haha the oldest trick 'read the bible' hes right but its a origanal story book take it for what it is a book of many mini fairytales its an ok book to read but for christ sake DONT TAKE IT SERIOUSLY FUKsake hav a laugh and move on with your life. )
@ThePhil909 you cant take it seriously if you have really read it, that's why catholics never encouraged people to read it and kept it in Latin, that way the priest can cherry pick from it, I never discount any possibility so if there is a God he wouldn't be impressed
I'm so glad your point was.... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) heard and understood by.... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) the vast amount of people who.... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) already feel the same way you... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) do.
I know no god than MY(<---BIG) only self ,as the One and Eternal.
and if you cant fit this idea in your tiny heads PLZ do not reply to me it would be a blasphemy.plus i cant spare MY divine time for your likings,after all I have send the small heads to hell allready.. peace and love MY(<-----truying to look bigger than i really am again obviously)sons
ok and daughters(<-----but you are the evil plus I dont like you for that apple staff back then)
While I dont share Penn's atheism, I do share his take on the Bible. And I salute that man. Some pale green thing in some of the Egypt protest footage resembles a horse so we got all these people citing biblical verses about egypt and swearing on their mothers that its one of the horsemen and this is armageddon. As I observe all the hype, I wonder what Penn would say about it
We cannot be sure if the Bible is baloney, we are just humans. The reason why I believe in God is because of all these unexplainable things such as ghosts and stuff. I have seen stuff that would turn a black man white.
@ThePoliticalMusician I have seen spooks but that doesn't prove there's a god . people blame gods for things they can't explain.Some times a spooky hag wakes me at night and holds me down in my bed, I cant scream or move and its terrifying and seems real. Im not the only one its a night terror dream, not real. God is possible but theres no real evidence I have seen
The Quran confirms some truths about the bible and talks about god and there is a hell and heaven like its in the bible and the quran. and my penn point is this guy is going to hell sooner than he thinks and "good people go to church". "weak people who could be influenced into doing something bad, dont go to church and dont believe in god neither the day of judgment" - in the words of a wise guy : " Chickity-check yo self before you wreck yo self"
I read a chapter (or a few, depending on how much free time I had) of the Bible a day, starting when I was thirteen. I'd read through it two and a half times by the time I was 18 and that was when I finally had to admit to my mother that I was an atheist. ....I started out really religious.
These poor guys. I wish them luck in finding a new career or..wherever they end up.
The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one. Human beings are relatively intelligent, but are limited to the modern day resources, dogma, and the unknown. So it is very unfair to say whether or not there is. We should admit, however, that we did come from somewhere. It's the fact that humans are relatively intelligent, however, that we get gnostic and cocky about it since selfishness is more convenient.
@jamesdragonforce "my source to confirm that I am not just bsing" correction for the first reply. I mean there are reputable and reliable sources on the internet llike the one I gave. But not all websites are reputable and reliable. And he made it seem like he had the fucking letter in his hand and knew that it was Jefferson's handwriting. He even stated "It is Jefferson's handwriting" how the fuck would he know? Does he have other Jefferson letters to compare to? Or is he a handwriting expert?
@jamesdragonforce "The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one."
1. The more general you are, the less it matters. Pick a specific god, and pin-point the god. You'll eventually find contradictions leading to the conclusion of a "false" god. Why does the difference between specifics and generality matter? Because "god is a personal god", and every time you check it against the specifics, *poof* goes God.
@jamesdragonforce "The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one."
2. Which God? Same from before, but from a different angle. Can you prove that there isn't a pink polka-dotted and omnipresent uni-lamb (no, it's not a unicorn; they're lying to you, those assholes)? Insert Pascal's wager, but in reference to this god I just now made up. Does that I say it's made up matter? Why? Ah, personal proof.
@jamesdragonforce "The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one."
3. You are God. Ridiculous? Can you prove to me that you exist? How do I know that I'm not talking to an advanced computer? Webcam? How do I know that you're not an advanced form of Japanese androidism? Oh, come on. Just admit it. Want me to shift the burden of proof a few more times?
@SomethingSea1 Why so many add hominem attacks, do you have trouble disproving my points? If you're going to reply to this, I'd like to see less of those.
"Why so many add hominem attacks, do you have trouble disproving my points? If you're going to reply to this, I'd like to see less of those."
Why did I waste my verbiage on you? You're thicker than a brick if you think I was doing adhoms. Is this an adhom? Yes. After I, unfortunately, actually used arguments to show you the error of your ways.
@jamesdragonforce "Human beings are relatively intelligent, but are limited to the modern day resources, dogma, and the unknown. So it is very unfair to say whether or not there is."
Unfair? And the horrors of religion aren't? Keep religion where it should be - in the non-descript - in deism - and you're still just barely keeping bigotry at arm's length. Yes, we came from somewhere, and it ain't a specific God. Perhaps some sort of "higher power"; and, necessarily, it is deistic.
@jamesdragonforce "It's the fact that humans are relatively intelligent, however, that we get gnostic and cocky about it since selfishness is more convenient."
There is something wrong with what they're doing...it's fine for them to be atheist, but to continue to collect a check for it is immoral, even if there is no God...and I have read the Bible, and it is Bullshit, but that conclusion does not inevitably lead to the other that there is no God...Just because "The Patriot" is bullshit doesn't mean there wasn't an American Revolution...
"Of the two commissioners who had concerted the amendatory clause for the gradual emancipation of slaves Mr. Wythe could not be present as being a member of the judiciary department, and Mr. Jefferson was absent on the legation to France"
Oh yeah because american soldiers where slaves in need of emancipation.
this is how the letter which the below quote is from begins "M. de Meusnier, where he mentions that the slave-law has been passed in Virginia, without the clause of emancipation, is pleased to mention that neither Mr. Wythe nor Mr. Jefferson were present to make the proposition they had meditated; from which people," and it was written by Jefferson and it is perserved letter still in existence to this day.
"What a stupendous, what an incomprehensible machine is man! Who can endure toil, famine, stripes, imprisonment & death itself in vindication of his own liberty, and the next moment ... inflict on his fellow men a bondage, one hour of which is fraught with more misery than ages of that which he rose in rebellion to oppose."-Thomas Jefferson, See a contradictory quote to your quote about him viewing slaves as animals if he did view them as animals he would not have said "Fellow Man".
@Empyreanmight He was talking about white men, you obviously have no idea that the reason blacks didn't have rights and weren't allowed to vote is because they weren't considered men, they were considered partly animals.
@adrenacrumb and it says "The rest of the letter" which implies that the letter also but not in these quotations addresses the treatment of american soldiers during the revolution. So why dont you look again.
@Empyreanmight and the next moment be deaf to all those motives whose power supported him thro’ his trial, and inflict on his fellow men a bondage, one hour of which is fraught with more misery than ages of that which he rose in rebellion to oppose. But we must await with patience the workings of an overruling providence, & hope that that is preparing the deliverance of these, our suffering brethren.
He was obviously talking about the prisoners of the British, you are so fucktarded it hurts.
@adrenacrumb yes "rest of letter" because these excerpts did not make up the whole letter and it reffered to the rest of the letter left out of this page. God way to take things out of context!!
@adrenacrumb Demeunier had queried Jefferson in reference to his article on the United States for the French Encyclopedia ("Etats Unis de l'Amerique," Dictionnaire d'Economie politique et diplomatique, l'Encyclopedie methodique.) This letter formed part of Jefferson's "Answers and Observations" in reply. The rest of the letter concerns alleged cases of cruelty against American prisoners of war on the part of the British during the Revolution. cont'd
@Empyreanmight Tell you what dipshit if he did say nice things about slaves as fellow men how about you post that, he surely did it more than once if at all.
