An important thing to note about that muta battle is not only that Calm failed to micro against the scourge, but also that he tried. So for a moment while Great was attacking, Calm was running and not attacking. His mutas took not only the scourge hits but also a whole volley from Great's mutas before they started counterattacking.
I agree with the sentiments of Eezkhoreoth at least partially. I like Diggity and Klazart better, but Moletrap you're great too. Don't listen to anyone who is hating. These triple commentaries are very interesting as they show different views on it. Thanks for the hard work gentlemen!
I don't think Moletrap's rundown on the format was correct, I think the winning team is the one that wins two out of the three events (Day 1, Day 2, Super Ace)
it's a psych out, he acted like he was going to attack Calm's mineral line with his muta mass. Calm freaked out and sent his mutas far west, much further than they needed to be. You can clearly see that in the beginning of that mutalisk-dogfight, Great's mutas landed a good 1-2 extra hits before Calm's mutalisks started attacking. Those 1-2 extra hits hurt. Lastly, Calm retreated his mutalisks too early, and was harassed while retreating as well.
yea Calm was confident with his preparation for the 'final battle' in his expansion... more mutas... +1 upgrade and he place those overloads to absorb the splash hits... too bad great didn't fall for that good job BRILLIANT
Not to criticize the commentators but I would just like to ask... Why is it more important to kill the "gas" drones as opposed to "mineral" drones?
I know that gas is very crucial in a ZvZ, but what I mean is, can't the defender simply re-assign the dead "gas" drone's workload to a "mineral" drone? If he does that, then it would've been like a "mineral" drone died instead.
Yet still he has to re-assign those drones. And by that, he need to waste a bit of his own time and concentration for just drow re-assigning. Also it's rather hard in middle of a battle, so it will most likely mean, that they will have a bit less gas. Yet still, it's not so much of a difference between mineral and gas drones.
reassigning a drone takes a couple seconds, so you might lose 16 gas or so... every second counts. also, the player might not know how many gas drones have died and assigned to many/to few.
Because spores are very expensive. They cost you a total of 175 minerals and one larva, so for the cost of two spores you could get a hatchery and save one larva in the process
Did July quit or something? I haven't seen any games from him in ages. Maybe he just doesn't fit in these tight STX shirts anymore. He does look like a pimp in that jacket in the end.
Wrong, the score of a matches doesn't matter. It's the match as a whole. So if STX wins 4:0, and loses one match 3:4 there will still be a "super ace-match" as the teams are 1:1 in matches.
easier said than done, especially when you have your Mutas already engaged against the enemy's Mutas! Scourges are easy to dodge(for pros that is) when they're chasing you, not when your Mutas are already engaged.
The difference is Savior is more humble and secondly Savior has a lot more on his mantle to support any cockiness. He has accomplished much more and during his prime was an absolute delight to behold.
When great has a Bonjwa feel to him he can have his name great :P
first off, Savior called himself Savior from the start of his career, so the whole he's-earned-it argument doesn't fly with me. Plus Great is a professional programmer. I'm pretty sure that makes him pretty great in my book, as I'm sure it does among his peer which is probably where he got the name.
Think about it this way, Savior has earned his name through an amazing career. Has great earned his name thus far? Yes Great is a proamer, so are the other how ever many progamers there are currently on the scene.
I would also go as far as to argue Savior would be considered far less self promoting as Great.
Savior isn't humble. he's always saying he's going to start owning people, then he never does it. I agree he has the right to be cocky tho.. but who cares, their names aren't cocky, would u rather they call themselves Suck? they have to pick a name that their fans will support
since when did savior "always say he's going to start owning people, then never do it?" he's not being cocky, he just said "i will destroy everyone in 2009" to generate hype and for fun. not necessarily from his heart or for cockiness.
i disagree, savior isnt necassarily a pretentious name at all. i believe it can mean simply a person who fights against evil, or something similar. also, its a pretty cool word.
i was just wondering about the translation factor, maybe great in south korean has a slightly different meaning, i dont know. i dont feel it to be too pretentious in the first place.
i just dont see the point in reading much into the players names, i dont think about the names bisu or fantasy or jaedong, so im not really going to consider savior or great.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
lol are u stupid of course u see only 4 units in zvz drones zerglings mutas and scourge. it has been like that ever since. since when do u watch starcraft? 1 week?
you dumb shit that is my point exactly. I know i see always the same thing in zvz game and it has been like that ever since, that is what i pointed out. I wana see a diferent tactic in zvz game, thats what im saying. Dont you find that boring after a while, always the same build, same units, same movements. Well i guess thats just fine for brain dead morons like yourself. Have a nice day
Dont you think that gets a little stale after a while? O well, maybe its just me, ill just skip zvz games. But every other race combo is good :) zvp, zvt, pvp...
