Dogfights: Hunt for the Bismark: John "Jock" Moffat

[oldhatrs25]

GUTS

[azimuth361]

This is why I don't read fiction. This REALLY happened! The true stories of heroes, real men, real stories, are better than what happens in the mind of any fiction writer. 'Pursuit', 'Ghost Soldiers', 'Neptune's Inferno', 'The Last Stand of the Tin Can Soldiers', '30 Seconds Over Tokyo' are better stories, TRUE stories than any piece of fiction I've ever found.

[jonnybottle]

What a great old Lad!!

[Seriphyn]

I heard this story from Jock Moffat himself, he was delivering a speech at Trafalgar Night in Aberdeen.

What this video didn't mention is what Jock saw after, which was the ship on its side, and sailors "just like us" drowning with no hope. It was a very powerful and moving speech for all of us.

[darkmossie633]

i thought one freak torpedo hit had disabled rudder, jamming it, so Bismark could only go round in circles? -it was not other hits by Swordfish, but the rudder hit fatal?

[kohyuzhi]

@darkmossie633

[RevSyd]

Use the Force, Jock! Use the Force!

[thmoorer]

Thank goodness for this video clip!!! I was watching on the History Channel and right at the point "Not yet, John!"...directTV decided to show me a "Emergency Alert System" check for Los Angeles. (I am in North Carolina). Now I know what happened.

[CrazyVT22]

omg the same thing happend to me in georgia

[thomasuras]

the germans should have brought along a few 12 gage shot guns . Stupid germans

[martin091723]

the truth is British armada and air force against Bismarck obviously they win and sunk the out numbered German battle ship...history only create for those who survive and telling different version of the event who knows they tell us the other part and hide the truth its only my opinion

[rifal004]

So what if it was outnumbered and outgunned? War is hell and u take every advantage you can get

[pharoah246]

Well your opinion is wrong.

[o3941]

History is writen by the victor.

[RevSyd]

@o3941 Is there a history where the Bismarck wasn't torpedoed?

[o3941]

@RevSyd What?

[RevSyd]

@o3941 "History is written by the victor" implies that the victor is lying about what happened. Because nobody can contradict them.

[duncr]

Canvas wrapped bi planes against the might of the German Navy. Take that Fritz!

[Pitcairn2]

John was 90 last week, I met him at his Birthday party, on Tuesday to photograph him for a magazine.. Nice old chap.

[piperoller2001]

these great ships , hood , bismark ,rodney , iowa class ships,

whatever,the aircraft with correct tacticts proved them obsolete

the huge capital ship with the huge rifles is a thing of the past,

kind of sad though,they represented alot of navy tradition.

[BardockFan2213]

hood wasnt iowa class

[steelpanther88]

so basically bismarck's flak guns werent that good, I mean there werent enugh of them, as opposed to American newer battleships for example. Also the reason the slow biplanes didnt get hit by flak was that the sighting systems were adjusted for normal faster monoplanes xD.

[Trainfanatic192]

The Bismark was sunk on WW1, not WW2.

[BardockFan2213]

are you fucking kidding me your a shit head

[Trainfanatic192]

Never mind, it is WW2, the bi-planes had me confused, sorry.

[BardockFan2213]

lol ok cuz it says it in the vid

[tubecruser]

WW2 nuub

[Trainfanatic192]

What?

[tubecruser]

of course it was in WW2!!!

[Trainfanatic192]

I know that!

[Olmecru]

estos tipos eran muy valientes para enfrentarse a un acorazado tan poderoso como el bismark utilizando solo biplanos lentos y pesados con poca maniobrabilidad, trataron de repetir la historia con los japoneses pero el resultado fue otro a tal punto que el principe de wales fue hundido

[Dogmeat7]

best Sea Battles were in the pacific. :)guys talk about battleships vs battleships how about Destroyer Escorts taking on not 1 battleships but many at the same time, now that takes Balls.

[StorkeyUK77]

Good point

[StorkeyUK77]

Like (but not quite the same) the BATTLE OF THE RIVER PLATE where 3 British Light Crusiers took on the GRAF-SPEE and they only won because he thought they were destroyers - and they used Destoyer tactics against him - then blew his sorry ars* off.

