@nakedBison69 I understand wy your so angry, If I didn't have sex after getting knocked up at 16 and having to sepend the rest of your younger years raising the children of a man who left you and them. You'll never move on from that, just like you'll never be apart of that sophisticated world you follow around on here. Your just not good enough for anything other then what your doing right now. It's not your fault you got knocked up by a loser, you were 16 and didn't know any better. Still don't
Is there no room to oppose both forms of cruelty? Yes, abortion in 99% of cases is, in fact, the murder of helpless, unborn babies. It is the moral shame of our country that we allow such evil. But it is also wrong to be unnecessarily cruel to animals. I would support doing the same acts of violence on Michael Vick, as he has done to those poor dogs. But I also think that those who murder helpless, unborn human babies, deserve the death penalty
I fully support abortion and for alot of reasons for which this bitch clearly doesn't under stand such as world over population. Think abortions bad how about the world government having to kill masses of people against their will because the earth will be at risk of losing all its resources.
Kids getting euthanized every day. I'd say that beats abortion.
Ps what makes any of you think we are better because where human. That's a form of eugenics.
@nakedBison69 nakedBison69 should let these ppl know what he responded to them, but he won't because this is the only way he can win any argument, by getting in the last word. But that don't mean much if they don't read it, does it?
@nakedBison69 notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, BUNNIES. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little bunnies too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
Many feel that the fetus cant feel the pain but I agree that we need to abolish abortion. We have the patch and the shot and the ring and the implant and society just does not need abortion anymore. Get BC in peoples face and you might get your wish. Pro BC all the way.
whoa i thought she meant real babies, not a fetus. The thing is women are really sensetive about their internal organs, i just dont get it but i sure respect it.
I dont know when life begins, but it is definetly after conception and probably before birth but the when is the sticky part.
In terms of trauma, I consider a woman being forced to give up their baby to an orphanage far worse than termination early in pregnancy but onlythe mother can decide as its her responsibility and hers alone.
actually, like begins at conception. that is one of the things one is supposed to have learned in Biology 101. and murdering babies is FAR worse than giving them up for adoption
@nakedBison69 Well of course biological-life technically begins at conception, but conscious-life does not begin at fertilisation. The Blastocyst has no functioning brain, not till long after implantation.
When the foetus has reach that "borderline" state of most basic consciousness I think the best judge of this is a medical ethics board and the mother herself, rather than inflexible absolute legislation.
A baby is very different from an unthinking/unfeeling mass of cells.
brainwaves have been detected in the fetus 40 days after conception. based on what you are saying, you would oppose any abortion done from 40 days from conception and onward
What science can say is consciousness can't begin before Week 20 (5 months) of normal development, lacking neurotransmitters+myelinization.
Activity before that (those fleeting "brainwaves") are much same as found in brain-dead adults.
Only by week 21-22 will a foetus respond to sound, even that isn't much of a sign of consciousness. Medical needs are still paramount; why deliver a fatally malformed foetus for a short and painful life?
@nakedBison69 Let's go by weeks, I'm in line with UK abortion law that abortion is only legal (with Doctor's approval) before 24 weeks.
Conveniently after 24 weeks the mother's Doctor can attempt an early term delivery, usually for medical reasons, the baby then has a high chance of surviving with modern medicine.
So there is no huge issue in the UK, but it's a compromise.
notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
I'm not phased by your gruesome rhetoric, I know pre-20 weeks foetal conciousness is impossible. Also, post-20-week abortions are so rare that doctors only enact in the most EXTREME cases, such as if foetus is found to be fatally malformed and any attempt at delivery would be futile and callous for the needless suffering it would cause.
Put it this way: no doctor should abort a 20-24 week old foetus without medically and ethically sound reasons.
Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
@nakedBison69 Well how the hell can I respond to that? You speak so harshly against medically necessitated abortion, yet you wish I had been aborted without medical reason. Isn't that hypocrisy?
What do you mean by I have no soul? Do you think I am a robot, just typing these words according to an elaborate algorithm? Am I not conscious? Alive, with feelings, and imagination?
You use the term "soul" in such a flippant way, as if it is nothing but shared empathy. REALLY Consider what I have said.
Treblaine thinks that helpless, unborn babies have no soul, are just robots, without feelings. Treblaine murders helpless, unborn babies in such a flippant way, as if it is nothing but a hangnail. REALLY consider what you are doing when you busy yourself with murdering helpless, unborn babies
@nakedBison69 OK could you explain to me how a foetus can have a soul without a functioning mind? Does a tree have a soul? Does a brain-dead adult still have a soul in their body? Does a sperm have a soul?
