Reconciliation in the Senate for Health care

[DGB228]

again, you failed to understand the main cause of this financial meltdown and thus my point. when Clinton deregulated the banks (which was passed by a Republican Congress) they essentially said, "we know there is no way you can afford this, but i lets see how far we get"

nobody is arguing that America isnt a consumer society, but SOME individual live beyond their means, or worse, think the are untitled to more, i.e. Unions

what ever happen to working hard to afford the things you want?

[molloyxx1]

BTW, every year a group of liberals [ and BTW make that the lowest savings rate in developed countries] get together to urge other Americans to go through a day where you dont buy a fucking thing [ expext obvious necessisities]. Where you don't get suckered into buying something you likely can't afford [ a 98 inch flat screen or all terrain vehicle] and just might be able to live a decent life without. I find that a curiously concervative instinct that, say, Ben Franklin would likely support.

[molloyxx1]

DGB228 Americans have been living on credit for decades, and have one of the lowest savings rates in the world. Consumerism is a national disiease, and promoted with great fervor and intensity every time you fucking turn around or turn on your television set. It is the precise result of free-wheeling capitalism and the inability of most Americans [like children[ to delay gratification]. They love their toys go bankrupt acquiring them. QA'm all about seeing that change,

[DGB228]

living beyond their means is why people are in this mess. its a fairly simple concept. but in America, everyone wants to be a winner, so in the end, we all lose. great work.

notice how not ONE democrat will talk about health care?!?!? its like when you get caught doing something wrong, you want to avoid it at all cost, everyone knows this thing will never actually do anything, it will just be like SS or the VA and medicare/caid, or the PO and public schools, or Cash for Clunker (lol) or.......

[molloyxx1]

DGB I have lived in rural areas all across America [ Maine, Montana, Colorado, Wyoming] and well know bus service is non-existant in such remote places. When I was younger I did hitch-hike to work [ from a town w/ a pop of 800] but this is not something any sane young working woman should consider. So, your notion that there is trqnsortation everywhere in the US is hooey.

[kerbio81]

Money talks, B.S. walks

Money talks, come on, come on

[kerbio81]

A French maid, foreign chef

A big house with king size bed

You've had enough, you ship them out

The dollar's up-down, you'd better buy the pound

The claim is on you

The sights are on me

So what do you do

That's guaranteed

Hey little girl, you broke the laws

You hustle, you deal, you steal from us all

[kerbio81]

Come on, come on, love me for the money

Come on, come on, listen to the money talk

Come on, come on, love me for the money

Come on, come on, listen to the money talk

[kerbio81]

Tailored suits, chauffered cars

Fine hotels and big cigars

Up for grabs, up for a price

Where the red hot girls keep on dancing through the night

The claim is on you

The sights are on me

So what do you do

That's guaranteed

Hey little girl, you want it all

The furs, the diamonds, the painting on the wall

[kerbio81]

You hustle, you deal, you steal from us all

Everyone who watches this video should play Money Talks by ACDC while watching.

[kerbio81]

You know, I almost swore I heard ACDC's Moneytalks playing in the background while tI watched the Senate vote for this on CSPAN

[molloyxx1]

@franksinatra34 true dat

[TigressMel]

so think about all of the things in that bill when your yelling that we all need to be covered. I'm one of the people who are sick and can't get any coverage! but i dont want the government shoving this down my throat while they blow smoke up my.... like they always do..... this health care bill is a very bad mistake for all of us.. it will cause more problems then it will slove

[molloyxx1]

What best represents the disconnect between propaganda and reality is the percentage of Americans over 65 and so Medicare eligible who are against this reform or go so far as to characterize it as socilialist. They certainly don't believe health care is being forced down their collective throat and are incensed when they suspect their benefits will be reduced. I hope you find a way to get care for your medical condition.

[TigressMel]

Page 489 Sec 1308: The Govt will cover marriage and family therapy. (Which means Govt will insert itself into your marriage even.)

Page 494-498: Govt will cover Mental Health Services including defining, creating, and rationing those services.

[molloyxx1]

What drivel.If a for profit marriage counseler 'inserts' him or herself into your business [ presumbaly because you request this] thats absolutely fine simply because they work for an organization devoted to maximizing profits but if you are working with a government counselor, be certain they are one of Satans spawn, genetically predisposed to destroy families in between devouring the flesh of helpless animals.

[TigressMel]

Page 429 Lines 13-25: The GOVT will specify which doctors can write an end-of-life order.. (I wouldn't want to stand before God after getting paid for THAT job!)

Page 430 Lines 11-15: The Govt will decide what level of treatment you will have at end-of-life! (Again -- no choice!)

Page 469: Community-Based Home Medical Services = Non-Profit Organizations. (Hello? ACORN Medical Services here!?!)

.

[molloyxx1]

Tigress. An 'end of life order'? Presumably you are refering to developing an advanced directive re the kind of care you choose to recieve in dire medical circimstances. This happens daily, and in conjunction with doctors enrolled with for profit insurers and doctors who are paid by Medicare. In short. you have swallowed right wing t rhetoric whole, and this is a poison al its own.

[TigressMel]

Page 427 Lines 15-24: The Govt mandates a program for orders on "end-of-life." (The Govt has a say in how your life ends!)

