Bill Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn interviewed on Democracy Now! (2 of 5)

[StratMasterZero]

Bill Ayers should have been tried fro treason and executed ... He still should be. Utter Filth.

[Boris82much]

Do a quick search for Donna Ron. She had the courage a few years back to post to the internet what Bill Ayers did to her back in the 60s. Today it's called kidnapping and rape.

And Dohrn? She praised Charlie Manson and his little hippy family upon their arrest for the murders of Sharon Tate and others in 1969. She was ecstatic that he was following her call to "kill pigs".

Both Ayers and Dohrn are trying to whitewash their terrorist past but aren't convincing anyone of their "altruism".

[democratos89]

Evil communist

[Josexylo9]

@democratos89 Ha! You probably don't even know what communism is!

[pococolo]

The Weather Underground jumped the shark.  They began to use crime and violence. People were wounded by their actions. I opposed the war AND, at the end, the methods of the Weather Underground. These people, fugitives for years, now have really good jobs, probably on the taxpayer dime.

[dccph]

Funny how you go around telling people how they should reply or shouldn't reply, and what sort of answers they should give you. Where did you learn to think like such an authoritarian? Let me guess... semper fi?

[omcorc]

These people shouldn't even be free today. Communism should be a crime. And these are died in the wool communists. All this "left" are destructive and murderous. Don't bother replying because you are wrong. Period.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc you would rather the government tell you how to live and what to think? you would rather your kids be sent to foreign lands to die for oil? i think youve been brainwashed. communism puts the people on the same level as the government, how is that bad? i guess if you like being a slave you wouldnt want to be equal to your master, i refuse to be a slave to this fascist government or the all mighty dollar. im not however a comunist im an anarchist. i dont think we need any government.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk We don't need government. Ok, right. Take away law and order and you'll see just how your anarchist wet dream becomes a nightmare. How old are you? I suspect you're young and naive and haven't really experienced the realities of the world yet. And communism does not put people on the same level as the gov't. Just look at China, the Soviet Union, the Khmer Rouge... That's communism for you.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc if you use communist china and the soviet union as examples, you must not know much about communism. read the communist manifesto, it all works on paper, its humans that just cant get over their lust for power that fuck up the whole idea of communism. i recommend you learn about what youre talking about before you make comments about someones age.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk Oh, it's the "it all works on paper" line once again. That always cracks me up. You're just a young kid with lots to learn about the world. I'm not racist and I'm not intolerant, so there's nothing to change in my mind. But, like the typical extremist, you are convinced that it is up to you to force people to accept your political beliefs. That's why so many millions are murdered when your ideology takes hold in different parts of the world.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc i dont care if you agree with me or not, im not trying to force anything on you. communism is not MY ideology, but it it does work on paper. under anarchy you could live however you wish and think whatever you want. i think that would be nice.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk Ok, so if we lived in an anarchistic society, and there's no rules, then if I want to live to rob people for a living, i can do that. You said it yourself that we could all do what we want.

I will say this one last time: it doesn't mean a damn thing if "communism works on paper". I've heard that for years and it's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. It's apologist BS for all the heinous shit the commies did over the years.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc anarchy does not mean lack of rules, it means lack of rulers. sure you could go around robing folks. until youre caught and shot, or worse, kicked out of your comunity. you say "we need laws to keep the bad people in line", yet bad is relative. the bad people lie to us and tell us "them brown folks got weapons of mass destruction" just so they can send another couple thousand of our children to be killed over a fuel that isnt even a necessity. smash the state!

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk "Our children"? I don't really think you're old enough to say that yet. So eventually someone would step in to stop the person robbing people, or committing other offences. That means that there must be some standard set, and therefore, in some way, there is an infrastructure (call it a state or a community). You say "bad is relative". Therefore, my definition of bad might be different from yous, so in you society no one can stop me because "bad is relative"...

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk There are absolutes in society, whether radicals like you will admit it or not. Harming others is bad. I understand your anger at fat politicians sending men and women of to wars that you might think are unjust. However, "smashing" the state is not the way.  It starts with young people staying away from the radical kooks and getting out there to, rationally, change their communities. Humans will always set standards (laws) and will always revert to a state. No way around it.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc it does not have to be like that. you dont need laws to defend your community. some things are hard wired into us. everyone knows murder is wrong. robing people would be a dumb move because you would have what you need allready. under anarchy as long as you pull your own weight you have what you need. the weathermen could see that in order to stop the war they had to go to the cause of the problem and stomp it out. i like how you use relative terms like "radical kook" lol.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk People coming together to punish a criminal would only happen in an orderly society. Order is based on the standards of a community, and in a civilized community those standards are codified into official laws so that there is no question what will happen if one steps out of line. You could take children, put them in an environment where they must live and work together, and I guarantee they would eventually be drawn toward a leader and set up rules (laws)...

