Great bullet it doesnt penatrate to much but just enough. One concern is is it gonna cycle my gun? with only 105 grain but still i think its a great bullet for your home my kid could be in the next room and if this bullet will protect my family and not go through the wall as far as a normal self defense bullet that gives me more of a chance to save my child from being hit as well i like it!
You did a great job performing and presenting your test results. However, I have to take some exception with the method of your test. Shooting thru drywall first and then into the gel would be the real life equivalent of trying to shoot someone that has broken into your home thru a wall without visualizing the intruder. Ethics and the responsibleness of that aside, it seems to me that you should have performed the test shooting thru the gel first (transversely) then into drywall.
i really like the thoughtfulness and objectivity of your videos, but i must question one of your conclusions here. 8.5" of penetration is not deep enough to hit vital organs on a person how thick? i'm 250 and just measured myself against a wall and found that i am 10" at the very deepest in the chest or belly. 8.5" could even hit my spine from the front. I'm sure that you have thought out your statement here more thoroughly than i have, so i ask you, what other factors am i missing?
here's the deal, LEGALLY once that round leaves your weapon you OWN it! All this talk about penetration i'm not understanding. The liver which is a very heavy bleeder is not that deep in the abdominal cavity also this is more than enough penetration to hit the aorta, the largest artery in the body. I'm a surgical scrub nurse with lots of trauma experience. Shot placement not bullet design is most important.
Thank you for sharing your testing and results! Sir, early in the video, you referred to a 124gr. variant of the 9mm EFMJ that had been marketed by Federal as well. Have you tested the 124gr ?
Thank you for sharing your testing and results! Sir, early in the video, you referred to a 124gr. variant of the 9mm EFMJ that had been marketed by Federal as well. Have you tested the 124gr ?
Some places in the world even if you can defend yourself, you aren't allowed to use hollow point bullets. This could be a better option than just FMJ.
If I'm not mistaken, wouldn't you want it to go through a perp, then through the wall? Shooting directly at the wall will obviously do some damage to someone on the other side. I would think you would want to see the damage through the perp, through the wall, and then what it would do to a bystander.
clearly not the best, but it might have it's place, like in a pocket 9mm. female and smaller shooters would most likely benefit from the reduced recoil too.
Once again it was a great review and video! But could you do this same test in the .40s&w? I believe i seen it at my local academy in a 180gr and the gun counter guy told me alot of people buy this ammo in here, but he didn't know much about it!
Thanks for the video. Since the bullet is marketed as being 'less penetrating', it is doing as advirtised. As to the wound track, would you only be firing one round at a bad guy or more than one (more bullet tracts.) An 8-9" penetration into the ballistic gel (after passing thru drywall and/or denim) seems reasonable. If I consider myself 'normal' size (5'9", 192 lbs) and a chest to back distance of 11", this round would be tickling my spine from a center mass shot. Decent IMHO.
These are intersting results. I am not sure I would carry it normally, but these have a place in special situations were you need less penetration. They will most likely feed better in some cheaper weapons as well since there is not hollow point. All around odd round with very different results.
Overpenetration, as frequently observed with your favorite "heavy-for-caliber" bullets, would leave you literally defenseless, even with a loaded handgun, in certain situations. Imagine if you were in the gathering near congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords when Jared Loughner began shooting;if you were to open up on him with rounds that penetrated reliably deeper than the thickness of the man's chest from head-on, you're probably hitting someone on the other side. Then you would also end up in jail
@zams650 A lot of older hollow point projectiles needs to strike something hard like bone before the expand properly. In the case of this round nine inches of penetration means even if the round should penetrate fully the energy left in the projectile isn't sufficient to cause much harm to anyone. It would most likely just bounce off them.
It went 9 inches both times, so what does that tell you? If you get an expanded bullet like that 9 inches through your chest it's pretty much going to ruin your day.
First thing ,Great video. I would agree that i wouldn't carry this ammo in a conceal carry weapon. But now i am buying it for my house load, were you dont want alot over penetration. I think it would be a good use for that. Less chance going through wall and hitting family member or someone next door.
Nice video. Very informative, thank you. I was wondering-with that lead moving forward. Maybe it's supposed to do that-the polymer being squished between the target and the lead. Maybe?
Damn it! I was hoping this ammo did well. lol i was going to a mag of them in my Sub2K, maybe the 16" barrel would improve its preformance. lol Anyway out of all the defense 9mm loads which would you recommend the most?
Depends on your perspective. Federal heavily markets this as a round designed to penetrate fewer walls in a home than traditional JHP's. Sure, that is a concern for me but my first priority is to stop the threat. Some people will buy it for the low penetration concept, and that concept only. I carry a round that I believe has a better chance of penetrating deeper. I'm going to use my remaining rounds of Guard Dog for target practice, if that says anything.
147 gr Federal HST, but I'm always open to trying something else that offers similar or better performance AND does not affect my ability to place fast, accurate hits.
@tnoutdoors9 I'm a bit confused by this responce. I look at my 9mm pistol the same way I look at my .223 AR.Small and very fast. A 223 in something like a TAP round, from my understanding, dumps all of its Kenetic energy into the first couple inches of a chest cavity and doesn't always exit out the back, making it more effective than military FMJ. Why wouldn't you want your 9mm to dump 100% of its energy into the bg's chest cavity/vitals as opposed to penetrating out their back?
@fnkdtnk Exit wounds bleed more rapidly than entrance wounds, and most handgun cartridges lack the energy needed to destroy tissues other than the traditional crush cavity. With rifles, they have dramatically fiercer wounds with the increased velocity, can can destroy tissue without actually coming into contact with them. To put it bluntly, penetration for pistols is perfect. (Not that you should carry a fmj 500 SW, but you get the idea).
Check the brassfetcher info that I just added at the end of this video description. It details the value of shot placement, angle, and body density. In other words, it illustrates that you need to accept the possibility of a worse case scenario IF your shots hit the intended target. Also consider that any bullet can deflect off bone and richochet 90 degrees in another direction. If that happens, I want momentum to continue as far as possible.
@Lethal0ption not at all ..special for my country in which is hollow point illegal to use in self defense. but i can use this , because its actually full metal jacket :D ..no air cavity at front. ..and this is much, much better for self defense then FMJ for sure. but yea, if i could i would go with hollow point, but i cant ..so.
@Lethal0ption Let's say you took that bullet to the chest, and it expanded like that and it then went 9 inches through your chest would that be a fail or a win? I'm pretty sure it would ruin your day. The most amusing thing is that it also went 9 inches through the gel when it had penetrated two sheet rock plates, so what does that tell you? and just to clarify, your chest is not filled with gel it's mostly just real soft tissue.
