well when it rains... u dont ride the motorcycle... but think again 1000 hp car on slippery road = death... you just touch the throttle and the car gets out of control...
@MrAmorbis i like the motorcycles more because of the acceleration... i dont like cars which have low acceleration... thats why bikes are better for me... :) hayabusa twin turbo pwnz this little car :)
This car sucks fuck that 1001 horse powers motocycles pwn hayabusa twin turbo pwnz this freaking car hayabusa`s acceleration is 10x better... different in top speed 10-20 kmh...
if a girl drove that car id slap the shit out of her no woman could handle that i dont give a fuck who you think you are they would crash it. fucking dumb cunts thinking they can do anything a man can do. what a fucking laugher
Stop posting shit about veyrons lap time. Veyrons lap time is done by a car magazine (wheelz magazine) with some random driver and in traffic with 4 overtakes. So its not official.
you know losers will always bring up the race track at everything, but the truth is when your in a veyron ..most the time it will be at streets, motorways ..the real world. other people, real people in cars will watch you destroy all your opponents on the roads lol ..girls will be watching how you leave other supercars for dead at the traffic lights lol for me thats more important than racing around a track sure its fun, but the real streets showing off front of girls is a priceless feeling
Scheint ja n richtig krasser Ghetto-Typ zu sein... Der hat bestimmt die Hälfte aller existierenden, weiblichen Bevölkerung in seinem VEYRON (natürlich als Lowrider mit 48 Zoll Felgen) gevögelt und nebenbei n Rennen gefahren (und natürlich gewonnen!)... Spastenjunge!! Chuck Norris ist n Witz gegen dich!!!
If i Had a Veyron I would regularly take it to a track... Ile PROBABLY have my own Track... Ile also be on the roads because, Mcdonalds don't do dilivary Hahaha
this is def. the ol' nordschleife and the lap time wouldn't be good unless they got someone w/ enuff balls to drive it all out. lets give kimi raikkonen a call
ABS isn't at all for people that can't drive. Even a ferrari f430 has ABS when in race mode (you can turn everything off if you really want to). It's almost as silly as saying "Disc brakes are for people that can't drive, drum brakes are for real men".
Only overtaken by some sort of prototype quicky thing with, as 357callahan said, 800 BHP less :)
Aaaaaand the driver obviously wasn't racing because the car's just too expensive, because it's a gran turismo not a racer and so on and for a million of other reasons no one still knows the time Veyron can do when lapping the Ring.
Why won't anybody simply take it for a spin there?? It's just an yet another expensive car.
The SSC has to have fewer features because if it had any more substantial weight it wouldn't be able to beat the Veyron in top speed. And they are designed and built with different purpouses in mind. The SSC has 4mph over the Veyron, while the Veyron accelerates faster, has the same breaking distance, and weighs 1400 pounds more. The Veyron is more of a masterpiece while the SSC is just made to go fast. And all super cars have the option to turn on or off features for track or road use.
More It would have to be a heavily substantial amount of weight to affect it's top speed. But as for features the aero has air conditioning, heater, power windows, sat nav, and havy duty sound system. it's fully loaded with your basic creature comforts.
7:40 done by a non-racing driver among the professional which is a testament about the easiness of the Veyron for average drivers. Now imagine if a professional driver like Pierre-Henry Raphanel raced.
As usual, you work hard to discredit the Veyron as you can. On this video, it is really clear the driver was not racing at all. Just to point out that the unofficial 7:40 time, the Veyron had to overtake four cars. Try to put a unskilled driver on a track with a track car like Porsche and tell again it can acheive a faster time.
Un unskilled driver will not lap anywhere near a Porsches capabilities. But an unskilled driver in a Veyron will pretty much go its fastest because it drives itself a lot.
That is one of features of the Veyron. It is designed to be handled easily with its thousand one horsepower. You got to admit the unofficial 7:40 done by a non-racing driver, a test engineer, is impressive. Should a race driver tried on Nürburgring track, the lap time would be lower than 7:40.
If it did lower it would lower by about 1 second. But if you lapped the SSC Ultimate Aero in 7:40 then put a racing driver in it would drop considerably. More like 10 seconds.
