@TheDetoX If all people could think rationally, everyone would want to be led into a life full of meaning instead of some deluded form of purposeful life atheism offer.
Here's what would convince me that god exists....god appearing and saying "hey, it's me god. watch me lift this mountain." Anything else is just circumstantial evidence that doesn't pass the test.
@Saebeck32 Here's what would convince me that you exist... you appearing and putting in my pocket one trillion dollars. Anything else is just circumstantial evidence that doesn't pass the test.
@Saebeck32 What if you (or me) are suffering from a delusion? Do you really think literally seeing something exist is a good criteria that it exists? Rational people know we've been passed this type of shallow thinking.
@TarriCJx19 Which is exactly why the flying spaghetti monster has yet to make an appearance - so that his lack of appearance can be taken as proof of his existence and noodly appendages.
@WoobaOne spaghetti is a materal object, God isn't. If you were to claim everything I state is the spaghetti monster you're just saying God, regardless of what you call Him.
@Saebeck32 i know you probly dont want a response lol, but my grandfather died before i was born, i never saw him or read anything he wrote, so i would say to you what i think any christian can exclusively say, What about Jesus Christ? hes not visible in our life too but we know what he said and did, and i couldnt find a single lie he said, people died for thier testimony to him and the twelve disciples spread a message that the whole world now knows, just as Jesus said they would.
Ive talked to and watched a hell of a lot of atheists, and none of them have ever been of the opinion that no amount of evidence would convince them. All of them that I've seen asked this question can give clear examples of evidence they would accept, including myself. He gave no examples of an atheist who held this supposed view, and no examples of evidence they would deny as valid. Mr. Craig would do a good job as a FOX news reporter.
Heres the thing, Jesus christ performed miracles in front of people, and there were those who would still not believe he was God's son. heres the thing, when there were people who saw jesus christ raise someone from the dead infront of their eyes and shrugged it off as "unconvincing" ad hominem, what makes you think telling someone about this 2000 years later they will be convinced. So to any christian moron who has a video entitled "qeustions for atheists", take it down, its pointless.
I used to think love and forgiveness were the only two commandments, but they aren't. Faith that Jesus is the only way because no one else ever gave their life for you, and also stay true to all the commandments as these are life saving, all have earthy consequences. We were told to confess ALL your sins - you'll be forgiven. Also we were told then TO TURN AWAY from sin, so not just confess it but also turn away from it.
The afterlife with Jesus has LAWS like a family home to keep it safe.
A totally closed off mind to something is a "reprobate mind"& I do beleive that there are atheist who don't want God to excist&even if a stick were to turn into a snake&they saw it, they will not beleive what they just saw.
@baldurus1 Maybe you should get your statistics right, smart guy. How many more people do we have claiming to be Christian than atheist, genius? If 99% of a population has black hair and only 1% has blonde hair, who do you think is going to commit more crimes?
It actually favors the larger group, because more people of the larger group would have to commit a crime to get to the same PERCENTAGE as the small group.
1% of 1000 is 0,1, 1% of 100 is 1, get the idea.
And when you compare the numbers to society 80% theist vs. 20% Atheist, the numbers aren't even close when you look at the prison statistics 99,8 vs 0,2.
@baldurus1 OH, I GET IT! GOSH, YOU'RE SO SMART! Even though I gave percentages too (and, well, you totally dodged that but we'll forgive that because I'm sure you're known for taking on arguments head-on anyway), well, I guess that doesn't matter. But I think you have a point. Say, we have a group of 100 people and 99 of them claim to be Christians and only 1 is an atheist, I'm sure your percentages are oh-so-relevant still to the facts. Nothing gets passed you, man.
The reason for not being open to the existence of a god is that all that we can see and will ever see can be considered natural phenomena. This is what scientists test. If there are things that scientists can't explain, then (atheistic) scientists are to take it as a challenge instead of conceding that something supernatural caused this.
Another problem is actually having proof that a god exists. "Proof of a god" might be an incoherent phrase.
What a lot of pretense in the title of this video. There is no truth, there are only opinions about the existence of God. That is why all the "proof about God discussion" are pointless. Just respect each other, and don't force anyone to live to your rules.
Archaeosix was in the front row hoping to God (he was in a sort of a "foxhole" after all) that Craig wasn't talking about him...
...Nah!! He was probably too busy chewing bubble gum and watching Rick Astley videos on his I-Mac totally clueless that he was the topic of conversation.
There's plenty of evidence that could be produced for god that would convince me:
God appearing and removing all pollution from the atmosphere.
God appearing and destroying all millitery equipment and making us live in peace.
God’s hand catching the planes just before they hit on 911.
Etc etc etc
Atheists require REAL evidence, and no theist has ever produced it. What theists consider to be evidence is actually nothing of the sort to any critical thinker.
@WildcardHatesYou If you give me 100 billion dollars I'll be convinced that atheism is true. I'm just following your thinking because I want to be as, uh, "critically minded" as you.
@WildcardHatesYou wondering what the heck the 14th of September was going to be. It turned out to be to the day when we got all of our debts paid off. It was around 6-8 months sooner than we ever thought possible. I know, "they are both coincidences". But you did ask... Sort of. Of course none of this is testable and repeatable. But one thing's for sure, I would die for my faith in Jesus. So I'm certainly convinced. We don't hold any of the cards. A little humility is called for.
@camthejock "What about God creating a universe so fined tuned for human existance?" but you need to show evidence that the universe IS fine tuned for human existance. The majority of the universe is not compatable for human existence, and the majority of evidence shows an evolutionary explanation for our own individual existence as a species.
The most contemporary evidence that exists shows that our species adapted to the earth, not the earth was adapted to us.
@WildcardHatesYou & WLC is not referring to you at the beginning. He said "I have met MANY atheists...." (meaning he's not making an umbrella statement). There are those atheists that would STILL deny existence of God even IF the things you listed all DID come to fruition through God's efforts (thats the point WLC is making). You actually fall within (& the people that gave you the thumbs up likely) the group that he says at 0:27 "a certain openess to God..." then=belief. WLC is clear on that.
@WildcardHatesYou Whenever you reject a worldview, you adopt another. If your an atheist its not as if anything is 'Wrong' with pollution, or planes hitting a building. I find that very 'Good' evidence that man is evil, and man is the problem, not the solution. Please explain why those events were wrong under atheism.
@WildcardHatesYou So, basically, you want God to be your sugar daddy and do everything that you think is fitting merely to convince you. He has revealed Himself through creation which is something we observe everyday (Romans 1). If that REAL evidence does not convince you, nothing will.
Assuming that someone can find actual evidence (not the bible, not attacks on evolution and big bang theory, not personal experience, not arguments from logic, but actual evidence) to support gods existence I'm sure there will be more than a few atheists who will refuse to accept it, and if someone can find evidence that god does not exist I'm just a proportional amount of theists will refuse to accept it.
@whatever144ify Uh, yeah, you can put God in a test tube to test to see if He exists. Get over it, science doesn't answer everything: watch?v=vxJQe_FefxY
@Christlovesanimals You're an arrogant jerk who's only interested in arguing, not understanding. The "shame" is that you would rather act this way than to try to come to an understanding. You're no better than the "average YT atheist".
Please!! One more "fail!" and please give me a "troll!!"...c'mon silly atheist !! you can do it!!
Ooops!...I just insulted all the genuine atheists out there who actually THINK about their positions by implying that you could hold their jock-straps silly bigot.
The opening song from "All in the Family?"....c'mon dude!! throw me a bone here!!
