Canadian cf-18 Fighter Jets In Libya , Mission Footage

[AwfTHENormal]

i was hoping youd use them.. .

[1988scottcarey]

Canada need to buy hovercrafts for the arctic, i'd gladly go up there just make sure a tim hortons is around.

[docatomics]

...and this is how my tax dollar is spent

~no more taxable income from this gaping tax hole

+I do not fund unwarranted murder and wealth conversion appears nowhere on any warrant that carries my authority or consent, I am not culpable for these war crimes and will not be paying the war reparations that have ruined Canada's future and hesionized our Peace Keepers intent when they signed on.

=STOP STEVEN HARPER !

[BostonCreamDonut]

@docatomics A country with the sheer geographical size as Canada needs to have a military capable of defending it, with interest in Canada`s arctic it was a great idea to start building 7 or 8 new ice breaking ships that are armed with helipads, along with a deep sea port. Canada now has capabilities who enters our Canadian arctic waters as opposed to letting any ship stroll through.

[MegaWolfgang]

@docatomics Stop left wing cheese dicks like you from keeping Canada weak and sitting at the kiddie table with Iceland. Grow up, its a nasty world out there, and the country does not need self deluded, head in the sand, I surrender types like you.

[PteMcElroy]

@docatomics nice troop support you got there you do realize that we stopped the guy doing the war crimes don't you people like u can feel free to stand in front of our troop and not behind them...

[nakawick]

@docatomics

you are such an idiot.

[1988scottcarey]

Hell i even saw an american in our canadian rehab from san francisco lol

[1988scottcarey]

Canadian rehabs are like the holiday inn.

[1988scottcarey]

Canadian rehabs are better then American ones. You get meals all the coffee you want and snacks and get to see you're doctor and give you you're meds free of charge.

[diesel9696]

@PoooTeeWeet Are you an American or Canadian, If American then go to hell, if Canadian then you should be promoting and protecting the National Interest of Canada at all cost. The national interest of Canada is that we should make our own Jets, simple, so that we can sell it to other countries and generate revenues and create jobs.

[RESTxINxPIECEZ]

those planes are beautiful. its about time our military starts modernizing. we cant be the US's little brother forever.

[Blackbirdisms]

@RESTxINxPIECEZ Agreed, and it will give us the legs to stand on if we decide not to participate in US aggression we have no business being involved in.

[CoolKillerClan]

even if are army is less superior in number and equpment whe have better quality soldiers then the americans and that making us equel to the american army

[dave19941000]

Even though our fighert are not as advanced as those of the US, we still win the wargames, what does that tell you?

[vistarox]

@dave19941000 As a Canadian I find that really hard to believe. I know that our men and women are arguably the best trained in the world, but the Americans have far more advanced technology. And the RCAF is far smaller than the American's Air Force. May I ask where you got the information about the wargames.

BTW: no offence meant to the great people at the RCAF. They're amazing!

[dave19941000]

@vistarox I get my information right from the source (my brother is a pilot of the RCAF).

[killtheglobalists]

We could build our own again or under licence again if the govt. would allocate the startup and maintain R/D.You make the specialists sign a long term contract and you give them the resources and funding to keep them here.Why not keep the high tech jobs here.They have wasted so much money on other mothballed projects.We don't need to compete just maintain and produce aircraft for our own use.

[Rayl1499]

Boeing designed the CF-18 Boeing is based in the US

[diesel9696]

Canada must design her own fighter jets rather than buying from the US, as we have some of the finest and best scientists in the world.

[jadger1871]

@diesel9696 We don't have the specialists or the production capability, it is a very high tech business that we are no longer capable of competing in

[diesel9696]

@jadger1871 My friend, where there is a will there is a way. Rather than buying F-35 from America, we should and we can design our own fighter jet.

[jadger1871]

@diesel9696 and it will be ready for test flights in 2225. A project to design and build this would cost more than our national GDP, and would mean creating a industry from the ground up, with no technical experience whatsoever

[diesel9696]

@jadger1871 If third world countries like China, India, and Pakistan can design it then why can't we?

