omgggg i forgot this guy is GOD!!, whoever the fuck is listening to this guy go ahead, but honestly religion is everyone's own purpose this man has no right to claim things like this, he does not even no what life is, and yet what death even is?, just because the bible stories may not be real, doesnt mean they send morals and messages to understand what life will bring us ahead, im not scared of death and never will be even if god doesnt exist,his cockiness is pathetic and people should wake up
If Atheists don't need constant reinforcement why go to school? Isn't school generally the reinforcement of ideas with facts and figures? And isn't church very much like school in that we gain deeper insights into what we believe, as anyone would find in school?
@speeddemon990084 Science -unlike religion- is always evolving. Education is always being updated. Religion sometimes backpedals, but it does not evolve. Therefor it does nothing but reinforce itself.
Atheist go to school to learn. Theists go to places of worship to reinforce. You're still not understanding the difference.
@bla87 Nor do you see the connection. Religion is also evolving as we consider new ways to think about God or the gods. Religion will even update itself according to scientific discovery.
@speeddemon990084 How so? Religion plays down certain views as morality evolves in an effort to avoid being labeled a hateful organization. That's about it.
@bla87 That's not really true. Religion is constantly updating its interpretations of their holy scriptures. At least this is true of Christianity.We update our interpretation of the Bible to fit our culture. I suggest you learn more about religions before you comment further. And stay away from Hitchens if you don't know much about religion as he may be intelligent, but he lacks understanding of Christianity for sure, though from what I know of Islam he understands that slightly better.
@bla87 Think of the Bible like the Constitution: We have to constantly adapt our interpretation of it to new inventions, situations, and environments.
@speeddemon990084 The constitution was never presented as the divine opinion of god. The fact that the bible is a dated reflection of the time in which it was published should tell you something.
@bla87 You're right about the Constitution, but that's inconsequential. The analogy still works. The Constitution was written in a certain time period, and meant to be flexible, as is the Bible. Think Jesus and the law: Jesus brought new understanding to the law. Now certainly we would never allow for certain things to be tossed aside, but we do acknowledge that many if not all of the Bible was written by humans inspired by certain events.
@bla87 I dunno who you're referencing with the "homophobic peers" bit at the end, but news is easy to come by when you have limited knowledge about an idea, religion, philosophy, or group. I would imagine you're getting alot of newsflashes today.
As I said earlier, many of the writers of the Bible were inspired by certain events, and not the voice of God. They wrote in their own time and reflect the culture they lived in, and they knew this.
@speeddemon990084 Homophobic peers refers to the sea of Christian activist that oppose gay marriage (duh)
“As I said earlier, many of the writers of the Bible were inspired by certain events, and not the voice of God. They wrote in their own time and reflect the culture they lived in, and they knew this.”
My point is that nowhere in the bible does it say that the book should be questioned or updated, and contrary to your implication I have read the bible.
@bla87 How so? This is not backpedaling, it is forward thinking. It is not shoring up a wall against criticism, it is allowing for new ideas to take root after thoughtful consideration.
Your point is misguided on the Bible. The Bible suggests that it is useful for instruction and correction, but not to be taken literally in every instance. Do you need to have permission to question?
@speeddemon990084 How is it not backpedaling to basically say: "The bible is the word of god- but okay, we admit this is wrong. This other stuff is still right, though"
It's not shoring up a wall against criticism? Then, why is every morality against the bible initially met with claims of going to hell? "The Bible suggests that it is useful for instruction and correction, but not to be taken literally in every instance."
That does not mean that the bible itself can evolve.
@bla87 Ok I never said that. And besides the original writers wouldn't have said that either, though they may have said they were doing God's will. On top of that we know more about the cultural context in which the Bible was written, so we can divine it's greater meaning more readily.
You are allowing a group of hard-line Christians to speak for the whole religion. Not every Christian will tell you that a lie earns you an automatic seat in Hell.
@bla87 I never said that it was updated, only that our interpretations are updated with new knowledge and insights. Again, much like education. Old facts are now repudiated by new facts: i.e. age of the Earth, orbit of the Earth around the Sun, Earth is round. How is it not backpedaling to say that the Earth is the center of the universe (as Aristotle thought) and then have someone condemn that fact with a new one: the Earth orbits around the Sun?
@speeddemon990084 Your original point was that atheist might as well not go to school if they don't need reinforcement. I pointed out that education updates itself, and religion just reinforces, commencing a long drawn out back and forth that has finally come full circle.
@speeddemon990084 The bible does not update itself and science does as evident in our current understanding of the earth, the sun etc. All these things are presented as theories (the latest is always accepted but never set in stone), and not the opinion of god.
You're basically proving my point that it was silly to say that atheist might as well not go to school.
@bla87 I don't think you understand me at all- my points or my beliefs, I'm sorry to say.
You are talking about a book that was finally completed about 1700 years ago. Such a book, you would be right to say could not rewrite itself. However, you fail to see that Biblical study does update. Science does not update itself. Science is evident, as we cannot change the way our world, and more largely, our universe work. Our understanding of how the world and universe work does change.
@bla87 You don't understand that religion is ever changing, as is our understanding of the universe. You predicate all your arguments on the idea that the Bible doesn't change. As I said below a book could not update itself, but our understanding can. Just any field of study.
@speeddemon990084 I understand your points- I'm sorry to say I disagree with them.
All books are up for interpretation. That doesn't mean literary changes into something else just as religion doesn't change. Society changes around these entities, but what is written in the bible remains concrete.
Again, just admit your argument that atheist might as well not go to school was remarkably stupid so I can go to bed.
@bla87 You're free to go to bed whenever you want. I'm not suggesting making any changes to the Bible itself, just the interpretation of it. You're just re-iterating what I'm saying, which is why I find it hard for you to disagree with me.
I never said Atheists shouldn't go to school. I do apologize for you taking it that way.
@speeddemon990084 No, you didn't literally say that. But, your world view is apparently not meant to be literal so how is one suppose to see the difference?
Information doesn't change religion. Morality evolves against it, and they adjust. That's completely different from the way science evolves. That's the difference I'm trying to establish.
@bla87 You're being judgmental, and I'll thank you to refrain from that.
Information does indeed change religion. You are talking to a religious person, and acting arrogant and ignorant; not a good combination by the way. You are supposing to tell me how my beliefs work, and how they change. This is becoming redundant. When Bible scholars interpret the Bible they look at the best possible manuscripts. Sometimes new ones are found which are better than the old. Therefore new insights.
@speeddemon990084 If you're going to debate someone you should develop some thicker skin. Disagreeing with someone does not involve judgement. I have not presented any false information. So, you're basically calling me ignorant because my views defer from yours. And I'm the judgmental one?
"Besides religion will also change its interpretation of the Bible because of new scientific discoveries, for instance the age of the earth vs Genesis 1."
@speeddemon990084 I'm expressing my believes on the matter. That does not infringe on yours. I'm "acting arrogant", but you're the one that is responding to my opinions like they're a harsh examination of your inner workings.
@bla87 Well when you say that my comment was the dumbest argument you'd ever heard apart from one, and that I had to admit that what I said was stupid that is a harsh criticism. Also when you say that I am not inclined to take things literally that is making an assumption on my character which you do not know.
I am not trying to respond in an arrogant fashion, though I do trust myself to know what I believe and why I believe it. I don't mind that we disagree.
@speeddemon990084 Okay, that first comment was harsh, but you have to admit IT WAS a stupid statement. Everything you to come out of your mouth since has been practical and intelligent (aside from saying that I was trying to tell you what you believe, but I think that was just a pissed off response) The second one is a joke that is obviously not meant to be hurtful.
