perpetuum concept I

[chrisofnottingham]

Key fact

Motion will only happen when that motion results in a system losing energy.

If one side is *always* more buoyant/lighter then the system as a whole will not move because the next position has just the same energy ie there is no loss of energy to be had.

Being always lighter on one side can achieved more simply in mechanical systems but in these too it does not result in any motion, hence why they are only ever seen 'working' in animation.

[TheSoldierCore]

one side warm zo air whill go up and the other side is cold zo aire go down

[OnkelKunibert]

@TheSoldierCore and thats the point where its nomore a perpetuum mobile. you have to put energy into the system to cool/heat the air.

[TheSoldierCore]

@OnkelKunibert or you put 2 generators on both sides so you can make more engerie with les energie juse

[OnkelKunibert]

@TheSoldierCore that wont work.. expanding air will cause it to cool down + compressing will heat it up.

you want to cool down the side that is heating up -> you have to work against this effekt.

same on the other side -> you have to put all the energy used for compression and decompression into the system to keep the temp.

a second generator will only cause the system to take a temp. between "high" and "low" faster.

in your theorie an e-motor with 2 or more generators would produce energy?

[TheSoldierCore]

@OnkelKunibert i think it will take engerie but you can make it into a furnace so you can warm your house on less energie

[cris23dumi]

where are the calculations?

[FullMusicEcho]

this system as shown in this video is not perpetuum mobile ,you would be able to say it is mobile if it would work in outer space which it doesn't because it needs gravity.i don't know your nationalty but what can you tell me about archimedes?

[MaxXxGodBlessed]

If it will work , it will be in the edge of balance if you try to gain something from this it will destabilize.Plus i am not sure if its going to work because at the critical point when the harmonica reach the bottom and try to lift up because of the lower density ,the buoyancy will be in the middle ,vertically looking up so it will start and stop the motion.Thats what i believe:D

[TriKri]

Although the floating force will be higher for the expanded harmonicas, energy is required to compress the harmonicas when they are over water.

[overunitydotcom]

Hi, well done, but you can only get something to work, if you use the virtual centrifugal forces and convert them somehow into rotational forces. Also use springs with it to store the forces and movements. Only with levers and torque arms you will never get anything selfrunning ! This is from my own research. P.S: Please subscribe to my youtube channel. Just click on my username and the subscribe. Many thanks. Regards, Stefan.

[Sketch9816]

your saying that compressed air floats less than non compressed air which is totally wrong.

[jib1000]

lol

Powered by unicorn tears?

[kalou881]

je travail depuis plus de 10 sur ce procéder, ou une variante de ce moteur, j'ai la solution pour le rendre efficace mais je n'ai pas les finances pour le faire, contacter moi,quattro88(arobase)gmx.fr on pourrais faire de grande chose

[FarceTheory]

I like this one very much. It is equilibrium at least. But it has a design flaw.

[highvoltagefeathers]

I don't understand /HOW/ it works, cause your video provides no explanation, but I do assure you that it won't.

[pombenenge]

It would work........ if there was no gravity

[HeadShot360IN]

the energy you get from the sack going up equals, or if anything, uses more, energy to compress the sacks on the other side.

[BobMobber]

Um, when the sacks expand at the bottom....where does the air come from? There's no more air in there than when it was compressed, the air is just less dense after the sack is expanded. Same amount of air, same buoyancy.

[lucas545454]

wrong, air has more bouyancy at depth, since their is more pressure down there, air want to go up more.

[ardjan]

Actually, the air pressure has very little effect, since the buoyancy is based on the weight of the water displaced. Since water doesn't compress, the weight of the displaced water will not change much, and thus the buoyancy will stay the same.

The error in this machine is that the energy needed to expand the bags is very large (you have to work against the waterpressure), and considerably greater than the energy provided by the difference in volume between the bags. The machine will not run.

[IthenGer]

so how does it work with a scuba diving jacket then?

[cyborgtroy]

"These harmonicas are filled with air, nothing more"

Oh good, I was afraid you would pull some sleight-of-hand and fill your harmonicas [sic] with helium or something. IN AN ANIMATION.

[eltigrelid]

it might be a bit easier for a perpetual motion machine to work in a no gravity area

[lewxx]

bullshit ^^

[tigerbody1]

sure, in an animation it would work, but what happens when

you apply this to the real world?