Page 429 Lines 1-9: An "advanced-care planning consultant" will be used frequently as a patient's health deteriorates.

Page 429 Lines 10-12: An "advanced care consultation" may include an ORDER for end-of-life plans.. (AN ORDER TO DIE FROM THE GOVERNMENT?!?)

[TigressMel]

Page 425 Lines 17-19: The Govt will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. (And it's mandatory!)

Page 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3: The Govt provides an "approved" list of end-of-life resources; guiding you in death. (Also called 'assisted suicide.')(Sounds like Soylent Green to me.)

[TigressMel]

Page 354 Sec 1177: The Govt will RESTRICT enrollment of 'special needs people!' Unbelievable!

Page 379 Sec 1191: The Govt creates more bureaucracy via a "Tele-Health Advisory Committee." (Can you say HC by phone?)

Page 425 Lines 4-12: The Govt mandates "Advance-Care Planning Consult." (Think senior citizens end-of-life patients.)

[TigressMel]

Page 321 2-13: Hospitals have the opportunity to apply for exception BUT community input is required. (Can you say ACORN?)

Page 335 L 16-25 Pg 336-339: The Govt mandates establishment of=2 outcome-based measures. (HC the way they want -- rationing.)

Page 341 Lines 3-9: The Govt has authority to disqualify Medicare Advance Plans, HMOs, etc. (Forcing people into the Govt plan)

[TigressMel]

Page 298 Lines 9-11: Doctors: If you treat a patient during initial admission that results in a re-admission -- the Govt will penalize you.

Page 317 L 13-20: PROHIBITION on ownership/investment. (The Govt tells doctors what and how much they can own!)

Page 317-318 lines 21-25, 1-3: PROHIBITION on expansion. (The Govt is mandating that hospitals cannot expand.)

[TigressMel]

Page 268 Sec 1141: The federal Govt regulates the rental and purchase of power driven wheelchairs.

Page 272 SEC. 1145: TREATMENT OF CERTAIN CANCER HOSPITALS - Cancer patients - welcome to rationing!

Page 280 Sec 1151: The Govt will penalize hospitals for whatever the Govt deems preventable (i.e...re-admissions).

[TigressMel]

Page 241 Line 6-8 HC Bill: Doctors: It doesn't matter what specialty you have trained yourself in -- you will all be paid the same! (Just TRY to tell me that's not Socialism!)

Page 253 Line 10-18: The Govt sets the value of a doctor's time, profession, judgment, etc. (Literally-- the value of humans.)

Page 265 Sec 1131: The Govt mandates and controls productivity for "private" HC industries.

[TigressMel]

Page 195 HC Bill: Officers & employees of the GOVT HC Admin.. will have access to ALL Americans' finances and personal records. (I guess so they can 'deduct' their fees)

Page 203 Line 14-15 HC: "The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax." (Yes, it really says that!) ( a 'fee' instead)

Page 239 Line 14-24 HC Bill: Govt will reduce physician services for Medicaid Seniors. (Low-income and the poor are affected.)

[TigressMel]

Page 150 Lines 9-13: A business with payroll between $251K & $401K who doesn't provide public option will pay 2-6% tax on all payroll.

Page 167 Lines 18-23: ANY individual who doesn't have acceptable HC according to Govt will be taxed 2.5% of income.

Page 170 Lines 1-3 HC Bill: Any NONRESIDENT Alien is exempt from individual taxes. (Americans will pay.) (Like always)

[TigressMel]

Page 126 Lines 22-25: Employers MUST pay for HC for part-time employees ANDtheir families. (Employees shouldn't get excited about this as employers will be forced to reduce its work force, benefits, and wages/salaries to cover such a huge expense.)

Page 149 Lines 16-24: ANY Employer with payroll 401k & above who does not provide public option will pay 8% tax on all payroll! (See the last comment in parenthesis.)

[TigressMel]

Page 12 4 lines 24-25 HC: No company can sue GOVT on price fixing. No "judicial review" against Govt monopoly.

Page 127 Lines 1-16 HC Bill: Doctors/ American Medical Association - The Govt will tell YOU what salary you can make.

Page 145 Line 15-17: An Employer MUST auto-enroll employees into public option plan. (NO choice!)

[TigressMel]

Page 91 Lines 4-7 HC Bill: Govt mandates linguistic appropriate services. (Translation: illegal aliens.)

Page 95 HC Bill Lines 8-18: The Govt will use groups (i.e. ACORN & Americorps to sign up individuals for Govt HC plan.

Page 85 Line 7 HC Bill: Specifications of Benefit Levels for Plans. (AARP members - your health care WILL be rationed!)

Page 102 Lines 12-18 HC Bill: Medicaid eligible individuals will be automatically enrolled in Medicaid. (No choice.)

[TigressMel]

Page 22 of the HC Bill: Mandates that the Govt will audit books of all employers that self-insure!!

Page 30 Sec 123 of HC bill: THERE WILL BE A GOVT COMMITTEE that decides what treatments/benefits you get.

Page 29 lines 4-16 in the HC bill: YOUR HEALTH CARE IS RATIONED!!!

Page 42 of HC Bill: The Health Choices Commissioner will choose your HC benefits for you. You have no choice!

Page 50 Section 152 in HC bill: HC will be provided to ALL non-US citizens, illegal or otherwise.