@adrenacrumb "Of the two commissioners who had concerted the amendatory clause for the gradual emancipation of slaves Mr. Wythe could not be present as being a member of the judiciary department, and Mr. Jefferson was absent on the legation to France" How can you see this sentence in the fucking excerpt and still say it is about american soliders you fucking imbecile!!
@Empyreanmight "What a stupendous, what an incomprehensible machine is man! who can endure toil, famine, stripes, imprisonment, & death itself in vindication of his own liberty, and the next moment be deaf to all those motives whose power supported him thro’ his trial, and inflict on his fellow men a bondage, one hour of which is fraught with more misery than ages of that which he rose in rebellion to oppose."
what rebellion did black fight to impose he is congratulating them for?
@adrenacrumb or this fucking excerpt from it too "M. de Meusnier, where he mentions that the slave-law has been passed in Virginia, without the clause of emancipation, is pleased to mention that neither Mr. Wythe nor Mr. Jefferson were present to make the proposition they had meditated;" was it VIRGINIA LAW TO ENSLAVE ITS OWN SOLDIERLY? fucking idiot
@Empyreanmight You honestly just took stupidity to new heights, try reading the entire sentence next time. If you thought he was congratulating blacks for fighting a rebellion you are mentally retarded, no doubt.
@adrenacrumb this is the portion of the letter which talks about american soldiers fucktard "If M. de Meunier proposes to mention the facts of ... The death of upwards of eleven thousand American prisoners in one prison ". I found the full letter and it is As I fucking said it
abomination (slavery)must have an end. And there is a
superior bench reserved in heaven for those
who hasten it.—
To E. Rutledge. Washington ed. ii, 180. Ford ed., iv, 410.
(P. 1787). Go look up the Jeffersonian Cyclopedia and look up slavery under it because these are all his letters regarding it you fucking moron and under one of them still in the topic of slavery does it show the quote I posted.
@adrenacrumb and also its in the University of Virginia website and the University of Virginia was established by Jefferson and they still have alot of his original letters so you know that its is a reliable resource and not fucking wikipedia
@adrenacrumb so even though I am giving you several fucking quotes from his letters perserved by the Univeristy of Virgina that was established by Jefferson that somehow makes me a troll?
@Empyreanmight I have provided proof he beat slaves and called them animals, you lost. Again, you lost a long time ago, until you discredit those 2 facts it really doesn't matter what else you post.
@adrenacrumb proof from what. Name your sources that probably are not even reliable. I GAVE YOU FUCKING PROOF BY THE UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA WHO ACTUALLY HAS PERSERVED LETTERS FROM JEFFERSON!!! Who the fuck is trolling now. Because I completely destroyed your argument and you keep arguing in spite of all the sources I gave you from reputable locations.
@Empyreanmight His own handwriting isn't reliable? If you say so troll, if you say so. Do you realize how stupid you are arguing against words the man wrote himself?
@adrenacrumb yeah because you have one of his letters in your own fucking hand right? and what makes you an expert on handwriting how do you know it is his and not someone like you who make up shit without researching anything for themselves
@adrenacrumb Good I am glad because I am sick of listening to an idiot such as yourself who tries hard to hold on to hope that he is right and wont even give me his sources so I can determine for myself whether or not you are telling the truth or whether or not the source has any validity or authenticity or even expertise in the manner. And yet you call me an idiot even thought most my postings on jefferson came from letters of his which are still in perservation and I gave you my source.
@Empyreanmight Denying people's own handwriting is a good way to win an argument, that's how you know you are up against a real champion of the truth.
@Empyreanmight I think in the future we should toss out what people write unless we are there ourselves watching them write it. Good call on that one.
@furQuil Hey I did not deny it because he did not present his source. I asked him what his sources where and he failed to tell me. I gave him sources from the University of Virginia which was established by Jefferson and they have perserved letters and if you go to their website they have a cyclopedia of jefferson's letters catalogue electronicly so you can go to it for resources. Which I did and I gave him my source to confirm that I am just bsing. He did not link to me his sources cont'd
@furQuil So for all I know he is bsing. Its the same as college level writing if you want to quote something you have to make sure you cite your sources if you do not your teacher is going to give you an F because the teacher does not know whether the quotes are factual or just the writer making up stuff. And just because a website has something posted about jefferson does not nessicarily mean that it is real or fact. because I can create a website and say Jefferson was an alien.
@furQuil Jefferson quote that will put it all to rest "I have
supposed the black man, in his present state,
might not be in body and mind equal to the
white man; but it would be hazardous to affirm,
that, equally cultivated for a few generations,
he would not become so.—" in the present form to Jefferson they were like animals not in racial inferiority but in a lack of education. Here he even says that in a few generations they might be equal to white men
@furQuil Also may I add notes on virigina was written in 1781 but in 1809 he wrote a letter to Henri Gregoire Which he retracts his previous observations on the subject of "negroes" he even states that at first he did indeed think them as inferior but he attributes this to his limited observations within his own state and he even goes on to thank others for showing him the potential of the black race. So look up his letter to Henri Gregoire Washington. and the quote i just posted was from 1785
@furQuil I fucking read it idiot you just proved you dont read what others write. and Asshole our arguments span over 100 comments so its hard to keep track. I am supposed to go through and read all his comments over again just because I did not remember when he posted that notes on virginia comment? God you people are impossible to debate with because you stay on one over with comment from 100 comments ago and yet you do not address my other comments.
@adrenacrumb Now you are not even making sense. First of all my quotes were actually from perserved letters of his from the University of Virginia in which he established and I have not heard one fucking counterargument against that. You know why? Because you cant so you revert to an old topic and try to say "I was right about that" yeah right once out of 10 makes you great right. And that is assuming that you actually have reputable sources and not revisionist falsified info
@adrenacrumb You know what dont take my word for it but please visit the university of virginia's website and look under "The Jeffersonian Cyclopedia" and look under "S" for "Slavery" because all his letters regarding slavery are there and you can find out for yourself. That is if you are not some kind of pigheaded bastard.
@adrenacrumb OMG ACCORDING TO ONE OF HIS LETTERS HE WAS A CHAIRMAN OF A COMITTEE TO DRAFT AN EMANCIPATION OF SLAVERY FOR ALL OF THE US BUT IT DID NOT GET ENOUGH VOTES BY THE STATES. AND HERE IS HOW THE BILL GOES. "After
the year 1800 of the Christian era, there shall
be neither slavery nor involuntary servitude
in any of the said States, [452] otherwise than in
@adrenacrumb "toil, famine, stripes, imprisonment, & death itself in vindication of his own liberty" THIS PART IS IN REGARDS TO THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION AND THEN THIS PART "and the next moment be deaf to all those motives whose power supported him thro’ his trial, and inflict on his fellow men a bondage" IS REFERRING TO THEM TURNING AROUND AND ALLOWING SLAVERY. GOD YOU ARE SO FUCKIN DENSE
@adrenacrumb "Rest of Letter" does not mean all of letter. Obviously you do not know how to read. Why would they say "Rest Of" when they included anyway? Moron. Heres how it is in its context The excerpts shown on the page is in regards to the virginian law regagrding the emancipation of slaves (WHICH IS FUCKING SAYS IN THE FUCKING LETTER IF YOU KNEW HOW TO FUCKING READ). Then the rest of the letter (which was not included) is about american soliders. That is what its fucking context is.
