Dude, I just stumble onto you tonight. And you are so on the money!!! The University system is a rip off. The four universities teach you how to think about doing something. And the community colleges teach you how to do something. I'm also with you on being through with America too. I've been thinking about joining the Peace Corp and getting out of the country at the governments expense and getting most of my student loans forgiven. The USA sucks these days! Peace to you, brother!
Been in a Community College for 6 years now. I have constantly been changing majors which has kept me there. But I must admit, unlike a lot of my friends who went to universities, I have actually learned a ton and have really good idea of what I want to do now.
I'm an education / career / life coach and adjunct professor working at death camps trying to get this message out. lol You are to the greatest degree, right on. The reason most never see this is because most are never taught to think independently, critically, intuitively. Hell, most are never taught to think, period. Because if they did the whole system would break down and profit fail. I teach from the perspective of what do the most need, most of the time, in most situations. REALITY! Peace!
In the vast majority of cases, education itself is stratified according to socioeconomic class. The real conceptual foundation of things is being taught behind the doors of elite prep schools and academies, and those proper foundations then get built upon in college, after taking whirlwind prep school refresher courses called "introductory" courses.
...And, of course, the rest of the freshmen are never told that they're up against prep school-educated kids in their class.
@silvermaniamania You should either drop out or change tracks. But you can study sociology even better by picking up cheaper books at a bookstore, library sale, or other places. Don't pay tuition prices to learn sociology.
I agree - the idea that alumni networks will help you find a job - not really. I don't think the university degree will make you more money than a community college if you can get real world experience. I think the first rule to success in work and making money is just to show up and try your best. The second rule to having success in work and ultimately making money is to learn how to be flexible and put up with a lot of crap day in and day. A university degree can not shield anyone from that.
I think I know what you mean by this -- that there is very no "science" in computer science. It's not like computer engineering -- it's mostly just programming and understanding the broad organization of computer and operating system architecture, but nothing to do with the physics and electronics of the thing.
If I were going to major in computer science, which is mostly oriented toward programming (which I despise), I would major in computer engineering instead, which is mostly oriented toward computer circuitry design, with a lesser emphasis on programming. That is much more interesting to me.
@kalijasin If you are going the computer science route stick to a concentration in Science's, I have many friends with BA's in computer sci(btw computer science is a bit of an oxymoron) and they have been unemployed over a year. Shit even people with a BS in computer sci are having a extremely hard time finding employment. Not trying to scare you, but the IT, and Computer field is one of networking(I know first hand) you need yo know some, before the hr's even look at your resume.
True -- but then if you become a doctor nowadays, you're mostly a shill for the petro-pharmaceutical industry, unless you become some kind of surgeon.
@TheLogicJunkie Well, i'm making something of my life and undergrad college is just a stepping stone towards that. I'm not going to sit around on youtube all day, like some, and complain about college being meaningless when in reality its not.
For a select group of people, college does pay off -- if they're amongst the selected. Because if you're not among the selected, you can bust your ass all day long and no matter how much you seek out guidance and mentorship, people will avoid you and play dumb, posturing that they "know nothing".
But congratulations to you on being lucky enough to be met halfway in your efforts. And may I also commend you on your giant wooden horse-building skills. You snuck your attack right in.
@kalijasin You're just selfish, make something of your life, even at the expense of others? The only real wealth is free time to spend on yourself, and thus college makes you poor :) Hare Krisna.
What about if I got my degree in political science or economics? Because i'm by far not a science person I already know that i'm more of a english / history person.
I'm not so sure about political science, but economics is a better major, I hear. Also, from what I've read, the future of political science lies in what Bruce Bueno de Mesquita is doing up at NYU. You should watch him on YouTube, and read his book "Predictioneering".
@TheLogicJunkie hmm I see. i'll look into that my ultimate goal is to become a lawyer but i've heard a lot of stuff how the law is corrupt now and the debt obviously becomes impossible to pay. I've never been interested into any career because of the slary i truly want to see justice served.
If you want to go anywhere in the sciences and research and technology (not just engineering), you need to go to college, because chances are you will be working at universities, which are the places where this stuff is researched. Professors suck as teachers, true, but there's a lot more to college than the "scam" supporters would have you believe.
Also, yeah...going community college route is definitely not bad.
@vector702 I think that college is particularly good for pursuing majors that require specialty equipment to study the subject. So, yes, we're talking about engineering, computer science, physics, and a lot of things like that, which are especially technology-dependent.
I am passionate about photography but clearly there is no financial security in it for me right now. I've chosen something practical to major and would like to one day run my own business, while making time for my true passion. The "do-what-you-love" mentality deters young students from thinking rationally and this is how we end up with a generation of useless majors and looming debts.
Well, there's no reason that you couldn't major in something immediately needed, like accounting, and then minor in photography, just so that you're around people you actually like and aren't going insane. But with that said, even accounting is very spiritual and philosophical, if you just make an effort to approach it from that aspect of it.
I think that the mantra "Do what you love" is pure poison. I think that "Do what needs doing" is much better for everyone.
@TheLogicJunkie I agree. I'm actually an Accounting major at the moment and find certain tasks repetitive but challenging nonetheless. I think everyone should learn a trade, regardless of their true passion. It helps put food on the table without you going completely insane from being in a cubicle so long. Haha!
@NinaLuxful Awesome! AND I do hope you're learning DATABASE accounting methods AND the IASB international accounting standards -- not just GAAP, because GAAP is already being phased out here in America.
@luvtwinkie1993 No, but just be aware that there may very well be a nursing glut going on. Before you get into nursing or any field, always talk to people in the field and see what they have to say about it, and the future of the field.
The only reason the education degree leads to jobs is that the education industry uses them as a barrier to entry. It's not that the degree really educates you.
As for engineering, true this is the most useful degree. However, most of the material is overkill for what the typical engineer does.
Business classes are also not particularly useful. It's mostly the usual academic pontification about business.
Bottom line is, college is for college professors.
only if you're going for the sole expectation of making bank as soon as you graduate. You get out what you put in. Yes its cold and hard and no one holds my hand like in high school and community colleges, but I've decided that I'm gonna beat the game and get my degree in Biology and Japanese. Imma rise to their challenge. I know that universities are just research institutions funded by making education a business, but I have scholarships (through hard work ppl), and won't be in debt.
Community colleges are a much better deal. I agree completely with this. The curriculum at the elite schools was established originally for the idle rich. Art, Political Science. None of that helps you in the working world. I'm not sure it even helps you with art or political science since the academic approach is so cold and narrow.
Agreed also that alumni networks are a sham. At best they are a fundraising device. Job centers at universities are also a sham.
I agree with alot of what you have to say about college. I have a Bacchelors in Communication and a Masters in Social Work. Yet, both does not mean anything. It is always I have no experience. I don't fit. I just feel that I have wasted 7 years of my life.
Well, not to be cruel, but maybe -- maybe -- you could improve your career chances by developing your writing and spelling a bit better. Because whoever let you get through all the college you say you've had, without challenging your writing and spelling, did you an enormous disservice by not holding up your writing abilities to the harsh light of day. You're not a son of George HW Bush, after all.
Get mad as hell if you want to, but that's the truth.
@TheLogicJunkie I'm not mad or anything. Just out of curiosity, what led you to believe that my writing and spelling wasn't challenged? Nevertheless thanks for the advice.
@Topg1 Well, now it's completely different. Now it's like you actually asked someone else to sit down at the keyboard and type for you -- it's that different.
I go with what I'm shown... you gotta meet me halfway here.
Community colleges are cost effective and overall cheaper. 3-4k tuition versus 10k saves you easily 12k in tuition and more if you live with your parents.
Universities have huge classrooms (lecture halls) where professors barely know your name. This is another reason and probably the most dominate reason why people can't learn as well in that environment.
Hey LogicJunkie, what do you think about technical schools? Is that another option that you would advise people to look at because it seems that having skills in a particular field is the best way to go. Being my third year now at a 4 year instituion, I am in the process of transfering to a community colege because my experience as an undergraduate has been nothing but diaster. However, technical schools is another thing to look at.
@b45100 Well, of course I would recommend technical schools -- but NOT necessarily the private, hugely expensive ones... I think they're mostly diploma mills.
Remember, NO college necessarily gives a shit whether you live or die -- colleges primarily care about themselves, and keeping the money rolling in. YOU are the one who's going to have to pay back all those ram-shackle loans you're stuck with after you graduate -- NOT the colleges. After you graduate, they don't want to know you.
Well, but even with all that, from what I understand, the basic setup of the SAT is still the same: it has more sections, but the maximum score on the main sections is still 800. So the maximum score will basically be some multiple of 800...
@TheLogicJunkie Yes. The maximum score is now 2400. If the man you were referring to got a 1500 on the old SAT test, then I agree, that is very impressive. Most colleges don't care about the writing score, so they'll just ask you for your Critical Reading and Math scores (which add up to 1600).