[StorkeyUK77]

Truth is - no act of heroism can EVER match that of the HMS Jervis Bay - an Armed Merchant-man who single handedly took-on the German Pocket Battleship ADMIRAL SCHEER on the night of 5 November 1940. Out-gunned, out-ranged and unarmoured the JERVIS BAY drew the fire of ADMIRAL SCHEER for over 10 minutes - only being able to return fire once. The sacrifice of both the vessel and its crew, in the face of impossible odds, ensured the majority of the convoy escaped un-harmed. Those were TRUE HEROS.

[thomasuras]

I think something is wrong with you . I stated that the Bismark was hit by a plane that was flying 80 mph, you write back and say "120mph is cruising speed - 80mph is torpedo launch speed - get IT RIGHT YOU IGNORANT " so how fast was the plane going that sent the Bismark in circles and taking on water before it sank on its maiden voyage ?

[StorkeyUK77]

BTW: The torpedos sent the BISMARCK wavering - but it was still able to be steared - the Captain ordered the props to be run on alternating patterns to try and keep the ship almost on a steady course - fact - it wasnt EVER doing circles. And it didnt take - on water because of that - the rear access room to the props were pressurised to stop water leaking - in. And she wouldnt have sank if HMS KG5 and the HMS RODNEY hadn't blasted it to ****.

[thomasuras]

so i guess the guy that was on the ship in the video and went threw all that was lying when he Said He radioed back With "The Torpedo slammed so hard , broke the rudder sent us in circles and were taking water, We will fight to the last shell long live the fuhrer " I'm sure you have more in site being no where near the ship and over 60 years later you have a better recall of what happened than the Germans that were on the ship when it happened

[StorkeyUK77]

LISTEN, JUST TRY - ONCE. I speak GERMAN. Not only doesnt the German sailor say "we were talking on water" but I SAID the ship's rudder room was pressurised. They couldnt repair the rudders because the water was in the ship - but the water didnt spread. The NAUTICAL TERMONOLOGY "taking on water" applies up-until the point when the water is stopped from spreading into the ship - therefore you are no-longer "taking" the water "on".

[StorkeyUK77]

And the insight I have is the fact a family freind WAS ON THE FUCKING BISMARCK @ the time - and its his granddaughter that taught me GERMAN. SO THATS MY INSIGHT YOU MORON!!!!!!!!!

[thomasuras]

So I'm guessing the conversation went something like this. "storkey you know the Brits never realy hurt the Bismarck , the sailors were playing cards the night before and the loser had to open the valves and sink the ship and swinback to France. The winners were just to drunk to realize that if the ship was sunk they would have to swim back also"

[StorkeyUK77]

SHAME - SUCH BULL ...

[Dogmeat7]

Ya dumbass I knew the japs learned too. but this VID has nothing to do with the DAMN JAPS!

[StorkeyUK77]

It does when people discuss military tactics. fool

[elswick1542]

battle of guadalcanal 13th nov 1942,the usn battleships Washington and south dakota engaged the ijn battlship kirishima,the south dakota suffered an elec fail but Washington hit back and sunk the ijn ship with 9 radar controlled salvoes,also at the battle of surigao strait the usn battleships sunk the ijn battleships yamashiro and fuso,so at least 2 bb to bb actions for the usn.

[StorkeyUK77]

...

[StorkeyUK77]

OOOOOOOO

[StorkeyUK77]

So when the BISMARK was sunk it was by 2 Battleships, A destoyer, An AIR Craft Carrier (HMS ARK ROYAL) and a multitude of other ships. If it was junk it would have sunk like all other normal ships - even American Battleships. To sink The TIRPITZ - BISMARCK'S sister ship they set-chargs on it, bombed it and finally dropped an Earthquake bomb on it - thats how good TIRPITZ and BISMARCK were designed - they were first-class battleships - not "pieces of junk." SO GO READ SOME REAL HISTORY!!!!!!!!!!!

[thomasuras]

Again the Bismark its like having the best knife in the world in a gun fight. What were the germans thinking or were they thinking ?