How I can have a conscious mind but no soul?
This "soul" you refer to seems to be meaningless.
It is not murder to abort a foetus without a mind, nor a fatally deformed foetus, it IS cruel to deliver a deformed foetus with zero chance of survival & would only begin a life of pain and suffering
Treblaine does not have a functioning mind, and therefore should be aborted ASAP. treblaine is a brain-dead tree. trablaine has no mind and no soul. putting "soul" in "quotes" adds absolutely "nothing" to treblaine's "arguments" or lack of them. treblaine is meaningless. it is not murder to abort treblaine who has no mind. it IS cruel to allow treblaine to continue to murder helpless, unborn babies who would have survived and thrived if not for treblaine's bloodthirsty murder of babies
Treblaine has no idea what he is talking about. treblaine makes no sense. treblain is just ranting nazi dogma to convince himself. treblaine is a keyboard using tree. treblaine is allergic to reason and logic. treblaine rants nazi dogma. treblaine has convinced nobody. it is obvious that treblain's parents are only to reaffirm his inflexible insistence on murdering helpless, unborn babies
@nakedBison69 Hey, you're the one ranting here saying "he believes this" or "he is that". All you do is turn around every criticism against you, against all logic, or endlessly repeat statement you've already made after I've made arguments against them... you're not facing up to my reasoning, you are blocking it out by endlessly repeating your original position.
And you disrespect the victims of Nazism throwing around "nazi" as such an empty and meaningless attack.
Treblaine is the one ranting here, believing this. treblaine is that. treblaine has no logic, instead endlessly repeating his passion for murdering helpless, unborn babies. treblaine is not facing up to his nazi lack of morality, blocking i tout by endlessly repeating his love of murdering helpless, unborn babies. treblaine has no respect for the helpless, unborn babies he murders. treblaine is empty and meaningless, and needs to be aborted
@nakedBison69 I google'd your name and you resort to this childish defence mechanism every time you lose your argument, you just resort to this third person reversal.
You have lost, and you are a terrible terrible loser. Like a toddler having a tantrum.
I suppose your genius comeback will be something like "NO! Treblaine is the toddler having a tantrum".
Feb 6, 2009 - With all due respect, nakedBison69 considers the ten greatest composers to be the following:1. Mozart (1756)2. Beethoven (1770)3. Bach (1685)4. Haydn (1732)5. Handel (1685)6. Rameau (1683)7. Palestrina (1525)8. Purcell (1659)9. Josquin (1450)10. Vivaldi (1678)
Feb 6, 2009 - In a way, it is good that I am such an amateur when it comes to truly great music. Because Haydn's music sounds to me almost indisguishable from that of Mozart, it is as if I have now doubled the amount of Mozart music I can listen to and enjoy. double the pleasure, double the fun, thanks to Haydn!
@nakedBison69 I don't know how things are done in the United States but in the UK if a Healthy mother with a Healthy 23-week gestated foetus asks for an abortion, there is no chance in hell she will get any doctor to perform it. The doctor would be struck off for malpractice.
The 20-24 week gap is there for many reasons. The '20 week scan' is there to catch fatal deformities, 4 weeks leeway is needed for a legal abortion. Sub-24-week delivery still is too dangerous (foetal brain damage).
Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
@nakedBison69 This is a delicate issue with few absolutes, and throwing around terms like "baby murder" don't help, especially when applied to a Foetus that wouldn't be considered alive if applied to an adult (such as brain-dead from an accident).
Babies are only physically helpless, there are SO MANY laws defending them not to mention the medical ethics boards regulating doctors performing abortions. This isn't about Rights to life/choice/whatever, this is simple objective medical ethics.
Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
@nakedBison69 But I see problems trying to apply this viable-deliver/abortion dilemma as (beyond typical US politics, neither side wanting to compromise) is your rather unique healthcare system.
Early term (20-30 weeks) delivery is only possible with the very best medical care for the baby to survive and be healthy. So Americans who want abortion limit moved back: dig deep and pay for those universal medical services to change those late-term abortions into early-term deliveries!
notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
Pretty stupid, these babies are aborted before you can even see them on ultrasound! There IS a time limit on having an abortion after which the baby is counted as a full human being with full rights. I'm with hurricaneheidi, think of some of the horrible scenarios under which a woman might get pregnant.