@bla87 Besides religion will also change its interpretation of the Bible because of new scientific discoveries, for instance the age of the earth vs Genesis 1.
@speeddemon990084 So.. let me understand this. You're now trying to say that education is the religion of the atheist??
Education is about teaching the unknowing things we know. Like, physics, mathematics. We live in a specialised society and these basic principles are important to understand before real, hard skills can be taught.
Religion, I'm sorry, is just about escaping death. There is no comparison.
@dmmchn Not entirely, no. I continue to be educated as a college student. Education is necessary for anyone of any belief. But what I am saying is that education provides knowledge about concrete ideas as well as abstract ones depending on the field of study, church does very much the same.
@speeddemon990084 Well from what I can gather from your other posts your point of view is as follows
- Science is reasonable, rational thinking valid
- However you still fear death to the point that you try to rationalise the beliefs of a time pre-science.
Religion isn't really a very abstract idea, especially christianity - it's only abstract in its interpretation, not its absolute message. Church simply teaches people "this is how to interpret, in order to be rewarded"
Not every religious person wants to blow himself up and kill as many people as he can just because of some supposed divine revelation. Hitchens shouldn't assume that the religious will kill us all in so called Holy Wars or Crusades.
@dmmchn There's not really any evidence against religion. Science can neither confirm nor refute the existence of God or gods. I don't feel marginalised either, but at times I feel that religions are misunderstood by their critics.
@speeddemon990084 Yes, that's true, and I agree- the only really rational position is agnosticism from either side. But what I mean is - theres evidence that contradicts the teachings of religions.
I'm mainly talking about hardline fundamentalists, and they are very vocal about it, and I think Hitchens is too. Science is hard. Understanding it is hard.
"Kill people because they are heathens" is easy, life affirming and personally meaningful.
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A question for atheists. In a world where there's no proof of God's existence or of life after death; how will you explain to your children why you brought them into the world and why they should die?
I love how he made the point that God and Jesus only made themselves known to humanity at that specific time after the Greeks, Romans, Persians, Egyptians and so many cultures before, in that specific part of the world. Why not everywhere at the same time since he's God he could do that. And safe all the bloodshed and hatred during the Crusades and all the missionary times.
Being the devout and true blue athiest I am death is extra hard. Once you become a "real" athiest. The type of athiest that became an athiest out of education and knowledge not out of a rebellion. You can never go back to religion even if you really wanted to. This makes me understand why religion doesn't die off. Death is hard and it's easy to not educate yourself. That is why. It;s comfort that reality doesn't offer.
@ProRanting Death is only hard to the young my friend. Spend time with lots of people of a very advanced age and death stops being a gruesome or scary thing, just a way to rest. Frankly the idea of immortality scares me more then death, It'll be just like how you were before you were born.
@TheAcad3mic I wish I could think like that, but I just can't. I savior my life and all of my beloved who live it with me. I've already faced a few major deaths in my time and mourn those loved ones no less then I did they day they were pronounced dead. I think we just have different mind sets. Mine is cowardly, but atleast I admit it. Severe memory loss runs through my family and the idea of forgetting my life is horrifying. Furthermore, I don't want to be Un-born. I want to live. Capital L. L!
@ProRanting I have to agree with you on one point, I'd much rather die in my sleep at the end of a full life with fantastic memories then forget them... Getting Alzheimers(sp?) or advanced dementia is genuinely one of my greatest fears. That disease is so cruel, and if you've seen anything like what I've seen in your family then you have my deepest sympathies. I think compared to that fate dying is easy. You're not who you were either way and your family don't have to face it in the same way...
this same guy tried to debate dawknis when he went to his show and now hes taking it easy with hitchens so i guess he learn not fuck with ppl like them
@sl3ya44 He doesn't debate, he interviews, and that often requires proposing an opposing point of view to prompt conversation. George strikes me as a very intelligent and mature host.
god is not great but Hitchens certainly is. What's with the stupid 2 comments before mine? Religion is the great deflector of logic, truth, inquiry, and free thought. Magic and superstition are useless and dangerous in an age of very possible self-destruction and annihilation. Religious nutjobs really must wake up.
i want to make an experiment.. indoctrinate children into a totally falsible ideology and see if in the future they become fundamentalist arrogants because of it
Hey, I've got another idea! Let's indoctrinate kids with the idea that their ancestors ass-fucked each other in trees, defecated on each others heads and food and killed each other for food and for the right to bang all the females and probably a few of the younger males.
Then, introduce them to Jack Daniels and Scotch and see if they don't turn into arrogant, self-important publicity hounds, spoiling for a fight...
hmm hitchen is right in many cases but then he says we are poorly evolved and that prehistoric humans lived only for 20 years, is there any evidence for this??
I agree that most of us dont know how to take care and eat right, but still
I have been in and was a fundamentalistic christian and now know that creationism is bullcrap, and the "god" I believed in is not great. but I would like to challenge all "ateists" and other to read this book :
@savednorwegian The evidence for the lifespan of early humans is in the fossil record. There's plenty of books on the subject of human evolution that include information on this. I'd recomment Why Evolution is True by Jerry A Coyne.
@savednorwegian Okay. I've looked at "Secret teachings of all ages" by Manly P. Hall and, while I'm not pretending to have read it all, it looks like it's full of hearsay and conspiracy theories? I'll keep reading and see if I can learn anything from it though.
@ormysceptic well im about to start reading it-but a good friend of mine has read it and told me about it, so much have been hidden from us by religion and socalled "men of god"-little g intended. but of course ill have to read it myself to come to a better conclusion. good for you! the stupidiest thin one can do is to not be skeptical and think about things for yourself, ill say "the only thing i know for sure; is that i might be wrong"-since i have been wrong so many times-but ive learned much
basically you have to gamble on one ideology,if your wrong your gonna go to hell.
what should we believe in? We know probably that jesus,mohammed existed..
but the funny thing is hinduism is the oldest religion by far..people don't seem to add that in..odd actually..so if man made god before jesus,mohammed,why should it be any different with jesus and mohammed? cuz we want it to to be different? does that make it more true.....=p?
Seriously?? does eh really think the world is going to end at the hands of fanatic power hungry muslims in iran and a few crazed jews? i feel tht is way below his standard of integrity to believe in such nonsense. Or maybe he has some info tht i dont have. If tht is the case i would like to see him present it.
@Perinnial2010 What about if you thought about, the fact that George Bush is a "born Again" and he sat right next to the button to nuclear weapons, I find that a little scary.
Comparing modern-day Christianity and Islamic fundamentalism is quite a stretch, even for Hitchens. And good Christian scholars do go to the Greek and Hebrew texts for authority, not the English or even Latin for the most part (I wouldn't call Ann Richards a theologian). Also, Hitchens aversion to "evangelism" doesn't make sense to me if he actually understands people. If someone actually believes in his religion, he would be a fool to keep his ideas to himself completely.
Atheist is about believe in a god, agnostic is about knowing a god. I am an agnostic-atheist, because I don't know if there is a god (I can prove a negative) but I don't believe in the existence of a superior power. I'm open minded to the possibility of god; but it must be enough proof to demostrate it. I hope that clarify a little.
Words are for conveying meaning, not concealing it. Communicate clearly when you have something to say. I could have phrased this as "Sesquipedalians preclude perspicaciousness" if I wanted to be a windy bastard, but I'm trying to make an actual point here.
By the way, obsequious and sycophantic both mean servile. Good writing isn't redundant.
