This sort of "academic" view of human suffering allows people to ignore said suffering. It's what's driving Westerners to blindly, cheerfully support the genocide going on in the Middle East by the West, and what has caused environmentalists to be so impotent that they can no longer influence public opinion or cause the public to take global warming (which has affected where I live beyond what I ever expected) seriously.
And the feminists' complete indifference to male suffering exposes the movement as a hate movement instead of a valid ideology. When you say things like "The reason 80+% of suicides are male..." that attempt to justify existing inequalities, you're not only supporting these inequalities; you're reducing an extraordinarily painful human problem to cold, dead statistics and logic so you can further dehumanize what you hate.
I understand your anger at the proliferation of Women's Studies. I personally think there should be no "Studies" program that focuses on a single gender or race. No Black Studies, no Women's Studies, no Men's Studies, nothing. Such "programs" only foster self-absorption and narcissism in the particular race or gender being studied, and foster hatred and intolerance of everyone else.
Google: Martha Laura Granados Immigration Prostitute
The VAWA Immigration Loop-hole:
If you are a woman, pretend to be in love with a US citizen / Legal Resident, deceive him to marry you. As soon as you got the marriage certificate dial 211 and falsely accuse him of Domestic Violence and Rape and move to a VAWA shelter.
You will be on a fast-track for a Green-Card and US citizenship - all expenses paid for by the US tax payer and as a bonus you will be getting full social benefits.
I like that you did. It's always interesting when men are expected to provide imperical evidence, their sources, and methodologies.
But if you ask the same of women, specifically feminists, they flip out and either try to shame the person or declare it a non-issue or better yet, the question isn't worth answering.
The scientific community works from a basis of facts & recurring observations allowing for challenge and change.
The feministific community runs on the basis of emotion and does not.
@factory2590 Having a penis,male's would respected me.In my job I would get more money,without sexual harassment.I could live my life the way I want.Men have it all so easy,so yeah I'd rather be a male then a female.
@factory2590 Women don't live in the reality you seem to perceive either. People of the same gender can have very different lives, and we all seem to only see the good side of others and the bad side of ours, that's how humans think. There's a lot of benefits both to being a man and woman, what you rather be depends on who you want to be as a person.
@factory2590 You asked me a long time ago why I idenfity myself with this seemingly evil (sole purpose is to oppress men) group, called the feminists. So here's the story: I'm sorta a tom boy, so naturally I spent my life wondering what it'll be like if I was actually a guy so I'll fit in more. Even though life isn't ideal, I'm still fine, cuz society today is fine with tom boys, it's socially acceptable. But that's b/c of feminists, if they didn't fight for it I would be screwed right now.
@factory2590 anyways, pretty much all the stuff I wrote comes down to 2 points:
1. Concerning you and ashatbulaparanormal's arguements on whether it's better to be male or female, it depends on your situation, and who you want to be. We always things the grass it's greener on the other side. Not saying you're supposed to take whatever you get if you don't think it's right. Fighting for your rights is fine, just don't be ignorant to others.
@factory2590 2. About your extreme hate about the feminists. They did a lot of good for women, u seem to be mad that they didn't protect men's rights as well. But this is a women's rights group, not equality police, you can't expect them to do that. Any rights group normally just fight for their own rights blindly, it's not a sign of evil, just ignorance (which is still bad). Of course some crap did come out of that ignorance. I admire a lot of what feminists have done, but not those things.
@FlameltaSK0 "They did a lot of good for women, u seem to be mad that they didn't protect men's rights as well. But this is a women's rights group, not equality police, you can't expect them to do that."
They commonly defend themselves by saying they're 'about equality', and regularly say they are 'for men'. They also say MRAs are unneccessary because Feminists look out for men too (not so much anymore though).
This is a common Feminist defense, I only point out the lie.
@factory2590 if that's a common defense then I'm sorry I never heard about it. The word feminism means women's rights. I think when they said equality, they meant equality to men in areas where women is lacking, like equal pay. They're working on getting equal pay because men currently have more compensation, but if one day men has less compensation, I won't expect them to say anything then. I won't expect you to address women's pay equality issue either, it's not your job.
@factory2590 Sorry I have no idea what you're talking about. I didn't know women are making more than men in major urban US centers, where did you get that from? Sorry I didn't really get that at all.
@factory2590 Cool, do you have a link? I googled time magazine, but can't find the article. I even searched women on times website, though I don't think you'll like the result of the search ^^;. I don't read too much magazines at all, so a little help here?
@FlameltaSK0 Go to a newsstand, pay the man a few bucks, and take your magazine home. Failing that, type some phrases into google. I'm not here to do your research for you.
@factory2590 are you actually that stubborn that you refuse to send me a link that you can just copy and paste? I might be mistaken, but I always thought that I should be able to obtain information from you on this topic, since your goal should be to educate the world on men's issues? The world includes more than people that'll automatically agree with you, and you need to have some composure when people do disagree with you.
@factory2590 as for this link, I'm still very interested in it. If you have the time to think of another insult, you can easily copy and paste it. I even did my due diligence and tried to search it up on time magazine's website, and couldn't find it. I don't believe asking you to send me the link is an unreasonable request. So, factory2590, can you please give me the link to the article you referred to previously? Thank you :)
@factory2590 And lastly, sorry for spamming up the comments section like this, I don't know why I'm so wordy... need to work on that...
I know this last comment doesn't help the spam, but I just want a proper conclusion. I don't dislike what you're doing at all, just trying to kill some ignorance coming from a lot of people (not just you). I don't mind if you correct me when I'm wrong, but don't be ignorant (I'm using this word a lot today) about it.
@FlameltaSK0 I still think you have absolutely NO idea what Feminism is about, or what it does. I also think you have ZERO appreciation for how important these issues are to men.
@factory2590 Maybe I don't, but that just means that feminism might not be what you think. You pointed at every bad point, put it together, and say that every feminist stands for that. That's not true, like I said I won't think you're a murderer if some MRA killed women out of hate.
In terms of appreciation, I personally think I appreciate what's fair, I just don't agree with you on certain definitions. You have to be more specific.
@FlameltaSK0 When the vast majority of a group believe certain things, then act on those certain commonalities in various anti-male ways, it's silly to insist I expend my energy on all those small infractions.
Strike at the root of a problem, and you kill all the others as well.
Feminism is the root.
I don't give a flying fuck if this hurts your feelings. It's still true.
@factory2590 lol, dw my feelings aren't hurt that easily :P
The disagreement is that I don't think the vast majority of feminists are anti-male at all. We have very different views of feminism, but if these messages haven't reached me, someone who associates myself with feminism, is the anti-male message really that strong? I'm pretty sure some women with male issues used feminism as a tool to get what they want, but in terms of core values, I don't think "screw men" is one of them.
@FlameltaSK0 You 'haven't heard' of one single thing that I have brought up...ever. It's like you think men live in a Fantasy Dreamworld...or you're NEVER paying attention, and dismissing what's brought to your attention...
@factory2590 I never said men live in fantasy dreamworld. I heard that men loses most of the time in divorce court, have child support put on them. You mentioned that men are sometimes stuck with a child they don't want... people tend to think they're most likely to commit a crime... I never dismissed any of that, I don't know where you're getting all of that.
No one ever said it was your fault. You have new information all the time, and of course I don't follow as much as you do.
@factory2590 ok, another question regarding "Strike at the root of a problem, and you kill all the others as well." If feminism were to officially disband right now, do you think anything will change? No, it'll just come back with a new name. Men haters will still hate and those who wants to fight for women's rights would still do so, it may slow the organization of these movements a bit, but it'll come back. Fight for your own rights, not the destruction of feminism (which btw is very vague).
@FlameltaSK0 Of course it would...until people have all the ways Feminism has been manipulating them into hurting men and society explained to them. The more they realize the injustices perpetrated, and the onion-thin arguments used to 'justify' this behaviour, feminists will pay.
@factory2590 "until people have all the ways Feminism has been manipulating them into hurting men and society explained to them" 1 problem, you're not very good at explaining things to people, b/c when people don't agree, you say "I don't need you to agree with me, fuck off" :)
Also, the whole "feminists will pay" thing, does that sound realistic? Pay how? Criminal court? Civil court? Who will be prosecuted? Under what laws? Do you have a realistic vision?
@ashatbulaparanormal I agree all those points are reality for a lot of women out there and that sucks, but just like what I've been saying to all the guys here, don't be too one sided. Men have their own problems as well and it's not good to turn a blind eye to that. factory is a bit extreme in some areas but he does have good points. How you're treated depends on the men/women that has power around you, if they're sexist jerks then you're gonna be screwed no matter who you are.
@ashatbulaparanormal yeah I totally understand. I feel like that a lot of times too, I don't want to go into specific reasons, but yeah, there's a lot of advantages to being a guy. And guys, this is a prime example of why a lot of women will not listen to your arguements even if they're good points, it's cuz women have their own issues and you're just ranting on how it sucks to be men w/o realizing that women has A LOT of crap to deal with as well. Just consider all sides before talking.
@FlameltaSK0 *continue from above* We don't respond well to selfish people, and that's probably where a lot of your passion comes from. Feminists have probably done things in the past that is selfish, they rant about their own equality issues without giving a second thought to what's happening to men, so I do understand that. But what you're doing is very similar, your response to ashatbulaparanormal was that you didn't care what problems she had, you have problems, and that's all that matters.
@FlameltaSK0 I told her I was advocating for MY concerns, not hers. Her position is that if I don't advocate her position AS WELL AS MINE, that I'm sexist...
@factory2590 "I told her I was advocating for MY concerns, not hers. Her position is that if I don't advocate her position AS WELL AS MINE, that I'm sexist..." But your position seems to be that if feminists don't advocate your position as well as men's they're sexist, I've been telling you this whole time that they don't have to advocate men's concerns just like you don't have to advocate women's concerns. You're contradicting yourself here.
@FlameltaSK0 I'm not saying that's wrong, but people react very negatively to that kind of behavior. Although what you're doing is very typical of activist groups, including feminists and racism activist groups, so maybe I shouldn't condemn you for it. You're still just a guy fighting for his rights, which is fine. What sets me off is the aggressiveness and blindness you do it with, I mean you twisted my quote just to make a point. You're so black and white, and NOTHING is black and white.
@FlameltaSK0 You haven't heard the half of it then. Because if I'm ever in the position to do so, I plan on rooting out Feminists wherever I can, and bringing them to justice.
Prosecution of Family Court functionaries for Human Rights violations? You bet your ass! Loss of job and pension for avowed bereaucratic Feminists? Gleefully! Removal of credentials for Academics deliberately lying to further a PC agenda? With Pleasure!
@factory2590 Actually I'm interested, can you explain each of those "crimes" in detail? I actually want to see if I can match it to any section of the criminal code or civil law. If it does then you actually have a case. I don't really understand the last 2, but "Prosecution of Family Court functionaries for Human Rights violations"... I can't really think of a law/tort that it violates... I guess the closest one is obstruction of justice or something... but lobbying does not fit that.
@factory2590 I'm sorry, but I'm not exactly in this field doing this kind of research, you are. Your goal, if I'm not wrong, is to educate others about this, but at this point you just seem to want to find more people that's already convinced of this and feel good. This isn't gonna grow your cause, and since most people here is just online to vent steam, your forces aren't organized. Anytime others have a disagreement with you, you can't seem to take it or have an open and polite debate.
