The superiority of the Luftwaffe is beyond controversy. Go google "list of world war 2 flying aces", look the Wikipedia and show some humbleness. The top3 german aces shot down nearly 1000 enemies. Under the top 100 ww2 flying aces there is not a single non-german pilot. This is no propaganda it is backed up by allied intelligence.
When you sneak attack countries that are not ready for war, your gonna get lots of kills. No disputing that the Germans had a good air force, but they were flying against unprepared nations.
When the Allies got into the grove, they beat them, plain and simple.
@Gelebify I had the list of how many planes the jerries shot down above 50 kills it came to around 17000 now why didnt they win?. I think some figures were inflated, and they were notorious as lying mongrels the germans.See a puff of smoke 'oh herman I got another give me the iron cross with emeralds and rubies with a sprey of wattle" We have been conned.
@Gelebify There are several reasons for the higher number of German aces. The top 2 reasons being that the Luftwaffe didn't rotate pilots - they flew in active service throughout the war and secondly in the early years of the war they were up against inferior aircraft types in Poland, France & Russia - Even UK. German pilots had combat experience gained in Spanish Civil War and Allied pilots (especially in Russia) had very little, if any, combat training.
never knew that always thought the spitfire wing area was larger. To be more precise, the Hurricane was @ 72 cm's longer, 14 cm's higher, just over 100cm's larger wingspan, 0.5metres larger wing area.
Spitfire was produced throughout WW2, the only British plane that was. The Hurricane was fitted with 4 20mm cannon where as the Spitfire used (initially) .303 machine guns. Then 2 cannon with 60 rounds each and 4 .303's. The 190 had 4 cannon and 2 machine guns. So actually the Spitfire was the least armed of the three. Beautiful nonetheless. The Hurricane always gets overlooked. Form over function I guess.
@smilo996 Not completely true about the Spitfire. It had 4 wing types A (x8 .303 mg), B (x8 .303 mg or x2 20mm cannon + x4 .303 mg), C (x2 20mm cannon + x4 .303 mg or x4 20mm cannon), D (unarmed for photo recon) and E (x2 20mm cannon + x2 .50 mg). Later in the war, the C and E wing types became more common, and x4 20mm cannon became standard in late variants.
The men who flew the Hurricane were brilliant pilots but the Me109 outclassed the Hurricane on most fronts, it wasn't the same with a Spitfire though.
@jagdflieger100 over 20000ft the,ME 109 and the Spit were the best under 20000 the Hurricane outflew both. info:Roland Beamont "The Years Flew Past" a battle of brit vet in Hurricanes flew Typhoons Tempests& after the war C.T.P. for Canberras, English Electric Lightnings, TSR2 gREAT BOOK IN THE END HE WAS SHAFTED BY THE COY HE HAD SERVED FOR 40YRS
@18tangles I was wrong the me 109E1toE4 EMILE was regarded by pilots as the best the me109G was the fastest.The E3 had 3 20mm cannonthe G one 20mm or 30mm engine cannontwo 13mm MGs forward fuselage ,info from Chris Chants Aircraft of WW2
@sinisterskid The Battle of Britain was only Britain and Germany fighting each other thats why they call it The Battle of Britain. America wasn't shooting down Nazis in the British channel. get your History right dude. I know America were fighting in Europe but on in Germany, because they weren't in the battle of Britain. Ok?
@seanhennessy obviusly oh uneducated one you were neither smart enough nor educated enough for the reference. Not surprising coming from a twat that doesn't seem to realize the Hurricans was more manouverable than the Emile and Fuchs modles. Yes slower...parity on firepower in my experience with high calibre automatics.
@GrigoriZhukov I'm afraid you are the uneducated one pal, maybe if your boyfriend took his dick out of your mouth for long enough, you could learn about the realities of aerial warfare rather than the fantasy bullshit you've learned from reading too much fantasy propaganda.
@seanhennessy sorry buddy, but you are the one whose got his facts arse backwards and shoved in the wrong hole. But hey, keep having your nazi fantisies...nothing wrong with that, ya nazi stooge.
@seanhennessy not so the hurricane was better than both under 20000 ft and this from a BoB vet who flew with the spit and against the ME 109. Read Roland Beamont the years flew past. Great insight to WW2.
But did the new Merlin engine solve the carburator cut-out that the Mk 1 Hurri % Spit suffered from? Were the cannon 20mm Orlikon or Hispano-Suza? Were the fuel tanks ever made self-sealing, unlike the Mk 1 Hurri &Spit 1? Just curious on this variant. Thanx.
@TheSV3 the fuel problem of negative G fuel cutoff wasnt dealt with until 1941 after the fitting of a restrictor plate which permitted a short duration of negative G. The problem was later solved by Rolls Royce in 1943 with a new carb design. The guns were usually 20mm Hispano although some variants were made such as the twin 40mm AT cannon MkII D, or the MKIV with twin 40mm AT and twin 303 Brownings, the fuel tanks were self sealing and were fitted as standard on most RAF fighters/bombers
@gordongate Thanx. I thought Rolls-Royce had solved the neg-G problem before Packard built their Merlin, as well as the cannon being Hispano-Suza and not a copy of the Orleikon. Reason I was asking about the fuel tanks was that my Battle of Britain references said the tanks eiter had no protection or at least a very rudimentary one; a fuel tank hit usually meant big trouble for the pilot when the tank flamed up. Thanx again for your help and info.
@TheSV3 for the best details on the hurricane see if you can find Roland Beaumonts books on the hurricane,he flew one in the Battle of Britain and was a test pilot for Hawker.He did tests on all western allied planes and the FW190.
@18tangles Thank you for your reference. I'll see what I can do on my end. What information I have is basic- and not detailed- info on both the Hurricane & Spit. The only book on the Battle/Britain by an actual Hurricane pilot is DUEL OF EAGLES by the late Peter Townsend of 85 Squadron & it's mosly general history/information as well as his expericences during the Battle. I thank you again for your reference
@TheSV3 thats fine glad to help. I will see if our local library still has them and I will get the REFERENCE NUMBERS. Roland beaumont is mentioned in the STR2 VIDEO ON YOU TUBE
If you were to ask the real guys from WW2 about their real enemy opposition, there would probably be respect and fear coming from all sides (Allied and Axis). There was plenty of American, British, German, Japanese, and Canadian courage (and sacrifice) to be found among pilots. They were up there to do a job and defend their countries.
Just because some of them were there to support wrong causes doesn't change that.
@jujitsuman68 something i'd never heard untill recently.
reading of german pilots diaries, show that 30% of their fighters could remain for defense of their own bases in france, as british bombers were attacking these airfields during the battle of britian.
@infernalzen i dont get what your trying to say, are you saying britain won the battle of britain because 30 % of the nazis airplanes whernt there.????? it was the battle of britain soft lad not the battle for france. we where defending are country from german scum and they gave up, in my terms they LOST.
@jujitsuman68 Yeh, they lost. But please, learn your own language before posting anything here! I´m German, but still a lot better in YOUR own language than you are!!! Shame on you.
@jujitsuman68 royal marine commando my bum I know a royal marine and he never swears, our AATTV blokes seldom swear and I know a few of those. I think you are a video warrior about 20 yrs old and still living at home. Poor bugger.
@18tangles i swear when i need to swear you cock, i`m 43 and own my house you muppet. as for video warrior , you wouldnt say any of it if you was standing in front of me. talk a good fight ever seen action.???? bet your a fucking cook , you muppet.