Don't think so. You deliberately avoided the driver factor. It was clear the amateur drive did not go full throttle and the fact he did 7:40 is impressive. SSC Ultimate Aero still have issue on brake and wheelspin.
I am not avoiding driver factor. You are avoiding car ability factor. Anyone can drive the Veyron. So as the driver skill goes way up the car barely goes any factor because of the way it was designed. Put a bad driver in the SSC it will lap slow. Put a skilled driver in and it will lap really fast. The Aero does not have brake and wheelspin issues.
Ability that need to be exploited by high skilled driver given the fact SSC Ultimate Aero TT does not come with security features such as ABS, power steering. Having a lot of torque on rear wheels can send that car spin out of control which is why SSC is so low. Aero TT is very much an old method.
Ability that need to be exploited by high skilled driver is the same theory that was given to the awsome McLaren F1. ABS, and power steering is in cheap cars. Doing away with it is to make the car more rewarding to drive. Power steering and ABS takes away from it being a car and makes it an appliance. The SSC is designed to be an enthusiasts car. More go less show. It still has show. It may be an old method but it is better for car people.
So all production car that have security features are cheap? Last time we heard, a car with ABS is still car. Speaking of which, those features were banned from racing because they were too effective. If SSC Ultimate Aero is for enthusiast, so is the Veyron although not in the same league.
No idiot. Its just that safety features aren't exotic. ABS is good for normal cars where most people suck at driving. SSC is for enthusiasts because it doesn't have those features. If youve ever performance driven or driven for fun (enthusiast) you would know that those features take away from the driving experience. Real drivers like control. It was designed to be a rewarding car to drive and reality is the Veyron won't be rewarding. Racing is a whole different storry.
ABS isnt for people who cant drive, if its piss wet and someone pulls out infront of you at a junction the last thing you want are your wheels to lock when you slam on the breaks, in such a situation you would be a fool to rely on brake control, no matter how good you are, even pro racing drivers lock wheels.
Safety features were banned from F1 to put more of an emphasis on driver skill. I know its hard but think: two people are racing and one is a much better driver, way faster, but with safety features it helps the slow driver and not the fast one so now they post the same lap times and the faster driver might not win. That's BS. Safety features were not banned in MotoGP and other sports for your info.
7:40 done by a non-racing driver among the professional which is a testament about the easiness of the Veyron for average drivers. Now imagine if a professional driver like Pierre-Henry Raphanel raced.
aorund the 1 minute mark the Veyron is overtaken by a long looking honda S2000...well the new NSX diguised as an S2000. Although I dont really think the Veyron was being hammered round the track- shame.
Yeah thats definately Nordschleife...man that W-16 sounds sweet...just a low rumbling growl that commands attention from all other drivers. But for the price, I would go McLaren F1, as it has infinately more practicality (if supercars have any at all :P) than this car.
FYI: the Veyron needs the same time lap to reach 300kmh than the McLaren F1, but with a slight difference: the McLaren was already going at 200kmh!!! So... RU sure you'd choose the F!? (wouldn't it be great to really have this choosing issue?) :-)
WTF!! I would drive faster than that.
damith77 4 months ago
It's amazing the amount of Veyron, Zondas, 599s, Nissan R35 and Carrera Gts that comment videos on youtube.
Friendroid 5 months ago
Jemand der die Nordschleife mit dem Hockenheim verwechselt gehört einfach nur noch in die Nieren getreten bis er Blut pisst.
Marauder1981 6 months ago
@Marauder1981 achso, na dann... ;) Worauf warteste?
Schon lustig, für Fehler körperliche Gewalt ausüben zu wollen. Denn dann müsstest du ja für deine Netiquette hier richtig böse verhauen werden... ;)
dunjeeone 6 months ago 2
@dunjeeone Netiquette ist Sklavenmoral ;)
Marauder1981 6 months ago
haha 0:53 an Aston Martin Rapide - a four doors car overtakes an Bugatti Veyron
Kraxelaxel 8 months ago
well when it rains... u dont ride the motorcycle... but think again 1000 hp car on slippery road = death... you just touch the throttle and the car gets out of control...
mrx495 10 months ago
Definitely Nürburgring Nordschleife!
