Bad is lack of good. Evil is the bad, who lacks the good quality!
At any time, Evil or bad, can decide to be good, through a comprehensive and standard guideline, which is guidelines sent down from Allah (God) via the prophets he selects from amongst the men.
I can say that the last prophet can bring the most complete guideline, because he is the "last" one, I refer to Islam!
I would say that good is positive emotion. no matter what the cause and bad is negative emotion. Surely you have felt happiness without sadness before.
i feel what makes you experience bad is a matter of opinion but the feeling is negative.
No i would say it causes a mix of positive and negative emotion to the people involved. I would say the negative to the people being robbed outweighs the positive from the guy becoming richer. this would mean it is immoral.
Determinism or even near determinism or randomness show we don't have full control over our actions and therefore do not have full responsability of the kind desert based morality requires. This does not automatically prove utalitarianism but it does do away with it's main competators.Punishment and reward for their own sake cannot be justified by utalitarianism, and the instrumental defences are weakening. I was going to make a video like this not sure if it's nescicary now, good work.
Thanks. all i was saying was that happiness and sadness still exists even if we are determined.. so good and bad things can still happen. leads to re-education rather than punisment.
Deternimism isn't the only flaw in a justice based view of morality, of the kind required to justify retributive punishment; it seems absurd that in a world as unavoidably injust as ours we could restore justice in those few crimes we find and can deal with: as most crimes are commited by people in injust social conditions or with an injustly low selection of nature's gifts so punishing them adds to injustice: the notion of desert is undeveloped: and it's difficult to know what effects desert.
And the Finale, Avatar Yen-Chen. "Yes, all life is sacred. Avatar Aang. I know you are a gentle spirit, and the monks have taught you well... but this isn't about you. this is about the world."
Aang: But the monks taught me to detach myself from the world so my spirit can be free!
Yen-Chen: Many great &wise Air nomads have detached themselves and acheived spiritual enlightenment. But the avatar can never do it, because your soul duty is TO the world.
Rejecting or accepting darwin's theory is like rejecting or accepting that the earth is round. It's ridiculous because they're all facts.
Yet people do it anyway.
I dislike this idea because it is opinion of the way people could be. No, you choose your own destiny, make your own mistakes, and build your own honor.
Casual determinism is a theory of how things are, not a theory of how things should be. Even a theory of how things should be, cannot be defended based on our subjective oppinions; some people like utalitatnainism, others dislike the idea, the truth value of the ideas (if an objective truth value exists for them) cannot be determined by our oppinions.
But honestly, do you truly believe that someone else is holding the reins for you? That you're not your own individual but rather being controlled by someone else?
That sounds like 2 things:
1. Religious
2. The Matrix
This stuff isn't a theory in the sense that the theory of evolution is a theory, is it? Where is the scientific evidence anyways?
I accept that, weather or not determinism is a scientific hypothesis depends on how we define determinism; if we define it in terms of moral responsability, then it may not be such an empirical question as if we define it in terms of weather organism's behaviour is ultimately externally caused or fully predictable in principle. I would argue that, while there isn't evidence for determinism, the view that humans are (like most things) ultimately predictable, is simpler than free will.
Humans are predictable? You mean in that we're all greedy for love, food, and money? Or that we have higher reasoning powers than other animals? Or that we simply have the power to choose?
I dunno. Humans are too complex for me. I can't predict what anyone's gonna do.
Well I can't predict what other people can do, but that doesn't make them unpredictable; ancient societies used to think that phenomenon now known to be fully natural were caused by spirits with free will. We may never be able to predict human behaviour perfectly, though all can to some extent.The question is, that if you were sufficiently omniscient to know the exact state of a freeze frame of the universe and all the laws of nature, could you predict human action?
Dr Manhattan can only do those things his genes and uprbinging lead him to do and are therefore not really his own actions, unless his actions are completely random and therefore not really choices. Even Dr Manhatten can't do something completely free, even if he thinks he's completely free.
He might be able to do anything he wants, but what he wants to do isn't ultimately in his control. He can only do what his past has shaped him to desire, and his past is ultimately out of his control.
Human action is unpredictable if someone with Dr Manhatten's knowledge couldn't predict human actions.
If you can say that someone did an action because of something, you're in effect saying that that thing caused their action. That thing may be " because they wanted to" but if you go onto ask "why did they want to" you will eventually come to a cause as external as the tachyons are to dr manhatten. Our actions are ultimarely caused by external factors.