How about talking about sex-based inequities in American social security payments and Medicare ? Women per year earn about 80% of the average male income, not counting the number of years when women are out of the work force for child-bearing. Due to difference in life spans, women also draw more Social Security benefits. So, they contribute less to SS yet draw 50% more.
ha ha interesting point, but this is just sorta... random, don't you think? social benefits are meant to help out those that are not so rich themselves, it takes from the rich and gives it to the poor. Of course those that earn less would get the most benefits. It annoys everyone that earns a decent income. I'm pretty sure that when the government set this up they weren't trying to make sure women will be favoured, it's just the way it worked out.
Well. men we need to get our shit together! We are the underdogs now! WE can stand up and be counted. Very very soon, if we don't act, we have any rights at all. We will have to take back our rights by force of arms and that will not be pretty. We will have to destroy the corrupt system to save our country and will have to put a lot of the selfish bitches and the government thugs who back them in the ground, like I said it will not be pretty!
Here's the problem. You're conflating abuses of the system with the system itself. I don't support using the system to impugn someone else, though relationships can often be tumultuous and leave a lot of baggage for both camps to sort through -- it does happen. Also, you miss my meaning when I say "run and get away with it" -- I meant that it is some ways socially acceptable behavior for men. And women, who often stand more to loose in those sorts of situations, deserve compensation.
Really? Ever hear the phrase "deadbeat Dads"? Ever wonder how many of those men wanted nothing to do with a child, but were forced into being a parent anyway?
You honestly believe this ISN'T a result of Feminism?
Of course not...feminism is nothing but goodness and light....right?
It's FAR more socially acceptable for a woman to have an abortion than for a man to "run away".
And you can't "conflate" in situations where the system was set up the way it is specifically to allow "abuse".
To the deadbeat dad thing, it's wrong, but I don't think it's the fault of feminism. Think about it, even before feminism existed, is it socially acceptable for a father to not care for his child?
Yes abortion would also be not socially acceptable, and that might be due to feminism. Feminism merely helped women's rights and did nothing for men's rights. They didn't want to set it up so that women could "trap" a man with a child. You can't put all the blame on feminism.
You don't think ANYTHING is the fault of Feminism. You're a feminist apologist, and you will do anything you can to defend the ideology. And that's ALL you care about.
It's patently obvious.
The more of you that do this bullshit, and the less of you that actually do something to help men THE WAY MEN WANT TO BE HELPED, the faster your sick, man-hating religion will be ground into dust under the heels of all the men you dismiss.
(Middle Aged Misogynist) *spouts a bunch of nonsense and uneducated reasons why women are doing so much better than men*
(Feminist) OK, prove it. *folds arms*
(Middle Aged Misogynist) Um... er... *scratches his head* uhh.. wait, u know wut, fuk u! i don't need logic to prov anything u do the wurk for me because after all u gotta prove MY own argument! take that stupid femininsistss u need logic and reason to answer shit but i dont cuz im a man... and ur not mai friend... yah!
Yup, and thank you for proving my above quote! ^___^
*bows* Thank you, thank you. And for my next trick...
But seriously, calm yourself down. I didn't say anything about the MSM, did I? Did I say male issues worthless, or that we don't need to take a look at men's problems or concerns in society? C'mon dude, give it up. Feminists aren't out to destroy you. If anything, they're trying to help you. Why don't you LISTEN to the arguments instead of running for the treehouse.
Who told you to get lost? I'm not telling you that. o_O
If I'm willing to talk to you, what does that say?
I can't comment about your specific experiences, all I can say is that your outlook about Feminism is seriously jaded. How about dropping all the baggage and starting anew?
Tell you what....when feminists start coming on here and saying "yeah, it's wrong, and we started this action to get things changed for men, even though it means women have fewer priveleges", THEN you can spout off like that.
Feminists have proven nothing more than an obstacle to men's rights, never a help.
Ever.
Yet you want me to give your kind another chance?
Fuck that. Prove yourselves, or don't, via your actions. As it sits, feminism deserves the reputation it enjoys...
Uh, what? Feminists don't want less or more rights for themselves, they just want equal treatment, equal protection under the law. Also, they fight for social equality and social justice. I keep telling you this isn't about giving women more rights, or impugning men.
Most modern day feminists ARE interested in the men who are discriminated against. Take a look at Feministing, or feministe U.S. blog, and you'll see them take up the case of many men: the mentally ill, veterans, men killed in custody, working class men, transgender and queer-identified men, Indigenous and first-nation men, and men with disabilities.
The first place I learned of the horrific Oscar Grant murder was at a feminist blog - the same one where I learned of 300 Afghani women protesting laws which would have legalised marital rape.
To see MRAs covering such a diversity of topics and helping the men who are actually at risk in the community would be a welcome change. However, at the moment, they only seem to care about white middle class dudes involved in custody disputes. They complain about domestic violence shelters, and a lack thereof, but many seem to expect feminists to do the hard work for them.
I can think of dozens of low-cost projects that many men's groups could actually do at present that don't involve some sort of 'competing-victim mentality.' Amongst them include prison outreach programs, literacy programs for fathers and sons, and male-led sexual abuse/rape helplines and support groups, which will all go a long way in addressing the men who are at risk, and ensuring they feel safe in doing so.
These are YOUR worthies, these are YOUR priorities. YOU don't get to decide for US what is more important. And frankly, it's about damn time SOMEONE started to care about the white guys in the suburbs too. Or are you racist as well as sexist?
You have your agenda, and you can't understand how anyone could disagree with it.
I'm telling you that your priorities are NOT shared by many, if any at all, of us.
My agenda is equality, yours is treating women like children and handing them special privileges.
My agenda includes multiple viewpoints, with no demographic left out save that of "feminist", your agenda holds an entire sex "responsible", except the anointed few who are deemed acceptable.
You seek to shame and browbeat and stifle, I seek to spark debate and discussion - sans personal attacks. You refuse all evidence that contradicts your views, I USED TO share those views then woke up.
Uh-huh. And yet in all your points all you have done is lambaste women in your 'quest' for men's rights. I have no done so. I have not called men pigs or dogs or said they are worthless. What I have done is talked about a culture and the problems we face because of that culture. I have also given ways how we can fix it, and shown how Feminism, as you continue to be extremely (and purposefully) myopic about, is about addressing those inequality issues, not about castigating or hating men.
You are not viewing the totality of my activism, only a few (maybe) videos, and yet you expect a complete thesis on each point to, as has been addressed in another video, "prove it".
You offer "solutions" that you find palatable, to problems you find important. That has about as much validity as me dictating what feminism should be about, and expecting feminists to do so.
In short, ridiculous.
You are fighting a battle we have no interest in, our battles lie elsewhere.
Then it is a battle you will lose, because you are fighting a ghost, and that is not fighting at all.
Again, answer the question. What are your views on women. I can't read all of your publications. And I certainly haven't seen all of your videos. But I have seen enough to know of your stances, many of which are directed at being against Femininsts and Feminsm instead of addressing greater societal ills.
And you don't think of Feminism as the source of many of society's ills. I do. And guess what? I don't have to prove to you anything I don't want to. Nyah.
My views on women are irrelevant, and I now grow suspect as to your motivation for demanding to know...so the answer is no.
I do not need to explain myself to you, and outside of exploring an issue, I see no need to address the subject. If you have a legit reason for asking, let's hear it...
Feminism? Social ills? Hell no. So what, everything was just peachy keen conserning male/female relationships BEFORE women rise up against oppression? I know its tough sometimes, but please do not regress into sheer lunacy.
I'm not clear on where you're going with this. I'm not against single parent families, but what does that have to do with my point below? It is inevitable that some male/female relationships, hell, ANY relationship between any gender mix will fail. But even after that bond has been sundered, if there are children, their needs must be addressed foremost. I'm talking about child support here -- I'm not sure how the laws are in Canada or what the general term is, but that was my point.
They used to call child support "marriage", but now single parent households depend on massive amounts of government money, and extorted funds from former spouses, instead. This is a demographic explosion so recent it antecedes Murphy Brown....
The way I see it, these "empowered" women who have better education, more bursaries, affirmative action, and the ability to "marry up" at their disposal can take care of their own children. If daddy WANTS to give, that's HIS business.
As to the taxpayer supporting the single moms, I highly recommend against this. I suggest that if women can't pay for their own kids upbringing, then they should lose the kids. Or, we could do what we do with men and simply throw them in jail, and damn the repercussions...
Lose the kids? Uh, to whom? The State? What should we do with these kids that you want to "lose." Oh right, there is abortion, but of course, you guys want your "say" in that, right? Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Again, you cannot have it both ways. How is that equal.
Fun Fact: Not everywhere, and not nearly to the same extent as single women.
It's not exactly rare to "lose your kids" to the state, happens all the time. It'd be a pretty true measure of how much women REALLY care about children when the consequences they visit on their kids are apparent, eh? When I say this, I refer to the single moms in places like the UK, where that was her whole life plan..
Being a housewife, to the government. Feminist utopia for trash...
As to the main point...it's up to MOM, you know, the one RESPONSIBLE for the decision to procreate?
Yeah, if she decided to have the kid on her own, she should have to support the kid on her own. If she can't, then I suggest chemical sterilization (say, depoprovera) for the entire duration she is on LIMITED social assistance.
Take the profit motive out of single motherhood and watch it disappear...
Yeah, if that MOM can even get an easy, safe abortion without men (and you know, it is mostly men, gotta agree with me there) trying to stop her. And by that I mean through the law. And again, it takes two to tango. She can decide to have the kid, and the person that helped her have the kid should help her provide, if he can't otherwise be there in her life. That's the very LEAST he can do. And I find your comment that there is some kind of profit motive in single parenthood insulting.
Dyakki, I agree that if both parents agrees to have the child, both should contribute and there should definitely be laws in place that makes sure the father doesn't leave the mother struggling. But I think what factory is saying is that in a less friendly situation, when the mother have the kid, and the father doesn't want the kid, he would be stuck in a situation where he suddenly have a kid he has to take care of that he doesn't want, and no way to get out of the situation.
Both the man and the woman is responsible for conceiving the child in the first place, but in this case the women could choose to have an abortion if she doesn't want the kid, and the man doesn't have the option. This is the unfairness that factory's talking about.
I think that if he made it very clear to her that he seriously don't want the kid or to support the kid, and knowing this, she still decides to have the kid, then he should be able to drop all parenting obligations and rights.
Unfun Fun: Partly agreed, as I can only speak to North America. But ever wondered WHY? Here's a tip, it ain't because of Feminists. It's because men run. OFTEN. And society lets them do it.
But you do know that having the State take care of children en masse isn't such a cool idea. That becomes a huge burden on society, and conditions are poor in many systems. Rather a single parent, male or female, than the State, good lord. And I have no idea where that housewife quote came from.
In this age of Deadbeat Dad rhetoric and Debtor's Prison, I challenge you to show that men "run and get away with it". I can show thousands of men forced to pay via "default paternity judgements" though... Or women proudly declaring in magazines that they couldn't find a man to marry, so they got knocked up and took the child support instead.