[jadger1871]

@diesel9696 China and India are not third world, and they both have a GDP vastly larger than our own. our GDP is $1.3 trillion, India is 4.1 trillion, China 10.1 trillion... plus, they do not have the social programs that we do, so they have more money to spend on the military because it isn't being thrown into social programs like we are doing. And quite honestly, I would not trust my life with any of their military technology

[DJonX7]

@jadger1871 Wrong on both areas. Canada has a gdp of 1.7 trillion, with only 34,000,000 people estimate. India has a population of 1,000,000,000 people.

[jadger1871]

@DJonX7 How much do they spend on social programs compared to Canada? Look at healthcare for instance.

check out stats from WHO, highlights from 2006:

health exp as % of total gov't spending: C=17.9% I=3.4%

per capita exp on health care (USD): C=$2754 I=$8

total spent on healthcare as % of GDP: C=10% I=4.9%

where are you getting that 1.7 tril from?

2011 estimates:Canada $1.391 tril (10%=139.1b)

India: $4.469 tril (5%=$223.45b)

They spend less than double us a population 34 times our size

[jadger1871]

@jadger1871 point being, We spend a lot more on things than they do, so we do not have the amount of money available for defence spending that they do

[DJonX7]

@jadger1871 A huge country with such a gdp rate would only mean poor people living.

[jadger1871]

@DJonX7 so lots of people looking for a military job... And it means they can spend more on military expenditures

[HeadSHOT604]

@DJonX7 Are you comparing Canada and India....because it's a stupid thing to do. Canada is a developed nations with tons of natural resources and money and India is a developing nations with little natural resources....

[hawker800FO]

@HeadSHOT604 read back man

[Toronto324]

@diesel9696 Improve

An American minister of Air defense told John Diefenbaker that planes are old and missiles are the new thing, so JD listened to him and canceled the Avro Arrow and laid off all the people who were working on the world's fastest plane...little did he know over 250 of those people went to the United States and joined a group which is now known today as NASA.

[MoreBankrBailoutsPLZ]

@Toronto324 Diefenbaker was worthless sack of shit,I spit every time I say the name.Back stabbed our aerospace industry for ever.

[diesel9696]

@Toronto324 True, but we must invest heavily on our defense technology to protect Canada from foreign aggressors. We have lots of clean water, who knows USA might be interested in that!!!

[chukufan1]

Are this Canadian made jets or US ?.. Anybody know..

[davenielsen78]

@chukufan1 Designed and built in the U.S.  As far as I know Canada hasn't designed and built an aircraft since the Avro Arrow.

[ChampionStuff]

@davenielsen78 yeah if it wasn't for Americans shutting them down for the simple fact of jealousy.

[po1gabboxing]

@chukufan1 USA use the same as canadians.

[chunkypoms69]

Canada stands up for the rights of human beings because thats what our people believe in. When a tyrant oversteps his boundries, I like to believe that our country will step in and cease the innocent slaughter of countless lives. The world needs a country that respects the human race, our beautiful earth, and a peace that will unify the world. Canada introduced peace-keeping to the world and I hope we can lead this domain into the future.

[Animurh]

@chunkypoms69 except we bow down to our masters in America and kiss their boot

[Riles07]

I love how the NDP campaigned against Harper for spending too much on planes and had silly depictions of him flying around in a paper mache jet LOL.

Meanwhile the Canadian citizenry thought "Jet planes, Harper sounds pretty fucking cool actually."

[Toronto324]

@hitzspelger 6 Jets were sent.