I still can't see how people try to deny evolution or the big bang when there is so much evidence. People don't deny the theory of an asteroid killing the dinosaurs. Why? because it doesn't challenge the words in whatever their religious text may be.
true, i cant say for certain there is not a macdonalds fast food outlet on the planet mars. dont waste your time with know or not know, use probability instead. it destroys religion.
The strongest reason why people believe in this nonsense is because they are brainwashed from a very young age with fairy tales of delusion and fantasy about something somebody said somebody told them happened 4,000 years ago...it boggles my mind how anyone can believe n such things as a invisible gods following them around and helping them out on a day to day basis. It is toxic to the human spirit to have such false ideas.
I love your sentiment, but unfortunately it can be PROVEN that Hitchens was born in England. If you can't prove one way or the other where you were born, then apparently you are still eligible
That's what I like about him too Jones. George can interview anyone and he seems down to earth and non-judgemental. And to be a good talk show host you have to be able to not judge and ask the tough questions.
Why is everyone trying to classify different kinds of atheism. It annoys me, for example the name "New Atheism", it sounds like a religion. I don't call myself an atheist, if someone asks me to define myself in terms of my religious beliefs, I will just say "none". It's as easy as that.
@HANK0000 I don't quite understand it either. I think people are so used to labelling people as Protestants, Catholics, Shi'ites, Sunni, etc. that they cannot for a second consider the fact that there are people who do not fall under the umbrella of religion at all.
I always say 'none' or that 'I haven't any religion', rather than say I'm an atheist. It just seems unnecessary to me to label one's self an atheist.
he in fact calls him self an ante theist ,he says that it is more then atheism , its the repulsion of any sort of maniacal jealous genocidal infanticide homicidal entity , and i agree .
Religion itself isn't entirely bad, as Hitchens even says himself it does have some great aspirations and some good morals, however the negative aspects of religion (ie: the dogmatic sense that this is the only 'correct' religion) is as Hitchens said a tainted core that pollutes every thread radiating outward from it. I liken it to star not much different to our own, only that it has higher radiation levels and therefore makes civilized life unbearably difficult and in many cases impossible
Religious people are religious because when they realize that they are going to eventually die, they start going through the 5 stages of grief. When the get to the 3rd stage of 'Barganing', a religion offers them a solution and they are stuck at that stage.
I feel, that as an atheist that was raised christian and went through the typically stages to become atheist, I also had to go through the 5 stages of dealing with grief in respect to my own inevitable death.
It's also good to see an american presenter reason objectively with his guest, rather than allow his personal feelings to obscure his ability to do so, likethat mega cock, wanker, complete fuckhead of the universe, o reilly. I hate that man
Thank you for posting this video. I have watched a video that presented a very good point for this video. It is called What is Spiritual Practice? POWERFUL and THOUGHT-PROVOKING by Tsemtulku
watch hitchens debates, he kills everyone. Hes smart, eduacted and well researched. this guy nows what hes talking about and hes not jabbering on, george should let him finish his point!
i wouldn't go that far to call him narcissist. And what do you mean most atheists are? If something, most religios people are and not the other way around. Jesus Christ must have been one of the biggest narcissists in the history (if that one we know about ever lived). That's what makes a religion, someone proclaming his self to be close to god or be a god himself.
I take it you are in fact an Atheist, then? Wasn't trying to offend.
Personally, I believe everybody worships something, whether it's money, a deity of some sort, or in the Athiest's case, themselves.
Most religious folks are just idiots. Narcissism requires one to constantly draw attention to themselves, where as the Christian belief is more about drawing attention to God (in whatever form that particular church sees Him).
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Athiests on the other hand are constantly reminding everybody of how ignorant the masses are, and how much more intelligent they themselves are simply because they refuse to believe in a God.
I'm not saying all Athiests are full of themselves, but just like being Christian typically includes being a complete douchebag who doesn't even know his own religion well enough to confidently debate, so too does the snobbish attitude come with the Athiest package.
yes i am and no i wasn't offended. And i don't really agree that everyone worships something in the same sense as people worship a God. you can't really worship money because you don't really think that it's a diety of some kind, you just love it because it gives you stuff you like.
And the prophets DID draw attentions to them selves. In the time when Jesus is supossed to have lived, There where an infation of prophets and gods. It's all about drawing attention to yourself.
Do you even 'get' what atheism states about a person? Really, I think you don't even know what you are talking about. The only thing that connects atheists together is a nonbelief in a theistic god or gods. Nothing more, nothing less. I presume we are both against racism. We are both 'a-racists', but does this connect us to eachother in our worldview and moral standards? Not at all. You're as much atheist as I am.. We both don't believe in THOUSANDS of gods..It's just that I believe in ONE less.
Again, you miss my point completely. You seem to think I am against Atheism. I am not. I'm pro-Atheism.
You're getting your panties in a bunch and making points I'm already quite aware of, all because I think Hitchens is a self-righteous dickwad.
You aren't satisfied with me sharing the general mindset but being against Hitchens' attitude; you think I have to worship him as you do, otherwise I 'don't know what I'm talking about'. How cynical is that?
Hitchens IS a narcissist. He is delightfully, wickedly clear on how highly he thinks of himself. Some of his best lines are about how arrogant he considers himself to be. It's one of the things that makes him so damn interesting...he's brilliant and brutal. I agree with you that most atheists are not - it takes great humility to say that mankind should make no claim to know all of the answers of our existence.
This is all I am saying. In my opinion, many Atheists are arrogant, but so are many Christians. Hitchens just happens to be one of the Atheists who is indeed arrogant.
How is this opinion in any way SUPPORTING the Christians' case? I swear, either I agree with everything ol' Chris says, or people call me out as not knowing what I'm talking about. Whatever happened to individualism?
Anyway, I just wanted to thank you for actually having sense. :)
Yeah... right. And your hypothesis is? Your proof to back up this biased sentence? Your argument for correlation of nonbelief (which does not tell anything about someone's moral standard) and narcissism?
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Ooh, getting feisty, are we?
It always amuses me when 'intelligent' individuals like yourself never seem to understand that what other people say are 'opinions'. Nothing more, nothing less.
bosnia91 wasn't offended by what I said, because he recognized that I stated my opinion, and not a fact. I've already clarified that not all Atheists are arrogant, but (in my opinion) most are. So you best cover your mouth the next time you sneeze out pointless dribble of this sort.
Feisty? I think you are the one that is 'sneezing out pointless dribble', and I am pointing that out. It's one thing to give your opinion, but your opinion apparently is without any foundation. My 'opinion' about your 'opinion' clearly points out that you're talking rubbish. These opinions are not equal, since I indirectly point out the flaw in your thinking. If you are generalising, please do so with some basis and don't flame, while you don't know what you're talking about. That's all.
Atheists arrogant? Most atheists will admit that they DONT know what there is, they just think that there is no reason to believe in God, RELIGIOUS PEOPLE are the ones who are saying that they DO know and not only that but they are challenging years of scientific research on the way. I dont know about you but i would say that religious people are the arrogant ones here.
now i respectfully disagree with your opinion that most atheists are arrogant.. idk how many atheists you have met in your life (not counting public figures) I just think you may have that impression because many of us are quite irritated by the fundamentalists or people who will turn away from facts when we present it to them.. that said.. most of my friends are christian and i have no problem with it. psh my best friend is a hardcore christian =P
I feel like I'm talking to a wall, here. When did I ever say I was a Christian? Furthermore, when did I ever say that I was against Atheism? See, this is what I'm talking about. I express my opinion that Hitchens is an ass, and every Hitchens fan runs through my comments and votes thumbs down without actually reading what I fucking typed.
