Mercury Vapor Confirmed

[vinczeee]

is that german yoda speaking?

[6Seraph6]

@vinczeee lol

[mkeeling5]

Gamma 2 phase amalgams is what I was looking at and it was the break down of the other 50% that I confused as a complete breakdown of the filling, I stand corrected!

[mkeeling5]

Let me revise my argument. At this point I'm not going to argue that mercury can't rise in certain conditions there are to many variables to argue that. But Im going to stick with the fact that for "smoking teeth" there needs to be proper controlled follow up experiements to change my mind on that particular video.

[vaporfire]

I agree, I think they could do a better job to show the experiment in a way that eliminates the elements of doubt.

[mkeeling5]

Alright I watched the video and my only argument about the is with concentrations. Amalgam fillings only have 5% Hg in the they are have I think 30-50% silver and serveral other elements in there composures. Also each experiment could very well be conducted differently I remember reading something sometime about a box that could be used with hazardous materials such as Hg.

[vaporfire]

Check out Wikipedia. According to them amalgam is 50% mercury, and 50% alloy that is a mixture of various metals.

[mkeeling5]

There's a very good reason I haven't gotten to that yet. I've been using my iPhone for all of this today and I've been working so I haven't quite had time to follow it up. I knew you were going to ask sooner or later! In about and hour or so I'll have some free time when I get home and I promise I will give it a view and give you my thoughts on it.

[vaporfire]

Ok, no sweat. Will check in AM for your thoughts.

[mkeeling5]

Even if it was just set out to prove Hg as a vapor then the out side influence of the air blow on it, from what I can assume is a dropper, only contaminates the experiment. My assertion is that the Hg should sink in O and that in the original it's the H2O that's the vapor rising of the tooth. The experiment conducted in this video doesn't not prove or disprove any thing. Certainly it doesn't validate the original video aside from the fact you can induce a vapor from mercury.

[vaporfire]

The blasts of air stimulate the liquid mercury metal, to give off vapor more quickly for this experiment, to help it be seen. It does not contaminate the spectroscopy because H20 doesn't resonate at 254nm UV--as mercury does! Of course the mercury vapor will go up when blasted with air in a closed container, that is the only direction it can go, and given that kind of force, it should not be expected to slow or sink immediately. You may be right that it will sink if totally unprovoked.

[vaporfire]

Just to clarify, air of course contains not only water vapor but also nitrogen, oxygen, argon, carbon dioxide. But these also will not absorb 254nm wavelength light light as mercury atoms will. That is why you can't see the air being blown down into the container, only the mercury vapor blasting up.

[mkeeling5]

Also the original doesn't even have a proper control so that should tell you something right there. secondly if you have a spare moment search "quack files and smoking teeth" it might open your mind on the subject.

[vaporfire]

I agree that a control would be a good thing. Perhaps it will be done. But not having it doesn't invalidate it. It does beg the question of why governments and dental associations haven't put money and time into thorough research on this topic? It would be a great to see the ADA or NIH fund an independent study on mercury vapor from amalgam that could produce high quality video and do all the proper controls. Do you think they would?

I'll check out the quack files, all views are welcome.

[mkeeling5]

I will leave you with two things to concider. First the experiment in your video is a poor reproduction of that in the smoking teeth video. The original video that you say this video is suposed to reproduce has a recently pulled tooth with and amalgam filling. If these "phd's" in this video were actually conducting a proper reproduction then it should be an exact duplicate, otherwise it's bunk and bad science

[vaporfire]

As I previously stated, the researchers set out only to confirm the scientific principles of the "smoking teeth" video, not to duplicate it. They wanted to examine the properties of Mercury as a vapor and confirm the spectroscopy, to see if that was accurate or not. That is why no amalgam was used. Also it was a small side project, not a serious endeavor which is why it is not Hollywood quality.

[mkeeling5]

I default to my previous comments. If you can't properly respond to anything I'm asking don't bother copying and pasting redundant assertions. It's a waste of your time and mine.

[vaporfire]

I have done a great job at answering your questions. But you have still not answered my questions:

1. Have you seen the mercury vapor videos on the State of Michigan web site from Bowling Green State University that show essentially the same result?