"The Socratic method forces people "to confront their own dogmatism," according to Leonard Nelson, By doing so, participants in Socratic dialogue are, in effect,"forcing themselves to be free," Nelson maintains. But they’re not just confronted with their own dogmatism. In the course of a Socrates Café, they may be confronted with an array of hypotheses, convictions, conjectures and theories offered by the other participants, and themselves - all of which subscribe to some sort of dogma. cont'd
The ministers may feel a responsibility to their congregations to service them. They may not believe in god, but in some of the more beneficial aspects of belief and the Bible.
To connect two Pennpoints: reading the Bible CRITICALLY and with an open mind can make you an atheist (it made me one); just reading it may not.
There's nothing wrong with what they're doing except that there is no god...and also that some of these ministers are teaching our kids it's not OK to be gay, they will burn in hell for thinking about sex, et al. For those ministers, even if they're closet atheists, I have no sympathy. What's wrong is wrong and if they're going to continue that kind of behavior from the pulpit I have no respect for them--we can't just assume because they doubt god they aren't using religion to bully.
Wait.. Why would you have to read the Quran in Arabic? I mean, it's their rule, not yours. You're not a Muslim, so you can read it in whatever language you want... Kinda like the Masonic ring your friend wears, right?
Penn, what do you mean you can't learn arabic to read the Quran because you are going to die? Are you OK hun? I know we are all going to die someday but you made it sound like your death is fairly imminent. Considering the Rosseta Stone commercials say it takes about 18 months to learn arabic, you should have plenty of time(if indeed you ARE healthy) to learn it to read the Quran...then you can tell the rest of us what kind of crazy batshit lay within. Take care hun, be healthy.
@MelindaBane what he ment by saying he would die, is that if he puplically denounced koran theres a chance some muslim cleric would declare a fatwah on him.
@GenerationB0RED The Qur'an has a lot of poetic jibe that only makes sense in Arabic many of the words and sentences can't be translated or so I have been told...
Religion-a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.
2. a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.
Morality- conformity to the rules of right conduct; moral or virtuous conduct.
2. moral quality or character.
3. virtue in sexual matters; chastity.
4. a doctrine or system of morals.
5. moral instruction; a moral lesson, precept, discourse, or utterance.
6. morality play. Back then religions had different versions of what was right and wrong. But we follow through our laws and policies the christian teachings of what is right and wrong. Therefore christian morality
@adrenacrumb and Thomas Jefferson and James Madison did not slaughter the indians themselves you imbecile. That crime was performed by those who came before and after them. Jefferson wrote the declarationa dn Madison the constitution. Jefferson wanted to abolish slavery but had to compromise in order to fight a war against the crown.
@Empyreanmight Jefferson was like no no no I want to abolish slavery but I can't so I guess I may as well have 100's of slaves at my house that I beat daily.
@adrenacrumb you really NEED TO FUCKING EDUCATED YOURSELF. There is historical eye witness accounts by his slaves and friends that stated that JEFFERSON TREATED HIS SLAVES LIKE FAMILY!!! Now who the fuck needs to be educated.
@Empyreanmight Jefferson gave his overseerers the explicit right to beat his slaves, you have no idea what you are talking about. Do you have people in your family beaten?
@adrenacrumb Now this argument has gone on long enough and I leave to everyone else (besides you) to determine who made the better argument. The person who makes assumptions (by stating made could have been good without religion ever existing) or the person who actually uses examples and quotes other philosophers who dealt in that subject. Go take a sociology class because it makes my argument for me. Basically all of your issues is complete contradictory to sociologist theory
@Empyreanmight "Stanton says children suffered physical violence. When James, a different slave and 17 at the time, was sick, one overseer whipped him "three times in one day." There were additional incidents over the years, and violence was commonplace on plantations, including Jefferson’s. According to Marguerite Hughes, Jefferson used "a severe punishment" like whippings when runaways were captured and he sometimes "sold" them to "discourage women to gain freedom."
@adrenacrumb Those were the slaves on his other plantations which he left their fate up to his hired overseers. He had his own slaves the ones who worked in his house present by request upon his death bed.
@Empyreanmight Okay you are retarded, Jefferson himself gave orders to have his slaves beaten period point blank you were wrong you will always be wrong, goodbye.
@adrenacrumb Whats funny is you looked it up and quoted it. Therefore you did not even know beforehand so how can you call me stupid for being wrong when you yourself did not even know until I mentioned it. If it was not for your distrust of what I was saying you would not have researched it and would have remained ignorant to it. It was my Professor who told me this so I am sorry if I took his word for it.
@Empyreanmight You do not know shit about socialization do you. I said t can be abused and led to religion. Whenever you have a mass of people following a philosophy it will ultimatly turn to religion. And I am an idiot even though it has been proven time and time again with the religions we have now. FOR CHRIST FUCKING SAKES LOOK AT SCIENTOLOGY! Seriously take a sociology class because you would get an F with the answers you have
@Empyreanmight Do you even know what the Socratic method is? Obviously you don't or you would realize trying to make the Socratic method dogmatic is maybe the dumbest thing ever said.
@adrenacrumb obviously you do not know what the socratic method is. Because you claim to be a practioner but your argument contradicts it. Because the Socratic method is a system of self-evalution always questioning yourself and evaluating the contradictions within your own beliefs. And I am not saying that philosophy itself leads to religion but that the meaning could be lost to the masses and they can corrupt it into a religion. It has happened before.
@adrenacrumbYou really need to learn about human nature before spouting off at the mouth.You think that the only reason why people are bad is because they have the wrong belief system?Religion was created by man.It was not an immaculate conception.You people think that religion is a deviation from mans true and good nature.As if religion was this supernatural force which possessed people and cause them to do things that go against their nature. cont'd.
@adrenacrumb and you think the socratic method would be any different. Given that in the past people would start revolutions on a idea then go completely 180. Look at Maximillain Robespierre and Joesph Stalin. They preached a certain ideology and thought that their is no way they could be corrupted because their ideology in their minds were incorruptible. Robespierre was at the head of the french revolution and wanted liberty and constitutionalism then he became a tyrant once in power.
@Empyreanmight The ENTIRE POINT of the Socratic method is to constantly question everything, how in the hell is something that solely relies on not being dogmatic going to turn dogmatic?
@adrenacrumb.Do you think Christ wanted his preaching's to become dogmatic or Marx for that matter. Why dont you read Mark and see how quickly his philosophy which from just that could not have turned people into tyrants but they had. And plus you have made my point bu stating you followed socratic method but still calling me stupid when socrates even said "True Knowledge is the belief that you know nothing". You have just proved yourself that the true meaning of the socratic method can be lost.
@Empyreanmight Yea when you threaten to throw people in fire for eternity if they don't obey your words then that pretty much means you are dogmatic. You don't understand what Socrates meant by that.
@adrenacrumb How about this you fucking let people believe whatever the fuck they want and stop being such a totalitarian asswipe. Its called be a practioner of free will and you do not like it when christians try to exert their will over you so what makes you think its ok for you to fucking do it? You are the biggest hypocrite idiot out there. Socrates was about self-evalution not evalution of others. Which you do! Tell me do you actually try to find flaws of your beliefs?