@Archaeosix daffy!....THANK YOU silly atheist! That's a new , unique ad hominem!!....I did NOT know you YT atheists were capable of unique thoughts!!....
Hey everybody!!! This silly atheist is so impressed by me he made up a unique ad hominem from me instead of usual parroting of atheistic pablum!....
@Archaeosix What Dr. Craig was talking about in that video was that a belief in God as properly basic. Many amateurs and novice thinkers do not understand this concept, even though it's among the learned philosopher.
@drcraigvideos But it's not. If it were, then trhere would be no atheists. Besides, what about the 'learned' philosophers that would disagree with that notion...like...Sam Harris, for example?
@Archaeosix Did Dr. Craig imply that there were not any closed minded Christians? I've heard Dr. Craig make the point that an innate contradiction about God would be good grounds for disbelief, if you know where he says that "no amount of evidence would convince him" could you please point out the video? Are you using this "point" as evidence that Dr. Craig's arguments are incorrect? If so wouldn't your arguments be incorrect too using the same standard? Thanks for any of your time.
@Archaeosix No that isn't correct, what Dr Craig mentioned was a belief that is 'properly basic' in which there is an innate, personal experience, which overrides any amount of external evidence.
@DigitalDecadence My understanding of the concept of a properly basic belief comes from "What is a Properly Basic Belief? (Alvin Plantinga)" watch?v=f7377jU2a8Y
I have found that Craig is absolute right. When pressed for what would convince atheists that God exists, the vast majority will never accept God existence no matter what the evidence
@drcraigvideos I totally agree. I think that even if Jesus himself appeared in the clouds for all to see and told us that he was Jesus returned to earth, the vast majority of atheist would write him off as a space alien, evolved from another part of the universe out to trick us.
The universe screams a designer, as most humans today and throughout history concede but atheist's eyes are closed tight
@drcraigvideos Where do you guys get this stuff from. Why wouldn't evidence of the supernatural convince people who don't believe in the supernatural, of the supernatural? There currently is not any evidence. Please provide some evidence. All I get is either "There is lots of evidence" or "Look around you" or "You have to find the evidence yourself" or a combination and we're asking for it. Point us to some evidence. Thank you.
@Nolgthorn *SIGH* There's the cosmological argument (view_play_list?p=7DF074B2FA080791) and the teleological argument (view_play_list?p=5F0775BFB8300080). Dr. Craig even gave evidence to Dennett (watch?v=_Wzol00G2MM) while Dennett dodged ALL of it duriing his rebuttal. Just because you're not convinced of the evidence doesn't mean we don't have evidence.
@agnostaxian many atheists have so much faith that their positions would make hillbilly snake-handling Christians envious.
hey! that's an idea! Christian hillbilly: "I'm going to show how much faith I have in God by having faith in his non-existence like these 'new atheists!' F*** those snakes! In fact, I'm going to bite those snakes heads off, not handle them!"
"Hold on....let me get a swig of "Hitchens 100% proof" here!
@agnostaxian I could believe he's real, but I could never believe he's a nice person. If he's real and wants me to believe he's real, he needs to do what everyone else needs to do and talk to me or write me a clear, english message using the world he apparently would have unlimited power over. I've actually never met any atheists who say they would still not believe after what I just said happened, but if you've met them then I guess they really exist.
@KevinLounsberry And I would like them to stay that way so that I can record it and bring other people to see it to verify it really happened and I have not simply gone insane.
@agnostaxian I wouldn't know, but if scientists saw the contortion on film. I'm sure they would be overjoyed to investigate and perhaps tell me what happened, after which I could make my final decision on whether or not. I also find it unlikely someone would make an invention with that sort of power only to use it on my street and on me when specifically I walk outside.
@KevinLounsberry So after seeing a tree twist and contort saying "I am God..." you would still need more evidence correct? Let' say scientists studied it and had no explanation for it, would you then say "My trees contortions proves that God exists"?
@agnostaxian Sort of. I'd just go get a video camera, pray politely for god to do it again since god listens to prayers and fulfills them and can do anything at all, then I'd record it for scientists to see, then theyd come down and investigate and if they say YEP, I don't know anything that could have done this. then I guess I'd be a christian and not break god's rules out of fear he would smite me and just like the bible says, I'd stone to death any child who doesn't listen to their parents.
@KevinLounsberry OK the last statement hits the core of why you dont accept God, you dont want God to exists and have an emotional hatred for Him, your tongue in cheek comment demonstrates your true grind with Christianity but anyway let's proceed.
So that would make you a Christian? Sort of?? Why the qualification?
Also, how would you know that the being that did the tree contorting action wasn't a space alien kid with a tree contorting toy trying to trick you?
@agnostaxian For some reason possibly this is hard for you to believe, but there are plenty of people I hate who I know all too well are real. My opinion of something were it to exist has no baring on whether or not I think it exists. there are plenty of other characters in books who I do like and I don't think they're real either. I have no reason to believe they or god are real. If god is real and wants me to believe he's real, I told you what he has to do.
@agnostaxian "how would you know that the being that did the tree contorting action wasn't a space alien kid with a tree contorting toy trying to trick you?" Well I guess I wouldn't know, then I'd just be committing unholy acts of murder via thrown mineral formations instead of holy ones. If something is powerful enough to read this comment I'm typing right now on youtube, find me, use a tree manipulation device just for me then I'd be stupid not to follow its will for fear of retribution.
@KevinLounsberry Your comment shows that nothing will convince you that God exists. If God did do your request, you would want more and then more ad infinitum. If you accept God existence then God has given so much evidence for his existence that 95% of the world accepts a divine reality, it is just your eyes are closed shut tight, even if Jesus appeared to you and slapped you in the face or zapped your ass with a lightening bolt, you still would not believe. You can't until u change your heart
@agnostaxian What are you, a troll? I just told you that after the scientists said they have no idea how it could have happened I would follow the christian laws because I wouldn't want god to punish me. You think I would follow the laws of an invisible bully I still thought wasn't real?
@KevinLounsberry You said you would not be sure if it was god or a alien child with a tree contorter. You also strawman & mock. Anyone who has read "Christianity for dipshits" knows why God commands us to do things.
Now if your atheist buddies said that the tree contortion doesn't prove that god exists but were sure there would be a naturalistic explanation would you say "You are wrong this proves that God exists" or would you say "you may be right I need more evidence"?
@agnostaxian No one can ever be 100% sure of anything except some times that based on all the evidence one currently has available to them, what they've derived from it makes the most sense, this counts also for evolution and big bang theory. If the "atheist buddies" to which you refer are well educated, well reputed scientists, then I would need to hear the reasons for their conclusion. Whether I would need more evidence would depend on that and what I think about it.
@KevinLounsberry I see, well maybe it is good that God doesn't contort your trees because in the Christian view God doesn't want you to bow to him and think of him as an asshole and bully trying to force you to believe & obey him but he wants to have a personal love relationship with you that you willfully enter into.
@agnostaxian He sends people to be burned eternity if they don't do what he tells them to, and wants disobedient children stoned to death, pagans stoned to death, I know there are more of those but I forgot them for the time being. They were in the old testament and nothing in the new testament ever said you don't have to do that any more. How can you tell me that isn't being a bully? What exactly do you think a bully is? And I can't have a relationship with people who don't talk to me.
@KevinLounsberry the OT is a revelation to a people in a tribal situation and is incomplete (John 1:17). The New Test. does say that we are not to stone people (Read John 8:1-11). The point of the law is that we all fall short and sin. None is righteous. All should die and we all need grace.