[StorkeyUK77]

As usual, thomasuras; you dont know what ya talking about. "Again the Bismark its like having the best knife in the world in a gun fight" - WHAT BULL YOU TALK!!!! HAHAAHHA - seriously - read the BISMARCK's specs - it was a perfectly designed, modern Battleship for its time (launched: 1939, sunk: May 27th 1941)and The Royal Navy ensured that it was sunk because they knew that a Battleship such as the Bismarck was tooooo great a threat. Just accept it - your arguement is falling apart!!!!

[Dogmeat7]

also to add the U.S proved back i nthe 20's that a plane could take out battleships but ppl were finding that hard to belive,least the Germans took notice on American dive bombing.

[StorkeyUK77]

Oh - bull - the Japs learnt too, Dogmeat7, did you enjoy Pearl Harbour then????? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH YOU FOOL!!!

[thomasuras]

peral harbor was a trap, to fire up the USA to get in the war and kick german ass

[elswick1542]

jock moffat=hero,rest in peace the crews of hood and bismark

[ww2luv]

why are they still using bidplanes?

[thomasuras]

Because the Germans are stupid and thats all u needed to sink their super ship. Why waste any ships fighting the Bismark, Any Air craft made battle ships like the bismarck obsolete

[dahlhorse]

you really are stupid monkey aren't you thomasuras dumb ass!

[thomasuras]

Go tell some one about this great battleship the "Bismark" go on and on how great and strong powerful best guns and on and on. Then tell them it was sunk on its first mission and the main reason it was sunk , was becuase a 80 mph biplane broke its rudder,then look at the expression on their face, and they will be calling you stupid

[BigChief427]

That's not the real reason. The problem was that the gun turrets were set up to track the fast moving modern monoplanes of the time. The gearing in the turret housings was not good for tracking slow biplanes, but was ideal for modern fighters. The gunners had problems keeping a bead on the slower Biplanes. But, had the brits used their modern planes, it would have been more interesting. Still, aircraft of any type could challenge even the mightiest of ships. So your half right.

[thomasuras]

No shit? So it wasn't built to defend its self aginst its enemy ? Smart Huh ? They knew about the sword fish , that wasn't a secret weapon. Who's fault was that ? Its safe to say The Germans had another piece of crap out on the water , and wasted time and resources on a worth less piece of out dated junk

[BigChief427]

LOL, yeah you right. I guess they never expected the british to use the swordfish. Also their where still people in the military who favored the battleship over the aircraft carrier. Stupid? Yes, but some people just didn't know better. Aka, stupid Germans and Japs.

[StorkeyUK77]

thomasuras (1 week ago) : you dont know anything - the BISMARK was a brand-new Battle-Ship, it wasnt a "worth less piece of out dated junk" you are totally ignorant - dont comment if you dont know what you are talking about Americans!!!!!!!!!!

[thomasuras]

Look at what happened , the pile of crap was sunk becuase of a bieplane that flew 80 mph, I could take down the biplane with a good shot gun,Ford makes brand -new cars all day long that are junk so what u talkin about willes

[StorkeyUK77]

MAXIMUM SPEED: 139 mph., CRUISING SPEED: 104-129 mph., CLIMB TO 5000 FT: 19 minutes, 0 seconds, RANGE: 350 nm, SERVICE CEILING: 15,000 feet

THATS the specs for a Fairey Swordfish, thomasaurus; so where does the "80 mph" com from??? And the BISMARK WASNT SUNK by the torpedos - they damaged the rudder and then HMS NORFOLK, HMS RODNEY, HMS King George V, and HMS DORSETSHIRE. YOU ARE SOOOOOOO INGNORANT - RESEARCH BEFORE YOUM START BULLING

[thomasuras]

All those numbers are with out a torpedo , If you would have done your homework you would have known that , The plane was travling approximately 80 mph , sent the mighty ship in circles. Very very foolish with the limited resources Germany had to sink it into that Piece of crap of a battle ship the bismarck.