@Lethal0ption Well how can you even begin to talk about a fail when the round performances flawlessly and delivers all it's energy in just 9 inches without disintegrating. It's only a 105 grain bullet but it would royally ruin your day and it's fairly cheap. So what's fail about that?
Great idea but I'm not paying $25 for a 20 round box, that's absurd. At the ridiculous prices for today's premium SD ammo, I'll stick with Winchester White Box, their JHP is plenty good for me.
If any one is stupid enough to place their life on any of these marketed and hyped crazy bullet designs? I feel sorry for them. Every police Department in the Country and the FBI are all brain washed by Ammo marketing reps, and bullet design genius. The Government mandates on ammo are ridiculous. The FBI 1986 mandates probably killed their agents, the bullets fragmented in the bad guy,and he killed two agents and shot 7. FMJ military mandated ammo does what its suppose to do? Stay together.
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The "jacket separation" you are complaining about is behavior as expected. The lead core is moving forward by inertia to perform the expansion of the polymer. If it was not free to move inside the jacket, it could not expand. The lead core is supposed to move forward when the bullet strikes a target and slows down! Don't you understand how this bullet is supposed to work? it isn't the compression from the FRONT that does it, it's the compression from the BACK.
I understand how this bullet is supposed to work. Jacket seperation by design or accident is not good. I am not a self-professed expert like you, but I know a piss poor bullet design when I see it. I strongly believe that using this ammo is placing a liabillity on yourself to stop a threat. Don't you understand that poor bullet design leading to underpenetration is not a positive aspect in stopping a threat? Did Federal send you here to crap on the video, or just trolling?
@tnoutdoors9 I agree, although as I'm sure you know this bullet WOULD be somewhat useful in a place where JHPs were banned, considering the only other option would be FMJ. I had assumed that was what this bullet was designed for and was surprised to see it in so many gun/ammo shopping locations here in Middle TN (I live in Hermitage). Also as far as you know are there any restrictions here pertaining to the "Law Enforcement" rounds? If not why is it impossible to find the RangerTs or Fed HSTs?
@thefinder808 It's because of Winchester/federals restrictions on their distributors to sell it only to LE, it's legal to purchase but Winchester/federal put restrictions on distributors to keep it out of public hands as much as possible, I guess they're worried about litigation IDK. Not sure about Winchester but I know federal will cut off distributors if they find them selling to non-law-enforcement. That's why it's easier to find on the Internet and not in actual stores
No he is just trolling like he does elsewhere, Dont you understand that!! LMAO!!!!! Thanks for the vid and keep up the great work. I have some of those in 40 cal, might just save my time on the next gel shoot and shoot something that will give better results. Keep the great vids coming!!
If I ever need to shoot through a car door or windshield, penetration is a good thing. However, shot placement is far more important in my opinion. 8-9" of penetration in my overweight chest area would hit some vitals and with a round like this, I wouldn't have to worry about it taking out my neighbors if I miss.
@devcon67 You're ignoring the fact if you are shooting at someone they are probably carrying some type of weapon as well, and where do you and most everyone else hold their weapon? In front of their chest of course, which means that if you hit the person's arm with this round it probably won't penetrate into the chest. This is why penetration AND shot placement are important.
One thing to consider tho its not "everything" if you measure from the chest to back of your average person it isn't usually more than 10 inches wich means it'll stop inside or just outside its target and wont be much threat downrange and it will disperse all of its energy in the target great video as always
@tnoutdoors9 10mm would be great. I have a Glock20 and love the round. I have started to lean more toward 9mm due to the low cost and readily available ammo though :-(
The projectile looks promising,maybe make this a + P load and see what happens .Better than a hollow point going thru denium good stopping power . This one looks like is has good potential in the 380 pocket guns.It might make another great personal defense round.
If this wasn't labeled "home defense", I'd be disappointed. They got it right with the name however as it is a lower recoil but most importantly, doesn't over-penetrate. I don't want to be shooting a bullet traveling to depths of 12"-16" for this intended purpose, I dont feel like missing and endangering neighbors. Same reason why the 12 gauge by the bed isn't loaded with buckshot. This is something I'd use for home defense only though - I'll take the nastiest JHP for concealed/everyday carry..
excellent vid...I've really taken a liking to your ammo test, you do them well. ln this vid enjoyed the variety of testing mediums.. I am sure it isn't cheap to do that every time, but I really like liked the drywall kicker.
It was nice to see you use the drywall, great videos! Maybe someday you could blast a 3" slug out of your 12gauge into that test gel, that would be nice to see.
Great video...u just saved me about $80..I was gonna give these new rounds a try but after watching ur video Ill just stick to my ranger hollow points...thnx again
Really enjoy your vids, thanks! I picked up some of this ammo and some 147 gr hollow points to test side by side. I like the idea of less penetration but I noticed I can fire off more quick accurate shots with the 147 gr hollow points because of less barrel flip. I could also notice my recoil reducer from Sprinco working for me better with the 147 gr.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, "Any round that can kill a bad guy will kill your kid if you miss and it hits in the right place." People that count on these trick rounds are only fooling themselves, they be better off buying normal rounds and using the saved money to train.
Great Detail review truly appreciated. In your personal opinion for a person that lives in an apartment complex what ammo would you recommend for a 9mm pistol. My main an obcious concern in over penetration of a neighbors apt wall if an emergency arose. Any an all help will be truly appreciates.
Looks like they need to +p that little guy. If I remember correctly, some municipalities have banned jhp pistol ammo and this product is aimed at them.
A very thorough review. Thanks for the added testing. BTW, did the "Retired Milkmen of America" petition you for the return of the jug test? I've heard they have a small, but powerful lobby... ;-)
I remember when EFMJ came out, they were designed for pistols that could not cycle hollow points and the second feature was a better carry load that FMJ in areas were carring hollow point is illeagal. For those of us that dont have those issues, stick with better options.
Thanks for the video, but I really wanted to see the Guard Dog in .45 auto. All my 9mms are loaded with Ranger Ts and those have an excellent reputation and amazing reliability in all my pistols; I don't plan on getting anything else for them. But I'm sorta "experimenting" with the .45 loads. At the moment, I'm using Hornady's Critical Defense, the classic Silvertips, and Guard Dogs, all three mixed up in my mags. I'm wondering if this design would maximize the "punch" of the .45 ACP.