I feel zvz really doesn't allow for imagination (very similar gameplay game after game), but is very exciting to watch, as well as being a great test of micro skill.
For me, tvt and tvp can both be very stale. Of course, some of them are extremely fun to watch.
have you seen luxury vs yellow? i dont remember it exactly but i believe that had a much larger array of zerg units used, made for a very interesting game.
and yes i definitely think ZvZ gets stale quickly, but the builds theyre using are the most effective, and thats why they use them.
what build would you suggest though? hydras wouldnt be mobile enough against mutas, mass ling would get eaten up by sunkens and mutas. any higher tech would leave you far too weak in early game.
You really think that because you never saw em, proplayers never tried other strategies in ZvZ? They have been trying for years, but guess what even if its the same unit, there are many different strategies that makes it interesting. You are apparently just too much of a noob to see any of that.
if there were more units used or maybe if they went past 2 base EVER it might be fun to watch but just 2 hatch muti scourge micro is rather boring to me
dont get me wrong either i love every other match up save for PvP but at least that can be entertaining because of how many different builds are viable but with ZvZ there are maybe 8 different patterns that it always falls into
i saw a ZvZ the other day actually that i liked one player used defilers and spore colonies it was really good to see
actually Calm didnt really play pathetically. he managed to sneak some lings into Great's base to kill a drone or 2 after Great did some damage to him. he also got the extra hatch and +1 attack for his Mutas. so he did most things right, the only thing is that he probably underestimated Great's Muta numbers and of course Great's Scourges landed perfectly...
What kind of a retarded moron dick sucking shit eating imbecil cals himself Great???
toleshaOG 10 months ago
An important thing to note about that muta battle is not only that Calm failed to micro against the scourge, but also that he tried. So for a moment while Great was attacking, Calm was running and not attacking. His mutas took not only the scourge hits but also a whole volley from Great's mutas before they started counterattacking.
drygel16 2 years ago 2
I'm looking forward to a Great-Jaedong match. But I'm afraid Jaedong will slaughter Great already with zerglings before he even gets Mutas out :-/
WarpBerlin 2 years ago
Khan>>STX
RealmEternal 2 years ago
Thanks for the triple..
And Whaat! how did he do it?!
Without plus one weapons!
DanielOsw 2 years ago
Very exciting ZvZ! I couldn't call it because Great had those Scourge, but Calm had that attack upgrade and what looked like more Mutalisks.
Thanks for casting! :]
z00tGRUNT 2 years ago
Klazart seems to simply tell us whats happening on the screen =(
LeaivaOnline 2 years ago
I agree with the sentiments of Eezkhoreoth at least partially. I like Diggity and Klazart better, but Moletrap you're great too. Don't listen to anyone who is hating. These triple commentaries are very interesting as they show different views on it. Thanks for the hard work gentlemen!
MrAndersonmm 2 years ago 5
moletrap is definitely worst of these 3 IMHO.
I'm usually trying to skip commentaries with his appearance, no offence
Eezkhoreoth 2 years ago
ya!
jellybellies132 2 years ago
moletrap roks
mavinator44 2 years ago 2
Thanks for the triple, enjoyed the whole set.
Arpy808 2 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
moletrap suks
jellybellies132 2 years ago
:) I didn't expect this post to appear! Moletrap, would you erase the above opinion?
pyrotoxic 2 years ago
I think it's something from Metallicas Death Magnetic
Irbubble 2 years ago
I don't think Moletrap's rundown on the format was correct, I think the winning team is the one that wins two out of the three events (Day 1, Day 2, Super Ace)
JodoYodo 2 years ago 5
Bad micro in end battle by loser...That's how he pulled it off.
SadegoGG 2 years ago
Is Great using some sort of new strategy? He's winning in positions he's supposed to lose.