[StorkeyUK77]

No - actually - do your homework - 120mph is cruising speed - 80mph is torpedo launch speed - get IT RIGHT YOU IGNORANT FOOL - Ive done my homework - do yours!!! HAHAHA - And GERMANY HAD resources when they built BISMARCK and TIRPITZ - Tell me - when has an AMERICAN BATTLESHIP EVER MET ANOTHER BATTLESHIP IN SHIP-TO-SHIP COMBAT ...... NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SO AHAHAHH - COME BACK AND ARGUE ONCE YOU ACTUALLY DO THAT, FOOL

[thomasuras]

Like i said before no doubt the Bismarck was over built. Just becuase america can sink ships with a few planes stating "AMERICAN BATTLESHIP EVER MET ANOTHER BATTLESHIP IN SHIP-TO-SHIP COMBAT ...... NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" is realy a very smart thing that america hasn't had to do that . That shows great leadership and good use of resources on USA part. We sink big expensive ships with cheep small aircraft.

[elswick1542]

uss washington met the ijn kirishima combat ship to ship and blew it out of the water,i fully agree with you aircraft are the best way to sink a ship,why risk the huge crews of battleships when a cheep aircraft can do the job even a 80mph biplane.

[Hellooo06]

It's also for much lower speed to make sure the torpedoes are launched accurately.

[Dogmeat7]

they were fling bi-planes because,

1. every oen thought WW1 was the the last war in europe lol.

2. the goverment thought that was good enough for them.

3. Liberal ppl like Chamberlin screw alot of things up an in the end get alot of ppl killed.

[StorkeyUK77]

NOOOOOO - They were Bi-planes because the Fairey Swordfish was a good plane for naval engagements. There WERE single-wing planes such as the Supermarine Seafire - a cousin of the Spitfire - but the Bi-planes robust build meant it could be used in rough weathers!!!!

[TroyaE117]

Imagine the moment when the Germans realised that the ship would not answer the helm.

[jonnybottle]

Silly Bardock! Remember Pearl!

[13squadron]

No battleships can resist an aerial attack both Pacific and Atlantic theater...weather it was a torpedo bomber, dive bomber, kamikaze suicide bomber...

[BardockFan2213]

uss enter prise can and she did

[13squadron]

yo! that ship was the main target of the IJN in battle for Guadalcanal...that's because of her fighter squadron of F4F wildcats...and she's still floating...by the way thanks for the information...there was a lot of awesome stories during those days...

[SmiertSpionem]

Wasn't that after they added stacks more AA guns to the deck?

I think if the Japanese had got their act together and thrown many kamikazes at one ship they could have taken down anything floating. As it was pilots were told to pick one ship each, a poor tactic!

[jpo51]

How is it that so many people incorrectly post the ship's name? It is BISMARCK, not Bismark! Why not fix it?

[thomasuras]

I call it the FIZMARK becuase it was a pile of junk and only lasted about 6 days on open water

[Basti6814]

Bismarck

Rest In Peace

!!!Du hast uns stolz gemacht!!!

und möge das deutsche Volk stolz bleiben!!!

A.H S.H  88

[Jonhny2]

A piece of proof that battleships were being replaced by aircraft carriers in the forties.

[SmiertSpionem]

50's perhaps? I know what you are saying, they were no longer the dominant craft at sea after the end of WWII.

[dougeagle]

Dyvone 13- the British didn't have the carriers that the US had during the war. The swordfish biplanes were very good...little slow, but they did the job well.

[Cyral189]

I was kind of laughing a little, that the greatest battleship of the German army was sunk by Biplanes of World War I. But, I have sheer and utmost respect for the John Moffat and his observer for taking on and delivering the fatal blow..

[konnigkratz]

Not from WW1. It's 1930's

[BardockFan2213]

yea i was laughing alot when hms hood the pride of the british navy got her ass kicked all over the place

[Pitcairn2]

You havnt a clue you little twat.

They hit her ammo magazine.

Over a thousand men died. You are so divorced from reality that you find this funny. I despair of todays young people.

[BardockFan2213]

no dude its ok those 100 ment were only brits nothing to worry about

[zepsterboy]

bardock fan2213 aka cunt of the planet

you are the biggest waste of sperm and egg that has ever been. pearl harbour, now that was funny.

[YouT00ber]

omg, you're such a douche.

