The Doctrine of Sola Fide and James 2:14-26, Pt. 3 - The Case of Abraham

[gateroadmusic]

If Abraham was justified before he was circumcised( Gen.15), then he was justified before he offered up Issac( Gen. 22). Romans 4:9-11 should settle once and for all the issue of when Abraham was justified to anyone who desires to know the truth and simply not cling to a religious dogma." for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. How was it then reckoned?when he was in circumcision or in uncircumcision?Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.

[Papasmurph4]

@gateroadmusic Let me ask you: Do you believe that Gen 15:6 is the ocassion when Abraham first believed God and when God first justified him on account of his faith? I lokk forward to hearing your response.

[gateroadmusic]

@Papasmurph4 All the N.T. writers reference this specific point as the time of Abraham's justification (Ro. 4:3,Gal.3:6, Ja.2:23). Why is it a specific point? It is when the Gospel was preached to him (Gal.3:8 ). The Gospel is about Jesus, the seed (Gal.3:16 ,Gen.15:3-6) The promise ( that Abraham believed ) was that Jesus , the Savior, would come from Issac, his son. Jesus said that " Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad (Jn. 8:56).

[Papasmurph4]

@gateroadmusic @gateroadmusic From your response, you evidently believe that it is possible for a person to have genuine faith in God and still not be justified by that faith? For it is written in Hebrews 11:8 that Abraham had such faith many years before Genesis 15:6. Furthermore, once he arrived in the land of promise, Abraham built altars at every stopping place and called upon the name of the Lord (Genesis 12:7, 8; 13:4, 18).

[Papasmurph4]

Finally, when war broke out and Abraham rescued Lot, Melchizedek says to him, "Blessed be Abram of God Most High" (Genesis 14:18-19). Clearly, Abraham was a true believer long before the account of Genesis 15:6. Yet you believe it wasn't until then that he was justified? This is absurd.

[Papasmurph4]

@gateroadmusic The statement that Abraham's faith "was reckoned to him as righteousness" is made with reference to three very different periods in the patriarch's life. (1) in Genesis 15:6, when told he would have innumerable descendants, "he believed in the Lord; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness." This was the continuation of the faith that Abram had long before demonstrated (see my last two posts).

[Papasmurph4]

(2) Romans 14:19-22 tells us that when he was near 100 he believed God relative to Sarah's having a child, "Therefore, also it was reckoned to him as righteousness." Finally, (3) when Isaac was a "lad" Abraham's faith was tested, and it is said he "... believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness" (James 2:23). The "faith" of Abraham was no miraculous experience. It was a life of humble acceptance and service in keeping with God's revealed will.

[Papasmurph4]

Justification was no single event in time, as you seem to think, but kept pace with Abraham's faith throughout his life.