[TigressMel]

this is the crap in this bill they just passed

Page 22 of the HC Bill: Mandates that the Govt will audit books of all employers that self-insure!!

Page 30 Sec 123 of HC bill: THERE WILL BE A GOVT COMMITTEE that decides what treatments/benefits you get.

Page 29 lines 4-16 in the HC bill: YOUR HEALTH CARE IS RATIONED!!!

Page 42 of HC Bill: The Health Choices Commissioner will choose your HC benefits for you. You have no choice!

[AidenPryde3025]

The American people elected "Social" Democrats to office in 2006/08/10 because the Republicans lost their way and moved from being fiscally responsible to being more like the Democrats.

So the nation said to itself, "if I'm going to have big and bad government I might as well elect the Democrats, because at least they are happy doing it."

Health care is not a right. The Constitution did not create a Department of Happiness. It only allowed for each and every person to pursue happiness.

[DGB228]

its like someone trying to sell you an obsolete car that most your family doesn't want, you all finally decide against it as its just too much for nothing when you have a BMW already, but then then dealer takes out the engine and seats but keep it the same cost, well you obviously dont want it now, it was bad before, but now its terrible. but then your two children read about this law that says they can get the terrible car it just them two vote! PERFECT!

[DGB228]

interesting how you focused on the 6 million working class, not the 24 million others. yes, i did vote, both times, for the better of the two shitty choices, like most Americans.

but no, the undeserving are the Illegals, some of the unemployed who chose to stay unemployed which is a shockingly high rate, or the 5-10 million 18-26 year olds who dont need, nor would they normally have health insurance.

so dont twist words to make a point. thats why the dems are where they are in such short time.

[molloyxx1]

Many of the 24 million others are people who are still working but simply can't afford health care and their employers don't provide it. Wages for the middle class actually declined vs the cost of living during the Bush years [ while the economic elites incomes rose]..

[molloyxx1]

There is a reason, DGB, 18 to 26 year olds pay extremely high premiums for auto insurance; they are at a high statistical risk for car accidents, i.e. more likely to physically injure themselves or others. Most states mandate the purchase of car insurance for very obvious, common reasons and I have yet to see anyone suggest this is a movement towards socialism.

[AidenPryde3025]

Auto insurance is mandated to protect others from YOU. Health insurance is for YOUR protection, not anyone else.

Tired of hearing this false comparison.  Stop using it please.

[DGB228]

@molloyxx1 we are not forced to buy auto insurance chief, but good try. you dont have to drive on public roads, there is transportation. you do, on the other hand, have to live, and therefore get taxed if you dont buy health insurance now. and where as your argument that younger people are more dangerous therefore have higher rates is correct but the EXACT opposite for health care, the younger people are forced to buy because a generation lived beyond their means.

[DGB228]

@molloyxx1 people who say socialism sound as ignorant, and clearly have no concept of what socialism is. agreed there.

and another main thing your missing, the nation wanted health care reform, they just didnt want this bill, and the way it was stripped of anything good and mistakenly forced upon the nation is why America is in a uproar.

[molloyxx1]

@DGB228 Recently the GOP opponent for Reids seat in Nevada dismissed the need for health care reform by suggesting we climb into a time machine and voyage back to the days of yore, when a stricken chicken farmer could barter with the local doctor [ remove this ugly tumor and I'll give you couple of A plus egg producres and a rooster to boot]. When challenged she repeatedly defended this exqusite delusion. Is this the kind of person you want in the senate?

[DGB228]

@molloyxx1 so wait, you dont think that farmers and people in small towns bartered for services as recent as the 50-60s? its common knowledge, and still happens in some places. but either way, curious how that makes harry reid better in any way.

both parties have idiots i dont think anyone is doubting that.

you seem lost and backwards, also its quite obvious that you are being willfully ignorant as anyone knows that if your dont have transportation you wouldnt look OR take a job you cant get to

[puckfelosi2010]

For any of you libtards out there who think you've won, think again. This thing goes to the voters now.

[totootwo1]

Some of us have jobs or are at least looking for work. ( high unemployment remember?) Oh yeah that's right. You and all the other libtards are too busy getting orgasmic over government takeover of healthcare. Well, you go ahead and jerk off to clown face pelosi. I have to get back to work.

[molloyxx1]

Interesting.[Liberal] Opposition posts are disappearing one by one.

[totootwo1]

molloyxx1: Say what? Maybe we have jobs unlike you people.

[totootwo1]

@ molloyxx1: What's the point of arguing with idiots? You and the frank sinatra guy are making total fools of yourselves which is quite entertaining. Can't wait for this thing to be defeated in the House. Seeing Pelosi cry in defeat will put a smile on my face.

[roseparade1]

frank I encounter this kind of incoherence all the time from the tin foil hat militia that Mr Beck and his ill educated cohorts have inspired and have more than once requested a decoder ring or some other mechanism for translation. It is my guess that if were privy to what goes on in their minds most of the day we would hear a dial tone.

[triple9IQ]

@roseparade1 Fuck you, you ignorant whore. You and you're liberal posse of weak-minded fools have just ruined our nation. Not just for me, my children, and my children's children, but for yours too. Fuck you from me, and 'Fuck you' from your unborn family.

