100" Kinetic Sailplane 357mph Dynamic Soaring World Record

[allamericandude15]

WITCHCRAFT!!

[ThisIs84]

WTF??!! That is insane!

[hottfuzz2]

HOLY CRAP THAT IS WAY TOO MUCH FORCE FOR A SMALL RC PLANE.

[hoelli19911004]

unreal

[niflap]

Moving like a jet. & not a drop of fuel burned.

[dustycoyote1]

If you guys clock it on the downhill side you could probably add 60 mph to it. Also, when you use 2 radar guns they might jam each other with 2 return signals it might be more reliable using 1 radar only.

[sll914]

@dustycoyote1

Agreed! We've always just used the up leg becasue it is safer and more convenient. All we really need is a relative comparison anyway. Mark Drela posted a nice plot of ground speed throughout the circuit on RCGroups that shows the downleg speed to be a little over 10% more than the upleg speed where we currently measure.

I have wondered about interference between the guns before...

[Stuckinthemuck1]

Very nice. Especially with all the phony video posts on here. Whatever you do, don't accidently fly that thing into yourself!!!! I think it'll leave a mark.

[DanFrederiksen]

what's the model?

[DanFrederiksen]

this is unpowered? pretty amazing

[martinusher1]

The idea of dynamic soaring came from watching large seabirds duck behind waves.

[hayabusarider168]

can the wings get ripped off if this spinning goes on for dozens of times at well over 100 miles per hour?

[galaxything]

is this official in the giunis book of world records?

[JCrashB]

Amazing. I used to do that in the early 1990's but with the material back then we never reached those speeds...the planes would just have been shredded to pieces.

It would be interesting to measure the g-forces the plane has to endure. I suspect them to be well in the two figures, say like 20 or 30 g.

[MarcChep]

How landing

[sll914]

@MarcChep  Drop flaps and it'll land slowly

[stefanmckinley]

Very cool, how long can you keep it up?

[Blasikov]

@PeiperJ2 : Just like a sailboat tacks at an angle to the wind to get it's greatest speed.

[alexdevries420]

no reading no reading next time hire some tech ppl to film and use the radar gun he wasnt even pointing it at the plane no reading duhh man these guys make stoners look good!

[CBum425]

@alexdevries420 Maybe they could get you to show them how it's done.

[pol6455]

strong wings

[DougsterCanada1]

Beautiful! Loved watching. I have built and flown "floaters" like the Oly 650 & Oly II. Had one lose control at the slope one day, a fella was relieving himself just below the edge of the slope just inches from where my 650 buried itself about 6 inches into the soil. I shudder to think what a 300 MPH plus impact might do! Egads!

[convict9110]

so Now.... how do you land it?

[sll914]

@convict9110

burn off all the speed, then drop the flaps to hover down to the top of the ridge like a helicopter as long as the wind is a steady 25-30mph or so...

[DavidSunshine867]

@PeiperJ2

I'm no expert, but it should be possible given the upwards airflow. The wind lifts the model up, every loop, and every loop it comes back down as far as it was lifted up, gaining speed each time if there's excess energy from the lift used to overcome all the friction. That's why they try to minimize control surface changes, no sharp turns or changes, those take up speed. It's the terminal velocity (sloped), minus losses for looping. You can see the max if you drop it from a plane.

[protheus123]

@DavidSunshine867 He uses the wind to gain speed when he comes towards the ridge. Every time he does this, he gains almost the speed of the wind because he is moving the same way, already having the kinetic energy (under the form of speed) collected from the previous loop. When he gets against the wind, he losses a small amount of what he gains, because he gets helped by gravity and the profile of the wing. But there is a limit imposed by air friction of the max gained speed.

[DavidSunshine867]

@protheus123

When uses his own speed to gain height, he loses speed as well, say he loses X mph going up 100m, but the upwards wind has contributed to 10m of height gain in that same time, he will come downwards 110m the next fall, if he only loses the equivalent of 5m height in mph, he will have gained a 5m drop in speed, accelerating at < 9.81m/s^2, if he does this over and over again, it adds up, as long as he doesn't lose too much speed through human error. Too sharp of a turn, etc.

