric Turtlesaurus, Neon Night Riders, Bury My Shell At Wounded Knee, etc. all sounded fantastic on the SNES. Especially love the galloping drum intro w/Bury My Shell.
@IcedEarthaholic I find the Arcade to be the best for all the tracks really. It has the most instruments, sounds the cleanest, and has the best sounds overall. Genesis is a close 2nd, but SNES basically sounds like someone put a pillow over the speaker.
@SegaFanatic5188 I stand by what I say myself, yes the arcade version had a clean sound to it absolutely, but I just did not like alot of the arrangements on it. The Genesis version had some nice arrangements, but I feel honestly if you applied what you said about the SNES with the pillow over the speaker, you'd get my opinion overall with the whole thing. Though in cases the Genesis version has the better soundtrack (Mortal Kombat being a prime example), for the Turtles? SNES for the win.
@megavolt67 As for Bubsy and Rock 'n Roll Racing, those are perfect examples of poorly handled Genesis soundtracks. I'd put them up there with Doom 32X. They could have been handled better as other games on the system have shown. They are perfect examples of poor instrument choice.
@SegaFanatic5188 So basically, poor SNES to Genesis translations are the result of bad choices and/or lackadaisical effort from composers/programmers, whereas poor Genesis to SNES translations are the result of limitations in the sound hardware. It's like the glass is always half-full with Genesis whereas it's always half-empty with the SNES. And the best part is, you can still technically call it even despite the one-sidedness of it all. Brilliant!
@megavolt67 I didn't say in all cases, I said in the cases of the games you mentioned. A few of the instruments in Rock n' Roll Racing stick out as just flat out awful choices that you hear in a lot of bad Genesis sound tracks.
@megavolt67 I didn't say in all cases, I said in the cases of the games you mentioned. A few of the instruments in Rock n' Roll Racing stick out as just flat out awful choices that you hear in a lot of bad Genesis sound tracks.
Muffled sound and things like that are hardware limitations. Just as Genesis not doing Strings and other orchestral instruments well is a hardware limitation. Poor hardware use and poor instrument choice is the developers problem though.
@SegaFanatic5188 Muffled sound doesn't affect composition, and it never stopped folks from appreciating the aural beauty of tracks like Aquatic Ambience, so why does it factor so heavily for you? Are you some kind of audiophile? But then, how could you be? These are 16-bit, cartridge-based consoles we're talking about it. I could understand someone reared today's consoles both SNES and Genesis audio, but this muffling focus seems specifically born out of SNES versus Genesis debates.
@megavolt67 For certain songs it doesn't bother me, but for others it does. For example the Final Fight games. The muffled audio really ruins those soundtracks for me. It basically makes the instruments all sound like kazoos or something awkward like that and after listening to it for a while it almost gives me a headache. It's when you get to your low pitched stuff that it really starts to get on my nerves.
@SegaFanatic5188 Well, I can't argue with some do and some don't, but as for the specific example, I really do like the music in Final Fight 3. It's no SoR2 (what is?), but I was surprised at how good it was. The first Final Fight on SNES sounds like crap (it's a crappy port, really). The second one I haven't put much time into, but yeah, I wouldn't generalize the whole series in such a way, because the third is really on a different level overall as one of the best beat'em ups of the era.
@megavolt67 From what I've heard of Final Fight 3, it's definitely a step up from the first 2, but I still find myself wondering "Could this have been done better on the Genesis?" As for Monster World IV I'm not surprised you don't remember it, it wasn't released outside of Japan, though there is a fan translation of it.
@SegaFanatic5188 I know MWIV is an import, and I played it for a while before, but the music didn't stick with me. I'll hit up Project 2612 and see if I can jog my memory a bit.
As for asking whether or not something could have been done better on the Genesis, I'm not sure what to say. It's kind of a weird question to ask (you know, except with multiplatform releases to compare). Do you prefer the Genesis sound? I mean, outside of debating the merits of each, maybe you also prefer it.
@megavolt67 When it's used well I prefer the sound of the Genesis. I kind of have a soft spot for FM Synthesis, which is probably why I like so many Arcade soundtracks from the 80's and 90's. It just seems to have a bit more energy to it in my mind.
Though I also love some soundtracks on the SNES like Super Metroid, Link to the Past, Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy 6 to name a few. What I hate on the SNES is the generic sort of muffled warbly sound a lot of games tend to use, like Final Fight 1.
@SegaFanatic5188 My problem is that I played Final Fight CD before Final Fight on SNES. Going from an improvement on the arcade music to a downgrade, lol.
As long as we're confessing, I might have a soft spot for the SNES's now unnecessary DSP effects. The SPC700 is like a cool little music box and the SNES sound is instantly recognizable to me.
You know the SNES TMNT Tournament Fighters is awesome rock/techno on any console. Muffling be damned, I say! I love that Pirate Ship track. :)
@megavolt67 I notice this with a lot of SNES fans in general. I've seen some radical fanboys go as far as to say this specific sound is the best sound ever as far as quality goes.
It does have a bit of a nostalgia factor and some times I like it like in Megaman X3 and certain sound effects. But other times it just annoys me. For example the music and sound effects in Super Mario Allstars annoy me to death. I actually prefer the NES versions over them.
@SegaFanatic5188 Ha ha, I feel you on that particular example. I like the NES music better for the original Mario games as well. The water world music for all-stars SMB3 is just wrong. The music generally has a sort of fluffy genericness. It doesn't have the bite of the originals.
As for the radical folks, some people really do love their preferred chiptune sounds that much, I guess. I know I've seen people say that the C64's SID chip has the best sound ever.
@megavolt67 I don't even think the SNES does techno better than the Genesis can do orchestral. Just as you say Genesis' attempts at orchestral sound tinny and like nails on chalkboards I say SNES attempts at techno sound muffled and warbly.
Now, if the SNES didn't have the limitations that it has then I would agree with you, it is better overall. However the memory constraints of the system really limit it, so as a result everything sounds muffled and muddy thus evening things out.
@SegaFanatic5188 Finally, when we're talking about the mediocre soundtracks, negative generalizations do hold true. But when judging which console had the best music, I'm looking at the most memorable soundtracks, and I do find more stylistic variety on the SNES. You yourself named three largely rock/techno scores as among the best of the Genesis. Can you at least acknowledge that the Genesis library emphasis on action games and the FM synth does skew it towards techno and rock?
@SegaFanatic5188 I own and have played many Genesis games and I have a hard time thinking of good orchestral or non-rock/techno kind of scores. Shining Force is alright, but it is appropriately overshadowed by the superior electronica stuff of the Sonic series and others. Even the more classical tracks (which frankly, are mediocre) in PSIV are overshadowed by the techno stuff. I've named soundtracks on the SNES that veer away from classical orchestral to other stuff.