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk Under anarchy there is no order. Look at Katrina in '05 (or any major disaster worldwide). In the absence of a lawful authority, people resort to their basest instincts. Is a a society governed by official laws perfect? No. Those of us who are more conservative realize that and work to make the best community possible, not a perfect one. Those of you to the left are the exact opposite, and you will continue you to fail because humans want law and order (not the TV show...) 

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc anarchy does not mean lack of order, it means no rulers. you cant compare a natural disaster like katrina to a political theory. those of you who are more conservative work to make what you think is the best community possible, and anyone that dont agree with what you say is best gets called a trouble maker. under anarchy you group up with like minded people to form a community. if something big needs to be done you have a meeting and come up with plan that everyone can agree on.....

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc you talk about human nature like its something thats set in stone. the beautiful thing about humans is that we're capable of anything. this generation would never be able to achieve peaceful anarchy because our minds have been corrupted by political and religious "leaders" for so many years that even something as logical as anarchy is now thought to be abstract. the next generation could get it right but it would have to start with us changing our mindset.......

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk I'm not even religious! Human nature is human nature. Start reading some books and stop living your life on the internet. You'll realize that throughout history, humans do act the same way. Perhaps evolution will change things, but you and your silly radical friends who probably come from affluent backgrounds cannot force it. Go enjoy life and stop being angry over things you can force to your will.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc ya know what. seeing as how you dont even know what anarchy is, this discussion is pointless. i won"t be responding to your comments anymore but i will leave you with some propaganda which is what you want to hear anyway. ignorance is bliss, you cant have any pudding if you dont eat your meat, we'll put a boot in yer ass its the american way. L8ER

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk You could have just said, "You caught me at a loss for words." It would have been easier. When you grow up you'll realize how ridiculous you sounded at your age. And I know what anarchy is, and it goes against tall human instincts. "L8ER". Is that how you children spell now a days? You're the typical radical: "YOU HAVE TO AGREE WITH ME OR ELSE." You lost this debate.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc im NOT at a loss for words, you DONT know what anarchy is,and i dont give a shit if you agree with me or not. i never said you were religious. you keep spewing the same shit, "uh chaos this, no law and order that" which has nothing to do with anarchism. if you knew anything about anarchists you would know that while most disagree on what anarchy is, they would put away intolerance, greed, racism, and hate, or as you call it "human nature", just to keep the system anarchistic......

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk L8ER... I figured it out. It's Newspeak. I keep forgetting how young people are destroying the written language. You're anarchist "utopia" would devolve into an Orwellian nightmare in a flash.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc if you like to read you should check out Emma Goldman or Edward Abbey instead of that rush limbaugh bullshit youre probably reading right now. i like how you say "young people" and "you children" like being 30 makes you some kinda wise old man. you dont understand that while he may disagree with your views, a true anarchist would give his life for YOUR right to have your own opinion which is what anarchy is all about.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc ya know if you like having politicians, plastic shit, hate, and patriotism shoved down your throat so damn much you can keep your fascist/capitalist government. enjoy your little tea party while you can because the young people youre so scared of are watching you consevatives as well as liberals fuck everything up with your little gang war. when you get old who do you think will be caring for you? "human nature" dont mean shit. the individual has the power change their own nature.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc you havnt heard anything ive said so far but il keep playing this little game.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk You're doing exactly what radicals like you do: if someone disagrees, then they're just not listening, or they don't get it. The scary part is that radicals are willing do to go great and violent like to ensure that we all "get it". I've heard what you said. And I know that you've heard what I said and you disagree. I respect that. This is The United States of America, and our right to disagree is written into LAW.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc no you see, you come up with this little "anarchy = chaos" thing of yours which is false, i call you on it and every thing i say goes right over your head. the very next comment you make is the same false "anarchy=chaos" theory. we're done here, you dont know what anarchy is, you dont even know the difference between socialism, communism, and marxism.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc one of these days you'll slip up and go outside without having your papers in order and you'll be locked up just like the other peasants. maybe then you'll see that you were wrong in supporting the rulers you love so much. you falsely accuse me of being a "radical". people like you turn people like me into radicals by rigging elections, starting wars under false pretenses, and wiping your ass with the constitution. youve turned america into nazi fucking grmany with your "patriot act"....

