I'm 62, live in Wyoming. I am not here to play petty games, exchange insults which serve no purpose. Ilan Pappe is speaking cogently and basing his address upon facts and data. Truths which may not be easy to admit. Ignorance is not an ethical basis for dialogue or insults. Please take your games elsewhere and allow those seeking information the freedom of choice to do so, without the insult of bigotry!
@adycousins - you'll also need to block kreplach2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 ( not much of an imagination im afraid ) as well as schlomo etc - this nuts got a myriad of accounts which he uses to stalk & harass people
@kreplach3 It would appear that you're not blocked. Hundreds of dead civillians = massacre. And why did the Hagganah prefer it to be thought of as a massacre? Because TERROR was the instrument of forced displacement.
The point is, it's obvious Zionism began at the same time as WW1, before the French and British occupation of the region, to control the distribution of the oil networks. They built the Suez canal, and the oil refineries, and the state of Israel was created as part of that process. Zionism therefore served the interests of the British / French alliance. Look at the Suez Crisis. It was the French / British interests allied with the Israeli army. They are one and the same.
Ithe point is you dont read history so writingto you is like writing to chimps.
Zionism began with Zionist settlers in 1878. There was never any oil in the area.
When were the refineries built? Where?
The Suez war was a convergence of common interests not a combining or welding. The Suez Canal was built way before oil was doscovered. READ HISTORY YOU FREAKING STUPID HICK.
You have proved YES - ISRAEL DO HAVE NUCLEAR WEAPONS -
YES - ZIONISTS STARTED TO SETTLE LONG BEFORE WW2 - THEREFORE THE CONCENTRATION CAMPS HAVE ZERO TO DO WITH THE ZIONISTS PLAN TO MAKE THEIR OWN STATE (in fact - the Neturei Karta JEWS - state that the ZIonists actually DELIBERATELY allowed the sacrifice of the Jews in the concentration camps, because it suited their end purpose - because it would give them even more excuse to justify the creation of Israel).
Israel is highly significant in terms of oil refining and distribution in the region.
The British took over Haifa in 1918 - and alongside their Jewish settler Zionist friends, they built the oil refinery which deliberately to process oil from Iraq, which the British had just recently bombed and occupied as part of their overall Middle Eastern campaign of occupation.
You sound like some white power chick who loves to play pretend. Like you pretend to have knowledge. A homeland is a haven FROM persecution. That all it was set up for. Not a homeland for a religion but for a persecuted people. And it was not exclusive. Do you know what exclusive means?
Genetic Scientists say Jews are descendants of ancient Hebrews too. READ SCIENCE!!!
If there was no such thing as Israeli white suprematist Russians blowing up the rest of the Middle East - I think that most Jews would have no problem in the rest of the world. (fact which most intelligent Jews who are not zionists have realised).
Liliaaaaaaaa, you are arguing with people who have been told and sold the propaganda of so many generations. One doesn't have to be anti- Jewish, anti-Zionist, anti-Palestinian, anti-Arab, or even pro-anything to see that it's about basic human rights and human wrongs. This whole story is filled with rights and wrongs on both sides since 1947 but the balance of wrongs quickly fell on the Israeli side where it has remained ever since.
The original British partition was not the democratic process of the indigenous Palestinian Jews, Muslims and Christians. Immigrant Zionist settlers pre 1948 owned only 7% of the land. After the partition, 82% of the Palestinians were forced off 78% of the land by 100,000 Hagana soldiers to make way for 'Israel'. Even if Israel is now a state, in international law, all the Palestinian people should be allowed to return once there is peace.
82% were not forced out. They left voluntarily. There were some explusions, much much smaller than 82% There is no international law ruling. There is very unfair rulings by the UN however. Of course the ist UN resolution was not even considered by the Arabs. Perhaps all the rest are moot.
The 82% figure was from Palestinian sources. If people left voluntarily - I think you have to consider that if people knew that there were 100,000 Hagana troops who were coming to assassinate people in their own homes, and the British had basically washed their hands of the matter - then it was going to be pretty obvious people were going to flee for their lives. You are right - the UN position on this matter to this day remains contentious. It's normal that the Arabs were not going to be happy.
The Hagannak never announced ANY tghreat to the Arab populace. Wheras the Arabs ALWAY DID. Driving the Jews in to the sea crap. Many Arabs arent going to be happy until ALL the Jews leave
Sorry - I have never ever in my entire life seen evidence of any Arabs stating that they wanted to drive anybody into the sea. I have only heard brain washed Israelis stating the words 'they want to drive us into the sea' over and over again - either while weilding large rifles over their shoulders, or talking about their time in the army hunting down Palestinian terrorists. Most Arabs have always stated to me that Jews lived side by side with no problem until the creation of the state of Israel
i think what you have said is slightly distorted. the hagganah set themselves up deliberately for 'self defence' or 'war against arabs' - you can find all kinds of stuff about 'fighting for israel' going back to the 20s if you look for it. The old 'arab throwing jews into the sea is so crap it is very boring i heard it so many times. its the israeli navy bombing people having picnics on beachs and shooting at fishermen these days. i think you need to catch up with the times!
I have never seen any evidence of the family who were bombed being a 'hoax' therefore please provide evidence.
instead there is plenty of evidence that various people have been shot at and kidnpaped by the Israeli navy. including a US senate member in waters outside of Gaza, which is against international laws.
There is nothing that states anything with fact. It was just 'supposition' - it doesn't deny the fact that the Israeli navy were shooting at and kidnapping people in Gaza waters, including a US senator they put in prison. You can't dispute that.
I dont need to dispute that. Gaza fisherman have been caught smuggling weapons and boats have carried out terrorist attacks. Its history. You know, what you dont read. McKinney wasnt a senator. Read books.
Even Israelis with brains don't say the same *** as you. Just look at wikipedia you'll see the Hagana turned into a regular army of 100,000 ground troops that stormed the entire country.
I don't see how the Arabs are supposed to make the Jews leave when they made the state of 'Israel' and now they have the nuclear weapons.
How many Israelis did Hamas rockets kill in the last few years? 18. Most of them fall on their own land that they are denied access to!!
You can not "say" Try reading. There was no storming just defense. The Arabs tried to make the Jews leave BEFORE THEY know about the ZION BOMB. 1948, 1967
Try seeing instead of assuming!
So war has a boxscore now. All wars MUST have equal casuailties??? WTF???
Enough rockets put Israel in danger NO NATION CAN STAND FOR THAT.
THE BRITISH STATED VERY CLEARLY DURING THEIR OCCUPATION OF THE REGION IN THE FIRST WORLD WAR THAT THEY WERE GOING TO CREATE A JEWISH HOMELAND. (long before any dead people in Germany)
THE ABUSIVE LAWS AGAINST THE PALESTINIANS CONTINUE FROM THE RACIST COLONIALIST STRATEGIES OF THE BRITISH, THE STATE OF ISRAEL WAS PLANNED AS PART OF THE BRITISH / FRENCH /AMERICAN COLONIALIST PROJECT FOR THE CONTROL OF THE ENTIRE REGION. WHERE IS THE SO CALLED LIBERATION OF THE ARABS THAT WAS PROMISED?????
The country belongs to the original people who live there - that means THE LAND BELONGS TO THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE - IT DOES NOT BELONG TO SOME DRUNK RUSSIANS WHO DO NOT EVEN HAVE ANY POGROMS TO RUN AWAY FROM.
ALL THE CONCENTRATION CAMP SURVIVORS ARE DEAD A LONG TIME AGO. THE LAND DOES NOT BELONG TO A BUNCH OF WHITE CAUCASIAN CONVERT IMMIGRANTS.
The country belongs to the PEOPLE WHO BOUGHT LAND THERE AND DEFENDED IT. JEWS ASRE NOT RUSSIANS. JEWS COME FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD. YOU OBSESSION ON WHITENESS MAY INDICATE AN ARYAN WHITE SUPREMACIST ORIGIN FOR LILIAAAAAAA. Are you a white power dummy?
No - the people who bought land - bought 7% - you forget they then used this excuse to start an 'armed struggle including throwing bombs at people. You forget the majority of Jews in Israel are ex Russians paid to be there who are mostly ex -Chechens and Turks who converted in the first place. Actually, my blood is far more likely to be original Palestinian Phoenicain Hebrew myself, than any Chechen Jewish convert.
Apparently all the Khazars who are all the ones who got victimised in Eastern Europe in the first place were originally Chechens and Turks who converted to Judaism in order to be neutral in relation to the Christian and Islamic wars. They are more genetically related to the Chinese Turkish Muslim Uygurs than anyone else.
Khazars , you idio,t came way before the Chechens or the Turks, Again, READ HISTORY. What Christian Islamic WArs??? You take any blood samples of the Uygurs. Ask a Turk if hes a Uygur! Ha! Youre such a dope!
What do you mean to say I am a white power advocate from what I am saying? Being white means you live in the North pole and never go out. If you go to a sunny part of the planet. You get a suntan. It's a natural biological result of sunbathing.
White suprematism only works with White Russian convert Jews who think they are better than Arab Jews.
But, yes, they were originally Chechen Turks, who were nomads, that travelled to various parts of Eastern Europe, including Poland.
It might be a waste of time answering your 14 messages as your a imbecile who assumes intelligence. Maybe youre a suntan power advicate HA! WHAT A MAROON!!! I see you acknowlegde what whit supremacistsa are Isee. You are defintely a Klangirl. I see that now. Are White Russians runnibf Israel?? S Are Sephardim slaves?? HA! HA! No you friggin idiot The Chechens arent Cossacks or Tartars or Khazars or Jews. READ FREAKING HISTORY!!!
You don't even know how to spell and you make the mistake that I must be American - maybe becos you think Americans are the only ones who write English. I stated before my ancestral roots are more likely to be from the ancient land of Canaan than yours. Regarding numbers of Russians - there are 1.5 million Russians and 0.5 million Californians now in the settlements in the occupied Palestinian territories all paid for by the Israeli state.