[protheus123]

@DavidSunshine867 The combined gravity pull and kinetic energy collected, isn't enough to gain speed in going downwards against the wind, thats just because the airspeed on the plane would be already its speed+wind airspeed = high drag force, but its enough to save a part of the energy collected the energy collected. Going with the wind, the airspeed is much smaller, cause its minus the wind speed by 2 (comparative to going against it).

[protheus123]

@DavidSunshine867 The pitch under wich it attacks the wind at the base of the loop, gives the benefit of using the gravity force half way , without loosing height, but even gaining a bit, because the winds direction is vertical. This only applies when passing the airspeed possible by the airplane in a vertical drop (in a free enviroment, not affected by wind or other forces). Until it reaches that limit its helped by the full loop.

[DavidSunshine867]

@protheus123

DS gliding is awesome, I don't understand the full physics of it, but I agree with you that the plane can do this until terminal velocity(gravity and air drag), minus the efficiency losses of the turns.

And you're probably right, that the gravity and kinetic energy gained only isn't enough, there's energy gained out of the wind, but what exactly is the mechanism of this? You mentioned the pitch of attack to the wind, this must be the key to gaining speed?

[jwboll]

@DavidSunshine867 close to the surface of the hill, with a strong wind there can be an upward movement in the air of... say 4000 feet per minute. (rough guess) a little higher, when he flies back down the slope, the air is rising at a lower rate... say 1000 feet per minute. It's kind of like putting the plane into a very rapid descent from an unlimited altitude.

[jwboll]

@DavidSunshine867 close to the surface of the hill, with a strong wind there can be an upward movement in the air of... say 4000 feet per minute. (rough guess) a little higher, when he flies back down the slope, the air is rising at a lower rate... say 1000 feet per minute. It's kind of like putting the plane into a very rapid descent from an unlimited altitude.

[aseglkj]

how many Gs are that?

[sll914]

@aseglkj

We have calculated the G's to range from 50G under regular flight up to 75G when a large control input is made with the transmitter. The plane in this video weighs 200oz (12.5 lb)...

[rctestflight]

how much does that plane weigh?

[sll914]

@rctestflight

About 12-13 lbs

[parkourbr16]

woooooooooooooww

[MyFatty69]

wow, gliders realyer do go well!

[mechmove]

crazy stuff, anyone scared something might fail and the plane goes out of control?

[sll914]

@mechmove

Precisely why we built a massive stone wall to hide behind. This video shows some atypical unsafe behavior. We have since tightened up on the safety aspect to where everyone on site is advised to take cover behind the wall or radar rock whenever there is a plane in the groove. You are right, eventually something will fail on every plane, best to plan for it...

[cy2kill]

when are you going super sonic? :P

[sll914]

@cy2kill

There is already supersonic airflow over the wing due to the acceleration over the top. The top speed of 445mph by John Buxton with his 100" Kinetic DP was around Mach=0.65. REALLY FAST!!!

[EnglishTurbines]

How do you guys get a "reliable" Radar reading from something so small which is made from composite? I assume you pull the trigger as it comes back up the hillside?..sooo..thats like maybe 1 second only?..Just curious, Im a modeller like you guys...UK...I would be a bit dubious myself given the wildly fluctuating readings.

[ardvarkkkkk]

Now, put the gun on the correct scale.

[sll914]

@ardvarkkkkk

The gun is on the correct scale but this record speed is old news There are now more than 6 different people in the world who have flown R/C Sailplanes over 357mph. The new record is 428mph set by the Kinetic again at Weldon on May 10, 2010. No video of that one but there is video on Vimeo of a previous flight at 412mph...

[MrStr8shootr]

This is accomplished by using the rotor found on the downwind or "back" side of a slope. It is not thermaling or sloping in the traditional way. You guys are way overthinking this. Google dynamic soaring and youll see how it works. Normally when you sloap soar you try to avoid this area. Also when flying real aircraft these regions are avoided at all cost.

[mitchamus]

at 1:33 the gun reads 375? but he says 325 wtf???

[dukenukem08]

Excellent !!

