Vegas

[enticia]

come visit me at the NEW site for GERMAN SHEPHERD LOVERS! I found it last week!

myGSDog.com

[m1shadow]

As a German shepherd lover and owner i must say- STOP WITH THE SLOPING BACKS!!!!!!!!!!! You F'n showline breeders are ruining the breed! Check out the ORIGINAL German shepherd, it had a straight back. Sloping backs contribute to hip dysplasia and severly limit the dogs functional traits. How do i know? I have owned the breed and dealt with them my whole life, my last GSD, Tank lived to almost 11 before cancer got him,had perfect hips till his last day! He was a straight back WORKING LINE GSD!

[jmdnarri]

@m1shadow I completely agree that these show lines have gone WAY too extreme wit the sloped backs, but the angle of the dogs back/ hips has nothing to do with the formation of the hip socket; but it does hinder their stride. These dogs are supposed to be protection dogs but some of them can't run faster than a person they would be trying to catch!!

[boredequalshappyness]

@m1shadow I totally agree. My Shepherd is straight backed and she is very agile and speedy. She's a perfect picture of what Mox Von Stephanitz had created 100 some years ago. The only problem is shes not registered so people don't speak kindly about her :(

[m1shadow]

@boredequalshappyness Sounds like you have a wonderful dog! Btw, do NOT let the fact she is not registered bother you, it's just a piece of paper, and ignore the idiots with rude comments about her! My female German shepherd isn't registered either, and i got her from a shelter! However, she is obviously a pure German shepherd and is an amazing dog; loving and loyal, but also fiercely protective of me and the home! She is a straight back working line, check out my videos if you want!

[teddybear4422]

best dogs

[arklimjon]

yes, you don't have d data to defend it, but the breed wardens and top class breeders do, and for generations, they know what they are doing.. they know tons more than any of you folks here who think they are inhuman and ugly. and for your info, these dogs are loved than u could ever imagine.. They resemble hyenas, because hyenas are efficient runners with their angulated legs, and high withers. this is about good angulation, not a bust job, or a nose lift

[LionessCub1]

You mention that these top class breeders know what they are doing.... You seem to be neglecting the fact that many top class breeders have turned their breed into a non functioning show breed that couldnt possibly do the work they were intended to do. For example the bulldog. Please youtube "BBC pedigree dogs exposed" user wallee9000 has the entire episode on youtube. Then you can see how some top line breeders care more about the "breed standard" then they do the actual dogs

[arklimjon]

yes, a bulldog used to be a bull baiting dog for gladiator use, do you still need them? they were miniaturized and bred to become pets... you mean you still want them to be bred as man eaters? killing machines?

[LionessCub1]

its exaggerating a bit to call them man eating killing machines now isnt it? They may no longer be needed for bull baiting but all that was needed to change them into a more practical pet was a change in temperament at most. Not changing them into brachiocephalic dogs that have a multitude of breathing problems. Most of them can't move well at all and the natural ability to swim was bred out of them.

[arklimjon]

well they used to be man eating machines before. a yorkie & the pekingese used to be as big as a german shepherds but were miniaturized for companionship. we see different pitbulls now, fighting,amstaff & bully types. working rotts also have bigdog lines for cart pulling, and small dog lines for show and herding. most breeds have a standard & mini sized version, for a purpose. but some, like.english mastiffs are still preferred n bred big. man customises his animals for a certain purpose

[arklimjon]

if you ask me, bulldogs were famous for their big ugly faces, and that's why man love them & had to keep breeding them as pets for companionship, as docile housepets who don't need exercise.. that's why they are classified as non-sporting breed.  If you want a swimming dog, get a lab,weimareiner, or a new foundland, those dogs are bred to swim!

[LionessCub1]

why is it acceptable to make something that is going to suffer most of its life because somebody didnt want to exercise their dog? There are also many companion dogs that don't have all of these bred in problems. there are many dogs that don't much care for swimming but at least they can if they have to.

[arklimjon]

your question is as good as "Why man have to make viruses and antiviruses at the same time"? is that acceptable? why do some men prefer to smoke when they are killing themselves? why do men prefer to sit on the sofa and watch tv for hours?.. . Americans are too concerned about inhuman treatment to animals on tv but loves to see human violence and gore on tv. what's acceptable?

[arklimjon]

if you want a dog that doesnt have health problems, get a dingo from australia, or an australian cattle dog (blue heeler), that is half dingo. that's a great great breed, and they are not very angulated.