Robotman42 2 years ago
it's a psych out, he acted like he was going to attack Calm's mineral line with his muta mass. Calm freaked out and sent his mutas far west, much further than they needed to be. You can clearly see that in the beginning of that mutalisk-dogfight, Great's mutas landed a good 1-2 extra hits before Calm's mutalisks started attacking. Those 1-2 extra hits hurt. Lastly, Calm retreated his mutalisks too early, and was harassed while retreating as well.
Aixrotciv 2 years ago 2
You mean Great is playing mind games with people and winning the actual game based on mind-games?
Robotman42 2 years ago
Well noticed. The scourge all landing and the 2 volleys fired before Calm attacked back were what swung the battle in my opinion.
SSdraken 2 years ago
lol
HotWolf100 2 years ago
GG
How the hell did he pull that off?! Amazing.
LtMercutio 2 years ago
Anyone else unsatisfied with that ending?
RaisedforM12 2 years ago
yep ^^
Konrad111111 2 years ago
THE ZERG IS OP IN ZERG V ZERG!!!!!
i hope i made someone lol with that comment :P
dwoclan 2 years ago
Yes you did :)
LordEdge19 2 years ago
only because I happen to know that the player named "the zerg" is not, in fact, OP in any match up
bobothegoat 2 years ago
haha good call
decoup22 2 years ago
SPOILERS
yea Calm was confident with his preparation for the 'final battle' in his expansion... more mutas... +1 upgrade and he place those overloads to absorb the splash hits... too bad great didn't fall for that good job BRILLIANT
carmack720 2 years ago
Not to criticize the commentators but I would just like to ask... Why is it more important to kill the "gas" drones as opposed to "mineral" drones?
I know that gas is very crucial in a ZvZ, but what I mean is, can't the defender simply re-assign the dead "gas" drone's workload to a "mineral" drone? If he does that, then it would've been like a "mineral" drone died instead.
FrSIBYLA 2 years ago
Yet still he has to re-assign those drones. And by that, he need to waste a bit of his own time and concentration for just drow re-assigning. Also it's rather hard in middle of a battle, so it will most likely mean, that they will have a bit less gas. Yet still, it's not so much of a difference between mineral and gas drones.
Kacnafein 2 years ago
reassigning a drone takes a couple seconds, so you might lose 16 gas or so... every second counts. also, the player might not know how many gas drones have died and assigned to many/to few.
celewign 2 years ago
yeah! go winning team! i am pleased.
benjaminhooper1987 2 years ago 2
dam GG, Calm needed more info. :(
ReganHuang 2 years ago
Compared to Great, the nick Miracle feels even more pretentious :D
zethgb 2 years ago
nicely done from the winner, really unexpected
sc2gg4ever 2 years ago
Why don't people just build like 2 spore colonies in each base.
mireka 2 years ago
Because spores are very expensive. They cost you a total of 175 minerals and one larva, so for the cost of two spores you could get a hatchery and save one larva in the process
DrunkenJedi4 2 years ago 2
So people stop asking, July isn't playing because was practicing for his GOM match vs. Flash
ndralcasid 2 years ago
What a waste with those result.
megadethqc 2 years ago
SPOILERS
khan is the new oz lol.
great comes from behind in 2 ZvZ AND completely carries his team.
Lassie747 2 years ago
get moletrap to talk less (at the beginning he dint even mention the 2 other commentators), otherwise great commentary...
tgdwarf 2 years ago
Huzzah!!! 4 to 3!
NinjaWolfHybrid 2 years ago
Why did July not play???
Influenza91 2 years ago 3
im just curious, why is it that I havent seen a z v p game yet?
Siscast 2 years ago
Actually, if one team win 4-3 and the other team wins 4-0 they still play the "Super" ace match, shoot off game.
OminouString 2 years ago 3
Those scourge hits really decided the game.
Repression 2 years ago
man, if you have a name like Great, Best, or Miracle, you better be good, lol.
donnk 2 years ago
Comment removed
XxSconeManxX 2 years ago
Am i missing the map pool for the Proleague? I'm pretty sure that I have no freakin clue what maps they use these days.
valnizzas 2 years ago
wtf that game was for july!
Skr0s 2 years ago 3
Pπp! FBH looked so sad at teh end. Jealous?
Sabu113 2 years ago
Did July quit or something? I haven't seen any games from him in ages. Maybe he just doesn't fit in these tight STX shirts anymore. He does look like a pimp in that jacket in the end.