Okay, but here's the thing: if you're showing up and doing well AND the assessments you're being given are basically comparable in difficulty to what they're giving at the big four-year universities, then all that's left to explain why it's all seeming so easy, is that the community colleges are probably using BETTER textbooks that explain things more simply and clearly, AND teachers who are boiling it down easier.
Truly GOOD teaching makes learning EASY. That's how it's SUPPOSED to be.
Hey TheLogicJunkie, this was an excellent video! I can appreciate your honesty as well as your advice. I have a question for you: what about majoring in economics, computer science, or nursing (I have a few friends that majored in these fields and are doing quite well)? I understand you can’t cover everything in a short video, but there are majors that apply to many jobs. Overall, you mentioned a goldmine of good advice for undecided students and you deserve a but thumbs up for your honesty.
Those are great choices, and another choice I would add to that list is majoring in engineering, with an emphasis on chemical, civil, computer, or mechanical/robotics.
Also, within economics, I would focus on behavioral economics and accounting. Also, computer-based banking and encryption authentication methods.
Possibly. But all too often you can't gauge what you brought in the first place, except by hindsight. You often discover your latent aptitudes through what you're able to learn and gain, once you're actually subjected to the challenge of having to learn something.
"Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forward."
@unabonger777 I moved back to the east coast, and I had to get a whole new computer and camera system, and everything is just out of whack now. But I'll do it again, probably real soon... But thanks for asking.
Well, purely on its surface, I'd say you'd be right. BUT, if he's of the predominant ethnicity AND good-looking AND tall AND loves to run with the crowd AND all that stuff, then that's what matters. That will get him in, regardless of his major. The major is just a formality and, I say even more cynically than that, a veneer -- albeit a powerfully convincing one at that.
..... of course. It's who you know and who you blow, as we say around here. And being good looking or beautiful sure helps. Our world is shallow and superficial, that won't change. Go with the flow ...
The only exception I'll give to what I just said is a tentative exception, and that is for majors like engineering and the extremely counterintuitive majors, where what is taught is very in-depth in terms of formal, quantitative methods and highly idiosyncratic procedures in general. Then you're going to need some truly controlled environment to internalize that stuff.
@cheeriosinabowl lol yeah whats up with all these useless degrees that colleges offer. like my brothers girlfriend has a Bachelors in african history from university of california, and she paid that shit off with credit cards and is in massive debt, with obvious unemployment. shit unless theirs black history month, every month, she obviously is wayy in the hole interms of employability.
Keep in mind that engineering is probably the hardest of all majors. That's why few take it, but if you want to learn about math/physics, I would suggest engineering. My hs physics teacher told us that the way that physics is taught in college is garbage.He b right! For example, physics profs never were told the difference between temperature and heat. Not once. In Engineering they told us what the difference was and how they worked. That's only one example of many....
As a mechanical engineering undergrad from Appalachia with a basic knowledge of Russian, coming from an underfunded public school which consistently failed NCLB testings, I have to say that everything you say is absolutely correct. If you said this in your other video, I would not have been nearly as malignant of a cunt. You should know going into college what you want to do, and know the risk and debt that you take on. Good show.
Well, I don't see how I would've said anything different in any of my other videos -- my stance is very simple: I don't think colleges ought to be admitting people who aren't objectively ready to meet the colleges' standards as to the level of difficulty that their introductory courses operate on.
...But the flip side of this position of mine is that if colleges ARE going to admit students who aren't objectively ready, then they must assume the task of putting them on a remediation track.
But the problem is that colleges want to have their cake and eat it, too -- they want to admit applicants who clearly, by any demonstrable standards such as the AP tests, aren't yet (if indeed they ever will be) at the prerequisite skill level to begin where college introductory courses begin. And then, after these students are admitted, they are basically ignored by the college advisory system and left to twist in the wind.
@TheLogicJunkie And if we're talking about a public un, then the cost of remediation must be much lower, imo. If that school admits students who don't meet that requirements, then its the responsibility of that uni to do the job but at a far lower price. Wont happen because those classes make a huge profit for the unis in that they generally throw a GTF/instructor who get paid nothing compared to any level prof, those students usually flunk and need to take the class over again.
what do you think of learning ultrasound/rad tech/nuc med?
I'm from Canada so healthcare is tightly regulated here with only a few schools that teach this.
I'm currently trying to upgrade my high school grades and apply to one of these programs.
Trying to go the community college (dipoma) route verse the degree route because I think colleges would do a better job teaching verse just weeding everyone out in sight.
Do you know when I've been the most successful in college? When I've already been studying the subject matter in my free time, before I've ever actually paid to take a class in a given thing. Why? Because 1) it demonstrates that I'm actually already comfortable with the core ideas, and 2) all college courses tend to be profoundly lousy in actually teaching any subject -- only high-quality prep schools and pre-college academies truly teach well in this country.
@mjustonestar Well, I agree with the "learn Chinese" part. But just as much as learning Chinese, it may be even better to learn German, because Germany is always really secretly pulling the strings -- including China's strings.
@hieristjetzt I don't know anything about the law, except that I had one cousin who started at Vanderbilt Law School and then withdraw out of disinterest and contempt, and another who graduated from Georgetown Law School and then started as an entertainment lawyer in LA, and then got out, too.
A friend of the family did graduate from law school, however, and has been a working real estate attorney for several years now. So I guess it depends on the legal field you go into.
@TheLogicJunkie Yes, the good thing about law is that you can go into very many different fields. You can also work for the government. A lot of the people who work there have a law degree. This is what I hear.
I have no degree yet but your video has influenced me quite a bit. I have never thought of becoming a lawyer but it is also a degree with a guaranteed job, just like a teacher or a doctor. I agree 100% that it's dumb to work for a degree without a specific job in mind. For what then???
@hieristjetzt I would only go to college if I had a specific degree in mind AND it was highly necessary AND required a set of skills that were hard (or somewhat unpleasant) to acquire.
@TheLogicJunkie Law doesn't fall into that category? I guess engineering and math definitely does, as you said. But frankly, I would suck at both. Law on the other hand is something I can wrap my head around. It's not really hard I would say. But it's still hard to get very good grades, I guess. There are a lot of lawyers in my country (germany) but only the best can choose their job. And there is a joke that some of them drive cabs. It's depressing if you add the minimum 7 years of education...
@hieristjetzt The thing about law is that it essentially is a field that, on paper, technically revolves around logic adeptness, but in reality all that is completely thrown out the window by the magic of the gavel. At some point the "magic of the gavel" (whereby a judge's tapping a gavel magically creates "truth") just exhausts your money supply and, past that point, unless a lawyer has some perversely personal reason for continuing to represent you, you're out of fuel and stalled.
@TheLogicJunkie I guess it all depends on what kind of law system you have. I find it interesting that there are so many differences between countries although practically all of the modern state laws base on kants philosophy, the a priori irrefutable value of any being AND on "honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere". These are just a couple of words, really. That's why the system depends highly on linguistics, semantics, philosophy etc. It's not exact but do we have a choice?
I am a 23 year old freshman at a University, YSU. At my school they encourage the students to get involved in their school career. Which means getting to know your teachers and staying on top of your grades. My english teacher encourage's me to come to him with any problem I have as far as the work. Im going right now for psychology because I changed my mind for years about what I wanted to do. Now I'm actually happy with my decision.
@uniqueasIam22 I say your personality test doesn't give a rat's ass about you. I say you study psychology in your own free time, and without all the childish torment from psychology professors at college tuition rates.
If you're into paying for abuse, pay somebody ten bucks to punch you in the face. But don't pay for a degree in psychology. College is bad enough as it is.
I think that everything you said about universities also applies to community colleges. I've heard community college admit to being gatekeepers, I've seen students blacklisted for their political views, and community college teachers state they don't care because they have tenure - I kid you not!
Unfortunately, lots of community colleges have the mentality to provide transferable degrees instead of providing a useful skill, and they want to be more, "competitive" by having a university model.
@td84 Yeah, you do have a point there. To a great degree, college is college -- even community college. But at least it's a lot harder for community college to overestimate itself than for universities. As a result, they tend to have more to prove on a day-to-day basis, I think.
@TheLogicJunkie Although I would like to agree with you, unfortunately to be recognized in the educational realm the college must be regionally accredited. On top of that, most of the programs that community colleges have, for example nursing require state level requirements and curriculum review. This means that the, "higher functioning level of society" are pulling the strings.
To me, at least where I live, it's the same thing as a university but just smaller and with a different name.
I gotta agree with you there - even comm. colleges are taking part in the college industrial complex. In the comm. college that I went to, almost all the people there are unfriendly, the professors are callous and discourages dissenting viewpoints, and the social worker spent the latter half of my three years strong-arming me into taking subjects that were irrelevant to my major. This is why I view comm. colleges and universities as little more than state-sponsored Ponzi schemes.
You may be more likely to get a job with an engineering degree but the programs are still quite bloated. For example, you don't need to study artificial intelligence or theory of algorithms to be a web programmer even though the typical program requires them. Even in the engineering programs, the schools get much more money out of you than is justified by educational goals.