@SegaFanatic5188 So if you're going to flip my arguments back at me and propose that the opposite holds true to the same extent for everything I've been saying, then I need examples. They don't have to be examples of "superb" orchestral, jazz, whatever. Just good ones. Like how Contra III is a good rock/techno score on the SNES. Or TMNT Tournament Fighters. Three tracks from Sonic 2 isn't enough. More stuff like Toejam & Earl (the first VGM I recorded on tape) would be better.
@megavolt67 Not everything in the Sonic games are electronica. There are a lot of examples of orchestral stuff, big band stuff, as well as more tropical styled songs that I wouldn't categorize as electronica. Some I can think of right of the top of my head:
Aquatic Ruin Zone
Casino Night Zone
Sky Chase Zone
Wing Fortress Zone
Hidden Palace Zone
Sonic 2 Ending
Angel Island Zone
Sky Sanctuary Zone
Those are all non techno tracks that are some of the best tacks in the games.
@SegaFanatic5188 Think of SNES TiT as an interpretation rather than a reproduction and perhaps you won't get that "stuttering feeling" you do when you make a comparison. Is it safe to say that you feel the same about SNES Street Fighter II? I've heard Genny fans praise Champion Edition because it sounds more like the arcade but truly, I prefer the SNES sound. In fact, where people praise SNES Super SF for *yawn* sounding more like the arcade, I preferred the original SFII & Turbo SNES music.
@megavolt67 I do prefer the Genesis version for some tracks like Guiles do to it being a bit higher pitched and having more punch to it. However again the System could do better as homebrew developers have shown. But overall I prefer the CPS1 renditions the most, and some of the CPS2 renditions. Though I do like some of the PC-Engine renditions. But in General I don't really like the 16-bit ports of the Street Fighter games.
@SegaFanatic5188 Hidden Palace is going in the right direction. Slow and majestic is rarely handled so well on the Genny. Still, you're selecting tracks here, and the great majority of Genesis music that gets remembered is of the rock/techno variety. That's why I brought up Toejam & Earl to try and help you. That one is unique for its funk/rap approach. It's just tough for you perhaps because the Genesis is indeed known for its action games, all of which feature pulse-pounding soundtracks.
@megavolt67 Well a lot of Genesis soundtracks tend to use a mix of different Genres.
Toejam and Earl is a decent example of a funk/rap soundtrack but I figured you might consider that too techno style.
Revenge of the Shinobi has some interesting tracks in it that I wouldn't really consider rock or techno like China Town. Monster World IV is a pretty good example of a non-techno and rock styled soundtrack. I'd say it sounds rather SNESish in it's compositions.
@SegaFanatic5188 Unfortunately, I can't remember a single track from Monster World IV. Coming from you though, the SNESish comment doesn't inspire confidence, lol.
Ecco is a good soundtrack that is more ambient-like than what one usually gets on the Genesis. The second is good too, but it definitely has more rock'n to it. Other than that, hmm, it's really the rock and techno music that sticks out most for me. Capable or not, the music just isn't there. Not enough RPGs, maybe?
@megavolt67 The only stuff that sounds tinny and like nails on a chalkboard on the Genesis are the bad ports. The games made for the system sound fine for the most part with a few exceptions here and there. And Gun Hazard is ok, but nothing really memorable to me, nothing coming close in terms of what we have in Genesis games like Streets of Rage, Thunder Force, Ranger X, etc. If anything I'd say most Genesis music is better composed.
@megavolt67 Sonic is not all rock and techno. Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone all have a more orchestral and big band sound to them. Casino Night Zone also has more of a Jazz band sound to it. FM Synthesis can rather accurately reproduce the sounds of a lot of real instruments such as guitars, brass, even some wood winds as well as a decent amount of percussion. Where it runs into trouble is when Strings come into play.
@SegaFanatic5188 Not all, but largely. If it's not fast-paced and upbeat, it's forgettable. That tends to be the rule with Genesis music.
I've heard the arcade version of TiT before and I think the SNES version actually improved on it. Listening to your comparisons just reinforces that belief. It just has more punch in the right places. Genesis sounds tinny, though ironically, so does the arcade original of this particular track. So I agree with you about the accuracy bit at least.
@megavolt67 The reason the Arcade and Genesis versions sound similar is because they both are pure FM synthesis. The only difference is the Arcade uses a YM2151 which has 8 channels where as the YM2612 in the Genesis only has 6. And I feel that the Arcade version has the most punch really. The SNES version just seems to stutter along really. If you listen carefully you can even hear instruments missing in the SNES version that are present in both the Arcade and Genesis versions.
@SegaFanatic5188 I think I hear what you're trying to say with the missing instruments, but again, I'm not big on simply going with the one that best mirrors the arcade. For example, I actually prefer the Genesis music for Sagaia (Darius II) to the original arcade version. What my ears hear is that the SNES TiT puts a greater emphasis on the melodic hooks. It's similar to the reason that I prefer SoR2 music to SoR1 music. I prefer a clearer progression to a busy soundscape that blurs/blunts.
@megavolt67 See with the SNES version to me it sounds like it's stuttering a long, which makes it feel broken to me. I prefer the smoother notes of the Genesis and Arcade versions. A interesting comparison to look at would be Thunder Force III to Thunder Spirits. Those games share a lot of the same music and you can hear how music made to work with the Genesis transitions to the SNES.
@SegaFanatic5188 I don't hear any stutter at all. If you listen to Zombies Ate My Neighbors, Rock 'n Roll Racing, Spiderman & X-Men: Arcade's Revenge, and Bubsy, you can hear how music made to work with the SNES transitions to the Genesis.
But if you want a good Genesis to SNES transition, try Cool Spot, which sounds great on the SNES as well.
@megavolt67 I hear the stutter in between ever note. Where as on the FM Synthesis based systems (Arcade and Genesis) There is no stutter between each note, the songs flow more smoothly. Just because you are 5 years older than me doesn't mean I haven't heard my fair share of both systems and their soundtracks. I grew up with these systems as well. SNES may do great orchestral stuff, but when it goes into other kinds of music it starts to get muffled and weird sounding.
@megavolt67 Have you heard the Arcade version? The Genesis version sounds almost spot on except for maybe 1 or 2 missing channels. The SNES version sounds rather off and a bit broken up. The Arcade and Genesis versions have smoother transitions between notes where as on the SNES it's a bit broken and jumpy.
@megavolt67 Funny you mention the Megaman X soundtracks. You should have a listen to this:
watch?v=OUwg-n1GgOo
Not only does it sound good, I think it sounds even better than the SNES original. And again, the Genesis can do more than Techno and Rock as well. Those are just two genre's it does exceptionally well. There are good examples of it doing other genres. For example this track for Castlevania is a good example of a more orchestral styled track done well:
Once again, the Genesis version plays faster and has better sound.