@jujitsuman68 your 43, no education,no class devoid of good manners must have been raised in the outhouse,yes I did see action, 20 yrs in the army two tours of vietnam finished up a WO.None of my men swore, better upbringing I suppose. Swearing does not make you tough or a big man. It shows everybody just how low some people get. I would say what I like in front of you and you would take it, because basically you're a coward.
@18tangles i`m a coward thats a good come back you big mouth muppet, vietnam didnt you get your arse handed to yea.????? like i said if i want to swear i will swear do you understand you CUNT. i done my own tours in the middle east so you go crawl back under your rock. FOOL.
@jujitsuman68 poor man I should have realised, beaten by towel heads on motor bikes and utes, it must be demoralising. At least with us, our polies lost it for us and we gave better than we got. The sand! that was it, the sand got into your jets, tanks, artillery helmet vids,weapons thats why you lost. I apologise who were you with the poms or yanks?
@18tangles what the fuck are you chatting you old cunt.???? lol . go and bury your head in the sand you homo. you got your fucking arse kicked bye the better man.
@jujitsuman68Oh it is you, who was raised in the toilet and still lives in one, no you are stupid as well as a dickhead. You served where? And you are telling me we were beaten by the better man. Grow up you know that then and now your politicians and ours dont have the guts to take it all the way. How many ragheads live in the U.K. what have you done about it ,nothing,We fight our polies here about the Muslims You crawled under your rocks and allowed them to take over.Bradford Muslim Land.
@18tangles yea your a homo you got your arses handed to yea by lil men in black pj`s. what ever country your from isnt 100% white so stop chatting shit you old cunt.
@jujitsuman68 and to you ,mate you being an Englishman could you tell me where I would find a C.O.H OF THE BLUES AND ROYALS he was in my squadron in the late 70s. Are there sites I could go to.He was back with his unit when they were blown up by an IRA bomb. I do not know if he was among them, no names came out.
@jujitsuman68 No we got rid of the white australia policy some years ago. But we did not lose whole towns to your brothers from the east like you have. We have suburbs in sydney close, but not yet
@jujitsuman68 Thats a big statement and we would have some but nowhere near as bad as pommy land.You know they reckon by 2050 the whites will be in the minority maybe then you can sue the govt. for a better deal
@jujitsuman68 "we where defending our country from german scum & they gave up."
I can imagine Nazi scum for the first time flying towards the White Cliffs of Dover - after having breezed through Spain, Poland, the Netherlands & France - but this time they are greeted by an angry swarm of Spitfires & Hurricanes manned by 20-something young men, the likes of Bob Doe & Douglas Bader.
Only for these Nazis to learn a very costly lesson on what happens when u really piss off the British.
"Vastly superior to a Bf109-F"?? I don't think so. The only reason a 109-F was ever downed by a Hurricane of any type was that Luftwaffe command made a serious tactical error and forced the Bfs to fly close escort to the horribly slow Ju-88s and He-111s. At slow speeds they lost their advantage to the lighter wing loading of the Hurricanes and pre-IX Spitfires. This is why Galland half-jokingly asked Goring for a squadron of Spitfires: if you're going to be low and slow you want a Spitfire.
This is a news reel for the general public that the would see at the cinema. One has to realize that moral must be kept up so that's why such the positive spin on the Hurricane witch was a great aeroplane in it's own right. If a 109 F4 pilot got impatient and did a stupid thing like slowed down and to turn with that Hurricane the Hurricane would have him. If the 109 stayed on his game and boomed and zoomed the Hurricane sooner or later he would hit him.
This is a news reel for the general public that the would see at the cinema. One has to realize that moral must be kept up so that's why such the positive spin on the Hurricane witch was a great aircraft in it's own right. If a 109 F4 pilot got impatient and did a stupid thing like slowed down and to turn with that Hurricane the Hurricane would have him. If the 109 stayed on his game and boomed and zoomed the Hurricane sooner or later he would hit him.
1 in 4 of the 20 mm cannon shells actualy exploded on inpact with airplane fusilage most went straight through without detonating ,but against engine block or solid object they were devastating and first british plane fitted with 4 20mm was westlands whirlwind
12 .303s spread out along both wings hell of a lot of lead flying ,but imagine 12 of them all nose fixed like on one mark of the whirlwind thats firepower,all in one place
Too many German planes were going home full of holes from the eight brownings which just were not up to the job,heavier cannon shells make a big difference.
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In 2007, Japanese govt org bought 1 pg. of Wall Street Journal & filled it with OUTRAGEOUS LIES: 1) the females were whores who volunteered to service Japanese soldiers. 2) Japanese govt paid them more than Japanese army generals.
GOOGLE: Jan Ruff O'Herne - Japanese military sex slave
@pudransemarikas Actually the hurricane could outturn a bf109E, a hell of a lot of 109s fell to the hurricane in 1940 and it shot down more german aircraft than any other in the battle of britain. Hurrishit my arse. Also if it wasn't for the hurricane ruggedness alot more pilots would have been killed. It wasnt until the 109f that the hurricane was truly outclassed as a fighter and even then it became a great ground attack aircraft, mostly in the north african desert. Don't knock the hurricane
@Nomasain Early ww2 yes, but 1941 and after, far more SPitfires as the Hurricane was phsed out as thre SPit was far superior. You are thinking of just the battle of Britian which was in summer 1940 - in the BOB there WERE more Hurris than Spits
Better then the 109F? Wishful propaganda I suspect. From what I read the Hurri. was being phased out because of the 109F. The later 4 canon version was a way of extending the life of the Hurri. but the 109F was considered by many German pilots to be the definitive 109 and many aces grew their reputations with this version. I have a soft spot for the Hurricane but the "vastly superior" comment is laughable quite frankly.
@FrancoHitlini The beauty of the hurricaine was, they were many, when damaged,they could be patched up and turned around fast, parts being interchangeable. In a dog fight, they were not as manouverable as the 109, but they were indispensible bringing down the slower, enemy Bombers, whilst leaving the fighters, to the faster, more agile "spits". The hurricaine also found a niche as a ground attack aircraft, firing rockets and cannon, or as "Hurri Bombers".
@engaurd ....well it certainly shot down a lot. 75% of the BF109's shot down in the Battle of Britain were shot down by Hurricaines. High tec doesn't always win wars...ask the Americans
Notice the gun camera footage doesn't show the Hurricane against enemy aircraft. By the time they put Merlins in the Hurricane... that ship had sailed.
Птеродактиль был самым паршивым самолётом,который Россия получила по ленд-лизу.Наши старые,добрые ишаки, особенно последних модификаций,могут дать сто очков форы этому уроду от авиации.
The hawker hurricane had an all metal construction. In the beginning of production it used a fabric covering on the wing but an all metal covering was introduced in April 1939 and used on all later marks. No wood at all on this aircraft....
No offence taken! I guess that we'll always have our own personal favorites...The ME-109 caused the allies a whole bunch of grief...THAT IS FOR SURE...
I'm sorry about that I'm not one to be a smarty pants lol. I'm just a 109 nut. I've been one ever since my dad told me this story of seeing one when he was over seas in WWII. Then he bought me my first model and that was a 109 also. The story is he was up on this hill in Italy and all of a sudden he hears this thing coming, he looks up it's getting loader and loader...LOADER! Then he looks down and zooming through the gorge below is this enemy 109 G. Close and fast.