@asianwomansl To a great degree, I do agree with you that schools are padding their curricula with all kinds of self-indulgent courses in esoterica, largely to pad their tuition revenues. But even so, I still think that knowledge of "future frontier" areas like artificial intelligence and theoretical underpinnings are essential to anyone who wishes to have real upward mobility within a company.
@TheLogicJunkie I've worked for 20 years in info technology. You don't need those things at all unless you work in Bell Labs and the like. The typical programmer loads and unloads databases all day long. Even the heads of IT at your standard corporation don't even mention artificial intelligence.
For what it's worth, I've read that economics majors have salaries not much below engineers, who on average have the highest salaries. Do a google search -- I'm sure the articles are there.
I went to a two year community college and and went to a private college. He is right I learned more from my community colleges professors plus I established a relationship with them more than a 4 year college.
College still sucks, one way or another they will screw you over and make you suffer. I'm a university student, and I'm so burnt out on the BS. I still want to get an associates of arts in business to potentially make a better name for myself. Honestly, I've started off with a community college and they screwed me worse than the university is doing now. A business degree should be good, because business will always be relevant in everyday life. However, the game is still rigged.
@kltiswhoib I believe you. Have you noticed how everything that professors teach is trite and dull and then they demand you memorize silly impractical details. And professors make absurd demands just to make themselves appear legitimate. The community college I went to had a lot of jerks running the show too.
@dutytocareforothers Correct, it seems like the goals of the professors is to slave you and force pointless details on you. Oh yeah, don't dare to have an opinion of your own. You're not supposed to. It's the kind of nonsense that you'll never benefit from or remember after 2.5-10 years of endless rhetoric. The few skills that you do learn are nearly pointless on a resume without real on-the-job experience. Ugh, I hate it so much and they have me trapped in at least 2 different ways now.
your so in debt. but your selling a book. impressive. i looked into what it costs to have a book made. i looked into it for 2 months. and a man in debt can not afford this. very impressive sham.
@nothadnotbad He can if he has family members who are willing to pay for it. And, incidentally, you couldn't make a single down payment on a small house with what I made off the book.
So much for your "very impressive sham". What else you got?
Wow...Logic Junkie....I must say that you have a razor sharp intellect to clearly see things as they are and approach the core of the problem on any given issue. And obviously you have balls of steel to speak out against college system so openly. So kudos to you.
I have a request for you. What are your views on pursuing Ph.D. (in any stream)? Do you think it is worth it? what, according to you are the employment opportunities, after a Ph.D. ? Could you post a video on that ?
@TheChromelover Well, thanks. And because I was actually in a PhD program for about a year, I'll say that I don't necessarily think it's a great thing because, even though you usually have it paid for you through fellowships and that sort of thing, the "publish or perish" life afterwards just doesn't impress me -- particularly with regard to salary -- UNLESS you've gotten to the point where you just want to hide away in somewhat safe obscurity. I, personally, would rather make money.
@TheChromelover Also, aside from not my not having the temperament for the cliqueish, effete, and venomously passive-aggressive world of academia, I also found the science arms of academia insanely depressing, as I have a problem with claustrophobia, recirculated air, and that sickly fluorescent lighting. I could never be in a sunless fucking lab all day, like a pasty, bug-eyed cave toad, as almost all of them are.
You hit the nail on the head. I felt the same. After my undergrad, I was accepted in a very good Graduate school program in Engineering as A PhD candidate. But after about a year or so in graduate school, I realized that PhD is an over-kill, not worth the effort and is not remunerative (don't get me wrong - I like research. But at the end of the day, I'd like to have a comfortable middle-class lifestyle). So I am walking out with a masters degree (graduation on this May 20).
There is a whole movement toward minimalist technology. Why? Because people are tired of being intimidated and beholden to "black box" technology that is completely beyond their capacity -- or anyone else's -- to truly fathom.
God I told my parents, literally told them in Neanderthal sylables - COMMUNITY COLLEGE BETTER... LESS OF RIP OFF... NOT A DEATH CAMP... - what do they do? they look up 2 colleges... 2 out of a billion, both of which are 4 years. I end up taking the tour of both, and choose one over the other because it has a pretty sweet gym - so what's the only thing i learned in college? Become independant and do whatever the hell you want.
So true. I enjoyed the community college much more than the university. The CC felt far more nurturing and the school work was much more fun and interesting. I never understood why all the hype was around the universities, which felt soulless and boring. So I wondered what I missed and why my experience didn't fit the cultural mythos.
Speaking from my personal domain, schools and colleges are a shell-game to defraud you for snake-oil. Schools and colleges do not contribute and waste time for others, how I got to be where I am with myself today was being autonomous. Schools and colleges are a wolf in sheep's clothing.
I have experienced charlatan's that claim to have college degrees in their domains, one was in being a "teacher". I call him a charlatan because he detracts from others and other red-herrings as well as telling others what they can and cannot do. He used euphemism's as well as other weasel words about what he claimed to be an expert in. It's all just underhanded and exploitative use of others.
Speaking of colleges, It reminds me of parasites and their domains of corruption. It's like a poison that is covert and very very exploitative by getting you to be a in box where they (the parasites) can just manipulate you and impoverish you till you are all that is used up to them.
A chemistry degree is great. It's the foundation for modern nanotechnology -- particularly with respect to materials engineering, which is HUGELY marketable.
@TheLogicJunkie Fuck yes. I've been looking to get into nanotechnology and I know this is what I want to do but I'm not sure what path to take. Any suggestions?
@gamersgene Do a web search for nanotechnology professional societies and college programs, and see what they recommend. I know of one at UC Santa Barbara, and one at Rice in Houston. But there are almost certainly others.
Also, nanotechnology basically centers around physical chemistry -- the overlap of physics and chemistry. So a degree in something like chemical or electrical engineering, or chemistry, or materials engineering, would probably be a good undergrad major.
21 year old college dropout here. Switched to a 2 year technical school and said screw-it to the 4-year plan. Now I easily earn 50K+ year in web. College is a scam in many cases; build on your skills, start a business, follow your real dreams. Live the life you want to live. If only more people knew.
You definitely made the right choice. And if you get a chance, pick up a copy of a new book called "Were You Born On the Wrong Continent?" by Tom Geoghegan. It explains why Europe -- and Germany in particular -- is doing things right, while America continues to keep doing the wrong thing with ever-increasing fervor. And how we do education is one of our biggest catastrophes.
@Thepiratejoe Awesome statements. We have disconnected from the virtue developing skills for practical living. Basic skills that benefit all people. Technical schools seem to focus on the practicality of things and make sure you truly understand what you doing and why you doing along with directly teaching you the 'skill'. Great move, bro.
With the advent of the most recent iPad2, there won't be much, if any, market for computer repairists any more. Focus on computer networking, security, and/or engineering the actual circuit designs. Also, programming with always be healthy.
Finally, consider robotics. That is the newest, most emergent field.
@xXSgofyyahXx That's a pretty decent plan -- as good as any I've heard. And if you can do it, try to also work in some accounting and finance courses. If you can get into computerized banking, that would be great.
There is will be amarket for computer repairists because laptops still offer software and hardware features that ipads don't.The latest ipad model holds only 64 gb of data whereas a laptop hold up to 2 terabytes(2000 gb) of data. Ipads are good as e-book readers . Plus , if your laptop gets damaged , you are likely still to be able to retain all of your data because the harddrive won't be damaged. If your ipad2 is damaged, you will least likely be able to retain your data.
@dutytocareforothers what do you mean? that I shouln't even bother with community college. see I'm don't know what I want to do. and know I have alot of other things goign on in my life that I need to take care off. if go back to school, it will be to get a ceritficate.
@dutytocareforothers yeah right. like you can get any jobs for that crap. and besides, billing and coding jobs don't earn someone alot. only like 30,000 a year. no thanks.
6:02-6:10: RE: "Now there are probably some engineers out there who are going to laugh in black-hearted, dessicated laughter at what I just said." Exactly! For one thing, there's a myth that the there's an engineer shortage, a myth promoted by...the engineering colleges!
Well, my point with that is that at least having an engineering degree is probably more generalizable and applicable than most other degrees. Of course, I guess there can come to be a glut of them, too, but at least you know they have a track record of quantitative and scientific discipline.
Do not go to a big state college or private college to get an education degree. They are not usable, period. I have one, I should know. And even if you did manage to get a full time teaching job,which is unlikely anywhere in the US but the South, it will be unlikely to pay enough to cover your loans and living expenses particularly if you go to a more expensive school. Skip loans and go to a small school. You don't need the prestigious degree to be a teacher anyway. Also, consider another major.
You only get one financially easy chance to get a bachelor's degree, and to waste it on something that you could study on your own by either searching for relevant books on Amazon, or checking out from a library, is just a huge mistake in my mind.