I always find those who are running out of material ALWAYS fall back on grammar punditry. Your no expert of grammar and spelling HA! YOUR ASSUMED ANCESTRAL ROOTS O White Power girl disguised bigot. The ruse of impartiality of yours worked for a while. But you gave it ALL AWAY with the WHITE JEWS QUOTE!! There are Jews from Ethopia, New York, Westerrn Europe, Eastern Europe, and India. Does that fit your stereotypes?
There are so many Russians now - that Putin himself has stated that Russia is in danger of de-population - so now he would like the women especially to go home and have children rather than sell their bodies overseas - You might not know it - but Israel is doing a very good job for the Russian Mafia pimps and their whores to provide a base to sell their services throughout the Middle East. Well done American brain-washed zionists for supporting Russian Mafia pimps and their whores.
Russians are empting into 13 mile wide Israel. Theyve moved to the USA, Europe, etc. Like a obediant good white supremacist w you MUST mention Russian prostitutes in Israel withoput mentioning far greater counts in Europe and America. You seem to be a agent/whore for Jew haters. Glad you revealed yourself.
A number of my best friends are Jewish, I celebrated Passover and Sukot with some of them this year. So I can't be classed as a Jew hater.
One of my best friends is related to Anne Frank, she's quite a famous Jewish person.
They don't need to go around making hateful statements about other people, just because of their roots. They also have Palestinian Muslim and Chrstian friends.. Just because you're Jewish it's not an excuse to be evil and kill people.
OK then look up white supremacists or KKK in Google. Do they resembe your opinions? You know like Whites, lacks, Aryans etc. If youre concerned with fairness why unfairly label white Askenazi Jews as all Israelis??
I'm not interested in KKK since I am aware that they are evil satanists and would rather not.
I am not anti- Jewish - I told you a million times.
I am pro-peace.
I am pro- understanding - I appreciate that you have been honest about certain things.
I would hope that Hamas would stop killing people - just the same that I would hope that any IDF or Jewish or settler people would also stop killing people.
it is a small place, it is ridiculous to expect the entire world population of Jews to fit into one tiny small country.
It would be much better for Jews who have occupied to leave peacefully with the people of the land they have occupied, then they will have a better public image world wide, and they will have a much easier time throughout the entire world. Intelligent people who are also Jews also state this fact as obvious.
Its not meant as a settlement place for all Jews. But all Jews can fit. Its not ridiulous.
It would be great if the settlers left central areas. But THAT IS NO GURANTEE OF AN EASIER TIME. Remember before there was an occupation there waere Arab attacks.
The British in the 20s said they were going to create a homeland for the Jews.
At the same time, they said they were going to liberate the Palestinians from the Ottomans. These 2 things contradict each other.
The first Palestinians accepted the first settlers who lived and worked with them peacefully.
It was only when the Irgun and Hagana started to arm themselves, and the British 'did nothing' - that it obviously created tension. The Irgun stated clearly they would take the land by force.
The British declared a homeland in 1917. Read history. They never said anything about Palestinian Arabs as there werent any. They did announce libertion for Arabs. And thus there was Jordan and Iraq. The Palestinians(called Arabs then) started attacking Jews in 1920, It continued in 1921,29, 36, 37, 38, 39, 46, 47, 48 R E A D H I S T O R Y
The original people were the same as the original Palestinians named by the Romans. They called 'themselves' Palestinians under the Ottoman occupation.
Re the Arabs - you have to consider that the first Jewish settlers were welcomed - it was only when the Irgun started the terrorist attacks against civilian populations, including other Jews, because they WANTED an armed struggle. There were already Jews living in the region, for centuries, and they all lived in peace.
No I don't agree that all of the world's Jews can fit into one country - Israel is mostly desert.
Most settlers from the Northern hemisphere are not adapted to live in deserts.
The water consumption of the average Israeli is excessive. That's partly due to intensive agricultural projects that are extremely wasteful of water.
There is no reason to state that people from a worldwide religion should settle in one country. You couldn't expect that of any other religion. It is not realistic.
I agree, I think that it's important to acknowledge that different people have migrated and spread all over the planet, so therefore it would be better for people who have dispersed to generally live peacefully amongst their host communities.
I have no idea what you are talking about regarding white suprematism. Personally I think that sunbathing is beneficial since it means that it stimulates your body naturally to produce vitamin D which is healthy to protect the body from various illnesses, as long as it is done in moderation. From my objective obsevation I would consider that having a natural suntan would be more biologically more useful than being an albino which would cause you to be more likely to be subject to skin cancer.
Maroon is a colour - which is a kind of dark red colour similar to a shade also known as burgundy.
If you look at the history of the Khazars, it states that they were a bunch of Turkish nomads from Southern Russia who roamed in the region throughout what is now known as Georgia, Chechnya, Ukraine and Azerbayjan.
Ha you just want to answer. And say anything. Maroon is a variant of MORON.
Khazars came on the heels of the Hun invasion. From Central Asia along with the Magyars, Bulgars, Alans, etc They arrived IN the North Caucasus-Ukraine. They didnt roam, dimit, They set up a kingdom. Read the 13th tribe.
Exactly, the Khazars are converts who were originally part of the Mongolian hordes who practiced shamanism, and often killed off their own leaders.
The descendants of the Hebrews dispersed in the Middle East, and some converted over time.
Most of the original blood line are most likely Palestinian Bedouin. The original Filistines of ancient texts refer to Greek colonisers which became the Ptolomeic dynasty, who produced Cleopatra. The Romans called ALL the people they occupied PALESTINIANS.
The Khazars WERE NOT CHECHENS OR MONGOLS. They were a turkic tribe.
AGAIN WITH RACE BLOOF THEORY!!!
Original bloodlines do not determine your HIOME. Did they check YOUR bloodline where you live??
The Romans called Phillistine..Palestine. But That doesnt mean the Philiistines were Palestinian READ HISTORY. READ HERODOTUS! The Phillistines were Pegasian Greeks who settled in Gaza in 1300 BCE. THey were NOT the Greeks who set up the Ptolemaic dynasty in 320 BCE. READ READ READ READ
You can read on wikipedia that it says that the Khazars were related to other tribal groups in the region who instead converted to different religions. Originally they would all have been shamanistic belief systems.
I agree re the difference between the Phillistines as the Greeks settlers of Gaza and the region that the Romans then called Palestine, that would have included a wide group of people, including Hebrews, Phoenicians, Ptolomeic Greeks, and Aramaic speaking Nabateans.
The fact is that the Canaanites/Phoenican/Hebrew history is blurred - because of the very fact that the Romans occupied - they re-nameed the entire region and called it 'Palestine' and they also took over the temple, and they also divided up the region and divided people up against themselves and they also re-wrote history to justify their own actions, in order to validate themselves throughout history.
I would suggest that it is better not to mix up nationality with religion, nor with blood lines.
These things are all separate.
Re the original Greek Filistines, I suggested that it is likely that the Ptolomeic dynasty would probably have followed the same migration, and that it was part of a trend over a number of centuries.
My own blood line is also probably originally from the Phoenician but I'm not going to start to worship Baal because of that fact.
Its nice to keep things separate but its not always possible. Reality isnt always compartmentalized. The Ptolemaics were Greeks who came with Alexander the Great..In no way the same route as the Greek Phillistines 1000 years before.
Bloodlines dont HAVE to follow religions. Usually dont.
Regarding whether or not the Mycanean Greeks had any relation to the Ptolomeic Greeks, it's difficult to say - but the important point - is the fact that the Palestinians named in the ancient texts who were Mycanean Greeks are NOT THE SAME as the Palestinians now.
The modern day Palestinians are most likely to by the direct descendants of the original Judeans, Israelites, Edomites, Samarians, Nabateans, Phoenicians, and Ptolomeic Greeks, who were occupied by the Romans.
I don't know these things, because I am not a white suprematist.
It doesn't bother me what colour people are. I go brown in the sun.
I don't particularly understand your tendency to accuse people of being white suprematists.
All I know is that in Israel these days, my Jewish Israeli friends have told me that the Russians are the ones who seem to act like they own the place because of their colour.
Also, it would help to understand you more if you could spell.
White Supremacism doesnt depend on your skin. It depends on your brain. Or lack of one. When I see statements all concerned about HOW WHITE people are I KNOW its a goofball klanperson nearby.
Russians arent the most polite. They are onbnoxious in NY. But they have the RIGHT TO LIVE WHEREVER THEY SET UP HOMES. legally!
My point I was making, is that there is a large majority of Russians who are taking advantage of the Israeli policy of Allia, so now there are 1.5 million Russians who have taken up residency in Israel.
Each person who does allia is paid $25,000 to do that.
That means they are paid to colonise the region, at the expense of the indigenous people, who do not get any compensation for their land that has been taken.
That is a deliberate policy that goes against the indigenous people.
Please note - I've said it before - I don't subscribe to any kind of racism against Jewish people, or any other semitic people. I think white suprematists should go and spend a long time in a desert country, and then they will also go brown themselves. In Italy, everyone is white in the winter, and black as moors in the summer, so you don't get the same kind of white racism as you do in English speaking countries. It doesn't make sense.
actually- I will just state - that if any white person does want to go and spend time in a desert - I would suggest that they do so by paying for the experience to the indigenous population.
I know that Israelis often have positive relations with Bedouins - it would be nice if the Israelis could also have positive relationships with the Palestinians who are probably their ancestors - since the modern day Palestinians are not the same as the Greeks of several thousands of years ago, which I am glad you agree with.
You might not realise that the original Etruscans who came BEFORE the Romans were most probably a Phoenician/Canaanite colony. Their alphabet influenced the development of the Latin alphabet. Their language was most likely Semitic. Blood tests have shown some descendants in Etruscan regions to be totally different genetically to other Italians. The first capital of Italy pre-Romans was Fiesole in Tuscany, near to where Florence is now. Romanised history denies this pretty much completely.