[NfectBeats]

it got already a patent, remember seeing this past year on the patent webiste

[stitch626123]

a patent just means that you own the intlequal rights to it not that it works

[NfectBeats]

where do you read "it got a patent so it works", I was just remebering i've seen it before

[FREDARCHIMAN]

tu veux rire ;o)

[istogukosova]

my father had the same idea 15 years ago

[eltigrelid]

the heavier the material the longer it rolls, so if a giant one were made, say 40 feet high, it would probably last hours maybe days

[Matt12341234]

Or it would just balance out and stop after 2 seconds.

[eltigrelid]

that too

[tricky778]

Assuming that you had a fluid with zero viscosity, zero surface tension, a truly rigid material, zero friction bearings and material that could crumple without heating up, maybe you could get the device to run forever. But then you may as well just make a wheel.

[Aclecant]

i know it is not part of the theory of this machine, but it would be difficult to find a material that would not eventually rip or crack, or at least last for a long enough time

[sspoke]

it's a very good idea.. i know because im different too, you are trying to sink AIR which usually floats back up.. (also used to recover those ships which were shipwrecked)..

but the thing is.. Sinking AIR thats already filled up.. will take AS much power as used to make them lift up.. so it won't work.. unless you ran something that released air.. near the top and inflate near the very bottom..

I do have a actually perpetuum concept that indeed works.. but it's on the princeble of magnets..

[frankensteinmoneymac]

So far all of the magnetic pepetuum I have ever seen fail.....what makes yours different? You claim it works so you are implying it is beyond the hypothetical stage and you have a working model.........please share....putting up a video of it would be nice as well.

[sspoke]

I know why all magnetic fail and thats why mines wont.. now if you plan to built your magnetic machine up as a tower you will be dealing with gravity.. but gravity is not that much of mistake as magnets themselves..

thing is when you push a magnet into another magnets field its like ramming a soft boiled pealed egg into a hole thats smaller in circumference it's PRETTY PLAIN LOGIC.. but not many people get it.. at first I thought only I understood but thx to that i found solution cant make vid.

[frankensteinmoneymac]

Ah the old magnet as "soft boiled pealed egg into a hole" type of perpetuum.....I know it welll......Wait a minute...no I dont!!!! What the heck are you talking about!!!?? Since I have never seen nor can concieve of a perpetuum that works by means of pushing soft boiled eggs through holes...Your magnetic version which you claim works this way baffles me. Why can you not post a vid?!?! R U afraid of people stealing? Patend it 1st then. Or do U think ending Big Oils strangelhold is a bad thing?

[openingpremiere]

use 1 bag, track its movement around your setup eg point a,b,c..then think about all forces acting on it at each stage call point A..dead bottom this is the most important point in your process as transition from compressed to expanded state happens here plot its journey can it get around to point A again? If no, Put in a second one this might let you see why it can not work.Find a way to get compressed air down to fill bags YOUR RICH good luck. Damm Drawing funny circles again. Keep Trying

[openingpremiere]

played with this idea befor heres the problem air bag on way down..just as it nears bottom and then rounds it starts to expand its internal volume due to the rails it runs on getting wider apart ...this air bag would have to fight the high pressures of the water to expand. this is where i fell short then New idea FILL THE BAGS WITH COMPRESSED AIR bag will open no problem BUT what happens at the top We Have to use a lot of power to compress The air tried all sorts of depths pressures

[atremides]

You have to apply work on the bottom, against the outer force of water pressure. This is an elementary exercise for hydrostatics. A waste of resources...

[prophet2012]

You should look closer to the structure.. in the other video it becomes more clear that the rigid expandable harmonica in its collapsed form is heavier than the water but when expanded and filled with air it is lighter. because of the pressure at the bottom and the wider rails on the side it will expand and rise up. on the top the rails are tighter again allowing the harmonica to collapse and sink to the bottom. no trics just mechanics and well, lets call it hydrodynamics

[frankensteinmoneymac]

actually when it is filled with air it is heavier.......your concept relies on it being more bouyant, in water, not lighter in general. air has weight,,for instance a jar with the air vaccumed out will be lighter than one with the air still inside. It would also be more boyant than the jar with air (this might make an interesting variation on your idea)...... I think your concept is flawed, but I have not looked at it closely enough to tell exactly so I will remain open minded for the moment.