[limky1]

All u people who say f this f that. Need to thing u only say that cuz u know men and women are risking there lives so u can sit at home and go to work and eat twinkies or what ever. Yes it would be great to live in a world where armed men and women aren't needed but it's time to wake the fuk up the world isn't all fields of flowers and Cotten candy and skies filled with rainbows. And like one of the other guys that commented before there ganna spend the same amount flying mission or training it

[acupoflego]

Its funny how people think this costs money. It doesnt really cost that much. The planes fly when there at home the soliders get paid when there at home, the bombs are used before the expiration date at home. So when its all said and done 75% of the total cost of being there would be burnt up at home.

[Jasmo74]

That is shame instead of spending money on stupid war they shoud invest money in a crumbling infrastructure ,lower rent prices ,cheaper day cares

[GanknBank]

@Jasmo74 or you could just get a job

[Jasmo74]

@GanknBank

I know you need somebody to think instead of you

[GanknBank]

@Jasmo74 or you dont understand the importance of the Libya economy on the rest of the world, its cool tho! have fun bro

[Ibntomort]

fuk canada fuk usa fuk nato son of the bitches fuk you all mother fukers

[nateextreme0969]

@Ibntomort and your country is any better..............

[XA789]

@Ibntomort Fuck you asshole for not providing any reasons to hate us proud Canadians, so until you find a brain go suck a dick jackass.

[Ibntomort]

@XA789 bastard you canadian have oil and wealth already why you need the libyan oil why you attackedlibya for oil bastards thieves why you son of the bitches if i saw a candian i would spit on his face

[XA789]

@Ibntomort Well first of all. thank you for replying to providing me reasons to base your arguments on. Now let me see if I can debunk some of those. I absolutely do not support my own country being part of the strike group to attack first. We did not attack Libya for oil, we attacked for freedom of the Libyan people and because of our friendship with the U.S. As for the fact that we have wealth and we are rich...well we just experienced thing called the recession and are now pretty screwed.

[walperstyle]

@XA789 The 'recession' didn't hit us that hard due to the fact that Canada has so many resources already, and such a small population. Truth is, NATO really wanted to know it had full support of the Libyan people before it went into a Combat situation.  It was also great timing being NATO has a military presence. It saved the taxpayer a lot of money being we were already there.

[XA789]

@walperstyle I suppose but it sucks because secularly this is such a bad decade, no new tech means the futures not terrific.

[walperstyle]

@XA789 can you elaborate? Are you in the service?

[XA789]

@walperstyle No new technologies as in the service, new tech as in general life that can be mass-produced to jump-start the economy. In the Great Depression, there was the birth of the T.V., Radio many other technologies to come. In the 1990s, there was the Internet. Right now, it seems we are starting to reach the end of the technology profitability spectrum as the developments are incremental or experimental...even then the technology business is mostly monopolized by China and Japan.

[o0BFBC20o]

@Ibntomort Hahahahahah really? You think Canada went to Libya for oil? You hypocrytical stupid American. You live in the most oil hungry country in th world. The Canadian Military flew missions in Libya to help overthrow a man who has been making life hell there for years. We peacekeep. You go to war for oil.

[1988scottcarey]

Canada was in the iraq war, Walter Natynczyk was 2nd in command of the American III Corps between 2004-2005.. To put it in short a canadian was 2nd in Command of 35 000 american soldiers.

[gloryglorybarcelona]

@1988scottcarey - no way, really? what a huge accolade for him, and for Canada

[snatchhog]

canada should ramp up their military like harper suggests

[RoudyRaccoon]

@snatchhog We already are, plans are to increase active forces to 70,000 and reserves to 50,000.

As well as the production of more warships, tanks, new LAV's and the F-36's coming soon.

[TheCORE87]

@RoudyRaccoon

You meant to say F-35's

And yeah replacing roughly 100 CF-18's with 65 SINGLE-engined F-35's I don't think is very smart.

And about those warships, yeah they've been on hold for years (and still are) no contracts have been signed still.

I think Harper is just speaking out of his arse (as always) and just has his head too far up the American's crap-holes...

[nateextreme0969]

@TheCORE87 didnt halifax not just get a contract to build naval vessels yesterday

[TheCORE87]

@nateextreme0969

I'm not sure, do you have any articles/facts to prove this??