I just think a lot of Atheists are arrogant; it doesn't mean I'm against their beliefs. Jesus, people are so sensitive.
lmao dude why are you geting so pissed.. i wasnt defending hitchens.. i dont really know him personally so i cant truly make the judgement that he's arrogant... he may be.. anyway i was just dissagreing with your comment that most atheists are arrogant.. i'm just pointing out your wrong on that.. no big deal..
You must not have read the comment war I already had with another 'bright' young lad on the same issues.
If you would read that where I already explain over and over how I know my opinion is simply opinion and that I'm not anti-Atheist or anti-anything related to it directly, you would know why I'm getting so 'pissed', as you put it.
I am simply irritated at people's false assumptions based on youtube comments barely long enough form a complete thought, much less curse a belief system.
I never thought you said anything anti-atheist.. I think you are misinterpreting what i said hah.. you and I just simply see things differently.. you think that everyone worships something.. money.. god.. themselves(atheists) I disagree.. I dont worship myself.. hah I cant even think of one thing i would worship... probably the sun since it gives us so much lmao but other than that idk
My apologies, then. I'm just so used to dickwad Hitchens fanboys attacking me that I assumed you were doing the same. It's difficult to determine a person's meaning sometimes when typing is the only way to communicate.
It's okay. No worries. But I know what you mean,, actually one thing that irritates me is when there is a public figure like Hitchens or Dawkins or Haggard or anyone who represents a person's central beliefs, there are people on youtube who go ahead and agree with EVERYTHING those public figures have to say just because they agree on one thing.. hah I for one disagree with hitchens on A LOT of things.. the only thing we have in common is our lack of faith.
Don't agree with a lot of atheist being arrogant but I do agree on Hitchens. But I think it's more a case of him seeming to be an ass AND an atheist rather than because he is an atheist.
And just to be clear, I am an atheist myself. And regularly considered arrogant, an ass or a bitch and I can assure you...the two are not directly related! ;D
If English was good enough for Jesus, it's good enough for me. Lol.
Kousaburo 1 month ago
That guy is so hot. George, I mean. Yum.
TheCaptaininsaino 1 month ago
omgggg i forgot this guy is GOD!!, whoever the fuck is listening to this guy go ahead, but honestly religion is everyone's own purpose this man has no right to claim things like this, he does not even no what life is, and yet what death even is?, just because the bible stories may not be real, doesnt mean they send morals and messages to understand what life will bring us ahead, im not scared of death and never will be even if god doesnt exist,his cockiness is pathetic and people should wake up
homiev2 1 month ago
this was fucking awesome. televised hitchens, where there arent ignorant assholes jumping in during his points? thanks strombo
virtuosochannel 1 month ago
If Atheists don't need constant reinforcement why go to school? Isn't school generally the reinforcement of ideas with facts and figures? And isn't church very much like school in that we gain deeper insights into what we believe, as anyone would find in school?
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 This is the dumbest argument I’ve heard since a Christian told me: “atheism is offensive because it implies that god is a liar”
Education is the act of learning, not “reinforcing.” The fact that you can’t separate the two says all sorts of things about religion.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 Education might be about learning, but it reinforces, enhances, strengthens, criticizes, weakens, or condemns certain worldviews and ideas.
For instance I accept evolution as fact, but that acceptance may need occasional reinforcing if it is to withstand certain criticisms.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 Science -unlike religion- is always evolving. Education is always being updated. Religion sometimes backpedals, but it does not evolve. Therefor it does nothing but reinforce itself.
Atheist go to school to learn. Theists go to places of worship to reinforce. You're still not understanding the difference.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 Nor do you see the connection. Religion is also evolving as we consider new ways to think about God or the gods. Religion will even update itself according to scientific discovery.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 How so? Religion plays down certain views as morality evolves in an effort to avoid being labeled a hateful organization. That's about it.
When was the last time someone updated the bible?
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 That's not really true. Religion is constantly updating its interpretations of their holy scriptures. At least this is true of Christianity.We update our interpretation of the Bible to fit our culture. I suggest you learn more about religions before you comment further. And stay away from Hitchens if you don't know much about religion as he may be intelligent, but he lacks understanding of Christianity for sure, though from what I know of Islam he understands that slightly better.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@bla87 Think of the Bible like the Constitution: We have to constantly adapt our interpretation of it to new inventions, situations, and environments.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 The constitution was never presented as the divine opinion of god. The fact that the bible is a dated reflection of the time in which it was published should tell you something.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 You're right about the Constitution, but that's inconsequential. The analogy still works. The Constitution was written in a certain time period, and meant to be flexible, as is the Bible. Think Jesus and the law: Jesus brought new understanding to the law. Now certainly we would never allow for certain things to be tossed aside, but we do acknowledge that many if not all of the Bible was written by humans inspired by certain events.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 The bible was meant to be flexible? That's news to me, not to mention your homophobic peers.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 I dunno who you're referencing with the "homophobic peers" bit at the end, but news is easy to come by when you have limited knowledge about an idea, religion, philosophy, or group. I would imagine you're getting alot of newsflashes today.
As I said earlier, many of the writers of the Bible were inspired by certain events, and not the voice of God. They wrote in their own time and reflect the culture they lived in, and they knew this.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 Homophobic peers refers to the sea of Christian activist that oppose gay marriage (duh)
“As I said earlier, many of the writers of the Bible were inspired by certain events, and not the voice of God. They wrote in their own time and reflect the culture they lived in, and they knew this.”
My point is that nowhere in the bible does it say that the book should be questioned or updated, and contrary to your implication I have read the bible.
bla87 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 In fact, that statement of yours only proves my point that religion only survives through backpedaling.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 How so? This is not backpedaling, it is forward thinking. It is not shoring up a wall against criticism, it is allowing for new ideas to take root after thoughtful consideration.
Your point is misguided on the Bible. The Bible suggests that it is useful for instruction and correction, but not to be taken literally in every instance. Do you need to have permission to question?
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 How is it not backpedaling to basically say: "The bible is the word of god- but okay, we admit this is wrong. This other stuff is still right, though"
It's not shoring up a wall against criticism? Then, why is every morality against the bible initially met with claims of going to hell? "The Bible suggests that it is useful for instruction and correction, but not to be taken literally in every instance."
That does not mean that the bible itself can evolve.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 Ok I never said that. And besides the original writers wouldn't have said that either, though they may have said they were doing God's will. On top of that we know more about the cultural context in which the Bible was written, so we can divine it's greater meaning more readily.
You are allowing a group of hard-line Christians to speak for the whole religion. Not every Christian will tell you that a lie earns you an automatic seat in Hell.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 Again, when was it ever updated?
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 I never said that it was updated, only that our interpretations are updated with new knowledge and insights. Again, much like education. Old facts are now repudiated by new facts: i.e. age of the Earth, orbit of the Earth around the Sun, Earth is round. How is it not backpedaling to say that the Earth is the center of the universe (as Aristotle thought) and then have someone condemn that fact with a new one: the Earth orbits around the Sun?
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 Your original point was that atheist might as well not go to school if they don't need reinforcement. I pointed out that education updates itself, and religion just reinforces, commencing a long drawn out back and forth that has finally come full circle.
bla87 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 The bible does not update itself and science does as evident in our current understanding of the earth, the sun etc. All these things are presented as theories (the latest is always accepted but never set in stone), and not the opinion of god.
You're basically proving my point that it was silly to say that atheist might as well not go to school.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 I don't think you understand me at all- my points or my beliefs, I'm sorry to say.