[LionessCub1]

i love gsds i just don't like seeing the breed suffer. And there are plenty of of them with pedigrees and without ( in my opinion ) the ridiculous over angulation

[arklimjon]

yes, the germans have retained the old gsd lines for those who prefer it while maintaining their new breed standard. its a matter of preference.. Those american type gsds winning in westminister shows for me are rubbish but the judges think otherwise. In as much as everyone of us doglovers don't wanna see the dog breeds suffer, we can't change people's thinking. breed wardens are selected to do their job because they are the best in their craft, so who are we to question them?

[arklimjon]

German mentality never sacrificed function to beauty.. that's one thing. german breedings are closely monitored in germany,you cannot breed your dog if you can't pass a certain rating,or you cannot breed your bitch to a rated dog if yours doesn't have a schutzhund title.These breeders live with accountability, to ensure that the breed continues to improve.. & sorry, I bet my bottom dollar, they are more knowledgeable than you are. If you prefer the underangulated shepherds, stick w/ malinois.

[LionessCub1]

Im sorry are you agreeing that gsd's are being very badly bred? just not in germany? and if so do the others dogs not matter? And again working dogs in GERMANY don't usually have that crazy over slant much of their slant that u see in them is just the stacked pose. Bet whichever dollar you've got you can't honestly say to yourself that these problems don't exist.

[arklimjon]

some dogs, some gsds are badly bred, but in germany, defective pups are culled instantly, and those who grew up incorrectly aren't allowed to be bred. Yes, Working german lines aren't bred to be angulated..ONLY the SHOWLINES.. I've had 2 different types of shepherds before with distinct lines and appearances, both from germany. I even had a beautiful showline gsd who became successful as a working k9 due to his lack of angulation, and couldn't run for a long time in the showring.

[LionessCub1]

sorry user is Walle9000

[LionessCub1]

Last thought i promise... while hyenas do have a roached back to a degree their body mechanics and structure is NOTHING like these GSDs They move in a completely different fashion. Hyenas are very efficient runners which has in part to do with their bone structure but also the size of their heart and lungs. User jemimaharrison has a youtube video of some GSD's at the Manchester show. She slows down the winners walking at the end you can see how bad it is. some others are actually limping : (

[arklimjon]

well what you saw is a lousy dogshow with irresponsible exhibitors.. i've been to a dogshow with outstanding gsds and a bunch of mutated great danes.. the japanese judge had to dismiss all of them from joining. there are millions of cow hocked rottweilers and cocker spaniels with ectropion. thing is, breeds have problems...but a conditioned gsd with a normal lung can run as efficiently as a hyena.. have you heard of hip dysplasia? even straight hocked labradors are cursed with that.

[LionessCub1]

i agree it was a lousy dog show with a bunch of irresponsible exhibitors and breeders. And yes a conditioned gsd with normal heart lungs and good hips can run very efficiently. What im saying is that there are far too many breeders who are breeding more for that exaggerated slant then the health of the dog. And no bad breeding isn't limited to GSD's I don't think its acceptable in any breed. But major Dog shows allow for disabled dogs to be shown and bred with no problem.

[arklimjon]

Yes, but if irresponsible breeding is your issue here, then you should be talking about puppy mill operators and not SV breeders, or showfanciers. If you're saying that this abnormality occurs mostly to gsds, then probably its because there are more gsds being bred then there are belgian tervurens or collies.. as for dogshows, you cannot ask a proud owner not to show his mutated dog. but a judge can dismiss them...

[LionessCub1]

If you watch the bbc show i pointed out to u you can see that many judges don't care that the dog has a disability as long as its not immediately obvious. Puppy mills are almost universally despised and known to be bad. However most people have no idea that the pedigree pup they payed so much can also come with a list of problems for Show accepted bad breeding. Again this is in no way limited to GSD's

[arklimjon]

we are off the original topic now.. we were talking about gsds..I was just pointing it out to you, that there are bad crippled gsds as well as bad crippled labradors, but there's no way that the great breeders or the breed wardens wanted this to happen.. for me, the german shepherd looks better and better, and as athletes, they run faster, run longer than the original gsd of max stephanitz.

[LionessCub1]

and with that said i have no problem with great breeders who can breed a dog with or without angulation that doesnt suffer any adverse health effects and can move gracefully and efficiently. However there are far fewer of those breeders than the ones who will happily breed and show the poor crippled dogs. Its them that I have an issue with.