Great Video. Thanks for all the extra time and effort on this one. It brings to light the real performance of a unique concept. We appreciate the videos and the information that separates the hype from the reality. THANKS!
Much appritiated! I've always sort of wondered if I should "upgrade" to something like this. You probably have or will have some tests of hornady etc up... I'll look for those.
Have you ever tested RBCD ammo? Recently came across it and thinking about doing some tests myself, although I don't have a camera. :)
if i wanted a bullet for inside the house i would go with a glaser safety slug - not this bullet...yes the little pellets may make it through a wall - but not with enough energy to kill a family member...as far as street carry?- well , i would never carry a bullet that yaws right out of the barrel....
im not sure i understand why this is so bad i like my neighbors and my family and dont want alot of over penetration. could you maybe explain why this is such a negative for home defense?
For misses and hitting your walls, this appears to be a better option than JHP. If you want to effectively stop the threat, this pales in comparison to underpenetrating 9mm's I've tested and researched.
Does the concept of overpenetration tempt anyone to use this for street carry, more open environment, or do you feel for some reason that 8 to 9" penetration for the street bad guy isn't enough? Why is it considered enough when they are already inside your home?
@surfside006 ive never been privy to that kind of info ive been shooting rifles since i was a little kid but pistols are really kinda new for me im just trying to understand all the angles.
@jeeperscreepers71 A hi-power rifle bullet might go through the whole neighborhood no joke.
But most hand gun bullets are maybe a quarter as powerful if you hit a bad guy body probably the bullet will stay in him.If you use a hollow point it make simply give him a belly ache.And he may expire a week later.
Nobody wants to shoot any body, but if your life is in danger,do you want to play Russian roulette, you want to survive. That means seriously stopping the threat FMJ will help you do so.
Thanks for testing these rounds, I purchased some of these for my 9mm Hi Point C9, and I feel that these would be fine for me in a small apt. complex. I wish it was +p rated though, plus p rated runs better in my C9, Being that it was really made for it.
That was very disappointing.. I was really looking forward to efmj ammo for my hollow point sensitive hi point to keep in my truck... I guess I will just have to stick with flat points or something... Maybe some soft point ammo. I had high hopes for this stuff..
Do you think the jacket separation occurred in the barrel or when the jacket expanded? That is an interesting round. I don't necessarily believe the low penetration of the bullet is always a bad thing. Very interesting video.
What a great video. That's a junk bullet. Bullets kill through a CNS hit or quickly dropping blood pressure. If that light, soft edged bullet hits as predicted by this video, you better put multiple hits on target. This is why police officers carrying the 9mm have to fire a volley of shots to save their lives.
The video is also a good warning to anyone who plans to take cover behind dry wall.
i could not wait for u to test this round. ty so much! thisis not the worst r pound u have test but its not the best, it wont be replacing my top 3 picks. for the 9mm. #1 124gr gold dot, 115gr critacal defense and 127 gr +p ranger t- series
Interesting & Informative as usual TN9, Keep up the great work!! Interesting take by Federal on the clogging issue of hollowpoints & the polymer plug. About only use for this bullet after your vid i can see, is for those scared to death of over penetration but not wanting to use regular FMJ bullets.
Awesome ballistics test. I feel that this bullet is a bit light for self defense and your test prove that fact. Also, I am surprised at the amount of gel in the bullet. Very nice comparison done with the water jugs and dry wall. Great ballistics test video. Very well done!
This is a good round for home defense because of the unlikely chance that the bullet will pass through the bad guy and endanger people in the next room or apartment. An 8 1/2" deep hole in someone would likely change their mind.
I believe the round to be adequate with proper placement. I personally would rather end the threat vs. end up in court due to collateral damage via over penetration. The round simply makes sense.
I am guessing this ammunition was made for people in states where hollowpoint ammunition is illegal? I do find this bothersome by the results, definitive not my choice for a carry load.
Did you pull one of the unfired bullets to see what the backside looks like? I'm wondering if that space you saw at 02:50 might be manufactured that way.
I did not pull a bullet. The base is actually not flat, there is a generous cavity that resembles the base of a Civil War Minie Ball. The core moved forward on impact for each test, with the greatest amount of movement on the denim block test; third in the sequence.
Great video, and thank you for such a thorough review. I know this was rare and I love your videos, but honestly it would be great to see this with all future bullet reviews.
sure is neat looking ammo even when expanded and interesting in concept. I do see why it was made to be lighter and how over penetration is a possible problem as often it is a concern that i have when purchasing defensive loads so theoretically this is ammo i would .."like" to use but i would prefer to see a more aggressive expansion and a heavier bullet. Really enjoyed the simulated wall test you did. That is one of my primary concerns but also what if it penetrates though the target as well.
In 9mm I seem to think so. I prefer to stay at 124 gr or above for 9mm, although the 115 gr Federal +P+ BPLE is a proven performer. The Guard Dog is also loaded light in .40 (135 gr) and .45 ACP (165 gr) for likely the same purpose here.......reduce overpenetration through walls.
Should do that with all bullet ammo testing. Next up definitely my own personal protection which i carry in a couple of my handguns are the extreme shock. I use the air freedoms and the fang face which are named differently now due to legal issues. But really got to check out extreme shock.
My understanding of this round is that its a home defense round that was designed not to over penetrate walls. This is one I have purchased but not tested, based on that thought. Thank you for this info it is very informative.
Another great vid, thanks for all of the hard work and for sharing. I was pretty interested in these, but I think that I'll stick to my Gold Dots. Take care.
Depends on the angle, focusing on COM it could 5" or multiples of that. As a hunter, you wait for the best possible shot, as in, your not punching one up the rear end trying to hit the heart; correct? You prefer an instant drop, correct? I want the same for self defense, but I'm facing a disadvantage of being the one hunted, wanting an opportunity to fight back and win with ammo that does not accept minimal penetration as a compromise.
You do have to remember that in real life you'll be going through some heavy bone mass before you reach the vitals. without a good penetrating bullet, it would not get through that bone mass.
@reillyt868 When they say, "Brass Only" they really mean no CCI Blazer aluminum or steel case. Those materials do not 'spring back' after firing. Most of the shiny cases you see are actually nickel plated brass and will feed and eject better than plain brass. That's why most of personal defense rounds are so plated.
@reillyt868 if you watch nutnfancys video on the sub 2000 i think its his "sub gun needs part one" he runs in to alot of problems with non brass casings, but also like Tnoutdoors says check with the manufacturer to be sure but my guess is it will most likely have issues.