[MrThompson2333]

I retired 2005 my health monthly payments were 541.00 now it's 917.00 I'm being raped like some many others the majority of protesters in Medicare or Medical crying . They have what all Americans need. You won't understand until you lose your insurance or kicked off because you've max out your life time cost. Those who are in denial need to experience this event . I had to find a part time job , get your facts straight because what I'm reading on this page is far from whats real

[usam1981]

@franksinatra34 Who might this president be, I don't see one?

[totootwo1]

What I want to know is why dumbocrats are in such a hurry to pass this NOW when it doesn't go into effect until 2013 or 2014? I think there's more important things to focus on like UNEMPLOYMENT!!!!

[molloyxx1]

The Senate passed an 18 billion dollar jobs bill [ much of it devoted to giving small business tax breaks] just today by 68 to 29. Eleven Republicans voted with the Democratic majority. 29 decided, obviously, that American small businesses should not get these tax breaks.

[usam1981]

@totootwo1 Simple, the dumbocrats want to pass it before they have to start to run for re-election. When that happens they will not be able to push for it. If it passes, they have, in the bill, it set up so that the bill can't be repealed by another congress.

[totootwo1]

Well it looks like the House may try to pass the thing without a vote! Wow! There's rules, and then there's dumbocrats. I think there's a copy of the Constitution in Washington. Dumbocrat law makers use it as a door mat! "Obummer-not the change we were wanting".

[DGB228]

At this point, Epic Win either way. If it passes, wow, unreal, Dems will lose Majorities in both House and Senate, taxes will skyrocket, and some 30-40 million undeserving people will receive sub-par care. if it doesnt pass. well, America wins, but the O loses his third major political battle in a year.

[molloyxx1]

Undeserving Americans? 6 millions working class Americans lost thier jobs during the collapse of the economy during the later stages of the Bush administration [ who, BTW, DGB, didi you vote for in 2000 and 2004?} and their health along with it. They are 'undeserving' because they were laid off through no fault of their own?

[DGB228]

interesting how you focused on the 6 million working class, not the 24 million others. yes, i did vote, both times, for the better of the two shitty choices, like most Americans.

but no, the undeserving are the Illegals, some of the unemployed who chose to stay unemployed which is a shockingly high rate, or the 5-10 million 18-26 year olds who dont need, nor would they normally have health insurance.

so dont twist words to make a point. thats why the dems are where they are in such short time.

[molloyxx1]

Costomers? An unintended irony.

[molloyxx1]

Executives from California Health insurance giant Anthelm Blue Cross, under fire for scheduled rates hikes of up to 39 percent, insisted Tuesday that their premiums were fair and legal. Translation; for profit health care executives don't give a sweet shit about their costomers, are only interested in maximizing profits and well know existing regulations are not sufficient to prevent this kind of craven profiteering. A public option would stop this kind of shit in its fucking tracks.

[molloyxx1]

What is bullshit is that the Republicans have not proposed anything that would remedy a fact that should be an embarassment to all of us; that more than 30 million Americans have no health insurance whatsoever and that 45, 000 Americans die each year via lack of insurance. America is ranked 37th in the world in terms of quality national health care, a travesty for the 'greatest nation on earth'.

[usam1981]

@molloyxx1 Wrong, wrong, wrong, we have tried to pass bills that fix this, but you never hear about them, EVER. Also, do you know that over half of those 30 Million are ILLEGAL IMAGRANTS. I bet you didn't. Also, if you take out the accidental deaths and age related deaths that we can't control, we go back up to the top of the list, so shut up.

[molloyxx1]

Half of those 30,000,000 are illegal immigrant? . I'd love to see a source for that number [ something not even the usual suspects of the right wing crackpot militia seem to claim] AND, there is nothing in the health care bill that provides coverage for illegal immigrants. Accidental deaths have nothing to do with insurance [ do YOU have insurance that prevents you dying from a car accident] and neither is there insurance against getting so old that you, you know, pass away. WTF?

[usam1981]

@molloyxx1 That was a number that has been reported by Many different sourses, including many of the CREDABLE SOURSES out there. Also, you don't get what I was saying about the deaths, if those are the cases, nothing in this bill can fix those deaths, ever.

[Flametopology]

This American has 3 words: THIS IS BULLSHIT!

[DGB228]

in one year, one year, the Left went from puberty to castration. they thought they had some balls in Nov of 08, by Nov 09 gone. all hope lost.

[DGB228]

incorrect, there is no single payer, if there were, maybe, maybe, maybe could work. most likely not.

Bushs debt was accumulated by, 2 Wars, a Global Meltdown, a few large natural disasters, and, oh yeah, 9/11.

Obama has done a 1/3 Bushs damage in record time.

its fine. you can say and think what you want, but numbers dont lie, i.e. jobless rate, stock markets, debt, approval rating (congress/President), number of dropping Democrats....

[molloyxx1]

What conservatives routinely fail to mention is that Blue States subsidize Red States, i.e. that Blue States contribute more to the federal treasury than they receive and that Red States receive more than they contribute. This, according to a certain cast of mind, qualifies Red States as welfare states, unable to keep their own financial houses in order and so dependant on...Liberals to bail them out.