OtomoTenzi 6 months ago
@OtomoTenzi Then we are looking at two VERY different Genesis versions. The Genesis version is simply LOUDER, not better. SNES version has way better quality. And they move at pretty much the same speed. Also the 6 button controller was better for Street Fighter, not for Mortal Kombat.
Tkscz 5 months ago
STOP ARGUING AND JUST GET MORTAL KOMBAT 9!!
kindofscary 8 months ago
@kindofscary Mortal Kombat 9 sucks
TheSuperman401 6 months ago
@TheSuperman401 Are you Retarded
kindofscary 6 months ago
@kindofscary UR A MORON
TheSuperman401 6 months ago
@TheSuperman401 UR A SDGSDGOMSBOMNOSNOPKIRHSPNBF
kindofscary 6 months ago
@kindofscary UR A WIERDO
TheSuperman401 6 months ago
Genesis Wins
TheSuperman401 8 months ago 6
@TheSuperman401
YEARGH!!!
OtomoTenzi 5 months ago
@TheSuperman401 bien dicho
capcom1135 2 months ago
The Sega 6 button controller was better for fighting games than The snes controller.
Snes had better colors and sound.
Genesis had the better controller and was a faster machine than the snes.
NicholasSanderfer 9 months ago 2
Since I'm wearing headphones, I can tell how the SNES port utilizes the stereo as a fighter falls on one side of the screen. Despite the muffled, but superior sound, I prefer the SNES port. It's like people were beginning to grow lazy with most Genesis/Mega Drive ports after the Super Nintendo's relatively bad start was coming to an end. What happened??
SuperMario811 10 months ago 3
I wish this guy would have put the arcade in there as well to really show which is a closer port. Being a huge MK fan the SNES is the clear winner cleaner sound and graphics, the gen version has been struck with laryngitis again.
sandroace 11 months ago
@sandroace Yeah, it's like after the first MK on SNES, which was a huge, censored JOKE (all thanks to Nintendo of America), it seems like SNES got gradual revenge on the Genesis/Mega Drive--starting with Mortal Kombat II. Despite the first but ridiculous MK port on SNES, the SNES--in my opinion--had the better soundtrack in all three ports, even though I LOVE MK2's soundtrack on the Genesis/Mega Drive.
SuperMario811 10 months ago
@SuperMario811 Agreed. Visually and Audibly the SNES was far superior in all ports particularly 1 and 2. The only down fall in part 1 was the obvious lack of blood and sluggish gameplay, but still looked and sounded miles better than it's Genesis counterpart.
sandroace 10 months ago 3
I used to love the SNES version. until i got my PS1 as a birthday gift back in 1996. I loved the PS1 version by far, it's very colse to the Arcade.
ImprovedMano 11 months ago
I grew up with both SNES and Genesis systems...I'd have to say that the SNES version sounds (and looks) a little cleaner/superior. The Genesis sounds a bit 'scratchy.' In the case of MK3, SNES is what Genesisn't
AngryGumball 11 months ago
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AngryGumball 11 months ago
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super nintendo is great but it doesn't follow the standart trend music wise snes has a generic fluffy muffled sound that only can sound good with itrested and good comnposers behind it,genesis is just chiptune and beyond like the c64 it's shit oh i meant sid chip or the awesome nes music etc.
aryinc 11 months ago
super nintendo is great but it doesn't follow the standart trend music wise snes has a generic fluffy muffled sound that only can sound good with itrested and good comnposers behind it,genesis is just chiptune and beyond like the c64 uit's shit chip or the awesome nes music etc.
aryinc 11 months ago
Wow, didn't know the Genesis version was that good.
itchyisvegeta 11 months ago
@ TheDukeljk
Yeah.. Because I prefer the SNES version I'm a fag... That makes sense[/irony]
And not a SEGA fan for the same reason?
Get your head straight!
I love many SEGA games. As an example, I prefer Ninja Gaiden on the Master System because the music, graphics and story is superior(MY opinion).
Stigtrix 11 months ago
the snes one has really ugly music,genesis version has grittyness written all over it,genesis version is darker deeper better.
aryinc 11 months ago
megadrive/genesis system talking to the supernintendo system: YOUR SOUL IS MINE!!
SEGAmegadriveable 11 months ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Oh yeah, the instrument set thing. I'd say that varies from game to game, particularly on the SNES, what with the use of samples and all. It's sort of an extra factor that isn't an issue for the FM synth-only Genesis (except for what to do with the one channel that it does have for samples, which is usually used for drums).
megavolt67 1 year ago
Snes version is better with only one Point the Gamepad..
Mosquit 1 year ago
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This was a much better port than the crap Probe pulled with MK1 and MK2 for the Genesis. They dropped turds on the Genesis, SCD, 32X and Saturn.
Da1shocker 1 year ago
genesis version is better.i'm not beeing a fanboy but the music in the snes version is so wrong and so off,like the only thing i hear in the snes version is bass.
DeadlyAllianceBand 1 year ago
genesis music sounds decent, but the voice samples and sound effects are terrible compared to the snes version, so scratchy and garbled
DJackson747 1 year ago
@DJackson747
Oh really ? Check 0:49-0:53 , If you don't know what he's saying you'll never understand it.Still think that SNES version has better and clear voice ?Apart of that , they look the same.
BulgarianPsychopath 1 year ago
Yeah I think genesis wins this one but the snes version of mortal kombat 2 is far supperior to the genesis one.
tgamerlegend 1 year ago
Megadrive finish him to Snes.... fatality :) i have snes and genesis versions... genesis have more graphic details, better sound (incredible right?? but is true)...
frajaos 1 year ago
@frajaos and the voices in the megadrive are clear than the super nintendo
Herman0709 1 year ago
Megadrive finish him to Snes.... fatality :)
frajaos 1 year ago
ive played both versions and genesis graphics and sound are SOOO worse
griloleatherface 1 year ago
MegaDrive wins. Flawless victory.
ResurrectedTemplar 1 year ago 8
Genesis wins, GO BLAST PROCESSING!
TheGenesisfan93 1 year ago 3
genesis = 320x224 aspect ratio 3.2 snes = 256 x224 aspect ratio 5.4
horsedickd0tmpeg 1 year ago
I just played both versions, and has better graphics, music, smoother gameplay, and more bonus content on SNES. SNES wins
DarkRetroFan64 1 year ago
@DarkRetroFan64 my bad they actually have the same amount of content.
DarkRetroFan64 1 year ago
I'm surprised, the Genesis and SNES versions actually look pretty similar here. As usual, the Genesis has better sound, but the SNES has slightly more details.