Read the story of Jesus and his paradigm, he is not a bully but extends love to all. God wants none to go to hell but all to be with him but he will not force you to accept him.
@agnostaxian John 8:1-11, Jesus says people without sin may throw stones. So pretty much any christian can as long as they've never blasphemed, and have sought forgiveness for all other sins, blasphemy being the only unforgivable sin. What is being without sin anyways? Does it specify? seems like a pretty huge thing to be so vague about. is it never having sinned in your life? not sinning right now? not sinned since your last confession? not intending to sin in the future? where does it say?
@KevinLounsberry The point of John 8 and the whole NT (Read Romans 3) is that we all have sinned and we all need grace.
Jesus made it clear that in the new era God's kingdom and human government are distinct. Jesus' kingdom is not of this world and spiritual (John 18:36) so we are not to force people to obey God through coercion. After 1500 years of Christian tyranny in europe, the church finally got it right with the separation of Church and state. It must be a free choice
@KevinLounsberry The point is he's the one telling you things that would prove to him god is real, and you seem to keep thinking of reasons those things would not prove god is real. So I can't help but wonder, how does someone who believes god is real so able to come up with reasons you can't prove god's existence. OneEyedJack1970, can you tell me why you yourself believe god is real?
@deekomendez I will do one better, what is after prayer Christians (and only Christians) were able to levitate when they prayed "in Jesus name". They were able to do this for as long as you wanted them to and we called scientists to make sure it was not a trick. Would you then conclude "The Christian God exists"?
@agnostaxian Are you trying to trick me or something? I don't believe anything with absolute certainty but as I said levitating Christians would be pretty strong evidence for me. Do you know any?
@deekomendez I am going somewhere with this, no trick though. I am trying to demonstrate to you that nothing with convince you that God (let alone the Christian God) exists.
So you say that it would be convincing if Christians could levitate correct?? How would you know that the Christians were not tapping into some kind of quantum principle not know yet??
@agnostaxian as I said, I wouldn't be absolutely convinced but that evidence, especially if it could be combined with a demonstration of eg prayer making a difference to people's health, Christian's being able to grow back lost limbs etc. then it would all push me towards the conclusion that the Christian God existed. That is how science works, the accumulation of evidence backing up a given theory. So I disagree, given evidence I WOULD tend to believe that the Christian God existed.
@deekomendez So you wouldn't be absolutely convinced that God exists?? Like as convinced as you are that the world is round and not a trapezoid?? I think you would feel comfortable with saying "the earth is a sphere" correct and not "I am pushed toward the conclusion that the earth is a sphere"? What would it take for you to say "God exists"?
If I could pray and a 3rd arm grew instantly, would you then say "God exists" or would you say "I need more evidence"?
@deekomendez answer the question. Everytime I go down this path with atheists (especially utube atheist) they always through in a dodge like you just did. Answer the question. At what point would you say "God exists" with the same certainity that you would say "The earth is a sphere"? What would it take?
@agnostaxian I think I've answered your question. Establishing the existence of an omnipotent being is pretty big and as you pointed out, other explanations would have to be eliminated before it could be accepted with anything like certainty. The comparison to establishing the world is round isn't fair. That's as simple as taking a photo (albeit from space). So to answer your question. How much would it take to convince me say 90%? A helluva lot. But unfortunately you can't provide ANY
@deekomendez You have not answered the question. You have said you would "tend" to accept that God exists if shown levitating Christians through prayer. So I will ask again, what would it take for you to say that "God exists" in the same way you will say "the earth is a sphere"?
That is fair because I want to know what would prove to you that God exists with certainty so answer the question. Be specific, at what point would you say "God exists"?? Be specific
@agnostaxian It's not as simple as that. The roundness of the world is something that can be established with a very simple test. The existence of God takes a bit more than that. More evidence would make me more convinced up to a point of relative certainty. As I've explained I'm not 100% certain of anything. That doesn't mean I'm not open to evidence. I'd just need a lot of it. Let me turn it round on you. What kind of evidence would convince (or even persuade) you that God didn't exist?
@agnostaxian Who's dodging now? Spontaneous limb regrowth, levitation, prayer driven recovery. Just those three would put me in the say 70% convinced category. So back to you. I'll ask again.. What kind of evidence would convince (or even persuade) you that God didn't exist?
@deekomendez 70% is not certain. What would get you into the 90% range? CERTAINTY is what I have been asking for this whole time.
I will discount your questions because utube atheist always try and side step this question by trying to switch topics....ie- "There is no evidence...", "What would convince you..." "What evidence would it take for you to believe in Santa...". answer the question. What would make you CERTAIN that God exists? Name it
@agnostaxian and as I said in my very first answer I am not 100% certain of ANYTHING. You should read Descartes. Sigh. OK 90%. All of the above plus a personal appearance by Jesus (not just to me!) under scientific conditions demonstrating through supernatural powers his divinity AND providing a good explanation for the perceived inconsistencies in scripture. That would get me to 90%. So I've answered your question. Your turn.
@deekomendez ohh no, no, no, no. Why do you want to change the subject? afraid to go further? You seem so squirmy. Let's focus here. Now you said that you would accept with certainty the Christian God if limbs grew, levitation through prayer and a personal appearance of Jesus under scientific conditions with others present correct??
Now heres another question for you, how would you know that "Jesus" was "Jesus" and was not a space alien trying to trick us? How would you know (90% certain)?
@agnostaxian I've answered your question but you will never be happy with my answer. And it's hardly changing the subject. It's just the same question flipped around. You won't answer it because you have no answer and that is the difference between you and I my friend.
@deekomendez lol, no I have an answer to your question but i won't answer it because you are trying to dodge the real issue by switching topics. I have seen it 100 times by utube atheists. you know deep down nothing will convince you that God exists. I think even if Jesus appeared in the sky for all to see, most atheists would say he was a space alien trying to trick us or some other bs
There is tons of evidence for God's existence right now, your eyes are just closed tight
@agnostaxian Hey! That makes pseudo-atheists "Religionists!!!"
LMAO!!
"Religionist" :a fakeass word made up by fakeass people practicing fakeass Philosophy and Sociology as they seek fakeass proof for their fakeass atheism.
Are ANY christians 'open' to the iea of there being NO god?
Oh, the shifting sands of evidence.....uncertainty, never 'knowing' that one is 100% right....that's life. But to run to 'faith' is a cop out, in my view. The 'indweling holy spirit' is able to utterly convince thousands of people of mutually exclusive faiths and beliefs that THEIRS is the truth. It's good to grow up and learn to cope with uncertainty. Hope you're never convicted of crime by 'faith' rather than (shifting) evidence!
@derek24hudson Your an idiot. It is atheist who are the ones who can't cope with uncertainty. Look at the claim of being a "freethinker". Yeah atheists want freethought right..well... unless you are a Jew, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu, Mormon, Jehovah's, Sihk, psychic, EEEEvil ID propenent, Scientologist, Shinto, Confucian, pantheist, Deist, pussy agnostic or anyone else that has a thought that differs from the utube atheist doofus possey but other than that think free! u r laughable
The only remark that makes any sense from you is 'you're an idiot', and even that is wrong Let me know when you grow up, learn to argue in a civilised, educated and coherent way, and then I would be happy to debate with you. But I'm not holding my breath, judging from your first infantile, ingrammatifical, poorly-spelt and laughable ramblings. Of that, I AM certain.