Ardunafeth 2 years ago 2
Lol... Prolly cuz hes gonna own evryone
DaTwilight 2 years ago
STX just doesnt use him that much, i have no idea why
kranima 2 years ago
is july in 14:09?
go3231023 2 years ago
yes he is
Skr0s 2 years ago
I think so, yes. its either July or Dragoon :P i believe its july ;)
Sol9o 2 years ago
i love how julyzerg's face is always like =T
karene27 2 years ago
yea i love how his face is equal sign capital T too.
Pwnsauce93 2 years ago
I am rooting for Samsung, like always. Hell of unsynched bow on their part.
Super ace-match? Ridiculous format!
Nostalgamagic 2 years ago
Wrong, the score of a matches doesn't matter. It's the match as a whole. So if STX wins 4:0, and loses one match 3:4 there will still be a "super ace-match" as the teams are 1:1 in matches.
Doso777 2 years ago
What a waste of +1
RaiKageRyu 2 years ago
not really a waste, just didnt work for him cause he underestimated Great's Muta number...
HeLL12aiseR 2 years ago
Dodge scourge = win :)
larzarus1234 2 years ago
easier said than done, especially when you have your Mutas already engaged against the enemy's Mutas! Scourges are easy to dodge(for pros that is) when they're chasing you, not when your Mutas are already engaged.
HeLL12aiseR 2 years ago
Yeah I know but if he had dodged them he would have won. Thats my message nothing else.
I dont say calm did a poor job you already explained why ;)
larzarus1234 2 years ago
Moletrap, you have the format wrong. If STX wins 4-3, and Khan wins the next series 4-0, it's 1-1 and goes to super ace match.
TealLurker 2 years ago
Should've been a Tossgirl vs. Frozean ace match.
TealLurker 2 years ago
agreed!
java0033 2 years ago
damn calm, calm has been playing so good, but great just had a good game.
WhopperSr 2 years ago
i wanna kiss the coach
lazomaniac 2 years ago 2
ha, Klaz has a problem with the name 'Great' but no 'Savior'??
NaturalTvventy 2 years ago
The difference is Savior is more humble and secondly Savior has a lot more on his mantle to support any cockiness. He has accomplished much more and during his prime was an absolute delight to behold.
When great has a Bonjwa feel to him he can have his name great :P
Mustardjelly001 2 years ago
first off, Savior called himself Savior from the start of his career, so the whole he's-earned-it argument doesn't fly with me. Plus Great is a professional programmer. I'm pretty sure that makes him pretty great in my book, as I'm sure it does among his peer which is probably where he got the name.
NaturalTvventy 2 years ago 4
Think about it this way, Savior has earned his name through an amazing career. Has great earned his name thus far? Yes Great is a proamer, so are the other how ever many progamers there are currently on the scene.
I would also go as far as to argue Savior would be considered far less self promoting as Great.
Mustardjelly001 2 years ago
savior used to go by IPXzerg
thundasc 2 years ago
Savior isn't humble. he's always saying he's going to start owning people, then he never does it. I agree he has the right to be cocky tho.. but who cares, their names aren't cocky, would u rather they call themselves Suck? they have to pick a name that their fans will support
SovietSR71 2 years ago 2
Haha, Suck would be my favorite player for sure. And I'd guess they get these names before they become pros, though I could be wrong about that.
NaturalTvventy 2 years ago 2
since when did savior "always say he's going to start owning people, then never do it?" he's not being cocky, he just said "i will destroy everyone in 2009" to generate hype and for fun. not necessarily from his heart or for cockiness.
Da1337ed 2 years ago
i disagree, savior isnt necassarily a pretentious name at all. i believe it can mean simply a person who fights against evil, or something similar. also, its a pretty cool word.
i was just wondering about the translation factor, maybe great in south korean has a slightly different meaning, i dont know. i dont feel it to be too pretentious in the first place.
AlpinKirkonen 2 years ago
yea, a name is just a name. if i name myself "conan the barbarian", it doesn't mean I think I am Conan the Barbarian.
wangstick 2 years ago
hah, well you might.
i just dont see the point in reading much into the players names, i dont think about the names bisu or fantasy or jaedong, so im not really going to consider savior or great.
AlpinKirkonen 2 years ago
is it me or z-v-z games are always the same?