You are talking about a book that was finally completed about 1700 years ago. Such a book, you would be right to say could not rewrite itself. However, you fail to see that Biblical study does update. Science does not update itself. Science is evident, as we cannot change the way our world, and more largely, our universe work. Our understanding of how the world and universe work does change.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@bla87 You don't understand that religion is ever changing, as is our understanding of the universe. You predicate all your arguments on the idea that the Bible doesn't change. As I said below a book could not update itself, but our understanding can. Just any field of study.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 I understand your points- I'm sorry to say I disagree with them.
All books are up for interpretation. That doesn't mean literary changes into something else just as religion doesn't change. Society changes around these entities, but what is written in the bible remains concrete.
Again, just admit your argument that atheist might as well not go to school was remarkably stupid so I can go to bed.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 *Note: Literature, not literary
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 You're free to go to bed whenever you want. I'm not suggesting making any changes to the Bible itself, just the interpretation of it. You're just re-iterating what I'm saying, which is why I find it hard for you to disagree with me.
I never said Atheists shouldn't go to school. I do apologize for you taking it that way.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 No, you didn't literally say that. But, your world view is apparently not meant to be literal so how is one suppose to see the difference?
Information doesn't change religion. Morality evolves against it, and they adjust. That's completely different from the way science evolves. That's the difference I'm trying to establish.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 You're being judgmental, and I'll thank you to refrain from that.
Information does indeed change religion. You are talking to a religious person, and acting arrogant and ignorant; not a good combination by the way. You are supposing to tell me how my beliefs work, and how they change. This is becoming redundant. When Bible scholars interpret the Bible they look at the best possible manuscripts. Sometimes new ones are found which are better than the old. Therefore new insights.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
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@speeddemon990084 If you're going to debate someone you should develop some thicker skin. Disagreeing with someone does not involve judgement. I have not presented any false information. So, you're basically calling me ignorant because my views defer from yours. And I'm the judgmental one?
"Besides religion will also change its interpretation of the Bible because of new scientific discoveries, for instance the age of the earth vs Genesis 1."
Again, backpedaling.
bla87 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 I'm expressing my believes on the matter. That does not infringe on yours. I'm "acting arrogant", but you're the one that is responding to my opinions like they're a harsh examination of your inner workings.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 Well when you say that my comment was the dumbest argument you'd ever heard apart from one, and that I had to admit that what I said was stupid that is a harsh criticism. Also when you say that I am not inclined to take things literally that is making an assumption on my character which you do not know.
I am not trying to respond in an arrogant fashion, though I do trust myself to know what I believe and why I believe it. I don't mind that we disagree.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 Okay, that first comment was harsh, but you have to admit IT WAS a stupid statement. Everything you to come out of your mouth since has been practical and intelligent (aside from saying that I was trying to tell you what you believe, but I think that was just a pissed off response) The second one is a joke that is obviously not meant to be hurtful.
bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 Besides religion will also change its interpretation of the Bible because of new scientific discoveries, for instance the age of the earth vs Genesis 1.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
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bla87 1 month ago
@bla87 Again any field of study will change it's interpretation based on new information.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 So.. let me understand this. You're now trying to say that education is the religion of the atheist??
Education is about teaching the unknowing things we know. Like, physics, mathematics. We live in a specialised society and these basic principles are important to understand before real, hard skills can be taught.
Religion, I'm sorry, is just about escaping death. There is no comparison.
dmmchn 1 month ago
@dmmchn Not entirely, no. I continue to be educated as a college student. Education is necessary for anyone of any belief. But what I am saying is that education provides knowledge about concrete ideas as well as abstract ones depending on the field of study, church does very much the same.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 Well from what I can gather from your other posts your point of view is as follows
- Science is reasonable, rational thinking valid
- However you still fear death to the point that you try to rationalise the beliefs of a time pre-science.
Religion isn't really a very abstract idea, especially christianity - it's only abstract in its interpretation, not its absolute message. Church simply teaches people "this is how to interpret, in order to be rewarded"
dmmchn 1 month ago
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I know he's dead now but I want to thank Mr Hitchens for everything he did to advance rationality against superstitious/religious ignorance.
Mattyb88ful 1 month ago
I like this interviewer he seems like a genuine guy.
dilwich123 2 months ago
George Stroumboulopoulos is so cool, and soooo much younger than me! I'm glad he's around and on TV
Damnblastify 2 months ago
gather every sunday to clap n shout ha ha , its babyish , nicely put chris
loly1969 2 months ago
gather everysunday to clap n shout ha ha ,
loly1969 2 months ago
"we dont need this constant reinforcement, it's babyish" well said
UjioSatashi 3 months ago 3
Not every religious person wants to blow himself up and kill as many people as he can just because of some supposed divine revelation. Hitchens shouldn't assume that the religious will kill us all in so called Holy Wars or Crusades.
speeddemon990084 4 months ago
@speeddemon990084 The more the evidence mounts up against religion, the more marginalised and frustrated religious people will feel...
dmmchn 2 months ago in playlist More videos from 32bitwonder
@dmmchn There's not really any evidence against religion. Science can neither confirm nor refute the existence of God or gods. I don't feel marginalised either, but at times I feel that religions are misunderstood by their critics.
speeddemon990084 1 month ago
@speeddemon990084 Yes, that's true, and I agree- the only really rational position is agnosticism from either side. But what I mean is - theres evidence that contradicts the teachings of religions.
I'm mainly talking about hardline fundamentalists, and they are very vocal about it, and I think Hitchens is too. Science is hard. Understanding it is hard.
"Kill people because they are heathens" is easy, life affirming and personally meaningful.
dmmchn 1 month ago
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TheServiceWeb 5 months ago
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A question for atheists. In a world where there's no proof of God's existence or of life after death; how will you explain to your children why you brought them into the world and why they should die?
QuestionForAtheists 6 months ago
I love how he made the point that God and Jesus only made themselves known to humanity at that specific time after the Greeks, Romans, Persians, Egyptians and so many cultures before, in that specific part of the world. Why not everywhere at the same time since he's God he could do that. And safe all the bloodshed and hatred during the Crusades and all the missionary times.
stoicfan 8 months ago 12
science can only go so far... and then theres God
homiev2 1 month ago
'Just because I agree with someone's philosophy, doesn't mean I need to congregate with him every Sunday and sing and dance and clap and shout.'
I lol'd
jastheace06 9 months ago
Was nice to see someone interview him unbiased, without trying to debate him with ignorant, premedieval ramblings for a change.
MrAnalChrist 9 months ago 2
@MrAnalChrist yeah, stroumbopolous rules.
taffysaur 9 months ago
Being the devout and true blue athiest I am death is extra hard. Once you become a "real" athiest. The type of athiest that became an athiest out of education and knowledge not out of a rebellion. You can never go back to religion even if you really wanted to. This makes me understand why religion doesn't die off. Death is hard and it's easy to not educate yourself. That is why. It;s comfort that reality doesn't offer.
ProRanting 1 year ago
@ProRanting Death is only hard to the young my friend. Spend time with lots of people of a very advanced age and death stops being a gruesome or scary thing, just a way to rest. Frankly the idea of immortality scares me more then death, It'll be just like how you were before you were born.
TheAcad3mic 11 months ago
@TheAcad3mic I wish I could think like that, but I just can't. I savior my life and all of my beloved who live it with me. I've already faced a few major deaths in my time and mourn those loved ones no less then I did they day they were pronounced dead. I think we just have different mind sets. Mine is cowardly, but atleast I admit it. Severe memory loss runs through my family and the idea of forgetting my life is horrifying. Furthermore, I don't want to be Un-born. I want to live. Capital L. L!