[DGB228]

its thinking like that why people like Obama, Pelosi, Palin, Reid, Sheila Jackson-Lee, get in power. the concept of an grown adult actually believing that taking money form one state to another is a bad thing, is laughable. i.e Katrina, so we should have just said "swim" right? but again, true to form, base your facts on skewed numbers. Lets say, for arguments sake, that what you said above is correct. Well, the blue state have more Blue voters, unfortunately the money, is still in Red hands.

[molloyxx1]

Could you run that by me again DGB? I read it and reread it, sometimes standing on my head, sometimes using my decoder ring, sometimes enlisyting the aid of an interpreter....but still could not begin to extract a single coherent statement. And I am almost certain you meant, in your heart of hearts, to respond to my [ admittedly disagreeable comments].

[DGB228]

if you think that Bush "cause" this economic downfall, then you just showed your ignorance of the Global Economy. thats another day, but even Rachel Maddow would contend that Clintons de-regulations of the banks was the major factor.

next, I can get good healthcare because I work hard for it. I should have to pay for YOU. (i already do). and now its 47 million? what happen to 30? so which is better then private companies being greedy pigs where you can leave, or the Gov, where you cant?

[molloyxx1]

This kind of logic suggests, really, that Bush didn't exist, that his 8 year long reign of error was nothing more than a terrible dream triggered by too much cheese and Prozac, that there was no 'decider' making decisons or failing to make decisions, that Republican party was not in control of the house and senate for a full decade [ before Jan 21 2007], that there were WMD's, that Katrina was a mild tropical storm, that the Detroit Lions won 8 consecutive superbowls.

[usam1981]

@molloyxx1 Oh, Obama's 1 year reign of error has been much worse than Bush's 8 years, and I shudder to think about how his last 3 years will go, yes I said 3, no more than that if the american people are smarter than you Dems seem to think.

[DGB228]

yes, 22% with 2 wars, and a global economic meltdown. Ghandi would have had a lowerrating too in that situation.

and it wasnt you that was inconsistent, it was President Obama. the number have changed 3 times. (kind of like if you make more than 250K, 200K, 150k during the election) . and i already pay for their care, and i work hard for my great care. we dont want the Government in charge, look at the Post office, the VA, Medicare, Medicaid, Public School.

[totootwo1]

Well, I must admit you've got a point there. There's a lot of RINO's in the party who actually act more like Democrats. That's why they lost control of the House and Senate. Rinos.

[DGB228]

yeah well Bush didnt get below 50% until the 4th year, then Won again. Obama got below 50% in a matter of months.

30 million? really? what happen to 35? then 15? its back to 30? and its Free right?!?!?! lol

i love who the lefts "points" are the Rights facts. lol

Listen, i think we can all agree this healthcare bill is a failure. it started terrible but is not just a aborted spawn from hell. the healthcare CARE in America is the best in the world, but the SYSTEMS in place, definatly are not

[totootwo1]

The DNC motto should be "When all else fails, blame Bush".

[DGB228]

what did American find wrong with the bill? in order to save time (and because we know the left squirms at facts, but loves attacks) what did you LIKE about the bill?

[usam1981]

@DGB228 Nothing

[DGB228]

thank you for illustrating Americas point. its not "free" health care, there is no PO, there is no medicare buy-in, there is only sub par care, and taxes.

also, your statement of "Bush still used Reconciliation for a major bill." the difference was his bill was CUTS Obamas is SPENDING. even you can see that right?

i hate to be the bearer of bad news, but Obama had the worst first year approval of any president.

[molloyxx1]

Obamas first year approval ratings were almost identical to Reagans [ who saw his party lose seats in the fall of 82]. W's, thanks to 9/11, were close to 90 percent they closed at 22 percent Health care premiums have doubled in the past 10 years and will do so again in the coming decade if nothing is done. The Republicans have a proven track record of doing nothing on this matter and are clearly intent on preserving that record, meaning health cae costs will devour still more of the GDP

[molloyxx1]

W's tax cuts for the economic elites [ restoring the upper bracket to where it was before Clinton slightly increased them, something Republicans routinely predicted would destroy the economy.. Not quite] have been estimated at depriving the treasury of 2.9 trillion in revenues. He ran the Iraq war off budget, at a cost of appx 1 trillion and counting.

[DGB228]

the tax bill, was for tax CUTS, not adding a 1 trillion dollar "health care" bill that has nothing anyone wants.

also, that tax bill of 2001 was a 62-38 vote, so, not 51-49 like now.

good try though. keep digging. i sit back and watch the left tear themselves apart. they had the largest majority in, what, 60 years and couldnt do shit. remember seats arent power. Republicans are power.

[totootwo1]

@ franksinatra34: Dude, come on. Have you seriously not read my previous posts? I know reconciliation was used in the past and I'm not condoning its use back then either. The point I'm making is simply that its use to pass health care is STILL unconstitutional EVEN THOUGH reconciliation has been used in the past. RECONCILIATION WAS NOT INTENDED FOR THIS KIND OF BILL. Democrats acknowledge this, but there's rules, and then there's democrats. Wake up man.

[se4bristow]

Thank you for responding to the nitwit! Good Job.

[molloyxx1]

What reconciliation allows for is the expansion of coverage to millions of uninsured Americans as this is certainly a budgetary matter. Insurance reform cannot be included but represents the kind of changes that are more popular w/ the electorate and that the Republicans could take a beating for if they choose to oppose. Reconciliation has certainly has been used [totootwo] to pass 'significant legislation'; welfare reform, SCHIP and COBRA to name a few.