@derek24hudson You are a loser. You come on a Christian vid post and spout this "I am so enlightened and you all are like Children who can't deal with uncertainty" bs. Get a life. Go to your vid posts and stroke your dick there.
Utube atheists like you are the most arrogant, narrowminded, dogmatic "we know everything and everyone else is stupid" people on the planet. You are absolutely certain about all your hairbrained ideas like no other.
Go to your imaginary girlfriend and leave us alone
Perhaps more atheists would be open to the idea of a god being real if the god being presented weren't so absurd that explanations such as deception, misinterpretation, and delusion are far likelier than the god actually being real.
I think what you're saying is that 'hard atheism' is a 'deterministic' stance, based more on volition than on evidence aye or nay.
How can this be an example of 'free thinking', or rational thought?
A deterministic position is based on a personal agenda, rather than logic and reason, which contradicts the premise of free thot.
Agnosticism would be a more reasoned choice, since neither premise (theism or atheism) is provable. Even Dawkins admits that on an atheistic scale of 1 to 7, he's a 6
Atheism and theism are provable logically, you just need to find contradictions in god or make deductive arguments that imply god necessarily exists.
Agnosticism, in the sense you're posing it, really appears to be a position almost all rational people hold to as is. The only question is do they think god likely does or doesn't exist, and hence how they get the labeled as theist or atheist. If a person cannot determine which is more likely, then they would be a true agnostic though.
@MaximumAxiom - "The only question is do they think god likely does or doesn't exist ... If a person cannot determine which is more likely, then they would be a true agnostic."
What args can we employ? Dawkins uses Occam's Razor logic to disprove God. From the God Delusion, "A creator would have to be at least as complex as its design, and therefore at least as improbable."
Where is the logic here?! The construct of the designer has nothing to do with its end product.
KCA is an example of an argument that would prove god's existence using deductive argumentation if it was sound (which I don't believe it is). I could construct other arguments that would "prove" atheism or theism, though they would be terribly unsound.
If atheists could only think rationally, they would be Christians.
YHWHisSovereign 2 months ago
@YHWHisSovereign If all people could think rationally everyone would stop trying to control eachothers lifes.
TheDetoX 2 months ago
@TheDetoX If all people could think rationally, everyone would want to be led into a life full of meaning instead of some deluded form of purposeful life atheism offer.
jackywong 2 weeks ago
"SOME???"
1GodOnlyOne 2 months ago
Here's what would convince me that god exists....god appearing and saying "hey, it's me god. watch me lift this mountain." Anything else is just circumstantial evidence that doesn't pass the test.
Saebeck32 3 months ago
@Saebeck32 Here's what would convince me that you exist... you appearing and putting in my pocket one trillion dollars. Anything else is just circumstantial evidence that doesn't pass the test.
drcraigvideos 3 months ago 7
@drcraigvideos That makes no sense. You can see me, I can talk to you. The same can not be said of a god.
Saebeck32 3 months ago
@Saebeck32 What if you (or me) are suffering from a delusion? Do you really think literally seeing something exist is a good criteria that it exists? Rational people know we've been passed this type of shallow thinking.
drcraigvideos 3 months ago 8
@Saebeck32 Just because you can't see him doesn't mean he is not there though
TarriCJx19 2 months ago
@TarriCJx19 Which is exactly why the flying spaghetti monster has yet to make an appearance - so that his lack of appearance can be taken as proof of his existence and noodly appendages.
WoobaOne 2 months ago
@WoobaOne spaghetti is a materal object, God isn't. If you were to claim everything I state is the spaghetti monster you're just saying God, regardless of what you call Him.
FamousDave2186 2 months ago
@Saebeck32 I can't see you, and for all I know, the text could be generated by a computer program.
God's existence is much more certain than yours.
1GodOnlyOne 2 months ago
@Saebeck32 i know you probly dont want a response lol, but my grandfather died before i was born, i never saw him or read anything he wrote, so i would say to you what i think any christian can exclusively say, What about Jesus Christ? hes not visible in our life too but we know what he said and did, and i couldnt find a single lie he said, people died for thier testimony to him and the twelve disciples spread a message that the whole world now knows, just as Jesus said they would.
jamesearlcash500 1 month ago
The irony of this . . .
WLC himself will never change his opinion, as he has said, even if he admitted that there was no evidence at all in his favour.
He believes because he feels it to be true.
ThMrksman 3 months ago
@ThMrksman Craig has never claimed that his position is unchangeable. Present your case and let's see if it flies!
lourak 3 months ago
Ive talked to and watched a hell of a lot of atheists, and none of them have ever been of the opinion that no amount of evidence would convince them. All of them that I've seen asked this question can give clear examples of evidence they would accept, including myself. He gave no examples of an atheist who held this supposed view, and no examples of evidence they would deny as valid. Mr. Craig would do a good job as a FOX news reporter.
htomerif 3 months ago
Heres the thing, Jesus christ performed miracles in front of people, and there were those who would still not believe he was God's son. heres the thing, when there were people who saw jesus christ raise someone from the dead infront of their eyes and shrugged it off as "unconvincing" ad hominem, what makes you think telling someone about this 2000 years later they will be convinced. So to any christian moron who has a video entitled "qeustions for atheists", take it down, its pointless.
MagnusCattus 3 months ago
That is because "repentance" must be preached, "change your mind!"
That is what repent means!
That is the reason the message of repentance is so important when you read the New testament, yet it is neglected today.
davejens1 3 months ago
@davejens1 To me, to repent, in this context, means to give up any confidence you have in the content of your mind.
356pla 3 months ago
I'm curious to know why this video has so many dislikes, what is it about what Dr Craig said that people dislike?
DigitalDecadence 4 months ago
I used to think love and forgiveness were the only two commandments, but they aren't. Faith that Jesus is the only way because no one else ever gave their life for you, and also stay true to all the commandments as these are life saving, all have earthy consequences. We were told to confess ALL your sins - you'll be forgiven. Also we were told then TO TURN AWAY from sin, so not just confess it but also turn away from it.
The afterlife with Jesus has LAWS like a family home to keep it safe.
nevernextdoor1 4 months ago
A totally closed off mind to something is a "reprobate mind"& I do beleive that there are atheist who don't want God to excist&even if a stick were to turn into a snake&they saw it, they will not beleive what they just saw.
RonSafreed 4 months ago
on both sides perhaps...
cashox3 5 months ago
What evidence???
baldurus1 5 months ago
all evidences states that atheists have no morals.
ikawpipa 5 months ago
@ikawpipa Really?
Take a look at prison population, teen pregnancies, STD rates, divorce rates etc. etc. etc.
Prison population theists 99,8% Atheists 0,2%(population in society theist 80% Atheist 20%).
A religious teen is more then 20 times more likely to become pregnant then an Atheist teen.
STD's are rampant among religious people.
Divorce rates theists 37% Atheists 24%.
Want to try that again?
baldurus1 5 months ago
@baldurus1 Maybe you should get your statistics right, smart guy. How many more people do we have claiming to be Christian than atheist, genius? If 99% of a population has black hair and only 1% has blonde hair, who do you think is going to commit more crimes?
drcraigvideos 5 months ago
@drcraigvideos Math fail.
I gave the numbers in percentage. LOL
It actually favors the larger group, because more people of the larger group would have to commit a crime to get to the same PERCENTAGE as the small group.
1% of 1000 is 0,1, 1% of 100 is 1, get the idea.