DjMatze91 1 year ago
@MrAmorbis i like the motorcycles more because of the acceleration... i dont like cars which have low acceleration... thats why bikes are better for me... :) hayabusa twin turbo pwnz this little car :)
mrx495 1 year ago
@mrx495 until it rains
MrBingping 10 months ago
overtake or not, the way it handles the corners is super slow.
I've seen normal supercars take these corners faster.
ASSHOLELA 1 year ago
vrooooommmmmm.....
iklanbiz 1 year ago
This car sucks fuck that 1001 horse powers motocycles pwn hayabusa twin turbo pwnz this freaking car hayabusa`s acceleration is 10x better... different in top speed 10-20 kmh...
mrx495 1 year ago
@mrx495 right..and the motorcycles ways about 3500bls less..so suck it? this thing weights about 2 tons and it can pwn your silly little bike
MrAmorbis 1 year ago
@MrAmorbis then why doesn't a veryron have the texas and maxton mile record? Huh shit for brains?
noslacksucks 11 months ago
why do people say 16.4? i thought it was 2 audi 4.2 v8s put together (therefore being a 8.4 quad-turbocharged w16)
FUCK202 1 year ago
@FUCK202 I believe it's because it's 16 cylinder and 4 turbochargers
jbenekeorr 1 year ago
@jbenekeorr could be, but its misleading, normally it would mean 16400cc engine.
FUCK202 1 year ago
@FUCK202 dude it means 16 cyclinder and 4 turbos
aerlingus18 1 year ago
@aerlingus18 ill reply the same as i did last time :could be, but its misleading, normally it would mean 16400cc engine.
FUCK202 1 year ago
@FUCK202
16 clyinders 4 turboes.
ASSHOLELA 1 year ago
@ASSHOLELA yes im not blind ive seen both answers already thanks
FUCK202 1 year ago
if a girl drove that car id slap the shit out of her no woman could handle that i dont give a fuck who you think you are they would crash it. fucking dumb cunts thinking they can do anything a man can do. what a fucking laugher
jewsbitch6990 1 year ago
I saw a new Honda NSX owning the Veyron ! Honda Japan FTW !
putocagapff 1 year ago
if a guy drove that car, a girl would say what a waste of money.
If a girl drove that car, she'd get ANY guy in the world.
lzenna1 1 year ago
Drives so clean.
Gabxiel 2 years ago
and slow around the corners
matomato123 1 year ago
Stop posting shit about veyrons lap time. Veyrons lap time is done by a car magazine (wheelz magazine) with some random driver and in traffic with 4 overtakes. So its not official.
brudel001 2 years ago 12
you know losers will always bring up the race track at everything, but the truth is when your in a veyron ..most the time it will be at streets, motorways ..the real world. other people, real people in cars will watch you destroy all your opponents on the roads lol ..girls will be watching how you leave other supercars for dead at the traffic lights lol for me thats more important than racing around a track sure its fun, but the real streets showing off front of girls is a priceless feeling
SidneyXda 2 years ago 3
Scheint ja n richtig krasser Ghetto-Typ zu sein... Der hat bestimmt die Hälfte aller existierenden, weiblichen Bevölkerung in seinem VEYRON (natürlich als Lowrider mit 48 Zoll Felgen) gevögelt und nebenbei n Rennen gefahren (und natürlich gewonnen!)... Spastenjunge!! Chuck Norris ist n Witz gegen dich!!!
Minimal561 2 years ago
If i Had a Veyron I would regularly take it to a track... Ile PROBABLY have my own Track... Ile also be on the roads because, Mcdonalds don't do dilivary Hahaha
MikalGreen1 2 years ago
@MikalGreen1 And then u will crash the car and waste all your money lol.
Rockcem1 1 year ago
I'm not a bad driver, but if I'm gonna Die, I'm taking that thing with me :D
MikalGreen1 1 year ago
@MikalGreen1 Lolzz
Rockcem1 1 year ago
what over took it on that one corner?