Look -- if you're not ready (for whatever reasons) to pursue a bachelor's degree in something with more skill-leverage, such as accounting or engineering or whatever, then either withdraw and just work or...
transfer to a community college, where you can get the kind of fundamental-but-not-directly-marketable skills such as "rhetoric" out of the way. But don't be so irresponsibly self-indulgent as to formally declare that as your major.
If you want to MINOR in it, fine. But don't major in it. Study it to your heart's content and even become an expert in it, but don't have that be your given major, by which you market yourself.
@TheLogicJunkie I already graduated from a community college and transferred with an A.A. in communications. I primarily studied journalism as I was told to learn to write and research. However, very few schools in my state have journalism for a bachelor's and communications was capped, but rhetoric was wide open so I applied as a rhetoric major. Also, I liked the idea of majoring in one of the original liberal arts majors. Not contradicting you, just giving you the "logic" behind my choice.
@theshooter2000 Okay, fair enough -- but I STILL wouldn't do a rhetoric major. I would find a way to get a degree OR critical skills that you need -- but, still, preferably with an actual degree in the thing itself WITH the appropriate name, because hiring people in the outside work world are very often superficial, ignorant, and/or simply incapable of going any more deeply into your application than just the field name of your degree.
@TheLogicJunkie Well the degree that is most common for my line of work is either communications or journalism. However, they will also say something along the lines of other degrees acceptable, but communications/journalism is preferred. My university (Berkeley), just changed the name of their communications program to Media Studies and as I mentioned earlier it is capped. Although, I'm sure I could get into the major and do fine. However, it is an interdisciplinary major, so I would basically
@TheLogicJunkie way more doing self education than anything they are telling us in my classes. You're right about math though, there was a guy younger than me at my previous company with a math degree and he had the utmost respect although he had a terrible time communicating with vendors and customers and would bring me with him to every lunch to keep up the conversation and build rapport, which is a talent of mine. Anyway, I do speak japanese (I'm not Japanese) which has always gotten me work.
@TheLogicJunkie LOL, yeah I'm a former mormon missionary that served in Japan for 2 years. When I got home I went to work for Fuji and then later went onto call center work outsourced for AT&T both jobs were Japanese language oriented. I can't write, but with a bit of study could probably place out of the entire department easily as I can read just fine once learned. BTW, I completely agree with your views on religion, which is why I GOT THE HELL OUT!!!
@theshooter2000 be taking courses all over the place. Luckily, I do have actual corporate work experience with a big name japanese corporation. Originally, I was going to go to a state school that had a public relations (another preferred degree) degree or a degree in journalism with an emphasis in public relations, but when Berkeley accepted me, I figured it was the right thing to do. I'm only 2 days in and already wondering if I should get out now, which led me to your videos. I've had learned
@theshooter2000 Well, let me say that I've come to learn that the right people in the right places liking you, is at least half the battle. And the fact that you have well-placed people in Japan who will vouch for you is a HUGE feather in your cap. If it looks like you have somewhere to go in the "real" world out there waiting for you after (or, better yet, even before) graduation, then I'd say you're actually doing fine.
@TheLogicJunkie I was also told to learn how to count and minor in accounting, but I have too many credits already to do that. I tried working, but always had the problem of getting a better/higher paying position because I didn't have a degree even when I was better qualified for the position.
I want to say I really appreciate your time. I think selfish people, and people that want to gobble up humanity (as you put it) are poisonous to humanity, and the world.
I'm not sure where humanity is heading, however I encourage you to pull through strong!
I was a teacher and disagree with going into teaching unless you major in math or science ed....or special ed. Otherwise, good luck on finding a job!!!!
Teaching science is a pain in the ass -- all that lab setup drives me nuts. I'd much rather teach math. And I'd only want to teach in a school where admission was conditional and hard to get, or gifted.
I thank you for all this, I had second thoughts about choices for college or even wanting to go to them. As much as people claim we should go to them without mentioning Debt.. I thank you for even bringin this to the light.. Cause God knows all those folks Praising College as a miracle never tells you that you might waste 2-5 years of your life studying and going into debt to find out you won't even have a damn job to support you or your family with. SMH @ The World we Live in today.
Dude, I just stumble onto you tonight. And you are so on the money!!! The University system is a rip off. The four universities teach you how to think about doing something. And the community colleges teach you how to do something. I'm also with you on being through with America too. I've been thinking about joining the Peace Corp and getting out of the country at the governments expense and getting most of my student loans forgiven. The USA sucks these days! Peace to you, brother!
hihoneyhello 6 days ago
You're welcome!
SullenDreamer 1 week ago
<3 You're awesome!!!
SullenDreamer 1 week ago
@SullenDreamer Thanks...
TheLogicJunkie 1 week ago
Been in a Community College for 6 years now. I have constantly been changing majors which has kept me there. But I must admit, unlike a lot of my friends who went to universities, I have actually learned a ton and have really good idea of what I want to do now.
Plus, I have no debt.
JohnHam 3 weeks ago
JohnHam, you're the hero of the day. That's great news.
TheLogicJunkie 3 weeks ago
I'm an education / career / life coach and adjunct professor working at death camps trying to get this message out. lol You are to the greatest degree, right on. The reason most never see this is because most are never taught to think independently, critically, intuitively. Hell, most are never taught to think, period. Because if they did the whole system would break down and profit fail. I teach from the perspective of what do the most need, most of the time, in most situations. REALITY! Peace!
probrojeffro 3 weeks ago
In the vast majority of cases, education itself is stratified according to socioeconomic class. The real conceptual foundation of things is being taught behind the doors of elite prep schools and academies, and those proper foundations then get built upon in college, after taking whirlwind prep school refresher courses called "introductory" courses.
...And, of course, the rest of the freshmen are never told that they're up against prep school-educated kids in their class.
TheLogicJunkie 3 weeks ago
my friedn got engineering degree and he is going to military...
silvermaniamania 3 weeks ago in playlist More videos from TheLogicJunkie
I am buried with student loan too... learning sociology...
silvermaniamania 3 weeks ago in playlist More videos from TheLogicJunkie
@silvermaniamania You should either drop out or change tracks. But you can study sociology even better by picking up cheaper books at a bookstore, library sale, or other places. Don't pay tuition prices to learn sociology.
TheLogicJunkie 3 weeks ago
I agree - the idea that alumni networks will help you find a job - not really. I don't think the university degree will make you more money than a community college if you can get real world experience. I think the first rule to success in work and making money is just to show up and try your best. The second rule to having success in work and ultimately making money is to learn how to be flexible and put up with a lot of crap day in and day. A university degree can not shield anyone from that.
catfishblues123 1 month ago
Sorry BA in computer science is an oxymoron.
Atheist18505 1 month ago
I think I know what you mean by this -- that there is very no "science" in computer science. It's not like computer engineering -- it's mostly just programming and understanding the broad organization of computer and operating system architecture, but nothing to do with the physics and electronics of the thing.
TheLogicJunkie 1 month ago
You did not say, computer science. A BA or BS in computer science is very, very useful.
kalijasin 1 month ago
If I were going to major in computer science, which is mostly oriented toward programming (which I despise), I would major in computer engineering instead, which is mostly oriented toward computer circuitry design, with a lesser emphasis on programming. That is much more interesting to me.
TheLogicJunkie 1 month ago
@kalijasin If you are going the computer science route stick to a concentration in Science's, I have many friends with BA's in computer sci(btw computer science is a bit of an oxymoron) and they have been unemployed over a year. Shit even people with a BS in computer sci are having a extremely hard time finding employment. Not trying to scare you, but the IT, and Computer field is one of networking(I know first hand) you need yo know some, before the hr's even look at your resume.
Atheist18505 1 month ago
Its not a rip off if you want to become a doctor like me.
kalijasin 1 month ago
True -- but then if you become a doctor nowadays, you're mostly a shill for the petro-pharmaceutical industry, unless you become some kind of surgeon.
TheLogicJunkie 1 month ago
@TheLogicJunkie Well, i'm making something of my life and undergrad college is just a stepping stone towards that. I'm not going to sit around on youtube all day, like some, and complain about college being meaningless when in reality its not.
kalijasin 1 month ago
For a select group of people, college does pay off -- if they're amongst the selected. Because if you're not among the selected, you can bust your ass all day long and no matter how much you seek out guidance and mentorship, people will avoid you and play dumb, posturing that they "know nothing".
But congratulations to you on being lucky enough to be met halfway in your efforts. And may I also commend you on your giant wooden horse-building skills. You snuck your attack right in.
TheLogicJunkie 1 month ago
@kalijasin You're just selfish, make something of your life, even at the expense of others? The only real wealth is free time to spend on yourself, and thus college makes you poor :) Hare Krisna.
Siva3Enthroned 3 weeks ago
What about if I got my degree in political science or economics? Because i'm by far not a science person I already know that i'm more of a english / history person.
guitarmessiah95 2 months ago
I'm not so sure about political science, but economics is a better major, I hear. Also, from what I've read, the future of political science lies in what Bruce Bueno de Mesquita is doing up at NYU. You should watch him on YouTube, and read his book "Predictioneering".