By the way - when I said that the language of the Etruscans was likely to be Semitic, that meant that it is most likely to have been Phoenician. In my understanding, the Egyptian, Hebrew, and Phoenicians were all pretty much inter-connected at the time anyway. I am just saying that to clarify the fact that Semitic is not just Hebrew, I mean it in the sense that it was probably some other early Semitic language maybe related to Phoenician or Aramaic. I don't know. I wasn't there.
I think there's a variety of different interpretations of the reality of the 'mess' that is Israel/occupied Palestine. The basic fact is that Israel was occupied and taken over first by the British and then handed over to the Hagana/Zionists to control. Basically it would have been a lot easier if they let the indigenous population remain and then there would have been no problem. whoever's idea it was to dislocate 82% of the population from 78% of their own land, was pretty stupid.
The British hardly handed Israel over to the Zionists. The British were engaged in suppressing a revolts by the Arabs and the Jews. They slightly favored the arabs. Some Brits loved that Lawrence of arabia crap. And others wre Jew Haters as taught in their churches. It was the Arabs idea to relocate. They believed false rumors by Arab Radio and followed orders of the 5Arab.Armies that ivaded the area for a second holocaust.
As mentioned above, even on wikipedia it states that the British had the intention of supporting a Jewish state from 1922, so therefore they did not favour the Arabs, they wanted to create a state for the Jewish people from 1922. That's why the Arabs revolted, because it was their country and they were not represented in the decision making process, when they were supposed to have been 'liberated'.
They supported the Arabs by taking Eastern Palestine from the Mandate and creating Jordan. The Arabs revolted at the mere presence of Jews. The Jews were willing to have a mixed ethnic state.
They already had Jews living among them - the Middle East in general was ALWAYS a refuge to the Jewish people PRIOR to the creation of the state of Israel. There was no need for conflict. Turkey for example (98% Muslim majority) helped Jews to flee from Greece during WW2. Turkey almost ALWAYS helped Jews flee from pogroms or persecution in Europe or Russia.
About your insistence of the matter of the Dhimmi - I don't know how you can be discussing this matter - I think that it is a historical matter that the original land laws of the Ottomans and land rights of the original inhabitants under the historical system have been totally disregarded. I think that you are confusing 'land laws' and religion.
The Palestinians along with a wide range of other 'people' were occupied by the Ottomans. The British took over.
The Palestinians did not get a chance to 'rule' even though the British had stated that they would be liberated when the Ottomans' were defeated..
Once the 'armed' Hagana army decided to take over and 'fight for their right for Israel' - then the British washed their hands of the whole situation. When did the Palestinians ever get to rule??
Perceived threats are as good as threats. Read psychology. Israel has what 3 planes in 1948??? Read history. The information came from eyewitnesses and then was exaggerated to cause Arab uproar. Instead it caused Arab flight.
100,000??? That's more than D-Day. Are you serious??? No the British didnt mount the largest amphibious landing of Jews in history LOL
The IRGUN WERE THROWING BOMBS AT PEOPLE AND SUPPORTING an ARMED STRUGGLE AGAINST THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE AS RACIST WHITE NORTHERN CAUCASIAN RACIST CONVERT ZIONISTS ALREADY FOR MORE THAN 20 YEAR BEFORE 1948.
Everybody on the entire planet knows there was NO JUSTIFICATION FOR THE ZIONIST RACIST BULLSHIT FROM A BUNCH OF EX RUSSIAN NAZIS JEWS TO GO AND INVADE SOMEONE ELSE'S COUNTRY.
IF YOU CAUSE CONFLICT IN THE ENTIRE PLANET - THEN IT IS NO WONDER EVERYONE HATES ISRAEL.
EVEN MY JEWISH FRIENDS HATE ISRAEL AND HATE STUPID LIAR BULLSHIT ZIONIST DEFENDERS.
YOu don't even have an argument?? HOW CAN YOU ARGUE WITH A NUTCASE WHO SAYS 'I AM SCARED OF THE ARABS WHO ARE GOING TO THROW ME INTO THE SEA' WHEN EVERYONE KNOWS THAT ISRAEL is the one with the NUCLEAR BOMBS???
Hamas can't even fire their own rockets further than their own land. Most of their rockets hit their own farmland that they are not allowed to cultivate. So much for the 'dhimmi state'.
NUTCASE?? HA! When Israel acknowledged the bomb to Nixon in 1973 and the Arabs of course, the effort to drive the JEWS into the Sea ended on the part of states. Now its Hamas and Fatahs mission. You dont expect Israel to nuke Gaza City or Jenin. Hint: Fallout.
Hamas hits enough targets to make THEIR POINT. Stop dancing around the truth, Liz
Whenever you look at evidence of Hamas hitting Israel buildings, they show very small holes which are not very substantial. The reaction against the entire civilian people of Gaza affecting thousands is called 'a disproportionate response'. it is not called 'preventing terrorism' - If you want to prevent military agression - you don't bomb people - you go into the areas, and you arrest people and put them into prison then you have a military curfew. They didn't do that.
Kreplach - I would just point out to you - that I know enough Arabs or Iranians who are not impressed with the running of Iran.
At the same time, originally Israel and Iran had a good relationship particularly with the building of the first Israeli / Iranian pipeline designed to pipe oil via Eilat to Europe.
Personally I don't know why Israeli leaders are continuing to aggravate their neighbours who they originally had made deals with, when they are in their territories.
The first oil pipeline in Eilat was built as part of a friendly agreement between Israel and Iran.
Iran has the largest population of Jews outside of Israel in all of the Middle East.
If people care about 'Jewish communities' it would probably be a good idea to be nice to Iran - so that they continue to be nice to their Jewish citizens who have full rights, and who are represented in parliament.
Its wasnt Israel who started the threaten Israel with destruction and try to build atmic bombsd cycle! The Iranians are outMusliming the Arabs since 1983.
Kerplach - you also have to remember that pre the British take over - the land was governed by the Ottomans, so therefore the land laws were under Islamic land law legislation - which is comparable to traditional nation state laws of ownership separate to the religious issue of what kind of God you believe in - it's not the same as 'believing in a God who gave some kind of 'ancestral claim' based on reading a book that was based on a collection of stories written thousands of years ago.
Only 7% of the land was bought by the first Zionists. The rest was taken by force. The indigenous population left because the Hagana armed soldiers were shooting women and children. The British basically washed their hands of the issue. The creation of Israel was planned pre WW1. There was some division amongst the British pre Balfour agreement, but it was basically permitted at the expense of the indigenous population like it or not.
The rest was abandoned by the Arabs Read history. Watch You Tube videos on this. There is little documentation on your shooting myths. The creation Of Israel was planned when the Arabs rejected 181.Before that the haven was created NOT the state. READ!!
Kerplach - there's no need to be rude. You have to admit - anything from a pro-Zionist perspective is going to be self-defensive.
Still, you can read about the Hagana and how they evolved into the IDF. Stuff I found said they developed from security guards for the early settlements who trained the the early settlers til there were 100,000, then they the rest of the territory by force.
the first Zionists bought land - once they had formed into the Hagana and had bought guns to shoot people with - they didn't bother with buying land any more. That policy of just taking what they want at gun point still remains. That's not particularly Jewish in the normal conventional meaning of the word - normally also it's not civilised behaviour either.
Even if you read the details about the British Mandate of Palestine on wikipedia- it states that the British wanted to install a Jewish state from 1922, which was when the Ottomans surrendered. I also read somewhere else that the British was bombing people in the 20s and 30s to control people throughout the Middle East, including Palestine.
I agree with you - but I also think that like you said - Israelis and jewish people are brain washed so much that unless they are educated people - then they don't realise it themselves. You also have to consider that they are just used as part of a big 'game' to get into the middle east by the west - as an excuse to make problems with all the muslims so that they can use that as an excuse to get at the oil. Even palestinians themselves told me - osama bin laden was a big lie 4 years ago.
Israel is the only state with undeclared nuclear weapons in the region. If the poor Jewish concentration camp survivors are just poor suffering people under some mean Arabs, then how did that happen?
From a realistic objective point of view, I would see that Israel is the major military power in the region, that uses military action against the Arabs almost constantly to 'control' the entire wider region, which just happens 'by coincedence' to be where the oil is.
?? that's a new one. please stop saying things like 'read history' - history has often been described as 'changed by the political forces of the time to suit the end of those who contracted the writer in the first place'.
You dont seem to know elementary history. You need to know that to write on ploitical issues. Your knowledge portfolio is very permeable. You really cannot excuse yourself away from knowing basic facts.
I think that most of the residents of New York particularly the fire fighters who were gagged are aware that there were controlled demolition explosions that had been planted in the building, prior to any aeroplanes hitting them. Osama was in hospital having kidney dialysis at the time in Dubai. He was not in Iraq, and he was not in Afghanistan either.
I don't see why you would say that. There are plenty of videos that show that the speed of the fall of the 3 buildings were the same as free fall. That is not a collapse caused by damage to the structure. There are also videos of the architects stating that they designed the buildings to withstand earthquakes, which is standard. The buildings had steel support structures which firemen have described as having been melted, and puliverised at temperatures far hotter than that caused by aeroplanes
You are not an expert on demolitions. Neither am I.Hear one side without the other is prejudice in action. It was jet fuel that ignites not just the airplanes.
911 doesnt add up so there needs to be a rehauled investigation. Premature conclusions are a waste of time.
As someone else pointed out above - the Jews always lived in peace in the Arab world, before the state of Israel was created and many jews were in fact helped by Muslim majority Turkey to flee - when Jews were targetted in Europe.
The original Palestinians included Jews who objected to the state of Israel alongside their Palestinian Christian and Muslim neighbours. Israel was not created by the democratic choice of the actual inhabitants of the land.
Expelling the Palestinians was not an otpion. Giving them an Israeli citizenship was also not an option. The only remaining option was to create a structure enabling Israel to control them. An 'open prison'. This is understandable, considering the circumstances at that time. After all, they were the ones who refused a two-state solution. The real crime was to build settlements on that land.
And the zionists tried to drag the US in it, with it's attack on the USS Liberty. Attempt of a false-flag attack. The british orginally offered this land to the Rothschilds in its Balfour declaration. The league of nations then, and the UN now continue this mandate.