MJacksonLive 1 year ago
Genesis version sorry as usual...in terms of EVERYTHING.
kaox44 1 year ago
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bigalejoshileno 1 year ago
Megadrive has better music as usual. But I can't really say on the gameplay. I have never played it on either.
jacksprat1990 2 years ago
Like the sound on the SNES much better.
Yarkie 2 years ago
this mk is better on mega drive. mk2 was poor on md,
spartastar 2 years ago
The SNES version has really ugly sound here compared to the SEGA.
wrestletube1 2 years ago
you deaf?
nooblet911 1 year ago
@nooblet911 No, on this particular game the Yamaha does sound better than the SPC Chip.
Some games sound better on SPC and some sound better on Yamaha, this is one of them in my opinion. The SPC versions of these tunes sound too mono toned and the guitars are nowhere near the same standard.
wrestletube1 1 year ago
no it doesn't. you deaf.
nooblet911 1 year ago
@nooblet911
The sound in the Snes version is muffled beyond beleif
Alevamltd 1 year ago 4
it sounds SCRATCHY in the genesis version
nooblet911 1 year ago
@nooblet911
no it's not
Alevamltd 1 year ago
yes it is. its a scratchy, low quality sound on the genesis.
nooblet911 1 year ago
@nooblet911
The genesis has TEN sound channels
Snes has only EIGHT
Alevamltd 1 year ago
so what. most genesis games still sound like @ss
nooblet911 1 year ago
@nooblet911
Respect the genesis man
Alevamltd 1 year ago 9
I don't "respect" any console. it's not a living thing after all.
nooblet911 1 year ago
@Alevamltd I love how you make that sound like an advantage. And yet, each of the SNES's channels is capable of 16-bit sampled sounds. Of the Genny's ten, only six are actually FM channels and only one of those six could be used for sampled sounds. The only argument Genny fans have in the musical tech department is that the SNES sound is more compressed ("muffled", as they like to say). Virtually every other sound advantage goes to the SNES. It's just technically superior in that area.
megavolt67 1 year ago
....of course, composition trumps all, and the Genesis has some great music, but the SNES sound was more versatile. That much is not an opinion, but a fact. It is why different SNES soundtracks are more successful with different styles (orchestral, jazz, ambient, whatever) whereas Genesis music tends to work better when an electronic and/or rock'n style is used (to take advantage of the FM sound).
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67
I still like the genesis better
Alevamltd 1 year ago
@Alevamltd Ha ha, that's okay. Some people might prefer the NES sound, the C64, or other distinctive chiptune sounds. I just felt like it wasn't fair to state that "more channels = superior sound" in this case. I mean, most Genesis soundtracks don't even use all ten channels, as the four channels associated with the TI PSG chip were present largely because the Master System had them.
In any case, I love me some Genesis soundtracks as well. SoR2's is GODLY good.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Same here. Add in the soundtracks for Revenge of Shinobi, Shinobi III, Golden Axe 2...
spideymayne 1 year ago
@megavolt67 There are engines for the Genesis that give an additional PCM channel. SNES has it's perks, it's great at Orchestral stuff, ambient stuff and things like that, but Genesis kicks it's but when it comes to rock and techno style stuff.
And if ROM size permitted, they could have just streamed a prerecorded track through that one PCM channel. Take a look at this if you don't believe me: watch?v=oKsUAywSyEg
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I've heard that argument before, and I still don't agree. Sega fans use it to suggest that the difference between the two is purely matter of preference. Fact is, SNES has some very good rock and techno stuff lke Megaman X and Super Aleste. Basically, while the Genesis is pretty bad at just about anything BUT rock and techno, the SNES can do almost anything very well. It just tends to get recognized more for the orchestral-style scores that accompany its RPG lineup.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Also, if you want me to recommend more rock'n and/or techno-ish type scores for the SNES, just ask. It's not incapable of putting out really good stuff in that department by any stretch of the imagination. Unfortunately, most Sega diehards haven't heard much SNES music beyond the Nintendo and Square stuff (not that that stuff isn't great, but it does tend to leave out the more rock'n stuff, except for FF Mystic Quest [which is another good rock'n SNES soundtrack, btw]).
megavolt67 1 year ago
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SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
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@megavolt67 Just how most SNES diehards haven't heard much Genesis music outside of Sonic and the bad ports like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat.
There are plenty of great soundtracks on the Genesis. Some of which are easily overlooked. For example Sonic 2 alone has at least 3 good examples of Orchestral and big band sounding tracks with Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone.
Both systems have good and capable audio chips. They are just two different approaches to sound.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
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@megavolt67 Just how most SNES diehards haven't heard much Genesis music outside of Sonic and the bad ports like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat.
There are plenty of great soundtracks on the Genesis. Some of which are easily overlooked. For example Sonic 2 alone has at least 3 good examples of Orchestral and big band sounding tracks with Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone.
Both systems have good and capable audio chips. They are just two different approaches to sound.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Just how most SNES diehards haven't heard much Genesis music outside of Sonic and the bad ports like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat.
There are plenty of great soundtracks on the Genesis. Some of which are easily overlooked. Sonic 2 alone has at least 3 good examples of Orchestral and big band sounding tracks with Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone.
Both systems have good and capable audio chips. They are just two different approaches to sound.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 You should watch my top ten Genesis tracks video, lol. Sinking Old Sanctuary is one of my all time favorites. And yet, that's more a compositional achievement than something which benefitted from the Genesis synth's thrashy and metallic sound. Anyway, it's a fact that the SNES sound hardware is more advanced, despite your stubborness. And if you want some comparisons where the SNES actually outrocks the Genesis, try Rock 'n Roll Racing and Spiderman/X-Men Arcade's Revenge.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I never understand this. Do NES fans also maintain that its sound is "different but equal"? I hope not. A great soundtrack is a great soundtrack regardless of the sound limitations (SoR2 is in my all-time top five, for example), and I would certainly take the soundtrack of Megaman 2 over many that were introduced on more advanced sound hardware, but facts are facts, people. No one is denying the distinctive sound of chiptunes on different consoles, but that's something different.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 It depends what you are comparing it to really. With the SNES and Genesis, SNES has a more advanced chip but it's limited severely by memory and other constraints. This causes us to end up with sounds that are muffled, warbly and just plain awful sounding at times. Since Genesis doesn't have to rely on samples it's not nearly as limited in this. Since it's synthesized in real time we get clean and crisp sounds. However it's limited by the limitations of FM Synthesis.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 That's just it. The FM limitation means more to the actual music and what kind of styles will (techno) or won't (orchestral) work so well. That's more of a limit to the art than sound quality. Samples can sound like anything, whereas FM synth will always sound thrashy and chunky. From Turtles in Time to Chrono Trigger, the SNES did different styles better. I like some Genesis soundtracks a great deal, but it's obvious to most that the SNES had the bigger instrument set.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Hyperstone Heist sounds much closer to the Arcade than the SNES port of Turtles in Time. And the Arcade sounds the best out of all of them. And you aren't getting the whole point of memory limitations. Not only does it limit the quality of samples but it also limits the number of different samples and instruments you can have at one time.