[ClaytonBezui]

@PeiperJ2 The answer is simple, they use the thermals to gain altitude then use gravity to gain speed

[lesterclaypool1]

@ClaytonBezui that really does nt make sence becasuse the rate of something falling is not 357 miles an hour ,,,, so it must be trusting down as well as up ,,, i believe the rate of fall for gravitaional fall is 12 feet per second ,,, but you might wish to look that up

[ClaytonBezui]

@lesterclaypool1

You are talking about terminal velocity, each item has different terminal velocity depending on its drag coefficient. a sleek airplane would reach a higher terminal velocity falling than say a parachute jumper (even before he opens his shute). , does anyone know what the wind speed was on the slope?

the rate of acceleration of gravity (g) is about 9.8meters/second^2 (g)minus the force of the drag(initialy it is zero but increases until F = g when you reach terminal velocity)

[lesterclaypool1]

@ClaytonBezui you are correct this doesnt seem quite right does it ? it appears that this is correct but i seem to be a little scepticle yes yes terinal velocitiy is 9.8 maters which equals 12 feet per second all things concidered but i would like to take a good look at the measuring devices we cronoed a paint ball gun on a wrong setting [ feet per sec ] and it sure works out different that miles per hours , or even kilometers per hour , i suppose this is possible it just seems crazy

[lesterclaypool1]

@ClaytonBezui how do you get a drag coeffeciencie that actually goes this far ? you re talking about meters per second ,,,, this is miles an hour ,,,, multiply the meters in a mile then multiply that by 537 miles a hour ,,, then divide that by the number of seconds in a hour ,,, no this plane actually gains trust from its lift and drive coupled with the tail wind

[DavidSunshine867]

@ClaytonBezui

Ya, I agree with you, the top speed is pretty much the terminal velocity, minus any friction caused by the control surface inputs, but if he doesn't turn and goes straight he can almost reach terminal velocity.

Like unlimited free fall. The thinner the air the faster he could go, so do this at higher altitude and you get even higher speeds!

[heathfiedler]

lol i couldn't do it id end up losing sight of it and smacking a friend with the damn thing xD

[madnesscombat5]

@heathfiedler and decapitating them.

[heathfiedler]

hah yeah that would suck

[traxxaslover123]

how do sailplanes work?

[sll914]

Ever seen a flying squirrel? Ever throw a paper plane? You get the idea...

The trick is finding air that is rising faster than the plane is sinking. Once you get the hang of that, then you combine basic sustained flight with manipulating airmasses moving at different speeds and then you can experience dynamic soaring...

[heathfiedler]

well all they use is gravity and lift to fly just have to get em in the air with either another plane pulling it and letting it go or some kind of really powerful pully system or wench system. At lest thats my idea on it. I do know some use small planes to tow them in to the air

[gliderboy438]

As a full size sailplane pilot, i had been wondering when some one would DS in a full size. Looking at the coments here, we would be stuffed by the 'g' very quickly and also would rapidly get well past our max manoevering speed (not much more than 100kts on most sailplanes). But hell, it would be FUN! Well done you guys, really great stuff.

[skogsstjarnan]

How can a plane that's weights 100 tons be lifted by just air?? Its called thermodynamics.

[johanspiiike]

but hey people have missed something, is noone gonna comment on this or has noone noticed it yet that when they film the speed meter at 1.33 into the video it clearly states 375 when he yells "325" what's that all about?

[sll914]

Canuckhelinut also pointed this out earlier. The number in the bottom right corner is the max speed range of the gun, not the peak recorded speed...

[sll914]

Also, this is old news, The latest record is 399mph set at the same location by the 100" Kinetic. You can find the video on Vimeo...

[scmbyhbk]

how can a glider like this be so fast?

[Flyboyjimi]

Pretty fast for a glider you lost your calling as an aerospce engineer! Burt and Dick Rutan got nuthin on you!!

[liteglow2000]

I think I let the experts answer on that ..

As I dont know for myself..

But if you google, there is many pages that explain how its possible..

[liteglow2000]

Try to sit in a chair that is spinning around with you feet out !

When you are spinning, try to take your feet IN :) then you understand..

[sz42781]

how can i make one

[mcmarga]

buy one ;)

[YeahYeahYeahs8]

I love that thunder-like sound of turbulence created by the airfoil at those speeds (mm) So sick!