TheLogicJunkie 2 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie hmm I see. i'll look into that my ultimate goal is to become a lawyer but i've heard a lot of stuff how the law is corrupt now and the debt obviously becomes impossible to pay. I've never been interested into any career because of the slary i truly want to see justice served.
guitarmessiah95 2 months ago
If you want to go anywhere in the sciences and research and technology (not just engineering), you need to go to college, because chances are you will be working at universities, which are the places where this stuff is researched. Professors suck as teachers, true, but there's a lot more to college than the "scam" supporters would have you believe.
Also, yeah...going community college route is definitely not bad.
vector702 2 months ago
@vector702 I think that college is particularly good for pursuing majors that require specialty equipment to study the subject. So, yes, we're talking about engineering, computer science, physics, and a lot of things like that, which are especially technology-dependent.
TheLogicJunkie 2 months ago
Okay. Since I plan on being a math major at Columbia University and seeking employment in finance, I am doing the right thing.
PolitcalIslam 3 months ago
@PolitcalIslam I'm not guaranteeing that, but I will say that just from what I'm hearing, it sounds good to me.
TheLogicJunkie 2 months ago
Yes, the skills you need for lower-middle class professions.
PolitcalIslam 3 months ago
I am passionate about photography but clearly there is no financial security in it for me right now. I've chosen something practical to major and would like to one day run my own business, while making time for my true passion. The "do-what-you-love" mentality deters young students from thinking rationally and this is how we end up with a generation of useless majors and looming debts.
NinaLuxful 3 months ago
Well, there's no reason that you couldn't major in something immediately needed, like accounting, and then minor in photography, just so that you're around people you actually like and aren't going insane. But with that said, even accounting is very spiritual and philosophical, if you just make an effort to approach it from that aspect of it.
I think that the mantra "Do what you love" is pure poison. I think that "Do what needs doing" is much better for everyone.
TheLogicJunkie 3 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie I agree. I'm actually an Accounting major at the moment and find certain tasks repetitive but challenging nonetheless. I think everyone should learn a trade, regardless of their true passion. It helps put food on the table without you going completely insane from being in a cubicle so long. Haha!
NinaLuxful 3 months ago
@NinaLuxful Awesome! AND I do hope you're learning DATABASE accounting methods AND the IASB international accounting standards -- not just GAAP, because GAAP is already being phased out here in America.
TheLogicJunkie 3 months ago
What about nursing major? Is it useless?
luvtwinkie1993 3 months ago
@luvtwinkie1993 No, but just be aware that there may very well be a nursing glut going on. Before you get into nursing or any field, always talk to people in the field and see what they have to say about it, and the future of the field.
TheLogicJunkie 3 months ago
The only reason the education degree leads to jobs is that the education industry uses them as a barrier to entry. It's not that the degree really educates you.
As for engineering, true this is the most useful degree. However, most of the material is overkill for what the typical engineer does.
Business classes are also not particularly useful. It's mostly the usual academic pontification about business.
Bottom line is, college is for college professors.
seaslipper1 3 months ago
only if you're going for the sole expectation of making bank as soon as you graduate. You get out what you put in. Yes its cold and hard and no one holds my hand like in high school and community colleges, but I've decided that I'm gonna beat the game and get my degree in Biology and Japanese. Imma rise to their challenge. I know that universities are just research institutions funded by making education a business, but I have scholarships (through hard work ppl), and won't be in debt.
vector702 2 months ago
Community colleges are a much better deal. I agree completely with this. The curriculum at the elite schools was established originally for the idle rich. Art, Political Science. None of that helps you in the working world. I'm not sure it even helps you with art or political science since the academic approach is so cold and narrow.
Agreed also that alumni networks are a sham. At best they are a fundraising device. Job centers at universities are also a sham.
seaslipper1 3 months ago
@seaslipper1
Uh...you need a college education to be a doctor. And we need doctors. And engineers. QED college is a necessary "evil". Like government
vector702 2 months ago
I agree with alot of what you have to say about college. I have a Bacchelors in Communication and a Masters in Social Work. Yet, both does not mean anything. It is always I have no experience. I don't fit. I just feel that I have wasted 7 years of my life.
Topg1 4 months ago
Well, not to be cruel, but maybe -- maybe -- you could improve your career chances by developing your writing and spelling a bit better. Because whoever let you get through all the college you say you've had, without challenging your writing and spelling, did you an enormous disservice by not holding up your writing abilities to the harsh light of day. You're not a son of George HW Bush, after all.
Get mad as hell if you want to, but that's the truth.
TheLogicJunkie 4 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie I'm not mad or anything. Just out of curiosity, what led you to believe that my writing and spelling wasn't challenged? Nevertheless thanks for the advice.
Topg1 4 months ago
@Topg1 Well, now it's completely different. Now it's like you actually asked someone else to sit down at the keyboard and type for you -- it's that different.
I go with what I'm shown... you gotta meet me halfway here.
TheLogicJunkie 4 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie People get lazy when it comes down to "lower" forms of writing, i.e. internet comments
AlbinoAzn777 3 months ago
@AlbinoAzn777 I find that some do, some don't. But, yes, there are those who think that way.
TheLogicJunkie 3 months ago
@Topg1 but what are you doing now?
1991Avega 3 months ago
This video I can agree on some points.
Community colleges are cost effective and overall cheaper. 3-4k tuition versus 10k saves you easily 12k in tuition and more if you live with your parents.
Universities have huge classrooms (lecture halls) where professors barely know your name. This is another reason and probably the most dominate reason why people can't learn as well in that environment.
movcrit 4 months ago
Comment removed
b45100 5 months ago
Hey LogicJunkie, what do you think about technical schools? Is that another option that you would advise people to look at because it seems that having skills in a particular field is the best way to go. Being my third year now at a 4 year instituion, I am in the process of transfering to a community colege because my experience as an undergraduate has been nothing but diaster. However, technical schools is another thing to look at.
b45100 5 months ago
@b45100 Well, of course I would recommend technical schools -- but NOT necessarily the private, hugely expensive ones... I think they're mostly diploma mills.
Remember, NO college necessarily gives a shit whether you live or die -- colleges primarily care about themselves, and keeping the money rolling in. YOU are the one who's going to have to pay back all those ram-shackle loans you're stuck with after you graduate -- NOT the colleges. After you graduate, they don't want to know you.
TheLogicJunkie 4 months ago
1500 is actually a pretty bad score now.
IwillKillYourCereal 5 months ago
Well, but even with all that, from what I understand, the basic setup of the SAT is still the same: it has more sections, but the maximum score on the main sections is still 800. So the maximum score will basically be some multiple of 800...
TheLogicJunkie 5 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie Yes. The maximum score is now 2400. If the man you were referring to got a 1500 on the old SAT test, then I agree, that is very impressive. Most colleges don't care about the writing score, so they'll just ask you for your Critical Reading and Math scores (which add up to 1600).
IwillKillYourCereal 5 months ago
Truthfully, I used to look down on everyone and anyone who attended a community college.
That all changed once I attended one and had a great experience.
Now I look down on anyone who looks down on community colleges.
To sum it up:
Community college = learning institution
University = Research institution
There's a BIG difference.
moecool 5 months ago 2
Beautifully put.
TheLogicJunkie 5 months ago
I went to a community college and it was great. I did feel like you just had to show up to pass. It was so much easier than an university.
sirisnin 5 months ago
Okay, but here's the thing: if you're showing up and doing well AND the assessments you're being given are basically comparable in difficulty to what they're giving at the big four-year universities, then all that's left to explain why it's all seeming so easy, is that the community colleges are probably using BETTER textbooks that explain things more simply and clearly, AND teachers who are boiling it down easier.
Truly GOOD teaching makes learning EASY. That's how it's SUPPOSED to be.
TheLogicJunkie 5 months ago 2
Hey TheLogicJunkie, this was an excellent video! I can appreciate your honesty as well as your advice. I have a question for you: what about majoring in economics, computer science, or nursing (I have a few friends that majored in these fields and are doing quite well)? I understand you can’t cover everything in a short video, but there are majors that apply to many jobs. Overall, you mentioned a goldmine of good advice for undecided students and you deserve a but thumbs up for your honesty.
Thestarvinstudent 6 months ago
Those are great choices, and another choice I would add to that list is majoring in engineering, with an emphasis on chemical, civil, computer, or mechanical/robotics.
Also, within economics, I would focus on behavioral economics and accounting. Also, computer-based banking and encryption authentication methods.
TheLogicJunkie 6 months ago
it's not what you take, it's what you bring.
unabonger777 6 months ago
@unabonger777
Possibly. But all too often you can't gauge what you brought in the first place, except by hindsight. You often discover your latent aptitudes through what you're able to learn and gain, once you're actually subjected to the challenge of having to learn something.
"Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forward."
TheLogicJunkie 6 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie why did you stop making videos?
unabonger777 6 months ago
@unabonger777 I moved back to the east coast, and I had to get a whole new computer and camera system, and everything is just out of whack now. But I'll do it again, probably real soon... But thanks for asking.
TheLogicJunkie 6 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie and what was your major in college?
unabonger777 6 months ago
I have a friend whose son graduated from a top University in Canada. He majored in ancient English literature.
Now I thought to myself -- what the hell is that useless degree going to do for him? What a waste of time and money. Holy crap, LOL.
cheeriosinabowl 6 months ago
Well, purely on its surface, I'd say you'd be right. BUT, if he's of the predominant ethnicity AND good-looking AND tall AND loves to run with the crowd AND all that stuff, then that's what matters. That will get him in, regardless of his major. The major is just a formality and, I say even more cynically than that, a veneer -- albeit a powerfully convincing one at that.
TheLogicJunkie 6 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie
..... of course. It's who you know and who you blow, as we say around here. And being good looking or beautiful sure helps. Our world is shallow and superficial, that won't change. Go with the flow ...
cheeriosinabowl 6 months ago
@cheeriosinabowl
The only exception I'll give to what I just said is a tentative exception, and that is for majors like engineering and the extremely counterintuitive majors, where what is taught is very in-depth in terms of formal, quantitative methods and highly idiosyncratic procedures in general. Then you're going to need some truly controlled environment to internalize that stuff.
TheLogicJunkie 6 months ago
@cheeriosinabowl lol yeah whats up with all these useless degrees that colleges offer. like my brothers girlfriend has a Bachelors in african history from university of california, and she paid that shit off with credit cards and is in massive debt, with obvious unemployment. shit unless theirs black history month, every month, she obviously is wayy in the hole interms of employability.
Mannypacquia0 1 month ago
I would like to go for computer engineering. Is college worth it?
Bizzenson 6 months ago
@Bizzenson For computer engineering, yes. But don't bother with that field unless you actually have a love of computers in your own personal time.
TheLogicJunkie 6 months ago
Keep in mind that engineering is probably the hardest of all majors. That's why few take it, but if you want to learn about math/physics, I would suggest engineering. My hs physics teacher told us that the way that physics is taught in college is garbage.He b right! For example, physics profs never were told the difference between temperature and heat. Not once. In Engineering they told us what the difference was and how they worked. That's only one example of many....
ripperduck 7 months ago
As a mechanical engineering undergrad from Appalachia with a basic knowledge of Russian, coming from an underfunded public school which consistently failed NCLB testings, I have to say that everything you say is absolutely correct. If you said this in your other video, I would not have been nearly as malignant of a cunt. You should know going into college what you want to do, and know the risk and debt that you take on. Good show.
Fittykent 7 months ago
Well, I don't see how I would've said anything different in any of my other videos -- my stance is very simple: I don't think colleges ought to be admitting people who aren't objectively ready to meet the colleges' standards as to the level of difficulty that their introductory courses operate on.
...But the flip side of this position of mine is that if colleges ARE going to admit students who aren't objectively ready, then they must assume the task of putting them on a remediation track.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
But the problem is that colleges want to have their cake and eat it, too -- they want to admit applicants who clearly, by any demonstrable standards such as the AP tests, aren't yet (if indeed they ever will be) at the prerequisite skill level to begin where college introductory courses begin. And then, after these students are admitted, they are basically ignored by the college advisory system and left to twist in the wind.
And that is fraud.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie And if we're talking about a public un, then the cost of remediation must be much lower, imo. If that school admits students who don't meet that requirements, then its the responsibility of that uni to do the job but at a far lower price. Wont happen because those classes make a huge profit for the unis in that they generally throw a GTF/instructor who get paid nothing compared to any level prof, those students usually flunk and need to take the class over again.
ripperduck 7 months ago
what do you think of learning ultrasound/rad tech/nuc med?
I'm from Canada so healthcare is tightly regulated here with only a few schools that teach this.
I'm currently trying to upgrade my high school grades and apply to one of these programs.
Trying to go the community college (dipoma) route verse the degree route because I think colleges would do a better job teaching verse just weeding everyone out in sight.
Thoughts??
moecool 7 months ago
Do you know when I've been the most successful in college? When I've already been studying the subject matter in my free time, before I've ever actually paid to take a class in a given thing. Why? Because 1) it demonstrates that I'm actually already comfortable with the core ideas, and 2) all college courses tend to be profoundly lousy in actually teaching any subject -- only high-quality prep schools and pre-college academies truly teach well in this country.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@mjustonestar Well, I agree with the "learn Chinese" part. But just as much as learning Chinese, it may be even better to learn German, because Germany is always really secretly pulling the strings -- including China's strings.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
What about Law? It's employable and you can earn good money with it, or am I wrong?
hieristjetzt 7 months ago
@hieristjetzt I don't know anything about the law, except that I had one cousin who started at Vanderbilt Law School and then withdraw out of disinterest and contempt, and another who graduated from Georgetown Law School and then started as an entertainment lawyer in LA, and then got out, too.
A friend of the family did graduate from law school, however, and has been a working real estate attorney for several years now. So I guess it depends on the legal field you go into.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie Yes, the good thing about law is that you can go into very many different fields. You can also work for the government. A lot of the people who work there have a law degree. This is what I hear.
I have no degree yet but your video has influenced me quite a bit. I have never thought of becoming a lawyer but it is also a degree with a guaranteed job, just like a teacher or a doctor. I agree 100% that it's dumb to work for a degree without a specific job in mind. For what then???
hieristjetzt 7 months ago
@hieristjetzt I would only go to college if I had a specific degree in mind AND it was highly necessary AND required a set of skills that were hard (or somewhat unpleasant) to acquire.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie Law doesn't fall into that category? I guess engineering and math definitely does, as you said. But frankly, I would suck at both. Law on the other hand is something I can wrap my head around. It's not really hard I would say. But it's still hard to get very good grades, I guess. There are a lot of lawyers in my country (germany) but only the best can choose their job. And there is a joke that some of them drive cabs. It's depressing if you add the minimum 7 years of education...
hieristjetzt 7 months ago
@hieristjetzt Oh, you live in Germany? Then why not become a union lawyer? Or an intellectual property attorney?
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@hieristjetzt The thing about law is that it essentially is a field that, on paper, technically revolves around logic adeptness, but in reality all that is completely thrown out the window by the magic of the gavel. At some point the "magic of the gavel" (whereby a judge's tapping a gavel magically creates "truth") just exhausts your money supply and, past that point, unless a lawyer has some perversely personal reason for continuing to represent you, you're out of fuel and stalled.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie I guess it all depends on what kind of law system you have. I find it interesting that there are so many differences between countries although practically all of the modern state laws base on kants philosophy, the a priori irrefutable value of any being AND on "honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere". These are just a couple of words, really. That's why the system depends highly on linguistics, semantics, philosophy etc. It's not exact but do we have a choice?
hieristjetzt 7 months ago
I am a 23 year old freshman at a University, YSU. At my school they encourage the students to get involved in their school career. Which means getting to know your teachers and staying on top of your grades. My english teacher encourage's me to come to him with any problem I have as far as the work. Im going right now for psychology because I changed my mind for years about what I wanted to do. Now I'm actually happy with my decision.
uniqueasIam22 7 months ago
My personality test told me to go for Psychology
uniqueasIam22 7 months ago
@uniqueasIam22 I say your personality test doesn't give a rat's ass about you. I say you study psychology in your own free time, and without all the childish torment from psychology professors at college tuition rates.
If you're into paying for abuse, pay somebody ten bucks to punch you in the face. But don't pay for a degree in psychology. College is bad enough as it is.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
I think that everything you said about universities also applies to community colleges. I've heard community college admit to being gatekeepers, I've seen students blacklisted for their political views, and community college teachers state they don't care because they have tenure - I kid you not!
Unfortunately, lots of community colleges have the mentality to provide transferable degrees instead of providing a useful skill, and they want to be more, "competitive" by having a university model.
td84 7 months ago
@td84 Yeah, you do have a point there. To a great degree, college is college -- even community college. But at least it's a lot harder for community college to overestimate itself than for universities. As a result, they tend to have more to prove on a day-to-day basis, I think.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie Although I would like to agree with you, unfortunately to be recognized in the educational realm the college must be regionally accredited. On top of that, most of the programs that community colleges have, for example nursing require state level requirements and curriculum review. This means that the, "higher functioning level of society" are pulling the strings.
To me, at least where I live, it's the same thing as a university but just smaller and with a different name.
td84 7 months ago
@td84
I gotta agree with you there - even comm. colleges are taking part in the college industrial complex. In the comm. college that I went to, almost all the people there are unfriendly, the professors are callous and discourages dissenting viewpoints, and the social worker spent the latter half of my three years strong-arming me into taking subjects that were irrelevant to my major. This is why I view comm. colleges and universities as little more than state-sponsored Ponzi schemes.