There are interviews with composers of the era who praise the Genesis because it allowed for more freedom than the SNES. Explain that one.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I have both games and the SNES version sounds considerably better to me. Its got more oomph.
The memory limitations are why the samples are compressed, but again, that's a clarity issue. Ultimately, it didn't stop composers from crafting superior soundtracks like Front Mission, Live-A-Live, Castlevania IV, Plok!, Tactics Ogre, TMNT Tournament Fighters, Mystic Ark, Star Fox, etc. There's a great artistry and variety that the Genesis cannot match. It's just the truth.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I'm not sure where else you want to go with this. I've heard a great deal on both consoles and I'm 100% sure that the musical legacy of the SNES is greater than that of the Genesis. When you think of the best Genesis soundtracks, there's just no escaping that the rock and techno ones are the most memorable (Thunderforce, Sonic series, etc). Even with its RPGs, it's Phantasy Star IV that most folks point to, and its for the many rock/techno highlights. It is what it is.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Oh, and I wouldn't mind seeing or reading some of those interviews you're talking about, if you've got links. We may disagree on the specific comparison here, but I do feel that the limitations of the chiptune days forced composers to be more creative sometimes. I recall Yuzo Koshiro (who I feel is the guy that got the best out of the Genesis) saying something about how he preferred the chiptune days because he felt that the music back then fit the games better.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 The one interview that comes to mind is actually one with Yuzo Koshiro. He specifically mentions how the memory limitations of the SNES limited the number different samples and instruments they could have at one time and that they had to design an engine that streamed the samples off the cart in real time as they were needed. He then goes onto say that while there were limitations for the Genesis they weren't nearly as restricting. I can send you a link to it if you'd like.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Sure, go ahead. I can see why Koshiro might have a soft spot for the Genesis. Revenge of Shinobi and SoR really put him on the map, and as I think I mentioned before, I hold the SoR2 soundtrack in the highest regard. The FM synth meshed with the house/techno style perfectly in that one.
Anyway, if what you say about is true, then it is an irony of a sort that many VGM fans consider Actraiser to be his best effort. Critics tend to have different opinions than creators.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 He states in the Interview that SoR2 and Actraiser are his best works. But he states that the SNES was much more limiting to work with because of memory constraints. They had to stream samples in off the cart to get around it as the way the system was set up by default they couldn't have all the instruments they wanted at once. You only have 64KB of memory on the SNES for audio, and since it relies on samples that fills up very quickly.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Thanks for the link. He says that the Genesis has similar memory restrictions (he's asked about it directly), but that the sound chip is simpler to work with, which isn't exactly the same as "allowing more freedom". Just that it's a less complicated matter. Clearly, other SNES composers were also able to work around the memory issue, as indicated by the many great-sounding soundtracks to come. I've already mentioned many, and if you haven't heard them, do check them out.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Genesis did have those limitations as well, but since you weren't relying on samples you don't run into them as quickly. Since on the Genesis you generate your own sounds in real time the memory limitations don't get it your way as much,
There are some great soundtracks on the SNES, but there are also some bland and generic sounding ones that tend to use the same instruments, which to me sound almost like Kazoos since they are so compressed.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 The end result makes the limitations irrelevant, at least when compared to the Genesis. In the end, soundtracks like Gun Hazard simply blow away the great majority of music on the Genesis in terms of sound and composition. We're going in circles here and you haven't refuted the most important fact, which is that the more varied music was produced on SNES.
And yes, some SNES music sounds generic, just like some Genesis music sounds tinny or like nails on a chalkboard.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I grew up with both the SNES and Genesis. I've also got five years on you, and as far as I can tell, it's pretty obvious that I've heard more SNES music and maybe even more Genesis music. Stop harping on the same points and realize that the SNES produced more grand soundtracks that continue to be remembered more often to this day. Part of it is the inexperience that many folks have with the Genesis, but part of it also the greater versatility of a sample-based soundchip, the
megavolt67 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 (cont.) near exclusivity (on SNES) of incredibly talented developers known for their great music (because of the composers they had), like Capcom, Konami, Rare, and Square. And part of it is the emphasis of the Genesis on sports and action games. If you know RPGs, you know that the soundtracks tend to be more diverse stylistically and contextually because the stories and gameplay cover a greater range of content. There's just many reasons why SNES won/wins out musically.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 So, can we end this now? If you prefer the Genesis sound, that's fine, but the whole level playing field thing you stubbornly keep shooting for? It's a pipe dream. Whatever advantages the Genesis had in sound were ultimately outweighed by the advantages the SNES had, and they should be. The SNES was released two years after the Genesis and it was only a matter of time until scores like DKC made people look at the Genesis and hear something dated. Everything's been said.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 That's just it though, the advantages weren't outweighed. In most cases it evened out in not only sound but other areas like graphics as well. This is why the SNES didn't completely dominate in the US and Europe. Gamers saw it didn't actually beat the Genesis in every aspect and this is why the Genesis not only sold equally with the SNES, but it actually outsold it for a few years.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I was just talking about the music, and now you're bringing up the console war itself, which is a different discussion. If we're talking games, then of course I wouldn't claim that the SNES beats Genesis in every aspect. I'm not even saying that about the music. Just that the SNES bests it musically OVERALL. Also, I still own my original consoles along with 75 or so Genesis games and 100+ SNES games. I even have the early model Genesis with the best sound. Agenda much?
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 It's not really an agenda, you just wouldn't believe the number of SNES fanboys that go on and on about how much the Genesis sucks yet their only experiences with either system are emulators that poorly reproduce Genesis audio and ones that remove the heavy filtering that SNES hardware does that results in sounds sounding muffled. I'm actually relieved that you still have both systems and know what they are supposed to sound like.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Like many Sega diehards, you've got a chip on your shoulder when it comes to SNES versus Genesis debates. It makes your arguments very one-sided because you take the pro-SNES argument for granted. But generalizing the majority of SNES music as muffled isn't valid reasoning for leveling the field. People just don't say, Final Fantasy VI has a great soundtrack, but it's muffled, so Phantasy Star IV is on par. It's just not something that hurts the music like you claim it does.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 It's not the majority of all SNES music that's muffled, all of it is muffled because the system does that on it's own automatically.
Now, I like the SNES and the Genesis equally, and I view them as equals. However I take the Genesis side because in most Debates the Genesis is usually the underdog getting bashed by SNES fans.