ProRanting 11 months ago
@ProRanting I have to agree with you on one point, I'd much rather die in my sleep at the end of a full life with fantastic memories then forget them... Getting Alzheimers(sp?) or advanced dementia is genuinely one of my greatest fears. That disease is so cruel, and if you've seen anything like what I've seen in your family then you have my deepest sympathies. I think compared to that fate dying is easy. You're not who you were either way and your family don't have to face it in the same way...
TheAcad3mic 11 months ago
I hope Hitch gets well. We need his voice of reason and intelligent debates.
1atheist2 1 year ago 8
"We are young people in the geological sense."---Georgie
That would be in the "evolutionary" sense.
LordChimpKing 1 year ago
@LordChimpKing I think he was probably thinking more about the age of the earth
000snow000 10 months ago
Did Hitchens say "Sonny and Cher muslims"?
bleuscorpio 1 year ago
@bleuscorpio Sunni and Shia
detahdomo 1 year ago
No, it is the fear of death that is at the root of religions. That, and the crummy lives the vast majority of people lead on earth.
surfric 1 year ago 3
Fear of death is at the core of it all as Hitch says. That's it.
surfric 1 year ago
@surfric
Explain? I see nothing of that at all, in fact he seems rather fearless.
dummbatz48 1 year ago
this same guy tried to debate dawknis when he went to his show and now hes taking it easy with hitchens so i guess he learn not fuck with ppl like them
sl3ya44 1 year ago
@sl3ya44 He doesn't debate, he interviews, and that often requires proposing an opposing point of view to prompt conversation. George strikes me as a very intelligent and mature host.
BulletMagnetOWI 1 year ago
@BulletMagnetOWI Glad someone said it. :)
xSolraccarloSx 1 year ago
@sl3ya44 George (the interviewer) never debated Dawkins, you have the wrong guy.
wownov83 11 months ago
god is not great but Hitchens certainly is. What's with the stupid 2 comments before mine? Religion is the great deflector of logic, truth, inquiry, and free thought. Magic and superstition are useless and dangerous in an age of very possible self-destruction and annihilation. Religious nutjobs really must wake up.
mtnbiker1974 1 year ago
i want to make an experiment.. indoctrinate children into a totally falsible ideology and see if in the future they become fundamentalist arrogants because of it
MattyJoels 1 year ago
@MattyJoels
"i want to make an experiment..."
Hey, I've got another idea! Let's indoctrinate kids with the idea that their ancestors ass-fucked each other in trees, defecated on each others heads and food and killed each other for food and for the right to bang all the females and probably a few of the younger males.
Then, introduce them to Jack Daniels and Scotch and see if they don't turn into arrogant, self-important publicity hounds, spoiling for a fight...
What you think?
SKS4000 1 year ago
@SKS4000 Sorry, the ass fucking is usually the domain of the Church leadership.
xxDrudgeryReportxx 1 year ago
george stromsdafhu84ur84th[ew9ajioji is a pretty good interviewer i think
brenonion 1 year ago
and ill recommend especially two books by Blavatsky:
"Isis unveiled" and "The Secret Doctrine"
these two and "Secret teachings of all ages" will blow you away if your ears can hear and eyes can see, :P
savednorwegian 1 year ago
hmm hitchen is right in many cases but then he says we are poorly evolved and that prehistoric humans lived only for 20 years, is there any evidence for this??
I agree that most of us dont know how to take care and eat right, but still
I have been in and was a fundamentalistic christian and now know that creationism is bullcrap, and the "god" I believed in is not great. but I would like to challenge all "ateists" and other to read this book :
"Secret teachings of all ages" by Manly P. Hall
savednorwegian 1 year ago
@savednorwegian The evidence for the lifespan of early humans is in the fossil record. There's plenty of books on the subject of human evolution that include information on this. I'd recomment Why Evolution is True by Jerry A Coyne.
ormysceptic 1 year ago
@ormysceptic ok ill check it out, lots of books on my hands to read now, but i have put it on my list now :)
savednorwegian 1 year ago
@savednorwegian Okay. I've looked at "Secret teachings of all ages" by Manly P. Hall and, while I'm not pretending to have read it all, it looks like it's full of hearsay and conspiracy theories? I'll keep reading and see if I can learn anything from it though.
ormysceptic 1 year ago
@ormysceptic well im about to start reading it-but a good friend of mine has read it and told me about it, so much have been hidden from us by religion and socalled "men of god"-little g intended. but of course ill have to read it myself to come to a better conclusion. good for you! the stupidiest thin one can do is to not be skeptical and think about things for yourself, ill say "the only thing i know for sure; is that i might be wrong"-since i have been wrong so many times-but ive learned much
savednorwegian 1 year ago
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God does exist !!!
1. Living God-bread of life like Jesus promised in Bible
Eucharistic miracles of Naju !
2. Manopello veil of Veronica and Jesus face exact like on shroud of Turin(no comparing to some fictional models)
3.Eucharistic Miracle Lanciano, Italy 8th Century A.D. till now alive, real blood AB!
4. Uncorrupted bodies of catholics saints
5.Calanda, Spain in 1640, a young farmer’s leg was restored to him after having been amputated two and a half years earlier
JezusSlave 1 year ago
basically you have to gamble on one ideology,if your wrong your gonna go to hell.
what should we believe in? We know probably that jesus,mohammed existed..
but the funny thing is hinduism is the oldest religion by far..people don't seem to add that in..odd actually..so if man made god before jesus,mohammed,why should it be any different with jesus and mohammed? cuz we want it to to be different? does that make it more true.....=p?
SvendsenAtheist 1 year ago
Christian's do take the bible literally, when it suits their purpose, and gives them what they need to opress those they see as enemies.
RobNLynchburgVA 1 year ago 21
@RobNLynchburgVA well put
SvendsenAtheist 1 year ago
@RobNLynchburgVA Exactly
stoicfan 1 month ago
The host seemed pretty anti-hitchens in the beginning, but it turned out to be a pretty decent interview.
Thanks for the upload.:)
Anonsnet 1 year ago
Is George Stroumboulopoulos a christian??
Jammed9000 1 year ago
@Jammed9000 Take a look at his name.. He's Jewish
trousersnake7 1 year ago
@trousersnake7
Sounds Greek to me....
Jammed9000 1 year ago
@Jammed9000 Good job sherlock, his dads greek and his mothers Ukranian. I guess its hard to notice sarcasm through text..
trousersnake7 1 year ago
Seriously?? does eh really think the world is going to end at the hands of fanatic power hungry muslims in iran and a few crazed jews? i feel tht is way below his standard of integrity to believe in such nonsense. Or maybe he has some info tht i dont have. If tht is the case i would like to see him present it.
Perinnial2010 1 year ago
@Perinnial2010 I think he is simply stating muslims with WMDs are a huge threat.
jimjamgumbob 1 year ago
@Perinnial2010 What about if you thought about, the fact that George Bush is a "born Again" and he sat right next to the button to nuclear weapons, I find that a little scary.
MasonicEyes 1 year ago
@gersfan109 I am open-minded about the existence of neighbours I have never seen, but I might not worship them, even if I knew them.
What if I meet a goddess I dislike?
I would not be agnostic (relatively to her), but I would be an atheist.
LiberdadeHedonista 1 year ago
Good for you George Stroumboupoulos. The only American presenter who interviews atheists from an unbiased position.
bibhuna 1 year ago 3
@bibhuna Hes not American hes Canadian and this is a Canadian show not an American show.