Love your tests. This is a neat concept but looks like it kinda fails to deliver. It might work for really picky guns that just wont feed a jhp or where jhp is prohibited but still needs more development. I am glad you tested these, I was thinking they were probably pretty good rounds. Maybe they should change the name of the round from Guard Dog to Ankle Biter.
Great bullet it doesnt penatrate to much but just enough. One concern is is it gonna cycle my gun? with only 105 grain but still i think its a great bullet for your home my kid could be in the next room and if this bullet will protect my family and not go through the wall as far as a normal self defense bullet that gives me more of a chance to save my child from being hit as well i like it!
honda963d 2 days ago
Was it a glock 17 or 19 ?
Jormungandr69 5 days ago
The round was created to help reduce OVER penetration. Would have been nice to see if it perfumed as designed. Thanks for your work on this!
T34C282 6 days ago
You did a great job performing and presenting your test results. However, I have to take some exception with the method of your test. Shooting thru drywall first and then into the gel would be the real life equivalent of trying to shoot someone that has broken into your home thru a wall without visualizing the intruder. Ethics and the responsibleness of that aside, it seems to me that you should have performed the test shooting thru the gel first (transversely) then into drywall.
T34C282 6 days ago
i really like the thoughtfulness and objectivity of your videos, but i must question one of your conclusions here. 8.5" of penetration is not deep enough to hit vital organs on a person how thick? i'm 250 and just measured myself against a wall and found that i am 10" at the very deepest in the chest or belly. 8.5" could even hit my spine from the front. I'm sure that you have thought out your statement here more thoroughly than i have, so i ask you, what other factors am i missing?
kasbekz 1 week ago
here's the deal, LEGALLY once that round leaves your weapon you OWN it! All this talk about penetration i'm not understanding. The liver which is a very heavy bleeder is not that deep in the abdominal cavity also this is more than enough penetration to hit the aorta, the largest artery in the body. I'm a surgical scrub nurse with lots of trauma experience. Shot placement not bullet design is most important.
kdubb11 1 week ago
Pollee-mur.
a2birdcage 1 week ago
I agree 100%, this crap will never be in my wife's weapon.
GunsHarleysUSA 2 weeks ago
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Thank you for sharing your testing and results! Sir, early in the video, you referred to a 124gr. variant of the 9mm EFMJ that had been marketed by Federal as well. Have you tested the 124gr ?
731trident 3 weeks ago
Thank you for sharing your testing and results! Sir, early in the video, you referred to a 124gr. variant of the 9mm EFMJ that had been marketed by Federal as well. Have you tested the 124gr ?
731trident 3 weeks ago
great video, i wanted to look into these rounds myself and glad to see your video b4 doing so.. so overall do you think they are worth it?
xSpawn31 3 weeks ago
kinda of a nice round actually, especially in autos that don't like a traditional hollow point ie, don't feed them reliably.
ladyfeind 3 weeks ago
great video!
dredank 4 weeks ago
Some places in the world even if you can defend yourself, you aren't allowed to use hollow point bullets. This could be a better option than just FMJ.
AngeredKabar 1 month ago
If I'm not mistaken, wouldn't you want it to go through a perp, then through the wall? Shooting directly at the wall will obviously do some damage to someone on the other side. I would think you would want to see the damage through the perp, through the wall, and then what it would do to a bystander.
nhassey48 1 month ago 2
clearly not the best, but it might have it's place, like in a pocket 9mm. female and smaller shooters would most likely benefit from the reduced recoil too.
TheRiggenbach 1 month ago
Once again it was a great review and video! But could you do this same test in the .40s&w? I believe i seen it at my local academy in a 180gr and the gun counter guy told me alot of people buy this ammo in here, but he didn't know much about it!
RoadHardOffRoad 1 month ago
too light, too fast... and frankly, too damn weird. and too much plastic... only thing this bullet doesnt have ENOUGH of is lead.
atleast the ammo company's havent given up on building a better mousetrap.
deltaomegaable 1 month ago
Thanks for the video. Since the bullet is marketed as being 'less penetrating', it is doing as advirtised. As to the wound track, would you only be firing one round at a bad guy or more than one (more bullet tracts.) An 8-9" penetration into the ballistic gel (after passing thru drywall and/or denim) seems reasonable. If I consider myself 'normal' size (5'9", 192 lbs) and a chest to back distance of 11", this round would be tickling my spine from a center mass shot. Decent IMHO.
dahgaed 1 month ago
I own a couple boxes of the LE 124 gr +P EFMJs. It would be interesting to see how those perform vs. the Guard Dog.
vanzpp 1 month ago
These are intersting results. I am not sure I would carry it normally, but these have a place in special situations were you need less penetration. They will most likely feed better in some cheaper weapons as well since there is not hollow point. All around odd round with very different results.
Jesses001 1 month ago
Overpenetration, as frequently observed with your favorite "heavy-for-caliber" bullets, would leave you literally defenseless, even with a loaded handgun, in certain situations. Imagine if you were in the gathering near congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords when Jared Loughner began shooting;if you were to open up on him with rounds that penetrated reliably deeper than the thickness of the man's chest from head-on, you're probably hitting someone on the other side. Then you would also end up in jail
zams650 1 month ago
@zams650 A lot of older hollow point projectiles needs to strike something hard like bone before the expand properly. In the case of this round nine inches of penetration means even if the round should penetrate fully the energy left in the projectile isn't sufficient to cause much harm to anyone. It would most likely just bounce off them.
SquirrelFromGradLife 1 month ago
It went 9 inches both times, so what does that tell you? If you get an expanded bullet like that 9 inches through your chest it's pretty much going to ruin your day.
SquirrelFromGradLife 1 month ago in playlist More videos from tnoutdoors9
First thing ,Great video. I would agree that i wouldn't carry this ammo in a conceal carry weapon. But now i am buying it for my house load, were you dont want alot over penetration. I think it would be a good use for that. Less chance going through wall and hitting family member or someone next door.
wmz67 2 months ago
Nice video. Very informative, thank you. I was wondering-with that lead moving forward. Maybe it's supposed to do that-the polymer being squished between the target and the lead. Maybe?
catseatcheese 2 months ago
Nice video, very informative. Thanks
mdc0rqj 2 months ago
Cool!
frogseb 3 months ago
Damn it! I was hoping this ammo did well. lol i was going to a mag of them in my Sub2K, maybe the 16" barrel would improve its preformance. lol Anyway out of all the defense 9mm loads which would you recommend the most?
TactiKoolStuff 3 months ago
is this a fail?
