I am a direct decendent of Bartlome Romero a general in Juan Onates military. If Juan would have been a native he would have been a good warrior since he was spanish he was a terrorist. Where is the justice in the scalpings of that day that seems quite cruel and unusual to me.
Apache artist Bob Haozous has said that Don Juan de Oñate had a small amount of Aztec ancestry mixed in with his Spanishness. But, Wikipedia claims he was of Basque descent, while other Web sites say he was of Spanish nobility, or even a Spanish-Jew. Oñate is as much mystery as he is controversy.
@JeffGR4 HELLO I DO REMEMBER ! I'M GREATGRANDSON OF FERNADIN DE ARAGON 2 )KING OF SPAIN JUAN ONATE IS MY 1ST COUSIN 16 GENERATION AND PROUD OF IT , JEWISH AND ONCE NOBLE UNTIL THE ABOLISHMENT OF ALL NOBEL TITLE 1824 , WE ONCE HAD GREAT AMOUNTS OF LAND WE ARE DESCEDANTS OF JOSE VASQUEZ BORREGO(FOUNDER OF DOLORES AND (TOMAS SANCHEZ ) FOUNDER LAREDO TX , BROTHER OF DIEGO VASQUEZ BORREGO FATHER OF NEW MEXICO'S FOUNDER YOEL POMPA
@JeffGR4 and his desceandants did have aztec blood some of the of his family married moctezuma 2 daughters i have a family tree connecting us , hernan cortez is included
If those guys are Native Americans I am from Finland. A great part of so called "Native" Americans are multiracial, and many times more white than indian. And take into account that in all the Spanish expeditions, including Oñate´s, there were more Indians than Whites. Of course Indians supporterd Oñate. If there is one Native among those guys probably his ancestor arrived as support troops for Oñate´s expedition....
its funny if it wasnt for the spanish el paso would have never been established and not to mention that was the way of life, how about the aztec they were all wiped out by the spanish but then again im just a normal citizen, stupid native "AMERICANS"
you have to see it from both sides in stead of being ignorant and just thinking your right. no we shouldn't tear down the aqueducts. but were talking about a statue. statue s are made to honor and glorify some one. i recognize what onate did the exploration was good. And your speaking for spain even the king of spain banished him from new mexico when word got to him of what onate did your backing up someone that in that time was looked down on.
@ssszar like i said before you don't tear down aqueducts just cause "hethens" used them. if you have someone who is good at something use them. There are alot of great leaders but unfortunately there comunist or out of their minds you don't build statues of them.
@ElPasoBound17 that has nothing to do with onate, onate to new mexicans is our george washington, an din comparison onate was a far better man than washington, the fact the americans have lied about our founding fathers shows us that we need to bring the truth to light, and his memory must be honored by us who are descended from the spanish colonists,so yes a statue must be built in honor of him, and the fact is onate did nothing the americans accuse him of
@ssszar oh please if anything hes your christopher columbus. George Washington was born and raised here on american soil. he fought against warriors and soldiers who were willing he didn't go around cutting off the feet of the natives when they lost and didn't harm the women and the children. how can you be so ready to defend onate and not the founding fathers of our nation. and what truth to light?
@ElPasoBound17 and onate was born in mexico, do you even know how the battle of acoma started, it was an ambush by the people of acoma, the spanish went their to trade, after the battle onate put some of the acoma warriors on trial, he didnt march in and start looking for feet to cut off, after the trial those found guilty were sentenced to servitude for a set time, what good would a one footed servant be?
@ElPasoBound17 not to mention that the trial transcripts say the sentence was to have their toes cut off, not the whole foot, the whole foot was started by anti spanish pro american heretic bigots here, you ask why im ready to defend onate and not the founding fathers of the united states? because im proud of my spanish history, im a son of spain, a new mexican nationalist, and im not american.
@ssszar oh well you know as long as its just their toes after all people do that everyday and its perfectly humain. well spanish blood runs through my veins too I am an American. i have no idea why you are making such a commotion over this statue when first of all idk if you even live here in el paso but you clearly state not to be an American and this is an American issue
@ElPasoBound17 no people dont do that every day today, however back then it was a common punishment in the old world, considering onates own nephew was murdered in the ambush it seems he showed alot control.
@ElPasoBound17 this is more than an american issue, whenever in new mexico the sons and daughters wish to place a statue to one of our heroes the communists, the protestants, the americans all come out of the woodwork to promote anti spanish lies and hate, he have to put up with statues of the child murderer pop'e but when we want to honor the founding father of new mexico people like you promote anti spanish black legened lies
George Washington is hardly the standard bearer for morality, as he was a slave owner who restricted participation to government for only rich and powerful land owning white men.
Thomas Paine, the great liberal thinker who was ahead of his time ended up condemning Washington for that.
Besides, if an apache killed a pueblo indian it was a "cultural expression" but if a conquistador killed an indian it was a genocidal act. The guy in red t-shirt says we make no distinctions, so why do they distinguish between an apache who came from Asia and who raped, stole and murdered and a conquistador? It's wrong to approach history from a moral view.
@juampy69 Except that imperialist Europeans killed over 100 million indigenous people. Indigenous tribes didn't all say cumbiyah together but they didn't kill millions of people.
@uncleruckus714 And, how can you calculate the number of americans indegenous killed by themselves since 15.000 years before Christ? Where are the books with the correct numbers? There is nothing to calculate that. Just a vain attempt to become feelings into science. Humanity is made of conquests; how can we change that? By means of hating any human being who existed before you? Is that the formula?
@uncleruckus714 I insist. Please tell me the figures of 15000 years of history in pre-Columbian people. Maybe more people were killed. Should we talk about aztec wars? Should we talk about Ahuitzol emperor in 1487? He killed 80000 mexicans in only 4 days. 14 deaths by minute for 96 hours. A level of killing more intense than Auschwitz. Dont replace knowledge with feelings. I understand your feelings but history is more complicated than that.
I'd like to say a few things from Spain. If Spanish conquest was horrible, Roman conquest of Spain was horrible too, so please, let's erase any trace of Roman conquest from Spanish soil. Let's demolish the aqueducts, the arcs and the bridges. Let's demolish the Arc of Triumph in Paris, on account of the 10 million dead in Napoleonic wars. The history of mankind is a history of conquests. Whether we like it or not.