VivaLaNick335 2 years ago
looked like a jaguar xkr. veyron's ring times aren't impressive at all...
fredrikolsson 2 years ago
i disagree 100%
mccarthy155 2 years ago
already said 21320131 times.. a Nissan GTR ( r35)
stepxunit 2 years ago
omg..
jonte64 2 years ago
nissan gtr
conutach 2 years ago
its look like it handles well because its in almost every corner goes inside
patko1610 2 years ago 3
is der von nem jaguar überholt worden? =D
14fadu6 2 years ago
Schwer zu erkennen...
aber ich denk es ist ein Aston Martin
tobigrimm1994 2 years ago
He didn't switch traction control off
tysolambodiablo 2 years ago 3
I can hear the screaching sound of those tire's being shreaded up from all that understeer.
Towelman20 2 years ago
Nordschleife at the nurburgring
lukewill783 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Nice vid! check out mine!
CrissAngelLIVE 2 years ago
Wow, that thing handles about as well as a wet turd. To damn heavy.
cbremer83 2 years ago 3
it was some sort of an aston martain
suicidehotline1 2 years ago
no its bentley
zorny81 2 years ago
no way its a ford!
swanny812 2 years ago
no its a honda
V1et4lyf3 2 years ago 2
looks like its jst rolling....never push to its limits....whc is very sad...and wt is tht car overtaking veyron.
rafzune 2 years ago
Uhm yeah no shit? Why don't you buy a car for over a million bucks and push it to its limits. How would YOU feel?
IYukiI 2 years ago
It´s not Hockenheim ;) It´s the Nordschleife ;)
glenn110688 2 years ago 4
anyone know of an official or unofficial time for the veyron at the nurburg?
ur1off 2 years ago
7:40, aka shitty. The fat lard can't turn.
TheOfficialKC 2 years ago
lol.... cheers bud.
ur1off 2 years ago
and u then n00b!
u don't have any wife at all
and the houses not....cause u live in a little box.....
and whut the hell is a carrera GT500
RSMovies12 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
i own a Bugatti Veyron and i like him very much ....
cause much ppl r dreamin' about this car
so i'm happy with it.......i have to tell you
i dnt have much money anymore now
RSMovies12 3 years ago
lol RSMovies12
U are a retard .. I got a Bugatti Veyron a Carrera GT500 and a Lambo galardo ... 20 houses and 150 wemon in almost each country in the world ....
retard dont talk shit ....
Lepsarsinep 3 years ago 3
Veyron owners don't talk like little kids.
s4m2 2 years ago 9
its not the hockenheimring its the nurburgring nordschleife track been there many times its unbelieveable
pedro1693 3 years ago
This is footage from during a manufacturer test day at the Nordschleife. The car that passes also has camoflage on it.
workshop77777 3 years ago
bugatti x la vita
luka1346754613268956 3 years ago
this is def. the ol' nordschleife and the lap time wouldn't be good unless they got someone w/ enuff balls to drive it all out. lets give kimi raikkonen a call
cobrafan427 3 years ago
ABS isn't at all for people that can't drive. Even a ferrari f430 has ABS when in race mode (you can turn everything off if you really want to). It's almost as silly as saying "Disc brakes are for people that can't drive, drum brakes are for real men".
DarthDaverUber 3 years ago 2
i love the car
but not the interior console.
looks ridiculous.
khenry1991 3 years ago
How can you have 16.4 cylinders in a car the title is wrong
YouFucked2 3 years ago
I'm pretty sure there is no such thing as 16.4 cylinders shit head. Congrats on knowing absolutely nothing about cars.
workman88 3 years ago
He probably means it's a W16 engine (two 4.0 v8s side by side essentially) with four turbo chargers. so 16cyl 4turbo.
DarthDaverUber 3 years ago 3
that isnt a game
Ahuothe 3 years ago
dude r u sure this isnt the nurburgring? looks remarkably similar!
Dalley100 3 years ago
this definately is the nurburgring...wonder what is the lap time
unknown4691 3 years ago
Yes def. ring. And the time.... A Veyron isnt a ring car!
abchaz01 3 years ago
MINDBLOWINGLY FAST!!!
Only overtaken by some sort of prototype quicky thing with, as 357callahan said, 800 BHP less :)
Aaaaaand the driver obviously wasn't racing because the car's just too expensive, because it's a gran turismo not a racer and so on and for a million of other reasons no one still knows the time Veyron can do when lapping the Ring.
Why won't anybody simply take it for a spin there?? It's just an yet another expensive car.
theannoyingdogpoo 3 years ago
Lol... this is Nurburgring, not Hockenheim.