Because from my knowledge all Harper has been caring about is his precious 16 billion dollar F-35 money hole.

We can barely afford to upgrade our army, where is the money for multi billion dollar ships going to come from?

[o0BFBC20o]

@TheCORE87 The CF-35's are replacing our aging Cf-18's. We do need them. If not right now. I think Harper could have waited. We are upgrading every single LAV and IFV in the Canadian Military at a cost of billions of dollars too. Our money isnt all going to the Air Force.

[TheCORE87]

@o0BFBC20o

Our military budget is roughly 21 billion per year.

16 billion of that is going toward our CF-35's...

You do the math wheres the vast majority of the funding going??

(And now apparently that pricetag will be increased as well).

[walperstyle]

@TheCORE87 It goes to the people working in the Military. Believe it or not, the Canadian Military pays its personal very well compared with our neighbor down south. There is a lot of tradespeople in our Military. Whenever you immobilize any military, the cost goes up even more due to transportation costs. There is no hidden agenda with the Canadian Military. Also, unlike the US, we look out for our returning vets and families. Pensions and healthcare.

[TheCORE87]

@walperstyle

Only the higher ranking personnel get well payed (such as officers) if you're anything less, (infantry) expect anything from minimum to a little over (pending on rank) but it's not much...

[walperstyle]

@TheCORE87 Such as any job, but last time I checked, we don't have Infantry in Libya. Those that are in Afghanistan are making good money. My friends wife is getting looked after real well. If you are interested, you can see the pay scale on the Forces dot CA website.

[TheCORE87]

@walperstyle

I wasn't talking about Libya i'm talking about the army as a whole... *face slap*

And I just checked the pay scales, and like I said officers and above get paid more others get paid average but what they have listed is before deductions so...

[walperstyle]

@TheCORE87 so where are you going with this conversation? Its ok to admit you got lost and don't have a point anymore.

[TheCORE87]

@walperstyle

How did I lose?

I just told you that regular forces get low pay, and I was right.

You're the one who's trying to drive the conversation in a different direction because you know i'm right.

But anyways whatever beleive what you want, apparently actually serving in the army (like myself) gives me absolutely no knowledge of army pay...

[walperstyle]

@TheCORE87 Once again, you are lost. I never said you lose. Best of luck on your random internet talking, it may work with the younger people out there. Seeing what else you post on youtube really doesn't showoff your ability to sound intelligent.

[TheCORE87]

@walperstyle

I know I didn't say that you said "I lost"

But you were implying it weren't you??

Anyways my point remains... next.

[walperstyle]

@TheCORE87 And what was that point again? 

[lekoucha]

I dont think its in Libya. The landscapes in in the background of the jets show that its in some european country ( Lybia is a desert )

[GreatWhiteNorth82]

@lekoucha You're correct. This is in Italy. The CF-18s refuel in air on way to Libya.

[lekoucha]

@GreatWhiteNorth82 But if its a video footage of canadian govt , i don't trust them pretty much ... I mean ,how many canadian air fighters took part in Libya's mission ? With the Kaddafi's regime ready to crumble, everybody praises the US , france and UK for the job but they never talk about canada ! how deep is canada involved in that war ? seems like they play secondary role ...

[GreatWhiteNorth82]

@lekoucha The Commander of the entire mission in Libya is Canadian General Charles Bouchard. Research it. You can watch his daily briefings on NATO.com.

So, not only is the entire mission under Canadian command, our 7 CF-18s that are there, are the go-to planes/pilots when the job needs to get done.

Why the secrecy behind Canada's involvement? That's how we roll!

[lekoucha]

@GreatWhiteNorth82 But you shouldnt keep it secret ! i mean if you were highly involved in the mission's success you should be proud of it ! why always let the US and the french (dumbass arrogant people !) earn all congrats and canada hides behind em ? it doesnt make any sense to me ; may be you could gimme suggestions ....

