Traditional Tae Kwon Do (Ohdowkan) - Kwang Gae

[Valosken]

Is it me, or does this resemble karate A LOT? xD

[MathewJoki]

@Valosken Tae Kwon Do was strongly influenced by Karate during the Japanese occupation of Korea, when the practioning of traditional Korean martial arts such as Tang Soo Do were outlawed.

[Valosken]

@MathewJoki

Interesting. :D Thanks.

[svlondon]

I dont think he would have ever aproved WTF TKD. But I dont think he pattented for many reasons. But above all reasons he believe taekwondo belonged to the world. I firmly believe this and yes the WTF TKD may not be all correct but we ourselves are with error as well. Master or Student we are still learning and discovering ways to develope our art.

[svlondon]

I believe the General choi would be happy to know that people continue to practice, improve and love Taekwon-do as he did. He would be disappointed in the way the people criticise each other over what is right and wrong. We should be pushing for the development of TKD and ourselves not fighting over who is right and wrong. Think about what you ppl type before doing it your intelegence level might not sink below the idiot level.

[dragonbalzy]

@svlondon No he would not,he called WTF tkd, "sham taekwondo". He was very particular about the way his patterns should be done. I kind of blame him really, perhaps if he had pattented tkd or copyrighted it, then nobody but ITF people would legally be allowed to practise tkd. Shocking oversight, "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, but poor imitations can confuse persons watching and allow the imitator to mistakenly believe he is doing a good imitation" paraphrasing Gen. Choi

[dragonbalzy]

@svlondon No he would be happy if people developed the real teakwondo that he invented, not the "sham " taekwondo, that only has a name in common with the martial art he invented. As he said, the WTF and others stole the name taekwondo. Do not go putting words and sentiments in Gen Choi's mouth, he did NOT approve of sham tkd, and he would not support ppl from non-ITF schoold doing ITF patterns. And doing them quite badly as it turns out.

[Gemmatkd]

@mathewJoki And just incase you decide to go down the road of calling me a hater! I am well aware of where Taekwon-do originated, and have friends who do tkd of various kinds. I've seen your version of Kwang-Gae done by many, just better. I simply suggest working on your sharpness and your side kicks!

[MathewJoki]

@Gemmatkd Thanks, I'll take that into consideration in my future training. Feel free to post a video response demonstrating some examples of correct sharpness and side kicks within this form. I've had plenty of comments on how my for could be better, but oddly enough none of those people commenting have got around to posting response videos so I can learn the "proper technique." Nor do they tend to have ANY taekwondo videos on their channels either. Hmmmm....

[Gemmatkd]

Both your attempts to get some kind of reaction from me have been wasted I'm afraid @MathewJoki.

I am happy with the way my patterns look and feel no need to post anymore vids of myself. May I suggest that if you don't want peoples opinion; don't post your vids! Or at least disable the comments button.

[MathewJoki]

@Gemmatkd Oh, but I enjoy calling out the keyboard warriors far too much to turn off comments! :P I'm glad that you're happy with your patterns and you don't care what other people think about them that you don't want to take the time put them online. I just figured you should know that if you're going to be making comments on others' videos you do end up falling into a pool of people look like they have no idea what they're talking about. No offense, just my humble opinion.

[Gemmatkd]

to me it looked like an ill timed strange dance! I've seen kwang-gaedone very well both with and without sine wave! Lack of sine wave is no excuse for sloppy technique! It just wasn't sharp! I'd be embarassed TBH

[MathewJoki]

@Gemmatkd Well that's the opinion of one more keyboard warrior. You should upload some videos of your own. Or are you concerned you'll embarrass yourself?

[6arcsn1sky]

Though I'm not a taekwondo student, the way you do your shapes appears more like karate in which the art came from. High props for making it appear what it look like before Choi-sabeomnim added the sine wave.

[MathewJoki]

@6arcsn1sky Thanks for the props! Always appreciated, especially with all the haters that are gonna hate. :P

[6arcsn1sky]

@MathewJoki Sure thing since the haters don't know that old styled taekwondo came from karate.