Determinism isn't the idea that we're being controlled by 'someone' else (unless we accept determinism on the grounds that we were created by a god who knew everything that we would do before he created us), it's the idea that our actions are not ultimately controlled by us. I tried for years to think of something fully caused by me that i could do, it's impossible. We may have choice in the proximate sense, but ultimate responsability requires ultimate choice, which we could not have.
it's not selfless but it is impartial; you have to judge yourself, and your intimates, by the same standard you judge anyone else... many take this as a slipery slope to 'utalitarianism leads people to never have close relationships' but I've yet to meet a utalitarian who can't justify personal relationships (or some form of justice, or some form of apreciation of beauty) instrumentally from the principle of utility.
I was mainly just a bit wary of illustrating your views with an example from fiction, I don't really care which is better. I have to agree that the Matrix did fail after the first movie but that's almost a universally accepted truth now :I I've never really studied eastern philosophy, but from what i've seen there's a lot of metaphors and ambiguity we don't see so much in the west. There's a lot of determinism in the east though, more so than in the west (budhism is very deterministic).
You still take all the responsibility for all your actions. You are in charge of your own spiritual enlightenment. You choose whether your path is to be reborn. Nothing can dictate your path.
I'm taking a course on Jainism, which is pretty close to Buddhism.
The Air Nomads in Avatar are so similar to the Buddhists...
Maybe I should watch more Avatar, I should certainly read up more on eastern philosophy and religions. There is a sense in which people can be responsible even if they are determined, but it's only the utalitarian sense; the sense in which someone deserves reward or punishment for what they've done in the past is, because it is (for nonfictional characters) unchangable, ultimate in nature and requires ultimare responsability, of a kind you cannot have without ultimate freedom.
Eastern philosophy is amazingly different from the west. you'd enjoy it. I enjoy studying it.
Don't get surprised by Sallekhana, the mastery of death (AKA the eastern idea of suicide)
Avatar is amazingly done, once again, for a kid show. It's won several Annie awards, which are awards for animation. And this was among several other kinds of animation shows too.
Martial arts is incredibly accurate as well as the philosophies. And i love all the morals that come up in the whole show...beautiful
I recall Avatar winning and being nominated for the Annies last year (it was the only nominee i hadn't watched at the time If i remember), I've only caught the ends of episodes whilst waiting for other shows to start. I should definitly give it more of a try.
Yeah! It's pretty funny too. I mean, i burst out laughing at certain parts of it. There is one pet animal that is there solely to make it more kiddish, but if you ignore him the show's really good.
I think Season 3 is by far the best, but you can't watch that cos' it won't make any sense.
Go try avatar!
ANd i have to find somebody who will teach me Tai Chi, Ba Gwa, Hungar, and Northern Shoalyn...
I totaly agree. I think it could be something to do with the fact that a lot of western philosophy was based on the idea of a diety. eastern was more about enlightenment - happiness.
I don't see you explaining the relationship between determinism and responsibility.
HashKeth 1 year ago
Nice video. You explained your points very well without overcomplicating it.
Ah, v0tebot'd I see.
HonestDiscussioner 2 years ago
Yeah votebots suck. thanks for watching man i appreciate it.
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
You talk about good and bad.
What is bad? isnt it only an opinion?
I answer the above questions this way:
Bad is lack of good. Evil is the bad, who lacks the good quality!
At any time, Evil or bad, can decide to be good, through a comprehensive and standard guideline, which is guidelines sent down from Allah (God) via the prophets he selects from amongst the men.
I can say that the last prophet can bring the most complete guideline, because he is the "last" one, I refer to Islam!
med1367 2 years ago
I would say that good is positive emotion. no matter what the cause and bad is negative emotion. Surely you have felt happiness without sadness before.
i feel what makes you experience bad is a matter of opinion but the feeling is negative.
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
Are you saying robbing others, or kidnapping others is a negative emotion?
med1367 2 years ago
No i would say it causes a mix of positive and negative emotion to the people involved. I would say the negative to the people being robbed outweighs the positive from the guy becoming richer. this would mean it is immoral.
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
Determinism or even near determinism or randomness show we don't have full control over our actions and therefore do not have full responsability of the kind desert based morality requires. This does not automatically prove utalitarianism but it does do away with it's main competators.Punishment and reward for their own sake cannot be justified by utalitarianism, and the instrumental defences are weakening. I was going to make a video like this not sure if it's nescicary now, good work.
unassumption 2 years ago
Thanks. all i was saying was that happiness and sadness still exists even if we are determined.. so good and bad things can still happen. leads to re-education rather than punisment.