One day after the State of Israel declared itself as an independent nation (May 14, 1948), Lebanese, Syrian, Iraqi, Egyptian, and Transjordanian troops, supported by Saudi and Yemenite troops, attacked the nascent Jewish state, triggering the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. On that day, Azzam Pasha (Secretary-General of the Arab League) announced:
"
This will be a war of extermination and a momentous massacre which will be spoken of like the Mongolian massacres and the Crusades".[6]
did u forget the fact that the total of these above mentined armies were 24.000 soldiers and the israeli army was 90.000 Wel equipped, with airplanes(as they bombes akka later)have u forgot the biggest of the armies was the Jor. army lead by the br. Glob Pasha and 47 other british officers whome already orchestrated the attack on the last meeting with the haganna on may 2.- The only massacres happened in Palestine were committed by israeli zionist during the clensing of palestine in 48.
You forget the Jews were a rag tag army with scrapd of weapons well trained to a degree mostly Holocaust survivors with out much arms. Your figures are in error too. The only massare was possibly Deir Yassin although thats looking like another battle blamed on the Jewish radicals.
That's complete rubbish. The British army handed over the entire British military arsenal, including aeroplanes to a 'newly formed' Israeli government. How did that happen? This covert hand-over of power has never been openly discussed. There was also obvious Zionist 'training' and brain washing already from pre-1st world war. This 'also' has never been openly discussed.
I'm refering to kreplach's comment that the Israeli army was a rag tag army of people who had come out of concentration camps. The British themselves were famously already attacked when they first occupyied Palestine by a trained Zionist terrorist organisation who bombed them in the King David Hotel, where the British were stationed in Jerusalem, during the 2nd world war, before the survivors were released at the 'end' of the war.
The majority of contemporary Zionists are actually from the U S of A and are brain washed in religious schools in the U S of A. Christian Presbyterians in the U S of A have also been brain washed since pre 1st world war, also, to 'believe' and 'support the state of Israel by 'the new revised presbyterian bible that was written turn of 20th century. Pre 1st world war.
it's called 'alliance of interested parties' who will mutually benefit from profitting from conflict. the masses are brain washed including 'jewish people' who support zionism. they are used also. why do you think 'kibbutzes' don't pay people - and it's all happy clappy dancing in the name of religion - meanwhile the kids are separated from their families to make them all retarded and it's all on palestinian occupied land.
it is 'not' the same as international laws on how to run a country.
Do the masses really concern themselves with Jews/ Not really. Its only the fringe loonies including Jew haters such as yourself. Look up socialism. already. Start an education instead of an assume-ication.
After all your ranting,U expressly and intentionally skip the fact that in June 1967 Jordan,Egypt and Syria waged an annihilation war against Israel,which they have lost!U,like this Pappe quack ,propose that Israel's actions were either cacodemonia and vagary or an evil master plan.Isn't this kind of war against Israel,like the war in 1948, an ethnic cleansing?Do U reserve this "book keeping" on Israel?
Normally when you talk about conflict situations you need to recognise the fact that there are 2 sides. I think that the 100,000 trained Zionists who waged the first 'war' against the indigenous population of Palestine were also intent on ethnic cleansing as well surely, don't you think?
Do U practice what U preach?U haven't found my arggument wrong so I'll asume U think I'm right.I'd really like to read your perception on the issue.2 facts for U.1.Israel,since it's creation,never,ever,initiated a war on it's adjacent neighbors,never.2.The real settlers here are the Arabs,U see,Arabs come from the Arabian Peninsula,what claims do they have on this land?
Antisemitisim today is replacing the word Jew with Zionist and get away with it because it makes U sound so liberal!
You can't accuse me of being a Jew hater - I was invited to a Jewish Sukot recently and was awarded a Lulav which I now have over my door. I am aware that the original Jewish people practiced their religion in tents, and didn't need to invade other countries in order to prove themselves.
The Nuterei Karta Jews - state quite clearly that ZIonists are not the same as 'Jews', they state clearly that Zionists are idol worshipping secularists.
So do DNA tests of jews!U R talking about truth that can be manipulated,facts are very firm!In June 1967 Jordan,Egypt and Syria commenced an annihilation war against Israel,is waht I'm saying "manipulated"?The quack Pappe opens his speech from 19/6/1967 why doesn't he start with what brought Israel to these places.That's nescient education that brings people like U to detest Israel!
The Hagana was formed after the 1929 Hebron massacre,are U familiar with this event,I'm probebly manipulating!
Kobi - Israel was created by a foreign occupying force which trained people to target and assassinate the indigenous population. That also has nothing to do with Judaism according the Neturei Karta Orthodox Jews who state that Jews are supposed to live in peace under the laws of the land that they live in. Israeli leaders today don't even follow their own laws! Recent supreme court rulings have been brushed aside by Israeli political leaders stating that they are 'merely reccomendations'.
he lost everything for what he stands for - what a giant of a man !
SantaOfNeretva 6 months ago
There can´t be any "anniversary of al Nakba", it´s an ongoing event.
kolkrabe19 1 year ago
I'm 62, live in Wyoming. I am not here to play petty games, exchange insults which serve no purpose. Ilan Pappe is speaking cogently and basing his address upon facts and data. Truths which may not be easy to admit. Ignorance is not an ethical basis for dialogue or insults. Please take your games elsewhere and allow those seeking information the freedom of choice to do so, without the insult of bigotry!
daebyday 1 year ago 8
@kreplach3 Oh yes, now I remember. No point in "debate" with someone who just makes stuff up. I await kreplach4
adycousins 1 year ago
@adycousins - you'll also need to block kreplach2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 ( not much of an imagination im afraid ) as well as schlomo etc - this nuts got a myriad of accounts which he uses to stalk & harass people
watch?v=y1dir7h_anU
flumoxed2 1 year ago
@flumoxed2 Nice to see you trolling me around youtube. Isnt that illegal.
Everybody should see /watch?v=q4m3TsfEgtI to see what crude Jew Hater will do
Kreplach6 1 year ago
@adycousins Oh yes what a great refutation. I made it all up. Nice and easy and neat for you.
Kreplach6 1 year ago
@adycousins As youi can see I skipped 4 and 5. Debate facts and history are not your strong suites.
Kreplach6 1 year ago
@kreplach3 Depends on your comments
adycousins 1 year ago
@kreplach3 It would appear that you're not blocked. Hundreds of dead civillians = massacre. And why did the Hagganah prefer it to be thought of as a massacre? Because TERROR was the instrument of forced displacement.
adycousins 1 year ago
@kreplach3 Yes there is. Its called Deir Yassin.
adycousins 1 year ago
The point is, it's obvious Zionism began at the same time as WW1, before the French and British occupation of the region, to control the distribution of the oil networks. They built the Suez canal, and the oil refineries, and the state of Israel was created as part of that process. Zionism therefore served the interests of the British / French alliance. Look at the Suez Crisis. It was the French / British interests allied with the Israeli army. They are one and the same.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Ithe point is you dont read history so writingto you is like writing to chimps.
Zionism began with Zionist settlers in 1878. There was never any oil in the area.
When were the refineries built? Where?
The Suez war was a convergence of common interests not a combining or welding. The Suez Canal was built way before oil was doscovered. READ HISTORY YOU FREAKING STUPID HICK.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Thankyou Kreplach -
You have proved YES - ISRAEL DO HAVE NUCLEAR WEAPONS -
YES - ZIONISTS STARTED TO SETTLE LONG BEFORE WW2 - THEREFORE THE CONCENTRATION CAMPS HAVE ZERO TO DO WITH THE ZIONISTS PLAN TO MAKE THEIR OWN STATE (in fact - the Neturei Karta JEWS - state that the ZIonists actually DELIBERATELY allowed the sacrifice of the Jews in the concentration camps, because it suited their end purpose - because it would give them even more excuse to justify the creation of Israel).
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
There are 2 oil refineries in Israel.
One in Haifa - and one in Ashdod.
Israel is highly significant in terms of oil refining and distribution in the region.
The British took over Haifa in 1918 - and alongside their Jewish settler Zionist friends, they built the oil refinery which deliberately to process oil from Iraq, which the British had just recently bombed and occupied as part of their overall Middle Eastern campaign of occupation.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
So the Arabs send their oil to Israel now??? Did you tell Maliki?? :D
kreplach2 2 years ago
I don't know who Maliki is.
I think that if you use your brain, then you will put 2 +2 together.
The British occupied 'Palestine'.
They built an oil refinery to recieve oil from Iraq.
They built a pipeline to recieve oil from Iran.
I wonder why.
Oh, Israel is in between the Middle East and Europe.
How strange.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Maliki is the PM of Iraq. READ! The British wanted Israel to be an oil hub. IT DIDNT WORK OUT THAT WAY.
Israel is at the crossroads. NOT STRANGE Hebrews in 1800 BCE knew that.
kreplach2 2 years ago
A homeland is a haven where Jews can settle unmolested!
kreplach2 2 years ago
Why the **** should there be a homeland for some people from a 'religion' that most of the people converted to?
there is no such thing as a homeland for any other religion on the planet.
The ancient Hebrews of 2000 years are not the same as modern Jews.
The modern day descendants are the Palestinians. Genetic Scientists will tell you that.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
You sound like some white power chick who loves to play pretend. Like you pretend to have knowledge. A homeland is a haven FROM persecution. That all it was set up for. Not a homeland for a religion but for a persecuted people. And it was not exclusive. Do you know what exclusive means?
Genetic Scientists say Jews are descendants of ancient Hebrews too. READ SCIENCE!!!
kreplach2 2 years ago
If there was no such thing as Israeli white suprematist Russians blowing up the rest of the Middle East - I think that most Jews would have no problem in the rest of the world. (fact which most intelligent Jews who are not zionists have realised).