And when you compare the numbers to society 80% theist vs. 20% Atheist, the numbers aren't even close when you look at the prison statistics 99,8 vs 0,2.
baldurus1 5 months ago
@baldurus1 OH, I GET IT! GOSH, YOU'RE SO SMART! Even though I gave percentages too (and, well, you totally dodged that but we'll forgive that because I'm sure you're known for taking on arguments head-on anyway), well, I guess that doesn't matter. But I think you have a point. Say, we have a group of 100 people and 99 of them claim to be Christians and only 1 is an atheist, I'm sure your percentages are oh-so-relevant still to the facts. Nothing gets passed you, man.
drcraigvideos 5 months ago
@ikawpipa random comment... no foundation at all.
cashox3 5 months ago
"evidence is trivial"....only if your Christian. you see, ALL the evidence is in the other camp...
pillowbugg 7 months ago
@pillowbugg Such as?
5starsoldier 6 months ago
@pillowbugg
"ALL the evidence is in the other camp..."
Wow, that's quite a convincing argument (not really...)
THEEVANTHETOON 6 months ago
The reason for not being open to the existence of a god is that all that we can see and will ever see can be considered natural phenomena. This is what scientists test. If there are things that scientists can't explain, then (atheistic) scientists are to take it as a challenge instead of conceding that something supernatural caused this.
Another problem is actually having proof that a god exists. "Proof of a god" might be an incoherent phrase.
TheFanwindow 7 months ago
What a lot of pretense in the title of this video. There is no truth, there are only opinions about the existence of God. That is why all the "proof about God discussion" are pointless. Just respect each other, and don't force anyone to live to your rules.
Ranokian 10 months ago
Archaeosix was in the front row hoping to God (he was in a sort of a "foxhole" after all) that Craig wasn't talking about him...
...Nah!! He was probably too busy chewing bubble gum and watching Rick Astley videos on his I-Mac totally clueless that he was the topic of conversation.
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
There's plenty of evidence that could be produced for god that would convince me:
God appearing and removing all pollution from the atmosphere.
God appearing and destroying all millitery equipment and making us live in peace.
God’s hand catching the planes just before they hit on 911.
Etc etc etc
Atheists require REAL evidence, and no theist has ever produced it. What theists consider to be evidence is actually nothing of the sort to any critical thinker.
WildcardHatesYou 10 months ago 7
@WildcardHatesYou If you give me 100 billion dollars I'll be convinced that atheism is true. I'm just following your thinking because I want to be as, uh, "critically minded" as you.
drcraigvideos 10 months ago
@drcraigvideos yet another atheist pwned: it's never ceasing....
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
@drcraigvideos lol!...shhhh!...they think they're smart! don't ruin it for them!
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
@drcraigvideos Why'd you block the guy you responded to?
BigLundi 9 months ago
@BigLundi Because he was beginning to troll.
drcraigvideos 9 months ago
@WildcardHatesYou wondering what the heck the 14th of September was going to be. It turned out to be to the day when we got all of our debts paid off. It was around 6-8 months sooner than we ever thought possible. I know, "they are both coincidences". But you did ask... Sort of. Of course none of this is testable and repeatable. But one thing's for sure, I would die for my faith in Jesus. So I'm certainly convinced. We don't hold any of the cards. A little humility is called for.
MPaulHolmes 3 months ago
@WildcardHatesYou What about God creating a universe so fined tuned for human existance? wait....nope, that STILL probly wouldnt be good enough, lol.
camthejock 3 months ago
@camthejock heheh...i had to laugh at that. Good words.
hexusziggurat 3 months ago
@hexusziggurat haha yup
camthejock 3 months ago
@camthejock "What about God creating a universe so fined tuned for human existance?" but you need to show evidence that the universe IS fine tuned for human existance. The majority of the universe is not compatable for human existence, and the majority of evidence shows an evolutionary explanation for our own individual existence as a species.
The most contemporary evidence that exists shows that our species adapted to the earth, not the earth was adapted to us.
ashunga543 3 months ago 4
@WildcardHatesYou & WLC is not referring to you at the beginning. He said "I have met MANY atheists...." (meaning he's not making an umbrella statement). There are those atheists that would STILL deny existence of God even IF the things you listed all DID come to fruition through God's efforts (thats the point WLC is making). You actually fall within (& the people that gave you the thumbs up likely) the group that he says at 0:27 "a certain openess to God..." then=belief. WLC is clear on that.
hexusziggurat 3 months ago
@WildcardHatesYou Whenever you reject a worldview, you adopt another. If your an atheist its not as if anything is 'Wrong' with pollution, or planes hitting a building. I find that very 'Good' evidence that man is evil, and man is the problem, not the solution. Please explain why those events were wrong under atheism.
JPBuysjr 2 months ago
@WildcardHatesYou So, basically, you want God to be your sugar daddy and do everything that you think is fitting merely to convince you. He has revealed Himself through creation which is something we observe everyday (Romans 1). If that REAL evidence does not convince you, nothing will.
chaplainmartin 1 month ago
Assuming that someone can find actual evidence (not the bible, not attacks on evolution and big bang theory, not personal experience, not arguments from logic, but actual evidence) to support gods existence I'm sure there will be more than a few atheists who will refuse to accept it, and if someone can find evidence that god does not exist I'm just a proportional amount of theists will refuse to accept it.
bantam700 10 months ago 2
WHAT evidence?
anything that can be measured by independent scientist will do.
until evidence is found gods are bronze age cousins of Harry Potter
whatever144ify 11 months ago 2
@whatever144ify Uh, yeah, you can put God in a test tube to test to see if He exists. Get over it, science doesn't answer everything: watch?v=vxJQe_FefxY
drcraigvideos 11 months ago
Comment removed
Archaeosix 11 months ago 10
@Archaeosix Fail. I'm sure, of course, that you're taking what he said out of context to suit your purposes.
Craig sifts the evidence and , I'm sure, if he found Christianity to be illogical he would abandon it.
Unlike the average YT atheist he is not Arational.
That said, of course, the hypothesis that someone could be totally unbiased is ludicrous, even Craig.
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
@Christlovesanimals You sure are sure of yourself. Fail? Really? I think you've completely missed the point of my comment... what a shame.
Archaeosix 10 months ago
@Archaeosix No dude. I understand it completely: obviously more than even you do.
What a shame....
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
@Christlovesanimals You're an arrogant jerk who's only interested in arguing, not understanding. The "shame" is that you would rather act this way than to try to come to an understanding. You're no better than the "average YT atheist".
You fail. :-)
Archaeosix 10 months ago
@Archaeosix ahhh...the real "typical YT atheist" appears!!...silly me! and I thought you had more going for you...
As Jack Nicholson once said "you can't handle the truth."
Fail?...yep...."typical YT atheist" orientation....No "troll" for me??..Damn! I feel cheated!
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
@Christlovesanimals Wait a minute.... Mel Gibson?? Is that you?!
Archaeosix 10 months ago
@Archaeosix Wait a minute! Archie Bunker is that you?
Still no "troll!!" Damn!...
I got me a "fail" though!!....Whee!....I'm really dealing with a crackerjack mind on the other end here....
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
an anti-Christian bigot is still...well..a bigot.
Archie.
Please!! One more "fail!" and please give me a "troll!!"...c'mon silly atheist !! you can do it!!
Ooops!...I just insulted all the genuine atheists out there who actually THINK about their positions by implying that you could hold their jock-straps silly bigot.
The opening song from "All in the Family?"....c'mon dude!! throw me a bone here!!
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
@Christlovesanimals lol Mel, you're so damn daffy!