Lethal0ption 3 months ago
@Lethal0ption
Depends on your perspective. Federal heavily markets this as a round designed to penetrate fewer walls in a home than traditional JHP's. Sure, that is a concern for me but my first priority is to stop the threat. Some people will buy it for the low penetration concept, and that concept only. I carry a round that I believe has a better chance of penetrating deeper. I'm going to use my remaining rounds of Guard Dog for target practice, if that says anything.
tnoutdoors9 2 months ago 4
@tnoutdoors9 haha, Let me have em then! i like em
nolanosam 1 month ago
@tnoutdoors9 what do you carry in 9mm
oObassheadOo 1 month ago
@oObassheadOo
147 gr Federal HST, but I'm always open to trying something else that offers similar or better performance AND does not affect my ability to place fast, accurate hits.
tnoutdoors9 1 week ago
@tnoutdoors9 I'm a bit confused by this responce. I look at my 9mm pistol the same way I look at my .223 AR.Small and very fast. A 223 in something like a TAP round, from my understanding, dumps all of its Kenetic energy into the first couple inches of a chest cavity and doesn't always exit out the back, making it more effective than military FMJ. Why wouldn't you want your 9mm to dump 100% of its energy into the bg's chest cavity/vitals as opposed to penetrating out their back?
fnkdtnk 4 weeks ago 3
@fnkdtnk Exit wounds bleed more rapidly than entrance wounds, and most handgun cartridges lack the energy needed to destroy tissues other than the traditional crush cavity. With rifles, they have dramatically fiercer wounds with the increased velocity, can can destroy tissue without actually coming into contact with them. To put it bluntly, penetration for pistols is perfect. (Not that you should carry a fmj 500 SW, but you get the idea).
dysqsarhut 2 weeks ago
@fnkdtnk
Check the brassfetcher info that I just added at the end of this video description. It details the value of shot placement, angle, and body density. In other words, it illustrates that you need to accept the possibility of a worse case scenario IF your shots hit the intended target. Also consider that any bullet can deflect off bone and richochet 90 degrees in another direction. If that happens, I want momentum to continue as far as possible.
tnoutdoors9 1 week ago
@Lethal0ption not at all ..special for my country in which is hollow point illegal to use in self defense. but i can use this , because its actually full metal jacket :D ..no air cavity at front. ..and this is much, much better for self defense then FMJ for sure. but yea, if i could i would go with hollow point, but i cant ..so.
abradras 2 months ago
@abradras That makes sense
Lethal0ption 2 months ago
@Lethal0ption Let's say you took that bullet to the chest, and it expanded like that and it then went 9 inches through your chest would that be a fail or a win? I'm pretty sure it would ruin your day. The most amusing thing is that it also went 9 inches through the gel when it had penetrated two sheet rock plates, so what does that tell you? and just to clarify, your chest is not filled with gel it's mostly just real soft tissue.
Yeah just walk it off...yeah you'll be fine...
SquirrelFromGradLife 1 month ago in playlist More videos from tnoutdoors9
@SquirrelFromGradLife dont get butt hurt
Lethal0ption 1 month ago
@Lethal0ption Well how can you even begin to talk about a fail when the round performances flawlessly and delivers all it's energy in just 9 inches without disintegrating. It's only a 105 grain bullet but it would royally ruin your day and it's fairly cheap. So what's fail about that?
SquirrelFromGradLife 1 month ago
SOLD! These are less expensive than JHP, therefore I'm sold on buying them.
EquipaPatriot 3 months ago
Great idea but I'm not paying $25 for a 20 round box, that's absurd. At the ridiculous prices for today's premium SD ammo, I'll stick with Winchester White Box, their JHP is plenty good for me.
Blahblobify 3 months ago
If any one is stupid enough to place their life on any of these marketed and hyped crazy bullet designs? I feel sorry for them. Every police Department in the Country and the FBI are all brain washed by Ammo marketing reps, and bullet design genius. The Government mandates on ammo are ridiculous. The FBI 1986 mandates probably killed their agents, the bullets fragmented in the bad guy,and he killed two agents and shot 7. FMJ military mandated ammo does what its suppose to do? Stay together.
surfside006 3 months ago
Great test. I have been watching your channel for about a year now, and was waiting for this ammo test. Thank you.
kodisilver 3 months ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
The "jacket separation" you are complaining about is behavior as expected. The lead core is moving forward by inertia to perform the expansion of the polymer. If it was not free to move inside the jacket, it could not expand. The lead core is supposed to move forward when the bullet strikes a target and slows down! Don't you understand how this bullet is supposed to work? it isn't the compression from the FRONT that does it, it's the compression from the BACK.
ardrhi 4 months ago
@ardrhi
I understand how this bullet is supposed to work. Jacket seperation by design or accident is not good. I am not a self-professed expert like you, but I know a piss poor bullet design when I see it. I strongly believe that using this ammo is placing a liabillity on yourself to stop a threat. Don't you understand that poor bullet design leading to underpenetration is not a positive aspect in stopping a threat? Did Federal send you here to crap on the video, or just trolling?
tnoutdoors9 3 months ago 18
@tnoutdoors9 I agree, although as I'm sure you know this bullet WOULD be somewhat useful in a place where JHPs were banned, considering the only other option would be FMJ. I had assumed that was what this bullet was designed for and was surprised to see it in so many gun/ammo shopping locations here in Middle TN (I live in Hermitage). Also as far as you know are there any restrictions here pertaining to the "Law Enforcement" rounds? If not why is it impossible to find the RangerTs or Fed HSTs?
thefinder808 3 months ago
@thefinder808 It's because of Winchester/federals restrictions on their distributors to sell it only to LE, it's legal to purchase but Winchester/federal put restrictions on distributors to keep it out of public hands as much as possible, I guess they're worried about litigation IDK. Not sure about Winchester but I know federal will cut off distributors if they find them selling to non-law-enforcement. That's why it's easier to find on the Internet and not in actual stores
bigboss686 2 months ago 2
@tnoutdoors9
No he is just trolling like he does elsewhere, Dont you understand that!! LMAO!!!!! Thanks for the vid and keep up the great work. I have some of those in 40 cal, might just save my time on the next gel shoot and shoot something that will give better results. Keep the great vids coming!!
ScubaOz 3 months ago
Interesting!