[Frankus08]

simplemente, patetico. sorry

[warrlic2]

Who is your instructor?

[warrlic2]

Those kicks are supposed to be two side kicks one knee hight the other mid section

[RolandStGermain]

With the proliferation of Taekwon-do, it is inevitable that independent schools would open up with different takes on the Hyung. I think it is good to see differences between schools.

[dragonbalzy]

@RolandStGermain It's an ITF pattern, i'm iTF its OUR pattern. We do not do WTF patterns, so we feel free to criticize when people do OUR patterns badly. Taekwondo may have proliferated, ITF tkd has not, the hallmark of ITF tkd is uniformity, we all try to do our patterns according to a uniform doctrine, with varying levels of success. The kwang gae they do goes wrong from the start, the heaven hand is made in a circular motion with the right hand on top. The balance pose is wrong etc.,etc.

[RolandStGermain]

@dragonbalzy It was a pattern before the ITF was founded. Many independent schools in the USA teach the hyungs according to the way that they were instructed. Naturally, there is some variation in the patterns between different schools and organizations. Some instructors may even change some of the forms according to their own understanding of the art. A martial art should never remain in a state of stasis but should change and even as the martial arts have always done. Cheers!

[dragonbalzy]

@RolandStGermain KwangGae was one of the 24 patterns created by Gen Choi, the ITF is Gen Choi's organization, the Chang Hun patterns belong to the ITF and to no other organization. Create your own patterns, with their own practical meaning, then no one else will criticize. We will just admire your great skill.

[RolandStGermain]

@dragonbalzy I think that you need to do some study on the history of Taekwondo. Gen. Choi along with other masters developed the chang hon forms but they did this prior to the creation of the ITF in 1966. The Sine Wave was not added to the forms until sometime in the 1970's. So many independent TKD schools practice the Chang hon forms in a way that predates the "official" standardization.

By the way, which ITF are you talking about because are about four organizations claiming the title?

[MathewJoki]

@RolandStGermain Thanks for the support in the argument. Some zealots can't get it through their heads that the art has evolved in many different ways over the past 40-50 years, and even that there is not one sole governing body of "ITF" which is the "correct form" of which all others at imitating. As you and I have stated previously, there are numerous offshoots of TKD and four even calling themselves ITF. It.s important not to ignore other branches/evolutions of the art but to learn from them.

[warrlic2]

i completly agree with svlondon

[brassbumuk]

very odd almost tae chi

[MrEnorminform]

Guy`s,please train more hard!I don`t want to be someone who post hadercomments...But actually this really looks not even close at the okay-point.For a master you should have the will for selfperfection!And when you show the whole world such a...,sorry,you wont raise a cheer.Man a black belt in Taekwon-Do should be able to Kick easy to the haed of his opponent...For your defens,Kwan Gae is not easy at all...

[warrlic2]

@MrEnorminform kwang gae is easier then most in my opinion beacuse the majority of moves are slowed down

[MrEnorminform]

@warrlic2 maybe they are slowed down,but i think you can´t kick slow...look at your clip,there are only 4 sidekicks an you missed all...technical they are not even close.by a sidekick your knee has to go first up and then comes the reall kick.on this way it is much harder to performe a nice kick,aspecially when you try to kick to the head...forms where infented to train your technic and even bruce lee said:you only should practice with 100% of your power and technical super clean!l

[warrlic2]

@MrEnorminform this is not my video for one i think that this pattern is so unacceptable for black belt standards!!!!!!!!!! and the reason why we slow moves down is for muscle training and to recognize any technical mistakes in or pattern or techniques (which he is showing the lack of)

[MrEnorminform]

Sorry,but you have to train this much more...There are only 4 sidekicks and you didnt manage to do only one correct.Besides,there are no slow movements in the way you performt it.plaese try to do this cleaner!first is technik,second power and last speed...always remember:a black belt should teach you self perfection!