Archaeosix 10 months ago
@Archaeosix daffy!....THANK YOU silly atheist! That's a new , unique ad hominem!!....I did NOT know you YT atheists were capable of unique thoughts!!....
Hey everybody!!! This silly atheist is so impressed by me he made up a unique ad hominem from me instead of usual parroting of atheistic pablum!....
I'm SOOOO special!---I MUST be.
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you silly atheist!
I can die happy now!!
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
@Archaeosix What Dr. Craig was talking about in that video was that a belief in God as properly basic. Many amateurs and novice thinkers do not understand this concept, even though it's among the learned philosopher.
drcraigvideos 10 months ago 14
@drcraigvideos But it's not. If it were, then trhere would be no atheists. Besides, what about the 'learned' philosophers that would disagree with that notion...like...Sam Harris, for example?
BigLundi 9 months ago
@BigLundi Sam Harris doesn't mention properly basic beliefs in his writings. You don't know what you're talking about.
drcraigvideos 9 months ago 2
@Archaeosix Did Dr. Craig imply that there were not any closed minded Christians? I've heard Dr. Craig make the point that an innate contradiction about God would be good grounds for disbelief, if you know where he says that "no amount of evidence would convince him" could you please point out the video? Are you using this "point" as evidence that Dr. Craig's arguments are incorrect? If so wouldn't your arguments be incorrect too using the same standard? Thanks for any of your time.
kvash3154 4 months ago
@Archaeosix you have the link for this video? Would love to see it, he probably blows himself out the water...
Andersxman 4 months ago
@Archaeosix No that isn't correct, what Dr Craig mentioned was a belief that is 'properly basic' in which there is an innate, personal experience, which overrides any amount of external evidence.
DigitalDecadence 4 months ago
@DigitalDecadence My understanding of the concept of a properly basic belief comes from "What is a Properly Basic Belief? (Alvin Plantinga)" watch?v=f7377jU2a8Y
studentofsmith 4 months ago
An atheist who is open to the truth soon becomes a Christian.
YHWHisSovereign 1 year ago
@YHWHisSovereign haha That's a little closed-minded. ;-)
Archaeosix 11 months ago
@YHWHisSovereign Damn straight. And I'm one of them.
"A little philsophy inclineth a man to atheism. A lot inclineth him to God." Francis Bacon.
Christlovesanimals 10 months ago
I have found that Craig is absolute right. When pressed for what would convince atheists that God exists, the vast majority will never accept God existence no matter what the evidence
agnostaxian 1 year ago 8
@agnostaxian 99% of atheist youtubers are like this.
drcraigvideos 1 year ago
@drcraigvideos I totally agree. I think that even if Jesus himself appeared in the clouds for all to see and told us that he was Jesus returned to earth, the vast majority of atheist would write him off as a space alien, evolved from another part of the universe out to trick us.
The universe screams a designer, as most humans today and throughout history concede but atheist's eyes are closed tight
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian No doubt whatsoever about that one!!
I'm convinced now--after dealing with some of these "blind as a bat, faith out the wazoo"
atheists that only God Almighty on Judgment Day can handle these people...
EastofForever 1 year ago
@drcraigvideos Where do you guys get this stuff from. Why wouldn't evidence of the supernatural convince people who don't believe in the supernatural, of the supernatural? There currently is not any evidence. Please provide some evidence. All I get is either "There is lots of evidence" or "Look around you" or "You have to find the evidence yourself" or a combination and we're asking for it. Point us to some evidence. Thank you.
Nolgthorn 11 months ago
@Nolgthorn *SIGH* There's the cosmological argument (view_play_list?p=7DF074B2FA080791) and the teleological argument (view_play_list?p=5F0775BFB8300080). Dr. Craig even gave evidence to Dennett (watch?v=_Wzol00G2MM) while Dennett dodged ALL of it duriing his rebuttal. Just because you're not convinced of the evidence doesn't mean we don't have evidence.
drcraigvideos 11 months ago
@agnostaxian many atheists have so much faith that their positions would make hillbilly snake-handling Christians envious.
hey! that's an idea! Christian hillbilly: "I'm going to show how much faith I have in God by having faith in his non-existence like these 'new atheists!' F*** those snakes! In fact, I'm going to bite those snakes heads off, not handle them!"
"Hold on....let me get a swig of "Hitchens 100% proof" here!
Make sense? about as much faith in Nogod does.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@agnostaxian I could believe he's real, but I could never believe he's a nice person. If he's real and wants me to believe he's real, he needs to do what everyone else needs to do and talk to me or write me a clear, english message using the world he apparently would have unlimited power over. I've actually never met any atheists who say they would still not believe after what I just said happened, but if you've met them then I guess they really exist.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry So how would you like God to write you a clear english message? Do you want Jesus to appear to you and talk to you?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian When next I walk outside, I would like to see the trees twist and contort to spell the words "I am god, and I am real"
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry And I would like them to stay that way so that I can record it and bring other people to see it to verify it really happened and I have not simply gone insane.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
Comment removed
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry OK, let's say that happened. How would you know that it wasn't someone using a special invention to trick you?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian I wouldn't know, but if scientists saw the contortion on film. I'm sure they would be overjoyed to investigate and perhaps tell me what happened, after which I could make my final decision on whether or not. I also find it unlikely someone would make an invention with that sort of power only to use it on my street and on me when specifically I walk outside.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry *final decision on whether or not I believed it was real
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry So after seeing a tree twist and contort saying "I am God..." you would still need more evidence correct? Let' say scientists studied it and had no explanation for it, would you then say "My trees contortions proves that God exists"?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian Sort of. I'd just go get a video camera, pray politely for god to do it again since god listens to prayers and fulfills them and can do anything at all, then I'd record it for scientists to see, then theyd come down and investigate and if they say YEP, I don't know anything that could have done this. then I guess I'd be a christian and not break god's rules out of fear he would smite me and just like the bible says, I'd stone to death any child who doesn't listen to their parents.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry OK the last statement hits the core of why you dont accept God, you dont want God to exists and have an emotional hatred for Him, your tongue in cheek comment demonstrates your true grind with Christianity but anyway let's proceed.
So that would make you a Christian? Sort of?? Why the qualification?
Also, how would you know that the being that did the tree contorting action wasn't a space alien kid with a tree contorting toy trying to trick you?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian For some reason possibly this is hard for you to believe, but there are plenty of people I hate who I know all too well are real. My opinion of something were it to exist has no baring on whether or not I think it exists. there are plenty of other characters in books who I do like and I don't think they're real either. I have no reason to believe they or god are real. If god is real and wants me to believe he's real, I told you what he has to do.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@agnostaxian "how would you know that the being that did the tree contorting action wasn't a space alien kid with a tree contorting toy trying to trick you?" Well I guess I wouldn't know, then I'd just be committing unholy acts of murder via thrown mineral formations instead of holy ones. If something is powerful enough to read this comment I'm typing right now on youtube, find me, use a tree manipulation device just for me then I'd be stupid not to follow its will for fear of retribution.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry Your comment shows that nothing will convince you that God exists. If God did do your request, you would want more and then more ad infinitum. If you accept God existence then God has given so much evidence for his existence that 95% of the world accepts a divine reality, it is just your eyes are closed shut tight, even if Jesus appeared to you and slapped you in the face or zapped your ass with a lightening bolt, you still would not believe. You can't until u change your heart
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian What are you, a troll? I just told you that after the scientists said they have no idea how it could have happened I would follow the christian laws because I wouldn't want god to punish me. You think I would follow the laws of an invisible bully I still thought wasn't real?