It wasn't a massacre. 70 Spanish soldiers fought against 2,000 Acoma people barricaded behind the walls of the city on top of the mountain (a city that was presumed to be indestructible). The Acoma knew the Spaniards were coming and were ready and waiting. The soldiers had only their swords, a small cannon and "muchos cojones". The Acoma people fought like angry demons with everything they had. The natives outnumbered the Spaniards by 10 to 1. Genocide? It was an epic battle.
The Acoma natives are just playing with history by changing many of the facts (what is that about cutting off the feet of all natives men???) to gain easy support and sympathy from people who know nothing about history. But it is very simple to understand. If the Spanish were so cruel and evil, how is it possible that the Acoma people and so many other native Americans tribes are still alive and were allowed to keep their culture, religion and traditions?
Don Juan de Oñate did not killed he just cut off every indians' right foot, because the indians killed his nephew and Don Juan de Oñate loved him like his son.
If these Indians are there bothering, reproaching and making the monkeys (natural thing in them) it is because the conquerors decided not to kill them to all. I recognize that the anglo-saxon colonists they acted with more intelligence and to the few ones that left alive they confined them in reserves.
is monument has nothing to do with Europeans,or rich white people. Onate was born on what is now Mexican soil. Onate is Mestizaje. This monument is dedicated to the first wave of hispanic migration into what is now the USA. Everyone faught 26 generations ago....Pueblo vs Pueblo.....Apache vs Pueblo..Respect that you cry baby indians.you killed plenty of your own.... RESPECT OUR CULTURE!
I already answered two months ago to your stupidity. I will exhort to you than you don't say more foolishness and stupidities about my country, when your country are not an example in nothing, nor before nor now, and less to give lessons of moral
Why did tax payer money go to build a monument to a criminal against humanity? If they wanted to build a monument to Ichman or Hitler would we protest?
I want to put up a Jeffrey Dahmer monument. Perhaps El Paso is interested? Regardless of whatever explanations of history, honoring any filthy Spanish conquistador is an offense to any native america. They were invading catholic bastards period, and the hispanic culture is still a macho ignorance-ssturated cult based on violence and overbreeding.
John Houser has created a monster, honoring Juan de Oñate dishonours civilization, democracy, and pays tribute to violence, rapes, killing again the Peoples Native Americans. I am glad that I Native Americans have said "shame" in the face to these people accomplices of these crimes committed in history on the skin of innocent people, guilty only to exist.
¿porqué será que la gran mayoría de los estadounidenses ven con buenos ojos a los conquistadores españoles? posiblemente es porque trabajan, son cultos, tienen futuro y miran por su futuro y saber aprecir las cosas buenas que España dejó en América, por eso cuando te vas a al oeste de USA te encuentras nombres españoles por todas partes.
A los otros, a los que critica les diria que si no les gusta lo que ven, que se larguen a sus paises y traten de erradicar el idioma español de alli.
THESE DAMN "NATIVE AMERICANS" NEED TO BE SUPRESSED....AT LEAST AS LONG AS WE THE FORIEGNER DESCENT PEOPLE ARE HERE.
Can you imagine these damn Indigenous people being free and liberated like the peoples of India, Pakistan, Phillipines, millions of people in Africa, and NOW....Kosovo
(2/17/08 declared independence)is free from Serbia, too...this is wrong.
These damn "Native" people must never ever be free and liberated...long live USA.
Juan De Onate was a great man that brought civilization to an uncivilized land. Just listen to these savages shriek and holler like wild animals! That should tell any reasonable person what Juan De Onate was dealing with when he subdued their savage ancestors. When Onate colonized New Mexico and the South West the Indians were living in the stone age. They had yet to invent the wheel. Give me a break, Juan De Onate even brought civilization to the
FACT: The Indians that Oñate conquered were living a neolithic lifestyle.
Where was your metallurgy? Where were your wheels? Why were you eating each other?
You cannot expect to stagnate in the stone age while the rest of the world experiences the renaissance and think that you're going to make it through unscathed.
Haven't you ever played Civilization IV? If you don't keep up with science, you WILL be conquered by people who do.
¿como te atreves a decir que la mayoría de los españoles cometieron violaciones? ¿estuviste alli para verlo? no digo que hubieran violaciones pero igual tambien hubo muchos matrimonios mixtos. Lo que pasa es que allí siempre pensais lo peor cuando se trata de españoles. El sistema de castas .... Costa Rica y Chile prosperan ¿siguen teniendo alli el sistema de castas?
Para empezar ya vivo en España, soy español, y a mi la verdad ni me gusta ni me disgusta, porque la historia no se puede cambiar. Solo que vosotros en vez de mirar para el futuro solo miráis para el pasado.
Pero ¿de que me estás hablando? para empezar ¿de donde eres? porque si eres norteamericano, es decir estadounidense, gringo, WASP etc entonces será mejor que te calles la boca porque no estás en condiciones de dar lecciones. Y si eres mexicano o hispano residente en Estados Unidos solo te quiero decir que el pasado es el pasado y ya no se puede regresar a el, sino ahora convivir lo mejor posible con los demás y aprender de los errores.
Los gitanos llevan 300 años en España y es un pueblo por ejemplo que no vale. Nunca han prosperado en nada, pero al igual que los indios, se benefician de nuestro nivel de vida y de los progresos de nuestra civilizacion occidental. Sin embargo, los judios y los chinos nos son europeos y alli donde van, prosperan...sigue siendo culpa del hombre blanco? No. Es que quien no vale, no vale y punto, pasen 500 o 200 años
DearFamilyMember...quien no vale, no vale. Hayan pasado 500 años de la llegada de los españoles, o 200 años de independencia. En la america española los indigenas tuvieron libertad para hacer lo que quisieran y no lo hicieran, no estudiaron, nos prosperaron. Asi que dejate de la excusa del europeismo para justificar la falta de progreso de los indigenas
¿Apoca los Indígenas se independizaron de los europeos? ¡Nunca! Sigue la ocupación. Domas porque ellos reclaman llamarse "EE.UU.s", "Argentinos" o "Brasileños" siguen siendo europeas bajo la mascara. Esto esta manifestado en la campaña y glorificaciones de idiomas, religiones, arquitecturas, ascéticos extranjeros que sus descendientes han promovido. ¿Dime si los presidentes, personas de riqueza o los dueños de gran hectáreas de tierras son Indígenas?
But that they don't sin with the hypocrisy, because if they dress pants it is because there spaniards (in this case, Juan de Oñate) and other europeans arrived
I don't understand the natives, to the Muslims, etc etc etc...They criticize the Europeans (in this case, their historical past), to the white North Americans, and however, they benefit of all our civilization. If they want to be true Indian that they will live in caves, that they pray to the pachamama and instead of eating pizza that they eat ants.