[hosmanc]

Way to make this pattern crappy

[chaoticend27]

Very smooth fellas, how much i miss Karate and my class

[palkumchi]

idk what the hell this is but it looks like crap! sorry guys

[mrrightnow9]

traditional tae kwon do is chan hong. not this. this looks more like karate.

[6arcsn1sky]

@mrrightnow9 Well, duh, that taekwondo came from karate.

[dragonbalzy]

@6arcsn1sky karate and taekkyon

[6arcsn1sky]

@dragonbalzy Again from your masters' foolish claims that taekwondo has taekkyeon which doesn't.

[zambokschwammkopf]

You have changed lots of the movements, for example rear foot stance high knifehand guarding block is not performed in slow motion, the last movement is a punch not a flat fingertip thrust.. No offence intended, but please reference a textbook/website that lists these movements as being correct at the time of publication, would be interesting to read!

Thanks

[svlondon]

The General would have a heart attack if he saw this. I agree not traditional and 2 yellow belts could replace these guys and do a way better job

[MathewJoki]

Research your history.

[asterix187]

@MathewJoki I actually think it may be you that needs to research your history as TKD has never been like this. If you look at the legacy videos for example that were over seen by General Choi (or any other videos to be honest) you will never see Kwang Gae performed in this fashion.

[TKDoX]

@MathewJoki I would kindly ask you to inform us about what history you are referring to. If you want to claim that you are correct, you have to come up with a little bit more evidence than, "Research your history." This form is ok, but it does lack in more than one area.

[MathewJoki]

@TKDoX Gen. Choi's original TKD did not have sign wave, and he did not begin to implement it until the late 70s-80s. What is now commonly understood as TKD has been changed from its original format, a large motivation behind that being nationalization to make TKD look dissimilar to Karate, the martial art of the Japanese who oppressed Korean people for many years. And I will kindly say that I don't wish to argue or debate that, as I've had to defend the fact many times already.

[TKDoX]

@MathewJoki I'm very familiar with the history of the sine wave, more so than you are aware. In fact, I practice a more traditional method which does not implement sine wave. I never gave any indication that it was the lack of sine wave which made this form below par. The fact of the matter is that this performance does not measure up to black belt standards and some of the techniques are simply incorrect. You can attribute all of this criticism to your technique.

[TKDoX]

@MathewJoki I am very familiar with the history of the sine wave motion sir. In fact, I myself practice Tae Kwon Do without the sine wave. Unfortunately, it is not lack of sine wave which makes this a poor interpretation of Kwang-Gae, it is sub-par technique. This is not an example of black belt level skill. Not to mention that some of the movements are incorrect. If this was a fantastic performance by someone's standards, he or she would have already come to your defense.

[MathewJoki]

@TKDoX I look forward to seeing your videos demonstrating "black belt level skill" then so that I can learn from something constructive and not simply from unsubstantiated belittlement.

[TKDoX]

@MathewJoki Something tells me you wouldn't benefit from seeing it. Good luck with your training sir.

[dragonbalzy]

@MathewJoki Whether Gen Choi created sine wave, when he invented tkd, is irrelevant, tkd is still his martial art. Whether you accept that or not , ITF is his organization, kwang gae is his pattern, kwang gae should be done the way he and his organization the ITF says it should be done. I used to be a part of Songham tkd, I don't criticize the way they do their patterns, they do them the way In Hyuk Suh said they should be done, not my business anymore. I only critique the ITF's patterns.

[asterix187]

@svlondon I think that they look like they could be good but they way in which they have been taught to execute the moves is shocking. In general they moves that they do though seem fairly precise. Its just the wrong way.

[MathewJoki]

@asterix187 That's kind of like saying "Monet was right, and Van Goghe was wrong." It's an art after all. Just because your interpretation of the "brushstrokes" is different, it doesn't mean that all others are wrong.

[shaunlouis137]

I agree

[MrAlakfron]

that was truely not traditonal that was truly horrible