[GreatWhiteNorth82]

You should also research the CF-18. The advanced avionics and infrared pods are the best in the world. The CF-18s and their pilots, are hands down the best non stealth night bombers in the campaign.

Today, 7 CF-18s can do what it would have taken 30 CF-18s to do in 1990. Also, Canada has a CP-140 Aurora Maritime patrol plane there, and a few Airbus CC-150 refuel tankers.

[GunsOfThePhoenix]

@lekoucha Its Italy, its where the Canadian planes are stored and repaired before they go into combat.

[PanzerBlitz43]

@The Canada's a terrorist state with a Bush clone as dictator..govt controlled socialist slimebags who worship hordes of immoral welfare sucking "ministers" Harper's a global arms dealer, a criminal warmonger and global environment destroyer. Canada loves slaughtering Afghan children, why is nobody surprised they bomb Libyans. Harper even flew personally to Europe to beg them to let him massacre millions of seals in his favorite cruelty bloodbath, but they all told that little roach to piss off.

[ATGOD]

@PanzerBlitz43 there's no such thing as terrorist dumbass >.>

[mcmladenmilic1]

ignorance is the most expensive in all of this. The West was transformed into sadistic. it's sad on our west part!

[beautyinbreakdowns2]

@thenorthernwolf117. How many people want to get into Russia and how many want to get into the USA? There is no contest. This is the most objective test of a country's quality. The USA wins hands down.

[yurikomuro]

proud to be Canadian and proud of brave Canadian pilots risking their necks for world peace. Take that Ghadaffi!

[PanzerBlitz43]

@yurikomuro If you're "proud to be canadian" then you're proud to be a child murderer and a terrorist. That's about as "proud" as Canadians get.. bunch of immoral slimebags. not surprised you have a japanese name, you're proudly proud of kiling milions in WWII as well.

[yurikomuro]

@PanzerBlitz43 your just jealous fag

[ATGOD]

@yurikomuro he has to be jealous or... just trolling because he's the immoral one since he is being a hypocrite

[GreatWhiteNorth82]

@PanzerBlitz43 I'm proud to be Canadian, liberators of two world wars, South Korea, Gulf war, Afghanistan, Libya and keepers of the peace in another dozen countries.

[PanzerBlitz43]

@GreatWhiteNorth82 sorry to inform you but there's no such thing as "war" in the Gulf, Afghanistan, or Libya in any sense of the word"war", it's just a street gang of stupid mercenaries illegally invading neighborhoods, murdering children and families, and pillaging for their criminal corporate and government masters. The gang you're so "proud of"  shouldn't even be called mercenaries, since they work for criminals and terrorists.

[GreatWhiteNorth82]

@PanzerBlitz43 Tell that to the women and children of Afghanistan that now have clean water, electricity and schools to go to in the morning. 

There is good that comes of war. History proves that.

[PanzerBlitz43]

@GreatWhite BS they were destroyed. The did not supply the world with 97% of its opium, they did not have massive poverty & mass imprisonment with midnight raids before alien mercs became their worst nightmare, bringing them terrorist contractors, enslaving them with warlords & a fake puppet goverment, and murdering 100,000 of them with an equal number maimed. They have that now thanks to you slimebags. A couple of shoddy "schools" from rip off criminal contractors doesn't cut it for Afghans.

[PanzerBlitz43]

@GreatWhiteNorth82 Oh yes and war has been previously defined as armies fighting armies. This is NOT "war" it's just pillage.. illegal occupation and murder of women and chldren. It's straight up crime. That's because the US has no military whatsoever it just recruits street gangs. Today's US/NATO mercs illegally invade neighborhoods, illegally bomb and occupy homes, murder and pillage. US/NATO are the world's top terrorists.

[GreatWhiteNorth82]

@PanzerBlitz43 You have a lot to say, but fail to back any of it up with fact. Which laws have been broken? That's what I thought...