But sure, single parent all you want...just don't force ANYONE else to pay for it.
Before, laws like this weren't enforced, men routinely got away with fathering many children, leaving the mother struggling. Is that just? There is a societal reason why men more often than women, engage in this kind of behavior. So even though the law applies both ways, and it should, men are often hit by it more, because it simply applies to them more, statistically.
Women have the ability to choose if the pregnancy continues, as well as if they will raise the child. If she "struggles" then it's a result of HER CHOICE, not his actions. After all, it "takes two to Tango", right?
Do women have the power to make choices, or are they children that should have "support" in carrying out their choices?
Again, no choice = no responsibility.
It's what your country is founded on, at least for now....
@factory2590 You and Dyakki are not on the same topic here. You're talking about the fact that the father wanted nothing to do with the child before its birth but the mother won't abort the child and he can't get out of financial responsibility and is therefore stuck.
Dyakki is talking about a situation where the both parents originally agreed to have the child, and then the father decided to not contribute to raising the child, and the fact that men "walk away" more than women. I think...
But the reality is, 70% of divorces are initiated by women, the main reason? They don't "feel fulfilled". In short, WOMEN are "walking away", and then sticking the man with the bill while she fucks someone else, and gets HIM to raise the kids...er...too.
You figure that's fair. I get it. Let's try that with 93% of children going to Dad for a while, and see how you feel then..
I agree with everything you said. You mentioned about the percentage of guys in prison, which brings me to the question is it me or is the number of women killing their own children are on the rise. Classic example Susan Smith
@factory2590 Fulfillment is only a part. There are significant financial motivations for a woman to abscond with a man's contribution of assets earned before the marriage, their children and secure a stream of income to live without his influence.
@factory2590 oh boy... see that's what I mean... I never said I thought men "walked away" more than women, the "I think" is to address the uncertainties of my statement when I said you and Dyakki are on different topics.
I'm not going to fight with you on stats because I admit I don't do 1/5 as much research as you do. I would feel absolutely fine with 93% of kids going to dad if the dad is a better parent.
The problem is you already see people through a biased lens, I hope you wouldn't.
@factory2590 You are spot on but you gotta remeber Hasty genaralizations will get us nowere. This is the logical fallacies that feminists use and we are not them. We need to be cold and caculating and let these misquided matriarch crusaiders wallow in their own bullshit!
@CpsLock3 It's not a hasty generalization. It's verifiable FACT that over 75% of Divorces are instigated by women, and it's a verifiable fact that the most common reason given is 'irreconcilable differences' (ie, "I just don't love him anymore").
@factory2590 My deepest apoligies you might have misunderstood. I take english in collage and I know the part where you said "of COURSE you think that. You're a sexist bitch." Is a hasty generalization. I am an MRA too and I know that being bullbaited by these feminists into using logical fallacies is a self defeating process. I think you and I boath understand that using logical fallices in arguments devalue there content to anyone new looking in. We need to be more factual and you have.
@factory2590 Been but it should not be an excuse to use them in arguments. If we use more facts and less logical fallacies new people will start comming in.
@CpsLock3 Uh, LOOK AT THE STATS... 75%+ of all Divorces are instigated by women. You can keep saying these things are hyperbole, but it's verifiable fact. If you are unable to look it up, then I suggest you stop telling other people what to say.
This is not exaggeration AT ALL. That said, if you want to bore someone to death and virtually ensure they will ignore you, feel free to start spouting facts and figures.
@CpsLock3 All right I trust you know an alternative called a voice for men radio or men's radio. It however isn't getting much advertisments and souly needs donations. You can look it up in youtube. Thehappymisoginist is the host of the show.
@CpsLock3 You're way behind the curve there. Paul and I do all sorts of projects together, and I helped him come up with the plan for that show to some extent.
I not only know about it, I'm the marketing guy for AVfM
@CpsLock3 I'd recommend you spend your time doing something more ...fruitful. Feminists are a waste of time, and frankly irrelevant to our cause, simply because they are aware of mens issues, and spend their time taking up ours.
Better to pester regular folks, or better yet politicians. Getting a feminist angry is as easy as saying "men deserve equal rights to women...INCLUDING abortion".
They can't handle it when men want in on their sphere of control.
*slaps his forehead* Ah, right, "marriage." Yes, and this lovely "better half" of child support does not always work. In fact, these days, it fails more often than it succeeds.
And no, YOU MUST GIVE. If you did the deed. As I said, that responsiblity also falls on a woman, if she is not in the picture. It works both ways, and it should. However, there is a social reason why men more than women often fall in this camp. Because they can get away with it, and often do.
@factory2590 I definitely believe in father's rights and try to spread the message as much as anybody, but I have to say that doesn't pass the sniff test.
I'll have to do some research on that. Great vids btw
I don't care what you want. My views on women are evident throughout my writings, as well as my videos. In any case you'll eventually accuse me of some variation of the usual shaming tactics, and I have no patience for that boring-ass path anymore.
My views on women are completely irrelevant to the validity of my arguments, and the concept of "fairness". My view on Feminism, by way of contrast, is both germane and a matter of public record.
If I am to take you at your word, then you are a misogynist who believes women are overstepping their bounds, couched in some nonsensacal hang-wringing. You are just like those who think gays want "too many rights" when they dare challenge social and religious pograms against them, just like those who say blacks asked for "too much" when they dared challenge the status quo. You too make the same arguments against women, if your "pubic record" is to be believed.
Which of my posts do you reference? Are you conflating the word "feminist" with the word "women"? I suspect so, nearly universally. Typical of a feminist.
There exists a divide between biology and ideology, much as you wish it were not so....
But contrary to what you may think, I believe you to be better than that, or at least, have the potential to be. That is why I want you to set the record straight on your views on women and equality. You know, I would be behind you 100% if your message was geared toward shoring up some of the legal and societal issues that hurt men especially, because of the prevailing, largely Western view of gender roles and socialization.
Parity is pretty easy. Look at the laws....do they treat both sexes the same? No? Then it is NOT equality, regardless of what your bullshit Patriarchy Theory(tm) says (without a shred of proof).
Look at the education boys get, vs girls. Look at the suicide rate of men (2nd or 3rd leading cause, depending on age group). And you Feminists are the ones standing in the way...NOT helping. You CROW when women best men, you smile when men are downtrodden...publicly, in newspapers.
Because that's what Feminists fight against too. Men have been hurt by these things, and I would be a fool to deny it, being male myself. So if that is your ONLY TRUE CAUSE, then I am behind you. But I fear you have erred along the way, especially in the idea of historical context. Instead of looking at the idea of patriarchy on its scientific and historical merits, you take it as some kind of affront to you own masculinity, or rather, as a blow against men themselves.
No, I look at the entire term "Patriarchy" as equating with "men / male power". I have since the early 1980's, and to this day, not one of you has ever been able to show how that term is not the most fitting for the concept.
Not one, ever, in almost 30 years.
Either the theory is awful vague (to the point of uselessness), or feminists can't explain shit.
If feminism is so damn beneficial, point to some real, actual, concrete, affects you every day measurably kind of effects Feminism has on men. Things MEN would agree are beneficial. I'm curious. The "ability to examine" anything, by the way, existed long before feminism...it used to be called "politics".
Patriarchy is the structuring of family units based on the man, as father figure, having primary authority over the rest of the family members. Patriarchy also refers to the role of men in society more generally where men take primary responsibility over the welfare of the community as a whole. This authority often includes acting as the dominant figures in social, economic, and political procedures, including serving as representatives via public office.
And on that perceived offense, you then proceed to entrench yourself in intractable and ultimately indefensible arguments against the other gender; reason and logic well having been defenestrated ages ago. So again, I challenge you -- prove me wrong here and now, show me this is not what you are. Are you man enough?
Women can choose if they want to be a parent, in some states right up to age 12 (of the child), and walk away from parenthood with no financial or social obligation to continue that relationship. Men have no choices, in any regard, in this matter. And major feminist groups ardently work to maintain this every day.
Defend that, as a feminist, and show me how the patriarchy is responsible, and then we'll talk.
See, this is the problem. It's hard to relate to you because of the angle you're coming from. You aren't seeing the whole issue. To you, it seems like men get the short end of the stick -- end of story. But to me, I see "men get the short end of the stick, and I understand WHY." Now, while I agree that things like this need to be shorn up, we cannot do that until we adress some of the larger social issues that women face. It's like you're skipping steps here.
That explains a lot, but it doesn't make you right. You still haven't even explained what "The PAtriarchy" is yet, but you insist not only that it's responsible for all sorts of wrong to women, but that all men benefitted from it as well, and that all men owe all women as a result.
Show me where I said "da menz deserve it" kind sir.
And I gave you a very competent definition of what patriarchy means. If you can't understand it, please refer to that illustrative aid we call the encyclopedia. :]
Explain to me, exactly, which issues women face, and how they are more important. Before you do so though, I would like you to list what you understand to be the issues faced by men.
I think that would be most informative.
As for "da menz deserve it"...which part about the equation between "patriarchy" and "men" did you miss? Couple that with your "reparations" stance, and what do you get??
This reminds me of the popular male abortion argument "why don't I have a say." Easy for you to say that, but the social reality is very different. Do you have any idea how easy it is for you as a man, to impregnate a woman, and walk away with no consequences? If men can walk away from parenthood, why shouldn't women be able to, especially if they are left without the means to care for that child? So what are we to do when the woman keeps a child but the man walks away. Are we to allow this?
We allow women to do it daily. In fact, we defend their right to do so tooth and nail. We also deprive men of parental rights, stating they are not even able to gain custody in the case of adoption as there is no "familial bonding" without contact.
You invoke Biology when talking about women, but invoke the law when it comes to forcing men to "pony up".
You're tyrants, just on that issue alone.
It's not just hypocrisy, it's subjugation via family court.
And again you miss the mark. How many times do I have to tell you Feminists are with you on the issue of custody. However, I must say that this issue is often contentious, and becomes a sparring point between the couple, with either side vying for custody as a way to "get back" at the other side. What about the child's rights? I think, first and foremost, factors should be mulled over to determine what is best the child, in that case, first and foremost.
There has been so much atrocity done in "the best interests of the children" (see: Adolf Hitler) that I'd rather NOT use that standard, thank you very much.
Again, feminists have had 40+ years to be "fair" to men, and to this day they continue to work against them. Child custody is DEFINITELY the main area they work against men.
It's documented thoroughly at Glenn Sacks' site...
Fighting against shared custody. False accusations of DV as scare tactic, Duluth Model of DV itself...etc..
Yes, and if you really read what I was speaking about, you'd know it just some of the jingoistic, feel good "do it for the children" lipservice we often hear. But I will not deign a response the great spectre of Mr. Adolf, for he is a ghost and my work is with the embodied. And again, that is false. Feminists do not believe that women should have custody of children simple by virtue of 'womanhood.' Feminists fight against old tired gender tropes were created by patriarchy to begin with!
You keep saying that, and I keep giving examples of areas where feminists are indeed standing in men's way, aiming to do them harm. Far from fighting for more shared parenting, feminist groups are contending that family court is biased in men's favor, and is giving custody willy-nilly to child abusing devils..
And that's just one, incredibly blatant manner in which feminism attacks men.