No colonialist country has had any fray Bartolomé De Las Casas that denounced the abuse to the Indians, and if the Spaniards had had a true politics of horror, many of the tribes that now are manifested against they could not make it, because they had been locked in reservations
It is curious the aversion that Spain still takes place in some indigenous populations. It is not to attack the French or the own North Americans in yes whose brutalities are more recent, as Wounded Knee massacre, 1890. No. Are always the Spaniards, although with massacres of several centuries
I believe that it is something truly absurd that there are people that in the XXI century, in a democratic country, prosper and in peace, seek to live and to act as ago 500 year-old people, in this case as in the north america of the XVI century
I have said, United States doesn't have anything in comparison with the monuments that there is in Spain and that they left other civilizations. The life in those times was of this way: Brutality and war. And in the case of United States, spaniards contributed something: the agriculture, the ranching, the introduction of the horse, the taming, the equestrian art, the rodeo or the cowboy (that for if you don't know it, all this is of Spanish origin)
Qué paradoja, que sean los estadounidenses los que precisamente admiran más a los conquistadores españoles. Desde luego no son los acomplejados desagradecidos que viven de Mexico para abajo.
Los Indígenas del continente de "Américas" también no odian domas para odiar. Pero si odian a estatuas que representan la perpetua ocupación y conquista de las tierras de los Indígenas. Este hombre represento y lucho los intereses de los extranjeros y no por los Indígenas, por ejemplo, expandió y apoyo la colonización, Cristianismo, robo de tierras, masacres, etcétera. Después de todo hoy los europeos del norte lo están glorificando como un líder. ¿Esto es mal no crees?
Los españoles hicieron algo que no hicieron los ingleses: mezclarse con los indígenas y no meterlos en reservas como si fueran poblacion afestada. Eso está pasando en USA, pero vete a cualquier pais de Hispanoamérica y verás que eso no ocurre.
¿Robo de tierras y masacres? pues eso sería con la independencia ¿o eso no lo has estudiado? que esos paises hoy en dia vayan tan mal es culpa de ellos, estan independizados desde hace 200 años.
¿Destruimos el acueducto de Segovia o el anfiteatro de Merida, que fueron construido por los romanos?¿Destruimos la Alhambra? Pero qué gente más estupida son los indigenas de America (no todos, al menos estos y los que piensan como estos con Juan de Oñate). Si tuvieran las invasiones y las guerras que ha tenido España en 2500 años odiarian a medio mundo, y sin embargo en España, hasta el extremo de conservar cosas de las civilizaciones que han pasado por aquí
-juanjoseph: Do not be upset because the "Natives" refuse to be passive, be more tolerant.
Did they really need foreigners and horses to survive? The "Native" were doing fine which explains the more than 35,000 thousand years of their historical presence on the "Americas" with out foreigners and horses to survive. May the Indigenous people succeed in their plight to free themselves and their lands "continent of the Americas" from the perpetual occupation since 1492.
Occupation is the one that has made your country, putting the few existent Indians in USA in reserves as if they were infected. The Spaniards didn't make the same thing.
Exactly, the Spaniards and their descedents forced Christianity (or persuaded), occupied the lands, racially discriminated, massacred the Indigenous peoples for centuries as well introducing small pox and other diseases which also dicimated the "Native" population. Thanks for distinguishing this difference.
and the Englishmen what they made? did they colonize those lands with roses, carnations and smiles? at least in the lands conquered by the Spaniards the natives they don't live in reserves. In United States the natives live in reservations as if they were infected. HYPOCRITE.
juan de oñate's father is cristobal de oñate, founder of Guadalajara, Cristobal de Oñate is the grandson of Pedro de Baeza, lord of Narrihondo, who was a desendant from the house of Haro, the lords of Bizkaiko, its family founded the Gernikako Arbola: the symbol of al freedom and liberties Euskadi
Married Isabel Moctezuma grandaughter of Moctezuma Xocoyotzin(an aztec emperor) and daughter of Hernán Cortes
show more respect
atte. Juan José Hernández Oñate, descendant of Juan de Oñate
Los europeos y sus descendientes siguen ocupando las tierras de los Indígenas "América".
Si no lo miras así pues estas mirando por un punto de vista euro céntrico.
Los Indígenas apoyan unión y liberación ya después que los europeas y sus viviendo descendientes (por más de 500 años) siguen queriendo glorificar monstruos que invadieron y teorizaron los Indígenas en el aquel tiempo. La estatua apoya y perpetúa "la conquista" a los Indígenas.
La vida es así, conquistar y/o ser conquistado ¿nunca te has preguntado qué habitantes existian en América antes de que llegaran los llamados "indígenas americanos"? España tambien estuvo a punto de ser conquistada por completo por los musulmanes pero aunque tardaron casi 8 siglos en expulsaros al final lo consiguieron.
De nada os sirve lamentaros, la historia es como es. Preocuparos de trabajar y salir adelante y quitaros ya los pajaros de la cabeza.
Es triste que la tribu Ácoma muestra esta falta de respeto al escultor, gritando mientras presenta su discurso, perdiendo la oportunidad de escuchar lo que puede resultar en un mejor entendimiento entre dos culturas. Es triste que tampoco entienden que olvidar la historia en su enteridad significa olvidar lecciones muy importantes además del sufrimiento y la angustia de su propia gente. Por favor, dejen de negar a su pasado.
Afirmar que el sistema de clases actual en SudAmerica se deba a lo que los españoles hicieror hace más de 400 años es demagogia pura? Seria como culpar a Roma por lo que pueda ocurrir en la actualidad de España! No parece esto ridiculo? A mi si y mucho.
Se creeran que estaban mejor practicando sacrificios humanos que nada tenian que ver con su "systema" de castas, verdad? de Risa!
A lo mejor el progreso no es para todo el mundo y por eso algunos prefieran seguir vistiendo en taparabo LOL!
These Europeans and supporters deserve a metal of honor for their contributions in making an invader into a hero!
The statue is a reaffirmation and propaganda symbol to make the Indigenous peoples' lands "America" more hospitable to present day European-"Americans" (squatters) in their endless effort to Europeanize "America".
It revives the colonization notion:
"Freedom, Liberty, and Justice for the Indigenous people...Never!"
I feel horribly embarrassed for the Indians in this video. They behaved horribly at that dedication. They showed a complete lack of respect for others culture as if they had never committed any crimes and are guilt free of anything. When are people going to give up this act of entitlement for a history that occurred over 400 years ago.