Both the Afghan and Libyan missions were sanctioned by the United Nations. Iraq was not.  Canada was not in Iraq.

[PanzerBlitz43]

@GreatWhiteNorth82 you say "United Nations" like that excuses everything and everyone's going to believe the UN is not a groveling lackey of western terrorist governments. "United Nations" doesn't make western terror legitimate.

[wingacrazy19]

@GreatWhiteNorth82 actually Canada's air force was in Iraq for a short time

[KosaiAvonej]

Canada fights not for itself but for the prosperity and continuity of the world, we remain ever vigilant for the call to duty when peace is threatened in the balance. We fight not only for our freedom but yours as well, that is how it always has been and how it shall be.

[99cacahuate]

@KosaiAvonej the white race is the cancer of the world.......

[RoudyRaccoon]

@99cacahuate Problem officer?

[usig00]

@RoudyRaccoon Best video game, ever!

[TheNorthernWolf117]

@KosaiAvonej We have no right to put our noses in these country's business. But hey,you guys can go die for the oil industry,because if America really cared about the world,everybody would be safe! Not just the countries with riches.

[XSAPaladin]

@TheNorthernWolf117 Dude its the way the world works deal with it. We are helping libya out because it is for the interest of the western world, on a plus side we are saving lives. If you cant deal with that then get the fuck out of the western side and go live in libya, pakistan, saudi arabia, etc. where people will chop off your balls for saying something wrong.

[TheNorthernWolf117]

@XSAPaladin That made no sense... But I'm sure they'd kidnap you,and chop your balls off,because they already said they don't need our help. Oil is the interest of America.

[XSAPaladin]

@TheNorthernWolf117 First of all, France and Britain are leading the campaign in libya. US and Canada are playing supporting roles. Secondly who is "they"? Libyan Government was Do you even know where the majority of Oil in libya goes to? I'll give you a hint, its in Europe. NATO is fulfilling a UN mandate by intervening in Libya. You can not deny that Gaddafi was performing crimes against humanity by shooting protestors, our actions in Libya, while out of self interest, are still saving lives

[TheNorthernWolf117]

@XSAPaladin I can give a long list of problems with the USA & the UK,but nobody ever wants to invade them for it,and unlawful killings involving American Forces happened many times.

[XSAPaladin]

@TheNorthernWolf117 I can give you an even longer list of atrocities committed by Russia, China and many other countries around the world. At the end of the day Self interest is always going to be the primary motivation for all countries, the difference is NATO will conduct their missions with some semblance of honor and logic. Unlike China who will run over their own civilians with T64 tanks.

[PanzerBlitz43]

@Xdin "honor and logic"? haha How can you even say those words and not choke on your own vomit? NATO and its gang members the CIA & Pentagon are the TOP terrorist nations in world, constantly attacking humanity with mass murders of millions for their own putrid greed. Canada's part of that dirty terrorist group. The Axis of World Terror includes Harper, Sarkozy, Cameron and ObamaOsama the clown, and your terrorists are the worst evil the world has seen since Adolf Hitler and Stalin, bar none.

[XSAPaladin]

@PanzerBlitz43 If ya feel so strongly against Nato and the west why dont you move to China and see how it works out for you there. You dont know shit about greed and terror, Nato doesnt run its own civilians over with T64 Tanks and they have these things called Laws, every country fucks up but Nato is at least held accountable to some degree. Wtf do you think China is doing in Sudan?

[ATGOD]

@PanzerBlitz43 Nice trolling.

[XSAPaladin]

@TheNorthernWolf117 Name me a country that does not conduct its actions out of self interest? Your taking a shot at America and NATO while countries like Russia and China do the same shit but with absolutely no regard for human life.

[TheNorthernWolf117]

@XSAPaladin Russia values peace more than America does,you don't see Russia invading countries anymore,the Russians don't nuke Japan,and kill tens of thousands either,America has killed several Million non-combatants [which is all of the wars combined],nothing Russia has done is as wrong as that. China on the other hand can live however they choose.