And yet your kind thinks if you just come on here and say black is pink enough times, it'll happen...
No, you keep giving examples of where you THINK that is happening, but that's just your bias showing, or perhaps your misunderstanding, or dislike, or some strange combination of a lot of things. But that's fine. Because I'm going to continue to point out where you're wrong, especially with the whole "family court being biased against men" -- show me a mainstream Feminist study that supports that claim, please, or any scientific study?
@factory2590 Factory, "every" is a very solid word. It means 100% certainty, I don't think you should use that word. Scientists can't even use 100% certainty on gravity.
I'm not sure if the wage gap is a lie, your point is that women work less than men, but I thought the wage gap theory states that women get paid less for the SAME job. Also, I'm rather certain about the lower chance of promotion for women. I talked to someone that's been through that, it was really sad.
Hm... where did ur stats post go? o_0 To make things more even, I don't know where they got the the 1 in 6 women are raped in college thing... that's clearly not true... I'm in university, I have more than 6 friends.. there, disproved...
Every study conducted lately into looking at this...EVERY (there's that word again) comprehensive study, shows that women's choices of work and hours dictate that "wage gap".
In other words, if women worked as hard, or as much, or in as dangerous/difficult of a job as men...they would actually OUTEARN men.
In major "blue" cities in the US, women under 35 outearn the men. And women dominate education....
That's the weakest of all Feminist talking points.
Factory feminism is never meant to be fair to men, I don't know why you would expect that. You seem to think that feminism is some sort of equality police and is angry that they did a crappy job. They're a female rights group, of course they don't defend men... This is true for ALL rights groups. I don't recall any sort of group fighting black racism doing anything for the equality of white men, it's how rights groups work, you fight one side only.
They told everyone they were, they browbeat anyone who had a differing opinion, they shut down debate, and positioned themselves as experts and authorities.
You yourself are posing like that, telling me I don't understand, instead of listening.
Your ideology sold itself as being about Equality.
All you've done is added your name to the feminists who admit it was all really just a big fraudulent power-grab.
@factory2590 *sigh* ok, I'll say this before anything else. everything I say here is an opinion, I never posed myself as any sort of expert, you on the other hand are. I merely don't have enough word counts to say I think before everything.
Now I'm not on the feminist group's marketing team so I have no clue what they're trying to sell themselves as. All I know is I see them as a force pushing for women's rights, and to give women the same rights as men in areas where they're lacking.
@factory2590 Also, feminism isn't a group you join, I didn't join a club where we go and carry out some leader's plans. It's just a belief that you live by, just like this men's rights thing you're doing. If some other guy fighting for men's rights go and kill 50 women out of pure hatred, I'm not gonna blame you for believe the same thing, though I'll probably watch you more carefully. My point is don't go and pick on feminism as the sole evil for your cause, it's too biased and one sided.
@FlameltaSK0 Feminism doesn't address male issues because women are inherently selfish. Men are expected to tough it out in a way that women are not.
"Feminism doesn't address male issues because women are inherently selfish" - don't agree, women are not inherently selfish, as mothers that trait would be destructive and humans wouldn't have survived this long. There are modern forces however, that encourage women to be selfish, I'll agree with that.
"Men are expected to tough it out in a way that women are not." - now this I do agree, but you have to tackle society and many times, men themselves to fix that.
Or should we engage in recommendatory measures to address the situation, so that you cannot escape your reasonability once a child is born? It sounds like you want your cake and the ability to partake of it, but you cannot have it both ways. This is social reality.
How about legal parity with women? Is that so hard to understand?
She has the right to abortion, if he tells her he wants to leave her, she can make her decisions without impediment, but better understanding of the situation. Even AFTER the birth of the child she can decide for herself, yet men can't "because it's different".
NO, it's not different, at all.
Not one friggin bit.
And insisting it is only confirms why people like you are not helping men.
I have absolutely no idea of what you're talking about here. If a woman is pregnant and decides to keep her child and the father is no where to be found, do you not think it is just to ask for some compensation from him? Similarly, if a father is left with a child, and the mother has walked away, he may also demand the same.
No, I do not think it is just to ask for compensation from him, unless he's married to her, and it's his kid.
None whatsoever.
If the father takes on the responsibility for the child willingly, and the mother makes clear her desire to remove herself totally, then no he doesn't either.
And asking the State to pay for her CHOICE to have a child is a non-starter too. If she can't afford it, there's always adoption.
OR
She could have a stable relationship and raise the kid like that. Her choice.
Again, what? As I said before, people have to understand the child comes first in these cases, or SHOULD. Not whatever interests the parents have, especially if they are using the child as some kind of bargaining chip. Why should it matter if they are married. If you helped make the child, you should help pay for her support, if you can't otherwise be there. The same goes for the other party in the opposite scenario. Why is that so unfair? Talking about trying to call black pink.
No, "the children" are NOT paramount, and shouldn't be, ever. Not one successful society in history has ever been child centric like that. There have, however, been plenty of societies that use that line...
Nazi Germany.
Stalin's Russia...
Mao's China.
No marriage = no "commitment". Ask any woman, she'll tell you. As for live ins, well, that's covered under "he takes responsibility willingly".
No I think as long as you're the father, you should have some sort of natural obligation to your child. But if before its birth, you specifically stated that you don't want anything to do with the child, and the mother still gave birth, then you can opt out. But if you're nowhere to be found you should have some sort of responsibility, or else we're promoting men to run away. You should be responsible for your own actions, but not letting you have a way out is not the way to go either.
Right now, we force men into parenthood, even for one night stands they'll never see the kid from. We adopt out kids without even telling the father he is one, and force men to support children that aren't theirs.
We assign parenthood to men all the time, willing or unwilling does NOT matter..
NONE of this is foisted on women.
And ALL of it is based 100% purely, strictly, on the gender of the person involved.
THAT is systemic discrimination, and it's out in the open for all to see.
In Canada or the US the genital mutilation of infant baby boys is legal but infant baby girls is illegal. That is sexism but the feminists aren't complaining. I'm fed up with all the sexism. Women marry wealth, status, power. Girls the chap who collects your rubbish is an environmentalist. Stop being so fucking stuck up.
This sort of "academic" view of human suffering allows people to ignore said suffering. It's what's driving Westerners to blindly, cheerfully support the genocide going on in the Middle East by the West, and what has caused environmentalists to be so impotent that they can no longer influence public opinion or cause the public to take global warming (which has affected where I live beyond what I ever expected) seriously.
KhagarBalugrak 3 weeks ago
And the feminists' complete indifference to male suffering exposes the movement as a hate movement instead of a valid ideology. When you say things like "The reason 80+% of suicides are male..." that attempt to justify existing inequalities, you're not only supporting these inequalities; you're reducing an extraordinarily painful human problem to cold, dead statistics and logic so you can further dehumanize what you hate.
KhagarBalugrak 3 weeks ago
I understand your anger at the proliferation of Women's Studies. I personally think there should be no "Studies" program that focuses on a single gender or race. No Black Studies, no Women's Studies, no Men's Studies, nothing. Such "programs" only foster self-absorption and narcissism in the particular race or gender being studied, and foster hatred and intolerance of everyone else.
KhagarBalugrak 3 weeks ago
"women don't care about men"...Never a more true statement buddy.
Yazoo2564 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Google: Martha Laura Granados Immigration Prostitute
The VAWA Immigration Loop-hole:
If you are a woman, pretend to be in love with a US citizen / Legal Resident, deceive him to marry you. As soon as you got the marriage certificate dial 211 and falsely accuse him of Domestic Violence and Rape and move to a VAWA shelter.
You will be on a fast-track for a Green-Card and US citizenship - all expenses paid for by the US tax payer and as a bonus you will be getting full social benefits.
VAWAhorrors 4 months ago in playlist More videos from factory2590
This has been flagged as spam show
1. Give Women Voting Rights
2. Give Women Equal Rights
3. Give Women Extra Rights
4. Give Women Extra Protection... from Men
5. Hear only Women and Ignore Men
6. Believe Women only and Treat men as Perpetrators
7. Let Women Falsely Accuse Men without Consequences
8. Encourage Women to be Helpless Victims and to think of All Men as Rapists
9. Encourage False Accusations by Women (VAWA) and Punish Innocent Men
10. ...Watch Women Destroy Men, the Family and Society !!!
VAWAhorrors 4 months ago in playlist More videos from factory2590
I like that you did. It's always interesting when men are expected to provide imperical evidence, their sources, and methodologies.
But if you ask the same of women, specifically feminists, they flip out and either try to shame the person or declare it a non-issue or better yet, the question isn't worth answering.
The scientific community works from a basis of facts & recurring observations allowing for challenge and change.
The feministific community runs on the basis of emotion and does not.
OniNoFro 1 year ago 4
This is crap! I'd rather be a man,then a woman.
ashatbulaparanormal 1 year ago
@ashatbulaparanormal Penis envy?
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 Having a penis,male's would respected me.In my job I would get more money,without sexual harassment.I could live my life the way I want.Men have it all so easy,so yeah I'd rather be a male then a female.
ashatbulaparanormal 1 year ago
@ashatbulaparanormal There's only one problem.
Men don't actually live in a reality created by a jealous, misguided woman.
But you know what? I'd LOVE it if women could spend some time as a man before they could complain men have it 'better' than them.....
because lady, you have NO idea what it's like if you actually want this for yourself...
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 Women don't live in the reality you seem to perceive either. People of the same gender can have very different lives, and we all seem to only see the good side of others and the bad side of ours, that's how humans think. There's a lot of benefits both to being a man and woman, what you rather be depends on who you want to be as a person.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 You asked me a long time ago why I idenfity myself with this seemingly evil (sole purpose is to oppress men) group, called the feminists. So here's the story: I'm sorta a tom boy, so naturally I spent my life wondering what it'll be like if I was actually a guy so I'll fit in more. Even though life isn't ideal, I'm still fine, cuz society today is fine with tom boys, it's socially acceptable. But that's b/c of feminists, if they didn't fight for it I would be screwed right now.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 anyways, pretty much all the stuff I wrote comes down to 2 points:
1. Concerning you and ashatbulaparanormal's arguements on whether it's better to be male or female, it depends on your situation, and who you want to be. We always things the grass it's greener on the other side. Not saying you're supposed to take whatever you get if you don't think it's right. Fighting for your rights is fine, just don't be ignorant to others.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 2. About your extreme hate about the feminists. They did a lot of good for women, u seem to be mad that they didn't protect men's rights as well. But this is a women's rights group, not equality police, you can't expect them to do that. Any rights group normally just fight for their own rights blindly, it's not a sign of evil, just ignorance (which is still bad). Of course some crap did come out of that ignorance. I admire a lot of what feminists have done, but not those things.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 "They did a lot of good for women, u seem to be mad that they didn't protect men's rights as well. But this is a women's rights group, not equality police, you can't expect them to do that."
They commonly defend themselves by saying they're 'about equality', and regularly say they are 'for men'. They also say MRAs are unneccessary because Feminists look out for men too (not so much anymore though).