In IL-2 Sturmovik that is flying an F4 against Spitfire Vs, P-40s and Hurricanes in the desert. I've been flying IL-2 since the demo in 2001 now I'm on IL-2 1946 and Cliffs of Dover. It's only a sim but it's the best sim as far as flight models go. I'm not going by the sim though I just added that for a joke.
Personally. I would stick that plum-voiced twat in a Hurricane 2C and let him have a crack at the "vastly inferior Bf109F". Heck, the Hurricane was inferior to a 109E
@tommiatkins Exactly. The Hurricane was fine for bringing down bombers or maybe slugging it out with a cumbersome Me-110, but Spitfires were the real enemy of 109s during the Battle of Britain. Soviet pilots who flew lend-lease Hurricanes used to call it "pterodactyl."
@infernalzen My friends father flew the Typhoon during the war and said that that plane was a beast. The engine was too much for the plane and that exhaust constantly seeped into the cockpit, and when he was shot down, he suffered terrible burns.
@engaurd what ever...I've likely read as much or more. The hurricane could take the lumps shooting down a bomber and the spit couldn't. Mind you the 111 and Do18 aren't armed all that well.
@engaurd the 109 wasn't all that. Spit's could turn inside of them at will. The Hurricane was superior to the "F" and methinks you forget a far superior aircraft to the 109. That being the FW190 much less the highly underrated P47 C/D much less the P38(all models) now take that unsafe POS 109 and stick it in the smelter.
This has probably been covered somewhere on here, so forgive me if I'm asking again - when did the Hurricane get its 8 Brownings? This is the configuration I always associate with the airplane.
@deino117 At the time war was declared on September 3, 1939, nearly 500 Hurricanes had been delivered and eighteen squadrons had been equipped. These were all of the Mark I type, armed with eight 0.303-in. machine-guns but having alternative propeller installations
@infernalzen Thanks. So the new version covered in this vid went to 4 guns instead of the original 8? That seems odd, unless of course the four were higher calibre or superior in some other way.
Every time I read about the Hurricane, the devastating fire of those 8 Brownings is always mentioned, especially as it was so deadly against bombers. So it sounds as if the 8-gun version was always the 'classic' Hurricane, not this later 4-gun version - whatever its improvements might have been.
@deino117 The earlier Hurricane's 8 .303's was well suited against poorly armored early-war bombers, but as fighters got faster and armor got thicker cannons were used instead. Machine guns had high rates of fire and were well suited for punching through lightly armored targets to hit the crew and vital components within. Cannons had slower rates of fire and muzzle velocity but fired high-explosive rounds well suited for breaking apart structural components of the target.
@wraith444 Thanks. I've heard about how the cannon had a slower rate of fire and were harder to get on target - but were so much more deadly if you did. Somewhere there's footage of a Spit fuselage being tested against some German cannon fire and the gun practically severs the tail entirely.
I think I mentioned elsewhere how Rudel nailed an Il-16 ("Rata") or two with his Stuka's anti-tank cannon, and the highly demoralizing effect the results had on other Russian pilots in the immediate area.
@deino117 The 4x20mm config here is worth about 20 .303 calibre brownings, they were rifle calibre bullets of about 8mm with solid shot. The 20mm Hispano round shown here has explosive power and was far more powerful, said to be worth 3.3 .50 brownings by the US Navy. And the .50 browning was more powerful than the old .303 browning on the earlier hurricanes. If you complare the size of the bullets of a hispano 20mm round and a .303 browning round, the .20mm is massive AND explosive.
@deino117 4 guns yes, but they were 20mm cannon and not .303 machine guns. Cannons were tried on Spitfires during the Battle of Britain, but had a tendency to jam. I think they were also superior than the 20mm cannon on the 109e or the Zero, which were copies of the Swiss-made Orlekon cannon and had a low muzzle velocity and rate of fire until the Mauser 30mm cannon came out on the 190. The 8-gun configuration was what was known as the "a-wing" on both the Hurricane & Spitfire.
@deino117 are you being intentionality thick? The original Hurricane had 8 x .303 machine guns that fired rifle bullets. I presume by the term 'Browning' you mean '50 (50cal) Brownings like the Mustang had. It didn't have these. This later version had 20mm cannons which can shred armoured vehicles, they are devastating against aircraft. Think about it like this, 8 machine guns firing bullets the length of your index finger or a four cannons firing bullets the length of your forearm .
@matrixsenior Hey Einstein, glad you could make it. I'm sorry to say you "presumed" wrong, but I suppose that's nothing new for you. No, I didn't mean 50cal Brownings. I meant the .303 M1919 Brownings!
Try to put less effort into being insulting and abusive and a bit more into thinking before you write next time...
@deino117 A bit touchy there 'deino'. I wasn't being insulting at all, it was a straight forward question. I also went to some lengths to explain the principle to you in a manner you would understand, which I thought was quite nice of me. Ultimately it was a stupid question old chap.
@deino117 The 20mm guns were used for ground attack, mostly, but also to give a heavier punch against enemy fighters. The eight .303 Browning machine guns fired bullets too light and small to give devastating knockout blows often in the brief burst you could get in against a fighter, though they'd shred a bomber of course, which is in your sights for more than a fraction of a second and can't evade so much. By the end of the war, 20mm cannon and .50 calibre guns were standard for this reason.
@SerenissimaRepublica No, 20mm were used for air to air from the start of the war, and on all RAF aircraft from 1941. You are htinking of the 40mm cannon on the Hurri 'can opener'. The 20mmn cannon was far superior to the .303 or .50 cal machine guns for air to air and are still used today.
@deino117 The four gun version fired 20mm explosive shells - as opposed to the eight gun earlier version that fired 0.303 inch (7.71mm) bullets.
Fewer rounds per second fired but each hit being hugely more damaging to the airframe of the target.
The wings of the Hurricane were an advantage and a disadvantage. Thick enough to accommodate heavy armament (even 2 x 40mm tank buster guns during the North African campaign) but the thickness limited the top speed to about 345 mph.
@funkmasterjee i very much doubt the hurricane with the 40mm could muster up 345 mph, it's top speed during the battle of britain was around the 330-40mph i would say if it was loaded up with 40mm cannon and normally a couple of bombs on each wing it would have been lucky to break 320mph, but of course it doesn't realy come into it because the hurricane in this guise was used for ground attack and wouldn't normally been up to highter altitude to reach those sort of numbers.
@deino117 the 20mm cannon was far harder hitting than the pathetic .303's, but this mark hurricane was used primarly for ground attack, to great effect in the desert in 1942. As a pure fighter the hurricane was obsolete by late 1941.
@deino117 Just as a matter of interest, experience during the Battle of Britain had shown that the 8 browning, .303 calibre, machine guns fitted to both the Spitfire and the Hurricane could often be ineffective unless fired at close range. Many bomber sized targets (Dornier, Heinkel, Junkers) returned safely with a large number of holes but no significant damage. The cannon equipped versions, introduced fron 1941 on, firing 20mm explosive shells did much greater damage per round.
@deino117 4 X 20MM cannons can deliver more weight of fire in a 1 second burst than 8 X .303 Mgs. they are also HEI, HE, AP. .303 was really limited to AP, Ball and tracer.
@deino117 The 4 were 20mm cannon firing explosive shells, much superior to 8 .303 bullets. I think the 4 cannon would be significantly more "devastating" to an enemy bomber than the 8 brownings.