Lookinformemarbles 4 months ago
I thought the wound channel was impressive. Great expansion. I might give this round a look see.
bumjim2000 4 months ago
If I ever need to shoot through a car door or windshield, penetration is a good thing. However, shot placement is far more important in my opinion. 8-9" of penetration in my overweight chest area would hit some vitals and with a round like this, I wouldn't have to worry about it taking out my neighbors if I miss.
devcon67 4 months ago
@devcon67 You're ignoring the fact if you are shooting at someone they are probably carrying some type of weapon as well, and where do you and most everyone else hold their weapon? In front of their chest of course, which means that if you hit the person's arm with this round it probably won't penetrate into the chest. This is why penetration AND shot placement are important.
iHumanist 4 months ago
Wow, that's very nice.
NC77583 4 months ago
Love your videos, very much knowledge is learned from this ! Thank You ! :3))
EmY008800 4 months ago
i THINK YOU JUST SAVED ALOT OF LIVES!!!!
timbo749 4 months ago
so is this round going to be better for personal protection and home defense ? Do they make this in .45acp?
fireman7522 4 months ago
i really dont think 8inches is bad penetration.... at the end of the day, if its gonna end up IN them. Its gonna work
gshdrums 4 months ago
One thing to consider tho its not "everything" if you measure from the chest to back of your average person it isn't usually more than 10 inches wich means it'll stop inside or just outside its target and wont be much threat downrange and it will disperse all of its energy in the target great video as always
fpssilentfox 4 months ago
Do you plan on doing any 10mm tests? I would love to see the results.
THEKINGOFMETROPOLIS 4 months ago 8
@THEKINGOFMETROPOLIS
10mm.....possibly the latter part of 2012 at the earliest. Nothing in the immediate future.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago 2
@tnoutdoors9 would you shoot some .357 magnum hallow point
jjjjdogify 4 months ago
@jjjjdogify
Hoping to start testing .357 Magnum early 2012.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago
@tnoutdoors9 thanks man ive been hoping some body that does know wat their doing to test them
jjjjdogify 4 months ago
@tnoutdoors9 10mm would be great. I have a Glock20 and love the round. I have started to lean more toward 9mm due to the low cost and readily available ammo though :-(
GunzEveryWhere 4 months ago
@THEKINGOFMETROPOLIS
+1 on the 10mm!!!
XParaXBellumX 2 weeks ago
Exelent vid!!
Bigntactical1 4 months ago
The projectile looks promising,maybe make this a + P load and see what happens .Better than a hollow point going thru denium good stopping power . This one looks like is has good potential in the 380 pocket guns.It might make another great personal defense round.
dannyfivefifty 4 months ago
I think I will stay with the Hornandy Critical Defense.
Glock n Load,
Mike
videosbymike 4 months ago
If this wasn't labeled "home defense", I'd be disappointed. They got it right with the name however as it is a lower recoil but most importantly, doesn't over-penetrate. I don't want to be shooting a bullet traveling to depths of 12"-16" for this intended purpose, I dont feel like missing and endangering neighbors. Same reason why the 12 gauge by the bed isn't loaded with buckshot. This is something I'd use for home defense only though - I'll take the nastiest JHP for concealed/everyday carry..
HorsepowerAddiction 4 months ago
LOVE the longer format and the addition of drywall. great job!
revgotchrist 4 months ago
excellent vid...I've really taken a liking to your ammo test, you do them well. ln this vid enjoyed the variety of testing mediums.. I am sure it isn't cheap to do that every time, but I really like liked the drywall kicker.
vboyanich 4 months ago
I was wondering if you would do some testing of 7.62x39 ammo. Thanks!!!
trustygun25 4 months ago
It was nice to see you use the drywall, great videos! Maybe someday you could blast a 3" slug out of your 12gauge into that test gel, that would be nice to see.
Art2Sec26 4 months ago
This round has it's place.
Some areas declare JHP bullets illegal for carry.
Federal has gotten around those bans with this bullet.
Migs4000 4 months ago
Thanks for the video. I would like to see how the .45 caliber stack up.
roglamb 4 months ago
Whoa exactly as advertised on 3 Gun Nations commercials!
MaseratiChris556 4 months ago
Great video...u just saved me about $80..I was gonna give these new rounds a try but after watching ur video Ill just stick to my ranger hollow points...thnx again
Titan9mm 4 months ago
thank you for performing these test. great job!
putodedago 4 months ago
its ok for self defence kuz you can shoot them like 5 times and they would bleed out at least if not droping instantly
wildlifeoutfitter 4 months ago
Really enjoy your vids, thanks! I picked up some of this ammo and some 147 gr hollow points to test side by side. I like the idea of less penetration but I noticed I can fire off more quick accurate shots with the 147 gr hollow points because of less barrel flip. I could also notice my recoil reducer from Sprinco working for me better with the 147 gr.
xjapa1n 4 months ago
I've said it before and I'll say it again, "Any round that can kill a bad guy will kill your kid if you miss and it hits in the right place." People that count on these trick rounds are only fooling themselves, they be better off buying normal rounds and using the saved money to train.
Lokpyrite 4 months ago
Great Detail review truly appreciated. In your personal opinion for a person that lives in an apartment complex what ammo would you recommend for a 9mm pistol. My main an obcious concern in over penetration of a neighbors apt wall if an emergency arose. Any an all help will be truly appreciates.
created2worshyp 4 months ago
It's an interesting design idea, though it obviously fails to perform as well as JHP. Seems like there's always a niche market for gimmick ammo!
roentgen571 4 months ago
Thanks for the test, I had wondered about this ammo. May serve well where over penetration is the concern.
I hope we may see a test of some Wilson Combat ammo in the not to distant future!
Lars191145 4 months ago
looks like some1's inner's will get messed up badly
doncheeto17 4 months ago
great tests, excellently done, great job man
goalieslayer 4 months ago
Thank you so much for doing this!
Gotskilla 4 months ago
@scubaoz
I could agree more
Doc6mm 4 months ago
Looks like they need to +p that little guy. If I remember correctly, some municipalities have banned jhp pistol ammo and this product is aimed at them.
erkwit 4 months ago
The expanded bullet at 2:00 is a cool-looking little object. Love the blue polymer "accents."
mulkurul85 4 months ago
A very thorough review. Thanks for the added testing. BTW, did the "Retired Milkmen of America" petition you for the return of the jug test? I've heard they have a small, but powerful lobby... ;-)
TheGunfighter45acp 4 months ago
I remember when EFMJ came out, they were designed for pistols that could not cycle hollow points and the second feature was a better carry load that FMJ in areas were carring hollow point is illeagal. For those of us that dont have those issues, stick with better options.