[StorkeyUK77]

you are SOOOOOO IGNORANT - DAMN - I REALY PITY YOU - HMS HOOD got "her ass kicked" by fluke; by a chance shot - even the GERMANS said that you fool - AND I WAS LAUGHING @ PEARL HARBOUR - AHAHAHAHHAHAHAAHAHAHHAAHAHAH ALLOT - THAT is a REAL reason to laugh - U.S.A. HAS NEVER EVER HAD A SHIP-TO-SHIP ENGAGEMENT - SO YOU CANT SAY ANYTHING - AND IT SAYS THAT ON C.I.A. WEBSITE, USGOV WEBITE ETC ETC - YOU DONT KNOW ANYTHING!!!!!!! @ LEAST HOOD FOUGHT AGAINST ANOTHER, BETTER, MORE MODERN SHIP .....

[StorkeyUK77]

...... UNLIKE ANY SCUMMY US SHI"P*" (REPLACE THE "P*" WITH "T") HAS EVER DONE - ALL THESE FANTASTIC SHIPS YOU SUPPOSEDLY HAD - USS Pennsylvania, USS Downes, USS Cassin, USS California, USS Shaw, USS West Virginia USS Oklahoma, USS Helena, USS Utah, USS Honolulu, USS Arizona etc etc - all BURNED WITHOUT EVER FIRING @ ANOTHER SHIP ... EVER!!!!! AHAHAHAHAH - SO MUCH FOR THE U.S. NAVY

[BardockFan2213]

wow your so cool you can reply to a comment from 3 months ago and pear harbor was gay too start with ok lets see the japs snuck up on us and most ships were getting re fueld you faggot and your lucky the japs did cuz if they didnt yous be speaking german right now cuz you english were getting ass'es kicked by the germans so fuck off

[thomasuras]

England wasn't close to getting their ass kicked by germans, Germany lost their air force becuase of England

[BardockFan2213]

lol then why did the americans come in and finsh the job gorge patten lead the final asualt to berlin hmm and he wasnt english they couldnt finsh the fight we had to wipe up there mess like moms do if babys puke on themselve so that being said the u.s.a was mommy and you were puke faced baby plus i said that commont 3 months ago cuz someone was talking shit about bismark i wasnt being spiteful too england alone but too the kid that was talking shit about bismark i was defending a great ship

[thomasuras]

LMAO great ship , well i guess you can say that so was Clumbus ships he had 3 great ships also.

[BardockFan2213]

thats all you have too say wow the bismark was 2end bigest ship there was out on the sea and biggest too engage sea too sea it sunk aleast trice what the hood ever did and it was able too go duble what it could for a short while of time armed with nothing but guns it was a total war machine so not a great your stupied and cant say much more the a few words to my comment you just shoundnt then respect the dead and what they fought for

[StorkeyUK77]

lol

[StorkeyUK77]

actually THE RUSSIANS PUSHED TO BERLIN FIRST MATE - Not Britain or The US - RUSSIA!!!!!!

[thomasuras]

that ship was the dumbest idea a human could come up with. Total waste of time money and war effort. I'm surprised you never saw Germany trying to make a supper catapult with a real real big ass rock , to try and take out the enemy, they were so far behind it wasn't funny .

[BardockFan2213]

if it was such a crappy ship how come it took the hood down so easy wow that makes so much since what a crappy ship oh wait it easyly took down the hood

[thomasuras]

The hood was crap also , you dident see the British build another hood did ya

[BardockFan2213]

then you make no sence at all first you defend the hood now your talking trash wow dude that just shows what a loser you are

[thomasuras]

never defended the hood , i can still here the biplane approaching . yeea-yeea-yeea-putt-yeea-putt-­putt-yeea-errrreeee- as the engine wined's SPLASH! waaa-wwaa-wwaa 5 min latter KABOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No more Bismarck

[BardockFan2213]

yeah i can hear it now all those screams from the people aboard the hood when that shell hit the amunition bay the taering of meatl as the hood split in two the screaming of grown men notghing they could do but die ahh yes noo more pride of the nbritsh navy no more hood

[StorkeyUK77]

THE BRITISH DIDNT BUILD ANOTHER HMS HOOD???? NO - Because of the fact it was the flag-ship and destroyed in such circumstances that, in honour of the crew who served her, there shall never be another HMS HOOD - Thats now British Naval Tradition.