[super6plx]

@prophet2012

Interesting concept, but I suspect the energy would be lost in both the compression of the tubes and on the drag on the downward moving tubes.

[ozalisk]

@prophet2012

Man, you have two pneumatic cylinders - upper, which is being compressed, and lower, which is increasing his volume. In both places, the forces inside the upper cylinder and the force outside the lowest one are stopping the system.

If you want one more substantination, just try to patent your device. Or try to build an acting model.

[PaulMurrayCanberra]

@prophet2012 "it will expand and rise up" - only way to do that is by pulling air downward into the water, which takes the same amount of work as lifting the displaced water. People who make perpetual motion devices based on buoyancy always forget this. If the harmonica is springy enough to open by itself at the bottom, then it take exactly the same amount of input work to compress it closed again at the top.

[jlac47]

I don't understand how the structure of the harmonicas is supposed to cause water pressure to help open them.

[prophet2012]

the structure of the harmonica expands in volume when pressured, the mechanics involved are really easy actually, I suggest you look at the other videos I posted

[EverythingInane]

i don't understand, how could you have air transferred in through the edges of the balloons on a track that they move along? how could you waterproof it, seeing as how the edges of the balloons would need the air outside to expand? that and the problem of how you would keep the balloons level so they don't jam. otherwise... it seems like it just might work

[mrek94]

what is that program

[dawrr]

Looks like Solidworks or ProEngineer. I may be wrong

[Gameczar]

dont ask... just enjoy... besides nobody here knows how to explain this stuff

[Hedning1390]

How do you solve the problem with lifting water from the bottom when you try to expand the baloon thingys?

[markgandalf]

please build it... it is marvellous

[eileenniblock]

amazing concept.instead of the air being transfered through a hose on the guide rails why not transfer the air through flexible hoses from harmonica to harmonica in the centers

[prophet2012]

I did think about this as a possibility but as the waterpressure works hardest on the top and bottom it's safer to put the hoses on the sides.. allowing maximum pressure on most parts of the surface. Also i think it's better to have two hoses to allow a less pressured airflow..

[shabso]

can anyone tell with what program this animation was made?

[prophet2012]

the animation was made by a designbureau called C4 but I'm afraid they go under another name nowadays if they still exist at all, i'm sorry but I do not know which program they used.. but the animation is at least ten years old so maybe that helps narrowing it down?

[ontoue]

ignore the below comment

[anzezaf]

well it seems to me that this is the only good way to make a perpetuum mobile device, but it still wont work, but its probably the most possible one

[sam6kamel]

Nice clips, but, am I the only one that realizes that refilling the "harmonicas" at the bottom will in reality, with losses, take more energy than the floting and sinking combined will give? And it does not matter how they are refilled, or the angles, or anything else, the energy needed to refill them will be to great, that fact alone makes it impossible

[prophet2012]

through the harmonicas flows air nothing more, as the whole construction is placed in a rigid rails structure it will pull the harmonicas at the bottom outwards and also because of the unique construction of the harmonica the pressure at the bottom will instead of collapsing the structure make it grow. Just remind youreself of the mechanical boxing arm if you will, a far more simplistic harmonica but still following the same rule

[sam6kamel]

not warke i make it its just a fack video

perpetual motion is impossible

[ontoue]

its your logic that gets science nowhere

[michad9for]

don´t give up!

[fishyerik]

Nice clips, but, am I the only one that realizes that refilling the "harmonicas" at the bottom will in reality, with losses, take more energy than the floting and sinking combined will give? And it does not matter how they are refilled, or the angles, or anything else, the energy needed to refill them will be to great, that fact alone makes it impossible.

[prophet2012]

Actually due to the rigid harmonica structure the greater the pressure gets the further they want to expand.. so instead of filling them up with air.. the form at the bottom actually sucks in the air.. so the energy comes from the enormous waterpressure at the bottom. but when it sucks in more air, like a balloon it becomes lighter, allowing it to rise to the surface.

[fishyerik]

The waterpressure will not make the "harmonicas" suck air into them, it will work in the exact opposite way. In order the make the "harmoincas" suck in air they will have to expand, totally, an the waterpressure works agains that, and over the whole surface. No matter what shape or form on the harmonicas.

So, one of the forces you think will work for you will in fact consume ALL the energy you can get, in other parts of the construction, sorry. Nice clips.