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
Deternimism isn't the only flaw in a justice based view of morality, of the kind required to justify retributive punishment; it seems absurd that in a world as unavoidably injust as ours we could restore justice in those few crimes we find and can deal with: as most crimes are commited by people in injust social conditions or with an injustly low selection of nature's gifts so punishing them adds to injustice: the notion of desert is undeveloped: and it's difficult to know what effects desert.
unassumption 2 years ago
Hurm... No. I don't like it. I don't like it at all.
I like the idea of shaping your own destiny.
"You must actively shape your own destiny, and the destiny of the world." Avatar Korok.
"You must be decisive." Avatar Roku.
"Only justice will bring peace." Avatar Kioshi.
EllenRussell54 3 years ago
And the Finale, Avatar Yen-Chen. "Yes, all life is sacred. Avatar Aang. I know you are a gentle spirit, and the monks have taught you well... but this isn't about you. this is about the world."
Aang: But the monks taught me to detach myself from the world so my spirit can be free!
Yen-Chen: Many great &wise Air nomads have detached themselves and acheived spiritual enlightenment. But the avatar can never do it, because your soul duty is TO the world.
EllenRussell54 3 years ago
Here is my wisdom to you: Selfless duty calls you to sacrifice your own spiritual needs, and do whatever it takes to protect the world...
Dunno why i did that. I started quoting, and i had to continue.
Point is, i don't like this determinsm idea.
EllenRussell54 3 years ago
Disliking an idea doesn't make it false. I dislike evolution, that doesn't make the theory false.
unassumption 2 years ago
Heh. Evolution is FACT. This stuff is opinion.
Rejecting or accepting darwin's theory is like rejecting or accepting that the earth is round. It's ridiculous because they're all facts.
Yet people do it anyway.
I dislike this idea because it is opinion of the way people could be. No, you choose your own destiny, make your own mistakes, and build your own honor.
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
Casual determinism is a theory of how things are, not a theory of how things should be. Even a theory of how things should be, cannot be defended based on our subjective oppinions; some people like utalitatnainism, others dislike the idea, the truth value of the ideas (if an objective truth value exists for them) cannot be determined by our oppinions.
unassumption 2 years ago
Yes, true true...
But honestly, do you truly believe that someone else is holding the reins for you? That you're not your own individual but rather being controlled by someone else?
That sounds like 2 things:
1. Religious
2. The Matrix
This stuff isn't a theory in the sense that the theory of evolution is a theory, is it? Where is the scientific evidence anyways?
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
I accept that, weather or not determinism is a scientific hypothesis depends on how we define determinism; if we define it in terms of moral responsability, then it may not be such an empirical question as if we define it in terms of weather organism's behaviour is ultimately externally caused or fully predictable in principle. I would argue that, while there isn't evidence for determinism, the view that humans are (like most things) ultimately predictable, is simpler than free will.
unassumption 2 years ago
Humans are predictable? You mean in that we're all greedy for love, food, and money? Or that we have higher reasoning powers than other animals? Or that we simply have the power to choose?
I dunno. Humans are too complex for me. I can't predict what anyone's gonna do.
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
Well I can't predict what other people can do, but that doesn't make them unpredictable; ancient societies used to think that phenomenon now known to be fully natural were caused by spirits with free will. We may never be able to predict human behaviour perfectly, though all can to some extent.The question is, that if you were sufficiently omniscient to know the exact state of a freeze frame of the universe and all the laws of nature, could you predict human action?
unassumption 2 years ago
Dr. Manhattan can.
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
Dr Manhattan can only do those things his genes and uprbinging lead him to do and are therefore not really his own actions, unless his actions are completely random and therefore not really choices. Even Dr Manhatten can't do something completely free, even if he thinks he's completely free.
unassumption 2 years ago
Dr. M can do anything he wants. If your thinking of times when he can't, it's all because of those damn tachyons.
i wonder if those are even real.
But Dr. M doesn't even see time the same as us. He doesn't see humans the same way as us. He is different, an outsider. Nothing appeals to him.
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
He might be able to do anything he wants, but what he wants to do isn't ultimately in his control. He can only do what his past has shaped him to desire, and his past is ultimately out of his control.
Human action is unpredictable if someone with Dr Manhatten's knowledge couldn't predict human actions.
unassumption 2 years ago
Dr. M couldn't predict what Veidt was doing because of the damn tachyons!
He probably could if he wasn't being interfered with.