MultiPBW 4 months ago
You may be more likely to get a job with an engineering degree but the programs are still quite bloated. For example, you don't need to study artificial intelligence or theory of algorithms to be a web programmer even though the typical program requires them. Even in the engineering programs, the schools get much more money out of you than is justified by educational goals.
asianwomansl 7 months ago
@asianwomansl To a great degree, I do agree with you that schools are padding their curricula with all kinds of self-indulgent courses in esoterica, largely to pad their tuition revenues. But even so, I still think that knowledge of "future frontier" areas like artificial intelligence and theoretical underpinnings are essential to anyone who wishes to have real upward mobility within a company.
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie I've worked for 20 years in info technology. You don't need those things at all unless you work in Bell Labs and the like. The typical programmer loads and unloads databases all day long. Even the heads of IT at your standard corporation don't even mention artificial intelligence.
TheOwllake 7 months ago
@TheOwllake Fair enough...
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
I'm at community college. It's legit, I actually get to know my professors
Trimbler00 7 months ago
Yep, yep!
TheLogicJunkie 7 months ago
Dont forget nursing!
MizzyTheQueen 8 months ago
What is anyone's opinion on getting an Economics degree from a nationally reputable state school?
jol223334 8 months ago
For what it's worth, I've read that economics majors have salaries not much below engineers, who on average have the highest salaries. Do a google search -- I'm sure the articles are there.
TheLogicJunkie 8 months ago
I believe you're confusing psychology with sociology.
DrDread 8 months ago
i agree.
solidust23 8 months ago
I went to a two year community college and and went to a private college. He is right I learned more from my community colleges professors plus I established a relationship with them more than a 4 year college.
mmou3878 8 months ago
College still sucks, one way or another they will screw you over and make you suffer. I'm a university student, and I'm so burnt out on the BS. I still want to get an associates of arts in business to potentially make a better name for myself. Honestly, I've started off with a community college and they screwed me worse than the university is doing now. A business degree should be good, because business will always be relevant in everyday life. However, the game is still rigged.
kltiswhoib 8 months ago
@kltiswhoib I believe you. Have you noticed how everything that professors teach is trite and dull and then they demand you memorize silly impractical details. And professors make absurd demands just to make themselves appear legitimate. The community college I went to had a lot of jerks running the show too.
dutytocareforothers 8 months ago
@dutytocareforothers Correct, it seems like the goals of the professors is to slave you and force pointless details on you. Oh yeah, don't dare to have an opinion of your own. You're not supposed to. It's the kind of nonsense that you'll never benefit from or remember after 2.5-10 years of endless rhetoric. The few skills that you do learn are nearly pointless on a resume without real on-the-job experience. Ugh, I hate it so much and they have me trapped in at least 2 different ways now.
kltiswhoib 8 months ago
your so in debt. but your selling a book. impressive. i looked into what it costs to have a book made. i looked into it for 2 months. and a man in debt can not afford this. very impressive sham.
nothadnotbad 8 months ago
@nothadnotbad He can if he has family members who are willing to pay for it. And, incidentally, you couldn't make a single down payment on a small house with what I made off the book.
So much for your "very impressive sham". What else you got?
TheLogicJunkie 8 months ago 3
Wow...Logic Junkie....I must say that you have a razor sharp intellect to clearly see things as they are and approach the core of the problem on any given issue. And obviously you have balls of steel to speak out against college system so openly. So kudos to you.
I have a request for you. What are your views on pursuing Ph.D. (in any stream)? Do you think it is worth it? what, according to you are the employment opportunities, after a Ph.D. ? Could you post a video on that ?
TheChromelover 8 months ago
@TheChromelover Well, thanks. And because I was actually in a PhD program for about a year, I'll say that I don't necessarily think it's a great thing because, even though you usually have it paid for you through fellowships and that sort of thing, the "publish or perish" life afterwards just doesn't impress me -- particularly with regard to salary -- UNLESS you've gotten to the point where you just want to hide away in somewhat safe obscurity. I, personally, would rather make money.
TheLogicJunkie 8 months ago
@TheChromelover Also, aside from not my not having the temperament for the cliqueish, effete, and venomously passive-aggressive world of academia, I also found the science arms of academia insanely depressing, as I have a problem with claustrophobia, recirculated air, and that sickly fluorescent lighting. I could never be in a sunless fucking lab all day, like a pasty, bug-eyed cave toad, as almost all of them are.
TheLogicJunkie 8 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie
You hit the nail on the head. I felt the same. After my undergrad, I was accepted in a very good Graduate school program in Engineering as A PhD candidate. But after about a year or so in graduate school, I realized that PhD is an over-kill, not worth the effort and is not remunerative (don't get me wrong - I like research. But at the end of the day, I'd like to have a comfortable middle-class lifestyle). So I am walking out with a masters degree (graduation on this May 20).
TheChromelover 8 months ago
@TheChromelover I agree with your decision -- as far as I'm concerned, there is no lure to asceticism.
TheLogicJunkie 8 months ago
I've decided to inquire into welding and brick laying from those who are tactful in it.
Swampymcswamp 9 months ago
There is a whole movement toward minimalist technology. Why? Because people are tired of being intimidated and beholden to "black box" technology that is completely beyond their capacity -- or anyone else's -- to truly fathom.
TheLogicJunkie 9 months ago
God I told my parents, literally told them in Neanderthal sylables - COMMUNITY COLLEGE BETTER... LESS OF RIP OFF... NOT A DEATH CAMP... - what do they do? they look up 2 colleges... 2 out of a billion, both of which are 4 years. I end up taking the tour of both, and choose one over the other because it has a pretty sweet gym - so what's the only thing i learned in college? Become independant and do whatever the hell you want.
FaidleyEthan 9 months ago
So true. I enjoyed the community college much more than the university. The CC felt far more nurturing and the school work was much more fun and interesting. I never understood why all the hype was around the universities, which felt soulless and boring. So I wondered what I missed and why my experience didn't fit the cultural mythos.
GlobalDating 9 months ago
Speaking from my personal domain, schools and colleges are a shell-game to defraud you for snake-oil. Schools and colleges do not contribute and waste time for others, how I got to be where I am with myself today was being autonomous. Schools and colleges are a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Swampymcswamp 9 months ago
I have experienced charlatan's that claim to have college degrees in their domains, one was in being a "teacher". I call him a charlatan because he detracts from others and other red-herrings as well as telling others what they can and cannot do. He used euphemism's as well as other weasel words about what he claimed to be an expert in. It's all just underhanded and exploitative use of others.
Swampymcswamp 9 months ago
In my domain, all I ever needed to survive for myself was from my criteria:
A.. Cultured Vocab
B. Self-Sufficient and Autonomous
C. Knowledge in your own preferences
Swampymcswamp 9 months ago
Speaking of colleges, It reminds me of parasites and their domains of corruption. It's like a poison that is covert and very very exploitative by getting you to be a in box where they (the parasites) can just manipulate you and impoverish you till you are all that is used up to them.
Swampymcswamp 9 months ago
what about a chemistry degree
ericlol99 9 months ago
A chemistry degree is great. It's the foundation for modern nanotechnology -- particularly with respect to materials engineering, which is HUGELY marketable.
TheLogicJunkie 9 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie Fuck yes. I've been looking to get into nanotechnology and I know this is what I want to do but I'm not sure what path to take. Any suggestions?
gamersgene 8 months ago
@gamersgene Do a web search for nanotechnology professional societies and college programs, and see what they recommend. I know of one at UC Santa Barbara, and one at Rice in Houston. But there are almost certainly others.
Also, nanotechnology basically centers around physical chemistry -- the overlap of physics and chemistry. So a degree in something like chemical or electrical engineering, or chemistry, or materials engineering, would probably be a good undergrad major.
TheLogicJunkie 8 months ago
Thanks for this video, Logic Junkie.
21 year old college dropout here. Switched to a 2 year technical school and said screw-it to the 4-year plan. Now I easily earn 50K+ year in web. College is a scam in many cases; build on your skills, start a business, follow your real dreams. Live the life you want to live. If only more people knew.
My $0.02, TPJ
Thepiratejoe 9 months ago 14
You definitely made the right choice. And if you get a chance, pick up a copy of a new book called "Were You Born On the Wrong Continent?" by Tom Geoghegan. It explains why Europe -- and Germany in particular -- is doing things right, while America continues to keep doing the wrong thing with ever-increasing fervor. And how we do education is one of our biggest catastrophes.
TheLogicJunkie 9 months ago
@Thepiratejoe spread the word brotha
stillirize187 9 months ago
@Thepiratejoe What exactly is it that you do.
mmou3878 8 months ago
@Thepiratejoe Awesome statements. We have disconnected from the virtue developing skills for practical living. Basic skills that benefit all people. Technical schools seem to focus on the practicality of things and make sure you truly understand what you doing and why you doing along with directly teaching you the 'skill'. Great move, bro.