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Now you lost me I have no idea what youre wtiiting here.
kreplach2 2 years ago
That's writing
kreplach2 2 years ago
The British stated they were creating a homeland not a Jewish state.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Comment removed
kreplach2 2 years ago
liliaaaaaaa,
Do you want me to anser your deluge of messages????
kreplach2 2 years ago
Comment removed
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Comment removed
kreplach2 2 years ago
Liliaaaaaaaa, you are arguing with people who have been told and sold the propaganda of so many generations. One doesn't have to be anti- Jewish, anti-Zionist, anti-Palestinian, anti-Arab, or even pro-anything to see that it's about basic human rights and human wrongs. This whole story is filled with rights and wrongs on both sides since 1947 but the balance of wrongs quickly fell on the Israeli side where it has remained ever since.
tacgroup2 2 years ago
Youve faulty in your history perception.
the balance of wrongs is on the rabs side as they cannot accept a Jewish state in their UMMA lands.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Kerplach.
That's just ignorant repetition.
The original British partition was not the democratic process of the indigenous Palestinian Jews, Muslims and Christians. Immigrant Zionist settlers pre 1948 owned only 7% of the land. After the partition, 82% of the Palestinians were forced off 78% of the land by 100,000 Hagana soldiers to make way for 'Israel'. Even if Israel is now a state, in international law, all the Palestinian people should be allowed to return once there is peace.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
82% were not forced out. They left voluntarily. There were some explusions, much much smaller than 82% There is no international law ruling. There is very unfair rulings by the UN however. Of course the ist UN resolution was not even considered by the Arabs. Perhaps all the rest are moot.
kreplach2 2 years ago
The 82% figure was from Palestinian sources. If people left voluntarily - I think you have to consider that if people knew that there were 100,000 Hagana troops who were coming to assassinate people in their own homes, and the British had basically washed their hands of the matter - then it was going to be pretty obvious people were going to flee for their lives. You are right - the UN position on this matter to this day remains contentious. It's normal that the Arabs were not going to be happy.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The Hagannak never announced ANY tghreat to the Arab populace. Wheras the Arabs ALWAY DID. Driving the Jews in to the sea crap. Many Arabs arent going to be happy until ALL the Jews leave
kreplach2 2 years ago
Sorry - I have never ever in my entire life seen evidence of any Arabs stating that they wanted to drive anybody into the sea. I have only heard brain washed Israelis stating the words 'they want to drive us into the sea' over and over again - either while weilding large rifles over their shoulders, or talking about their time in the army hunting down Palestinian terrorists. Most Arabs have always stated to me that Jews lived side by side with no problem until the creation of the state of Israel
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
i think what you have said is slightly distorted. the hagganah set themselves up deliberately for 'self defence' or 'war against arabs' - you can find all kinds of stuff about 'fighting for israel' going back to the 20s if you look for it. The old 'arab throwing jews into the sea is so crap it is very boring i heard it so many times. its the israeli navy bombing people having picnics on beachs and shooting at fishermen these days. i think you need to catch up with the times!
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Since you heard so many times and it conflicts with your agenda OF COURSE ITS BORING!!! The Picnic bombing has been exposed as a hoax. Pallywood.
kreplach2 2 years ago
I have never seen any evidence of the family who were bombed being a 'hoax' therefore please provide evidence.
instead there is plenty of evidence that various people have been shot at and kidnpaped by the Israeli navy. including a US senate member in waters outside of Gaza, which is against international laws.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Google Gaza Beach Hoax and youll see it was a munitions dump of Hamas thart blew
kreplach2 2 years ago
There is nothing that states anything with fact. It was just 'supposition' - it doesn't deny the fact that the Israeli navy were shooting at and kidnapping people in Gaza waters, including a US senator they put in prison. You can't dispute that.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I dont need to dispute that. Gaza fisherman have been caught smuggling weapons and boats have carried out terrorist attacks. Its history. You know, what you dont read. McKinney wasnt a senator. Read books.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Kreplach - what can I say.
Even Israelis with brains don't say the same *** as you. Just look at wikipedia you'll see the Hagana turned into a regular army of 100,000 ground troops that stormed the entire country.
I don't see how the Arabs are supposed to make the Jews leave when they made the state of 'Israel' and now they have the nuclear weapons.
How many Israelis did Hamas rockets kill in the last few years? 18. Most of them fall on their own land that they are denied access to!!
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
You can not "say" Try reading. There was no storming just defense. The Arabs tried to make the Jews leave BEFORE THEY know about the ZION BOMB. 1948, 1967
Try seeing instead of assuming!
So war has a boxscore now. All wars MUST have equal casuailties??? WTF???
Enough rockets put Israel in danger NO NATION CAN STAND FOR THAT.
kreplach2 2 years ago
THE BRITISH STATED VERY CLEARLY DURING THEIR OCCUPATION OF THE REGION IN THE FIRST WORLD WAR THAT THEY WERE GOING TO CREATE A JEWISH HOMELAND. (long before any dead people in Germany)
THE ABUSIVE LAWS AGAINST THE PALESTINIANS CONTINUE FROM THE RACIST COLONIALIST STRATEGIES OF THE BRITISH, THE STATE OF ISRAEL WAS PLANNED AS PART OF THE BRITISH / FRENCH /AMERICAN COLONIALIST PROJECT FOR THE CONTROL OF THE ENTIRE REGION. WHERE IS THE SO CALLED LIBERATION OF THE ARABS THAT WAS PROMISED?????
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Readf history Iraq, Syria, Jordan Egypt Lebanon are the result of Arab Liberation.
kreplach2 2 years ago
The country belongs to the original people who live there - that means THE LAND BELONGS TO THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE - IT DOES NOT BELONG TO SOME DRUNK RUSSIANS WHO DO NOT EVEN HAVE ANY POGROMS TO RUN AWAY FROM.
ALL THE CONCENTRATION CAMP SURVIVORS ARE DEAD A LONG TIME AGO. THE LAND DOES NOT BELONG TO A BUNCH OF WHITE CAUCASIAN CONVERT IMMIGRANTS.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The country belongs to the PEOPLE WHO BOUGHT LAND THERE AND DEFENDED IT. JEWS ASRE NOT RUSSIANS. JEWS COME FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD. YOU OBSESSION ON WHITENESS MAY INDICATE AN ARYAN WHITE SUPREMACIST ORIGIN FOR LILIAAAAAAA. Are you a white power dummy?
kreplach2 2 years ago
No - the people who bought land - bought 7% - you forget they then used this excuse to start an 'armed struggle including throwing bombs at people. You forget the majority of Jews in Israel are ex Russians paid to be there who are mostly ex -Chechens and Turks who converted in the first place. Actually, my blood is far more likely to be original Palestinian Phoenicain Hebrew myself, than any Chechen Jewish convert.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
There were no excuses. Are you a white power advocate? The majority of Jews were from Poland too. Read history.
Jews are not Chechens you dope
kreplach2 2 years ago
Apparently all the Khazars who are all the ones who got victimised in Eastern Europe in the first place were originally Chechens and Turks who converted to Judaism in order to be neutral in relation to the Christian and Islamic wars. They are more genetically related to the Chinese Turkish Muslim Uygurs than anyone else.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
14 messages in my inbox aint enough I see.
Khazars , you idio,t came way before the Chechens or the Turks, Again, READ HISTORY. What Christian Islamic WArs??? You take any blood samples of the Uygurs. Ask a Turk if hes a Uygur! Ha! Youre such a dope!
kreplach2 2 years ago
What do you mean to say I am a white power advocate from what I am saying? Being white means you live in the North pole and never go out. If you go to a sunny part of the planet. You get a suntan. It's a natural biological result of sunbathing.
White suprematism only works with White Russian convert Jews who think they are better than Arab Jews.
But, yes, they were originally Chechen Turks, who were nomads, that travelled to various parts of Eastern Europe, including Poland.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
It might be a waste of time answering your 14 messages as your a imbecile who assumes intelligence. Maybe youre a suntan power advicate HA! WHAT A MAROON!!! I see you acknowlegde what whit supremacistsa are Isee. You are defintely a Klangirl. I see that now. Are White Russians runnibf Israel?? S Are Sephardim slaves?? HA! HA! No you friggin idiot The Chechens arent Cossacks or Tartars or Khazars or Jews. READ FREAKING HISTORY!!!
kreplach2 2 years ago
You don't even know how to spell and you make the mistake that I must be American - maybe becos you think Americans are the only ones who write English. I stated before my ancestral roots are more likely to be from the ancient land of Canaan than yours. Regarding numbers of Russians - there are 1.5 million Russians and 0.5 million Californians now in the settlements in the occupied Palestinian territories all paid for by the Israeli state.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I always find those who are running out of material ALWAYS fall back on grammar punditry. Your no expert of grammar and spelling HA! YOUR ASSUMED ANCESTRAL ROOTS O White Power girl disguised bigot. The ruse of impartiality of yours worked for a while. But you gave it ALL AWAY with the WHITE JEWS QUOTE!! There are Jews from Ethopia, New York, Westerrn Europe, Eastern Europe, and India. Does that fit your stereotypes?
kreplach2 2 years ago
There are so many Russians now - that Putin himself has stated that Russia is in danger of de-population - so now he would like the women especially to go home and have children rather than sell their bodies overseas - You might not know it - but Israel is doing a very good job for the Russian Mafia pimps and their whores to provide a base to sell their services throughout the Middle East. Well done American brain-washed zionists for supporting Russian Mafia pimps and their whores.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Russians are empting into 13 mile wide Israel. Theyve moved to the USA, Europe, etc. Like a obediant good white supremacist w you MUST mention Russian prostitutes in Israel withoput mentioning far greater counts in Europe and America. You seem to be a agent/whore for Jew haters. Glad you revealed yourself.
kreplach2 2 years ago
A number of my best friends are Jewish, I celebrated Passover and Sukot with some of them this year. So I can't be classed as a Jew hater.
One of my best friends is related to Anne Frank, she's quite a famous Jewish person.
They don't need to go around making hateful statements about other people, just because of their roots. They also have Palestinian Muslim and Chrstian friends.. Just because you're Jewish it's not an excuse to be evil and kill people.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
So you say. It clashes with your classification of your ideals in RACE THEORY! Jewishness doesny give excuses in fact it takes them away
kreplach2 2 years ago
I'm not from the US - so I don't understand the concepts that you are talking about like they are 'assumptions' regarding race theory.