@adrenacrumb so you are so much better than those poor diluted religious types right?Do you think that statement goes well with the Socratic Method?Socratic Method is a negative evalution of oneself. So far all you have done is negativly evaluate others you hypocrite.So go blindly say you follow socrates without even knowing what the fuck he even said and what he meant by it.I am done with you!Now I am going christmas shopping because unlike you I do not hold myself above celebrating the holiday
@Empyreanmight Firstly, at least go to wikipedia and read the first sentence about the Socratic method. Secondly, who said I don't celebrate the holidays? You are worthless.
@adrenacrumb Ha! everyone with a brain knows that wikipedia is not a reliable source. and anyways Socratic Method is an open philosophy and has many aspects to it most of which relies on self-evalution of you speak of the appeals to logic. Then everyone practices socratic method because everyone uses logic or contradictions to confound other's beliefs. Socrates also said alot of contradictions himself. cont'd
@adrenacrumb "The Socratic method requires that - honestly and openly, rationally and imaginatively - they confront the dogma by asking such questions as: What does this mean? What speaks for and against it? Are there alternative ways of considering it that are even more plausible and tenable?"- taken from philosopher website You so called version of the socratic method is merely tribalism. You attack those who you do not agree with without using any logic or reasoning. Like a rabid dog
@adrenacrumb and I was partially correct about jefferson. He did treat some of his slaves like family and even paid some of them. This is after doing more research cause it was conflicting that a history professor would tell me something that was false. But according to other sources (Not wikipedia which you got your's from) some of his slaves did not want to leave Jefferson's possession during a time when jefferson wanted to abolish slavery in Monticello.
@Empyreanmight Seriously know what you are talking about before talking nonsense to people, you've corrected yourself on every single topic and you still don't know what the hell you are talking about.
@Empyreanmight I have no desire for someone who states things as facts even though they are entirely wrong and then goes to find out if there is anything that backs up their stupid statements, like I said before go get an education, you are just making Christians look like morons.
@adrenacrumb so I do not know what I am talking about even though my last posts were quotes from other sources. and now you are going on a tirade how I do not know what I am talking instead of properly responding which sets the context for my favorite quote "Insults are the arguments employed by those who are in the wrong." -Jean Jacques Rousseau. Now this refers to when you shut down and stop debating and just go on a tirade about the opposition. Which you have just done.
@Empyreanmight Jefferson ordered for people to be beaten viciously, who cares how he treated some of his slaves, you lost, it's over, it was over a while ago.
@adrenacrumb from what source did you get that from? and did it say "viciously" because remember in those days they beat their kids. and you were partially wrong because you assumed that he treated all his slaves poorly and you just got lucky in so that you found a source that confirms it. And you said that I was entirly wrong because I assumed that they all were treated like family. But some did get treated poorly and some did get treated badly. So how are you right?
@Empyreanmight Okay listen you're done you can't even read what I posted, you are such a dope.
According to Marguerite Hughes, Jefferson used "a severe punishment" like whippings when runaways were captured and he sometimes "sold" them to "discourage other men and women from attempting to gain their freedom."
read moron read, it was right in the post where it was from. Read dumbass
@adrenacrumb One account from one perspective it does not mean he did not treat some of his slaves like family. You are trust arguing what I have said that he treated some poorly and some like family. Just because you have on eyewitness testimony to support the claim that in that instance he treated a certain number of slaves poorly does not equate to all. one does not equal all. Why dont you read my posts.
@adrenacrumb Edmund Bacon, Monticello’s overseer for sixteen years recalled that Jefferson “was always very kind and indulgent to his servants. He would hardly ever allow them to be overworked, and he would hardly ever allow one of them to be whipped.” But by law, Jefferson’s slaves were his property. And he treated them as property. Heres one eyewitness testimony for you and I am going to act like you and say that because I have one that means I am in the right
@Empyreanmight Okay you just posted something that said he had his slaved whipped, how stupid are you honestly? No, I didn't say he beat all of his slaves, you are unreal.
@adrenacrumbthe point is you were saying "HE DID NOT TREAT HIS SLAVES LIKE FAMILY". in which some cases he did. and just because he whipped ONE SLAVE does not negate that he was kind to certain slaves. Seriously how is this not getting through to you? So if I had two ducks and I beat the crap out of one and treated the other like a saint by your logic it can be assumed that I was mean to both my ducks?
haha the oldest trick 'read the bible' hes right but its a origanal story book take it for what it is a book of many mini fairytales its an ok book to read but for christ sake DONT TAKE IT SERIOUSLY FUKsake hav a laugh and move on with your life. )
ThePhil909 2 months ago in playlist Season 1
@ThePhil909 you cant take it seriously if you have really read it, that's why catholics never encouraged people to read it and kept it in Latin, that way the priest can cherry pick from it, I never discount any possibility so if there is a God he wouldn't be impressed
MrROTD 3 weeks ago
@MrROTD um blabla wtf? r with me or against couldnt make out wht u were saying confused
ThePhil909 3 weeks ago
I'm so glad your point was.... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) heard and understood by.... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) the vast amount of people who.... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) already feel the same way you... (We interrupt this to say that this comment is brought to you by Audible dot com) do.
teknotoast 4 months ago
The fastest way to become an atheist is to read the bible
Justwosweet 8 months ago 6
@Justwosweet I only made it a lttle ways in before I was like wtf?
MrROTD 3 weeks ago
I know no god than MY(<---BIG) only self ,as the One and Eternal.
and if you cant fit this idea in your tiny heads PLZ do not reply to me it would be a blasphemy.plus i cant spare MY divine time for your likings,after all I have send the small heads to hell allready.. peace and love MY(<-----truying to look bigger than i really am again obviously)sons
ok and daughters(<-----but you are the evil plus I dont like you for that apple staff back then)
avida13 9 months ago
@avida13 wat
TheEvilCouncill 9 months ago
@avida13 hassa diga ebowai then
MrROTD 3 weeks ago
Penn, you can find English versions of the Qu'ran.
Yeezyy1 10 months ago
I always skip through the begotten family trees.
IntrovertedLuddite2 1 year ago
While I dont share Penn's atheism, I do share his take on the Bible. And I salute that man. Some pale green thing in some of the Egypt protest footage resembles a horse so we got all these people citing biblical verses about egypt and swearing on their mothers that its one of the horsemen and this is armageddon. As I observe all the hype, I wonder what Penn would say about it
serenabear113 1 year ago
We cannot be sure if the Bible is baloney, we are just humans. The reason why I believe in God is because of all these unexplainable things such as ghosts and stuff. I have seen stuff that would turn a black man white.
ThePoliticalMusician 1 year ago
@ThePoliticalMusician You are right that we don't know. That is no reason to just believe whatever BS someone made up though.
finerbiner 1 year ago
@ThePoliticalMusician I have seen spooks but that doesn't prove there's a god . people blame gods for things they can't explain.Some times a spooky hag wakes me at night and holds me down in my bed, I cant scream or move and its terrifying and seems real. Im not the only one its a night terror dream, not real. God is possible but theres no real evidence I have seen
MrROTD 3 weeks ago
The Quran confirms some truths about the bible and talks about god and there is a hell and heaven like its in the bible and the quran. and my penn point is this guy is going to hell sooner than he thinks and "good people go to church". "weak people who could be influenced into doing something bad, dont go to church and dont believe in god neither the day of judgment" - in the words of a wise guy : " Chickity-check yo self before you wreck yo self"
90260 1 year ago
coffee jello? i'm listening!!
muddack 1 year ago
Heh, I just got the joke in the title of this video.
How slow on the uptake am I?