MrJohnboy1984 1 year ago
@bibhuna
It's actually a canadian show but I do agree with the rest
1mb0123d 1 year ago
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3:13 "We are the only species that knows it's gonna die"
Get your head out of your ass Chris!
I have to say I strongly disagree with that statement.
sfurner 1 year ago
@sfurner
Would you mind naming another that does?
Evalesco1 1 year ago
Comparing modern-day Christianity and Islamic fundamentalism is quite a stretch, even for Hitchens. And good Christian scholars do go to the Greek and Hebrew texts for authority, not the English or even Latin for the most part (I wouldn't call Ann Richards a theologian). Also, Hitchens aversion to "evangelism" doesn't make sense to me if he actually understands people. If someone actually believes in his religion, he would be a fool to keep his ideas to himself completely.
technicolorink 1 year ago
@technicolorink he would also be a fool to believe in the first place though. Regardless of whether he keeps his fairytales to himself or not.
krakkajackson 1 year ago
Atheist is about believe in a god, agnostic is about knowing a god. I am an agnostic-atheist, because I don't know if there is a god (I can prove a negative) but I don't believe in the existence of a superior power. I'm open minded to the possibility of god; but it must be enough proof to demostrate it. I hope that clarify a little.
Chavadorf18 1 year ago
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@ AnonymousWhitePerson: "You obsequious Sycophant."
Words are for conveying meaning, not concealing it. Communicate clearly when you have something to say. I could have phrased this as "Sesquipedalians preclude perspicaciousness" if I wanted to be a windy bastard, but I'm trying to make an actual point here.
By the way, obsequious and sycophantic both mean servile. Good writing isn't redundant.
FuzzyWhisper 1 year ago
Christians worship the Sun on Sunday and celebrate the resurrection of the Sun (Sunrise) on Easter Sunday.
AnonymousWhitePerson 1 year ago
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Hitchens masks his lack of spetial knowledge in flowery epithets.
AnonymousWhitePerson 1 year ago
I still can't see how people try to deny evolution or the big bang when there is so much evidence. People don't deny the theory of an asteroid killing the dinosaurs. Why? because it doesn't challenge the words in whatever their religious text may be.
ShredTheGnar690 1 year ago 6
Babyish does just about sums it all up!!
galdation 1 year ago 3
1:44 = lol
Phockiu 1 year ago
''Babyish''. That just about sums it all up!
GoldenRatio 1 year ago
true, i cant say for certain there is not a macdonalds fast food outlet on the planet mars. dont waste your time with know or not know, use probability instead. it destroys religion.
mratheist1 2 years ago 5
The strongest reason why people believe in this nonsense is because they are brainwashed from a very young age with fairy tales of delusion and fantasy about something somebody said somebody told them happened 4,000 years ago...it boggles my mind how anyone can believe n such things as a invisible gods following them around and helping them out on a day to day basis. It is toxic to the human spirit to have such false ideas.
JimmysCrackhorn 2 years ago 108
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@JimmysCrackhorn
Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life.
DoNotBeHighandMighty 1 year ago
Run for president Mr. Hitchens, and I will vote for you.
Snakkpack 2 years ago 5
Hitchens won't run, not without a rewriting of Article 2 of the Constitution....
Innuendo91 2 years ago
You obsequious Sycophant.
AnonymousWhitePerson 1 year ago
I love your sentiment, but unfortunately it can be PROVEN that Hitchens was born in England. If you can't prove one way or the other where you were born, then apparently you are still eligible
jdas22 1 year ago
That's what I like about him too Jones. George can interview anyone and he seems down to earth and non-judgemental. And to be a good talk show host you have to be able to not judge and ask the tough questions.
RealTime88 2 years ago
Why is everyone trying to classify different kinds of atheism. It annoys me, for example the name "New Atheism", it sounds like a religion. I don't call myself an atheist, if someone asks me to define myself in terms of my religious beliefs, I will just say "none". It's as easy as that.
HANK0000 2 years ago 3
@HANK0000 I don't quite understand it either. I think people are so used to labelling people as Protestants, Catholics, Shi'ites, Sunni, etc. that they cannot for a second consider the fact that there are people who do not fall under the umbrella of religion at all.
I always say 'none' or that 'I haven't any religion', rather than say I'm an atheist. It just seems unnecessary to me to label one's self an atheist.
ericxpenner 2 years ago 3
Very good point "ericxpenner", I feel the same way, have so for a long time..
joikee 2 years ago
@ericxpenner There may even be a time where it is actively dangerous to label oneself or be labeled as such.
michaelholloway8 2 years ago 2
he in fact calls him self an ante theist ,he says that it is more then atheism , its the repulsion of any sort of maniacal jealous genocidal infanticide homicidal entity , and i agree .
adlerbr12 2 years ago 2
You say humans are the only ones that know they are going to die. How do you know this? when Elephants go to their own burial ground to die.
josiejump64 2 years ago
This guy? Do you mean the interviewer or Hitchens lmao.
Because if you mean Hitchens, he's more than well-spoken.
He's one of the World's foremost intellectuals.
EminemBase 2 years ago
i thought Jesus was nothing more than a very lame carpenter.
LOL
sydneygayboi 2 years ago
the host needs a fake name
DannyEmbry 2 years ago
this guy seems pretty well-spoken.
rajasmasala 2 years ago 2
Religion itself isn't entirely bad, as Hitchens even says himself it does have some great aspirations and some good morals, however the negative aspects of religion (ie: the dogmatic sense that this is the only 'correct' religion) is as Hitchens said a tainted core that pollutes every thread radiating outward from it. I liken it to star not much different to our own, only that it has higher radiation levels and therefore makes civilized life unbearably difficult and in many cases impossible
maddcatone 2 years ago
Religious people are religious because when they realize that they are going to eventually die, they start going through the 5 stages of grief. When the get to the 3rd stage of 'Barganing', a religion offers them a solution and they are stuck at that stage.
I feel, that as an atheist that was raised christian and went through the typically stages to become atheist, I also had to go through the 5 stages of dealing with grief in respect to my own inevitable death.
scatlett 2 years ago 2
What a freaking legend.
ArchhereticK 2 years ago 5
seeing lots of talk about his personality and not much about the substance of what he's saying.
BillKiernan 2 years ago
Well then, here's your chance to be the first!
reddragonready 2 years ago
It's also good to see an american presenter reason objectively with his guest, rather than allow his personal feelings to obscure his ability to do so, likethat mega cock, wanker, complete fuckhead of the universe, o reilly. I hate that man
nigispangy 2 years ago
I'm with you on that
cthulhu12345 2 years ago
The reason this American presenter acts rationally and objectively is because he is Canadian...on a Canadian show.
macaines71 2 years ago 4
ahh ok, sorry about that - the difference in accent is too subtle
nigispangy 2 years ago
Hitchens is amazing
nigispangy 2 years ago 2
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Thank you for posting this video. I have watched a video that presented a very good point for this video. It is called What is Spiritual Practice? POWERFUL and THOUGHT-PROVOKING by Tsemtulku
MoiraKelly1 2 years ago
watch hitchens debates, he kills everyone. Hes smart, eduacted and well researched. this guy nows what hes talking about and hes not jabbering on, george should let him finish his point!
hailfire87 2 years ago 3
Yup, he's not just educated, but he's 'eduacted' ! Cool word, bro!
P0mt3 2 years ago
I think that Christopher Hitchens should let the speak also it's very ugly the way he keeps jabbing on.
bosnia91 2 years ago
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He's a narcissist. Most Athiests are. It's just how he is.