ACOMA INDIANS.....YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED FOR YOUR BEHAVIOR AT THAT DEDICATION.
Like it or not Juan de Onate is one of the pioneers and founders of the United States of America, he did not put the American Natives in reservations like others did. And he is related to Moctezuma and Hernán Cortés.
In the Middle Ages 500 years ago every person in the Americas had officially the same treat and rights than the Spaniards back in Europe. 500 years ago, alright?!!
Hello, the answer is that Juan de Oñate married Isabel de Tolosa Cortés Moctezuma, a descendant of the famous conquistador Hernán Cortés and the Aztec emperor Moctezuma. They had a son and a daughter.
juan de oñate's father is cristobal de oñate, founder of Guadalajara, Zacatecas and Tepic. Cristobal de Oñate is the grandson of Pedro de Baeza, lord of Narrihondo, who was a desendant from the house of Haro, the lords of Bizkaiko, its family founded the Gernikako Arbola: the symbol of al freedom and liberties Euskadi
Married Isabel Moctezuma grandaughter of Moctezuma Xocoyotzin(an aztec emperor) and daughter of Hernán Cortes
The truth of it is that the spaniards at the end got mixed with the native americans, Hernán Cortés, Juan de Oñate and all them, but the anglosaxons killed them all. And put them in reservations. I am not bitter anyway. The catholic kings of Spain, Isabel and Fernando gave the same treat to every person in the New World, the spanish nationality, and that was 500 years ago!!!!! Nobody remembers that!!!
I agree! The religion of the natives was also replaced with Christianity and Catholicism. Why celebrate those colonial holidays- why not maintain the native religious roots!
@marblecutter HELLO I DO REMEMBER ! I'M GREATGRANDSON OF FERNADIN DE ARAGON 2 )KING OF SPAIN JUAN ONATE IS MY 1ST COUSIN 16 GENERATION AND PROUD OF IT , JEWISH AND ONCE NOBLE UNTIL THE ABOLISHMENT OF ALL NOBEL TITLE 1824 , WE ONCE HAD GREAT AMOUNTS OF LAND WE ARE DESCEDANTS OF JOSE VASQUEZ BORREGO(FOUNDER OF DOLORES AND (TOMAS SANCHEZ ) FOUNDER LAREDO TX , BROTHER OF DIEGO VASQUEZ BORREGO FATHER OF NEW MEXICO'S FOUNDER YOEL POMPA
HELLO I DO REMEMBER ! I'M GREATGRANDSON OF FERNADIN DE ARAGON 2 )KING OF SPAIN JUAN ONATE IS MY 1ST COUSIN 16 GENERATION AND PROUD OF IT , JEWISH AND ONCE NOBLE UNTIL THE ABOLISHMENT OF ALL NOBEL TITLE 1824 , WE ONCE HAD GREAT AMOUNTS OF LAND WE ARE DESCEDANTS OF JOSE VASQUEZ BORREGO(FOUNDER OF DOLORES AND (TOMAS SANCHEZ ) FOUNDER LAREDO TX , BROTHER OF DIEGO VASQUEZ BORREGO FATHER OF NEW MEXICO'S FOUNDER YOEL POMPA
I am a direct decendent of Bartlome Romero a general in Juan Onates military. If Juan would have been a native he would have been a good warrior since he was spanish he was a terrorist. Where is the justice in the scalpings of that day that seems quite cruel and unusual to me.
Dustmero1 4 months ago
More black legend lies. If you study the archives onate showed great restraint against Indian attacks including attempts to kill him.
Conquistador505 6 months ago
Apache artist Bob Haozous has said that Don Juan de Oñate had a small amount of Aztec ancestry mixed in with his Spanishness. But, Wikipedia claims he was of Basque descent, while other Web sites say he was of Spanish nobility, or even a Spanish-Jew. Oñate is as much mystery as he is controversy.
JeffGR4 1 year ago
@JeffGR4 HELLO I DO REMEMBER ! I'M GREATGRANDSON OF FERNADIN DE ARAGON 2 )KING OF SPAIN JUAN ONATE IS MY 1ST COUSIN 16 GENERATION AND PROUD OF IT , JEWISH AND ONCE NOBLE UNTIL THE ABOLISHMENT OF ALL NOBEL TITLE 1824 , WE ONCE HAD GREAT AMOUNTS OF LAND WE ARE DESCEDANTS OF JOSE VASQUEZ BORREGO(FOUNDER OF DOLORES AND (TOMAS SANCHEZ ) FOUNDER LAREDO TX , BROTHER OF DIEGO VASQUEZ BORREGO FATHER OF NEW MEXICO'S FOUNDER YOEL POMPA
1r2h5f 1 year ago
@JeffGR4 and his desceandants did have aztec blood some of the of his family married moctezuma 2 daughters i have a family tree connecting us , hernan cortez is included
1r2h5f 1 year ago
Fucking Indigenous. Live Spain and Juan de Oñate!
TemerosoDeDios 1 year ago
If those guys are Native Americans I am from Finland. A great part of so called "Native" Americans are multiracial, and many times more white than indian. And take into account that in all the Spanish expeditions, including Oñate´s, there were more Indians than Whites. Of course Indians supporterd Oñate. If there is one Native among those guys probably his ancestor arrived as support troops for Oñate´s expedition....
trokoro 1 year ago
its funny if it wasnt for the spanish el paso would have never been established and not to mention that was the way of life, how about the aztec they were all wiped out by the spanish but then again im just a normal citizen, stupid native "AMERICANS"
xcon1983 1 year ago
you have to see it from both sides in stead of being ignorant and just thinking your right. no we shouldn't tear down the aqueducts. but were talking about a statue. statue s are made to honor and glorify some one. i recognize what onate did the exploration was good. And your speaking for spain even the king of spain banished him from new mexico when word got to him of what onate did your backing up someone that in that time was looked down on.
ElPasoBound17 2 years ago
avtually onate when onates reign as governor was over, and after his review he was made the chief mining operator of the entire spanish empire
ssszar 1 year ago
@ssszar like i said before you don't tear down aqueducts just cause "hethens" used them. if you have someone who is good at something use them. There are alot of great leaders but unfortunately there comunist or out of their minds you don't build statues of them.