Your ideas, sound like you are projecting your own ideas onto me - when they don't make sense.
I don't follow any concept of racial supremacy.
I am more concerned with equality and fairness for all people.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
OK then look up white supremacists or KKK in Google. Do they resembe your opinions? You know like Whites, lacks, Aryans etc. If youre concerned with fairness why unfairly label white Askenazi Jews as all Israelis??
kreplach2 2 years ago
I'm not interested in KKK since I am aware that they are evil satanists and would rather not.
I am not anti- Jewish - I told you a million times.
I am pro-peace.
I am pro- understanding - I appreciate that you have been honest about certain things.
I would hope that Hamas would stop killing people - just the same that I would hope that any IDF or Jewish or settler people would also stop killing people.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Even if Israel is not 13 miles wide -
it is a small place, it is ridiculous to expect the entire world population of Jews to fit into one tiny small country.
It would be much better for Jews who have occupied to leave peacefully with the people of the land they have occupied, then they will have a better public image world wide, and they will have a much easier time throughout the entire world. Intelligent people who are also Jews also state this fact as obvious.
For example Illan Pappe.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Its not meant as a settlement place for all Jews. But all Jews can fit. Its not ridiulous.
It would be great if the settlers left central areas. But THAT IS NO GURANTEE OF AN EASIER TIME. Remember before there was an occupation there waere Arab attacks.
kreplach2 2 years ago
The British in the 20s said they were going to create a homeland for the Jews.
At the same time, they said they were going to liberate the Palestinians from the Ottomans. These 2 things contradict each other.
The first Palestinians accepted the first settlers who lived and worked with them peacefully.
It was only when the Irgun and Hagana started to arm themselves, and the British 'did nothing' - that it obviously created tension. The Irgun stated clearly they would take the land by force.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The British declared a homeland in 1917. Read history. They never said anything about Palestinian Arabs as there werent any. They did announce libertion for Arabs. And thus there was Jordan and Iraq. The Palestinians(called Arabs then) started attacking Jews in 1920, It continued in 1921,29, 36, 37, 38, 39, 46, 47, 48 R E A D H I S T O R Y
kreplach2 2 years ago
The original people were the same as the original Palestinians named by the Romans. They called 'themselves' Palestinians under the Ottoman occupation.
Re the Arabs - you have to consider that the first Jewish settlers were welcomed - it was only when the Irgun started the terrorist attacks against civilian populations, including other Jews, because they WANTED an armed struggle. There were already Jews living in the region, for centuries, and they all lived in peace.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
No I don't agree that all of the world's Jews can fit into one country - Israel is mostly desert.
Most settlers from the Northern hemisphere are not adapted to live in deserts.
The water consumption of the average Israeli is excessive. That's partly due to intensive agricultural projects that are extremely wasteful of water.
There is no reason to state that people from a worldwide religion should settle in one country. You couldn't expect that of any other religion. It is not realistic.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Not all Jews are going to Israel. Not all Arabs live in Arabia. Not all Irish live in Ireland
kreplach2 2 years ago
I agree, I think that it's important to acknowledge that different people have migrated and spread all over the planet, so therefore it would be better for people who have dispersed to generally live peacefully amongst their host communities.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I have no idea what you are talking about regarding white suprematism. Personally I think that sunbathing is beneficial since it means that it stimulates your body naturally to produce vitamin D which is healthy to protect the body from various illnesses, as long as it is done in moderation. From my objective obsevation I would consider that having a natural suntan would be more biologically more useful than being an albino which would cause you to be more likely to be subject to skin cancer.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Ha Ha!! pretending youre not a white power or the like is very fuuny. Your content reveals you. Dont play the "im impartial and a newbie" game. :D
kreplach2 2 years ago
Maroon is a colour - which is a kind of dark red colour similar to a shade also known as burgundy.
If you look at the history of the Khazars, it states that they were a bunch of Turkish nomads from Southern Russia who roamed in the region throughout what is now known as Georgia, Chechnya, Ukraine and Azerbayjan.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Ha you just want to answer. And say anything. Maroon is a variant of MORON.
Khazars came on the heels of the Hun invasion. From Central Asia along with the Magyars, Bulgars, Alans, etc They arrived IN the North Caucasus-Ukraine. They didnt roam, dimit, They set up a kingdom. Read the 13th tribe.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Exactly, the Khazars are converts who were originally part of the Mongolian hordes who practiced shamanism, and often killed off their own leaders.
The descendants of the Hebrews dispersed in the Middle East, and some converted over time.
Most of the original blood line are most likely Palestinian Bedouin. The original Filistines of ancient texts refer to Greek colonisers which became the Ptolomeic dynasty, who produced Cleopatra. The Romans called ALL the people they occupied PALESTINIANS.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The Khazars WERE NOT CHECHENS OR MONGOLS. They were a turkic tribe.
AGAIN WITH RACE BLOOF THEORY!!!
Original bloodlines do not determine your HIOME. Did they check YOUR bloodline where you live??
The Romans called Phillistine..Palestine. But That doesnt mean the Philiistines were Palestinian READ HISTORY. READ HERODOTUS! The Phillistines were Pegasian Greeks who settled in Gaza in 1300 BCE. THey were NOT the Greeks who set up the Ptolemaic dynasty in 320 BCE. READ READ READ READ
kreplach2 2 years ago
You can read on wikipedia that it says that the Khazars were related to other tribal groups in the region who instead converted to different religions. Originally they would all have been shamanistic belief systems.
I agree re the difference between the Phillistines as the Greeks settlers of Gaza and the region that the Romans then called Palestine, that would have included a wide group of people, including Hebrews, Phoenicians, Ptolomeic Greeks, and Aramaic speaking Nabateans.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I read 2 books on the Khazars.
There were no Phoenicians by tyhe time the Romans arrived. They even forgot what Phoenician meant. THATS DOCUMENTED
kreplach2 2 years ago
Actually - I think this has to be re-evaluated.
The fact is that the Canaanites/Phoenican/Hebrew history is blurred - because of the very fact that the Romans occupied - they re-nameed the entire region and called it 'Palestine' and they also took over the temple, and they also divided up the region and divided people up against themselves and they also re-wrote history to justify their own actions, in order to validate themselves throughout history.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I agree with your point.
I would suggest that it is better not to mix up nationality with religion, nor with blood lines.
These things are all separate.
Re the original Greek Filistines, I suggested that it is likely that the Ptolomeic dynasty would probably have followed the same migration, and that it was part of a trend over a number of centuries.
My own blood line is also probably originally from the Phoenician but I'm not going to start to worship Baal because of that fact.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Its nice to keep things separate but its not always possible. Reality isnt always compartmentalized. The Ptolemaics were Greeks who came with Alexander the Great..In no way the same route as the Greek Phillistines 1000 years before.
Bloodlines dont HAVE to follow religions. Usually dont.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Regarding whether or not the Mycanean Greeks had any relation to the Ptolomeic Greeks, it's difficult to say - but the important point - is the fact that the Palestinians named in the ancient texts who were Mycanean Greeks are NOT THE SAME as the Palestinians now.
The modern day Palestinians are most likely to by the direct descendants of the original Judeans, Israelites, Edomites, Samarians, Nabateans, Phoenicians, and Ptolomeic Greeks, who were occupied by the Romans.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Comment removed
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
White convert Khazar Jews is a white supremacist term
kreplach2 2 years ago
Fine.
I don't know these things, because I am not a white suprematist.
It doesn't bother me what colour people are. I go brown in the sun.
I don't particularly understand your tendency to accuse people of being white suprematists.
All I know is that in Israel these days, my Jewish Israeli friends have told me that the Russians are the ones who seem to act like they own the place because of their colour.
Also, it would help to understand you more if you could spell.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
White Supremacism doesnt depend on your skin. It depends on your brain. Or lack of one. When I see statements all concerned about HOW WHITE people are I KNOW its a goofball klanperson nearby.
Russians arent the most polite. They are onbnoxious in NY. But they have the RIGHT TO LIVE WHEREVER THEY SET UP HOMES. legally!
Ease up on the grammar punditry.
kreplach2 2 years ago
My point I was making, is that there is a large majority of Russians who are taking advantage of the Israeli policy of Allia, so now there are 1.5 million Russians who have taken up residency in Israel.
Each person who does allia is paid $25,000 to do that.
That means they are paid to colonise the region, at the expense of the indigenous people, who do not get any compensation for their land that has been taken.
That is a deliberate policy that goes against the indigenous people.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Russians on The West Bank might be. Too bad the Arabs cant get together for compensation through negotiation
kreplach2 2 years ago
PS - I don't know about Klanspeople.