Did I ever say SNES and Phantasy Star are equal in Sound tracks? No I didn't. I said the systems are even.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@megavolt67 SNES may have games that cover a wider range of genres but that doesn't mean it's best at everything. There are certain genres it excels at and others it does very poorly. The same can be said of the Genesis. This is why they even out in the end.
Oh, and one thing I suggest to you is to go back to your consoles before stating some things, because Emulators are not entirely accurate. For one a lot of Genesis emulators screw up sounds, and many SNES emulators improve the sound.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@megavolt67 How about you stop putting the SNES on a pedestal it doesn't deserve? The System has an advanced sound chip but it's severely limited by memory and other bottlenecks. Outside of Megaman and Super Street Fighter 2 most of Capcom's stuff on the SNES is plain bad. It's typical warbly muffled and over compressed samples that sound nothing like their original instruments. A lot of stuff on the SNES has this same issue.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Techno, techno, techno. Rock, rock, rock. We know Koshiro is good. We know Technosoft is good. We know Genesis is good at thrash/electronica. You're not giving me anything we haven't turned inside-out already, and if you're still pushing the unsupported generalization about the SNES only being good at orchestral, then you haven't been paying attention to the examples of good non-orchestral stuff I've already mentioned. Should I mention ten or twenty more? Ugh.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I've listened to the examples you've given to me, I'm not really impressed. In fact I can't help but imagine how it could probably be better if it was on the Genesis. SNES does great at creating realistic sounding instruments because it uses samples. It however falls short at doing techno and offworldly sounds. And in many cases brass and other instruments I think are done better on the Genesis. They sound cleaner and not as much like bad Midi like they do on the SNES.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Demon's Crest? Final Fight 3? Breath of Fire 1/2? Those aren't bad soundtracks by any stretch of the imagination. Again, you generalize and assert without solid reasoning and without good examples. I've given you the benefit of the doubt up to this point, but I'm just about done with you, "SegaFanatic". You're doing too good a job of representing your username.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I've heard Final Fight 3's music, again nothing to write home about. Streets of Rage has it beat. It most the instruments are muffled and sound almost like kazoos.
You say I've ignored examples when I've mentioned perfect examples of the Genesis doing orchestral and big band stuff in some of it's most popular games and you still claim it can only do techno.
SNES can do other genres, but it has some it excels at. Just as the Genesis can do other genres but has some it excels at.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 You mentioned a couple of single TRACKS. And while a good melody can make it work out okay, it's not ideal. Ideal is SoR2, which has a style that matches the sound perfectly. But generalizing is safer for you since it obscures the truth. It's not even. The SNES is more competent at rock/techno that the Genesis is at orchestral. In fact, Super Aleste might be my favorite shmup score (it or Gate of Thunder), and it has a great otherworldly, techno-ish sound.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Also, if you're unimpressed by soundtracks like Mystic Ark and Live-A-Live, then I don't know what to say. Poor taste? Lack of a musical ear? Fortunately, the majority of VGM enthusiasts would disagree with you. Consider it a courtesy that I'm still addressing someone who asserts the exact opposite and hasn't provided nearly enough reasoning for it. It's just that some of you Sega guys are so sure that everyone else got it wrong. The delusional arrogance draws me.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Allow me to clarify, I am not really impressed with them as examples of rock and techno on the SNES. From what I've heard of ones like Mystic Ark the sound more along the lines of what we have in Final Fantasy, mixes of Orchestral and rock which would favor the SNES more mainly because of the orchestral portions.
And many of them are great compositions, but the instrument set does not do them justice. Starfox I think is a good example of this.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 And once again, are you going to tell me that Rock 'n Roll Racing doesn't sound good on the SNES? That it "stutters" somehow? That it's muffled? Everyone I've seen comment on it thinks that it sounds really good, and when you hear the Genesis version (which came out a year later), you can really tell that the composers attempted to reproduce the samples without much success. Or Bubsy, which is a variety of styles. That one sounds TERRIBLE on the Genesis.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Turtles in Time does stutter and here's why. It's using Samples from an FM Synthesizer as instruments and as a result each note sticks out and doesn't smoothly transition. This is the SNES trying to fake FM Synthesis and it doesn't do it as well as the real thing for obvious reasons. It does an admirable effort though. Listen to the areas where a lot of notes are played very rapidly. On the Genesis and Arcade it's done smoothly, on SNES it stutters in between each note.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 But Hyperstone Heist sounds like utter garbage in comparison to Turtles in Time...
How on earth can people say that it sounds better when the instruments are lacking and the turtle voices are extremely muffled?
I like both consoles, and have to admit that I think it's funny that only SEGA fans so far have said that Hyperstone Heist is better regarding sound and music.
Just download emulators and compare. More like "Turtles in Grime: Hyperstone Shite!" Baaaad sound!
Stigtrix 1 year ago
@Stigtrix First of all a lot of Genesis emulators are bad and inaccurate to the real hardware. The same can be said for SNES emulators. The most accurate ones, which still are not perfect, are Kega Fusion and bSNES.
Secondly compare SNES TiT to the Arcade version. You'll find it sounds nothing like it. Compare HH to the Arcade and you will find it sounds very similar. This is why the Genesis is considered better here.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 you're right in that the SNES version of Turtles in Time sounds nothing like the arcade version in terms of arrangements of the music, if anything for me it sounds way better. Listening to Neon Night Riders for both versions? No contest, SNES version kills it.
IcedEarthaholic 11 months ago
@IcedEarthaholic Listen to Sewer Surfin for all 3 versions. The Arcade kills both, but the Genesis version still sounds closer and better than the SNES version. Same for Alleycat blues, the boss battle music, and almost every other track. The Arcade is just the best sounding version.
SegaFanatic5188 11 months ago
@SegaFanatic5188 for you anyway, checked out both the arcade and Genesis versions, and while they are very cool, I will not deny that at all, for me the SNES version had most of the best arrangements. Prehistoric Turtlesaurus, Neon Night Riders, Bury My Shell At Wounded Knee, etc. all sounded fantastic on the SNES. Especially love the galloping drum intro w/Bury My Shell.
IcedEarthaholic 11 months ago
@IcedEarthaholic I find the Arcade to be the best for all the tracks really. It has the most instruments, sounds the cleanest, and has the best sounds overall. Genesis is a close 2nd, but SNES basically sounds like someone put a pillow over the speaker.
SegaFanatic5188 11 months ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I stand by what I say myself, yes the arcade version had a clean sound to it absolutely, but I just did not like alot of the arrangements on it. The Genesis version had some nice arrangements, but I feel honestly if you applied what you said about the SNES with the pillow over the speaker, you'd get my opinion overall with the whole thing. Though in cases the Genesis version has the better soundtrack (Mortal Kombat being a prime example), for the Turtles? SNES for the win.