[sll914]

More info on the Kinetic Sailplanes can be found at:

vv vv vv DSKineticDOTcom

[pmgodfrey]

Even though I build things that are strong and last forever... Nothing I have would withstand those speeds... Heck, I don't even think that fast. :)

[newyorkflyerRC]

Yeah baby... brake the sound barrier get into guiness book. Awsome.

[Canuckhelinut]

Hey guys...might want to check the speed gun reading at the 1:31 mark of the video...

To me that reads 375 not 325...

If so..WOW!!!!

That is sooo SICK!!!

Well done!

[sll914]

The number in the bottom right corner is 375 but that is the max speed range of the gun not the recorded speed... Of course this is obsolete now, see the video link above for the 392mph video...

[walkandlookup]

Was this an Acacia or a Sting?

[dodogolf1993]

20 G`s!!!!!^^

[getgad777]

It must of been stuck in a realy big wind

[shinobi992]

wtf

[sll914]

Click above to see the new video of current 392mph record...

[greatplanesman]

Hmm, I didn't know that you guys flew downwind. It was only today that I found you guys fly perpendicular to the wind, and then fly back down into a no air zone, only to repeat it :)

Umm, you wouldn't be able to recommend a model to me, would you?

[mterle]

Another way to understand DS is that the plane loses less energy between laps than it gains from the conversion of the angular acceleration (from increased lift) to a semi-linear acceleration. A plane will no longer accelerate each lap when the energy lost from drag-because of pilot error or otherwise-equals the energy gained from flying back into the wind and converting the increased airspeed into lift, lift into angular acceleration and so on.

[th3dud3007]

Could you put this is tems i could understand...or maybe a link? I want to understand how the glider goes so fast. Makes no sense to, but it is happening. I am just getting into gliders now, and would just like to understand it...wouldn't try that trick for years. Cheers

[greatplanesman]

Oh, is the plane being sold yet?

[sll914]

Almost! I expect to have them available by the end of May...

[DaleSparrow]

... O.O  I have seen one of these before, it was done by a balsa plane. after about 50mph the wings just shattered, there was nothing left of them. Now im wondering what the g-forces are on that poor thing. that is truly amazing.

[sll914]

Calcs suggest acceleration of around 40-60Gs varying with speed, circuit size, and how smooth you are on the elevator...

[DaleSparrow]

I am stunned. thinking that the body weighs mabe 700 grams or 1 kilo? (I cant see but it seems to be the size of chucky)

then those wings can hold over 60 kg... Damn amazing. that is a extremely well built plane.

[Delticola]

What's the science behind this wind action? The wind blows one direction on the side of the hill or multiple directions? What is the trick to getting the plane to that speed? Where are the forces pushing that plane?

[sll914]

It is called Dynamic Soaring. The plane extracts energy by moving between airmasses with different velocities. In the video, the wind is coming from the right. We are flying on the back side of a ridge. The air behind the ridge is basically still. Every time the plane moves from the still air into the 50mph headwind, it gains 50mph of airspeed. Repeat with each circuit while trying to minimize losses and eventually the plane really gets moving fast!

[v16050118130114]

Wow, I wonder how long it will be until someone approaches Mach 1? The record has been increasing by around 50-75 MPH per year, hasn't it?

[AlessandroAUS]

That's an interesting thought, although I think that because the sailplane would be going at the wave propagation speed (speed of sound) the wind would not be able to impart anymore energy into it, hmm.

[greatplanesman]

Near mach, but I think it would be powered flight to achieve Mach 1. Also, the plane might explode (quite literally), which is generally the result of an airframe being pushed too much...

[nathan87]

I'd imagine quite a while. mach 1 is approximately double this speed!

[LP640Murcielago]

lol, I was flying gliders with my sisters boyfriend and her friend today and they told me about this video and I didn't believe them but SHIT they were RIGHT!!! 357 MPH!!! that's almost like impossible!!! I thought it was a mean sound it made when ours went past us but now I no it can almost sound like a jet!!! AWESOME VIDEO!!!

[dieselstruck]

crap it sounds like an jet aircraft approaching!!