Huib1992 3 years ago 3
thats wat i thought, dumb fucker lol
scoobystu555 3 years ago
Could you ask for a better job?
Flavoade 3 years ago
The SSC has to have fewer features because if it had any more substantial weight it wouldn't be able to beat the Veyron in top speed. And they are designed and built with different purpouses in mind. The SSC has 4mph over the Veyron, while the Veyron accelerates faster, has the same breaking distance, and weighs 1400 pounds more. The Veyron is more of a masterpiece while the SSC is just made to go fast. And all super cars have the option to turn on or off features for track or road use.
jakefini777 3 years ago 4
More It would have to be a heavily substantial amount of weight to affect it's top speed. But as for features the aero has air conditioning, heater, power windows, sat nav, and havy duty sound system. it's fully loaded with your basic creature comforts.
superjump01 3 years ago
Those are all assumed for super cars. I meant driving features. The aero is pretty stripped down as far as those are concerned.
jakefini777 3 years ago
EN ESA VUELTA EL VEYRON ROMPIO
4 GOMAS (alto peso)
4 FRENOS (alto peso)
100 LITROS DE NAFTA (motor chupa nafta)
FEGTTTSDH 3 years ago
put noz lol
sweetboi2die4 3 years ago
Loll the gtr passed you he prolly felt so cool
albodude93 3 years ago
7:40 that's slow for what people think is such a great car. A Corvette Z06 with 505hp does it in 7:42
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
7:40 done by a non-racing driver among the professional which is a testament about the easiness of the Veyron for average drivers. Now imagine if a professional driver like Pierre-Henry Raphanel raced.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
Remember what you Veyron fans like to say. Anyone can drive the car to its limits. So put a pro in it and I doubt it will go much faster.
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
As usual, you work hard to discredit the Veyron as you can. On this video, it is really clear the driver was not racing at all. Just to point out that the unofficial 7:40 time, the Veyron had to overtake four cars. Try to put a unskilled driver on a track with a track car like Porsche and tell again it can acheive a faster time.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
Un unskilled driver will not lap anywhere near a Porsches capabilities. But an unskilled driver in a Veyron will pretty much go its fastest because it drives itself a lot.
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
That is one of features of the Veyron. It is designed to be handled easily with its thousand one horsepower. You got to admit the unofficial 7:40 done by a non-racing driver, a test engineer, is impressive. Should a race driver tried on Nürburgring track, the lap time would be lower than 7:40.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
If it did lower it would lower by about 1 second. But if you lapped the SSC Ultimate Aero in 7:40 then put a racing driver in it would drop considerably. More like 10 seconds.
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
Don't think so. You deliberately avoided the driver factor. It was clear the amateur drive did not go full throttle and the fact he did 7:40 is impressive. SSC Ultimate Aero still have issue on brake and wheelspin.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
I am not avoiding driver factor. You are avoiding car ability factor. Anyone can drive the Veyron. So as the driver skill goes way up the car barely goes any factor because of the way it was designed. Put a bad driver in the SSC it will lap slow. Put a skilled driver in and it will lap really fast. The Aero does not have brake and wheelspin issues.
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
Ability that need to be exploited by high skilled driver given the fact SSC Ultimate Aero TT does not come with security features such as ABS, power steering. Having a lot of torque on rear wheels can send that car spin out of control which is why SSC is so low. Aero TT is very much an old method.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
Ability that need to be exploited by high skilled driver is the same theory that was given to the awsome McLaren F1. ABS, and power steering is in cheap cars. Doing away with it is to make the car more rewarding to drive. Power steering and ABS takes away from it being a car and makes it an appliance. The SSC is designed to be an enthusiasts car. More go less show. It still has show. It may be an old method but it is better for car people.
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
So all production car that have security features are cheap? Last time we heard, a car with ABS is still car. Speaking of which, those features were banned from racing because they were too effective. If SSC Ultimate Aero is for enthusiast, so is the Veyron although not in the same league.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
No idiot. Its just that safety features aren't exotic. ABS is good for normal cars where most people suck at driving. SSC is for enthusiasts because it doesn't have those features. If youve ever performance driven or driven for fun (enthusiast) you would know that those features take away from the driving experience. Real drivers like control. It was designed to be a rewarding car to drive and reality is the Veyron won't be rewarding. Racing is a whole different storry.