You've got great values Lores so I 5 starred your video. Also you are on the radio in Los Angeles. So a woman with your values being on in LA gives extra credit. Being attractive and beautiful is just extra credit!! Ha ha ha ,thanks,I'll be listening.
We are all instinct driven, our instincts tell us to get food so humans and animals use their logic (or what they have) to get it by foraging, hunting or through civilisation.
Humans are very instinct driven, you don't think hard about driving a car, it's instinct, you learn it just like a tiger cub must learn how to hunt. Their urge to hunt is analagous for us to understand and manipulate our environment.
How are humans vile for understanding their actions and resisting their impusions?
lores rizkalla, I am so sorry for the way this speakFreeTv spoke to you. you do not deserve such disrespect, but at least you know that you have won, as he could not come up with any reasonable argument against what you said
It is not "mental gymnastics" to logically discuss the ramifications of legally or morally considering an undeveloped, non-sentient, non-conscious xygote to have more human rights than a pregnant woman. A religious fundamentalist would expect a woman to bear the seed of her own pedophilic, incestuous father, or the seed of a criminal rapist, or the seed of a man who date-raped her, or a fetus with a birth defect that would render the child less conscious and less functional than a fish.
The pregnant woman's whole life would be affected. I don't believe that a non-conscious bundle of developing cells should have more rights than a pregnant woman.
Modern society does not welcome illegitimate children. A young pregnant girl faces tremendous criticism and rejection from society as well as her immediate family. Some pregnant teenagers have actually hidden their pregnancies by becomeing overweight and wearing baggy clothes... then killed their own newborn babies - a truly hideous crime.
Such desperation illustrates the double-edged sword of legally denying a pregnant girl/woman the option of discreetly ending her early pregnancy. Such a situation is terribly unfortunate... but it is ONLY the woman who feels any pressure, fear or stress - not an early term xygote. I would NEVER advocate aborting a fetus who has a heartbeat and a developed nervous system.
I respect Lores Rizkalla for taking a stand against tasteless ad hominem attacks. I apologize for ever having lowered myself to the level of an insult monger. I prefer to discuss the issues rationally. Now we can do that again here without the debate degenerating into obnoxious personal attacks. Thank you Ms Rizkalla.
In the above comment you clearly insulted me personally, nakedjanet, and at that point, I had NOT insulted you. YOU called me a "moral barbarian" and compared me to Adolf 'Shitler' because I am in favor of animal rights. You insulted me rather than debating the issues in a rational manner.
Lores Rizkalla and I have a difference of opinion, and YOU and I have a difference of opinion, nakedjanet. I agree with scientists and with the Supreme Court, both of which point out that early term xygotes are not yet conscious, sentient, functioning human beings, and cannot, therefore, be accorded more human rights than a pregnant woman, who is ALREADY a sentient human being.
Accusing someone who cares about animal rights of not caring about human beings is a straw man argument. It sets up a false premise - that animal rights activists, by definition, do not care about people. This is not only illogical, it is outright propaganda against animal lovers.
Please substantiate your accusations about wellgoddam, nakedjanet. Lores warned you about unfounded insults and accusations. I see no insults of any kind from wellgoddam. Wellgoddam's comments were calm and founded upon logic and reason. Nothing wellgoddam said was in bad taste. Nothing said by wellgoddam advocates cruelty to animals or favors the murder of babies.
What wellgoddam said is that he "favors the rights of the living, thinking, functioning, female human being who is already in this world, and whose life may be very negatively impacted by an unwanted pregnancy." Thank you for your reasoned response, wellgoddam. It is unfortunate that many times the future of the undeveloped human xygote hinges upon the circumstances of the mothers' life - but that's just the way it is sometimes.
The anti-abortionists' unwavering, judgmental, and absolute lack of compassion for the woman who is pregnant and cannot deal with pregnancy and motherhood at the time is what I object to. Wanting to protect the mother's right to choose is NOT the same thing as advocating the murder of children. Not every woman chooses abortion - OBVIOUSLY. But I believe that each woman must be allowed to make her OWN choice in the matter.
A xygote is NOT yet a child - neither literally nor legally - so say scientists AND the Supreme Court. Therefore, a xygote does NOT have the same rights as a woman. A xygote has no more consciousness than a fertilized hen's egg... no more consciousness than the doctors said Terry Schiavo had when she was allowed to starve and dehydrate to death.