This is a common Feminist defense, I only point out the lie.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 if that's a common defense then I'm sorry I never heard about it. The word feminism means women's rights. I think when they said equality, they meant equality to men in areas where women is lacking, like equal pay. They're working on getting equal pay because men currently have more compensation, but if one day men has less compensation, I won't expect them to say anything then. I won't expect you to address women's pay equality issue either, it's not your job.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 You mean like right now where women are making more than men in most major urban US centers?
Yeah, they're talking about it alright. Crowing, actually.
Doesn't that tell you something about Feminism, or do you need to be hit with a few more clue-by-fours?
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 Sorry I have no idea what you're talking about. I didn't know women are making more than men in major urban US centers, where did you get that from? Sorry I didn't really get that at all.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 It's all over the news, and has been written about for over 3 weeks now.
Read TIME magazine...it's the friggin' COVER STORY for instance...
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 Cool, do you have a link? I googled time magazine, but can't find the article. I even searched women on times website, though I don't think you'll like the result of the search ^^;. I don't read too much magazines at all, so a little help here?
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 Go to a newsstand, pay the man a few bucks, and take your magazine home. Failing that, type some phrases into google. I'm not here to do your research for you.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 are you actually that stubborn that you refuse to send me a link that you can just copy and paste? I might be mistaken, but I always thought that I should be able to obtain information from you on this topic, since your goal should be to educate the world on men's issues? The world includes more than people that'll automatically agree with you, and you need to have some composure when people do disagree with you.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 as for this link, I'm still very interested in it. If you have the time to think of another insult, you can easily copy and paste it. I even did my due diligence and tried to search it up on time magazine's website, and couldn't find it. I don't believe asking you to send me the link is an unreasonable request. So, factory2590, can you please give me the link to the article you referred to previously? Thank you :)
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 And lastly, sorry for spamming up the comments section like this, I don't know why I'm so wordy... need to work on that...
I know this last comment doesn't help the spam, but I just want a proper conclusion. I don't dislike what you're doing at all, just trying to kill some ignorance coming from a lot of people (not just you). I don't mind if you correct me when I'm wrong, but don't be ignorant (I'm using this word a lot today) about it.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 I still think you have absolutely NO idea what Feminism is about, or what it does. I also think you have ZERO appreciation for how important these issues are to men.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 Maybe I don't, but that just means that feminism might not be what you think. You pointed at every bad point, put it together, and say that every feminist stands for that. That's not true, like I said I won't think you're a murderer if some MRA killed women out of hate.
In terms of appreciation, I personally think I appreciate what's fair, I just don't agree with you on certain definitions. You have to be more specific.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 When the vast majority of a group believe certain things, then act on those certain commonalities in various anti-male ways, it's silly to insist I expend my energy on all those small infractions.
Strike at the root of a problem, and you kill all the others as well.
Feminism is the root.
I don't give a flying fuck if this hurts your feelings. It's still true.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 lol, dw my feelings aren't hurt that easily :P
The disagreement is that I don't think the vast majority of feminists are anti-male at all. We have very different views of feminism, but if these messages haven't reached me, someone who associates myself with feminism, is the anti-male message really that strong? I'm pretty sure some women with male issues used feminism as a tool to get what they want, but in terms of core values, I don't think "screw men" is one of them.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 You 'haven't heard' of one single thing that I have brought up...ever. It's like you think men live in a Fantasy Dreamworld...or you're NEVER paying attention, and dismissing what's brought to your attention...
That's not my fault..
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 I never said men live in fantasy dreamworld. I heard that men loses most of the time in divorce court, have child support put on them. You mentioned that men are sometimes stuck with a child they don't want... people tend to think they're most likely to commit a crime... I never dismissed any of that, I don't know where you're getting all of that.
No one ever said it was your fault. You have new information all the time, and of course I don't follow as much as you do.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 ok, another question regarding "Strike at the root of a problem, and you kill all the others as well." If feminism were to officially disband right now, do you think anything will change? No, it'll just come back with a new name. Men haters will still hate and those who wants to fight for women's rights would still do so, it may slow the organization of these movements a bit, but it'll come back. Fight for your own rights, not the destruction of feminism (which btw is very vague).
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 Of course it would...until people have all the ways Feminism has been manipulating them into hurting men and society explained to them. The more they realize the injustices perpetrated, and the onion-thin arguments used to 'justify' this behaviour, feminists will pay.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 "until people have all the ways Feminism has been manipulating them into hurting men and society explained to them" 1 problem, you're not very good at explaining things to people, b/c when people don't agree, you say "I don't need you to agree with me, fuck off" :)
Also, the whole "feminists will pay" thing, does that sound realistic? Pay how? Criminal court? Civil court? Who will be prosecuted? Under what laws? Do you have a realistic vision?
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@ashatbulaparanormal I agree all those points are reality for a lot of women out there and that sucks, but just like what I've been saying to all the guys here, don't be too one sided. Men have their own problems as well and it's not good to turn a blind eye to that. factory is a bit extreme in some areas but he does have good points. How you're treated depends on the men/women that has power around you, if they're sexist jerks then you're gonna be screwed no matter who you are.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 still rather be a man/boy then a woman/girl.
ashatbulaparanormal 1 year ago
@ashatbulaparanormal yeah I totally understand. I feel like that a lot of times too, I don't want to go into specific reasons, but yeah, there's a lot of advantages to being a guy. And guys, this is a prime example of why a lot of women will not listen to your arguements even if they're good points, it's cuz women have their own issues and you're just ranting on how it sucks to be men w/o realizing that women has A LOT of crap to deal with as well. Just consider all sides before talking.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 IOW, "Don't complain to women about your problems, women think they're worse off, and won't care".
Good argument.
factory2590 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 *continue from above* We don't respond well to selfish people, and that's probably where a lot of your passion comes from. Feminists have probably done things in the past that is selfish, they rant about their own equality issues without giving a second thought to what's happening to men, so I do understand that. But what you're doing is very similar, your response to ashatbulaparanormal was that you didn't care what problems she had, you have problems, and that's all that matters.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 I told her I was advocating for MY concerns, not hers. Her position is that if I don't advocate her position AS WELL AS MINE, that I'm sexist...
Fuck that. Deal with your own shit lady.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 "I told her I was advocating for MY concerns, not hers. Her position is that if I don't advocate her position AS WELL AS MINE, that I'm sexist..." But your position seems to be that if feminists don't advocate your position as well as men's they're sexist, I've been telling you this whole time that they don't have to advocate men's concerns just like you don't have to advocate women's concerns. You're contradicting yourself here.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 I'm not saying that's wrong, but people react very negatively to that kind of behavior. Although what you're doing is very typical of activist groups, including feminists and racism activist groups, so maybe I shouldn't condemn you for it. You're still just a guy fighting for his rights, which is fine. What sets me off is the aggressiveness and blindness you do it with, I mean you twisted my quote just to make a point. You're so black and white, and NOTHING is black and white.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 You haven't heard the half of it then. Because if I'm ever in the position to do so, I plan on rooting out Feminists wherever I can, and bringing them to justice.
Prosecution of Family Court functionaries for Human Rights violations? You bet your ass! Loss of job and pension for avowed bereaucratic Feminists? Gleefully! Removal of credentials for Academics deliberately lying to further a PC agenda? With Pleasure!
And it's going to be a pleasure.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 Actually I'm interested, can you explain each of those "crimes" in detail? I actually want to see if I can match it to any section of the criminal code or civil law. If it does then you actually have a case. I don't really understand the last 2, but "Prosecution of Family Court functionaries for Human Rights violations"... I can't really think of a law/tort that it violates... I guess the closest one is obstruction of justice or something... but lobbying does not fit that.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 Do your own work. I'm tired of you 'earnest Feminists' wasting my time with shit you can do easily yourself.
I don't need, nor want, your 'support'. You are here only to waste my time.
Go the fuck away.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 I'm sorry, but I'm not exactly in this field doing this kind of research, you are. Your goal, if I'm not wrong, is to educate others about this, but at this point you just seem to want to find more people that's already convinced of this and feel good. This isn't gonna grow your cause, and since most people here is just online to vent steam, your forces aren't organized. Anytime others have a disagreement with you, you can't seem to take it or have an open and polite debate.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
Great material for incendiary conversation.
feministsAreCorrupt 1 year ago
How about talking about sex-based inequities in American social security payments and Medicare ? Women per year earn about 80% of the average male income, not counting the number of years when women are out of the work force for child-bearing. Due to difference in life spans, women also draw more Social Security benefits. So, they contribute less to SS yet draw 50% more.
feministsAreCorrupt 1 year ago
@feministsAreCorrupt
ha ha interesting point, but this is just sorta... random, don't you think? social benefits are meant to help out those that are not so rich themselves, it takes from the rich and gives it to the poor. Of course those that earn less would get the most benefits. It annoys everyone that earns a decent income. I'm pretty sure that when the government set this up they weren't trying to make sure women will be favoured, it's just the way it worked out.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
Well. men we need to get our shit together! We are the underdogs now! WE can stand up and be counted. Very very soon, if we don't act, we have any rights at all. We will have to take back our rights by force of arms and that will not be pretty. We will have to destroy the corrupt system to save our country and will have to put a lot of the selfish bitches and the government thugs who back them in the ground, like I said it will not be pretty!
unclefixer 1 year ago
If you don't mind me asking where did you research your information?
Which website/sites did you use because I want to do some further research into these statistics
LordXenocide 1 year ago
Man I don't know what to say....
playamarc19 1 year ago
Here's the problem. You're conflating abuses of the system with the system itself. I don't support using the system to impugn someone else, though relationships can often be tumultuous and leave a lot of baggage for both camps to sort through -- it does happen. Also, you miss my meaning when I say "run and get away with it" -- I meant that it is some ways socially acceptable behavior for men. And women, who often stand more to loose in those sorts of situations, deserve compensation.
Dyakki 2 years ago
Really? Ever hear the phrase "deadbeat Dads"? Ever wonder how many of those men wanted nothing to do with a child, but were forced into being a parent anyway?
You honestly believe this ISN'T a result of Feminism?
Of course not...feminism is nothing but goodness and light....right?
It's FAR more socially acceptable for a woman to have an abortion than for a man to "run away".
And you can't "conflate" in situations where the system was set up the way it is specifically to allow "abuse".
factory2590 2 years ago
To the deadbeat dad thing, it's wrong, but I don't think it's the fault of feminism. Think about it, even before feminism existed, is it socially acceptable for a father to not care for his child?
Yes abortion would also be not socially acceptable, and that might be due to feminism. Feminism merely helped women's rights and did nothing for men's rights. They didn't want to set it up so that women could "trap" a man with a child. You can't put all the blame on feminism.
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
You don't think ANYTHING is the fault of Feminism. You're a feminist apologist, and you will do anything you can to defend the ideology. And that's ALL you care about.
It's patently obvious.
The more of you that do this bullshit, and the less of you that actually do something to help men THE WAY MEN WANT TO BE HELPED, the faster your sick, man-hating religion will be ground into dust under the heels of all the men you dismiss.
And I will be eating popcorn as it happens...
factory2590 2 years ago
it must suck to be a straight white male
waah waah drink yourself to death you suburbanite piece of shit
Ultimos7 2 years ago
get off the internet dad
Ultimos7 2 years ago
Okay, so...