2. Do you also think they are faked?

[mkeeling5]

If you would like to actually to respond to anything I've posted that would be nice instead of accusing me of being a shill for big pharma. Maybe you should turn your conspiratorial eye onto the people you think are the good guys. If you can't answer anything that I've posed thus far atleast answer this, of all these phd's that have conducted this experiment how many of them have ties to imaot?

[vaporfire]

Well I must point out that you were the one to start accusations: "bizzare ideological conflict" and "magic trick[s]" (which I think was unfair) But lets put that behind us. To your questions:  The researchers involved are pure research scientists totally unconnected to dentistry or the IAOMT. I'm sure they'd never heard of it before seeing the video, which they *initially* thought was faked. They just investigated it as a matter of scientific curiosity, as good scientists do. (more coming)

[mkeeling5]

It's also my understanding that there's more to the experiment that they are preforming to actually analyze the data from the test that they are preforming? If it's there why don't they show the results of the test. Also in my previous comment I addressed the air. If your going to repond please read more carefully

[vaporfire]

This video & experiment was made to establish the credibility of the science in the "smoking teeth" video. The researchers involved--like you--all assumed it must have been faked and set out to prove it. So, a quick experiment was devised to answer the question: is mercury so volatile it can escape as a vapor AND be detected with standard spectroscopy? The answer--to their surprise--was: yes. And other researchers have duplicated it too. (Google: "State of Michigan Mercury Vapor")

[mkeeling5]

I do understand atomic absorption spectroscopy and also understand that there's a difference between preforming that kind of a test and preforming magic trick that's shown in the video. Also just because a person has a phd doesn't mean they don't have some bizarre ideological conflict that would influence them. .

[vaporfire]

Well if you accept the principles of spectroscopy, then why are you so reluctant to accept this clear demonstration of very straightforward physics, especially in light of the fact that it has been duplicated by several other groups including a University? It seems more likely that there are economic & political reasons for dismissing it, due to the potential implication(s) it may have to the liability of the dental industry, trade associations and government health regulators.

[mkeeling5]

Anyone can claim that they're anyone and anything on the internet. So you claiming that he is what he is means nothing. Also the term "skeptical" is used to liberally to include those cranks who swear there was no holocaust or that the moon landing never happened so I'm not impressed by any of that. The simple fact of the matter is mercury vapor does not float it sinks. If you watch the video even in between burst of air it's still rising. So it's fake and it's water.

[vaporfire]

Multiple Ph.D. level researchers collaborated make this video (for fun), and there was *no* water involved. Perhaps you don't understand how atomic absorption spectroscopy works? Did you watch the videos on the State of Michigan web site? They show exactly the same thing. Do you think they are fake too? If you are so sure, then duplicate the experiment--with correct technique--and prove us wrong.

[vaporfire]

Also, I should mention the reason the vapor rises is because it is being pushed by the force of air blown down on it. This should be obvious from watching the video.

[mkeeling5]

You kids obviously failed high school chemistry.

[vaporfire]

This experiment was performed by a skeptical senior physicist who set out to falsify it, yet conceded in the end it was true. More research revealed this experiment was

first performed by German scientists and published decades ago (references to

follow). The State of Michigan web site has also posted videos from Bowling

Green University confirming the method: (Google "state of Michigan mercury vapor"). If anyone has failed, it is our health regulators.

[amalgamvergiftung]

Does it work with phosporescent screens as well, or do I have to use a fluorescent screen anyway? Regards

[vaporfire]

A fluorescent surface is necessary, one that responds to UV and gives off visible light.

A science or optical supply store may carry them. I believe that fluorescent paper may even work.

[davidkennedydds]

Thank you professor and Martin for confirming that you can see mercury vapor at 254 nm light. Many alternative explanations were offered as to what can be visualized under these lighting conditions but as you now know none of them were true. The correct wavelength to see mercury is 254. Thanks for going to the trouble to firmly establish these fundamental facts.

[vaporfire]

Dr. Kennedy, we were glad to validate your technique and give firm scientific credibility to your amalgam videos.

Also, we are thankful to you for your efforts to warn the public about the danger of mercury vaporizing off amalgam. The end of the amalgam era is near.