[Gradegov]

The fact that an entire HC bill can't be passed using reconciliation is true. This reconciliation bill will onlly make changes or fix the Senate passed Christmas eve bill so that the Speaker can garner the votes needed to pass that HC bill, after the changes are made via reconciliation.

[totootwo1]

Oh, I see. Thank you for the clarification.

[totootwo1]

So there! Suck it Dumbocrats!!!!

[totootwo1]

Here's a quote from State Controlled New York Times:

reconciliation cannot be used to pass comprehensive health care reform. It wont work. It wont work because it was never designed for that kind of significant legislation. It was designed for deficit reduction The major package of health care reform cannot move through the reconciliation process. It will not work It will not work because of the Byrd rule which says anything that doesnt score for budget purposes has to be eliminated.

[totootwo1]

Correction: the quote is from State Controlled "See BS"

[se4bristow]

Thank you for being SMART.

[totootwo1]

Arguing that "since republicans have used reconciliation in the past so its ok for democrats to use it" is like saying its ok to steal since others have done it a lot in the past. No its not!!!

[totootwo1]

There are rules, and then there are democrats.

[molloyxx1]

And, again, reconcilaition has been used for health care measures in the past; COBRA and SCHIP coverage to name two. It was also used for the Bush tax cuts for the economic elites, a measure which we were told would vastly improve the fortunes of the middle class via the 'trickle down' [ or 'crumbs from the table']. It didnt. The middle class lost ground since its passage and the projections re lost revenue are at 2.9 trillion.

[totootwo1]

You're arguing an irrelevant fact. Yes, reconciliation has been used in the past. So What! Democrats are STILL wrong to use it! It's unconstitutional to us reconciliation to pass this bill. The simple fact of the matter is the bill is very unpopular but the Dems still want it because they're power hungry freaks.

[totootwo1]

@molloyxx1: You'll have to better than the old "But Republicans used reconciliation too!" line. Its irrelevant.

[p51joe]

There are two fools in this world. One is the millionaire who thinks that by hoarding money he can somehow accumulate real power, and the other is the penniless reformer who thinks that if only he can take the money from one class and give it to another, all the world's ills will be cured.

[roseparade1]

Anyone who thinks there is no relation between money and power has spent little time outside their cave. Osama Bin Laden would have been a cipher had he not used the fortune he inherited to fund his nefarious interests. [Of course those who hoard but never employ their resources do not apply, but in the context of this discussion they are irrelevant.Money and power are joined at the hip and always have been].

[1colonia]

Anybody, I mean anybody's running for re-election vote 'em out, that's the only way we get back to normal. They are all crooks, liars and cheats, I am sick about this %^&^% congress and Obama Care. This sligh Harry Reed and the witch riding the broom "Pe-losi, man get them out, we sure don't need them.

[p51joe]

AMEN! Vote em all out and term limit them! Kennedy in there for 50 years? That's insane. Washington and the media are the problem. We need statesmen, not politicians!

[JanisL]

Every Republican in the House and the Senate should be voted OUT of office this fall. They are traitors who have worked against the health and safety of every one of their constituents in their trashing of the healthcare reform effort! We need a new minority party to replace the GOP, they are drowning in corruption! These shysters are a danger to every American citizen. Retire them!

[cowboybob2009]

I agree, but so should the demomorons. None of them care about the people they are supposed to represent. But I would like someone to explain how the Republicans have so much power if the the Dems are in complete control of the Government...just sayin

[totootwo1]

@cowboybob2009 You have a good point. Republicans can't stop a thing. Its the dems afraid of losing their seat slowing this thing down.

[molloyxx1]

There is some truth to this. Blue Dog democrats are worried about losing their seats [ and there are a fair number of them as the Democratic Party is much friendlier to moderates than the GOP is] and so have been gutless by my estimation. But the Dems no longer have 60 in the senate via the election in Mass of the underwear model. The time for reconcilation, which the GOP has used 16 times since 1980 [ Dems 6], is long overdue.

[p51joe]

It is better for one to remain silent JanisL and have people wonder if you are a fool, than open it up and prove to all that you are.

Turn off the TV you foolhardy democrats and read th federalist papers, constitution and articles of confederation before you cast a another vote for another corrupt democrat. How can you tell a democrat is lying? His lips are moving, Watch Generation ZERO, Wake yourselves up!

[molloyxx1]

According to a Gallup Poll undertaken in August 2009, in coutries that do not offer, or mandate, national health care, 66 percent are satisfied w/ the quality of their health care. In countries that do offer or mandate national health care the satisfaction rate is 79 percent.

[cowboybob2009]

I looked up the poll you cited. There is more to it than you mention. Most interestingly, the countries that tend to be more satisfied as you state, have small populations as compared to US. Finland is the most satisfied with national HC. It has a population less than New York city. Seems a lot easier to have UHC where population is small, very little diversity and nil illegal immigration.

[roseparade1]

Hi cowboy bob. Have to say that this seems to verge on nitpicking. Not that your observation that the countries most satisfied w/ national health care are smaller in population, but that this discredits the premise of my post. Illegal immigration has no bearing on the US bill currently proposed as there is nothing in the bill that authorizes that 'illegals' be included in the expansion of care.