[w7mag]

Forget my 375 comment, I just figured out I was looking at the wrong part of the display.

Oops.

[w7mag]

And almost forgot,

Where abouts was this taped?

Looks like the high desert of So Cal.

(Acton, Palmdale area?)

[sll914]

You are correct.  Just an hour or so North of Palmdale...

[w7mag]

I noticed at about 1:32 when the camera zooms in on the display, it appears to read 375 I'm almost certain that's a 7 and not a 2,

Anyone concur?

In any event, NICE VIDEO and FLYING!!

Paul

[AlessandroAUS]

Your right

that's definitely 375!

[yabukogi]

I want to learn the name of the radar gun.

[sll914]

The gun is a high speed version of the Talon by Kustom Signals. Contact Phyllis or Maurice @ 1-800-4-kustom to get one.

[Annal85]

The guy that designed this radar gun must be a genius.

[sll914]

I agree! Maurice is the first guy to make a commercially available gun to read that fast. Certified genious ;o)

[118bigtom]

found it muck :)

[judaspriestfan16]

thats almost as fast as my piper cub goes.

[slyputz]

Outstanding work. Even for the videographer. And radar man.

For the disbelievers, this sailplane is "powered" by the sun. Really. Sun causes wind, wind hits mountains and is curved up. The vertical component of this wind provides the energy to lift the plane, counteracting gravity. Flying orbits, it COULD climb until the wind no longer curves up from the mountains. Instead, the pilot keeps it in an orbit, varying the altitude to maintain the energy. Speed or altitude.

[sll914]

Actually, altitude plays almost no role in building the speeds here. This is not a simple trade off from kinetic energy to potential energy (speed or altitude). Dynamic soaring relies only the velocity difference between the air on the front of the slope (40-50mph wind) and the air on the back of the slope(+/- 0mph).

[TheDramaTube2020]

Crazy!

[driftability]

Wow that

 is amazing.

[weetsie]

wow, just noticed you beat the land speed record by 5mph

[weetsie]

wow the wings can really take some force.

[jattamasso]

how do you land such a plane?????

[sll914]

The plane is equiped with flaps to slow it down for landing. It can 'hover' in about 35mph of headwind...

[greatplanesman]

Ahh, good. A speed demond can go slow :)

How fast do the flaps slow it down?

[lineudc]

Congratulations for your splendid Kinetic project and the World Record Mr. Spencer!

[greatplanesman]

Hmm, 357mph with a glider? Can you specify a bit more on the servos/battery/receiver/radio system used?

[sll914]

Mostly standard 72mhz RC stuff. 6v NIMH battery, Hitec Super Slim 72mhz Rx, JR 9303 Tx, and Volz servos...

[greatplanesman]

Any chance that I could try next time I'm in your area :D

[nolsmtm]

i dont get how this is possible. What propels it to those speeds?

[jattamasso]

it is not a propeller you moron. It's a glider. only wind lol

[sll914]

Google Search 'Dynamic Soaring' to learn more about the concept. Bottom line is manipulating the difference of 50mph wind on front of the ridge and relatively still air on the backside of the ridge.

[ratheads]

JEEZ that wing must be solid wood or c.f . !

[sll914]

The plane is hollow molded and is made mostly of carbon fiber with some kevlar and fiberglass...

[alexschweig]

spencer is da man! I can barely push over 110 with my Ferox

[Mp3R4E]

crazy

[rmp5s]

Amazing. I just recently discovered these types of gliders and I never in a million years would have guessed this could be done with a glider. Incredible.

[codykoffel]

unreal

[betochperu]

krazy

[Irvine5312x6ma]

How ON EARTH CAN YOU CONTROL THAT THING? IT HAS DISAPPEARED BEFORE YOU HAVE EVEN SPOTTED IT!!! EVEN I FEEL STRAINED SOMETIMES WITH MY 110 MPH ARC JUPITER!!!!!!! HOW ON EARTH CAN YOU FLY THAT AT THOSE SPEEDS!!??!?!?!?!

[greatplanesman]

Practice.

[chrisandrenee]

Great work, God Bless Chris

[miniblade35]

Awesome work:)