@fdsdh1 Actually the Mk IIb was the first fighter bomber variant of the Hurricane (had 12x .303s plus could carry to 250ib OR 2 500ib bombs) This one is the Mk IIc
@deino117 The four guns are cannons, each firing a 20mm explosive shell. The 8 gun version had only machine guns. The cannons deal greater deal of punishment than the MGs and are better suited for heavier targets like ships and bombers.
The Supermarine Spitfire Mk. I (deployed in the Battle of Britain alongside the Hurricane) was truly armed with 8 Browning machineguns.
@rockithoney And the Mk IIb had 12 Browning 0.303cal guns, plus the Mk IId had 2x40mm cannons in pods under the wings and a single browning in each wing
@deino117 this was its refit it fitted with cannons to pretty much used as an intercepter for long range bombers btw it wasnt that good compared to the me-109 it was kinda crap the me-109 was better at diving and always pulled away easly but couldnt clime..... the huricane was a good design but wasnt but needed the hight on your side.... if you could dive onto your enermy you would have the speed on your side..... it was also good in turns didnt overturn but lost speed fast.. :(
The superiority of the Luftwaffe is beyond controversy. Go google "list of world war 2 flying aces", look the Wikipedia and show some humbleness. The top3 german aces shot down nearly 1000 enemies. Under the top 100 ww2 flying aces there is not a single non-german pilot. This is no propaganda it is backed up by allied intelligence.
Gelebify 1 month ago
@Gelebify
When you sneak attack countries that are not ready for war, your gonna get lots of kills. No disputing that the Germans had a good air force, but they were flying against unprepared nations.
When the Allies got into the grove, they beat them, plain and simple.
wWwebBrowser 4 weeks ago
@Gelebify did not help them they lost.
18tangles 4 weeks ago
@Gelebify I had the list of how many planes the jerries shot down above 50 kills it came to around 17000 now why didnt they win?. I think some figures were inflated, and they were notorious as lying mongrels the germans.See a puff of smoke 'oh herman I got another give me the iron cross with emeralds and rubies with a sprey of wattle" We have been conned.
18tangles 2 weeks ago
@Gelebify There are several reasons for the higher number of German aces. The top 2 reasons being that the Luftwaffe didn't rotate pilots - they flew in active service throughout the war and secondly in the early years of the war they were up against inferior aircraft types in Poland, France & Russia - Even UK. German pilots had combat experience gained in Spanish Civil War and Allied pilots (especially in Russia) had very little, if any, combat training.
tomburley 2 weeks ago 3
During the BOB the Hurricane had x8 303's the same as the Spit. The cannon development and eventual fitting came started in October 1940...
beaujeste1 1 month ago
never knew that always thought the spitfire wing area was larger. To be more precise, the Hurricane was @ 72 cm's longer, 14 cm's higher, just over 100cm's larger wingspan, 0.5metres larger wing area.
smilo996 1 month ago
Spitfire was produced throughout WW2, the only British plane that was. The Hurricane was fitted with 4 20mm cannon where as the Spitfire used (initially) .303 machine guns. Then 2 cannon with 60 rounds each and 4 .303's. The 190 had 4 cannon and 2 machine guns. So actually the Spitfire was the least armed of the three. Beautiful nonetheless. The Hurricane always gets overlooked. Form over function I guess.
smilo996 1 month ago
@smilo996 seeing the spitfire +hurricane side by side, i was suprised to see the hurricane was larger :o
infernalzen 1 month ago
@smilo996 Not completely true about the Spitfire. It had 4 wing types A (x8 .303 mg), B (x8 .303 mg or x2 20mm cannon + x4 .303 mg), C (x2 20mm cannon + x4 .303 mg or x4 20mm cannon), D (unarmed for photo recon) and E (x2 20mm cannon + x2 .50 mg). Later in the war, the C and E wing types became more common, and x4 20mm cannon became standard in late variants.
chrisbenedictus 1 month ago 2
If this is Pathe, where is the chicken?
dbzrulesok 1 month ago
TO ALL MY FOES AND MY FRIEND HAPPY NEW YEAR
18tangles 1 month ago
The men who flew the Hurricane were brilliant pilots but the Me109 outclassed the Hurricane on most fronts, it wasn't the same with a Spitfire though.
jagdflieger100 2 months ago
@jagdflieger100 over 20000ft the,ME 109 and the Spit were the best under 20000 the Hurricane outflew both. info:Roland Beamont "The Years Flew Past" a battle of brit vet in Hurricanes flew Typhoons Tempests& after the war C.T.P. for Canberras, English Electric Lightnings, TSR2 gREAT BOOK IN THE END HE WAS SHAFTED BY THE COY HE HAD SERVED FOR 40YRS
;
18tangles 1 month ago
I love the profile of this plane, just like a Great White Shark with the sloping nose.
14goldmedals 2 months ago
@18tangles I was wrong the me 109E1toE4 EMILE was regarded by pilots as the best the me109G was the fastest.The E3 had 3 20mm cannonthe G one 20mm or 30mm engine cannontwo 13mm MGs forward fuselage ,info from Chris Chants Aircraft of WW2
18tangles 2 months ago
If it was not for Britains allies(USA-Canada and and so on) Britain would have not had that day with out their support!!
sinisterskid 2 months ago
@sinisterskid The Battle of Britain was only Britain and Germany fighting each other thats why they call it The Battle of Britain. America wasn't shooting down Nazis in the British channel. get your History right dude. I know America were fighting in Europe but on in Germany, because they weren't in the battle of Britain. Ok?
TheBAW194 2 months ago
@TheBAW194 During the battle of Britain the nazi assholes had less planes and man power because of Britans allies!!
sinisterskid 2 months ago
Ha Ha ....the Hurricane better than a 109F2 or F4? Really?
The 109s flew rings around Hurricanes, and up until the Spit 9 appeared, both the 109Fs and the 190s completely dominated the air war. FACT.
seanhennessy 3 months ago
@seanhennessy and you would not be totally correct but keep sucking willys dead dick.
GrigoriZhukov 3 months ago
@GrigoriZhukov You seem to have a penis fixation? This is a video about WWII fighter aircraft, perhaps you thought it was your usual buttseks forum?
seanhennessy 3 months ago
@seanhennessy obviusly oh uneducated one you were neither smart enough nor educated enough for the reference. Not surprising coming from a twat that doesn't seem to realize the Hurricans was more manouverable than the Emile and Fuchs modles. Yes slower...parity on firepower in my experience with high calibre automatics.
GrigoriZhukov 2 months ago
@GrigoriZhukov I'm afraid you are the uneducated one pal, maybe if your boyfriend took his dick out of your mouth for long enough, you could learn about the realities of aerial warfare rather than the fantasy bullshit you've learned from reading too much fantasy propaganda.
seanhennessy 2 months ago
@seanhennessy sorry buddy, but you are the one whose got his facts arse backwards and shoved in the wrong hole. But hey, keep having your nazi fantisies...nothing wrong with that, ya nazi stooge.
GrigoriZhukov 2 months ago
@seanhennessy not so the hurricane was better than both under 20000 ft and this from a BoB vet who flew with the spit and against the ME 109. Read Roland Beamont the years flew past. Great insight to WW2.
18tangles 1 month ago
@18tangles You is WRONG.
seanhennessy 1 month ago
@seanhennessy what about?