[molloyxx1]

error. Accidentally posted under a name used by my girlfriend, who forgot to sign out.

[totootwo1]

I know health care is really expensive but the only way the government can control costs is to ration care. This reform the democrats are preposing will bankrupt the United States. Look at Medicaid and Medicare. Those government run programs are going broke and the quality sucks.

[totootwo1]

google breitbart tv obama and dems in 05 NUCLEAR OPTION IS ARROGANT POWER GRAB AGAINST THE FOUNDERS INTENT

They said it friends. I'm not making this up.

[molloyxx1]

Republicans have been consistently using reconciliation since the 80's.[ 16 times to Dems 6] Reconciliation was used to pass W.s tax cuts for the elites and has been routinely used re health care issues; 1986 COBRA legislation and 1997 SCHIP [ health care funding for children]. And this from Rep presidential hopeful Eric Cantor-'Reconciliation is a measure we hope to use every year.' Once again, the Reps are exposed by the facts and depend on the ignorance of their constituents.

[hillcrest59]

@totootwo1 Thank you!!!! I [osted to my Facebook!!

[iamhassword]

wtf???

I can understand cutting off Oscar speeches but this is healthcare!!!

...dammit

[SamCatLu]

They are scamming us and need to be voted out ASAP.

[yolla48]

I will comment on Ms SindyK I understand your point and that is where there heading us or is that herding us? Right in to another Russia, if your not with the government as far as a part of them, then your not going to have a damn thing that isn't controlled period, They will do it all and guess who is the loser?? Let me tell you that it Wont be the Government~~

[MsSindyK]

@LicentiousSlut

Congress should just madate what is healthy food?!?!?!?!?!

You CANNOT be serious...

[MsSindyK]

what about mandating bed times?how much TV and online time?how we discipline our children?what clothes we wear?what music we listen to? Congress should just decide how we slugs should live our lives! No, you can't control people with taxes, but you can control them through mandates, right? How about controlling the flow of information? Only give people what they "need" to hear/know? Slugs aren't smart enough to know what's good for them. Is that the point you were trying to make?

[molloyxx1]

Why should taxpayers shoulder the financial burden created by the junk food industry. Rates of diabetes and obesity are soaring in America and are extremely expensive to treat throughout the course of the lifetime of the afflicted. It is little different than taxing cigarettes, obviously promotes better health and reduces health care costs, which doubled under the Bush Reign of Error.

[totootwo1]

@molloyxx1 Ok, so Republicans have used reconciliation in the past. I know. That's still doesn't justify democrats using reconciliation to pass health care reform. The problem with government run care is quality goes out the window and the government can regulate personal behavior.

[molloyxx1]

Republicans are behaving as if the Democrats were attempting to circumvent the Constitution, braying loud and long about a 'power grab'. My point is entirely about hypocrisy. Moreover, they are routinely howling about Medicare cuts, even though most would like to dismantle the system. As for the costs you refer to, the Dem position is aimed at reducing the skyrocketing costs, which the public option would certainly accomplish.

[totootwo1]

@molloyxx1 Sure but it would be accomplished by rationing care. Do you not think its odd that these law makers do not want the same care proposed for all of us? They're not giving up their plans.

[molloyxx1]

Rationing care is already practised by for profit insurance companies. For the most obvious of reasons; it increases the bottom line. Refusing coverage to those w/ pre-existing conditions, the most obvious example. Restrictive formularies for prescption drugs another. Premiums rise as quality of coverage decreases. For profit health care costs doubled in the past decade. In short, for profit insurers are not equipped to manage this crisis.

[totootwo1]

@molloyxx1 Profit insurers may not be equipped to manage this crisis but neither is the government. For example; Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security are all cash vampires that are not sustainable and really stink compared to private insurers. If dems get their precious reform, healthcare costs may come down (rationing) but they're going to tax they crap out of us and future generations. Something needs to be done to bring down costs, but government is not the solution.

[NHTPC]

MInd your business! In a free country people can be fat if they want!!!!!!! Some people are fat who do not eat less, they just are fat and can't help.

[ChrissyFlaMom]

We must not go back to sleep, and we should not forget to watch the other hand.

[ccfinfo]

I will make it my business to fight hard against EVERY single person in my state that votes for this bill. I am already gathering friends to help me.

[bwhite890]

They Need to Rush because all these Dems are going to be leaving the House and Senate in 2010..........................­......I hope, and pray..

[tencz57]

well we conservatives got a problem . With all the RINO'S in the GOP . McCain ,Graham and others scare me to death . Some how "We the People" must stop this Barry-Piglosi Takeover from happening .

 Signed: Old Nam Vet 67/69

[missyinal]

Take a look at this situation again today, sir. At least we've gained a timeout, thanks to Massachusetts wisdom.

[tencz57]

lets hope 4 the best . i have little faith in my country now . it's truly up to the people .

signed: Old Nam Vet 67/69

[WilliamHCarney]

The only reason Brown won was due to Coakley's over confidence. Millions of us are not worried because, Obama will make this happen. The only reason the Party of No (Republicans) do not want this is due to millions in campaign contributions they will loose from the health care insurance industry. I've spoke with many people from Canada who loves their health care. I've had friends move to Europe years ago due to better health care while the U.S. ranks 49th in health care. That's a damn shame.