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry You said you would not be sure if it was god or a alien child with a tree contorter. You also strawman & mock. Anyone who has read "Christianity for dipshits" knows why God commands us to do things.
Now if your atheist buddies said that the tree contortion doesn't prove that god exists but were sure there would be a naturalistic explanation would you say "You are wrong this proves that God exists" or would you say "you may be right I need more evidence"?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian No one can ever be 100% sure of anything except some times that based on all the evidence one currently has available to them, what they've derived from it makes the most sense, this counts also for evolution and big bang theory. If the "atheist buddies" to which you refer are well educated, well reputed scientists, then I would need to hear the reasons for their conclusion. Whether I would need more evidence would depend on that and what I think about it.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry I see, well maybe it is good that God doesn't contort your trees because in the Christian view God doesn't want you to bow to him and think of him as an asshole and bully trying to force you to believe & obey him but he wants to have a personal love relationship with you that you willfully enter into.
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian He sends people to be burned eternity if they don't do what he tells them to, and wants disobedient children stoned to death, pagans stoned to death, I know there are more of those but I forgot them for the time being. They were in the old testament and nothing in the new testament ever said you don't have to do that any more. How can you tell me that isn't being a bully? What exactly do you think a bully is? And I can't have a relationship with people who don't talk to me.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry the OT is a revelation to a people in a tribal situation and is incomplete (John 1:17). The New Test. does say that we are not to stone people (Read John 8:1-11). The point of the law is that we all fall short and sin. None is righteous. All should die and we all need grace.
Read the story of Jesus and his paradigm, he is not a bully but extends love to all. God wants none to go to hell but all to be with him but he will not force you to accept him.
He speaks to your heart
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian John 8:1-11, Jesus says people without sin may throw stones. So pretty much any christian can as long as they've never blasphemed, and have sought forgiveness for all other sins, blasphemy being the only unforgivable sin. What is being without sin anyways? Does it specify? seems like a pretty huge thing to be so vague about. is it never having sinned in your life? not sinning right now? not sinned since your last confession? not intending to sin in the future? where does it say?
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry The point of John 8 and the whole NT (Read Romans 3) is that we all have sinned and we all need grace.
Jesus made it clear that in the new era God's kingdom and human government are distinct. Jesus' kingdom is not of this world and spiritual (John 18:36) so we are not to force people to obey God through coercion. After 1500 years of Christian tyranny in europe, the church finally got it right with the separation of Church and state. It must be a free choice
agnostaxian 1 year ago
Care to narrow it down a bit? A hundred years? A billion years?
deekomendez 1 year ago
First off congrats on allowing ratings and comments on a pro-religious video.
Evidence I, as an atheist, accept would point towards the existence of the Christian God:
1. Prayer making a measurable difference to medical outcomes (without the patient knowing they were being prayed for).
2. Resurrection of the dead under scientific observation (and obviously not caused by medicine!).
I could come up with more. Surely they cant be too hard for an omnipotent creator!
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez You'll get your resurrection of the dead, but the point will probably be moot by then.
OneEyedJack1970 1 year ago
@OneEyedJack1970 When's that gonna happen then?
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez On the last day.
OneEyedJack1970 1 year ago
@OneEyedJack1970 That's not an answer. You don't know do you?
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez That is the answer. No man knows the time, but it's coming.
OneEyedJack1970 1 year ago
@OneEyedJack1970 Whos side are you fighting for here? You essentially just told him he'll never see the proof he would need to believe god is real.
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry Why fight? I can just let you prove my point for me.
OneEyedJack1970 1 year ago
@KevinLounsberry The point is he's the one telling you things that would prove to him god is real, and you seem to keep thinking of reasons those things would not prove god is real. So I can't help but wonder, how does someone who believes god is real so able to come up with reasons you can't prove god's existence. OneEyedJack1970, can you tell me why you yourself believe god is real?
KevinLounsberry 1 year ago
@deekomendez I will do one better, what is after prayer Christians (and only Christians) were able to levitate when they prayed "in Jesus name". They were able to do this for as long as you wanted them to and we called scientists to make sure it was not a trick. Would you then conclude "The Christian God exists"?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian It would be pretty persuasive.
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez So would you say with certainty that the Christian God exists if Christians could levitate through prayer?? Yes or no
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian Are you trying to trick me or something? I don't believe anything with absolute certainty but as I said levitating Christians would be pretty strong evidence for me. Do you know any?
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez I am going somewhere with this, no trick though. I am trying to demonstrate to you that nothing with convince you that God (let alone the Christian God) exists.
So you say that it would be convincing if Christians could levitate correct?? How would you know that the Christians were not tapping into some kind of quantum principle not know yet??
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian as I said, I wouldn't be absolutely convinced but that evidence, especially if it could be combined with a demonstration of eg prayer making a difference to people's health, Christian's being able to grow back lost limbs etc. then it would all push me towards the conclusion that the Christian God existed. That is how science works, the accumulation of evidence backing up a given theory. So I disagree, given evidence I WOULD tend to believe that the Christian God existed.
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez So you wouldn't be absolutely convinced that God exists?? Like as convinced as you are that the world is round and not a trapezoid?? I think you would feel comfortable with saying "the earth is a sphere" correct and not "I am pushed toward the conclusion that the earth is a sphere"? What would it take for you to say "God exists"?
If I could pray and a 3rd arm grew instantly, would you then say "God exists" or would you say "I need more evidence"?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian unfortunately there is no such evidence.
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez answer the question. Everytime I go down this path with atheists (especially utube atheist) they always through in a dodge like you just did. Answer the question. At what point would you say "God exists" with the same certainity that you would say "The earth is a sphere"? What would it take?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian I think I've answered your question. Establishing the existence of an omnipotent being is pretty big and as you pointed out, other explanations would have to be eliminated before it could be accepted with anything like certainty. The comparison to establishing the world is round isn't fair. That's as simple as taking a photo (albeit from space). So to answer your question. How much would it take to convince me say 90%? A helluva lot. But unfortunately you can't provide ANY
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez You have not answered the question. You have said you would "tend" to accept that God exists if shown levitating Christians through prayer. So I will ask again, what would it take for you to say that "God exists" in the same way you will say "the earth is a sphere"?
That is fair because I want to know what would prove to you that God exists with certainty so answer the question. Be specific, at what point would you say "God exists"?? Be specific
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian It's not as simple as that. The roundness of the world is something that can be established with a very simple test. The existence of God takes a bit more than that. More evidence would make me more convinced up to a point of relative certainty. As I've explained I'm not 100% certain of anything. That doesn't mean I'm not open to evidence. I'd just need a lot of it. Let me turn it round on you. What kind of evidence would convince (or even persuade) you that God didn't exist?
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez LOL! answer the question, what would it take???? again, be specific and stop trying to dodge
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian Who's dodging now? Spontaneous limb regrowth, levitation, prayer driven recovery. Just those three would put me in the say 70% convinced category. So back to you. I'll ask again.. What kind of evidence would convince (or even persuade) you that God didn't exist?
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez 70% is not certain. What would get you into the 90% range? CERTAINTY is what I have been asking for this whole time.
I will discount your questions because utube atheist always try and side step this question by trying to switch topics....ie- "There is no evidence...", "What would convince you..." "What evidence would it take for you to believe in Santa...". answer the question. What would make you CERTAIN that God exists? Name it
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian and as I said in my very first answer I am not 100% certain of ANYTHING. You should read Descartes. Sigh. OK 90%. All of the above plus a personal appearance by Jesus (not just to me!) under scientific conditions demonstrating through supernatural powers his divinity AND providing a good explanation for the perceived inconsistencies in scripture. That would get me to 90%. So I've answered your question. Your turn.