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc hitler said “Through clever and constant application of propaganda, people can be made to see paradise as hell, and also the other way round, to consider the most wretched sort of life as paradise.” sucks that you people blindly fell for it instead of thinking. you let them take away due process and habeas corpus. you let them wire tap and track phones, hack PCs, kick in doors, search and seize property, arrest and hold people indefinitely, and all without a warrant.....

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc hitler also said “The leader of genius must have the ability to make different opponents appear as if they belonged to one category.” i.e. "a war on terror" anyone that dissagree with the government, or speaks out against them can be called a "terrorist" while our leaders terrorize us with "threat levels", and irradiate other countrys with with spent uranium. this will continue to happen until we realize that leaders are and allways will be corrupt.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk Once again, you're doing what radicals do. You're making a broad generalization stating that all leaders are corrupt. Obviously, if yo ever want your movement to take shape, someone will have to get the ball rolling. Would that not be a leader? You seem to be backing off the "smash the state" rhetoric. Perhaps you're starting to see that anarchy is against human nature.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc nobody should have power over another mans life. all leaders are corrupt. im not backing off the smash the state "rhetoric", emma goldman was right when she said “The State is the altar of political freedom and, like the religious altar, it is maintained for the purpose of human sacrifice.” nobody has to get the ball rolling for "my movement" to take shape, logical thought rolls the ball of the anarchist. until you stop looking at anarchism as an ideology you will never understand it.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk Oh, ok... Well you guys are doing a bang up job doing anything. How are you able to force us all into your anarchist utopia while you're wasting so much time on the internet? What have you sacrificed for your movement? What have you done besides rant and rave about an imaginary society that will never exist in our lifetime, or future generations? Huh? I happy where I am. You're the one go off into the deep end here.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc "How are you able to force us all into your anarchist utopia while you're wasting so much time on the internet?" that statement is proof that you dont even know the basic principles of anarchism. an anarchist would never FORCE anyone to do anything. the act of forcing someone to do something is completely against anarchism. all i can do as an anarchist is try to provoke some thought. if you are happy with the way this country is i feel only sadness and dsappointment for you as a human

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc think about this. websters dictionary discribes terrorism as "the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion". now look at the

effect of the"threat level". "threat level is red today" so what happens? people start buying as many batteries, rolls of toilet paper, and duck tape as they can find because their scared shitless that their about to be attacked. they go and spend money which is what a capitalist government thrives on. now tell me, who are the terrorists?

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc think about this, websters dictionary describes terrorism as " the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion". now look at "the threat level" threat level is red what happens? people panic and start buying batteries, duck tape, and toilet paper because they're scared that they're about to be attacked. they spend money feeding the capitalist government who set the level to red just to have the level go back to green the next day. now tell me who are the terrorists?

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk And what's with this "you people blindlty fell for it"? I"m 32 years old and wasn't around back then. We're back to where we started. You just went to an extreme, grabbed some hyperbole from wikiquotes and cut and pasted it. I doubt you've read a real history from cover to cover in you entire life. And no one has kicked in my doors. Proof of our freedom is the fact that we can have this conversation without fear of reprisal. You're paranoid.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc sure, why would they kick your door? youre a good subject, you gladly swallow what they feed you. lol im paranoid? you know as well as i do that google keeps tabs on people they think are up to no good. you think my screen names not on a list some where for having this discussion? i said bush turned this country into a fascist nation like nazi germany and you conservatives "blindly fell for it" by jumping in line and goosestepping along with the group.

[omcorc]

@lonestarpunk I can certainly live how I wish. No one tells me what to do in my own home. And I can think whatever I want, too. In your anarchistic "utopia", peoples' inherent tendency to take advantage of others and hurt people, both physically and emotionally, would dominate. We need laws to keep the honest people honest and the bad people in line. Sorry, dude. But I really don't think you have any leg to stanf on here.