ElPasoBound17 1 year ago
@ElPasoBound17 that has nothing to do with onate, onate to new mexicans is our george washington, an din comparison onate was a far better man than washington, the fact the americans have lied about our founding fathers shows us that we need to bring the truth to light, and his memory must be honored by us who are descended from the spanish colonists,so yes a statue must be built in honor of him, and the fact is onate did nothing the americans accuse him of
ssszar 1 year ago
@ssszar oh please if anything hes your christopher columbus. George Washington was born and raised here on american soil. he fought against warriors and soldiers who were willing he didn't go around cutting off the feet of the natives when they lost and didn't harm the women and the children. how can you be so ready to defend onate and not the founding fathers of our nation. and what truth to light?
ElPasoBound17 1 year ago
@ElPasoBound17 and onate was born in mexico, do you even know how the battle of acoma started, it was an ambush by the people of acoma, the spanish went their to trade, after the battle onate put some of the acoma warriors on trial, he didnt march in and start looking for feet to cut off, after the trial those found guilty were sentenced to servitude for a set time, what good would a one footed servant be?
ssszar 1 year ago
@ElPasoBound17 not to mention that the trial transcripts say the sentence was to have their toes cut off, not the whole foot, the whole foot was started by anti spanish pro american heretic bigots here, you ask why im ready to defend onate and not the founding fathers of the united states? because im proud of my spanish history, im a son of spain, a new mexican nationalist, and im not american.
ssszar 1 year ago
@ssszar oh well you know as long as its just their toes after all people do that everyday and its perfectly humain. well spanish blood runs through my veins too I am an American. i have no idea why you are making such a commotion over this statue when first of all idk if you even live here in el paso but you clearly state not to be an American and this is an American issue
ElPasoBound17 1 year ago
@ElPasoBound17 no people dont do that every day today, however back then it was a common punishment in the old world, considering onates own nephew was murdered in the ambush it seems he showed alot control.
ssszar 1 year ago
@ElPasoBound17 this is more than an american issue, whenever in new mexico the sons and daughters wish to place a statue to one of our heroes the communists, the protestants, the americans all come out of the woodwork to promote anti spanish lies and hate, he have to put up with statues of the child murderer pop'e but when we want to honor the founding father of new mexico people like you promote anti spanish black legened lies
ssszar 1 year ago
@ElPasoBound17
George Washington is hardly the standard bearer for morality, as he was a slave owner who restricted participation to government for only rich and powerful land owning white men.
Thomas Paine, the great liberal thinker who was ahead of his time ended up condemning Washington for that.
Rahab111222 1 year ago
Besides, if an apache killed a pueblo indian it was a "cultural expression" but if a conquistador killed an indian it was a genocidal act. The guy in red t-shirt says we make no distinctions, so why do they distinguish between an apache who came from Asia and who raped, stole and murdered and a conquistador? It's wrong to approach history from a moral view.
juampy69 2 years ago 2
Comment removed
ScapularSaves 2 years ago
@juampy69 Except that imperialist Europeans killed over 100 million indigenous people. Indigenous tribes didn't all say cumbiyah together but they didn't kill millions of people.
uncleruckus714 2 months ago 5
@uncleruckus714 And, how can you calculate the number of americans indegenous killed by themselves since 15.000 years before Christ? Where are the books with the correct numbers? There is nothing to calculate that. Just a vain attempt to become feelings into science. Humanity is made of conquests; how can we change that? By means of hating any human being who existed before you? Is that the formula?
juampy69 2 months ago
@juampy69 Imperialist Europeans wiped out 90-95 percent which adds up to 100 million indigenous people in less than 500 years.
uncleruckus714 2 months ago
@uncleruckus714 I insist. Please tell me the figures of 15000 years of history in pre-Columbian people. Maybe more people were killed. Should we talk about aztec wars? Should we talk about Ahuitzol emperor in 1487? He killed 80000 mexicans in only 4 days. 14 deaths by minute for 96 hours. A level of killing more intense than Auschwitz. Dont replace knowledge with feelings. I understand your feelings but history is more complicated than that.
juampy69 2 months ago
I'd like to say a few things from Spain. If Spanish conquest was horrible, Roman conquest of Spain was horrible too, so please, let's erase any trace of Roman conquest from Spanish soil. Let's demolish the aqueducts, the arcs and the bridges. Let's demolish the Arc of Triumph in Paris, on account of the 10 million dead in Napoleonic wars. The history of mankind is a history of conquests. Whether we like it or not.
juampy69 2 years ago 2
It wasn't a massacre. 70 Spanish soldiers fought against 2,000 Acoma people barricaded behind the walls of the city on top of the mountain (a city that was presumed to be indestructible). The Acoma knew the Spaniards were coming and were ready and waiting. The soldiers had only their swords, a small cannon and "muchos cojones". The Acoma people fought like angry demons with everything they had. The natives outnumbered the Spaniards by 10 to 1. Genocide? It was an epic battle.
123diagun 2 years ago
The Acoma natives are just playing with history by changing many of the facts (what is that about cutting off the feet of all natives men???) to gain easy support and sympathy from people who know nothing about history. But it is very simple to understand. If the Spanish were so cruel and evil, how is it possible that the Acoma people and so many other native Americans tribes are still alive and were allowed to keep their culture, religion and traditions?
123diagun 2 years ago
Don Juan de Oñate did not killed he just cut off every indians' right foot, because the indians killed his nephew and Don Juan de Oñate loved him like his son.
FORS94 2 years ago
hey let put the statue of ( o s a m a bin laden )) at the world trade center let see if the american people likes that!
unnovato 3 years ago
Hey go to bibliotheque and read history or continue being a retarded ignorant.
curziomalatesta 2 years ago
Comment removed
unnovato 3 years ago
If these Indians are there bothering, reproaching and making the monkeys (natural thing in them) it is because the conquerors decided not to kill them to all. I recognize that the anglo-saxon colonists they acted with more intelligence and to the few ones that left alive they confined them in reserves.
Messermitch 3 years ago
fucking indians ....we must have exterminated them all...like the british and yankis
titorobreturns 3 years ago
is monument has nothing to do with Europeans,or rich white people. Onate was born on what is now Mexican soil. Onate is Mestizaje. This monument is dedicated to the first wave of hispanic migration into what is now the USA. Everyone faught 26 generations ago....Pueblo vs Pueblo.....Apache vs Pueblo..Respect that you cry baby indians.you killed plenty of your own.... RESPECT OUR CULTURE!
Indio411 3 years ago 2
fueron y se lo quitaron todo: la cultura,la lengua, las costumbres, la riqueza...
olaia12 3 years ago
It's just the Black Legend against Spain. What about the Brits all over the World?
WinnieThePosh 3 years ago
TheRealCritique...