(Middle Aged Misogynist) *spouts a bunch of nonsense and uneducated reasons why women are doing so much better than men*
(Feminist) OK, prove it. *folds arms*
(Middle Aged Misogynist) Um... er... *scratches his head* uhh.. wait, u know wut, fuk u! i don't need logic to prov anything u do the wurk for me because after all u gotta prove MY own argument! take that stupid femininsistss u need logic and reason to answer shit but i dont cuz im a man... and ur not mai friend... yah!
Dyakki 2 years ago
I am so tired of pompous fuckwads like you coming on here and calling me ignorant, yet not one of you knows a fucking thing about the MRM, or MRA.
Not fucking one of you.
You are all useless, man hating, invective spouting morons. I have yet to see an original thought from your kind..
Oh yeah...and I don't give a fuck what genitalia you have, you're a simpering fool.
That said, have a look around, maybe educate yourself...or continue to wallow in hate. Your choice....
factory2590 2 years ago
Yup, and thank you for proving my above quote! ^___^
*bows* Thank you, thank you. And for my next trick...
But seriously, calm yourself down. I didn't say anything about the MSM, did I? Did I say male issues worthless, or that we don't need to take a look at men's problems or concerns in society? C'mon dude, give it up. Feminists aren't out to destroy you. If anything, they're trying to help you. Why don't you LISTEN to the arguments instead of running for the treehouse.
Dyakki 2 years ago
I spent 15 years having them tell me to get lost...and NOW I 'm supposed to listen?
If they're so egalitarian and concerned, they can go and do good things for men without me.
I don't need to listen to them at all, and I won't. They can prove themselves friends of men after all, or not, on their own damn time.
factory2590 2 years ago
Who told you to get lost? I'm not telling you that. o_O
If I'm willing to talk to you, what does that say?
I can't comment about your specific experiences, all I can say is that your outlook about Feminism is seriously jaded. How about dropping all the baggage and starting anew?
Dyakki 2 years ago
Tell you what....when feminists start coming on here and saying "yeah, it's wrong, and we started this action to get things changed for men, even though it means women have fewer priveleges", THEN you can spout off like that.
Feminists have proven nothing more than an obstacle to men's rights, never a help.
Ever.
Yet you want me to give your kind another chance?
Fuck that. Prove yourselves, or don't, via your actions. As it sits, feminism deserves the reputation it enjoys...
factory2590 2 years ago
Uh, what? Feminists don't want less or more rights for themselves, they just want equal treatment, equal protection under the law. Also, they fight for social equality and social justice. I keep telling you this isn't about giving women more rights, or impugning men.
Dyakki 2 years ago
BY the way, read you opening statement on this thread, and tell me why I shouldn't just ban you outright for the sexist asshole you are?
factory2590 2 years ago
Most modern day feminists ARE interested in the men who are discriminated against. Take a look at Feministing, or feministe U.S. blog, and you'll see them take up the case of many men: the mentally ill, veterans, men killed in custody, working class men, transgender and queer-identified men, Indigenous and first-nation men, and men with disabilities.
Dyakki 2 years ago
The first place I learned of the horrific Oscar Grant murder was at a feminist blog - the same one where I learned of 300 Afghani women protesting laws which would have legalised marital rape.
Dyakki 2 years ago
To see MRAs covering such a diversity of topics and helping the men who are actually at risk in the community would be a welcome change. However, at the moment, they only seem to care about white middle class dudes involved in custody disputes. They complain about domestic violence shelters, and a lack thereof, but many seem to expect feminists to do the hard work for them.
Dyakki 2 years ago
I can think of dozens of low-cost projects that many men's groups could actually do at present that don't involve some sort of 'competing-victim mentality.' Amongst them include prison outreach programs, literacy programs for fathers and sons, and male-led sexual abuse/rape helplines and support groups, which will all go a long way in addressing the men who are at risk, and ensuring they feel safe in doing so.
Dyakki 2 years ago
These are YOUR worthies, these are YOUR priorities. YOU don't get to decide for US what is more important. And frankly, it's about damn time SOMEONE started to care about the white guys in the suburbs too. Or are you racist as well as sexist?
You have your agenda, and you can't understand how anyone could disagree with it.
I'm telling you that your priorities are NOT shared by many, if any at all, of us.
And you do NOT get to decide who's more valid.
factory2590 2 years ago
Right, because the only thing important to you is maintaining the status quo, and boo-hooing about how much you're being oppressed by women.
My 'agenda' is equality. Yours is being a misguided crybaby. You could do so much better.
Dyakki 2 years ago
My agenda is equality, yours is treating women like children and handing them special privileges.
My agenda includes multiple viewpoints, with no demographic left out save that of "feminist", your agenda holds an entire sex "responsible", except the anointed few who are deemed acceptable.
You seek to shame and browbeat and stifle, I seek to spark debate and discussion - sans personal attacks. You refuse all evidence that contradicts your views, I USED TO share those views then woke up.
factory2590 2 years ago
Uh-huh. And yet in all your points all you have done is lambaste women in your 'quest' for men's rights. I have no done so. I have not called men pigs or dogs or said they are worthless. What I have done is talked about a culture and the problems we face because of that culture. I have also given ways how we can fix it, and shown how Feminism, as you continue to be extremely (and purposefully) myopic about, is about addressing those inequality issues, not about castigating or hating men.
Dyakki 2 years ago
You are not viewing the totality of my activism, only a few (maybe) videos, and yet you expect a complete thesis on each point to, as has been addressed in another video, "prove it".
You offer "solutions" that you find palatable, to problems you find important. That has about as much validity as me dictating what feminism should be about, and expecting feminists to do so.
In short, ridiculous.
You are fighting a battle we have no interest in, our battles lie elsewhere.
factory2590 2 years ago
Then it is a battle you will lose, because you are fighting a ghost, and that is not fighting at all.
Again, answer the question. What are your views on women. I can't read all of your publications. And I certainly haven't seen all of your videos. But I have seen enough to know of your stances, many of which are directed at being against Femininsts and Feminsm instead of addressing greater societal ills.
Dyakki 2 years ago
And you don't think of Feminism as the source of many of society's ills. I do. And guess what? I don't have to prove to you anything I don't want to. Nyah.
My views on women are irrelevant, and I now grow suspect as to your motivation for demanding to know...so the answer is no.
I do not need to explain myself to you, and outside of exploring an issue, I see no need to address the subject. If you have a legit reason for asking, let's hear it...
factory2590 2 years ago
Feminism? Social ills? Hell no. So what, everything was just peachy keen conserning male/female relationships BEFORE women rise up against oppression? I know its tough sometimes, but please do not regress into sheer lunacy.
Dyakki 2 years ago
So it's better to have more than 70% of children born into single mother households?
You want to pay the taxes to afford that?
You want to force men to pay for it instead of you, by denying them legal equality with the women giving birth?
You think sweeping social change has no ill consequence? You think denial makes it disappear?
If you are what you say you are, the main difference between us is MRAs consider non-PC avenues as well....
factory2590 2 years ago
I'm not clear on where you're going with this. I'm not against single parent families, but what does that have to do with my point below? It is inevitable that some male/female relationships, hell, ANY relationship between any gender mix will fail. But even after that bond has been sundered, if there are children, their needs must be addressed foremost. I'm talking about child support here -- I'm not sure how the laws are in Canada or what the general term is, but that was my point.
Dyakki 2 years ago
They used to call child support "marriage", but now single parent households depend on massive amounts of government money, and extorted funds from former spouses, instead. This is a demographic explosion so recent it antecedes Murphy Brown....
The way I see it, these "empowered" women who have better education, more bursaries, affirmative action, and the ability to "marry up" at their disposal can take care of their own children. If daddy WANTS to give, that's HIS business.
factory2590 2 years ago
As to the taxpayer supporting the single moms, I highly recommend against this. I suggest that if women can't pay for their own kids upbringing, then they should lose the kids. Or, we could do what we do with men and simply throw them in jail, and damn the repercussions...
factory2590 2 years ago
Lose the kids? Uh, to whom? The State? What should we do with these kids that you want to "lose." Oh right, there is abortion, but of course, you guys want your "say" in that, right? Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Again, you cannot have it both ways. How is that equal.
Fun fact: Taxpayers support single dads, too. :]
Dyakki 2 years ago
Fun Fact: Not everywhere, and not nearly to the same extent as single women.
It's not exactly rare to "lose your kids" to the state, happens all the time. It'd be a pretty true measure of how much women REALLY care about children when the consequences they visit on their kids are apparent, eh? When I say this, I refer to the single moms in places like the UK, where that was her whole life plan..
Being a housewife, to the government. Feminist utopia for trash...
factory2590 2 years ago
As to the main point...it's up to MOM, you know, the one RESPONSIBLE for the decision to procreate?
Yeah, if she decided to have the kid on her own, she should have to support the kid on her own. If she can't, then I suggest chemical sterilization (say, depoprovera) for the entire duration she is on LIMITED social assistance.
Take the profit motive out of single motherhood and watch it disappear...
factory2590 2 years ago
Yeah, if that MOM can even get an easy, safe abortion without men (and you know, it is mostly men, gotta agree with me there) trying to stop her. And by that I mean through the law. And again, it takes two to tango. She can decide to have the kid, and the person that helped her have the kid should help her provide, if he can't otherwise be there in her life. That's the very LEAST he can do. And I find your comment that there is some kind of profit motive in single parenthood insulting.
Dyakki 2 years ago
No, the very LEAST he can do is absolutely nothing. If she has the choice, then she has the responsibility. Period.
You can't tell someone it's none of their business if she has a child, and then turn around and make that same guy pay to "help".
It takes two to have sex, most of the time, but that doesn't mean, at all, that he should be "paying".
Or, are women basically baby-whores in your eyes?
factory2590 2 years ago
Dyakki, I agree that if both parents agrees to have the child, both should contribute and there should definitely be laws in place that makes sure the father doesn't leave the mother struggling. But I think what factory is saying is that in a less friendly situation, when the mother have the kid, and the father doesn't want the kid, he would be stuck in a situation where he suddenly have a kid he has to take care of that he doesn't want, and no way to get out of the situation.
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
Both the man and the woman is responsible for conceiving the child in the first place, but in this case the women could choose to have an abortion if she doesn't want the kid, and the man doesn't have the option. This is the unfairness that factory's talking about.
I think that if he made it very clear to her that he seriously don't want the kid or to support the kid, and knowing this, she still decides to have the kid, then he should be able to drop all parenting obligations and rights.
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
Unfun Fun: Partly agreed, as I can only speak to North America. But ever wondered WHY? Here's a tip, it ain't because of Feminists. It's because men run. OFTEN. And society lets them do it.
But you do know that having the State take care of children en masse isn't such a cool idea. That becomes a huge burden on society, and conditions are poor in many systems. Rather a single parent, male or female, than the State, good lord. And I have no idea where that housewife quote came from.
Dyakki 2 years ago
In this age of Deadbeat Dad rhetoric and Debtor's Prison, I challenge you to show that men "run and get away with it". I can show thousands of men forced to pay via "default paternity judgements" though... Or women proudly declaring in magazines that they couldn't find a man to marry, so they got knocked up and took the child support instead.
But sure, single parent all you want...just don't force ANYONE else to pay for it.