Recreant456 1 year ago
it was a 5.44 minut comercial... GOOD JOB PENN! >:(
creamtube 1 year ago
I read a chapter (or a few, depending on how much free time I had) of the Bible a day, starting when I was thirteen. I'd read through it two and a half times by the time I was 18 and that was when I finally had to admit to my mother that I was an atheist. ....I started out really religious.
These poor guys. I wish them luck in finding a new career or..wherever they end up.
Eliada 1 year ago 4
I've said to people before that I'd be willing to go to church if only they weren't religious.
Ganthan 1 year ago
lmao you guys take the gideon bibles and toss them out. i think i might start doing the same thing.. thanks for the idea.
BornwithoutYahweh 1 year ago
The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one. Human beings are relatively intelligent, but are limited to the modern day resources, dogma, and the unknown. So it is very unfair to say whether or not there is. We should admit, however, that we did come from somewhere. It's the fact that humans are relatively intelligent, however, that we get gnostic and cocky about it since selfishness is more convenient.
jamesdragonforce 1 year ago
@jamesdragonforce "my source to confirm that I am not just bsing" correction for the first reply. I mean there are reputable and reliable sources on the internet llike the one I gave. But not all websites are reputable and reliable. And he made it seem like he had the fucking letter in his hand and knew that it was Jefferson's handwriting. He even stated "It is Jefferson's handwriting" how the fuck would he know? Does he have other Jefferson letters to compare to? Or is he a handwriting expert?
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@jamesdragonforce "The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one."
1. The more general you are, the less it matters. Pick a specific god, and pin-point the god. You'll eventually find contradictions leading to the conclusion of a "false" god. Why does the difference between specifics and generality matter? Because "god is a personal god", and every time you check it against the specifics, *poof* goes God.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@jamesdragonforce "The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one."
2. Which God? Same from before, but from a different angle. Can you prove that there isn't a pink polka-dotted and omnipresent uni-lamb (no, it's not a unicorn; they're lying to you, those assholes)? Insert Pascal's wager, but in reference to this god I just now made up. Does that I say it's made up matter? Why? Ah, personal proof.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@jamesdragonforce "The only issue that I take with this is you can't really know if there is a god, but neither can we know that there is an absence of one."
3. You are God. Ridiculous? Can you prove to me that you exist? How do I know that I'm not talking to an advanced computer? Webcam? How do I know that you're not an advanced form of Japanese androidism? Oh, come on. Just admit it. Want me to shift the burden of proof a few more times?
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@SomethingSea1 Why so many add hominem attacks, do you have trouble disproving my points? If you're going to reply to this, I'd like to see less of those.
jamesdragonforce 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"Why so many add hominem attacks, do you have trouble disproving my points? If you're going to reply to this, I'd like to see less of those."
Why did I waste my verbiage on you? You're thicker than a brick if you think I was doing adhoms. Is this an adhom? Yes. After I, unfortunately, actually used arguments to show you the error of your ways.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
@jamesdragonforce "Human beings are relatively intelligent, but are limited to the modern day resources, dogma, and the unknown. So it is very unfair to say whether or not there is."
Unfair? And the horrors of religion aren't? Keep religion where it should be - in the non-descript - in deism - and you're still just barely keeping bigotry at arm's length. Yes, we came from somewhere, and it ain't a specific God. Perhaps some sort of "higher power"; and, necessarily, it is deistic.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@jamesdragonforce "It's the fact that humans are relatively intelligent, however, that we get gnostic and cocky about it since selfishness is more convenient."
Simply the other side of the religion coin.
SomethingSea1 1 year ago
There is something wrong with what they're doing...it's fine for them to be atheist, but to continue to collect a check for it is immoral, even if there is no God...and I have read the Bible, and it is Bullshit, but that conclusion does not inevitably lead to the other that there is no God...Just because "The Patriot" is bullshit doesn't mean there wasn't an American Revolution...
puremilkgenius 1 year ago
i use to love what you say but u should of left religion out. Stick to polictics
mgfurst 1 year ago
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Empyreanmight 1 year ago
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Empyreanmight 1 year ago
"Of the two commissioners who had concerted the amendatory clause for the gradual emancipation of slaves Mr. Wythe could not be present as being a member of the judiciary department, and Mr. Jefferson was absent on the legation to France"
Oh yeah because american soldiers where slaves in need of emancipation.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Okay you seriously just wnet beyond stupid.
wfu . edu/~zulick/340/Jefferson . html
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb you need to fucking read it it says Virginia laws. tyeah it was virginia law to enlsave american soliders.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight When he talked about his fellow men it meant war prisoners, had nothing to do with blacks, you just failed hard.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
this is how the letter which the below quote is from begins "M. de Meusnier, where he mentions that the slave-law has been passed in Virginia, without the clause of emancipation, is pleased to mention that neither Mr. Wythe nor Mr. Jefferson were present to make the proposition they had meditated; from which people," and it was written by Jefferson and it is perserved letter still in existence to this day.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Because you cut the quote off early dumbass, read the whole quote.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
"What a stupendous, what an incomprehensible machine is man! Who can endure toil, famine, stripes, imprisonment & death itself in vindication of his own liberty, and the next moment ... inflict on his fellow men a bondage, one hour of which is fraught with more misery than ages of that which he rose in rebellion to oppose."-Thomas Jefferson, See a contradictory quote to your quote about him viewing slaves as animals if he did view them as animals he would not have said "Fellow Man".
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Go look up in his own handwriting in his own journal that he called them animals, this isn't debatable.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight He was talking about white men, you obviously have no idea that the reason blacks didn't have rights and weren't allowed to vote is because they weren't considered men, they were considered partly animals.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb No he wasnt you fucking idiot. This was a letter in response to a new law concering slavery in virginia
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Uh no, look again, he was addressing the treatment of American soldiers of war when saying that.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb and it says "The rest of the letter" which implies that the letter also but not in these quotations addresses the treatment of american soldiers during the revolution. So why dont you look again.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight and the next moment be deaf to all those motives whose power supported him thro’ his trial, and inflict on his fellow men a bondage, one hour of which is fraught with more misery than ages of that which he rose in rebellion to oppose. But we must await with patience the workings of an overruling providence, & hope that that is preparing the deliverance of these, our suffering brethren.
He was obviously talking about the prisoners of the British, you are so fucktarded it hurts.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb THIS LETTER IS IN REGARDS TO FUCKING VIRGINIAN LAW. READ THE WHOLE FUCKING THING MORON
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight "The rest of the letter concerns alleged cases
of cruelty against American prisoners of war on the part of the British during the Revolution."
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb yes "rest of letter" because these excerpts did not make up the whole letter and it reffered to the rest of the letter left out of this page. God way to take things out of context!!
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight die plz, learn to read.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Demeunier had queried Jefferson in reference to his article on the United States for the French Encyclopedia ("Etats Unis de l'Amerique," Dictionnaire d'Economie politique et diplomatique, l'Encyclopedie methodique.) This letter formed part of Jefferson's "Answers and Observations" in reply. The rest of the letter concerns alleged cases of cruelty against American prisoners of war on the part of the British during the Revolution. cont'd
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Tell you what dipshit if he did say nice things about slaves as fellow men how about you post that, he surely did it more than once if at all.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb "Of the two commissioners who had concerted the amendatory clause for the gradual emancipation of slaves Mr. Wythe could not be present as being a member of the judiciary department, and Mr. Jefferson was absent on the legation to France" How can you see this sentence in the fucking excerpt and still say it is about american soliders you fucking imbecile!!