[lonestarpunk]

@omcorc youre thinking of anarchy with todays mind. if we went overnight to anarchy sure it would be chaos. you cant change minds overnight, it might take 100 years to get an anarchistic society posible in the minds of people. not to mention putting it into actual practice. thats why we have to take that first step by getting racism and intolerance out of our minds. its the only way to coexist peacefuly with others. when we can peacefuly coexist we wont need any government taking our money.

[beasleybrother1]

Ok. People who blow up buildings, causing death, are terrorists. Period. I do not give a damn.

[natparry]

@beasleybrother1 By your definition, the United States Military is a terrorist organization. Does the military not blow up buildings, causing death? Of course it does, so by your definition, they are terrorists. Period.

[omcorc]

@natparry When did you serve in the armed forced? What qualifies you to make these statements? Answer the question and do not go off on a communist rant.

[TheJomogogo]

I wish I lived near Ayers and Dorhn I would hound those fucks every time they showed their face in public and fuck their day up

[omcorc]

@TheJomogogo And eventually be arrested for harassment. 

[howthefagworks]

commies aint cool 

[Konform2zoidberg]

Grayr189

Vietnam never attacked us.

The Government lied to get us into a war with them to back a murderous kleptocratic right wing government that was engaged in a civil war with the North.

We killed between 1-3 million people.

3 million people FLED vietnam. the govt killed 100,000 then 95000 died due to conditions in labor camps and 400,000 died while fleeing communist rule.

These things were not justifiable by the VC, but they are certainly not on the level you claim.

[Konform2zoidberg]

To claim they are directly responsible is profoundly absurd. The US, however, was directly responsible for backing a dictatorship in Vietnam, and preventing free elections which foreign policy experts admitted, in the 50's, that Ho Chi Minh would win in a shut out

If they are responsible for the VC coming to power, then they must also be indirectly responsible for the removal of the Khmer Rouge by the Vietnamese, which the US Govt had no problem with when it was antagonizing Vietnam.

[omcorc]

@Konform2zoidberg Yeah, we get it. It's in the past. Let t go and move on.

[miroma]

Socialism isn't about handouts. Welfare is a bourgeois policy. People who are able have to work under socialism or they get absolutely nothing.

[BobReidy]

Ill be fair.I hate sociallism but here is a contraiction.I dont know how much you know about the situation in Northern Ireland but the Northern Ireland political party Sinn Fein who Iam an ardent supporter of is a sociallist party.The only reason I support them is because they fight for a united Ireland.Look up Bernadette Devlin McCalliskey.She was a Northern Ireland freedom fighter who has been called "a miniskirted Castro."Again I hate sociallism but think highly of her.

[GRAYR189]

I guess if we weren't alive in that time, we can't POSSIBLY understand the "context" in which that pinko organization operated. I love the way those Commies are still trying to justify themselves. Well to MY mind, they're both TRAITORS and should die a traitor's death. All those pinkos who thought America was perpetrating "terrorism" in Vietnam; how many of them have ever acknowledged that they were DIRECTLY responsible for the 2-3 million people slaughtered after the Communist takeover?

[Boris82much]

Oh sure Wid. You betcha. And you have ocean front property in central North Korea too.

Every German ever forced into being East Germans must find your comments to be absolutely hilarious if not down right scary, arrogant and obtuse.

Get in line for a socialistic, welfare, handout way of life, folks.

The most dangerous and wicked system of 'em all: Ayer's Fascism--the real '1984' nightmare.

Wid85--your proctologist called; they found your head.

[Boris82much]

Google the name, Donna Ron. Read what she had to say about her experience with Ayers back in the 60's. Men who do this are scary and never, ever change. Their arrogance and sheer lack of conscience are what drives them.

BTW, he comes from wealth. He himself is wealthy. He hates all who believe in achieving, earning, creating wealth whether it be $20,000 a year or $600,000.Does he spread all of his wealth around like a good socialist? Do his kids attend public schools full of graffiti?

[wid85]

Just to pick you up on one point. There is nothing in mainstream socialism that abhors self interest. Socialism abhors systems that result in unfair allocation, and, more importatntly, control, of resources and productive assets. In an informed society cheap jibes such as your would be trivial. In this society, it serves an important purpose to pick up on them.

[NaziPrescottBush]

The Government is full of Criminal Elites,...

It was back then, it still is Now.

Google Aaron Russo Nick Rockefeller interview

[BobReidy]

You admit Abraham Lincoln never did anything criminal.He was a good leader.Reagan was pretty clean to.