How, exactly, is that wrong?
factory2590 2 years ago
Before, laws like this weren't enforced, men routinely got away with fathering many children, leaving the mother struggling. Is that just? There is a societal reason why men more often than women, engage in this kind of behavior. So even though the law applies both ways, and it should, men are often hit by it more, because it simply applies to them more, statistically.
Dyakki 2 years ago
Women have the ability to choose if the pregnancy continues, as well as if they will raise the child. If she "struggles" then it's a result of HER CHOICE, not his actions. After all, it "takes two to Tango", right?
Do women have the power to make choices, or are they children that should have "support" in carrying out their choices?
Again, no choice = no responsibility.
It's what your country is founded on, at least for now....
factory2590 2 years ago
@factory2590 You and Dyakki are not on the same topic here. You're talking about the fact that the father wanted nothing to do with the child before its birth but the mother won't abort the child and he can't get out of financial responsibility and is therefore stuck.
Dyakki is talking about a situation where the both parents originally agreed to have the child, and then the father decided to not contribute to raising the child, and the fact that men "walk away" more than women. I think...
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
"men "walk away" more than women. I think..."
Of COURSE you think that. You're a sexist bitch.
But the reality is, 70% of divorces are initiated by women, the main reason? They don't "feel fulfilled". In short, WOMEN are "walking away", and then sticking the man with the bill while she fucks someone else, and gets HIM to raise the kids...er...too.
You figure that's fair. I get it. Let's try that with 93% of children going to Dad for a while, and see how you feel then..
Sexist.
factory2590 2 years ago 17
I agree with everything you said. You mentioned about the percentage of guys in prison, which brings me to the question is it me or is the number of women killing their own children are on the rise. Classic example Susan Smith
orgasmtron1 2 years ago 2
@factory2590 Fulfillment is only a part. There are significant financial motivations for a woman to abscond with a man's contribution of assets earned before the marriage, their children and secure a stream of income to live without his influence.
feministsAreCorrupt 1 year ago
@factory2590 oh boy... see that's what I mean... I never said I thought men "walked away" more than women, the "I think" is to address the uncertainties of my statement when I said you and Dyakki are on different topics.
I'm not going to fight with you on stats because I admit I don't do 1/5 as much research as you do. I would feel absolutely fine with 93% of kids going to dad if the dad is a better parent.
The problem is you already see people through a biased lens, I hope you wouldn't.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 You are spot on but you gotta remeber Hasty genaralizations will get us nowere. This is the logical fallacies that feminists use and we are not them. We need to be cold and caculating and let these misquided matriarch crusaiders wallow in their own bullshit!
CpsLock3 8 months ago
@CpsLock3 It's not a hasty generalization. It's verifiable FACT that over 75% of Divorces are instigated by women, and it's a verifiable fact that the most common reason given is 'irreconcilable differences' (ie, "I just don't love him anymore").
Common knowledge to any who choose to look.
factory2590 8 months ago
@factory2590 My deepest apoligies you might have misunderstood. I take english in collage and I know the part where you said "of COURSE you think that. You're a sexist bitch." Is a hasty generalization. I am an MRA too and I know that being bullbaited by these feminists into using logical fallacies is a self defeating process. I think you and I boath understand that using logical fallices in arguments devalue there content to anyone new looking in. We need to be more factual and you have.
CpsLock3 8 months ago
@factory2590 Been but it should not be an excuse to use them in arguments. If we use more facts and less logical fallacies new people will start comming in.
CpsLock3 8 months ago
@CpsLock3 Uh, LOOK AT THE STATS... 75%+ of all Divorces are instigated by women. You can keep saying these things are hyperbole, but it's verifiable fact. If you are unable to look it up, then I suggest you stop telling other people what to say.
This is not exaggeration AT ALL. That said, if you want to bore someone to death and virtually ensure they will ignore you, feel free to start spouting facts and figures.
Just try and get them right.
factory2590 8 months ago
@factory2590 Just thought of this. Did you every listen to Tom Leykis?
CpsLock3 8 months ago
@CpsLock3 Used to a fair bit. He has good ideas in some cases, no clue what he's talking about in others.
factory2590 8 months ago
@CpsLock3 All right I trust you know an alternative called a voice for men radio or men's radio. It however isn't getting much advertisments and souly needs donations. You can look it up in youtube. Thehappymisoginist is the host of the show.
CpsLock3 8 months ago
@CpsLock3 You're way behind the curve there. Paul and I do all sorts of projects together, and I helped him come up with the plan for that show to some extent.
I not only know about it, I'm the marketing guy for AVfM
factory2590 8 months ago
@factory2590 Hey good news Feministfrequency blocked me I'm relly getting good at getting feminists butthurt.
CpsLock3 8 months ago
@CpsLock3 I'd recommend you spend your time doing something more ...fruitful. Feminists are a waste of time, and frankly irrelevant to our cause, simply because they are aware of mens issues, and spend their time taking up ours.
Better to pester regular folks, or better yet politicians. Getting a feminist angry is as easy as saying "men deserve equal rights to women...INCLUDING abortion".
They can't handle it when men want in on their sphere of control.
factory2590 8 months ago 4
@factory2590 I got a little treat for you. Type feminsm is. in the serch box and find out the results.
CpsLock3 8 months ago
*slaps his forehead* Ah, right, "marriage." Yes, and this lovely "better half" of child support does not always work. In fact, these days, it fails more often than it succeeds.
And no, YOU MUST GIVE. If you did the deed. As I said, that responsiblity also falls on a woman, if she is not in the picture. It works both ways, and it should. However, there is a social reason why men more than women often fall in this camp. Because they can get away with it, and often do.
Dyakki 2 years ago
"Must give" if you did the deed?
What?
Are you saying "shoulda kept your legs closed"?
Oh no, wait, that's sexist.
You must mean then that sex costs money, and devaluing the woman by making her pregnant costs a lot of money.
But then, that would mean all women are whores, and that's not right...
Oh right. It's because women's sexuality is "empowering", and men's is "dirty".
Sex is something men do "to" women, and any pregnancy is HIS fault. Her choice, his fault...yup, that's feminism..
factory2590 2 years ago
Whoa whoa... when did 70% of children are born into single mother households? I seriously don't believe this, are u making this up?
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
Look at the birth stats for Black children in the US.
70% single mother households.
No, I'm not making it up.
40% of all UK children haven't seen their father in over a year too...
Feminism, saving the day again. What a great ideology huh?
factory2590 2 years ago
@factory2590 "40% of all UK children haven't seen their fathers in over a year".
I think you meant all UK children of divorce. Sounds about accurate to me.
Jabes1966 1 year ago
@Jabes1966 No, I mean 40% of ALL UK children. Look it up.
factory2590 1 year ago
@factory2590 I definitely believe in father's rights and try to spread the message as much as anybody, but I have to say that doesn't pass the sniff test.
I'll have to do some research on that. Great vids btw
Jabes1966 1 year ago
If you call that waking up, then you need another dose of no doze, son -- go back to sleep!
Again, what are your views on women? I want the whole spiel.
Dyakki 2 years ago
I don't care what you want. My views on women are evident throughout my writings, as well as my videos. In any case you'll eventually accuse me of some variation of the usual shaming tactics, and I have no patience for that boring-ass path anymore.
My views on women are completely irrelevant to the validity of my arguments, and the concept of "fairness". My view on Feminism, by way of contrast, is both germane and a matter of public record.
factory2590 2 years ago
If I am to take you at your word, then you are a misogynist who believes women are overstepping their bounds, couched in some nonsensacal hang-wringing. You are just like those who think gays want "too many rights" when they dare challenge social and religious pograms against them, just like those who say blacks asked for "too much" when they dared challenge the status quo. You too make the same arguments against women, if your "pubic record" is to be believed.
Dyakki 2 years ago
Which of my posts do you reference? Are you conflating the word "feminist" with the word "women"? I suspect so, nearly universally. Typical of a feminist.
There exists a divide between biology and ideology, much as you wish it were not so....
factory2590 2 years ago
Female and woman do not mean the same thing, if you want to be technical.
But, OK.
Dyakki 2 years ago
But contrary to what you may think, I believe you to be better than that, or at least, have the potential to be. That is why I want you to set the record straight on your views on women and equality. You know, I would be behind you 100% if your message was geared toward shoring up some of the legal and societal issues that hurt men especially, because of the prevailing, largely Western view of gender roles and socialization.
Dyakki 2 years ago
No, you would be with me 100% if I agreed with and espoused your own particular take on said gender roles and legal and societal issues.
We address those things plenty in the MRM, although I admit more work is necessary. But hey, we don't have Billions to play with...
My views on equality are the damn POINT of these videos. 100% parity in rights and responsibilities, no exceptions.
Something Feminism is against, vehemently, on all fronts. Ergo, the greatest threat at present.
factory2590 2 years ago
Yes, but as I see it, your views are warped, and ignore social reality. You cannot have parity without letting go of your emotional reasoning.
Dyakki 2 years ago
Parity is pretty easy. Look at the laws....do they treat both sexes the same? No? Then it is NOT equality, regardless of what your bullshit Patriarchy Theory(tm) says (without a shred of proof).
Look at the education boys get, vs girls. Look at the suicide rate of men (2nd or 3rd leading cause, depending on age group). And you Feminists are the ones standing in the way...NOT helping. You CROW when women best men, you smile when men are downtrodden...publicly, in newspapers.
Friend my ass
factory2590 2 years ago
Because that's what Feminists fight against too. Men have been hurt by these things, and I would be a fool to deny it, being male myself. So if that is your ONLY TRUE CAUSE, then I am behind you. But I fear you have erred along the way, especially in the idea of historical context. Instead of looking at the idea of patriarchy on its scientific and historical merits, you take it as some kind of affront to you own masculinity, or rather, as a blow against men themselves.
Dyakki 2 years ago
No, I look at the entire term "Patriarchy" as equating with "men / male power". I have since the early 1980's, and to this day, not one of you has ever been able to show how that term is not the most fitting for the concept.
Not one, ever, in almost 30 years.
Either the theory is awful vague (to the point of uselessness), or feminists can't explain shit.
factory2590 2 years ago
It IS a blow against men themselves.
If feminism is so damn beneficial, point to some real, actual, concrete, affects you every day measurably kind of effects Feminism has on men. Things MEN would agree are beneficial. I'm curious. The "ability to examine" anything, by the way, existed long before feminism...it used to be called "politics".
factory2590 2 years ago
Patriarchy is the structuring of family units based on the man, as father figure, having primary authority over the rest of the family members. Patriarchy also refers to the role of men in society more generally where men take primary responsibility over the welfare of the community as a whole. This authority often includes acting as the dominant figures in social, economic, and political procedures, including serving as representatives via public office.
Dyakki 2 years ago
So male authority then?
Yeah, that's real different from "male power" or "men".
So you propose to "free" men from their constraining gender roles by removing any vestige of choice?
Sound plan...
I'm out.
factory2590 2 years ago
And on that perceived offense, you then proceed to entrench yourself in intractable and ultimately indefensible arguments against the other gender; reason and logic well having been defenestrated ages ago. So again, I challenge you -- prove me wrong here and now, show me this is not what you are. Are you man enough?