18tangles 1 month ago
But did the new Merlin engine solve the carburator cut-out that the Mk 1 Hurri % Spit suffered from? Were the cannon 20mm Orlikon or Hispano-Suza? Were the fuel tanks ever made self-sealing, unlike the Mk 1 Hurri &Spit 1? Just curious on this variant. Thanx.
TheSV3 3 months ago
@TheSV3 the fuel problem of negative G fuel cutoff wasnt dealt with until 1941 after the fitting of a restrictor plate which permitted a short duration of negative G. The problem was later solved by Rolls Royce in 1943 with a new carb design. The guns were usually 20mm Hispano although some variants were made such as the twin 40mm AT cannon MkII D, or the MKIV with twin 40mm AT and twin 303 Brownings, the fuel tanks were self sealing and were fitted as standard on most RAF fighters/bombers
gordongate 3 months ago
@gordongate Thanx. I thought Rolls-Royce had solved the neg-G problem before Packard built their Merlin, as well as the cannon being Hispano-Suza and not a copy of the Orleikon. Reason I was asking about the fuel tanks was that my Battle of Britain references said the tanks eiter had no protection or at least a very rudimentary one; a fuel tank hit usually meant big trouble for the pilot when the tank flamed up. Thanx again for your help and info.
TheSV3 3 months ago
@TheSV3 for the best details on the hurricane see if you can find Roland Beaumonts books on the hurricane,he flew one in the Battle of Britain and was a test pilot for Hawker.He did tests on all western allied planes and the FW190.
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles Thank you for your reference. I'll see what I can do on my end. What information I have is basic- and not detailed- info on both the Hurricane & Spit. The only book on the Battle/Britain by an actual Hurricane pilot is DUEL OF EAGLES by the late Peter Townsend of 85 Squadron & it's mosly general history/information as well as his expericences during the Battle. I thank you again for your reference
TheSV3 2 months ago
@TheSV3 thats fine glad to help. I will see if our local library still has them and I will get the REFERENCE NUMBERS. Roland beaumont is mentioned in the STR2 VIDEO ON YOU TUBE
18tangles 2 months ago
@TheSV3 go to roland Beaumont wicki and they list all his books
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles sorry my friend it is beamont
18tangles 1 month ago
Just don't mention Albert Pierrepoint to the Nazis he hung 200 of them after Nuremburg trials
LordGeorgeRodney 3 months ago
@LordGeorgeRodney carrying out a sentance after an exhaustive legal process?
infernalzen 3 months ago 2
@LordGeorgeRodney And a good job, too
IanHunedoara8 2 months ago
If you were to ask the real guys from WW2 about their real enemy opposition, there would probably be respect and fear coming from all sides (Allied and Axis). There was plenty of American, British, German, Japanese, and Canadian courage (and sacrifice) to be found among pilots. They were up there to do a job and defend their countries.
Just because some of them were there to support wrong causes doesn't change that.
westpoint64 4 months ago
Please everyone keep it nice! The war is long gone but not forgotten ofcourse.
ZerokillerOppel1 4 months ago
BATTLE OF BRITAIN WAS THE MAIN FIGHT BETWEEN BRITAIN AND GERMANY, THE REST IS FUCKING HISTORY. GO SPITFIRE AND HURRICANE.
jujitsuman68 5 months ago
@jujitsuman68 something i'd never heard untill recently.
reading of german pilots diaries, show that 30% of their fighters could remain for defense of their own bases in france, as british bombers were attacking these airfields during the battle of britian.
infernalzen 5 months ago
@infernalzen i dont get what your trying to say, are you saying britain won the battle of britain because 30 % of the nazis airplanes whernt there.????? it was the battle of britain soft lad not the battle for france. we where defending are country from german scum and they gave up, in my terms they LOST.
jujitsuman68 5 months ago 3
This has been flagged as spam show
@jujitsuman68 Yeh, they lost. But please, learn your own language before posting anything here! I´m German, but still a lot better in YOUR own language than you are!!! Shame on you.
traxel14 4 months ago 2
@traxel14 NOTHING AMATTER WITH MY ENGLISH YOU NAZI FUCKER, BRITAIN KICKED YOUR NAZI SCUM ARSE. SO FUCKOFF.
jujitsuman68 4 months ago
@jujitsuman68 keep it civil no need for foul language.
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles fuckoff. :)
jujitsuman68 2 months ago
@jujitsuman68 BABY BOY no class, no education, illiterate child.American ?
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles ROYAL MARINE COMMANDO, im defending britain about germans you muppet. so dont you worry yourself if i swear. :)
jujitsuman68 2 months ago
@jujitsuman68 royal marine commando my bum I know a royal marine and he never swears, our AATTV blokes seldom swear and I know a few of those. I think you are a video warrior about 20 yrs old and still living at home. Poor bugger.
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles i swear when i need to swear you cock, i`m 43 and own my house you muppet. as for video warrior , you wouldnt say any of it if you was standing in front of me. talk a good fight ever seen action.???? bet your a fucking cook , you muppet.
jujitsuman68 2 months ago
@jujitsuman68 your 43, no education,no class devoid of good manners must have been raised in the outhouse,yes I did see action, 20 yrs in the army two tours of vietnam finished up a WO.None of my men swore, better upbringing I suppose. Swearing does not make you tough or a big man. It shows everybody just how low some people get. I would say what I like in front of you and you would take it, because basically you're a coward.
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles i`m a coward thats a good come back you big mouth muppet, vietnam didnt you get your arse handed to yea.????? like i said if i want to swear i will swear do you understand you CUNT. i done my own tours in the middle east so you go crawl back under your rock. FOOL.
jujitsuman68 2 months ago
@jujitsuman68 poor man I should have realised, beaten by towel heads on motor bikes and utes, it must be demoralising. At least with us, our polies lost it for us and we gave better than we got. The sand! that was it, the sand got into your jets, tanks, artillery helmet vids,weapons thats why you lost. I apologise who were you with the poms or yanks?
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles what the fuck are you chatting you old cunt.???? lol . go and bury your head in the sand you homo. you got your fucking arse kicked bye the better man.
jujitsuman68 2 months ago
@jujitsuman68Oh it is you, who was raised in the toilet and still lives in one, no you are stupid as well as a dickhead. You served where? And you are telling me we were beaten by the better man. Grow up you know that then and now your politicians and ours dont have the guts to take it all the way. How many ragheads live in the U.K. what have you done about it ,nothing,We fight our polies here about the Muslims You crawled under your rocks and allowed them to take over.Bradford Muslim Land.
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles yea your a homo you got your arses handed to yea by lil men in black pj`s. what ever country your from isnt 100% white so stop chatting shit you old cunt.
jujitsuman68 2 months ago
@jujitsuman68 the foul mouthwho lives in a dunny
18tangles 2 months ago
@18tangles big hugs loser. lol
jujitsuman68 1 month ago
@jujitsuman68 and to you happy new year, we will continue our stoush anon.
18tangles 1 month ago
@18tangles all the the best.
jujitsuman68 1 month ago
@jujitsuman68 and to you ,mate you being an Englishman could you tell me where I would find a C.O.H OF THE BLUES AND ROYALS he was in my squadron in the late 70s. Are there sites I could go to.He was back with his unit when they were blown up by an IRA bomb. I do not know if he was among them, no names came out.