Please note - I've said it before - I don't subscribe to any kind of racism against Jewish people, or any other semitic people. I think white suprematists should go and spend a long time in a desert country, and then they will also go brown themselves. In Italy, everyone is white in the winter, and black as moors in the summer, so you don't get the same kind of white racism as you do in English speaking countries. It doesn't make sense.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
actually- I will just state - that if any white person does want to go and spend time in a desert - I would suggest that they do so by paying for the experience to the indigenous population.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Israeis often visit bedouins. Like tourists hire Navajhos.
kreplach2 2 years ago
I know that Israelis often have positive relations with Bedouins - it would be nice if the Israelis could also have positive relationships with the Palestinians who are probably their ancestors - since the modern day Palestinians are not the same as the Greeks of several thousands of years ago, which I am glad you agree with.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Thats not what I hear from Italians. Northern Italians look down on Southern Italians who look down on Sicilians.
kreplach2 2 years ago
You might not realise that the original Etruscans who came BEFORE the Romans were most probably a Phoenician/Canaanite colony. Their alphabet influenced the development of the Latin alphabet. Their language was most likely Semitic. Blood tests have shown some descendants in Etruscan regions to be totally different genetically to other Italians. The first capital of Italy pre-Romans was Fiesole in Tuscany, near to where Florence is now. Romanised history denies this pretty much completely.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
By the way - when I said that the language of the Etruscans was likely to be Semitic, that meant that it is most likely to have been Phoenician. In my understanding, the Egyptian, Hebrew, and Phoenicians were all pretty much inter-connected at the time anyway. I am just saying that to clarify the fact that Semitic is not just Hebrew, I mean it in the sense that it was probably some other early Semitic language maybe related to Phoenician or Aramaic. I don't know. I wasn't there.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I think there's a variety of different interpretations of the reality of the 'mess' that is Israel/occupied Palestine. The basic fact is that Israel was occupied and taken over first by the British and then handed over to the Hagana/Zionists to control. Basically it would have been a lot easier if they let the indigenous population remain and then there would have been no problem. whoever's idea it was to dislocate 82% of the population from 78% of their own land, was pretty stupid.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The British hardly handed Israel over to the Zionists. The British were engaged in suppressing a revolts by the Arabs and the Jews. They slightly favored the arabs. Some Brits loved that Lawrence of arabia crap. And others wre Jew Haters as taught in their churches. It was the Arabs idea to relocate. They believed false rumors by Arab Radio and followed orders of the 5Arab.Armies that ivaded the area for a second holocaust.
kreplach2 2 years ago
As mentioned above, even on wikipedia it states that the British had the intention of supporting a Jewish state from 1922, so therefore they did not favour the Arabs, they wanted to create a state for the Jewish people from 1922. That's why the Arabs revolted, because it was their country and they were not represented in the decision making process, when they were supposed to have been 'liberated'.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
They supported the Arabs by taking Eastern Palestine from the Mandate and creating Jordan. The Arabs revolted at the mere presence of Jews. The Jews were willing to have a mixed ethnic state.
kreplach2 2 years ago
They already had Jews living among them - the Middle East in general was ALWAYS a refuge to the Jewish people PRIOR to the creation of the state of Israel. There was no need for conflict. Turkey for example (98% Muslim majority) helped Jews to flee from Greece during WW2. Turkey almost ALWAYS helped Jews flee from pogroms or persecution in Europe or Russia.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Did I not tell you about dhimmi? How come you missed it. There is much on the internet about it.
PRIOR to the creaion of Israel the Muslims Arabs had supremacy or mastery over all other religions.
This caste system was called dhimmi. Read about it. That is the germination of this CONFLICT.
Turkey was not the oppressor of Jews. The ARABS WERE IN THEIR INSISTENCE OF DOMINATION CALLED DHIMMI!!!
kreplach2 2 years ago
About your insistence of the matter of the Dhimmi - I don't know how you can be discussing this matter - I think that it is a historical matter that the original land laws of the Ottomans and land rights of the original inhabitants under the historical system have been totally disregarded. I think that you are confusing 'land laws' and religion.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
We aint talking about Ottoman rules, Islamic rules here. The Ottomans were far more tolerant than the Arabs
kreplach2 2 years ago
You are mixing everything up.
The Palestinians along with a wide range of other 'people' were occupied by the Ottomans. The British took over.
The Palestinians did not get a chance to 'rule' even though the British had stated that they would be liberated when the Ottomans' were defeated..
Once the 'armed' Hagana army decided to take over and 'fight for their right for Israel' - then the British washed their hands of the whole situation. When did the Palestinians ever get to rule??
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Your statements contradict themselves.
If there was no 'threat' for the Arabs - then why did the civilian population leave?
Because they were being BOMBED BY AEROPLANES, so they were scared for their LIVES.
Where did the information from the radio reports come from??
Where did the 100,000 armed Hagana soldiers that stormed the country come from that were shooting at anyone they found alive?
If the 'British' were in control, how on EARTH could this be allowed, if they favoured the Arabs???
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Perceived threats are as good as threats. Read psychology. Israel has what 3 planes in 1948??? Read history. The information came from eyewitnesses and then was exaggerated to cause Arab uproar. Instead it caused Arab flight.
100,000??? That's more than D-Day. Are you serious??? No the British didnt mount the largest amphibious landing of Jews in history LOL
kreplach2 2 years ago
The IRGUN WERE THROWING BOMBS AT PEOPLE AND SUPPORTING an ARMED STRUGGLE AGAINST THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE AS RACIST WHITE NORTHERN CAUCASIAN RACIST CONVERT ZIONISTS ALREADY FOR MORE THAN 20 YEAR BEFORE 1948.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Your statements abotu the Arab armies defending their OWN TERRITORIES FROM FOREIGN INVADERS is NOT THE SAME AS THE HOLOCAUST.
GET REAL.
it WAS THE GERMANS AND RUSSIANS WHO ROUNDED UP THE JEWISH PEOPLE. They are already paying compensation.
100 of million of other people ALSO DIED IN WW2 - NOT JUST JEWISH PEOPLE.
It's OVER.
The Germans are already paying off the Jewish people, - the pogroms are OVER.
What is your problem???????
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
What statements???? Are you drunk?
Yes I know about the 5 million Non-Jews in addition to the 6 million Jews. DO YOU KNOW??? Whats your problem aside from extreme bias and ignorance???
kreplach2 2 years ago
Kreplach - I am bored of your zionist *****
Everybody on the entire planet knows there was NO JUSTIFICATION FOR THE ZIONIST RACIST BULLSHIT FROM A BUNCH OF EX RUSSIAN NAZIS JEWS TO GO AND INVADE SOMEONE ELSE'S COUNTRY.
IF YOU CAUSE CONFLICT IN THE ENTIRE PLANET - THEN IT IS NO WONDER EVERYONE HATES ISRAEL.
EVEN MY JEWISH FRIENDS HATE ISRAEL AND HATE STUPID LIAR BULLSHIT ZIONIST DEFENDERS.
EVERYONE IS FED UP OF THE ZIONIST BULLSHIT.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Youre bored cause you cannot find a crack in my arguements. You cant cause you know very minimal HISTORY!!! Who is this mythical "everybody"??
Your tantrum indicate you are the proponent of BULLSHIT and you cant defend YOUR BS!!!
kreplach2 2 years ago
YOu don't even have an argument?? HOW CAN YOU ARGUE WITH A NUTCASE WHO SAYS 'I AM SCARED OF THE ARABS WHO ARE GOING TO THROW ME INTO THE SEA' WHEN EVERYONE KNOWS THAT ISRAEL is the one with the NUCLEAR BOMBS???
Hamas can't even fire their own rockets further than their own land. Most of their rockets hit their own farmland that they are not allowed to cultivate. So much for the 'dhimmi state'.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
NUTCASE?? HA! When Israel acknowledged the bomb to Nixon in 1973 and the Arabs of course, the effort to drive the JEWS into the Sea ended on the part of states. Now its Hamas and Fatahs mission. You dont expect Israel to nuke Gaza City or Jenin. Hint: Fallout.
Hamas hits enough targets to make THEIR POINT. Stop dancing around the truth, Liz
kreplach2 2 years ago
Whenever you look at evidence of Hamas hitting Israel buildings, they show very small holes which are not very substantial. The reaction against the entire civilian people of Gaza affecting thousands is called 'a disproportionate response'. it is not called 'preventing terrorism' - If you want to prevent military agression - you don't bomb people - you go into the areas, and you arrest people and put them into prison then you have a military curfew. They didn't do that.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Kreplach - I would just point out to you - that I know enough Arabs or Iranians who are not impressed with the running of Iran.
At the same time, originally Israel and Iran had a good relationship particularly with the building of the first Israeli / Iranian pipeline designed to pipe oil via Eilat to Europe.
Personally I don't know why Israeli leaders are continuing to aggravate their neighbours who they originally had made deals with, when they are in their territories.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Aggravating the Arabs and Aryans err Irananians is Israel existing.
kreplach2 2 years ago
That's not true about Iranianianians.
The first oil pipeline in Eilat was built as part of a friendly agreement between Israel and Iran.
Iran has the largest population of Jews outside of Israel in all of the Middle East.
If people care about 'Jewish communities' it would probably be a good idea to be nice to Iran - so that they continue to be nice to their Jewish citizens who have full rights, and who are represented in parliament.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Its wasnt Israel who started the threaten Israel with destruction and try to build atmic bombsd cycle! The Iranians are outMusliming the Arabs since 1983.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Kerplach - you also have to remember that pre the British take over - the land was governed by the Ottomans, so therefore the land laws were under Islamic land law legislation - which is comparable to traditional nation state laws of ownership separate to the religious issue of what kind of God you believe in - it's not the same as 'believing in a God who gave some kind of 'ancestral claim' based on reading a book that was based on a collection of stories written thousands of years ago.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The Zionist clsim IS NOT BASED ON THE TORAH. The Zionist claim is based on land bought by Jews and defended by Jews.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Only 7% of the land was bought by the first Zionists. The rest was taken by force. The indigenous population left because the Hagana armed soldiers were shooting women and children. The British basically washed their hands of the issue. The creation of Israel was planned pre WW1. There was some division amongst the British pre Balfour agreement, but it was basically permitted at the expense of the indigenous population like it or not.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The rest was abandoned by the Arabs Read history. Watch You Tube videos on this. There is little documentation on your shooting myths. The creation Of Israel was planned when the Arabs rejected 181.Before that the haven was created NOT the state. READ!!
kreplach2 2 years ago
Kerplach - there's no need to be rude. You have to admit - anything from a pro-Zionist perspective is going to be self-defensive.
Still, you can read about the Hagana and how they evolved into the IDF. Stuff I found said they developed from security guards for the early settlements who trained the the early settlers til there were 100,000, then they the rest of the territory by force.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Sorry I got rude.
I so get self defensive from screwballs in You tube.