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight "What a stupendous, what an incomprehensible machine is man! who can endure toil, famine, stripes, imprisonment, & death itself in vindication of his own liberty, and the next moment be deaf to all those motives whose power supported him thro’ his trial, and inflict on his fellow men a bondage, one hour of which is fraught with more misery than ages of that which he rose in rebellion to oppose."
what rebellion did black fight to impose he is congratulating them for?
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb or this fucking excerpt from it too "M. de Meusnier, where he mentions that the slave-law has been passed in Virginia, without the clause of emancipation, is pleased to mention that neither Mr. Wythe nor Mr. Jefferson were present to make the proposition they had meditated;" was it VIRGINIA LAW TO ENSLAVE ITS OWN SOLDIERLY? fucking idiot
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Seriously learn to read this is pathetic.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight You honestly just took stupidity to new heights, try reading the entire sentence next time. If you thought he was congratulating blacks for fighting a rebellion you are mentally retarded, no doubt.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb this is the portion of the letter which talks about american soldiers fucktard "If M. de Meunier proposes to mention the facts of ... The death of upwards of eleven thousand American prisoners in one prison ". I found the full letter and it is As I fucking said it
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight You seriously have no clue and can't read a sentence.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Just find somewhere else he refered to blacks as his fellow man or stop wasting my time.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb This
abomination (slavery)must have an end. And there is a
superior bench reserved in heaven for those
who hasten it.—
To E. Rutledge. Washington ed. ii, 180. Ford ed., iv, 410.
(P. 1787). Go look up the Jeffersonian Cyclopedia and look up slavery under it because these are all his letters regarding it you fucking moron and under one of them still in the topic of slavery does it show the quote I posted.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb and also its in the University of Virginia website and the University of Virginia was established by Jefferson and they still have alot of his original letters so you know that its is a reliable resource and not fucking wikipedia
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Okay, it was his own handwritting where he called them animals, not wikipedia. You have trolled enough, die.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb so even though I am giving you several fucking quotes from his letters perserved by the Univeristy of Virgina that was established by Jefferson that somehow makes me a troll?
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight I have provided proof he beat slaves and called them animals, you lost. Again, you lost a long time ago, until you discredit those 2 facts it really doesn't matter what else you post.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb proof from what. Name your sources that probably are not even reliable. I GAVE YOU FUCKING PROOF BY THE UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA WHO ACTUALLY HAS PERSERVED LETTERS FROM JEFFERSON!!! Who the fuck is trolling now. Because I completely destroyed your argument and you keep arguing in spite of all the sources I gave you from reputable locations.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight His own handwriting isn't reliable? If you say so troll, if you say so. Do you realize how stupid you are arguing against words the man wrote himself?
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb yeah because you have one of his letters in your own fucking hand right? and what makes you an expert on handwriting how do you know it is his and not someone like you who make up shit without researching anything for themselves
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Yea, you're blocked.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Good I am glad because I am sick of listening to an idiot such as yourself who tries hard to hold on to hope that he is right and wont even give me his sources so I can determine for myself whether or not you are telling the truth or whether or not the source has any validity or authenticity or even expertise in the manner. And yet you call me an idiot even thought most my postings on jefferson came from letters of his which are still in perservation and I gave you my source.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Denying people's own handwriting is a good way to win an argument, that's how you know you are up against a real champion of the truth.
furQuil 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight I think in the future we should toss out what people write unless we are there ourselves watching them write it. Good call on that one.
furQuil 1 year ago
@furQuil Hey I did not deny it because he did not present his source. I asked him what his sources where and he failed to tell me. I gave him sources from the University of Virginia which was established by Jefferson and they have perserved letters and if you go to their website they have a cyclopedia of jefferson's letters catalogue electronicly so you can go to it for resources. Which I did and I gave him my source to confirm that I am just bsing. He did not link to me his sources cont'd
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@furQuil So for all I know he is bsing. Its the same as college level writing if you want to quote something you have to make sure you cite your sources if you do not your teacher is going to give you an F because the teacher does not know whether the quotes are factual or just the writer making up stuff. And just because a website has something posted about jefferson does not nessicarily mean that it is real or fact. because I can create a website and say Jefferson was an alien.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight He said it is from his 'Notes on the State of Virginia' printed as a book in 1785, you really should learn to read.
furQuil 1 year ago
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Empyreanmight 1 year ago
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Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@furQuil Jefferson quote that will put it all to rest "I have
supposed the black man, in his present state,
might not be in body and mind equal to the
white man; but it would be hazardous to affirm,
that, equally cultivated for a few generations,
he would not become so.—" in the present form to Jefferson they were like animals not in racial inferiority but in a lack of education. Here he even says that in a few generations they might be equal to white men
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
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Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@furQuil Also may I add notes on virigina was written in 1781 but in 1809 he wrote a letter to Henri Gregoire Which he retracts his previous observations on the subject of "negroes" he even states that at first he did indeed think them as inferior but he attributes this to his limited observations within his own state and he even goes on to thank others for showing him the potential of the black race. So look up his letter to Henri Gregoire Washington. and the quote i just posted was from 1785
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight You don't even bother reading what other people type, I'm obviously not going to have a 'conversation' with you. Blocked as well.
furQuil 1 year ago
@furQuil I fucking read it idiot you just proved you dont read what others write. and Asshole our arguments span over 100 comments so its hard to keep track. I am supposed to go through and read all his comments over again just because I did not remember when he posted that notes on virginia comment? God you people are impossible to debate with because you stay on one over with comment from 100 comments ago and yet you do not address my other comments.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Empyreanmight Kid if you were any dumber your parents would be court ordered to keep you on a leash.
furQuil 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight I mean why would we trust what he thought by notes written in his own hand, that isn't reliable. Again, you are a moron.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Now you are not even making sense. First of all my quotes were actually from perserved letters of his from the University of Virginia in which he established and I have not heard one fucking counterargument against that. You know why? Because you cant so you revert to an old topic and try to say "I was right about that" yeah right once out of 10 makes you great right. And that is assuming that you actually have reputable sources and not revisionist falsified info
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb You know what dont take my word for it but please visit the university of virginia's website and look under "The Jeffersonian Cyclopedia" and look under "S" for "Slavery" because all his letters regarding slavery are there and you can find out for yourself. That is if you are not some kind of pigheaded bastard.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb OMG ACCORDING TO ONE OF HIS LETTERS HE WAS A CHAIRMAN OF A COMITTEE TO DRAFT AN EMANCIPATION OF SLAVERY FOR ALL OF THE US BUT IT DID NOT GET ENOUGH VOTES BY THE STATES. AND HERE IS HOW THE BILL GOES. "After
the year 1800 of the Christian era, there shall
be neither slavery nor involuntary servitude
in any of the said States, [452] otherwise than in
punishment of crimes, whereof the party shall
have been duly convicted to have been personally
guilty.—"
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb "toil, famine, stripes, imprisonment, & death itself in vindication of his own liberty" THIS PART IS IN REGARDS TO THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION AND THEN THIS PART "and the next moment be deaf to all those motives whose power supported him thro’ his trial, and inflict on his fellow men a bondage" IS REFERRING TO THEM TURNING AROUND AND ALLOWING SLAVERY. GOD YOU ARE SO FUCKIN DENSE
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight No he isn't. Listen if you can't even read I can't help you, you are seriously dumb as hell.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb "Rest of Letter" does not mean all of letter. Obviously you do not know how to read. Why would they say "Rest Of" when they included anyway? Moron. Heres how it is in its context The excerpts shown on the page is in regards to the virginian law regagrding the emancipation of slaves (WHICH IS FUCKING SAYS IN THE FUCKING LETTER IF YOU KNEW HOW TO FUCKING READ). Then the rest of the letter (which was not included) is about american soliders. That is what its fucking context is.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Post something else saying the same thing, shouldn't be hard should it?