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
ABS isnt for people who cant drive, if its piss wet and someone pulls out infront of you at a junction the last thing you want are your wheels to lock when you slam on the breaks, in such a situation you would be a fool to rely on brake control, no matter how good you are, even pro racing drivers lock wheels.
g2theb 3 years ago 5
Safety features were banned from F1 to put more of an emphasis on driver skill. I know its hard but think: two people are racing and one is a much better driver, way faster, but with safety features it helps the slow driver and not the fast one so now they post the same lap times and the faster driver might not win. That's BS. Safety features were not banned in MotoGP and other sports for your info.
TheOfficialKC 3 years ago
THE SSC IS AMERICAN RUBBISH
hahassar 2 years ago 5
7:40 done by a non-racing driver among the professional which is a testament about the easiness of the Veyron for average drivers. Now imagine if a professional driver like Pierre-Henry Raphanel raced.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
i vesued one of thoe in nfs prostreet online it owned me i had a ford gt
eviltwin777 3 years ago
this car is awesome this car you can´t explain in words
magicjohnson789 3 years ago
It's the old Nurburgring Nordschleife, not Hockenheim!
Marcn3 3 years ago
I think the driver is not hammering it. he is taking it easy. I would too.
matiomatio 3 years ago
If you look around 35ish, they guy floors it
twistedmetal976 3 years ago
aorund the 1 minute mark the Veyron is overtaken by a long looking honda S2000...well the new NSX diguised as an S2000. Although I dont really think the Veyron was being hammered round the track- shame.
tommio69 4 years ago
The Veyron is driven by a non-racing driver, a test engineer. It was not racing at all.
Tippotipo 3 years ago
Hi guys, I'm looking for a clip with the Bugatti vs. MacLaren F1. I can't remember the title.
tomekz83 4 years ago
italian style
BoloByNightRemix 4 years ago
Lol no just no.
swedishvolvo 4 years ago
Dude, that's the Nordschleife of the Nürburgring or "The Green Hell"...
Picknicker2k7 4 years ago 2
beautiful machine
kevin15664 4 years ago
Orange County California has 3 of them in town!
Newport Beach, Newport Coast & Laguna Beach! Sick hua? All that salt air messing up the body!
repo4sale 4 years ago
So. Cal purchases 40% of Rolls Royace cars.
gsdotgs 4 years ago
omfg.... that 1001 hp makes it sound like a jet. the car looks awsome 2 most super cars look weird plus the car is luxurious cars neither.
120karrowz 4 years ago
it's a very beatifull car....and have 1001Ps
re4krauser4ever 4 years ago
shes pretty hot too
tranQu111ty 4 years ago
i want to hump the test driver
leupint 4 years ago
.ASÖSDA,SDAç
,a.ds
lçais, ö,föec,ksfö,ö
evrimebruogulcan 4 years ago
lame driving, overtaken by some prototype with 800hp less!
357callahan 4 years ago
lmao dude xD
CSilva76 4 years ago
Yeah thats definately Nordschleife...man that W-16 sounds sweet...just a low rumbling growl that commands attention from all other drivers. But for the price, I would go McLaren F1, as it has infinately more practicality (if supercars have any at all :P) than this car.
GRAWpcsucks216 5 years ago
And much more reliabilty.
But to be honest I think the Veyron looks a bit better than the McLaren F1. I never liked the Mclarens looks.
coolhund 5 years ago
FYI: the Veyron needs the same time lap to reach 300kmh than the McLaren F1, but with a slight difference: the McLaren was already going at 200kmh!!! So... RU sure you'd choose the F!? (wouldn't it be great to really have this choosing issue?) :-)
voolare 4 years ago
who is kind enough to provide one of those, and do a test on the track? ...hehe , just my dream.
oneonePyoPyo 5 years ago
I wonder what its best time is around there.
stalin9 5 years ago
jut zu wissen keule...:P
aber is doch penis?
dunjeeone 5 years ago
just for your information. its the Nürburgring Nordschleife and not the Hockenheimring.
maincutz 5 years ago