[XSAPaladin]

@TheNorthernWolf117 Russia Doesnt need to nuke japan, they basically nuked there own people in chernobyl.

[mcleanartists]

It would be an honour to smoke Qaddafi.

[BaconTV123]

this is what i think we should do...Keep all the CF-18, get some F-35s and buy some attack helicopters or build one cause its kinda sad how we have to use the Griffon as a transport/attack helo

[casselsa66]

@BaconTV123 Definitely agree with you - all these hippies who think that all violence in the world will end if Canada gets rid of our military aircraft. Hmm newsflash: there are many countries in the world which have nuclear weapons which could fall into the wrong hands and the West needs a strong force to stop this from happening

[bigdaddy101c]

@BaconTV123 

[shinnyshoes1]

I don't share your opinion. I have no fear, so I can not be a coward. "freedom" was not the display we Canadian's put on in Toronto last summer, nor is it what we have brought to the other parts of the world, in recent times.. To help you perhaps understand; look at how we have "helped" Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia, this list is long. Good day sir.

[sutton123454]

@shinnyshoes1 Sleep and Fight in the trenches of Somme, Vimy Ridge and Passchendaele, Step on the shores of Normandy, The beaches of the pacific war, maybe the jungle's of vietnam, Sands of Afghanistan... p.s we were not in Iraq.... You think you know anything about war when you think us canadian's were in iraq? please....

[GreatWhiteNorth82]

@sutton123454 You are correct about Vietnam. Upwards of 25 000 Canadians volunteered in the US Army to fight in Vietnam. All the while, aprox the same amount of Americans fled the US to seek refuge in Canada.

As for Iraq... Canadian General Walter Natynczyk not only helped plan the initial invasion, he was the commander of 35 000 Marines in Iraq. The US turns to Canada when the job needs to get done. We've been "renting" out officers for years.

[shinnyshoes1]

@shinnyshoes1 You weak minded people; Stop being followers. Become leaders! teach our children, not brain wash them that what we have done in the past is right. We need change. It is insane to think continuing on this path is going to bring peace or salvation.. BTW you have no idea what I know, have done or truly stand for. Don't do it for me I already for give you!

[shinnyshoes1]

I don't share your opinion. I have no fear, so I can not be a coward. "freedom" was not the display we Canadian's put on in Toronto last summer, nor is it what we have brought to the other parts of the world, in recent times.. To help youperhaps understand; look at how we have "helped" Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia, this list is long. Good day sir.

[MrBudlightrocks]

@shinnyshoes1 We are not involved in Iraq. Have you been to Afghanistan?? Do you know what good we have done there?? Do remember why we are there?? As for Somalia the UN pulled out in the 90's. Toronto last summer....lol If freaks did not protest country's meeting and getting along then there would be no need to have crazy security. Look at France G8 this week protesters can not get with in 40 km, and no protests where they can reach.

[Guardius9r]

Finally after 35 years these (then 32 million dollar) planes finally are used in action since the War in Yugo. These birds are getting really old, soon they will be like our F104 "widow-makers" crashing and killing skilled pilots. The great Canadian tradition of using equipment beyond useful life and getting our service persons killed! Thank goodness the F35A's WILL be bought. Now we need to replace the Seakings ASAP as they are 40+ yrs old. Quite disgraceful to make our personnel fly deathtraps

[TacairStationHQ]

@Guardius9r

Sir, Canada does NOT need $180m F-35A to perform this mission requirement! After the week-one action is completed, Canada can flow in with even more cost-effective next-gen alternatives for the CF-18. Far more cost-effective. Like 2-for-1 cost-effective. Think about it.

And good thing you brought up the point about skilled Canadian pilots ejecting (and your horrific words, killed). The F-35A operational squadron-level IOC date will push WAY OUT the date CF-18 pilots fly.