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
Look at Penn's face.
*
It is HUGE and RED, because he is ALREADY DEAD.
g4macdad 1 year ago
"Spread the other cheek" is not an atheist ideal...
SirWinstonChurchill 1 year ago
The prim minster of Australia (Julia Gillard) is Atheist.
DavRainbow6 1 year ago
the bible highest grossing worste piece of fiction ever.
christinepeace 1 year ago
Penn and Tell should recycle the bibles!
beenz07 1 year ago
There isn't a person on earth who isn't a hypocrite. And down with all organized religions. They're all...well.......BULLSHIT!
job1866 1 year ago
congrats on 100 vids, Penn!
El3ctricPenguin 1 year ago
"The Socratic method forces people "to confront their own dogmatism," according to Leonard Nelson, By doing so, participants in Socratic dialogue are, in effect,"forcing themselves to be free," Nelson maintains. But they’re not just confronted with their own dogmatism. In the course of a Socrates Café, they may be confronted with an array of hypotheses, convictions, conjectures and theories offered by the other participants, and themselves - all of which subscribe to some sort of dogma. cont'd
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
The ministers may feel a responsibility to their congregations to service them. They may not believe in god, but in some of the more beneficial aspects of belief and the Bible.
To connect two Pennpoints: reading the Bible CRITICALLY and with an open mind can make you an atheist (it made me one); just reading it may not.
KevJJ888 1 year ago
There's nothing wrong with what they're doing except that there is no god...and also that some of these ministers are teaching our kids it's not OK to be gay, they will burn in hell for thinking about sex, et al. For those ministers, even if they're closet atheists, I have no sympathy. What's wrong is wrong and if they're going to continue that kind of behavior from the pulpit I have no respect for them--we can't just assume because they doubt god they aren't using religion to bully.
cbn620 1 year ago
Many ministers in this situation convert to Unitarian-Universalism.
FatherBrain 1 year ago
Hahaha, there's an advertisement next to this video for a religious channel of some sort. :D
elessarbre 1 year ago
Wait.. Why would you have to read the Quran in Arabic? I mean, it's their rule, not yours. You're not a Muslim, so you can read it in whatever language you want... Kinda like the Masonic ring your friend wears, right?
tybo09 1 year ago
@tybo09 I think it's more of a thing about meanings lost in translations
koncewiczd 1 year ago
You want Harry Potter to beat the Bible? :(
I vote for George Carlin's "Brain Droppings".
Far better book and they have no clue how to make a movie from it.
tybo09 1 year ago
Sermon on the mount is great stuff? Oo But that's where Jesus introduced thought crimes.
FishofMuu 1 year ago
Penn is God. ;-)
LBurris597 1 year ago
@LBurris597 Would that mean Penn doesn't believe in himself? That's sad... Shouldn't everyone believe in themselves?
tybo09 1 year ago
I'm looking forward to finding out what coffee jell-o is!
TheNewfiegal78 1 year ago
@TheNewfiegal78
Me too -- I live in NY and was forced into catholicism -- we never got coffee jello!
Just some moldy old wine and cheap wafers that they called a "host" -- what the fuck?
surgeyX 1 year ago
Penn, what do you mean you can't learn arabic to read the Quran because you are going to die? Are you OK hun? I know we are all going to die someday but you made it sound like your death is fairly imminent. Considering the Rosseta Stone commercials say it takes about 18 months to learn arabic, you should have plenty of time(if indeed you ARE healthy) to learn it to read the Quran...then you can tell the rest of us what kind of crazy batshit lay within. Take care hun, be healthy.
MelindaBane 1 year ago
@MelindaBane what he ment by saying he would die, is that if he puplically denounced koran theres a chance some muslim cleric would declare a fatwah on him.
TrevHead10 1 year ago
Why can't you read a translation of the Qur'an? Isn't the Bible translated?
GenerationB0RED 1 year ago
@GenerationB0RED The Qur'an has a lot of poetic jibe that only makes sense in Arabic many of the words and sentences can't be translated or so I have been told...
Darkwizzrobe 1 year ago
Actually, reading the entire Bible I found to be very fulfilling. At the very least it has a lot of insight into the human condition.
Even the crazy stuff is pretty cool. Like the story of Ehud.
svd348 1 year ago
3. the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices: a world council of religions.
4. the life or state of a monk, nun, etc.: to enter religion.
5. the practice of religious beliefs; ritual observance of faith.
6. something one believes in and follows devotedly; a point or matter of ethics or conscience: to make a religion of fighting prejudice.
7. religions, Archaic . religious rites.
8. Archaic . strict faithfulness; devotion: a religion to one's vow.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
Religion-a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.
2. a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.
cont'd
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
Morality- conformity to the rules of right conduct; moral or virtuous conduct.
2. moral quality or character.
3. virtue in sexual matters; chastity.
4. a doctrine or system of morals.
5. moral instruction; a moral lesson, precept, discourse, or utterance.
6. morality play. Back then religions had different versions of what was right and wrong. But we follow through our laws and policies the christian teachings of what is right and wrong. Therefore christian morality
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Ah okay Christianity is the moral guideline people follow when they commit genocide and enslave people, good to know.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb no it isnt but is atheism the moral guidline for those actions. It is what seems to be your implications of such.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb and Thomas Jefferson and James Madison did not slaughter the indians themselves you imbecile. That crime was performed by those who came before and after them. Jefferson wrote the declarationa dn Madison the constitution. Jefferson wanted to abolish slavery but had to compromise in order to fight a war against the crown.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight So they made Jefferson keep a bunch of slaves at his house? They forced it on him?
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Jefferson was like no no no I want to abolish slavery but I can't so I guess I may as well have 100's of slaves at my house that I beat daily.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb you really NEED TO FUCKING EDUCATED YOURSELF. There is historical eye witness accounts by his slaves and friends that stated that JEFFERSON TREATED HIS SLAVES LIKE FAMILY!!! Now who the fuck needs to be educated.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Oh yea he treated them like family alright, I guess that is how he impregnated them.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb SO you would not impregnant someone you loved? You only impregnant people you treat like shit?
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Jefferson gave his overseerers the explicit right to beat his slaves, you have no idea what you are talking about. Do you have people in your family beaten?
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Now this argument has gone on long enough and I leave to everyone else (besides you) to determine who made the better argument. The person who makes assumptions (by stating made could have been good without religion ever existing) or the person who actually uses examples and quotes other philosophers who dealt in that subject. Go take a sociology class because it makes my argument for me. Basically all of your issues is complete contradictory to sociologist theory
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight "Stanton says children suffered physical violence. When James, a different slave and 17 at the time, was sick, one overseer whipped him "three times in one day." There were additional incidents over the years, and violence was commonplace on plantations, including Jefferson’s. According to Marguerite Hughes, Jefferson used "a severe punishment" like whippings when runaways were captured and he sometimes "sold" them to "discourage women to gain freedom."