[thomasuras]

So some one is lying here , Watch the video and numerous person that were on the ship state the fact that they were doomed, guns out and sinking. Theirs even a telegram explaining their dire condition. I think that old fart your talking to is full of chit

[jonnybottle]

This is not right. Patriotism aside, it was the one of the best ships of its time. For its part, the Hood was due to have extra armour fitted when the war broke out, and was vulnerable to just the short of hit that blew it up. But they were all at the end of their era. Aircraft carriers were just starting to come into their own, above all in the Pacific and it was an aircraft carrier that crippled Bismarck.

[BardockFan2213]

they launched the planes from shore not an aircraft a swordfish could get enough speed for an on water launch they had too have a longer one since they were older and not as advanced as other planes pretty much the guy who waas flying this got lucky and the germans made an eorrer and thats what happend not how great the brits were it was a fluke that sunk the bismark

[jonnybottle]

Missing the point, Bardock. Shore-based fighters protecting Scharnhorst & Gneisenau were comparable in performance/armament to the Zeros protecting the Japanese fleets. During the Channel Dash the Swordfish were slaughtered. Anyway, look at which aircraft sank ships in WW2: mainly dive bombers. The torpedo-bombers' biggest successes were against ships at anchor at Pearl Harbor and Taranto. The 1 US, 4 Japanese carriers sunk at midway / the Prince of Wales & Repulse fell to dive bombers.

[BardockFan2213]

thats huge bull zeros were the fastest and best armed fighter there was only a wild cat that could compare to them swordfishes are slow and clumse. then theres the flack paneren too consider for battle shipps it could only go so far up and most of the time dive bombers were flying out of range till it was too late and when the ships were at anchor there was no one too man the flack cannons of aa guns duh plus the japs came in numbers

[thomasuras]

LMAO u said " fluke that sunk the Bismark " It was a fluke the bismarck lasted 7 days hell if spotted sooner it would have been sunk in 1 day

[BardockFan2213]

you fagg they knew about it all along thats why they sent the hood and the prince of wales after it and they couldnt sink it in one day your stupid yeah they did want too sink faster cuz the brits couyld sink them duh

[thomasuras]

the germans just like sinking themselves?

[BardockFan2213]

your stupid

[Trainfanatic192]

The poster is not stupid to make this if he/she didn't make it! Sheesh, people!

[hildemel]

Its called scuttling to avoid the ship being captured, repaired, and being used by the enemy.

[thomasuras]

So ur telling me the Germans went to see saw the enemy and sank their own ship so the British couldn't sink them or capture their ship? WTF is the point of having a ship if ya got sink it every time you see the enemy?

[thomasuras]

believe me the only thing they would want that ship for is scrap not repair. It would make great bomb casings for the RAF and the US bombers leveling German cities. they wouldn't think about repairing and sending out that giant target again

[StorkeyUK77]

Actually - GERMANY was literally THE most technologically advanced nation before WW2 - Because they had planned for war - no one else had - NOT GREAT BRITAIN - NOT THE U.S.=- Thats a fact and certified by historians world-wide - even AMERICAN ONES!!!!! Germany - best tanks, best ships, best military training in 1939. So, as usual - youre using a really crappy arguament thomasaurus.

[thomasuras]

Your telling me they actually planned for that disaster? Holy chit now that says it all. And USA, British, dident plan? aint that some shit . Do all that planing , all those fine weapons and get put back in the stone age in less than 2 years. Well I would like to meet the Guys that planed all that , if they havent been hung yet and give them a big thank you hug. Street smart beats book smart any day

[BardockFan2213]

your stupid germany planed giving them the upper hand and so did the japs thats why they attacked pearl harbor and tom you fat fucker planes didnt sink the bismark the sunk them selves after 20 mins of being bombarded by the brits who couldnt sink her so they scutled it your a shit haed and suck a dick

[thomasuras]

That's not what the people that were on the bismarck said, watch the video . They were their

, they were stuck in a circle becuase of the blown up rudder and were taking on water. Like some one shooting themselves wile their bleeding to death the little 80 mph plane did them in. Just watch the entire video

[BardockFan2213]

your an idiot watch this vid Dogfights: "Sink the Bismarck" 5 of 5 thats the vid that youneed too watch this is only a 5th of the full storey

[thomasuras]

yea watch it and then reply when the guy says we radioed back and said we will fight to the last shell , when he knew he was doomed, they scuttled it becuase they wanted it to sink faster it was taking on water and doomed. Again they dident sink the ship for some kind of swming contest

[hildemel]

my god, you sir are an idiot

[thomasuras]

Ur the idiot along with all the other dumb asses that think they sculled the bizmark for some kind of swimming contest to see who can make it back in freezing waters first. not because the British had any thing to do with it

[vdub2002]

it would have been SOP to scuttle her if she couldnt fight. instead of risking capture.