I already answered two months ago to your stupidity. I will exhort to you than you don't say more foolishness and stupidities about my country, when your country are not an example in nothing, nor before nor now, and less to give lessons of moral
LordBuntaro 3 years ago
Why did tax payer money go to build a monument to a criminal against humanity? If they wanted to build a monument to Ichman or Hitler would we protest?
joyoftheday 3 years ago 2
I want to put up a Jeffrey Dahmer monument. Perhaps El Paso is interested? Regardless of whatever explanations of history, honoring any filthy Spanish conquistador is an offense to any native america. They were invading catholic bastards period, and the hispanic culture is still a macho ignorance-ssturated cult based on violence and overbreeding.
TheRealCritique 3 years ago 5
John Houser has created a monster, honoring Juan de Oñate dishonours civilization, democracy, and pays tribute to violence, rapes, killing again the Peoples Native Americans. I am glad that I Native Americans have said "shame" in the face to these people accomplices of these crimes committed in history on the skin of innocent people, guilty only to exist.
aprofeti 3 years ago 3
jajajaja, hay una pancarta que dice Hitler+Franco= Oñate
miranda8484 3 years ago 3
¿porqué será que la gran mayoría de los estadounidenses ven con buenos ojos a los conquistadores españoles? posiblemente es porque trabajan, son cultos, tienen futuro y miran por su futuro y saber aprecir las cosas buenas que España dejó en América, por eso cuando te vas a al oeste de USA te encuentras nombres españoles por todas partes.
A los otros, a los que critica les diria que si no les gusta lo que ven, que se larguen a sus paises y traten de erradicar el idioma español de alli.
Messermitch 3 years ago
orgulloso de ser español,
VIVA EL VINO Y VIVA ESPAÑA XDD
limoncito69 3 years ago
Y que le beneficio al español común...esta conquista???..mitos, muerte y reyes.
xuancarloshdz 3 years ago
might aswell put up a Hitler monument
Tay1344 4 years ago
THESE DAMN "NATIVE AMERICANS" NEED TO BE SUPRESSED....AT LEAST AS LONG AS WE THE FORIEGNER DESCENT PEOPLE ARE HERE.
Can you imagine these damn Indigenous people being free and liberated like the peoples of India, Pakistan, Phillipines, millions of people in Africa, and NOW....Kosovo
(2/17/08 declared independence)is free from Serbia, too...this is wrong.
These damn "Native" people must never ever be free and liberated...long live USA.
...rrmfg user thanks for supporting occupation.
Dangerdoom68 4 years ago
Go fuck yourself motherfucker's whity!
We will kill you!
renecaillie 4 years ago
Listen here, why would you want these "Native Americans" to be free and liberated from the USA?
....They will only know the Freedom, Liberty, and Justice that our forefathers and WE THE PEOPLE offer and allow them to have.
period.
Dangerdoom68 4 years ago
another dumb ass cracKKKer!!!
bitchyMcbyotch 4 years ago 2
We are only trying to survive! It's our land NOW!
Dangerdoom68 4 years ago
Juan De Onate was a great man that brought civilization to an uncivilized land. Just listen to these savages shriek and holler like wild animals! That should tell any reasonable person what Juan De Onate was dealing with when he subdued their savage ancestors. When Onate colonized New Mexico and the South West the Indians were living in the stone age. They had yet to invent the wheel. Give me a break, Juan De Onate even brought civilization to the
savage Indians.
rrmfg 4 years ago
it is sooo sad to have to read what uneducated...red necks think about!
do ur homework before u try and speak of what you don't know!!!!fucken cracKKKer!!
bitchyMcbyotch 4 years ago
FACT: The Indians that Oñate conquered were living a neolithic lifestyle.
Where was your metallurgy? Where were your wheels? Why were you eating each other?
You cannot expect to stagnate in the stone age while the rest of the world experiences the renaissance and think that you're going to make it through unscathed.
Haven't you ever played Civilization IV? If you don't keep up with science, you WILL be conquered by people who do.
dkrustyklown 3 years ago
dkrustyklown:
Haven't you ever played Civilization IV? If you don't keep up with science, you WILL be conquered by people who do.
---
Life is not a game your retard!
NartSaga 3 years ago
Well said: rrmfg!
These "Native" must never have freedom or liberation....
...if they do they might shoot us back to Europe! WE DON'T WANT THAT! NEVER!
Viva USA.
Dangerdoom68 4 years ago
VIVA LOS INDIGENAS!
Ya basta la estatua Don Juan Oñate el maldito extranjero.
Misssermitch 4 years ago 2
Por lo demas, mi mas sincera enhorabuena a los Estados Unidos a la ciudad de El Paso por esa estatua.
Messermitch 4 years ago
¿como te atreves a decir que la mayoría de los españoles cometieron violaciones? ¿estuviste alli para verlo? no digo que hubieran violaciones pero igual tambien hubo muchos matrimonios mixtos. Lo que pasa es que allí siempre pensais lo peor cuando se trata de españoles. El sistema de castas .... Costa Rica y Chile prosperan ¿siguen teniendo alli el sistema de castas?
Messermitch 4 years ago
Si no te gusta la verda...vete pa Espana!
Dangerdoom68 4 years ago
Para empezar ya vivo en España, soy español, y a mi la verdad ni me gusta ni me disgusta, porque la historia no se puede cambiar. Solo que vosotros en vez de mirar para el futuro solo miráis para el pasado.
Messermitch 4 years ago
El pasado afecta el presente.
Por esto es que los indigenas estan luchando en el presente como en el pasado para direjir un future mas mejor.
Gracias por apoyar este noble movimiente de liberacion.
Dangerdoom68 4 years ago
Pero ¿de que me estás hablando? para empezar ¿de donde eres? porque si eres norteamericano, es decir estadounidense, gringo, WASP etc entonces será mejor que te calles la boca porque no estás en condiciones de dar lecciones. Y si eres mexicano o hispano residente en Estados Unidos solo te quiero decir que el pasado es el pasado y ya no se puede regresar a el, sino ahora convivir lo mejor posible con los demás y aprender de los errores.
Messermitch 4 years ago
Los gitanos llevan 300 años en España y es un pueblo por ejemplo que no vale. Nunca han prosperado en nada, pero al igual que los indios, se benefician de nuestro nivel de vida y de los progresos de nuestra civilizacion occidental. Sin embargo, los judios y los chinos nos son europeos y alli donde van, prosperan...sigue siendo culpa del hombre blanco? No. Es que quien no vale, no vale y punto, pasen 500 o 200 años
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
DearFamilyMember...quien no vale, no vale. Hayan pasado 500 años de la llegada de los españoles, o 200 años de independencia. En la america española los indigenas tuvieron libertad para hacer lo que quisieran y no lo hicieran, no estudiaron, nos prosperaron. Asi que dejate de la excusa del europeismo para justificar la falta de progreso de los indigenas
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
¡Ya basta!