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Those were the slaves on his other plantations which he left their fate up to his hired overseers. He had his own slaves the ones who worked in his house present by request upon his death bed.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Okay you are retarded, Jefferson himself gave orders to have his slaves beaten period point blank you were wrong you will always be wrong, goodbye.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Whats funny is you looked it up and quoted it. Therefore you did not even know beforehand so how can you call me stupid for being wrong when you yourself did not even know until I mentioned it. If it was not for your distrust of what I was saying you would not have researched it and would have remained ignorant to it. It was my Professor who told me this so I am sorry if I took his word for it.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight You do not know shit about socialization do you. I said t can be abused and led to religion. Whenever you have a mass of people following a philosophy it will ultimatly turn to religion. And I am an idiot even though it has been proven time and time again with the religions we have now. FOR CHRIST FUCKING SAKES LOOK AT SCIENTOLOGY! Seriously take a sociology class because you would get an F with the answers you have
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Do you even know what the Socratic method is? Obviously you don't or you would realize trying to make the Socratic method dogmatic is maybe the dumbest thing ever said.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb obviously you do not know what the socratic method is. Because you claim to be a practioner but your argument contradicts it. Because the Socratic method is a system of self-evalution always questioning yourself and evaluating the contradictions within your own beliefs. And I am not saying that philosophy itself leads to religion but that the meaning could be lost to the masses and they can corrupt it into a religion. It has happened before.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight The Socratic method cannot be corrupted, it would balance itself, that is the point of the Socratic method.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumbYou really need to learn about human nature before spouting off at the mouth.You think that the only reason why people are bad is because they have the wrong belief system?Religion was created by man.It was not an immaculate conception.You people think that religion is a deviation from mans true and good nature.As if religion was this supernatural force which possessed people and cause them to do things that go against their nature. cont'd.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb and you think the socratic method would be any different. Given that in the past people would start revolutions on a idea then go completely 180. Look at Maximillain Robespierre and Joesph Stalin. They preached a certain ideology and thought that their is no way they could be corrupted because their ideology in their minds were incorruptible. Robespierre was at the head of the french revolution and wanted liberty and constitutionalism then he became a tyrant once in power.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Dude you are so stupid it is unreal.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight The ENTIRE POINT of the Socratic method is to constantly question everything, how in the hell is something that solely relies on not being dogmatic going to turn dogmatic?
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb.Do you think Christ wanted his preaching's to become dogmatic or Marx for that matter. Why dont you read Mark and see how quickly his philosophy which from just that could not have turned people into tyrants but they had. And plus you have made my point bu stating you followed socratic method but still calling me stupid when socrates even said "True Knowledge is the belief that you know nothing". You have just proved yourself that the true meaning of the socratic method can be lost.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Yea when you threaten to throw people in fire for eternity if they don't obey your words then that pretty much means you are dogmatic. You don't understand what Socrates meant by that.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb How about this you fucking let people believe whatever the fuck they want and stop being such a totalitarian asswipe. Its called be a practioner of free will and you do not like it when christians try to exert their will over you so what makes you think its ok for you to fucking do it? You are the biggest hypocrite idiot out there. Socrates was about self-evalution not evalution of others. Which you do! Tell me do you actually try to find flaws of your beliefs?
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb so you are so much better than those poor diluted religious types right?Do you think that statement goes well with the Socratic Method?Socratic Method is a negative evalution of oneself. So far all you have done is negativly evaluate others you hypocrite.So go blindly say you follow socrates without even knowing what the fuck he even said and what he meant by it.I am done with you!Now I am going christmas shopping because unlike you I do not hold myself above celebrating the holiday
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Wow you just convinced me you are mentally retarded.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Firstly, at least go to wikipedia and read the first sentence about the Socratic method. Secondly, who said I don't celebrate the holidays? You are worthless.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Ha! everyone with a brain knows that wikipedia is not a reliable source. and anyways Socratic Method is an open philosophy and has many aspects to it most of which relies on self-evalution of you speak of the appeals to logic. Then everyone practices socratic method because everyone uses logic or contradictions to confound other's beliefs. Socrates also said alot of contradictions himself. cont'd
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb "The Socratic method requires that - honestly and openly, rationally and imaginatively - they confront the dogma by asking such questions as: What does this mean? What speaks for and against it? Are there alternative ways of considering it that are even more plausible and tenable?"- taken from philosopher website You so called version of the socratic method is merely tribalism. You attack those who you do not agree with without using any logic or reasoning. Like a rabid dog
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight What in the shit are you even talking about man, you've lost it. Boy you are about as dumb as they get, I feel sorry for your parents.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb and I was partially correct about jefferson. He did treat some of his slaves like family and even paid some of them. This is after doing more research cause it was conflicting that a history professor would tell me something that was false. But according to other sources (Not wikipedia which you got your's from) some of his slaves did not want to leave Jefferson's possession during a time when jefferson wanted to abolish slavery in Monticello.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Seriously know what you are talking about before talking nonsense to people, you've corrected yourself on every single topic and you still don't know what the hell you are talking about.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight I have no desire for someone who states things as facts even though they are entirely wrong and then goes to find out if there is anything that backs up their stupid statements, like I said before go get an education, you are just making Christians look like morons.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb so I do not know what I am talking about even though my last posts were quotes from other sources. and now you are going on a tirade how I do not know what I am talking instead of properly responding which sets the context for my favorite quote "Insults are the arguments employed by those who are in the wrong." -Jean Jacques Rousseau. Now this refers to when you shut down and stop debating and just go on a tirade about the opposition. Which you have just done.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Jefferson ordered for people to be beaten viciously, who cares how he treated some of his slaves, you lost, it's over, it was over a while ago.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb from what source did you get that from? and did it say "viciously" because remember in those days they beat their kids. and you were partially wrong because you assumed that he treated all his slaves poorly and you just got lucky in so that you found a source that confirms it. And you said that I was entirly wrong because I assumed that they all were treated like family. But some did get treated poorly and some did get treated badly. So how are you right?
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Okay listen you're done you can't even read what I posted, you are such a dope.
According to Marguerite Hughes, Jefferson used "a severe punishment" like whippings when runaways were captured and he sometimes "sold" them to "discourage other men and women from attempting to gain their freedom."
read moron read, it was right in the post where it was from. Read dumbass
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb One account from one perspective it does not mean he did not treat some of his slaves like family. You are trust arguing what I have said that he treated some poorly and some like family. Just because you have on eyewitness testimony to support the claim that in that instance he treated a certain number of slaves poorly does not equate to all. one does not equal all. Why dont you read my posts.
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Because your post doesn't matter, he beat slaves, you said he did not. He did, that is the end.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumb Edmund Bacon, Monticello’s overseer for sixteen years recalled that Jefferson “was always very kind and indulgent to his servants. He would hardly ever allow them to be overworked, and he would hardly ever allow one of them to be whipped.” But by law, Jefferson’s slaves were his property. And he treated them as property. Heres one eyewitness testimony for you and I am going to act like you and say that because I have one that means I am in the right
Empyreanmight 1 year ago
@Empyreanmight Okay you just posted something that said he had his slaved whipped, how stupid are you honestly? No, I didn't say he beat all of his slaves, you are unreal.
adrenacrumb 1 year ago
@adrenacrumbthe point is you were saying "HE DID NOT TREAT HIS SLAVES LIKE FAMILY". in which some cases he did. and just because he whipped ONE SLAVE does not negate that he was kind to certain slaves. Seriously how is this not getting through to you? So if I had two ducks and I beat the crap out of one and treated the other like a saint by your logic it can be assumed that I was mean to both my ducks?
Empyreanmight 1 year ago