18tangles 1 month ago
@jujitsuman68 No we got rid of the white australia policy some years ago. But we did not lose whole towns to your brothers from the east like you have. We have suburbs in sydney close, but not yet
18tangles 1 month ago
@18tangles my mates just come back from living there so dont bullshit, you aint got nowhere thats 100% white.
jujitsuman68 1 month ago
@jujitsuman68 Thats a big statement and we would have some but nowhere near as bad as pommy land.You know they reckon by 2050 the whites will be in the minority maybe then you can sue the govt. for a better deal
18tangles 1 month ago
@jujitsuman68 YES WE HAVE Wilsons Downfall 20 km from Tenterfield, Liston & Legume TOO FAR FROM THE WELFARE OFFICE.
18tangles 1 month ago
@jujitsuman68 STOP THE SWEARING IT DEMEANS YOU
18tangles 1 month ago
@18tangles i will try. you have a good life.
jujitsuman68 1 month ago
@18tangles
Thank you, I'm weary of making the same post.
wWwebBrowser 4 weeks ago
@wWwebBrowser I thank you but to what are you refering to?
18tangles 4 weeks ago
@18tangles I was refering too people trying to win
arguments by gratuitous swearing
wWwebBrowser 4 weeks ago 2
@wWwebBrowser It is not just on this site its on all of them, I think mainly young people.
18tangles 4 weeks ago
@traxel14
blablabla
you're german = you suck
lottiesocks 3 months ago
@jujitsuman68 "we where defending our country from german scum & they gave up."
I can imagine Nazi scum for the first time flying towards the White Cliffs of Dover - after having breezed through Spain, Poland, the Netherlands & France - but this time they are greeted by an angry swarm of Spitfires & Hurricanes manned by 20-something young men, the likes of Bob Doe & Douglas Bader.
Only for these Nazis to learn a very costly lesson on what happens when u really piss off the British.
atrumira 1 month ago
@infernalzen COULD remain, COULD. That doesn't mean that the full 30% didn't see action.
TheDocGoblin 1 month ago
Hurricane was the real winner in the Battle of Britain, but the spitfire looks much nicer lol
TalonMercenary 5 months ago 9
"Vastly superior to a Bf109-F"?? I don't think so. The only reason a 109-F was ever downed by a Hurricane of any type was that Luftwaffe command made a serious tactical error and forced the Bfs to fly close escort to the horribly slow Ju-88s and He-111s. At slow speeds they lost their advantage to the lighter wing loading of the Hurricanes and pre-IX Spitfires. This is why Galland half-jokingly asked Goring for a squadron of Spitfires: if you're going to be low and slow you want a Spitfire.
sunscience 5 months ago
@sunscience Agree 100%
This is a news reel for the general public that the would see at the cinema. One has to realize that moral must be kept up so that's why such the positive spin on the Hurricane witch was a great aeroplane in it's own right. If a 109 F4 pilot got impatient and did a stupid thing like slowed down and to turn with that Hurricane the Hurricane would have him. If the 109 stayed on his game and boomed and zoomed the Hurricane sooner or later he would hit him.
IIJG27Rich 5 months ago
@sunscience Agree 100%
This is a news reel for the general public that the would see at the cinema. One has to realize that moral must be kept up so that's why such the positive spin on the Hurricane witch was a great aircraft in it's own right. If a 109 F4 pilot got impatient and did a stupid thing like slowed down and to turn with that Hurricane the Hurricane would have him. If the 109 stayed on his game and boomed and zoomed the Hurricane sooner or later he would hit him.
IIJG27Rich 5 months ago
Four 20mm cannon WILL mess up your day!
RetSquid 5 months ago
i think the announcer ment by better was in the armanent area jerry had two 22mm cannon and two machine guns while the hurri had 4 20mm
hunterkiller45 5 months ago
Hurris and spits used in cross channel fighter sweeps with paper droptanks extended thier range
hunterkiller45 5 months ago
1 in 4 of the 20 mm cannon shells actualy exploded on inpact with airplane fusilage most went straight through without detonating ,but against engine block or solid object they were devastating and first british plane fitted with 4 20mm was westlands whirlwind
hunterkiller45 5 months ago
12 .303s spread out along both wings hell of a lot of lead flying ,but imagine 12 of them all nose fixed like on one mark of the whirlwind thats firepower,all in one place
hunterkiller45 5 months ago
Too many German planes were going home full of holes from the eight brownings which just were not up to the job,heavier cannon shells make a big difference.
adoreslaurel 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
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They abducted 200,000 Asians (also Caucasians), raped them up to 50 times a day & buried them alive to save bullets.
Japanese govt won't apologize to any of surviving sex slaves.
In 2007, Japanese govt org bought 1 pg. of Wall Street Journal & filled it with OUTRAGEOUS LIES: 1) the females were whores who volunteered to service Japanese soldiers. 2) Japanese govt paid them more than Japanese army generals.
GOOGLE: Jan Ruff O'Herne - Japanese military sex slave
KimInLosAngeles 6 months ago
I'm trying to be a douche but the ME262 late in the war had 4 30mm's
GeneralNutcase 6 months ago
Oh shit 4 20 mm
diegomifits666 6 months ago
Haker Hurricane was built from non essential parts so can withstand alot of dmg indeed tough carb engine coughs at negative G...and lacks speed
DanottiTR 6 months ago
Comment removed
Gauchoo1234 7 months ago
@Gauchoo1234 lol yes, but remember that the hurricane was only really used to go after bombers. The spitfires would tackle the fighters.
wks1978 6 months ago
IT SUCKS
antibulletdodger101 7 months ago
good
ycshing5148 7 months ago
Also the Hurricane could out turn a 109, but it could not out climb it or outrun it in a dive.
MrRwab 7 months ago
More Hurricanes in line of duty TRUE they accounted for a larger aggregate kill count during the Battle of Britain than the Spitfire too!
MrRwab 7 months ago
im afraid the hawker tempest was a much
better plane
MrCasterton 7 months ago
@pudransemarikas Actually the hurricane could outturn a bf109E, a hell of a lot of 109s fell to the hurricane in 1940 and it shot down more german aircraft than any other in the battle of britain. Hurrishit my arse. Also if it wasn't for the hurricane ruggedness alot more pilots would have been killed. It wasnt until the 109f that the hurricane was truly outclassed as a fighter and even then it became a great ground attack aircraft, mostly in the north african desert. Don't knock the hurricane
Conwaya321 8 months ago
0:55-1:01 EPIC LIE!!!!!! It wasnt until the spitfire V that anything beat the bf109F
Conwaya321 8 months ago
During WW2 There were more Hurricanes in active duty than Spitfires. True of False?
Nomasain 8 months ago
@Nomasain Early ww2 yes, but 1941 and after, far more SPitfires as the Hurricane was phsed out as thre SPit was far superior. You are thinking of just the battle of Britian which was in summer 1940 - in the BOB there WERE more Hurris than Spits
Xiolablu3 8 months ago
Better then the 109F? Wishful propaganda I suspect. From what I read the Hurri. was being phased out because of the 109F. The later 4 canon version was a way of extending the life of the Hurri. but the 109F was considered by many German pilots to be the definitive 109 and many aces grew their reputations with this version. I have a soft spot for the Hurricane but the "vastly superior" comment is laughable quite frankly.
FrancoHitlini 9 months ago
@FrancoHitlini The beauty of the hurricaine was, they were many, when damaged,they could be patched up and turned around fast, parts being interchangeable. In a dog fight, they were not as manouverable as the 109, but they were indispensible bringing down the slower, enemy Bombers, whilst leaving the fighters, to the faster, more agile "spits". The hurricaine also found a niche as a ground attack aircraft, firing rockets and cannon, or as "Hurri Bombers".