I agre with this.
kreplach2 2 years ago
the first Zionists bought land - once they had formed into the Hagana and had bought guns to shoot people with - they didn't bother with buying land any more. That policy of just taking what they want at gun point still remains. That's not particularly Jewish in the normal conventional meaning of the word - normally also it's not civilised behaviour either.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
There was no taking of land while the Brits were in charge. When the war begain everybody took land both ways But Arabs mostlt left.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Even if you read the details about the British Mandate of Palestine on wikipedia- it states that the British wanted to install a Jewish state from 1922, which was when the Ottomans surrendered. I also read somewhere else that the British was bombing people in the 20s and 30s to control people throughout the Middle East, including Palestine.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Homeland not state. Homeland was a haven. British bombing MidEast??
kreplach2 2 years ago
I agree with you - but I also think that like you said - Israelis and jewish people are brain washed so much that unless they are educated people - then they don't realise it themselves. You also have to consider that they are just used as part of a big 'game' to get into the middle east by the west - as an excuse to make problems with all the muslims so that they can use that as an excuse to get at the oil. Even palestinians themselves told me - osama bin laden was a big lie 4 years ago.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I belive you maybe the indoctrinated brainwashed one here, This "used" is just an excuse to be a paranoid fantasy conspiracy theorist.
SURPRISE!! There is no petroleum in Israel Little Near Israel. Try thinking it will help you.
What about Ossama was a lit to Palestinins they certainly loved his 911 performance.
kreplach2 2 years ago
You are missing the point.
Israel is the only state with undeclared nuclear weapons in the region. If the poor Jewish concentration camp survivors are just poor suffering people under some mean Arabs, then how did that happen?
From a realistic objective point of view, I would see that Israel is the major military power in the region, that uses military action against the Arabs almost constantly to 'control' the entire wider region, which just happens 'by coincedence' to be where the oil is.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Easy. Read history. France owed Israel. They gave Israerl fissionable material. Read history.
kreplach2 2 years ago
?? that's a new one. please stop saying things like 'read history' - history has often been described as 'changed by the political forces of the time to suit the end of those who contracted the writer in the first place'.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
You dont seem to know elementary history. You need to know that to write on ploitical issues. Your knowledge portfolio is very permeable. You really cannot excuse yourself away from knowing basic facts.
kreplach2 2 years ago
I think that most of the residents of New York particularly the fire fighters who were gagged are aware that there were controlled demolition explosions that had been planted in the building, prior to any aeroplanes hitting them. Osama was in hospital having kidney dialysis at the time in Dubai. He was not in Iraq, and he was not in Afghanistan either.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Most NYers think something was fishy on 911 as do I. But saying the speculation of controlled demolitions is a fact id cart before the horse time.
kreplach2 2 years ago
I don't see why you would say that. There are plenty of videos that show that the speed of the fall of the 3 buildings were the same as free fall. That is not a collapse caused by damage to the structure. There are also videos of the architects stating that they designed the buildings to withstand earthquakes, which is standard. The buildings had steel support structures which firemen have described as having been melted, and puliverised at temperatures far hotter than that caused by aeroplanes
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
You are not an expert on demolitions. Neither am I.Hear one side without the other is prejudice in action. It was jet fuel that ignites not just the airplanes.
911 doesnt add up so there needs to be a rehauled investigation. Premature conclusions are a waste of time.
kreplach2 2 years ago
Comment removed
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Kobi - thanks for your reply.
As someone else pointed out above - the Jews always lived in peace in the Arab world, before the state of Israel was created and many jews were in fact helped by Muslim majority Turkey to flee - when Jews were targetted in Europe.
The original Palestinians included Jews who objected to the state of Israel alongside their Palestinian Christian and Muslim neighbours. Israel was not created by the democratic choice of the actual inhabitants of the land.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Amazing and very knowlegeable speaker, his book "the ethnic cleansing of palestine" is very accurate and informative.
hanysal 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Israelis were European but not Communistic. There was never a Palestinian geocide. They have Hoklocaust envy.
kreplach2 3 years ago
Expelling the Palestinians was not an otpion. Giving them an Israeli citizenship was also not an option. The only remaining option was to create a structure enabling Israel to control them. An 'open prison'. This is understandable, considering the circumstances at that time. After all, they were the ones who refused a two-state solution. The real crime was to build settlements on that land.
warmperson2007 3 years ago
A WHITE NELSON MANDELA IN THE MAKING!
tuberoller7 3 years ago
And the zionists tried to drag the US in it, with it's attack on the USS Liberty. Attempt of a false-flag attack. The british orginally offered this land to the Rothschilds in its Balfour declaration. The league of nations then, and the UN now continue this mandate.
RenneDanjoule 3 years ago
Why have all the survivors of the USS Liberty not condemned IsraeL? Because it was an accident.
kreplach2 3 years ago
One day after the State of Israel declared itself as an independent nation (May 14, 1948), Lebanese, Syrian, Iraqi, Egyptian, and Transjordanian troops, supported by Saudi and Yemenite troops, attacked the nascent Jewish state, triggering the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. On that day, Azzam Pasha (Secretary-General of the Arab League) announced:
"
This will be a war of extermination and a momentous massacre which will be spoken of like the Mongolian massacres and the Crusades".[6]
kreplach2 3 years ago
did u forget the fact that the total of these above mentined armies were 24.000 soldiers and the israeli army was 90.000 Wel equipped, with airplanes(as they bombes akka later)have u forgot the biggest of the armies was the Jor. army lead by the br. Glob Pasha and 47 other british officers whome already orchestrated the attack on the last meeting with the haganna on may 2.- The only massacres happened in Palestine were committed by israeli zionist during the clensing of palestine in 48.
RaedDK 3 years ago
You forget the Jews were a rag tag army with scrapd of weapons well trained to a degree mostly Holocaust survivors with out much arms. Your figures are in error too. The only massare was possibly Deir Yassin although thats looking like another battle blamed on the Jewish radicals.
kreplach2 3 years ago
That's complete rubbish. The British army handed over the entire British military arsenal, including aeroplanes to a 'newly formed' Israeli government. How did that happen? This covert hand-over of power has never been openly discussed. There was also obvious Zionist 'training' and brain washing already from pre-1st world war. This 'also' has never been openly discussed.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
I'm refering to kreplach's comment that the Israeli army was a rag tag army of people who had come out of concentration camps. The British themselves were famously already attacked when they first occupyied Palestine by a trained Zionist terrorist organisation who bombed them in the King David Hotel, where the British were stationed in Jerusalem, during the 2nd world war, before the survivors were released at the 'end' of the war.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
The majority of contemporary Zionists are actually from the U S of A and are brain washed in religious schools in the U S of A. Christian Presbyterians in the U S of A have also been brain washed since pre 1st world war, also, to 'believe' and 'support the state of Israel by 'the new revised presbyterian bible that was written turn of 20th century. Pre 1st world war.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
What is the brainwashing you write about? How does this process work?
kreplach2 2 years ago
So its only the Presbyterians?
kreplach2 2 years ago
it's called 'alliance of interested parties' who will mutually benefit from profitting from conflict. the masses are brain washed including 'jewish people' who support zionism. they are used also. why do you think 'kibbutzes' don't pay people - and it's all happy clappy dancing in the name of religion - meanwhile the kids are separated from their families to make them all retarded and it's all on palestinian occupied land.
it is 'not' the same as international laws on how to run a country.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Do the masses really concern themselves with Jews/ Not really. Its only the fringe loonies including Jew haters such as yourself. Look up socialism. already. Start an education instead of an assume-ication.
kreplach2 2 years ago
After all your ranting,U expressly and intentionally skip the fact that in June 1967 Jordan,Egypt and Syria waged an annihilation war against Israel,which they have lost!U,like this Pappe quack ,propose that Israel's actions were either cacodemonia and vagary or an evil master plan.Isn't this kind of war against Israel,like the war in 1948, an ethnic cleansing?Do U reserve this "book keeping" on Israel?
kobi1974 2 years ago
Kobi - was that addressed to me?
Normally when you talk about conflict situations you need to recognise the fact that there are 2 sides. I think that the 100,000 trained Zionists who waged the first 'war' against the indigenous population of Palestine were also intent on ethnic cleansing as well surely, don't you think?
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Do U practice what U preach?U haven't found my arggument wrong so I'll asume U think I'm right.I'd really like to read your perception on the issue.2 facts for U.1.Israel,since it's creation,never,ever,initiated a war on it's adjacent neighbors,never.2.The real settlers here are the Arabs,U see,Arabs come from the Arabian Peninsula,what claims do they have on this land?
Antisemitisim today is replacing the word Jew with Zionist and get away with it because it makes U sound so liberal!
kobi1974 2 years ago
Comment removed
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Kobi -
The 'facts' are easy to manipulate.
Pre British occupation.
There was no problem in Palestine between people of different religions, Muslims and Jews and Christians got along fine.
The first Zionists started to appear from Europe - 'before WW1' then all the troubles started.
The Hagana trained up to 100,000 people so there 'was' a war against the Arabs.
Even Israeli scientists state that the Palestinians and Bedouin are the original people of the land, through DNA tests.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
Also Kobi -
You can't accuse me of being a Jew hater - I was invited to a Jewish Sukot recently and was awarded a Lulav which I now have over my door. I am aware that the original Jewish people practiced their religion in tents, and didn't need to invade other countries in order to prove themselves.
The Nuterei Karta Jews - state quite clearly that ZIonists are not the same as 'Jews', they state clearly that Zionists are idol worshipping secularists.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago
So do DNA tests of jews!U R talking about truth that can be manipulated,facts are very firm!In June 1967 Jordan,Egypt and Syria commenced an annihilation war against Israel,is waht I'm saying "manipulated"?The quack Pappe opens his speech from 19/6/1967 why doesn't he start with what brought Israel to these places.That's nescient education that brings people like U to detest Israel!
The Hagana was formed after the 1929 Hebron massacre,are U familiar with this event,I'm probebly manipulating!
kobi1974 2 years ago
Kobi - Israel was created by a foreign occupying force which trained people to target and assassinate the indigenous population. That also has nothing to do with Judaism according the Neturei Karta Orthodox Jews who state that Jews are supposed to live in peace under the laws of the land that they live in. Israeli leaders today don't even follow their own laws! Recent supreme court rulings have been brushed aside by Israeli political leaders stating that they are 'merely reccomendations'.
liliaaaaaaaa 2 years ago