[taylort123]

Whats a damn shame is that you are 38 and have no idea what you are talking about.

If you really think she lost cause of over confidence, you didn't follow the race, and if you did catch any part of it, it was while you fell asleep while the evening news was on.

Canada, the UK, and Germany have all started to privatize their healthcare because its not monetarily efficient and is bankrupting them. My aunt works at the Cleveland Clinic in Florida, its largest Hospital. 75% Canada patients. Hah.

[sf3038]

Obama and his Administration are a bunch of thugs. Obama Czars with the exception of a couple are not vetted, and they are Communists and out to ruin America and want a Global government. Vote out anyone who is not a constitutionalist.. These idiots are not reading bills and NO bill should have Any pork in it. vote on one issue at a time only.

[ettucat]

Please, all you younger people who do not seem to know that CONGRESS is the Legislative branch of government, and it is made up of a House of Representatives and a Senate. The Senate is not separate from the Congress.

[playfyte]

When I think about what has gone on in the senate over the last six months, I ask myself; why do we even need a senate? It seems to complicte issues beyond necessity. This health care issue is a no brainer. If a company makes a donation to a person's campaign because they believe the person is a good representative, fine. But if they give a donation with the expectation that they "WILL" be given special consideration above the needs of the people then that is a bribe. Like Joe Liberman. Traitor

[ecodock]

This is nothing new! Its just that people have wanted to believe that no American could be so lazy and corrupt  in the U.S. senate, congress, and presidency.

God help us

[KatMcKat]

Don't vote for ANY of these people:

Congressional Progressive Caucus:

cpc (dot) grijalva (dot) house (dot) gov

... unless u b a socialist.

[KatMcKat]

my first comment disappeared...

[KatMcKat]

OH, AND IMPEACH BARRY!

[ncladyKarol]

I know my Congressmen and Senators from SC will read the bill. They also will let us know what it says. Lord, I wish they all would.

[DKnMcBee]

I can't stand hearing these politicians whining like children. They will not read the bill. They may have to put some effort into it. All I can say if you won't read the bill and the amendments then VOTE NO!!!

[ncladyKarol]

This is just sad. You can tell they don't want to work. If they have to work more than 4 days sometimes 3 days they can not handle it. They can not make it simple and vote on simple things, they have to have hundreds of admendments. How dumb can they get?

[rich0x]

This is a very misleading video. The debate has been going on for years. For decades, the Republicans have looked out for insurance companies and health care providers at the expense of most Americans. When they were in power, they showed no real interest in reform. In particular, GOP Senators posture, look very grave, strut, obstruct, and whine. The time for debate is over! ~ richard allbritton, Miami

[rickanderson52]

I forwarded this to Glenn Beck Show and Fox New

[msldcs]

Our Constitution is simply being destroyed by these goons. Doesn't seem to matter who we vote for because Washington corrupts them. Politicians buy into the special groups in DC, their plates become too full and this confusion is a result.

[LeboD]

This is so ridiculous I find it difficult to even comment. What happened to our once great country?

[ncladyKarol]

Shame, shame, they are too busy or lazy to give reasonable time to discussing a bill. All bills should be discussed and voted on. However I do not believe that the bills should be plastered with ear marks that have nothing to do with health care. Each ear mark should be a seperate bill and we the people should know who introducted the earmarks and what they are. It is about time that our leaders work. I am just sorry they don't have a 5 day work week. They could not handle it.

[pafaery]

Congress does not have time to read all these bills. They already work 2 1/2 days a week. Pelosi said they would be the hardest working congress ever and do 5 days, but Obama also said that we would have change. He was right and she was wrong.

[tillerylakelady]

Most of these people are worthless.We at least need people in Congress that will read the Bill,and act like it's not a Burden to do so. Vote the ones out of office that don't do their job!!

[dankeschone]

It's not really our money if they just print Trillions out of thin air. It's play money. Which means something else- buy silver and gold.

[ettucat]

Oh but it REALLY IS our money. Someone has to pay back the debt, and who do you think that will be?

[me2u2be]

How ridiculous. We need fresh blood in Washington. Read bills, discuss them, this is OUR MONEY!

[894341238]

We must abolish Political apathy to win in 2010.

[ebaytoad]

WTF.....THIS WON'T AFFECT THEM, so they do not care about US!!!!!!

[watchman315]

One bill at a time.

Read the bill.

Debate the bill.

Vote on the bill.

Why can't it be that simple?

We deserve what we get... we have become apathetic and complacent and are content to "let them deal with it". Insanity is sometimes defined as doing the same thing repeatedly, expecting different results, yet we send the same people back to DC, year after year.

[ettucat]

Yes, that is the problem. We generally get only the wealthy and the connected to vote for. Stop voting for the "name" you recognize, the Harvard grad, the person who has been in politics for years, the person who lives in the mansion on the hill. Vote for the least political people you can find on a ballot. Do your own research as to their background and accomplishments. Voters need to do THEIR JOB, and then maybe we will truly get some change in local and DC practices.

[TheTuberdon]

Good ol' Kent Conrad doesn't want to be there "clear through tomorrow". What does he think the people of his state sent him to D.C. for?