Why players never use hydralisk + mutalisk or some other tactic?
barakuda1111 2 years ago
mutas move around the map faster
DrummyJCZ 2 years ago
mutalings are pretty much the standard build for zvz
clifferd2001 2 years ago
i see that, but it would be nice to see diferent zvz game. It looks like im seeing the same game over and over. Zerglings, then mutas and gg
o well...
barakuda1111 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
lol are u stupid of course u see only 4 units in zvz drones zerglings mutas and scourge. it has been like that ever since. since when do u watch starcraft? 1 week?
Nebulak187 2 years ago
you dumb shit that is my point exactly. I know i see always the same thing in zvz game and it has been like that ever since, that is what i pointed out. I wana see a diferent tactic in zvz game, thats what im saying. Dont you find that boring after a while, always the same build, same units, same movements. Well i guess thats just fine for brain dead morons like yourself. Have a nice day
barakuda1111 2 years ago
k if you are so smart and everybody else is a dumb shit or a brain dead moron, why dont you come up with a better build and unit combo for zvz?
cant? then STFU.
dogabutila 2 years ago
try using a different unit combo against a good player, chances are it wont work. they use these specific few builds for a reason.
AlpinKirkonen 2 years ago
AlpinKirkonen tnx for the reply.
Dont you think that gets a little stale after a while? O well, maybe its just me, ill just skip zvz games. But every other race combo is good :) zvp, zvt, pvp...
barakuda1111 2 years ago
I feel zvz really doesn't allow for imagination (very similar gameplay game after game), but is very exciting to watch, as well as being a great test of micro skill.
For me, tvt and tvp can both be very stale. Of course, some of them are extremely fun to watch.
Smudge4C 2 years ago
have you seen luxury vs yellow? i dont remember it exactly but i believe that had a much larger array of zerg units used, made for a very interesting game.
and yes i definitely think ZvZ gets stale quickly, but the builds theyre using are the most effective, and thats why they use them.
what build would you suggest though? hydras wouldnt be mobile enough against mutas, mass ling would get eaten up by sunkens and mutas. any higher tech would leave you far too weak in early game.
AlpinKirkonen 2 years ago
You really think that because you never saw em, proplayers never tried other strategies in ZvZ? They have been trying for years, but guess what even if its the same unit, there are many different strategies that makes it interesting. You are apparently just too much of a noob to see any of that.
megadethqc 2 years ago
i dont even watch ZvZ games unless they are finals because of how repetitive the matchup feels to watch
thundasc 2 years ago
@thundasc
Atleast 1 person understand what im saying.
And yes there are overlords, you gota have overlords :)
@all
Nebulak187 tone pissed me off thats why i sad those things in post after him.
barakuda1111 2 years ago
You're missing some incredible showing of skills then.
megadethqc 2 years ago
if there were more units used or maybe if they went past 2 base EVER it might be fun to watch but just 2 hatch muti scourge micro is rather boring to me
dont get me wrong either i love every other match up save for PvP but at least that can be entertaining because of how many different builds are viable but with ZvZ there are maybe 8 different patterns that it always falls into
i saw a ZvZ the other day actually that i liked one player used defilers and spore colonies it was really good to see
thundasc 2 years ago
and overlords...
thundasc 2 years ago
someone's getting dumped by tossgirl...
TheJonahBomb 2 years ago 3
Yoohoo!!!
Awesome job guys, as always. THX!
w0nderj0e 2 years ago
ugh zerg
chivitos213 2 years ago
Was that amazing scourge play or poor defense against scourge? Amazing game....
Arathorn1973 2 years ago 5
hard to call it poor defense against Scourges when great started engaging his Mutas first, Calm had 2 options in that scenario:
1. fall back to get some distance from the Scourge to snipe them off, but taking Mutalisk fire during that time.
2. trying to win the battle head on, hopefuly sniping the Scourge before they land.
Calm chose the 2nd option, partially because he had the +1 advantage. honestly I dont think it would have been different if he chose the 1st option...
HeLL12aiseR 2 years ago
ugh. Calm, pathetic game.
ewethestuff 2 years ago
actually Calm didnt really play pathetically. he managed to sneak some lings into Great's base to kill a drone or 2 after Great did some damage to him. he also got the extra hatch and +1 attack for his Mutas. so he did most things right, the only thing is that he probably underestimated Great's Muta numbers and of course Great's Scourges landed perfectly...
HeLL12aiseR 2 years ago
Go Tossgirl! lol
1364wpr 2 years ago 3
Go GO GO SSK!!!
aahhpe 2 years ago 3
Loving these games. Keep the commentary going!
thunder3467 2 years ago 7