IcedEarthaholic 11 months ago
@Stigtrix
turtles hh isn't bad but not as good as the other.but i've played this on snes and genesis mk3 that is,genesis one is better,faster and better music.
aryinc 11 months ago
@Stigtrix Your a stupid dumb fag.... and not a sega fan.
TheDukeljk 11 months ago
@megavolt67 As for Bubsy and Rock 'n Roll Racing, those are perfect examples of poorly handled Genesis soundtracks. I'd put them up there with Doom 32X. They could have been handled better as other games on the system have shown. They are perfect examples of poor instrument choice.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 So basically, poor SNES to Genesis translations are the result of bad choices and/or lackadaisical effort from composers/programmers, whereas poor Genesis to SNES translations are the result of limitations in the sound hardware. It's like the glass is always half-full with Genesis whereas it's always half-empty with the SNES. And the best part is, you can still technically call it even despite the one-sidedness of it all. Brilliant!
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I didn't say in all cases, I said in the cases of the games you mentioned. A few of the instruments in Rock n' Roll Racing stick out as just flat out awful choices that you hear in a lot of bad Genesis sound tracks.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I didn't say in all cases, I said in the cases of the games you mentioned. A few of the instruments in Rock n' Roll Racing stick out as just flat out awful choices that you hear in a lot of bad Genesis sound tracks.
Muffled sound and things like that are hardware limitations. Just as Genesis not doing Strings and other orchestral instruments well is a hardware limitation. Poor hardware use and poor instrument choice is the developers problem though.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Muffled sound doesn't affect composition, and it never stopped folks from appreciating the aural beauty of tracks like Aquatic Ambience, so why does it factor so heavily for you? Are you some kind of audiophile? But then, how could you be? These are 16-bit, cartridge-based consoles we're talking about it. I could understand someone reared today's consoles both SNES and Genesis audio, but this muffling focus seems specifically born out of SNES versus Genesis debates.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 For certain songs it doesn't bother me, but for others it does. For example the Final Fight games. The muffled audio really ruins those soundtracks for me. It basically makes the instruments all sound like kazoos or something awkward like that and after listening to it for a while it almost gives me a headache. It's when you get to your low pitched stuff that it really starts to get on my nerves.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Well, I can't argue with some do and some don't, but as for the specific example, I really do like the music in Final Fight 3. It's no SoR2 (what is?), but I was surprised at how good it was. The first Final Fight on SNES sounds like crap (it's a crappy port, really). The second one I haven't put much time into, but yeah, I wouldn't generalize the whole series in such a way, because the third is really on a different level overall as one of the best beat'em ups of the era.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 From what I've heard of Final Fight 3, it's definitely a step up from the first 2, but I still find myself wondering "Could this have been done better on the Genesis?" As for Monster World IV I'm not surprised you don't remember it, it wasn't released outside of Japan, though there is a fan translation of it.
Here are some tracks from it though:
watch?v=TPaEc7JXmok
watch?v=5KyGyvx_B6w
watch?v=Ir6K2XBMo_k
watch?v=iV6aTH583Vc
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I know MWIV is an import, and I played it for a while before, but the music didn't stick with me. I'll hit up Project 2612 and see if I can jog my memory a bit.
As for asking whether or not something could have been done better on the Genesis, I'm not sure what to say. It's kind of a weird question to ask (you know, except with multiplatform releases to compare). Do you prefer the Genesis sound? I mean, outside of debating the merits of each, maybe you also prefer it.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 When it's used well I prefer the sound of the Genesis. I kind of have a soft spot for FM Synthesis, which is probably why I like so many Arcade soundtracks from the 80's and 90's. It just seems to have a bit more energy to it in my mind.
Though I also love some soundtracks on the SNES like Super Metroid, Link to the Past, Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy 6 to name a few. What I hate on the SNES is the generic sort of muffled warbly sound a lot of games tend to use, like Final Fight 1.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 My problem is that I played Final Fight CD before Final Fight on SNES. Going from an improvement on the arcade music to a downgrade, lol.
As long as we're confessing, I might have a soft spot for the SNES's now unnecessary DSP effects. The SPC700 is like a cool little music box and the SNES sound is instantly recognizable to me.
You know the SNES TMNT Tournament Fighters is awesome rock/techno on any console. Muffling be damned, I say! I love that Pirate Ship track. :)
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I notice this with a lot of SNES fans in general. I've seen some radical fanboys go as far as to say this specific sound is the best sound ever as far as quality goes.
It does have a bit of a nostalgia factor and some times I like it like in Megaman X3 and certain sound effects. But other times it just annoys me. For example the music and sound effects in Super Mario Allstars annoy me to death. I actually prefer the NES versions over them.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Ha ha, I feel you on that particular example. I like the NES music better for the original Mario games as well. The water world music for all-stars SMB3 is just wrong. The music generally has a sort of fluffy genericness. It doesn't have the bite of the originals.
As for the radical folks, some people really do love their preferred chiptune sounds that much, I guess. I know I've seen people say that the C64's SID chip has the best sound ever.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I don't even think the SNES does techno better than the Genesis can do orchestral. Just as you say Genesis' attempts at orchestral sound tinny and like nails on chalkboards I say SNES attempts at techno sound muffled and warbly.
Now, if the SNES didn't have the limitations that it has then I would agree with you, it is better overall. However the memory constraints of the system really limit it, so as a result everything sounds muffled and muddy thus evening things out.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Finally, when we're talking about the mediocre soundtracks, negative generalizations do hold true. But when judging which console had the best music, I'm looking at the most memorable soundtracks, and I do find more stylistic variety on the SNES. You yourself named three largely rock/techno scores as among the best of the Genesis. Can you at least acknowledge that the Genesis library emphasis on action games and the FM synth does skew it towards techno and rock?