[Guardius9r]

@TacairStationHQ I was not thinking in such short sighted terms my friend. The CF18A can do this job and so could just about any other cheap obsolete plane with total air superiority cover! No, I mentioned the F35A's only to point out they WILL be bought (fact) to eventually replace an already aging fleet of F18A's to meet Canada's requirement for a replacement. The debate about the plane is now mute, the Conservative majority will insure they ARE bought. I'm sure will lose more pilots til then.

[TacairStationHQ]

@Guardius9r I'm actually a conservative myself so the whole political aspect of this issue is irrelevant to me. But no, the CAF F-35A is NOT a done deal you can mark those words. The actual total Procurement costs and initial front-end investments required will very soon shock the expert policymakers. It's simply not an affordable aircraft and as such it's a flawed acquisition model. Better for CAF to make a short stopgap Lease deal and perhaps then buy mature, proven block V F-35A in 2022.

[Guardius9r]

@TacairStationHQ Well we're in agreement then, CF35A by 2016-22 :) Still going to be bought and Peter even said the exorbenant costs out there are for the Marine F35B Variant. IOW they are commtted to buying it. Facts:Majority Conservative Govt = CF35A . They have repeatadly told us its the plane. Thus the political aspect is the most relevent issue on the whole thing! Cost is the irrelavant issue as it has been repeatadly downplayed and/or dismissed by the Govt. That's all, its political.

[TacairStationHQ]

I'm actually not really in agreement with your pre-conceived assumptions, other than I will support a 'possible' FY22 buy order for a mature, proven, block 5 F-35A aircraft as long as it's fully evaluated and assessed to be cost-effective by then. That's a slight difference compared to your 'balls out, go nuts, fantasy dream procurement scheme no matter what' mentality.

So CAF should begin studying a 7-10 yr strategic stopgap Lease plan, as an offset to today's unsustainable b.s. plan.

[Guardius9r]

@TacairStationHQ You seem to be misunderstanding me. I'm not debating with you or anyone. I am not offering opinion or conceiving assumptions. I am repeating what the Government has been telling everyone since day one. The Government is going to buy the CF35A, read the statements from Harper, MacKay etc. They have been quite firm (as always) against all comers that we are buying it. That's the only relevancy here, the political determination is CF35A, period. Its not my opinion, its theirs!

[TacairStationHQ]

I will fully concur on that point that it's the CURRENT opinion and viewpoint of Govt that CF-35A will be procured to replace CF-18s. But that's a slight difference to actual end-game replacement policy decisions which are still up for modification and change. On that note, it's the opinion and assessment of many observers that CF-18 should in fact instead be replaced via a more sustainable, alternative plan - one which is more timely. The F-35 policy will shift soon given new factors...

[shinnyshoes1]

This is Harper's Military & the UN's. I don't think most Canadian want to have anything to do with these wars anymore...

[Guardius9r]

@shinnyshoes1 Harper's Military? haha..no they are Her Majesties Military! Everyone in Canada's military swears allegiance the the Queen, her heirs and descendants, definitely not Harper. Canada and most Canadians have traditionally supported the UN since Liberal PM Person initiated Peace Keeping! All parties in Canada voted in Parliament to support the War in Libya; so apparently these are Canada's Military performing at the behest of Parliament , who represent the people of Canada :)

[shinnyshoes1]

@Guardius9r Your points have merit; not sure about the representing the people of Canada thou..

[MrBudlightrocks]

@shinnyshoes1 So because you are a coward, Canada should not get involved?We should sit back and watch Gadafi murder his people?? Freedom is not free, peace has a price.

[shinnyshoes1]

@MrBudlightrocks in no way is coward part of this. Sorry guy; back to your budlights.

[MrBudlightrocks]

@shinnyshoes1 ??? Really ? Doing nothing to stop what Gadiafi is doing is cowardice. The old saying," evil triumphs when good men do nothing". The Arab Spring freedom wave should be supported by the west. So I will put on my Cadpad each day knowing that Canada stands for freedom. Drink to that.