Lecture by Stephen E. Braude on the Photographs of Ted Serios

[MoeRocco75]

Close to but not identical to the real subjects in the photos is what I meant..

[MoeRocco75]

Ive been scared and amazed in equal measure by Ted serios' photos from childhood to adulthood. As far as I know, nobody has convincingly debunked those photos. The strange way the photos are close to, but not identical makes things even more intriguing..

[philipacentaur]

Here's some evidence of trickery, right "in your face" so to speak. If you can't see it, the reason is probably that you don't wish to.

Youtube video: 5dJrI1X2Z4U

[OccasionallyBearded]

I'm shocked that the obnoxious in-your-face skeptics haven't commented on this yet...

[ar4216]

@OccasionallyBearded See the comment from philipacentaur above. :)

[OccasionallyBearded]

@ar4216 I saw it. Thanks though :) Also, I do *not* consider philipacentaur to be an "obnoxious in your face skeptic". I genuinely appreciate him showing me the video. I was referring to a certain breed of "skeptics". Also, I'm not sure if that other video undermines the experiments discussed by Braude, which seem to prevent/rule out the cheating method that may have been used in the video cited by philipacentaur. But I'm actually still not firmly convinced of anything in the Ted Serios case :)

[ar4216]

@OccasionallyBearded His assertion that if the viewer doesn't see what he sees in that video there is something wrong with them is an obnoxious stance imo.

[OccasionallyBearded]

@ar4216 Fair enough

[ar4216]

@OccasionallyBearded I agree with you about not being convinced by the Serios case. But I don't think it's as easy to explain away as the skeptics would have folks believe. And the comment from philipacentaur leads me to believe he didn't listen to a thing Braude had to say. His mind was made up. As far as my considering his stance to be obnoxious- I guess most of us can be a bit obnoxious and in your face at times. :) I've probably come across that way to skeptics before.

[OccasionallyBearded]

I love this lecture! I just want to make one correction. Prof. Braude says that the lab evidence "doesn't tell us anything" about psi. But that's not true... faraday chamber experiments show us that psi effects occur even when you block EMF, which means that psi effects are not reducible to (and don't depend on) EMF. That's important.

[MetaphysicsAddict]

just as skeptics often got highly positive results with some physical mediums (under stringent conditions), as Braude notes in this lecture. I just think he's being too hard on the lab work.

[ar4216]

@MetaphysicsAddict We've had a lot of good lab work since JB Rhine and I doubt it's managed to convince more than a handful of skeptics- it tends to be either ignored or misrepresented. Anyway, I enjoyed seeing him destroy the skeptical arguments concerning the "gizmo".

[OccasionallyBearded]

@ar4216 I think another problem is that the vaaast majority of scientists are simply clueless about the lab data. They just don't know anything about the topic. I think more scientists would be convinced if they had more knowledge of the lab work.

[ar4216]

@OccasionallyBearded Yes, yes, most definitely. Completely agree.

[MetaphysicsAddict]

(...) will have trouble with the lab data. But he fails to mention that some skeptics have indeed been "converted" by lab experiments, in some cases their own experiments. I agree that the work on D.D. Home is much more impressive than contemporary lab work, but the lab work is still providing evidence for the reality of psi. For example, see discussions of Ganzfeld meta-analyses by Carter (2007) or Radin (1997 and 2006). They show that even skeptics get positive results in the lab, just as...

[MetaphysicsAddict]

I enjoyed the summaries of D.D. Home and Ted Serios, but I think Braude should have worded things differently when discussing the lab-based data. The "source of psi problem" doesn't apply when lab-based experiments aim to determine the existence of psi. If somebody does lab work to answer that question, then the source if psi is no problem at all. It's only a problem if you presuppose that psi effects exists. Second, Braude suggests that "even open-minded skeptics" will (continued....)

[flowewritharoma]

lingistic theory good talk