megavolt67 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I own and have played many Genesis games and I have a hard time thinking of good orchestral or non-rock/techno kind of scores. Shining Force is alright, but it is appropriately overshadowed by the superior electronica stuff of the Sonic series and others. Even the more classical tracks (which frankly, are mediocre) in PSIV are overshadowed by the techno stuff. I've named soundtracks on the SNES that veer away from classical orchestral to other stuff.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 So if you're going to flip my arguments back at me and propose that the opposite holds true to the same extent for everything I've been saying, then I need examples. They don't have to be examples of "superb" orchestral, jazz, whatever. Just good ones. Like how Contra III is a good rock/techno score on the SNES. Or TMNT Tournament Fighters. Three tracks from Sonic 2 isn't enough. More stuff like Toejam & Earl (the first VGM I recorded on tape) would be better.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Not everything in the Sonic games are electronica. There are a lot of examples of orchestral stuff, big band stuff, as well as more tropical styled songs that I wouldn't categorize as electronica. Some I can think of right of the top of my head:
Aquatic Ruin Zone
Casino Night Zone
Sky Chase Zone
Wing Fortress Zone
Hidden Palace Zone
Sonic 2 Ending
Angel Island Zone
Sky Sanctuary Zone
Those are all non techno tracks that are some of the best tacks in the games.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Think of SNES TiT as an interpretation rather than a reproduction and perhaps you won't get that "stuttering feeling" you do when you make a comparison. Is it safe to say that you feel the same about SNES Street Fighter II? I've heard Genny fans praise Champion Edition because it sounds more like the arcade but truly, I prefer the SNES sound. In fact, where people praise SNES Super SF for *yawn* sounding more like the arcade, I preferred the original SFII & Turbo SNES music.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I do prefer the Genesis version for some tracks like Guiles do to it being a bit higher pitched and having more punch to it. However again the System could do better as homebrew developers have shown. But overall I prefer the CPS1 renditions the most, and some of the CPS2 renditions. Though I do like some of the PC-Engine renditions. But in General I don't really like the 16-bit ports of the Street Fighter games.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Hidden Palace is going in the right direction. Slow and majestic is rarely handled so well on the Genny. Still, you're selecting tracks here, and the great majority of Genesis music that gets remembered is of the rock/techno variety. That's why I brought up Toejam & Earl to try and help you. That one is unique for its funk/rap approach. It's just tough for you perhaps because the Genesis is indeed known for its action games, all of which feature pulse-pounding soundtracks.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Well a lot of Genesis soundtracks tend to use a mix of different Genres.
Toejam and Earl is a decent example of a funk/rap soundtrack but I figured you might consider that too techno style.
Revenge of the Shinobi has some interesting tracks in it that I wouldn't really consider rock or techno like China Town. Monster World IV is a pretty good example of a non-techno and rock styled soundtrack. I'd say it sounds rather SNESish in it's compositions.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Unfortunately, I can't remember a single track from Monster World IV. Coming from you though, the SNESish comment doesn't inspire confidence, lol.
Ecco is a good soundtrack that is more ambient-like than what one usually gets on the Genesis. The second is good too, but it definitely has more rock'n to it. Other than that, hmm, it's really the rock and techno music that sticks out most for me. Capable or not, the music just isn't there. Not enough RPGs, maybe?
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 The only stuff that sounds tinny and like nails on a chalkboard on the Genesis are the bad ports. The games made for the system sound fine for the most part with a few exceptions here and there. And Gun Hazard is ok, but nothing really memorable to me, nothing coming close in terms of what we have in Genesis games like Streets of Rage, Thunder Force, Ranger X, etc. If anything I'd say most Genesis music is better composed.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Sonic is not all rock and techno. Aquatic Ruin Zone, Sky Chase Zone, and Wing Fortress Zone all have a more orchestral and big band sound to them. Casino Night Zone also has more of a Jazz band sound to it. FM Synthesis can rather accurately reproduce the sounds of a lot of real instruments such as guitars, brass, even some wood winds as well as a decent amount of percussion. Where it runs into trouble is when Strings come into play.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 Not all, but largely. If it's not fast-paced and upbeat, it's forgettable. That tends to be the rule with Genesis music.
I've heard the arcade version of TiT before and I think the SNES version actually improved on it. Listening to your comparisons just reinforces that belief. It just has more punch in the right places. Genesis sounds tinny, though ironically, so does the arcade original of this particular track. So I agree with you about the accuracy bit at least.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 The reason the Arcade and Genesis versions sound similar is because they both are pure FM synthesis. The only difference is the Arcade uses a YM2151 which has 8 channels where as the YM2612 in the Genesis only has 6. And I feel that the Arcade version has the most punch really. The SNES version just seems to stutter along really. If you listen carefully you can even hear instruments missing in the SNES version that are present in both the Arcade and Genesis versions.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I think I hear what you're trying to say with the missing instruments, but again, I'm not big on simply going with the one that best mirrors the arcade. For example, I actually prefer the Genesis music for Sagaia (Darius II) to the original arcade version. What my ears hear is that the SNES TiT puts a greater emphasis on the melodic hooks. It's similar to the reason that I prefer SoR2 music to SoR1 music. I prefer a clearer progression to a busy soundscape that blurs/blunts.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 See with the SNES version to me it sounds like it's stuttering a long, which makes it feel broken to me. I prefer the smoother notes of the Genesis and Arcade versions. A interesting comparison to look at would be Thunder Force III to Thunder Spirits. Those games share a lot of the same music and you can hear how music made to work with the Genesis transitions to the SNES.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@SegaFanatic5188 I don't hear any stutter at all. If you listen to Zombies Ate My Neighbors, Rock 'n Roll Racing, Spiderman & X-Men: Arcade's Revenge, and Bubsy, you can hear how music made to work with the SNES transitions to the Genesis.
But if you want a good Genesis to SNES transition, try Cool Spot, which sounds great on the SNES as well.
megavolt67 1 year ago
@megavolt67 I hear the stutter in between ever note. Where as on the FM Synthesis based systems (Arcade and Genesis) There is no stutter between each note, the songs flow more smoothly. Just because you are 5 years older than me doesn't mean I haven't heard my fair share of both systems and their soundtracks. I grew up with these systems as well. SNES may do great orchestral stuff, but when it goes into other kinds of music it starts to get muffled and weird sounding.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Have you heard the Arcade version? The Genesis version sounds almost spot on except for maybe 1 or 2 missing channels. The SNES version sounds rather off and a bit broken up. The Arcade and Genesis versions have smoother transitions between notes where as on the SNES it's a bit broken and jumpy.
Here's a perfect comparison of this:
Arcade: watch?v=QsjoLDod4S4
Genesis: watch?v=VGWmplLZqFg
SNES: watch?v=fH-lLbHbG-A
Sorry but Genesis wins for this game.
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
@megavolt67 Funny you mention the Megaman X soundtracks. You should have a listen to this:
watch?v=OUwg-n1GgOo
Not only does it sound good, I think it sounds even better than the SNES original. And again, the Genesis can do more than Techno and Rock as well. Those are just two genre's it does exceptionally well. There are good examples of it doing other genres. For example this track for Castlevania is a good example of a more orchestral styled track done well:
watch?v=Q_ILz_PdzsY
SegaFanatic5188 1 year ago
Sega do a better work here than in MK2 and MK1
accionmigrania 2 years ago
@accionmigrania
the difference you're seeing is Probe vs Sculptured soft. Acclaim gave SEGA the crappy devs for MK1 & MK2.
vh9online 2 years ago