Los Indígenas no toleran más miren
"The Racism of Border Walls" video.
DearFamilyMember 4 years ago
-Missermitch:
¿Apoca los Indígenas se independizaron de los europeos? ¡Nunca! Sigue la ocupación. Domas porque ellos reclaman llamarse "EE.UU.s", "Argentinos" o "Brasileños" siguen siendo europeas bajo la mascara. Esto esta manifestado en la campaña y glorificaciones de idiomas, religiones, arquitecturas, ascéticos extranjeros que sus descendientes han promovido. ¿Dime si los presidentes, personas de riqueza o los dueños de gran hectáreas de tierras son Indígenas?
DearFamilyMember 4 years ago
But that they don't sin with the hypocrisy, because if they dress pants it is because there spaniards (in this case, Juan de Oñate) and other europeans arrived
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
I don't understand the natives, to the Muslims, etc etc etc...They criticize the Europeans (in this case, their historical past), to the white North Americans, and however, they benefit of all our civilization. If they want to be true Indian that they will live in caves, that they pray to the pachamama and instead of eating pizza that they eat ants.
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
Fortunately in movies as " Apocalypto " (maybe one of the best movies that I have seen at the moment) the turn has been given to the tortilla
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
No colonialist country has had any fray Bartolomé De Las Casas that denounced the abuse to the Indians, and if the Spaniards had had a true politics of horror, many of the tribes that now are manifested against they could not make it, because they had been locked in reservations
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
It is curious the aversion that Spain still takes place in some indigenous populations. It is not to attack the French or the own North Americans in yes whose brutalities are more recent, as Wounded Knee massacre, 1890. No. Are always the Spaniards, although with massacres of several centuries
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
I believe that it is something truly absurd that there are people that in the XXI century, in a democratic country, prosper and in peace, seek to live and to act as ago 500 year-old people, in this case as in the north america of the XVI century
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
I have said, United States doesn't have anything in comparison with the monuments that there is in Spain and that they left other civilizations. The life in those times was of this way: Brutality and war. And in the case of United States, spaniards contributed something: the agriculture, the ranching, the introduction of the horse, the taming, the equestrian art, the rodeo or the cowboy (that for if you don't know it, all this is of Spanish origin)
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
Qué paradoja, que sean los estadounidenses los que precisamente admiran más a los conquistadores españoles. Desde luego no son los acomplejados desagradecidos que viven de Mexico para abajo.
Messermitch 4 years ago
Sin embargo, en España no odiamos a nadie. Estamos hechos de otra pasta, afortunadamente
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
Los Indígenas del continente de "Américas" también no odian domas para odiar. Pero si odian a estatuas que representan la perpetua ocupación y conquista de las tierras de los Indígenas. Este hombre represento y lucho los intereses de los extranjeros y no por los Indígenas, por ejemplo, expandió y apoyo la colonización, Cristianismo, robo de tierras, masacres, etcétera. Después de todo hoy los europeos del norte lo están glorificando como un líder. ¿Esto es mal no crees?
DearFamilyMember 4 years ago
Los españoles hicieron algo que no hicieron los ingleses: mezclarse con los indígenas y no meterlos en reservas como si fueran poblacion afestada. Eso está pasando en USA, pero vete a cualquier pais de Hispanoamérica y verás que eso no ocurre.
¿Robo de tierras y masacres? pues eso sería con la independencia ¿o eso no lo has estudiado? que esos paises hoy en dia vayan tan mal es culpa de ellos, estan independizados desde hace 200 años.
Messermitch 4 years ago
¿Destruimos el acueducto de Segovia o el anfiteatro de Merida, que fueron construido por los romanos?¿Destruimos la Alhambra? Pero qué gente más estupida son los indigenas de America (no todos, al menos estos y los que piensan como estos con Juan de Oñate). Si tuvieran las invasiones y las guerras que ha tenido España en 2500 años odiarian a medio mundo, y sin embargo en España, hasta el extremo de conservar cosas de las civilizaciones que han pasado por aquí
LordBuntaro 4 years ago
-juanjoseph: Do not be upset because the "Natives" refuse to be passive, be more tolerant.
Did they really need foreigners and horses to survive? The "Native" were doing fine which explains the more than 35,000 thousand years of their historical presence on the "Americas" with out foreigners and horses to survive. May the Indigenous people succeed in their plight to free themselves and their lands "continent of the Americas" from the perpetual occupation since 1492.
DearFamilyMember 4 years ago
Occupation is the one that has made your country, putting the few existent Indians in USA in reserves as if they were infected. The Spaniards didn't make the same thing.
Messermitch 4 years ago
Exactly, the Spaniards and their descedents forced Christianity (or persuaded), occupied the lands, racially discriminated, massacred the Indigenous peoples for centuries as well introducing small pox and other diseases which also dicimated the "Native" population. Thanks for distinguishing this difference.
DFM
DearFamilyMember 4 years ago
and the Englishmen what they made? did they colonize those lands with roses, carnations and smiles? at least in the lands conquered by the Spaniards the natives they don't live in reserves. In United States the natives live in reservations as if they were infected. HYPOCRITE.
Messermitch 4 years ago
juan de oñate's father is cristobal de oñate, founder of Guadalajara, Cristobal de Oñate is the grandson of Pedro de Baeza, lord of Narrihondo, who was a desendant from the house of Haro, the lords of Bizkaiko, its family founded the Gernikako Arbola: the symbol of al freedom and liberties Euskadi
Married Isabel Moctezuma grandaughter of Moctezuma Xocoyotzin(an aztec emperor) and daughter of Hernán Cortes
show more respect
atte. Juan José Hernández Oñate, descendant of Juan de Oñate
juanjoseph 4 years ago
gora Oñate!!!
juanjoseph 4 years ago 3
devlind44-
Que ridículo eres.
Los europeos y sus descendientes siguen ocupando las tierras de los Indígenas "América".
Si no lo miras así pues estas mirando por un punto de vista euro céntrico.