KevinJKtheman 8 months ago
@engaurd ....well it certainly shot down a lot. 75% of the BF109's shot down in the Battle of Britain were shot down by Hurricaines. High tec doesn't always win wars...ask the Americans
matrixsenior 10 months ago
These British proppaganda footages are great.
martynrobin121 11 months ago
Notice the gun camera footage doesn't show the Hurricane against enemy aircraft. By the time they put Merlins in the Hurricane... that ship had sailed.
ahz123 11 months ago
@ahz123 What the hell do you mean 'By the time they put Merlins in the Hurricane'
The Hurricane always had a Merlin engine
TopGunSGA 11 months ago
@TopGunSGA hum. I did not know that. I thought the Merlin was a specific engine used in the Mustang, not a family of engines.
ahz123 11 months ago
@ahz123 The Merlin used in the Mustang was an American-made version of the Rolls Royce engine
en . wikipedia . org / wiki / Rolls-Royce _ Merlin
TopGunSGA 11 months ago
Птеродактиль был самым паршивым самолётом,который Россия получила по ленд-лизу.Наши старые,добрые ишаки, особенно последних модификаций,могут дать сто очков форы этому уроду от авиации.
shuljup 1 year ago
Rolls Royce Merlin and FOUR 20mm cannons? DIEYAM...!
deetjay1 1 year ago 7
@deetjay1 held in place with wood +canvas :o
infernalzen 1 year ago
@infernalzen ...so was the Mosquito and the Germans were shit scared of that too
matrixsenior 10 months ago
@infernalzen was held with metal, not wood
Xiolablu3 8 months ago
@infernalzen
The hawker hurricane had an all metal construction. In the beginning of production it used a fabric covering on the wing but an all metal covering was introduced in April 1939 and used on all later marks. No wood at all on this aircraft....
AusNav09 6 months ago
@deetjay1 they had some pretty good toys back in the day, eh mate??
MrTubbymarshall 7 months ago
@MrTubbymarshall
Well that's certainly a fact! Calling them toys would have NOT been what German pilots would have called them...LOL!
deetjay1 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@deetjay1
A Hurricane better than an 109 F4? My sides hurt from laughing so hard.
IIJG27Rich 5 months ago
@IIJG27Rich
You might just be right if that is what I had said...Nice try though...
deetjay1 5 months ago
@deetjay1
I didn't mean it at you I meant it as a reply to the newsreel
IIJG27Rich 5 months ago
@IIJG27Rich
No offence taken! I guess that we'll always have our own personal favorites...The ME-109 caused the allies a whole bunch of grief...THAT IS FOR SURE...
deetjay1 5 months ago
Comment removed
sunscience 5 months ago
@IIJG27Rich Thanks :)
I'm sorry about that I'm not one to be a smarty pants lol. I'm just a 109 nut. I've been one ever since my dad told me this story of seeing one when he was over seas in WWII. Then he bought me my first model and that was a 109 also. The story is he was up on this hill in Italy and all of a sudden he hears this thing coming, he looks up it's getting loader and loader...LOADER! Then he looks down and zooming through the gorge below is this enemy 109 G. Close and fast.
IIJG27Rich 5 months ago
@IIJG27Rich Because you flew so many missions against them, right?
jjj1951 4 months ago
@jjj1951
Probably done hundreds.
In IL-2 Sturmovik that is flying an F4 against Spitfire Vs, P-40s and Hurricanes in the desert. I've been flying IL-2 since the demo in 2001 now I'm on IL-2 1946 and Cliffs of Dover. It's only a sim but it's the best sim as far as flight models go. I'm not going by the sim though I just added that for a joke.
IIJG27Rich 4 months ago
Personally. I would stick that plum-voiced twat in a Hurricane 2C and let him have a crack at the "vastly inferior Bf109F". Heck, the Hurricane was inferior to a 109E
tommiatkins 1 year ago
@tommiatkins Exactly. The Hurricane was fine for bringing down bombers or maybe slugging it out with a cumbersome Me-110, but Spitfires were the real enemy of 109s during the Battle of Britain. Soviet pilots who flew lend-lease Hurricanes used to call it "pterodactyl."
fantom58 1 year ago
a bit of propaganda, no way was the hurri mk11 c a match for the 109 f
jabbyjabjo 1 year ago
think the major downside of the hurricane, was its fuel tank armour?
+the resulting burns of the hurricane pilots :(
infernalzen 1 year ago
@infernalzen My friends father flew the Typhoon during the war and said that that plane was a beast. The engine was too much for the plane and that exhaust constantly seeped into the cockpit, and when he was shot down, he suffered terrible burns.
bizarro604 1 year ago
@engaurd what ever...I've likely read as much or more. The hurricane could take the lumps shooting down a bomber and the spit couldn't. Mind you the 111 and Do18 aren't armed all that well.
GrigoriZhukov 1 year ago
great footage
eaglemike1515 1 year ago
@engaurd the 109 wasn't all that. Spit's could turn inside of them at will. The Hurricane was superior to the "F" and methinks you forget a far superior aircraft to the 109. That being the FW190 much less the highly underrated P47 C/D much less the P38(all models) now take that unsafe POS 109 and stick it in the smelter.
GrigoriZhukov 1 year ago
@engaurd
Agree big time :)
IIJG27Rich 1 year ago
This has probably been covered somewhere on here, so forgive me if I'm asking again - when did the Hurricane get its 8 Brownings? This is the configuration I always associate with the airplane.
deino117 1 year ago
@deino117 At the time war was declared on September 3, 1939, nearly 500 Hurricanes had been delivered and eighteen squadrons had been equipped. These were all of the Mark I type, armed with eight 0.303-in. machine-guns but having alternative propeller installations
infernalzen 1 year ago
@infernalzen Thanks. So the new version covered in this vid went to 4 guns instead of the original 8? That seems odd, unless of course the four were higher calibre or superior in some other way.
Every time I read about the Hurricane, the devastating fire of those 8 Brownings is always mentioned, especially as it was so deadly against bombers. So it sounds as if the 8-gun version was always the 'classic' Hurricane, not this later 4-gun version - whatever its improvements might have been.
deino117 1 year ago
@deino117
wiki has some pretty good info Hawker_Hurricane#Variants
infernalzen 1 year ago
@deino117 20mm cannon is much more devastating than .303 and is certainly a higher calibre
But the Hurricane didn't go from straight from 8 .303 guns to 4 20mm guns, the Mk IIb had 12 .303 guns
TopGunSGA 1 year ago
@deino117 this is 4 20mm cannons instead of 8 30cal mgs
Mattebubben 1 year ago
@deino117
Believe me, 4 20mm cannons will do a LOT more damage than the 8 or even 12 7,62mm guns of the earlier versions.
pschierhorn 1 year ago
@deino117 The earlier Hurricane's 8 .303's was well suited against poorly armored early-war bombers, but as fighters got faster and armor got thicker cannons were used instead. Machine guns had high rates of fire and were well suited for punching through lightly armored targets to hit the crew and vital components within. Cannons had slower rates of fire and muzzle velocity but fired high-explosive rounds well suited for breaking apart structural components of the target.
wraith444 1 year ago
@wraith444 Thanks. I've heard about how the cannon had a slower rate of fire and were harder to get on target - but were so much more deadly if you did. Somewhere there's footage of a Spit fuselage being tested against some German cannon fire and the gun practically severs the tail entirely.