ScubaOz 4 months ago
Thanks, I have been interested in this since I have been seeing it in the ads.
dnasplice 4 months ago
Thanks for the video, but I really wanted to see the Guard Dog in .45 auto. All my 9mms are loaded with Ranger Ts and those have an excellent reputation and amazing reliability in all my pistols; I don't plan on getting anything else for them. But I'm sorta "experimenting" with the .45 loads. At the moment, I'm using Hornady's Critical Defense, the classic Silvertips, and Guard Dogs, all three mixed up in my mags. I'm wondering if this design would maximize the "punch" of the .45 ACP.
TheWitnesserer 4 months ago
Great video. Do you think the lack of penetration is due to the lower weight and higher velocity of the round or some other factor?
Grav251 4 months ago
Great info again, thanks.
72cmcinc 4 months ago
Great Video. Thanks for all the extra time and effort on this one. It brings to light the real performance of a unique concept. We appreciate the videos and the information that separates the hype from the reality. THANKS!
OldPackMule 4 months ago
:) Thank you for sharing this. You really shed a light on this fairly new round.
lhusby 4 months ago
Comment removed
achigurh 4 months ago
Much appritiated! I've always sort of wondered if I should "upgrade" to something like this. You probably have or will have some tests of hornady etc up... I'll look for those.
Have you ever tested RBCD ammo? Recently came across it and thinking about doing some tests myself, although I don't have a camera. :)
thegangvault2 4 months ago
if i wanted a bullet for inside the house i would go with a glaser safety slug - not this bullet...yes the little pellets may make it through a wall - but not with enough energy to kill a family member...as far as street carry?- well , i would never carry a bullet that yaws right out of the barrel....
1789000 4 months ago
What bothers me the most about 9mm is over penatration.
This round seems to be effective for that purpose.
Great tests, you do the best tests I've seen, compare the same to the manufacturers videos.
ristin59 4 months ago
im not sure i understand why this is so bad i like my neighbors and my family and dont want alot of over penetration. could you maybe explain why this is such a negative for home defense?
jeeperscreepers71 4 months ago
@jeeperscreepers71
For misses and hitting your walls, this appears to be a better option than JHP. If you want to effectively stop the threat, this pales in comparison to underpenetrating 9mm's I've tested and researched.
Does the concept of overpenetration tempt anyone to use this for street carry, more open environment, or do you feel for some reason that 8 to 9" penetration for the street bad guy isn't enough? Why is it considered enough when they are already inside your home?
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago
@tnoutdoors9 i havent been watching your channel for that long which vids should i watch for comparison?
jeeperscreepers71 4 months ago
@jeeperscreepers71
Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST seem to do best, Winchester is generally good. CorBon and Hornady have worked as advertised.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago
@jeeperscreepers71 Assuming you completely buy into the over penetration myth. I been sold this tripe as cop
and I believed it. Assuming a bad guy is i your house? Assuming you actually shoot him,and actually hit him?
Do you know,that the FMJ bullet most likely never leave his body,or if it does,may fall on the floor behind him?
Instead of playing with myths and gel tests, read actual police autopsies. back Skin usually stop's the bullet exit.
and JHP wounds close close up,and 80% survive.
surfside006 4 months ago
@surfside006 ive never been privy to that kind of info ive been shooting rifles since i was a little kid but pistols are really kinda new for me im just trying to understand all the angles.
jeeperscreepers71 4 months ago
@jeeperscreepers71 A hi-power rifle bullet might go through the whole neighborhood no joke.
But most hand gun bullets are maybe a quarter as powerful if you hit a bad guy body probably the bullet will stay in him.If you use a hollow point it make simply give him a belly ache.And he may expire a week later.
Nobody wants to shoot any body, but if your life is in danger,do you want to play Russian roulette, you want to survive. That means seriously stopping the threat FMJ will help you do so.
surfside006 4 months ago
@surfside006 Lol what?
A 75 gr. 5.56 NATO OTM bullet is less likely to penetrate deep into barriers than ALL handgun calibers/bullets.
Have you measured yourself lately? How thick is your chest cavity? 12" will do...
iHumanist 4 months ago
Thanks for testing these rounds, I purchased some of these for my 9mm Hi Point C9, and I feel that these would be fine for me in a small apt. complex. I wish it was +p rated though, plus p rated runs better in my C9, Being that it was really made for it.
Eaks2215 4 months ago
That was very disappointing.. I was really looking forward to efmj ammo for my hollow point sensitive hi point to keep in my truck... I guess I will just have to stick with flat points or something... Maybe some soft point ammo. I had high hopes for this stuff..
YamahaWR200 4 months ago
@Tnoutdoors9
Sweet tests, hey could you run some 9mm powrballs through your sim test media, it's my favorite light for caliber load.
Doc6mm 4 months ago
Awesome testing!!
sjr341 4 months ago
Awesome test, interesting results thanks for doing these
GunWebsites 4 months ago
Do you think the jacket separation occurred in the barrel or when the jacket expanded? That is an interesting round. I don't necessarily believe the low penetration of the bullet is always a bad thing. Very interesting video.
taofledermaus 4 months ago
@taofledermaus
Seperation upon impact.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago
What a great video. That's a junk bullet. Bullets kill through a CNS hit or quickly dropping blood pressure. If that light, soft edged bullet hits as predicted by this video, you better put multiple hits on target. This is why police officers carrying the 9mm have to fire a volley of shots to save their lives.
The video is also a good warning to anyone who plans to take cover behind dry wall.
enjoythewildUSA 4 months ago
I love how thorough and rational your ammo test are.
franklima260 4 months ago
i could not wait for u to test this round. ty so much! thisis not the worst r pound u have test but its not the best, it wont be replacing my top 3 picks. for the 9mm. #1 124gr gold dot, 115gr critacal defense and 127 gr +p ranger t- series
Evoluztion 4 months ago
I like this before I even got the the introduction! I was really hoping you'd test this round! anxious to see the results!
JDW857 4 months ago
Interesting & Informative as usual TN9, Keep up the great work!! Interesting take by Federal on the clogging issue of hollowpoints & the polymer plug. About only use for this bullet after your vid i can see, is for those scared to death of over penetration but not wanting to use regular FMJ bullets.
MstangMch4 4 months ago
ouch !
hazman440 4 months ago
Awesome ballistics test. I feel that this bullet is a bit light for self defense and your test prove that fact. Also, I am surprised at the amount of gel in the bullet. Very nice comparison done with the water jugs and dry wall. Great ballistics test video. Very well done!
xtremearmor 4 months ago
This is a good round for home defense because of the unlikely chance that the bullet will pass through the bad guy and endanger people in the next room or apartment. An 8 1/2" deep hole in someone would likely change their mind.
yellowbusguy 4 months ago
@yellowbusguy over penetration to me isnt the problem so much as missing completely
neroharo 4 months ago
I believe the round to be adequate with proper placement. I personally would rather end the threat vs. end up in court due to collateral damage via over penetration. The round simply makes sense.