(Of course these tachyons are from the giant alien squid thing, not from...whatever the movie was)
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
If you can say that someone did an action because of something, you're in effect saying that that thing caused their action. That thing may be " because they wanted to" but if you go onto ask "why did they want to" you will eventually come to a cause as external as the tachyons are to dr manhatten. Our actions are ultimarely caused by external factors.
unassumption 2 years ago
Determinism isn't the idea that we're being controlled by 'someone' else (unless we accept determinism on the grounds that we were created by a god who knew everything that we would do before he created us), it's the idea that our actions are not ultimately controlled by us. I tried for years to think of something fully caused by me that i could do, it's impossible. We may have choice in the proximate sense, but ultimate responsability requires ultimate choice, which we could not have.
unassumption 2 years ago
Utilitarianism isnt selfless. if you can feel more happiness than 7 other people then it is correct to choose yourself.
Do some reasearch on determinism i cant explane it in one video. but physics isn't random
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
it's not selfless but it is impartial; you have to judge yourself, and your intimates, by the same standard you judge anyone else... many take this as a slipery slope to 'utalitarianism leads people to never have close relationships' but I've yet to meet a utalitarian who can't justify personal relationships (or some form of justice, or some form of apreciation of beauty) instrumentally from the principle of utility.
unassumption 2 years ago
Thanks yea i agree.
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
For every line from a shoddy nick toon, there's a line from the Matrix to counter it :p
unassumption 2 years ago
If you're comparing The Avatar to The Matrix, i'm sorry. The Matrix loses.
The first movie was great, but then they completely bombed.
Avatar started off great and got better. THey did an extraordinary amount of research for something that is only a kid show.
furthermore, the matrix gets its ideas from WESTERN philosophy. Avatar is mainly EASTERN philosophy.
You simply can't compare them. However, storywise, Avatar is much better done.
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
I was mainly just a bit wary of illustrating your views with an example from fiction, I don't really care which is better. I have to agree that the Matrix did fail after the first movie but that's almost a universally accepted truth now :I I've never really studied eastern philosophy, but from what i've seen there's a lot of metaphors and ambiguity we don't see so much in the west. There's a lot of determinism in the east though, more so than in the west (budhism is very deterministic).
unassumption 2 years ago
You still take all the responsibility for all your actions. You are in charge of your own spiritual enlightenment. You choose whether your path is to be reborn. Nothing can dictate your path.
I'm taking a course on Jainism, which is pretty close to Buddhism.
The Air Nomads in Avatar are so similar to the Buddhists...
but the Guru is so similar to the Jains...
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
Maybe I should watch more Avatar, I should certainly read up more on eastern philosophy and religions. There is a sense in which people can be responsible even if they are determined, but it's only the utalitarian sense; the sense in which someone deserves reward or punishment for what they've done in the past is, because it is (for nonfictional characters) unchangable, ultimate in nature and requires ultimare responsability, of a kind you cannot have without ultimate freedom.
unassumption 2 years ago
Eastern philosophy is amazingly different from the west. you'd enjoy it. I enjoy studying it.
Don't get surprised by Sallekhana, the mastery of death (AKA the eastern idea of suicide)
Avatar is amazingly done, once again, for a kid show. It's won several Annie awards, which are awards for animation. And this was among several other kinds of animation shows too.
Martial arts is incredibly accurate as well as the philosophies. And i love all the morals that come up in the whole show...beautiful
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
I recall Avatar winning and being nominated for the Annies last year (it was the only nominee i hadn't watched at the time If i remember), I've only caught the ends of episodes whilst waiting for other shows to start. I should definitly give it more of a try.
unassumption 2 years ago
Yeah! It's pretty funny too. I mean, i burst out laughing at certain parts of it. There is one pet animal that is there solely to make it more kiddish, but if you ignore him the show's really good.
I think Season 3 is by far the best, but you can't watch that cos' it won't make any sense.
Go try avatar!
ANd i have to find somebody who will teach me Tai Chi, Ba Gwa, Hungar, and Northern Shoalyn...
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
I totaly agree. I think it could be something to do with the fact that a lot of western philosophy was based on the idea of a diety. eastern was more about enlightenment - happiness.
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
Yeah.
Can you compare them?
I don't think so. The two are like different worlds.
In one world, mostly the West, Compassion and Mercy erode respect and power.
In the east, Compassion helps cleanse your soul of karma until finally you get to the point where you need to get rid of all karma.
EllenRussell54 2 years ago
You do shape your own destiny. all determinism says is that your personality is determined as well
PaddyCuinne 2 years ago
Indeed!
trick0171 3 years ago