You have free will, but if you choose to exercise it, you will spend forever burning in ETERNAL hell. Oh, and the dice are loaded so I already KNOW how you will end up - And plus, I made you in such a way that you would make that decision. I designed you and I am a perfect designer who never makes mistakes.... Oh, and Im going to invest in you the sins of Adam - Through no choice of your own.
@manchester26m When you do wrong, does God force it on you? Are you a child that you couldn't say no? You really think you had no choice? People do not go to heaven because they chose too, there are no loaded dice. I don't know if you had a bad experience with religious people, but for the love of you, READ what it actually says, understand it in CONTEXT, THEN talk.
@OmoItsekiri Is the Christian God omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent?
Does he know every desire thought and action done by every single person?
Because if he does, and if he's omniscient, he already knows the bad deeds destined to be commited by the person - He knows that the person will be condemned or not before the person is even born. Their destiny's are fixed therefore no free will.
So is it possible to prove God wrong? To surprise him? Or are you saying he isnt omniscient?
@manchester26m Yes, yes and yes. God's Pre-knowledge does not mean he fixed it. He is outside time and not governed by it, so he can see the outcome. And yes he knows who is and is not going to be with him for all eternity. It is not fair to blame God for your decisions. Try seeing it as God knows what decisions we will make and lets us see for our selves what we will do. It is not possible to surprise God.
It is fair to allow things to happen anyway, it holds up in court, there is proof.
Im saying that he creates sinners in the full knowledge that they will burn forever.
Im saying that he knows who will repent and believe in him and who wont. Its not a case of him being overjoyed when a lost sheep is found because he knows how it will work out.
@manchester26m God did not create sinners. He put sinless people into an unbroken world and gave them a choice, they failed. Their actions have consequences just like if you plant a seed it very well will grow as a result of rain, sunligt and nutrients. Consequences. I have no reply to your last point, the text says what it says. Whether you agree is up to you.
To say that I am guilty of sin as a result of something that happened(if it happened)thousands of years ago MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE IN THE LEAST! And then to say your only way to free yourself from this crime you inherited is to ask someone else to forgive you makes NO sense either, and the whole concept of it is offensive and should be rejected!
@99minerkc even if you aren't deemed a sinner by adam and eve's actions from many years ago, im sure you have sinned by your own choice in this life nevertheless. it doesnt matter whether you're blamed for something that happened so long ago; the simple fact of the matter is that you, like everyone else, are a sinner.
@99minerkc it also seems like you do not understand the concept of forgiveness. real forgiveness is not the petty "dont worry about it" or "forget about it" you see with people. sin is a direct offense against god. and because god is a god of justice, sin must be met with punishment, not merely swept under the rug.
@99minerkc but praise god! for god is so full of love that he sent down his only son to bear the just punishment we deserve, so that we may not die but inherit eternal life. by jesus, god shows that he is both fully just & fully loving. by jesus, we are forgiven. not because god simply says "its ok," but because he himself bore our punishment.
we sinners cannot truly forgive: thats why we need jesus to cover our sins and reconcile us with god. believe in him and you too will be saved from sin
@shoozieme You may deserve punishment but I don't! :-). I'll finish by saying I wasn't able to read your entire post due to you preaching! If I was looking to be preached to I would go to church, Religion in the usa is on the decline due to people waking up and realizing that it's just simply not true! It's my hope that you wake up some day and chose to live in reality!
You have free will, but if you choose to exercise it, you will spend forever burning in ETERNAL hell. Oh, and the dice are loaded so I already KNOW how you will end up - And plus, I made you in such a way that you would make that decision. I designed you and I am a perfect designer who never makes mistakes.... Oh, and Im going to invest in you the sins of Adam - Through no choice of your own.
Hows that for free will?
manchester26m 1 year ago
@manchester26m When you do wrong, does God force it on you? Are you a child that you couldn't say no? You really think you had no choice? People do not go to heaven because they chose too, there are no loaded dice. I don't know if you had a bad experience with religious people, but for the love of you, READ what it actually says, understand it in CONTEXT, THEN talk.
OmoItsekiri 11 months ago
@OmoItsekiri Is the Christian God omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent?
Does he know every desire thought and action done by every single person?
Because if he does, and if he's omniscient, he already knows the bad deeds destined to be commited by the person - He knows that the person will be condemned or not before the person is even born. Their destiny's are fixed therefore no free will.
So is it possible to prove God wrong? To surprise him? Or are you saying he isnt omniscient?
manchester26m 11 months ago
@manchester26m Yes, yes and yes. God's Pre-knowledge does not mean he fixed it. He is outside time and not governed by it, so he can see the outcome. And yes he knows who is and is not going to be with him for all eternity. It is not fair to blame God for your decisions. Try seeing it as God knows what decisions we will make and lets us see for our selves what we will do. It is not possible to surprise God.
It is fair to allow things to happen anyway, it holds up in court, there is proof.
OmoItsekiri 11 months ago
@OmoItsekiri Im not suggesting he "fixed it".
Im saying that he has the benefit of foresight.
Im saying that he is the creator of all
Im saying that he creates sinners in the full knowledge that they will burn forever.
Im saying that he knows who will repent and believe in him and who wont. Its not a case of him being overjoyed when a lost sheep is found because he knows how it will work out.
manchester26m 11 months ago
@manchester26m God did not create sinners. He put sinless people into an unbroken world and gave them a choice, they failed. Their actions have consequences just like if you plant a seed it very well will grow as a result of rain, sunligt and nutrients. Consequences. I have no reply to your last point, the text says what it says. Whether you agree is up to you.
OmoItsekiri 11 months ago
To say that I am guilty of sin as a result of something that happened(if it happened)thousands of years ago MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE IN THE LEAST! And then to say your only way to free yourself from this crime you inherited is to ask someone else to forgive you makes NO sense either, and the whole concept of it is offensive and should be rejected!
99minerkc 1 year ago
@99minerkc even if you aren't deemed a sinner by adam and eve's actions from many years ago, im sure you have sinned by your own choice in this life nevertheless. it doesnt matter whether you're blamed for something that happened so long ago; the simple fact of the matter is that you, like everyone else, are a sinner.
shoozieme 1 year ago
@shoozieme I don't sin therefore I need no salvation from anything! Even if I did sin I would reject your salvation story as it's not moral!
99minerkc 1 year ago
@99minerkc it also seems like you do not understand the concept of forgiveness. real forgiveness is not the petty "dont worry about it" or "forget about it" you see with people. sin is a direct offense against god. and because god is a god of justice, sin must be met with punishment, not merely swept under the rug.
shoozieme 1 year ago
@99minerkc but praise god! for god is so full of love that he sent down his only son to bear the just punishment we deserve, so that we may not die but inherit eternal life. by jesus, god shows that he is both fully just & fully loving. by jesus, we are forgiven. not because god simply says "its ok," but because he himself bore our punishment.
we sinners cannot truly forgive: thats why we need jesus to cover our sins and reconcile us with god. believe in him and you too will be saved from sin
shoozieme 1 year ago
@shoozieme You may deserve punishment but I don't! :-). I'll finish by saying I wasn't able to read your entire post due to you preaching! If I was looking to be preached to I would go to church, Religion in the usa is on the decline due to people waking up and realizing that it's just simply not true! It's my hope that you wake up some day and chose to live in reality!
peace to you.
99minerkc 1 year ago
I like this explanation! Keller is the man!
therexCo 2 years ago