CognitionPrime 8 months ago
@Thepiratejoe thank you. I dropped out due to the scam. now I starting my carrer as a model. let's see what happens with that.
1991Avega 3 months ago
I'm thinking of only getting an associate degree in information technology so I can get a career in computer support specialist :-[
not sure if that's a good idea though...
xXSgofyyahXx 10 months ago
With the advent of the most recent iPad2, there won't be much, if any, market for computer repairists any more. Focus on computer networking, security, and/or engineering the actual circuit designs. Also, programming with always be healthy.
Finally, consider robotics. That is the newest, most emergent field.
TheLogicJunkie 10 months ago
@TheLogicJunkie Actually in information technology I was planning on taking classes that focuses on networking and some programming :]
Don't know if the one you mention are sort of related to informatin technology since I be only working on getting an associate degree o-o;
xXSgofyyahXx 10 months ago
@xXSgofyyahXx That's a pretty decent plan -- as good as any I've heard. And if you can do it, try to also work in some accounting and finance courses. If you can get into computerized banking, that would be great.
TheLogicJunkie 10 months ago
There is will be amarket for computer repairists because laptops still offer software and hardware features that ipads don't.The latest ipad model holds only 64 gb of data whereas a laptop hold up to 2 terabytes(2000 gb) of data. Ipads are good as e-book readers . Plus , if your laptop gets damaged , you are likely still to be able to retain all of your data because the harddrive won't be damaged. If your ipad2 is damaged, you will least likely be able to retain your data.
Pentazoid111 9 months ago
There is fascism at the University of Pennsylvania.
MrFaisel34 10 months ago
college is a joke anyway you look at it. And i graduated from a 4 year university.
SirMicDre 10 months ago
I can always go back in the next few years. but the next time if I decide, I will go to community college. fuck going to a 4 years college.
1991Avega 10 months ago
@1991Avega Do you think employers are going to give a rat's ass if you graduate from a 2 year college? I think not.
dutytocareforothers 10 months ago
@dutytocareforothers what do you mean? that I shouln't even bother with community college. see I'm don't know what I want to do. and know I have alot of other things goign on in my life that I need to take care off. if go back to school, it will be to get a ceritficate.
1991Avega 10 months ago
@1991Avega Try any certificate in health-care including billing and coding. But don't get your hopes up too high.
dutytocareforothers 10 months ago
@dutytocareforothers yeah right. like you can get any jobs for that crap. and besides, billing and coding jobs don't earn someone alot. only like 30,000 a year. no thanks.
1991Avega 9 months ago
everything you said is right to the point. I am glad to know that there is someone like you who speak the truth.
b45100 11 months ago 2
How about "finding yourself" by getting a job?!?!
PlaceOfYes 11 months ago
Yes, yes, yes!
ogicabp4u 11 months ago
6:02-6:10: RE: "Now there are probably some engineers out there who are going to laugh in black-hearted, dessicated laughter at what I just said." Exactly! For one thing, there's a myth that the there's an engineer shortage, a myth promoted by...the engineering colleges!
SimperingSimpleton 11 months ago
Well, my point with that is that at least having an engineering degree is probably more generalizable and applicable than most other degrees. Of course, I guess there can come to be a glut of them, too, but at least you know they have a track record of quantitative and scientific discipline.
TheLogicJunkie 11 months ago
Do not go to a big state college or private college to get an education degree. They are not usable, period. I have one, I should know. And even if you did manage to get a full time teaching job,which is unlikely anywhere in the US but the South, it will be unlikely to pay enough to cover your loans and living expenses particularly if you go to a more expensive school. Skip loans and go to a small school. You don't need the prestigious degree to be a teacher anyway. Also, consider another major.
palehman 11 months ago
This is some amazing advice. Thank you.
nielss4 1 year ago
I decided to major in rhetoric. Do you think this is wise?
theshooter2000 1 year ago
It sounds suicidally unwise to me.
You only get one financially easy chance to get a bachelor's degree, and to waste it on something that you could study on your own by either searching for relevant books on Amazon, or checking out from a library, is just a huge mistake in my mind.
Look -- if you're not ready (for whatever reasons) to pursue a bachelor's degree in something with more skill-leverage, such as accounting or engineering or whatever, then either withdraw and just work or...
TheLogicJunkie 1 year ago
transfer to a community college, where you can get the kind of fundamental-but-not-directly-marketable skills such as "rhetoric" out of the way. But don't be so irresponsibly self-indulgent as to formally declare that as your major.
If you want to MINOR in it, fine. But don't major in it. Study it to your heart's content and even become an expert in it, but don't have that be your given major, by which you market yourself.
I think any other advice is a death trap.
TheLogicJunkie 1 year ago
@TheLogicJunkie I already graduated from a community college and transferred with an A.A. in communications. I primarily studied journalism as I was told to learn to write and research. However, very few schools in my state have journalism for a bachelor's and communications was capped, but rhetoric was wide open so I applied as a rhetoric major. Also, I liked the idea of majoring in one of the original liberal arts majors. Not contradicting you, just giving you the "logic" behind my choice.
theshooter2000 1 year ago
@theshooter2000 Okay, fair enough -- but I STILL wouldn't do a rhetoric major. I would find a way to get a degree OR critical skills that you need -- but, still, preferably with an actual degree in the thing itself WITH the appropriate name, because hiring people in the outside work world are very often superficial, ignorant, and/or simply incapable of going any more deeply into your application than just the field name of your degree.
TheLogicJunkie 1 year ago
@TheLogicJunkie Well the degree that is most common for my line of work is either communications or journalism. However, they will also say something along the lines of other degrees acceptable, but communications/journalism is preferred. My university (Berkeley), just changed the name of their communications program to Media Studies and as I mentioned earlier it is capped. Although, I'm sure I could get into the major and do fine. However, it is an interdisciplinary major, so I would basically
theshooter2000 1 year ago
@TheLogicJunkie way more doing self education than anything they are telling us in my classes. You're right about math though, there was a guy younger than me at my previous company with a math degree and he had the utmost respect although he had a terrible time communicating with vendors and customers and would bring me with him to every lunch to keep up the conversation and build rapport, which is a talent of mine. Anyway, I do speak japanese (I'm not Japanese) which has always gotten me work.
theshooter2000 1 year ago
@theshooter2000 You speak Japanese? You left out that little tidbit earlier. Yeah -- that will help you a lot.
TheLogicJunkie 1 year ago
@TheLogicJunkie LOL, yeah I'm a former mormon missionary that served in Japan for 2 years. When I got home I went to work for Fuji and then later went onto call center work outsourced for AT&T both jobs were Japanese language oriented. I can't write, but with a bit of study could probably place out of the entire department easily as I can read just fine once learned. BTW, I completely agree with your views on religion, which is why I GOT THE HELL OUT!!!
theshooter2000 1 year ago
@theshooter2000 be taking courses all over the place. Luckily, I do have actual corporate work experience with a big name japanese corporation. Originally, I was going to go to a state school that had a public relations (another preferred degree) degree or a degree in journalism with an emphasis in public relations, but when Berkeley accepted me, I figured it was the right thing to do. I'm only 2 days in and already wondering if I should get out now, which led me to your videos. I've had learned
theshooter2000 1 year ago
@theshooter2000 Well, let me say that I've come to learn that the right people in the right places liking you, is at least half the battle. And the fact that you have well-placed people in Japan who will vouch for you is a HUGE feather in your cap. If it looks like you have somewhere to go in the "real" world out there waiting for you after (or, better yet, even before) graduation, then I'd say you're actually doing fine.
TheLogicJunkie 1 year ago
@TheLogicJunkie I was also told to learn how to count and minor in accounting, but I have too many credits already to do that. I tried working, but always had the problem of getting a better/higher paying position because I didn't have a degree even when I was better qualified for the position.
theshooter2000 1 year ago
Hi LogicJunkie,
I want to say I really appreciate your time. I think selfish people, and people that want to gobble up humanity (as you put it) are poisonous to humanity, and the world.
I'm not sure where humanity is heading, however I encourage you to pull through strong!
gforce194 1 year ago
Thanks for the vote of confidence. Same to you.
TheLogicJunkie 1 year ago
I was a teacher and disagree with going into teaching unless you major in math or science ed....or special ed. Otherwise, good luck on finding a job!!!!
myfletcher 1 year ago
Teaching science is a pain in the ass -- all that lab setup drives me nuts. I'd much rather teach math. And I'd only want to teach in a school where admission was conditional and hard to get, or gifted.
TheLogicJunkie 1 year ago
I thank you for all this, I had second thoughts about choices for college or even wanting to go to them. As much as people claim we should go to them without mentioning Debt.. I thank you for even bringin this to the light.. Cause God knows all those folks Praising College as a miracle never tells you that you might waste 2-5 years of your life studying and going into debt to find out you won't even have a damn job to support you or your family with. SMH @ The World we Live in today.
sephyiroth