11snakedoc11 4 months ago
very good information thanks
rbelena 4 months ago
I am guessing this ammunition was made for people in states where hollowpoint ammunition is illegal? I do find this bothersome by the results, definitive not my choice for a carry load.
Renta1Cop 4 months ago
great tests.
Elweenieloco 4 months ago
Did you pull one of the unfired bullets to see what the backside looks like? I'm wondering if that space you saw at 02:50 might be manufactured that way.
sappha58 4 months ago
@sappha58
I did not pull a bullet. The base is actually not flat, there is a generous cavity that resembles the base of a Civil War Minie Ball. The core moved forward on impact for each test, with the greatest amount of movement on the denim block test; third in the sequence.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago
@tnoutdoors9 Thanks for the response - I enjoy your videos, and you do an excellent job of researching your subject and putting the facts out there!
sappha58 4 months ago
Great video, and thank you for such a thorough review. I know this was rare and I love your videos, but honestly it would be great to see this with all future bullet reviews.
binyamj 4 months ago
sure is neat looking ammo even when expanded and interesting in concept. I do see why it was made to be lighter and how over penetration is a possible problem as often it is a concern that i have when purchasing defensive loads so theoretically this is ammo i would .."like" to use but i would prefer to see a more aggressive expansion and a heavier bullet. Really enjoyed the simulated wall test you did. That is one of my primary concerns but also what if it penetrates though the target as well.
SakuraMasumi 4 months ago
Thanks for the very informative video. The 3 tests really help illustrate the overall performance of this round
SVTfordPINTO 4 months ago
I had some of this ammo by federal 10 years ago. Glad they updated and still make it. Doubt they could bond the lead core without damaging the poly.
easydoz1 4 months ago
isn't low penetration is what you need for home deface load scenario?
Prowler1 4 months ago
i think there is nothing wrong with 8 inches, all this stuff with 10 to 15 inches of penetration, is alot more than the width of a chest
gshdrums 4 months ago
Great job! Thanks for sharing...
hazeywolf 4 months ago
But if you got shot with this....... Yea you have been shot
coldbeer338 4 months ago
Nice video as always, isnt that bullet a bit light for a defenceive round?
kysteelworker 4 months ago
@kysteelworker
In 9mm I seem to think so. I prefer to stay at 124 gr or above for 9mm, although the 115 gr Federal +P+ BPLE is a proven performer. The Guard Dog is also loaded light in .40 (135 gr) and .45 ACP (165 gr) for likely the same purpose here.......reduce overpenetration through walls.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago
thanks for the effort, good fo
desirefirst 4 months ago
The gentler, softer ammo...
I've always wanted to shoot pillows out of the end of my barrel.
Thanks for the info.
ALAPINO 4 months ago
Perfectly symmetrical
Livelifechill 4 months ago
Thank you very much for doing these ammo tests! :D
deathrooster14 4 months ago
WOW, whole lotta like for this test. What a well thought out and rigorously conducted test. Thanks, TNOutdoors!!!!
snoeplow 4 months ago
Excellent test.
akiratubo 4 months ago
Should do that with all bullet ammo testing. Next up definitely my own personal protection which i carry in a couple of my handguns are the extreme shock. I use the air freedoms and the fang face which are named differently now due to legal issues. But really got to check out extreme shock.
DrKlickklackPow 4 months ago
Excellent testing, I really appreciate your work! Keep the great videos coming!
benmc68 4 months ago
My understanding of this round is that its a home defense round that was designed not to over penetrate walls. This is one I have purchased but not tested, based on that thought. Thank you for this info it is very informative.
jplerwill 4 months ago
Another great vid, thanks for all of the hard work and for sharing. I was pretty interested in these, but I think that I'll stick to my Gold Dots. Take care.
1AbominAble1 4 months ago
honestly tho how far is the heart down in the chest..
derekgrebner87 4 months ago
@derekgrebner87
Depends on the angle, focusing on COM it could 5" or multiples of that. As a hunter, you wait for the best possible shot, as in, your not punching one up the rear end trying to hit the heart; correct? You prefer an instant drop, correct? I want the same for self defense, but I'm facing a disadvantage of being the one hunted, wanting an opportunity to fight back and win with ammo that does not accept minimal penetration as a compromise.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago 3
@tnoutdoors9 i understand I was just saying it seems like it would stay in him pretty good.
derekgrebner87 4 months ago
@derekgrebner87
You do have to remember that in real life you'll be going through some heavy bone mass before you reach the vitals. without a good penetrating bullet, it would not get through that bone mass.
tchorses67 4 months ago
Don't think I'll be buying these any time soon, or ever. Great idea, including a wall in the test.
grizz474 4 months ago
Thanks for the heads up on this ammo. I am not real fond of the 9MM because of the lack of stopping power but I still own a couple of 9MM.
jpdolezal 4 months ago
Yesss! Thanks, man!
jopoy456 4 months ago
I want a good defense round to fire out of my sub 2000 but the manual says brass only do you think this round would be good?
reillyt868 4 months ago
@reillyt868
Go with the manual and contact the manufacturer to confirm. Tell them what you would like to carry and get their blessing first and foremost.
tnoutdoors9 4 months ago
@reillyt868 When they say, "Brass Only" they really mean no CCI Blazer aluminum or steel case. Those materials do not 'spring back' after firing. Most of the shiny cases you see are actually nickel plated brass and will feed and eject better than plain brass. That's why most of personal defense rounds are so plated.
philgarcia09 4 months ago
@reillyt868 if you watch nutnfancys video on the sub 2000 i think its his "sub gun needs part one" he runs in to alot of problems with non brass casings, but also like Tnoutdoors says check with the manufacturer to be sure but my guess is it will most likely have issues.
MegaNeckbeard 4 months ago
I really like the wall test. The test really shows the performance of the bullet in a real world senario.
pucksupport28 4 months ago
Love your tests. This is a neat concept but looks like it kinda fails to deliver. It might work for really picky guns that just wont feed a jhp or where jhp is prohibited but still needs more development. I am glad you tested these, I was thinking they were probably pretty good rounds. Maybe they should change the name of the round from Guard Dog to Ankle Biter.
shananagans5 4 months ago