[thomasuras]

well wtf good is a ship you have to sink because it cant fight?How worthless is that?

[BardockFan2213]

she couldnt fight suz she didnt have ammo

[thomasuras]

Why couldent she fight?

[BardockFan2213]

she couldn't fight because her stearing cloum was jamed by a fuckin torp so were would she go when all she can do is a circle and she was almost out of ammunation she was on her way the get more

[thomasuras]

Now who's fault was that? That's like saying the machine gunner would have taken them all out if it wasnt for the bullet in the head . he was doing fine until that Think about wtf ur saying

[jonnybottle]

This is revisionist bullshit, Storkey. We couldn't have a) survived and b) won if we hadn't had better technology. E.g. the Rolls-Royce Merlin was the best engine, our radar was the best and got better - and we used it to best effect - the Spitfire was the best defensive fighter, the Mosquito without parallel, the Lancaster the best bomber, and our code breaking was simply out of this world. Get real and think British.

[StorkeyUK77]

HEY - im as overly patriotic as the next guy - fact is Germany had prepared for war - we hadnt. I dont wanna argue with another Briton - but History stands - Germany was mobilized for war - we werent - they had fully trained troops - we had 40% of the Standing Army off in other parts of the world - we only won because of the channel and the R.A.F. breaking Hitler's will and capabilities to invade. Better technology>>>??? Germany had automatic rifles after 1940 - we didnt ...

[jonnybottle]

Now this is better. The Germans certainly had a head start, so it was the quantity not the quality of the technology avialable that was the problem. But the bit about the channel reminds me of when a French friend said: "olala, but eef you ad not been ze island". This goes too far with ze speculation. If we hadn't been an island we wouldn't have had the Royal Navy, ergo we wouldn't have had the Empire, ergo we wouldn't have been needed technology and we we wouldn't have developed the technology.

[ellebal1111]

@jonnybottle A little know fact about battleships superiority is that the French Richelieu class battleship were superior to the Bismark and British ships in most regards, including fire power, armament, armor, main guns technology of firing solutions and radar uses for long range finding...check this site  combinedfleet baddest keepers on google

[jonnybottle]

@ellebal1111 What a coincidence - my Dad served on the destroyer HMS Racehorse in a flotilla led by the Richelieu in the India Ocean. It alternated as the flotilla leader with the Dutch Battleship Tromp. He told me that on the Racehorse they much preffered being led by the Tromp because the French Captain was always stirring up trouble bombarding Japanese airbases If they didn't do a thorough job they were set upon next day by the surviving aircraft..

[jonnybottle]

@ellebal1111 But surely, Warspite was the best gunnery ship in any Navy. Check out its exploits at Matapan and D-Day plus something.

[StorkeyUK77]

Finally; something we agree on, mate!

[BardockFan2213]

thats a lie they were out of ammo

[Dyvone13]

im confused it said 1941 right? then why r they using those planes? i thought those were WWI planes...

[thomasuras]

Why was good planes on a big ass piece of junk like the Bismark. The germans were always building things that never fir the application. The biplanes could take off from a short deck. Just like a kite , thats realy all u needed to Defeat the Great German war ship

[YouT00ber]

Sure are a lot of lucky guys using Youtube these days!

[loyndsy]

I've flown with John in his Piper and even now he's all there.He's great fun to be with and it was a privilege to fly with him.Long life young man.

[poolfarm2]

The man is a hero.

[Sammyoak]

John Moffett said in this show that he witness Bismarck's sinking and he said it was a scene witch haunted him for many days.

[brtshstel]

I will say that the Bismark was a magnificent ship despite its fatal weakness from air attack. I love battleships like Missouri and Iowa, and Yamato, and ofcourse Bismark.