[prophet2012]

the waterpressure does not work against this in fact, it's the pressure that will allow the harmonica to expand, a simple example of this mechanical marvel you already know, namely the mechanical boxing arm a very simple device which expands when pressured.. the difference with these harmonica's is offcourse that they are hollow structures which become bigger , not smaller when pressured

[grasswine]

Very cool. Check out my perpetuum video too

[JRodJiggle]

try a V8. that will solve all your motion problems and make it go faster. ba dum chhh

XD

[prophet2012]

funny :D

[Sneadron]

...continued... it seems as though the whole system should move throught the water column. All of the accordian sacks appear to be interconnected by a blue hose. The sticking point is at the bottom of the loop, the force necessary to expand the accordian against the pressure of the water at the bottom would swamp the boyancy of the rising expandes sacks. (Ever try to breathe with a five foot

deep snorkel? It feels like one's lungs are being crushed) However,superconductivitycanbe­nearlyperpetu

[prophet2012]

thanks for the comments.. if you take the time to read the other comments i gave. i pretty much lay it all out there. It's true that the whole structure depends on choice of material rather than friction as the lifting power of air inside the harmonicas will be sufficient to overcome the friction.. but we need strong and expensive materials to make it...

[Sneadron]

When I first saw this, I thought it was a power plant for harvesting energy from the tempature gragient in ocean water, such as was proposed in the Usborne books of the 70's. I see too much fluid friction...Bubbles rise because the liquid is racing around the pocket of gas to get underneath it, therebly lowering its energy potential. Things rise (bubbles, baloons) because other stuff is going down. If there is no net downward movement of water...

[vietarc]

you need to modify your loop alittle bit. Separate them, then heat up 1 loop and cool the other loop. The main point is have a different temperature in each loop ===> different density in each loop. Heavery water go down as hot water rise. It's natual circulation.

[fueltvfan]

anything is possible with the human mind. DONT GIVE UP.

[prophet2012]

I won't, thanks :)

[neuron333]

we need more people like you posting, a little positive encouragement goes a long ways! I also have many ideas and could use some myself. Maybe I'll post some soon ...

[m1leswilliams]

Not anything. Energy cannot be created or destroyed. Simple as that.

[church1000]

But it can be harnessed.

[thatguypete]

So, how does stretching (compressing?) the bags make them any less bouyant?

[prophet2012]

the structure of the harmonica allows it to increase it's volume when pressured.. so once the harmonica passes it's lowest point and glides into the wider rails, it will stretch.. allowing it to fill up with air so the volume outnumbers the weight of the harmonica.. and now, much like a balloon.. it will by law of buoyancy try to surface.. when it's there the rails guide it into its smaller shape pushing the air out and making gravity the bigger force opposed to the working buoyancy..

[sigurdbjorli]

from where do you get that air? from the water?

[prophet2012]

the air sits inside the harmonicas as they are hollow structuresand they are interconnected so the air can flow around

[prophet2012]

so you see .. it's the displacement of water in a closed loop system with more gravity on one side and more buoyancy on the other.. the only critical point, in my views, would not be as some state friction.. but the angle at which the harmonicas open and close.. especially when you're talking large structures.. calculating the amounts of pressure at the bottom... the rails therefor are of crucial importance aswell... i guess it comes down to choice of materials thank you for commenting

[RFTAEC100]

it has already been made :'( well next time

[joachim2464]

There is no perpetuum mobile machine that can last forever yet!

[ShadyMan01]

And I'm sorry to say, there never will be. Energy is lost in the system through nonconservative forces such as friction etc, you cannot have a perpetual motion machine.

[joachim2464]

i know, but you never know, lol.

[RFTAEC100]

what if you fill just one side of the columns with water? change the cocoons for baloons or pingpong balls , and to avoid the water from rising to the other side, use an elastic valve, so that it widens when the baloon/ball is forced trough it, and when it passes the valve closes. Once the baloon/ball is in the water column, it will be forced up pulling the other ones in the empty column

[goldocoasto]

I had the same idea.I swear.

[BarrykeNL]

Love the idea, here are my 2 cents.

The pressure force pushing the cocoons UP is equal or less than the pressure preventing them from expanding. Thus expanding them will be difficult, if you cannot cancel out the pressure force at the deepest point.