Dyakki 2 years ago
Women can choose if they want to be a parent, in some states right up to age 12 (of the child), and walk away from parenthood with no financial or social obligation to continue that relationship. Men have no choices, in any regard, in this matter. And major feminist groups ardently work to maintain this every day.
Defend that, as a feminist, and show me how the patriarchy is responsible, and then we'll talk.
I'd suggest a video, comments are too short.
factory2590 2 years ago
See, this is the problem. It's hard to relate to you because of the angle you're coming from. You aren't seeing the whole issue. To you, it seems like men get the short end of the stick -- end of story. But to me, I see "men get the short end of the stick, and I understand WHY." Now, while I agree that things like this need to be shorn up, we cannot do that until we adress some of the larger social issues that women face. It's like you're skipping steps here.
Dyakki 2 years ago
So you are in the camp of "da menz deserve it".
That explains a lot, but it doesn't make you right. You still haven't even explained what "The PAtriarchy" is yet, but you insist not only that it's responsible for all sorts of wrong to women, but that all men benefitted from it as well, and that all men owe all women as a result.
That's a tall order.
I'd like you to prove even a smidge of that...
factory2590 2 years ago
Show me where I said "da menz deserve it" kind sir.
And I gave you a very competent definition of what patriarchy means. If you can't understand it, please refer to that illustrative aid we call the encyclopedia. :]
Dyakki 2 years ago
Oh god, the encyclopedia argument....
Explain to me, exactly, which issues women face, and how they are more important. Before you do so though, I would like you to list what you understand to be the issues faced by men.
I think that would be most informative.
As for "da menz deserve it"...which part about the equation between "patriarchy" and "men" did you miss? Couple that with your "reparations" stance, and what do you get??
factory2590 2 years ago
This reminds me of the popular male abortion argument "why don't I have a say." Easy for you to say that, but the social reality is very different. Do you have any idea how easy it is for you as a man, to impregnate a woman, and walk away with no consequences? If men can walk away from parenthood, why shouldn't women be able to, especially if they are left without the means to care for that child? So what are we to do when the woman keeps a child but the man walks away. Are we to allow this?
Dyakki 2 years ago
We allow women to do it daily. In fact, we defend their right to do so tooth and nail. We also deprive men of parental rights, stating they are not even able to gain custody in the case of adoption as there is no "familial bonding" without contact.
You invoke Biology when talking about women, but invoke the law when it comes to forcing men to "pony up".
You're tyrants, just on that issue alone.
It's not just hypocrisy, it's subjugation via family court.
factory2590 2 years ago
And again you miss the mark. How many times do I have to tell you Feminists are with you on the issue of custody. However, I must say that this issue is often contentious, and becomes a sparring point between the couple, with either side vying for custody as a way to "get back" at the other side. What about the child's rights? I think, first and foremost, factors should be mulled over to determine what is best the child, in that case, first and foremost.
Dyakki 2 years ago
There has been so much atrocity done in "the best interests of the children" (see: Adolf Hitler) that I'd rather NOT use that standard, thank you very much.
Again, feminists have had 40+ years to be "fair" to men, and to this day they continue to work against them. Child custody is DEFINITELY the main area they work against men.
It's documented thoroughly at Glenn Sacks' site...
Fighting against shared custody. False accusations of DV as scare tactic, Duluth Model of DV itself...etc..
factory2590 2 years ago
Yes, and if you really read what I was speaking about, you'd know it just some of the jingoistic, feel good "do it for the children" lipservice we often hear. But I will not deign a response the great spectre of Mr. Adolf, for he is a ghost and my work is with the embodied. And again, that is false. Feminists do not believe that women should have custody of children simple by virtue of 'womanhood.' Feminists fight against old tired gender tropes were created by patriarchy to begin with!
Dyakki 2 years ago
You keep saying that, and I keep giving examples of areas where feminists are indeed standing in men's way, aiming to do them harm. Far from fighting for more shared parenting, feminist groups are contending that family court is biased in men's favor, and is giving custody willy-nilly to child abusing devils..
And that's just one, incredibly blatant manner in which feminism attacks men.
And yet your kind thinks if you just come on here and say black is pink enough times, it'll happen...
factory2590 2 years ago
No, you keep giving examples of where you THINK that is happening, but that's just your bias showing, or perhaps your misunderstanding, or dislike, or some strange combination of a lot of things. But that's fine. Because I'm going to continue to point out where you're wrong, especially with the whole "family court being biased against men" -- show me a mainstream Feminist study that supports that claim, please, or any scientific study?
Dyakki 2 years ago
Mainstream feminist "studies" are about as academically rigorous as a 5th grade essay...
Every major "statistic" spouted by feminists is based on, or flat out is, false information.
1 in 4 women beaten on Superbowl Sunday. Lie
Women's standard of living goes down after divorce, men's goes up.
Lie
1 in 6 women raped in college.
Lie.
Every major "talking point", INCLUDING the "wage gap", is a lie.
Feminist "studies" are propaganda with data twisted to suit...
factory2590 2 years ago
@factory2590 Factory, "every" is a very solid word. It means 100% certainty, I don't think you should use that word. Scientists can't even use 100% certainty on gravity.
I'm not sure if the wage gap is a lie, your point is that women work less than men, but I thought the wage gap theory states that women get paid less for the SAME job. Also, I'm rather certain about the lower chance of promotion for women. I talked to someone that's been through that, it was really sad.
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
Hm... where did ur stats post go? o_0 To make things more even, I don't know where they got the the 1 in 6 women are raped in college thing... that's clearly not true... I'm in university, I have more than 6 friends.. there, disproved...
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
They pulled it out of their ass...you know, the same source nearly all Feminist "research"....
factory2590 2 years ago
Every study conducted lately into looking at this...EVERY (there's that word again) comprehensive study, shows that women's choices of work and hours dictate that "wage gap".
In other words, if women worked as hard, or as much, or in as dangerous/difficult of a job as men...they would actually OUTEARN men.
In major "blue" cities in the US, women under 35 outearn the men. And women dominate education....
That's the weakest of all Feminist talking points.
factory2590 2 years ago
Factory feminism is never meant to be fair to men, I don't know why you would expect that. You seem to think that feminism is some sort of equality police and is angry that they did a crappy job. They're a female rights group, of course they don't defend men... This is true for ALL rights groups. I don't recall any sort of group fighting black racism doing anything for the equality of white men, it's how rights groups work, you fight one side only.
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
They told everyone they were, they browbeat anyone who had a differing opinion, they shut down debate, and positioned themselves as experts and authorities.
You yourself are posing like that, telling me I don't understand, instead of listening.
Your ideology sold itself as being about Equality.
All you've done is added your name to the feminists who admit it was all really just a big fraudulent power-grab.
factory2590 2 years ago 11
@factory2590 *sigh* ok, I'll say this before anything else. everything I say here is an opinion, I never posed myself as any sort of expert, you on the other hand are. I merely don't have enough word counts to say I think before everything.
Now I'm not on the feminist group's marketing team so I have no clue what they're trying to sell themselves as. All I know is I see them as a force pushing for women's rights, and to give women the same rights as men in areas where they're lacking.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@factory2590 Also, feminism isn't a group you join, I didn't join a club where we go and carry out some leader's plans. It's just a belief that you live by, just like this men's rights thing you're doing. If some other guy fighting for men's rights go and kill 50 women out of pure hatred, I'm not gonna blame you for believe the same thing, though I'll probably watch you more carefully. My point is don't go and pick on feminism as the sole evil for your cause, it's too biased and one sided.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
@FlameltaSK0 Feminism doesn't address male issues because women are inherently selfish. Men are expected to tough it out in a way that women are not.
feministsAreCorrupt 1 year ago
@feministsAreCorrupt
"Feminism doesn't address male issues because women are inherently selfish" - don't agree, women are not inherently selfish, as mothers that trait would be destructive and humans wouldn't have survived this long. There are modern forces however, that encourage women to be selfish, I'll agree with that.
"Men are expected to tough it out in a way that women are not." - now this I do agree, but you have to tackle society and many times, men themselves to fix that.
FlameltaSK0 1 year ago
Or should we engage in recommendatory measures to address the situation, so that you cannot escape your reasonability once a child is born? It sounds like you want your cake and the ability to partake of it, but you cannot have it both ways. This is social reality.
Dyakki 2 years ago
How about legal parity with women? Is that so hard to understand?
She has the right to abortion, if he tells her he wants to leave her, she can make her decisions without impediment, but better understanding of the situation. Even AFTER the birth of the child she can decide for herself, yet men can't "because it's different".
NO, it's not different, at all.
Not one friggin bit.
And insisting it is only confirms why people like you are not helping men.
factory2590 2 years ago
I have absolutely no idea of what you're talking about here. If a woman is pregnant and decides to keep her child and the father is no where to be found, do you not think it is just to ask for some compensation from him? Similarly, if a father is left with a child, and the mother has walked away, he may also demand the same.
So, I don't get your point.
Dyakki 2 years ago
No, I do not think it is just to ask for compensation from him, unless he's married to her, and it's his kid.
None whatsoever.
If the father takes on the responsibility for the child willingly, and the mother makes clear her desire to remove herself totally, then no he doesn't either.
And asking the State to pay for her CHOICE to have a child is a non-starter too. If she can't afford it, there's always adoption.
OR
She could have a stable relationship and raise the kid like that. Her choice.
factory2590 2 years ago
Again, what? As I said before, people have to understand the child comes first in these cases, or SHOULD. Not whatever interests the parents have, especially if they are using the child as some kind of bargaining chip. Why should it matter if they are married. If you helped make the child, you should help pay for her support, if you can't otherwise be there. The same goes for the other party in the opposite scenario. Why is that so unfair? Talking about trying to call black pink.
Dyakki 2 years ago
No, "the children" are NOT paramount, and shouldn't be, ever. Not one successful society in history has ever been child centric like that. There have, however, been plenty of societies that use that line...
Nazi Germany.
Stalin's Russia...
Mao's China.
No marriage = no "commitment". Ask any woman, she'll tell you. As for live ins, well, that's covered under "he takes responsibility willingly".
See, there's that "choice" thing again.
factory2590 2 years ago
No I think as long as you're the father, you should have some sort of natural obligation to your child. But if before its birth, you specifically stated that you don't want anything to do with the child, and the mother still gave birth, then you can opt out. But if you're nowhere to be found you should have some sort of responsibility, or else we're promoting men to run away. You should be responsible for your own actions, but not letting you have a way out is not the way to go either.
FlameltaSK0 2 years ago
Right now, we force men into parenthood, even for one night stands they'll never see the kid from. We adopt out kids without even telling the father he is one, and force men to support children that aren't theirs.
We assign parenthood to men all the time, willing or unwilling does NOT matter..
NONE of this is foisted on women.
And ALL of it is based 100% purely, strictly, on the gender of the person involved.
THAT is systemic discrimination, and it's out in the open for all to see.
Feminist
factory2590 2 years ago
This is stone cold logic...there is nothing more to say...
Chrisiswrite 2 years ago
In Canada or the US the genital mutilation of infant baby boys is legal but infant baby girls is illegal. That is sexism but the feminists aren't complaining. I'm fed up with all the sexism. Women marry wealth, status, power. Girls the chap who collects your rubbish is an environmentalist. Stop being so fucking stuck up.
brendubab 2 years ago