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez ohh no, no, no, no. Why do you want to change the subject? afraid to go further? You seem so squirmy. Let's focus here. Now you said that you would accept with certainty the Christian God if limbs grew, levitation through prayer and a personal appearance of Jesus under scientific conditions with others present correct??
Now heres another question for you, how would you know that "Jesus" was "Jesus" and was not a space alien trying to trick us? How would you know (90% certain)?
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian I've answered your question but you will never be happy with my answer. And it's hardly changing the subject. It's just the same question flipped around. You won't answer it because you have no answer and that is the difference between you and I my friend.
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez lol, no I have an answer to your question but i won't answer it because you are trying to dodge the real issue by switching topics. I have seen it 100 times by utube atheists. you know deep down nothing will convince you that God exists. I think even if Jesus appeared in the sky for all to see, most atheists would say he was a space alien trying to trick us or some other bs
There is tons of evidence for God's existence right now, your eyes are just closed tight
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian sure you do.
deekomendez 1 year ago
@agnostaxian still waiting
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez your still dodging
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian what question am I dodging?
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez If you're waiting around for 100% evidence of God's existence you'll never be satisfied. Are you aware of this?
If you are aware, then what will be "the tipping point" for you?
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever I give up
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez I would too if I would be giving the lameass arguments you're giving on here....
you are dismissed son.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever well that's mature
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez I think so....
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever Yeah, these guys come on here and troll because they have no life and YOUR the immature one. right.....
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian you know....it sure is a BAD TIME to be a pseudo-atheist....
pseudo-atheism is getting its ass kicked in the Lab, in the Universities, in all the debates,
and now you can't even go on YouTube and "talk shit about God" and get your ass kicked
but good.
Thank God I have a brain I've chosen to use--not sit on like a YT pseudo-atheist on his cpu.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever Yeah to look at the universe and be a die hard atheist takes the faith that even the person in the wierdest religion would envy. lol
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian Hey! That makes pseudo-atheists "Religionists!!!"
LMAO!!
"Religionist" :a fakeass word made up by fakeass people practicing fakeass Philosophy and Sociology as they seek fakeass proof for their fakeass atheism.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever LOL! yeah, utube atheists are like hemorrhoids- annoying, will never go away and a real pain in the ass
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@EastofForever Maybe you can answer what agnostaxian can't. What evidence would persuade you even a little that God didn't exist?
deekomendez 1 year ago
@deekomendez i've already dismissed you son.
EastofForever 1 year ago
@EastofForever Humour me. Since you obviously think you're quite smart it should be easy for you.
deekomendez 1 year ago
@EastofForever i've already dismissed you son.
EastofForever 1 year ago
Are ANY christians 'open' to the iea of there being NO god?
Oh, the shifting sands of evidence.....uncertainty, never 'knowing' that one is 100% right....that's life. But to run to 'faith' is a cop out, in my view. The 'indweling holy spirit' is able to utterly convince thousands of people of mutually exclusive faiths and beliefs that THEIRS is the truth. It's good to grow up and learn to cope with uncertainty. Hope you're never convicted of crime by 'faith' rather than (shifting) evidence!
derek24hudson 1 year ago
@derek24hudson Your an idiot. It is atheist who are the ones who can't cope with uncertainty. Look at the claim of being a "freethinker". Yeah atheists want freethought right..well... unless you are a Jew, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu, Mormon, Jehovah's, Sihk, psychic, EEEEvil ID propenent, Scientologist, Shinto, Confucian, pantheist, Deist, pussy agnostic or anyone else that has a thought that differs from the utube atheist doofus possey but other than that think free! u r laughable
agnostaxian 1 year ago
@agnostaxian
The only remark that makes any sense from you is 'you're an idiot', and even that is wrong Let me know when you grow up, learn to argue in a civilised, educated and coherent way, and then I would be happy to debate with you. But I'm not holding my breath, judging from your first infantile, ingrammatifical, poorly-spelt and laughable ramblings. Of that, I AM certain.
derek24hudson 1 year ago
@derek24hudson You are a loser. You come on a Christian vid post and spout this "I am so enlightened and you all are like Children who can't deal with uncertainty" bs. Get a life. Go to your vid posts and stroke your dick there.
Utube atheists like you are the most arrogant, narrowminded, dogmatic "we know everything and everyone else is stupid" people on the planet. You are absolutely certain about all your hairbrained ideas like no other.
Go to your imaginary girlfriend and leave us alone
agnostaxian 1 year ago
What a mean character and a blackguard.
jerryhello100 1 year ago
what is this from?
xnorthcarolinax 1 year ago
Perhaps more atheists would be open to the idea of a god being real if the god being presented weren't so absurd that explanations such as deception, misinterpretation, and delusion are far likelier than the god actually being real.
Chuck1863 1 year ago
I think what you're saying is that 'hard atheism' is a 'deterministic' stance, based more on volition than on evidence aye or nay.
How can this be an example of 'free thinking', or rational thought?
A deterministic position is based on a personal agenda, rather than logic and reason, which contradicts the premise of free thot.
Agnosticism would be a more reasoned choice, since neither premise (theism or atheism) is provable. Even Dawkins admits that on an atheistic scale of 1 to 7, he's a 6
BeauLeeman 1 year ago
@BeauLeeman
Atheism and theism are provable logically, you just need to find contradictions in god or make deductive arguments that imply god necessarily exists.
Agnosticism, in the sense you're posing it, really appears to be a position almost all rational people hold to as is. The only question is do they think god likely does or doesn't exist, and hence how they get the labeled as theist or atheist. If a person cannot determine which is more likely, then they would be a true agnostic though.
MaximumAxiom 1 year ago
@MaximumAxiom - "The only question is do they think god likely does or doesn't exist ... If a person cannot determine which is more likely, then they would be a true agnostic."
What args can we employ? Dawkins uses Occam's Razor logic to disprove God. From the God Delusion, "A creator would have to be at least as complex as its design, and therefore at least as improbable."
Where is the logic here?! The construct of the designer has nothing to do with its end product.
In short, 'logic' fails.
BeauLeeman 1 year ago
@MaximumAxiom
I disagree. Neither are provable logically ( i.e. using formal logic ), as it happens.
Formal logic might prove that god CANNOT exist (is logically inconsistent) but that's as far as formal logic can take you. And it doesn't prove that.
It's like trying to prove how many planets are in the solar system using formal logic. Wrong tool. You have to get out & observe them.
Similarly - does god exist? Formal logic can't tell you - you have to 'get out & look'
MrMk1G 1 year ago
@MrMk1G
KCA is an example of an argument that would prove god's existence using deductive argumentation if it was sound (which I don't believe it is). I could construct other arguments that would "prove" atheism or theism, though they would be terribly unsound.
MaximumAxiom 1 year ago
@MaximumAxiom
I agree that KCA is unsound.
I'm only a layman philosopher, but I think that all other args I have seen are also unsound.
For many centuries formal logic was the only tool people (e.g. Thomas Aquinus) had to make sense of the world. So they used it!
Unfortunately formal logic is the wrong tool to use for determining IF something exists in the real world. That is why KCA, etc. are doomed to fail.
Not sure 'terribly unsound' args are going to get you very far :)
MrMk1G 1 year ago