[surferc7]

Holy shit thats my last name :O

[GenericGene]

Brilliant historical post - thank you.

[dannaryeguy]

the stringbag was an amazing machine it bested all of the newer aircraft that was supposed to replace it

[22steve5150]

no it didnt, the japanese and american torpedo bombers sank more shipping than the stringbags did and US and japanese ships had MUCH better AA defense than the germans did. these biplane pieces of crap wouldnt have came withing a couple miles of an iowa or yamato class battleship!

[dannaryeguy]

actually the larger guns wont bother a stringbag, it was its lack of speed that made it almost impossible to hit.. the error that most ships made was aim infront like with the faster and probably less effective later english aircraft and us navy planes.

[22steve5150]

you couldnt be more wrong about the swordfish's chances in the pacific theater. iowa and yamato had radar directed AA guns and proximity shells besides having a much higher concentration of rapid fire guns (5", 40mm, 20mm). swordfish would be suicide against US and japanese capitol ships!

[jonnybottle]

Although I deplore your invective about the Swordfish - it did great work all through the war, especially against U-boats - you are quite right. Naval aviation in the Pacific was in a different class culminating in the Corsair. A Zero would make mincemeat of the Swordfish, indeed shore-based Me 109's did when Swordfish tried to attack German ships dirng the Channel Dash. At Midway much faster Vindicators got shot down to the last plane by defensive fighters in the first attack on a carrier.

[gotcha109]

true, the bismarcks fire control systems couldn't compenste for a slow lead so to say....and proved the torpedo stands king in a naval battle when deck armour is thick enough to withstand shells

[dannaryeguy]

also whereas the newer aircraft was useless in most dogfights the little swordfish could tangle with them. Or simply hid away in the clouds till the enemies were gone.

[22steve5150]

you are wrong again, they couldnt tangle with the fighters. they may have been nimble but they couldnt defend themselves for shit and they were too slow to evade unless the fighter dropped right in behind them and after may 1942 (when german battlecruisers easily shot down an entire squadron) they werent used as torpedo bombers anymore, they became subhunters.

[gotcha109]

Yamato was a statue, and it's only action was a suicide mission...and as for the iowa class battleships, who'd they ever have a gun duel with??? they ended up being a symbol of power, and a gun platform for invasion troops...there days of sea-power never came to light. The Indianapolis proved there might against a magnetic torpedo under the keel, as this IOWA lasted but a few minutes before her broken back took her to the depths

[22steve5150]

wow are you fucking wrong. first the indianapolis was a 9,800 ton heavy cruiser built in 1930, not a 50,000 ton battleship built in the early 40's. the south dakota and north carolina class ships were effectively proxies for iowa and one of them took a long lance torpedo (best in the world, had a list for 5 minutes and was only out of action a couple months, another shot down 30 aircraft in one fight, and one sunk 2 older japanese battleships in one fight.

[paddymac8]

Great research! You are very correct. Iowa class battleships would rule, especially with their firing crews. Missouri versus Yamato would have been rather interesting.

Thanks!

[22steve5150]

you are also wrong about yamato. it actually shot down some of the modern bombers attacking it, required far more damage than bismark to disable(swordfish torpedo couldnt disable rudder with one hit,yamato's armor far thicker and size far larger), and at 27 knots it was as fast as most other battleships

[thomasuras]

the yamato and the bismarck dident make it more than 7 days on the water , you can see why these countries were defeated

[angelicaboys]

AH it was a little obselete the plane but it got the job done Britain didn't have many good torpedo planes maybe the Fairey Battle but the Swordfish was the best of all Britains Torpedo planes

[Conroy1979]

i agree

[faireyswordfishmk1]

i love the fairey swordfish id say its the best torpedo bomber of ww2

[jonnybottle]

Everybody loves the Swordfish but the US and Japanese had better torpedo bombers. Admiral Halsey (I think) said to a British Admiral when he saw a British carrier with Swordfish and Fulmars that he loved the armoured flight deck but "with those planes, stay out of the Pacific!"

[loyndsy]

Ive flown with Jock and he's still the daddy

[jdunn58]

I met John Moffett a couple of years ago. I consider it one of the highlights of my life!