P0mt3 2 years ago
i wouldn't go that far to call him narcissist. And what do you mean most atheists are? If something, most religios people are and not the other way around. Jesus Christ must have been one of the biggest narcissists in the history (if that one we know about ever lived). That's what makes a religion, someone proclaming his self to be close to god or be a god himself.
bosnia91 2 years ago 3
I take it you are in fact an Atheist, then? Wasn't trying to offend.
Personally, I believe everybody worships something, whether it's money, a deity of some sort, or in the Athiest's case, themselves.
Most religious folks are just idiots. Narcissism requires one to constantly draw attention to themselves, where as the Christian belief is more about drawing attention to God (in whatever form that particular church sees Him).
P0mt3 2 years ago
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Athiests on the other hand are constantly reminding everybody of how ignorant the masses are, and how much more intelligent they themselves are simply because they refuse to believe in a God.
I'm not saying all Athiests are full of themselves, but just like being Christian typically includes being a complete douchebag who doesn't even know his own religion well enough to confidently debate, so too does the snobbish attitude come with the Athiest package.
P0mt3 2 years ago
yes i am and no i wasn't offended. And i don't really agree that everyone worships something in the same sense as people worship a God. you can't really worship money because you don't really think that it's a diety of some kind, you just love it because it gives you stuff you like.
And the prophets DID draw attentions to them selves. In the time when Jesus is supossed to have lived, There where an infation of prophets and gods. It's all about drawing attention to yourself.
bosnia91 2 years ago
Do you even 'get' what atheism states about a person? Really, I think you don't even know what you are talking about. The only thing that connects atheists together is a nonbelief in a theistic god or gods. Nothing more, nothing less. I presume we are both against racism. We are both 'a-racists', but does this connect us to eachother in our worldview and moral standards? Not at all. You're as much atheist as I am.. We both don't believe in THOUSANDS of gods..It's just that I believe in ONE less.
JumpDeluxe 2 years ago
Again, you miss my point completely. You seem to think I am against Atheism. I am not. I'm pro-Atheism.
You're getting your panties in a bunch and making points I'm already quite aware of, all because I think Hitchens is a self-righteous dickwad.
You aren't satisfied with me sharing the general mindset but being against Hitchens' attitude; you think I have to worship him as you do, otherwise I 'don't know what I'm talking about'. How cynical is that?
P0mt3 2 years ago
Hitchens IS a narcissist. He is delightfully, wickedly clear on how highly he thinks of himself. Some of his best lines are about how arrogant he considers himself to be. It's one of the things that makes him so damn interesting...he's brilliant and brutal. I agree with you that most atheists are not - it takes great humility to say that mankind should make no claim to know all of the answers of our existence.
paperstreetfilms 2 years ago
Finally, someone intelligent to talk to!
This is all I am saying. In my opinion, many Atheists are arrogant, but so are many Christians. Hitchens just happens to be one of the Atheists who is indeed arrogant.
How is this opinion in any way SUPPORTING the Christians' case? I swear, either I agree with everything ol' Chris says, or people call me out as not knowing what I'm talking about. Whatever happened to individualism?
Anyway, I just wanted to thank you for actually having sense. :)
P0mt3 2 years ago
Yeah... right. And your hypothesis is? Your proof to back up this biased sentence? Your argument for correlation of nonbelief (which does not tell anything about someone's moral standard) and narcissism?
JumpDeluxe 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Ooh, getting feisty, are we?
It always amuses me when 'intelligent' individuals like yourself never seem to understand that what other people say are 'opinions'. Nothing more, nothing less.
bosnia91 wasn't offended by what I said, because he recognized that I stated my opinion, and not a fact. I've already clarified that not all Atheists are arrogant, but (in my opinion) most are. So you best cover your mouth the next time you sneeze out pointless dribble of this sort.
Fucking narcissist. :p
P0mt3 2 years ago
Feisty? I think you are the one that is 'sneezing out pointless dribble', and I am pointing that out. It's one thing to give your opinion, but your opinion apparently is without any foundation. My 'opinion' about your 'opinion' clearly points out that you're talking rubbish. These opinions are not equal, since I indirectly point out the flaw in your thinking. If you are generalising, please do so with some basis and don't flame, while you don't know what you're talking about. That's all.
JumpDeluxe 2 years ago
Atheists arrogant? Most atheists will admit that they DONT know what there is, they just think that there is no reason to believe in God, RELIGIOUS PEOPLE are the ones who are saying that they DO know and not only that but they are challenging years of scientific research on the way. I dont know about you but i would say that religious people are the arrogant ones here.
metaitachi 2 years ago
Arrogance is an attitude, not a mindset.
P0mt3 2 years ago
now i respectfully disagree with your opinion that most atheists are arrogant.. idk how many atheists you have met in your life (not counting public figures) I just think you may have that impression because many of us are quite irritated by the fundamentalists or people who will turn away from facts when we present it to them.. that said.. most of my friends are christian and i have no problem with it. psh my best friend is a hardcore christian =P
JoseEatsAirplane 2 years ago
I feel like I'm talking to a wall, here. When did I ever say I was a Christian? Furthermore, when did I ever say that I was against Atheism? See, this is what I'm talking about. I express my opinion that Hitchens is an ass, and every Hitchens fan runs through my comments and votes thumbs down without actually reading what I fucking typed.
I just think a lot of Atheists are arrogant; it doesn't mean I'm against their beliefs. Jesus, people are so sensitive.
P0mt3 2 years ago
lmao dude why are you geting so pissed.. i wasnt defending hitchens.. i dont really know him personally so i cant truly make the judgement that he's arrogant... he may be.. anyway i was just dissagreing with your comment that most atheists are arrogant.. i'm just pointing out your wrong on that.. no big deal..
JoseEatsAirplane 2 years ago
You must not have read the comment war I already had with another 'bright' young lad on the same issues.
If you would read that where I already explain over and over how I know my opinion is simply opinion and that I'm not anti-Atheist or anti-anything related to it directly, you would know why I'm getting so 'pissed', as you put it.
I am simply irritated at people's false assumptions based on youtube comments barely long enough form a complete thought, much less curse a belief system.
P0mt3 2 years ago
I never thought you said anything anti-atheist.. I think you are misinterpreting what i said hah.. you and I just simply see things differently.. you think that everyone worships something.. money.. god.. themselves(atheists) I disagree.. I dont worship myself.. hah I cant even think of one thing i would worship... probably the sun since it gives us so much lmao but other than that idk
JoseEatsAirplane 2 years ago
My apologies, then. I'm just so used to dickwad Hitchens fanboys attacking me that I assumed you were doing the same. It's difficult to determine a person's meaning sometimes when typing is the only way to communicate.
Again, sorry.
P0mt3 2 years ago
It's okay. No worries. But I know what you mean,, actually one thing that irritates me is when there is a public figure like Hitchens or Dawkins or Haggard or anyone who represents a person's central beliefs, there are people on youtube who go ahead and agree with EVERYTHING those public figures have to say just because they agree on one thing.. hah I for one disagree with hitchens on A LOT of things.. the only thing we have in common is our lack of faith.
JoseEatsAirplane 2 years ago
Don't agree with a lot of atheist being arrogant but I do agree on Hitchens. But I think it's more a case of him seeming to be an ass AND an atheist rather than because he is an atheist.
reddragonready 2 years ago
I think you are right. Again, my assumption was not at ALL Atheist, but I think it's quit obvious that Hitchens is in fact quite arrogant.
Glad you understand, though. I wasn't trying to offend.
P0mt3 2 years ago
And just to be clear, I am an atheist myself. And regularly considered arrogant, an ass or a bitch and I can assure you...the two are not directly related! ;D
reddragonready 2 years ago