I think I mentioned elsewhere how Rudel nailed an Il-16 ("Rata") or two with his Stuka's anti-tank cannon, and the highly demoralizing effect the results had on other Russian pilots in the immediate area.
deino117 1 year ago
@deino117 8x.303 Inches cannons vs 4x.787 Inches cannons, it offers considerably better firepower.
FuriousJoeDK 1 year ago
@FuriousJoeDK the .303 were not cannons. They were machine guns
tommiatkins 1 year ago
@deino117 The 4x20mm config here is worth about 20 .303 calibre brownings, they were rifle calibre bullets of about 8mm with solid shot. The 20mm Hispano round shown here has explosive power and was far more powerful, said to be worth 3.3 .50 brownings by the US Navy. And the .50 browning was more powerful than the old .303 browning on the earlier hurricanes. If you complare the size of the bullets of a hispano 20mm round and a .303 browning round, the .20mm is massive AND explosive.
Xiolablu3 1 year ago
@deino117 The Hurricane in this video has 4 20mm cannons. Just one of them is probably superior to all 8 .30 caliber guns carries previously.
ahz123 11 months ago
@deino117 4 guns yes, but they were 20mm cannon and not .303 machine guns. Cannons were tried on Spitfires during the Battle of Britain, but had a tendency to jam. I think they were also superior than the 20mm cannon on the 109e or the Zero, which were copies of the Swiss-made Orlekon cannon and had a low muzzle velocity and rate of fire until the Mauser 30mm cannon came out on the 190. The 8-gun configuration was what was known as the "a-wing" on both the Hurricane & Spitfire.
TheSV3 11 months ago
@deino117 are you being intentionality thick? The original Hurricane had 8 x .303 machine guns that fired rifle bullets. I presume by the term 'Browning' you mean '50 (50cal) Brownings like the Mustang had. It didn't have these. This later version had 20mm cannons which can shred armoured vehicles, they are devastating against aircraft. Think about it like this, 8 machine guns firing bullets the length of your index finger or a four cannons firing bullets the length of your forearm .
matrixsenior 10 months ago
@matrixsenior Hey Einstein, glad you could make it. I'm sorry to say you "presumed" wrong, but I suppose that's nothing new for you. No, I didn't mean 50cal Brownings. I meant the .303 M1919 Brownings!
Try to put less effort into being insulting and abusive and a bit more into thinking before you write next time...
deino117 10 months ago
@deino117 A bit touchy there 'deino'. I wasn't being insulting at all, it was a straight forward question. I also went to some lengths to explain the principle to you in a manner you would understand, which I thought was quite nice of me. Ultimately it was a stupid question old chap.
matrixsenior 10 months ago
@matrixsenior Oh, I see - so "are you being intentionally thick" is your way of being friendly... and how's that workin for ya?
Stupid questions? That's your call. You're the one who says the Browning MG isn't a Browning MG...
deino117 10 months ago
@deino117 The 20mm guns were used for ground attack, mostly, but also to give a heavier punch against enemy fighters. The eight .303 Browning machine guns fired bullets too light and small to give devastating knockout blows often in the brief burst you could get in against a fighter, though they'd shred a bomber of course, which is in your sights for more than a fraction of a second and can't evade so much. By the end of the war, 20mm cannon and .50 calibre guns were standard for this reason.
SerenissimaRepublica 10 months ago
@SerenissimaRepublica No, 20mm were used for air to air from the start of the war, and on all RAF aircraft from 1941. You are htinking of the 40mm cannon on the Hurri 'can opener'. The 20mmn cannon was far superior to the .303 or .50 cal machine guns for air to air and are still used today.
Xiolablu3 8 months ago
@deino117 The four gun version fired 20mm explosive shells - as opposed to the eight gun earlier version that fired 0.303 inch (7.71mm) bullets.
Fewer rounds per second fired but each hit being hugely more damaging to the airframe of the target.
The wings of the Hurricane were an advantage and a disadvantage. Thick enough to accommodate heavy armament (even 2 x 40mm tank buster guns during the North African campaign) but the thickness limited the top speed to about 345 mph.
funkmasterjee 9 months ago
@funkmasterjee i very much doubt the hurricane with the 40mm could muster up 345 mph, it's top speed during the battle of britain was around the 330-40mph i would say if it was loaded up with 40mm cannon and normally a couple of bombs on each wing it would have been lucky to break 320mph, but of course it doesn't realy come into it because the hurricane in this guise was used for ground attack and wouldn't normally been up to highter altitude to reach those sort of numbers.
pramboy09 9 months ago
@deino117 the 20mm cannon was far harder hitting than the pathetic .303's, but this mark hurricane was used primarly for ground attack, to great effect in the desert in 1942. As a pure fighter the hurricane was obsolete by late 1941.
pramboy09 9 months ago
@deino117 Just as a matter of interest, experience during the Battle of Britain had shown that the 8 browning, .303 calibre, machine guns fitted to both the Spitfire and the Hurricane could often be ineffective unless fired at close range. Many bomber sized targets (Dornier, Heinkel, Junkers) returned safely with a large number of holes but no significant damage. The cannon equipped versions, introduced fron 1941 on, firing 20mm explosive shells did much greater damage per round.
7527crater 9 months ago
@deino117 Some Hurricanes carried pairs of 40mm cannon, read about No. 6 and 213 Squadrons RAF in Libya.
harryfaber 7 months ago
@deino117 4 X 20MM cannons can deliver more weight of fire in a 1 second burst than 8 X .303 Mgs. they are also HEI, HE, AP. .303 was really limited to AP, Ball and tracer.
dpsherry 6 months ago
@deino117 The 4 were 20mm cannon firing explosive shells, much superior to 8 .303 bullets. I think the 4 cannon would be significantly more "devastating" to an enemy bomber than the 8 brownings.
wks1978 6 months ago
@deino117 this is when the hurricane switched from fighter to fighter bomber?
was it this hurricane that only had enough ammo for 30 second burst
fdsdh1 6 months ago
@fdsdh1 Actually the Mk IIb was the first fighter bomber variant of the Hurricane (had 12x .303s plus could carry to 250ib OR 2 500ib bombs) This one is the Mk IIc
TopGunSGA 6 months ago
@deino117 The four guns are cannons, each firing a 20mm explosive shell. The 8 gun version had only machine guns. The cannons deal greater deal of punishment than the MGs and are better suited for heavier targets like ships and bombers.
The Supermarine Spitfire Mk. I (deployed in the Battle of Britain alongside the Hurricane) was truly armed with 8 Browning machineguns.
glock71 5 months ago
@deino117 Not all MKII Hurricanes had the 4x20mm cannons. It was for the MKIIc. The A variants remained having the 8 Browning 0.303cal guns.
rockithoney 1 year ago
@rockithoney And the Mk IIb had 12 Browning 0.303cal guns, plus the Mk IId had 2x40mm cannons in pods under the wings and a single browning in each wing
TopGunSGA 1 year ago
@deino117 this was its refit it fitted with cannons to pretty much used as an intercepter for long range bombers btw it wasnt that good compared to the me-109 it was kinda crap the me-109 was better at diving and always pulled away easly but couldnt clime..... the huricane was a good design but wasnt but needed the hight on your side.... if you could dive onto your enermy you would have the speed on your side..... it was also good in turns didnt overturn but lost speed fast.. :(