Los Indígenas apoyan unión y liberación ya después que los europeas y sus viviendo descendientes (por más de 500 años) siguen queriendo glorificar monstruos que invadieron y teorizaron los Indígenas en el aquel tiempo. La estatua apoya y perpetúa "la conquista" a los Indígenas.
rejectcomplacency 4 years ago
La vida es así, conquistar y/o ser conquistado ¿nunca te has preguntado qué habitantes existian en América antes de que llegaran los llamados "indígenas americanos"? España tambien estuvo a punto de ser conquistada por completo por los musulmanes pero aunque tardaron casi 8 siglos en expulsaros al final lo consiguieron.
De nada os sirve lamentaros, la historia es como es. Preocuparos de trabajar y salir adelante y quitaros ya los pajaros de la cabeza.
Messermitch 4 years ago
Si los Indigenas que conquisten su liberatad. Deja lamentos europeas que dice que esta tierra esta siguridado para ellos.
DearFamilyMember 4 years ago
Es triste que la tribu Ácoma muestra esta falta de respeto al escultor, gritando mientras presenta su discurso, perdiendo la oportunidad de escuchar lo que puede resultar en un mejor entendimiento entre dos culturas. Es triste que tampoco entienden que olvidar la historia en su enteridad significa olvidar lecciones muy importantes además del sufrimiento y la angustia de su propia gente. Por favor, dejen de negar a su pasado.
devlind44 4 years ago 3
Amen Sister.
Biscaine 3 years ago
Afirmar que el sistema de clases actual en SudAmerica se deba a lo que los españoles hicieror hace más de 400 años es demagogia pura? Seria como culpar a Roma por lo que pueda ocurrir en la actualidad de España! No parece esto ridiculo? A mi si y mucho.
Se creeran que estaban mejor practicando sacrificios humanos que nada tenian que ver con su "systema" de castas, verdad? de Risa!
A lo mejor el progreso no es para todo el mundo y por eso algunos prefieran seguir vistiendo en taparabo LOL!
Biscaine 3 years ago
AWESOME!
These Europeans and supporters deserve a metal of honor for their contributions in making an invader into a hero!
The statue is a reaffirmation and propaganda symbol to make the Indigenous peoples' lands "America" more hospitable to present day European-"Americans" (squatters) in their endless effort to Europeanize "America".
It revives the colonization notion:
"Freedom, Liberty, and Justice for the Indigenous people...Never!"
rejectcomplacency 4 years ago
I feel horribly embarrassed for the Indians in this video. They behaved horribly at that dedication. They showed a complete lack of respect for others culture as if they had never committed any crimes and are guilt free of anything. When are people going to give up this act of entitlement for a history that occurred over 400 years ago.
ACOMA INDIANS.....YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED FOR YOUR BEHAVIOR AT THAT DEDICATION.
Indio411 4 years ago
Gora Juan de Oñate!
Gora Euskalherria!
Gora Espainia!!
Biscaine 4 years ago
I completely agree with WinnieThePosh. ¡Viva España!
DAlessimo 4 years ago
VIVA ESPAÑA JODER
limoncito69 4 years ago 2
Like it or not Juan de Onate is one of the pioneers and founders of the United States of America, he did not put the American Natives in reservations like others did. And he is related to Moctezuma and Hernán Cortés.
In the Middle Ages 500 years ago every person in the Americas had officially the same treat and rights than the Spaniards back in Europe. 500 years ago, alright?!!
WinnieThePosh 4 years ago
Excuse me WinniThePooh, but how is juan de Oñate related to Moctezuma or Hernan Cortes???
Biscaine 4 years ago
Hello, the answer is that Juan de Oñate married Isabel de Tolosa Cortés Moctezuma, a descendant of the famous conquistador Hernán Cortés and the Aztec emperor Moctezuma. They had a son and a daughter.
WinnieThePosh 4 years ago
WTPosh,
Thanks I completely forgot about that.
And by the way sorry, all this time I've been calling you the Pooh and not the Posh oopss! Errare Humanum est!!
Biscaine 4 years ago 2
juan de oñate's father is cristobal de oñate, founder of Guadalajara, Zacatecas and Tepic. Cristobal de Oñate is the grandson of Pedro de Baeza, lord of Narrihondo, who was a desendant from the house of Haro, the lords of Bizkaiko, its family founded the Gernikako Arbola: the symbol of al freedom and liberties Euskadi
Married Isabel Moctezuma grandaughter of Moctezuma Xocoyotzin(an aztec emperor) and daughter of Hernán Cortes
juanjoseph 4 years ago
The truth of it is that the spaniards at the end got mixed with the native americans, Hernán Cortés, Juan de Oñate and all them, but the anglosaxons killed them all. And put them in reservations. I am not bitter anyway. The catholic kings of Spain, Isabel and Fernando gave the same treat to every person in the New World, the spanish nationality, and that was 500 years ago!!!!! Nobody remembers that!!!
WinnieThePosh 4 years ago 2
I agree! The religion of the natives was also replaced with Christianity and Catholicism. Why celebrate those colonial holidays- why not maintain the native religious roots!
marblecutter 4 years ago
@marblecutter HELLO I DO REMEMBER ! I'M GREATGRANDSON OF FERNADIN DE ARAGON 2 )KING OF SPAIN JUAN ONATE IS MY 1ST COUSIN 16 GENERATION AND PROUD OF IT , JEWISH AND ONCE NOBLE UNTIL THE ABOLISHMENT OF ALL NOBEL TITLE 1824 , WE ONCE HAD GREAT AMOUNTS OF LAND WE ARE DESCEDANTS OF JOSE VASQUEZ BORREGO(FOUNDER OF DOLORES AND (TOMAS SANCHEZ ) FOUNDER LAREDO TX , BROTHER OF DIEGO VASQUEZ BORREGO FATHER OF NEW MEXICO'S FOUNDER YOEL POMPA
1r2h5f 1 year ago
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@marblecutter
HELLO I DO REMEMBER ! I'M GREATGRANDSON OF FERNADIN DE ARAGON 2 )KING OF SPAIN JUAN ONATE IS MY 1ST COUSIN 16 GENERATION AND PROUD OF IT , JEWISH AND ONCE NOBLE UNTIL THE ABOLISHMENT OF ALL NOBEL TITLE 1824 , WE ONCE HAD GREAT AMOUNTS OF LAND WE ARE DESCEDANTS OF JOSE VASQUEZ BORREGO(FOUNDER OF DOLORES AND (TOMAS SANCHEZ ) FOUNDER LAREDO TX , BROTHER OF DIEGO VASQUEZ BORREGO FATHER OF NEW MEXICO'S FOUNDER YOEL POMPA
1r2h5f 1 year ago