[prophet2012]

these cocoons are harmonica- like metal constructions (look at the other vids for detail), built into a fixed railway. the air inside the harmonicas is a closed loop system. so like a balloon when the harmonica opens up it will rise to the surface pulling the empty cocoons under water again. also the weight of the empty cocoon allows it to sink to the bottom whereas the pressure at the bottom causes it to open up, sucking in air

[prophet2012]

the real question, i believe, is the angle of the harmonica because it's all about enough pressure on on all sides to allow it to expand. if the angle is wrong it will just sit there.. so you have to choose an angle which makes it "want" to expand at the bottom so it can suck in air and rise again

[cganivet]

I have only one thing to say. Build one and lets see it work.

[prophet2012]

I can only agree on that... we're working on it...

[matt4magic]

A question for you then, why won't it work, even if there were a separate air hose that could be attached during the pressuration?

[Hippie1abc]

you think that 2012 will come the 5th dimension or something??? i like your video.

[prophet2012]

Thanks, and no I don't think we'll enter a 5th dimension. Honestly I wouldn''t even know what that meant :) but I do believe that in a changing world the date 21/12/2012 certainly draws a line in our imagination as to how much shit we can take.. I mean it has to end some time.. better sooner than later :p... it probably means nothing but I even found banks who don't provide certain insurances beyond 2012 or shortly after.. seems like even they are suspicious go figure

[hartiberlin]

Hi,

please come to overunity dot com

to discuss your machine.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.

[atmeneti2]

I can only see an animation not a perpetuum mobile.

What is what ? Who is who? Some explanation would be needed I think..

[prophet2012]

yes well in the link supplied you can find several explanations.. also I posted 7 other animations on the same machine/idea. Aniway, in short the idea is that you use the elements air and water to set the whole thing in motion. the struchtures -or harmonicas if you will- stretch and fold along a railway immersed in water. at the downward side the railway is rather small so the harmocas push all the possible air inside outwards making them more heavy so they drop to the bottom of the tank.

[Grrand]

It stability, it can't to motion because it stability...

Or... i don't know

[Grrand]

It can't work

[prophet2012]

that's the easy answer offcourse. But why wouldn't it?

[matt4magic]

The force needed to expand the air volume is equal to the lifting force -> equlibrium - friction.

[dire67]

Prophet, My appologies. I don't mean to neg, but I'm trying hard to understand the concept. I didn't get audio so that might have something to do with it. Alas, with the limited 411 I have, they would seem to find equalibrium.

[prophet2012]

well the concept relies on unbalancing the equation.. and giving direction to the desired motion. when the 'harmonicas' are deflated they are heavier and will sink the reason they don't fill up is because they are restraint by the rails they are in, once these rails get wider againon the upward side the harmonicas fill up with air making them lighter and so they want to rise to the surface.. where they get pushed inwards again making them sink into the water..

[dire67]

Well that makes more sense. Find a way to make it work. Good luck!

[ccederlo]

Sorry, but there is one flaw in this idea. you explain it by saying "once these rails get wider again on the upward side the harmoncias fill up with air" Well, lets think... the harmonicas are under water so when the rails get widers, they will fill up with water..

And if your counter is to say they get air through piping in the rails.. well, the drag force and force required to simply expand the harmonicas would be too large.

Keep up the ideas though! One day society will crack the code!

[prophet2012]

sorry I know that was a short reply. The thing is that the outside pressure of the water at its deepest point will cause the pressure needed to expand and yes it's a closed system with tubes alongside the harmonicas. so there's no extra input, the rails are needed to make sure the harmonicas stop at their max/min shape. and help them keep holding a straight line. remember that waterpressure works in all directions and that heavy objects sink and filled with air will rise

[DeepHamster]

Thermodynamics is 200 years old dude, time to get up to date.

[gfcgamer]

Yea better trow the all the laws of thermodinamics in the trash!

DIY some free energy devices to see other videos to see that this laws, is in truth nothign more than stupid rules limited to 2D in a 3D world.

[DeepHamster]

You got me wrong, my point was, thermodynamics has been worked on and validated for 200 years, so I said it was time for the author to catch up with the world already.

[gfcgamer]

Living Energies: Viktor Schauberger's Brilliant Work with Natural Energy Explained

=> And all other books translated by Callum Coats.

Nothing else to say here, is up to you now.

[fingerprint211b]

I agree. As sad as it may sound, perpetuum motion doesn't exist. But there is free energy,which we don't need to invest matter or energy into, and would be wasted if not used : sun, wind, water, etc...