[arklimjon]

yes but this particular video shows a bunch of beautiful gsds who are actually excellent specimens and because they don't move/run like the common dog, you think they are cripples? Vegas is one of the best runners among the va group, this video only shows him walking n pacing, you should see them on a fast TROT! I also have a tervuren, its a beautiful dog, but none of them runs like a gsd..

[electriengineer]

I do not have any scientific reasoning or data to defend this, but I swear the GSD's that my wife and I rescue and foster with our GSD rescue group here in Tennessee look 100% better than many of these dogs. Maybe because they were not bred to be show dogs - I am not sure. Even the vet who performs a lot of the services for our rescue dogs says he has noticed the same thing. Either way, all GSD's deserve to be loved, regardless of breeding! They are truly the greatest!

[arklimjon]

yes, you don't have d data to defend it, but the breed wardens and top class breeders do, and for generations, they know what they are doing.. they know tons more than any of you folks here who think they are inhuman and ugly. and for your info, these dogs are loved than u could ever imagine.. they resemble hyenas, because hyenas are efficient runners. angulated legs, and high withers.

[terese84]

I would like to see the dogbreeders/owners having the same back as those poor dogs. I can't really see that it would be good for any purpose to hardly beeing able to use your legs and keeping proper balance in the body when walking.

[CreekValleyCritters]

Yes, if you are into the small rear end, sloping, walk-on-hocks hyena look. Captain Max von Stephanitz would be horrified at what has happened to his beautiful wolf-like dog.............

I love the German shepherd so much I have to speak out. If more of us did then maybe the GSD would go back to the super dog it used to be before the extreme selection of the show ring turned it into a weird abnormality.

[arklimjon]

i really don't understand people like you judging these breed wardens for being stupid and inhumane for what they've done for the breed.. I think they know what they're doing and the reason why they have sloping backs is not because of their aesthetic , it's because of function. germans know what they're doing when it comes to functionality. these specimens are show line shepherds designed to run for longer periods efficiently. If you want a k9 shepherd, they also have working lines for you.

[LionessCub1]

the slope in there back is actually purely aesthetic to make it look more elegant when they run. Its not for functionality if it was the working dogs would also have it. AKC UKC etc care more about a human beings ability to selectively breed a dog to words written on paper than the actual health or purpose of the dog. Its really sad :(

[arklimjon]

i disagree... they are bred to have angulated front as well as hindquarters , because its scientifically proven that a swinging L-shaped member has more coverage with less effort than a straight member.angled hindquarters shorten the hindlegs only vertically , making them look shorter and thus sloped.(check out windshield wipers,or compare legs of cow and deer) working dogs are meant to gallop, jump n do other things aside from running.. gsds can run longer effortlessly than other breeds

[LionessCub1]

but that still brings to question if it is indeed more functional why isnt this a sought after trait for the gds who are ACTUALLY working. Its one thing to have a minor degree of slanting which i agree can actually aid the pup in running more effortlessly. But too many breeders have gone far beyond that point to where its actually more harmful to the dog.

[arklimjon]

its not a question..its a proven fact that an angulated leg can cover more ground than a straight leg with lesser effort. and like i said, show gsds are bred to run effortlessly for long periods.. I didnt say they are bred to be K9s that jump over a-frames or dig for drugs. they just TROT and TROT... and I don't know what you're seeing, but a an angulated trotting gsd is the best trotting 4 legged animal in the world.

[LionessCub1]

im talking about over angulation here i already said that some angulation is fine and indeed helpful. im asking why arent the drastically angulated dogs ever working dogs?

[arklimjon]

a right angle(90degree,L-shaped) angulation is desired, and that's very angulated already. Why they arent used in working K9 sniff /attack dogs? because although they are efficient runners, they are not built for speed bursts, maneuverability/agility. working k9 dogs run in first gear, while gsds run in fourth gear.

[CreekValleyCritters]

It is so sad what has been done to the German shepherd. The beautiful athletic healthy wolf-like dog of 50 years ago has been turned into a freakish cripple. How anyone can find that beautiful is beyond me. We humans are designed to find the healthy and natural beautiful and the unhealthy and unnatural ugly, so only a small elite group of warped dog show people will find these dogs attractive. For the rest of us these dogs only perpetuate the poor reputation of the modern German shepherd.

[SH4MR0CK007]

maybe if you opened your eyes and looked you might see the beauty and sound temperment