The legal decision is BETWEEN prioritizing the rights of the unborn, and prioritizing the rights of the pregnant woman. Those of us who believe that the decision has to be granted to the woman are NOT advocating murder. We are prioritizing the rights of the woman. Some black-and-white absolute thinkers cannot seem to tell the difference.
The judgmental absolute thinkers would have society mandate that a human being with the mental functioning of a vegetable be kept alive for decades, until "natural death"(?!) at the expense of their family, or of the government indefinitely - thereby bankrupting the family or costing the taxpayers money to foster a non-conscious being.
The judgmental absolute thinkers would force every xygote to be carried to term and call it "murder" to discard one. What should the fertility clinics do, then, huh? Force the biological parents of every xygote created in the fertility process to be carried to term by that biological mother? THINK about what you are saying, and its true ramifications, instead of just shouting "murderer" at everyone who disagrees with you.
And not everyone who is in favor of abortion gives a shit about animals, either. The connection between a person's concern for the welfare of animals and their stance on a woman's right to choose is unfounded, and is yellow journalism.
The PETA guy is correct - these are two separate issues. What no one has said here so far is that some of us favor the rights of the woman over the rights of an undeveloped fertilized egg (xygote). THAT is the issue. I favor the rights of the living, thinking, functioning, female human being who is already in this world, and whose life may be very negatively impacted by an unwanted pregnancy.
I've been watching this debate, and it was YOU, nakedjanet, who first initiated the insults. HH stated her opinion, and you responded with extreme insults rather than calmly and reasonably responding. Unfortunately HH lowered herself to your level soon thereafter, but YOU started it, and YOU escalated the level of insults to EXTREME bad taste, IMO.
What a joke!! Not everyone that thinks Mike Vick is guilty and that he is a jerk who deserves to go to jail is in favour of abortion. If you want a reality check see the video comment about Vick at off the goal post This is a world wide web dot com address.
i've removed a couple of comments here. please refrain from presuming upon people's private lives! that is totally and completely out of line...and does not help your argument, or whatever it is you're trying to do....even if you do support what i'm saying. all the more reason, i won't tolerate it!
I respect you for maintaining standards of decency here, loresrizkalla. I also believe your heart is in the right place. You and I just disagree about a woman's right to choose. I would never support late-term abortion, or any abortion after the fetus has a heartbeat.
YOU support my description of YOU, nakedjackass, with every idiotic, blowhard comment you make. PROVE THAT I AM ANYONE'S LESBIAN LOVER, YOU LYING JACKASS... AND THEN PROVE THAT RON PAUL IS ANTI-SEMITIC. You can't do it... you lying jackass!!!
LOL! What an empty-headed JACKASS!!! ALL this idiotic nakedjackass can do when asked to provide FACTS is copy MY post and replace his name with mine! PUT UP OR SHUT UP, empty headed nakedjackass! GIVE US FACTS to back up your scurrilous, unfounded accusations, or slink away like the blowhard you really are!!!
What a FEEBLE EXCUSE for your obvious inability to offer any FACTS to substantiate your empty-headed, libelous, scurrilous accusations about both me and Ron Paul. You are a dogmatic, deluded, fundamentalist blowhard, nakedjackass, who believes in a book written thousands of years ago by ancient Hebrews who offered innocent animals as blood sacrifices to their bloodthirsty imaginary "god". No WONDER you think nothing of abusing innocent, sentient, living creatures.
Guess what? Michael Vick was once one of those innocent little babies..... and it is public record that 70 percent of the black and bi-racial kids born are born to single mothers. Children of single mothers have a greater incidence of becoming criminals. Society would have been much better off if Michael Vick's mother had an abortion.
"Proof of this can be found in a study by Professor Ellen Freeman of the University of Pennsylvania, who surveyed black, never-pregnant females age 17 or younger. Only 40% of those surveyed said that they thought becoming pregnant in the next year "would make their situation worse."(10)
Likewise, a study by Professor Laurie Schwab Zabin for the Journal of Research on Adolescence found Likewise, a study by Professor Laurie Schwab Zabin for the Journal of Research on Adolescence found that: "in a sample of inner-city black teens presenting for pregnancy tests, we reported that more than 31 percent of those who elected to carry their pregnancy to term told us, before their pregnancy was diagnosed, that they believed a baby would present a problem..."
"In other words, 69 percent either did not believe having a baby out-of-wedlock would present a problem or were unsure.
Until teenage girls, particularly those living in relative poverty, can be made to see real consequences from pregnancy, it will be impossible to gain control over the problem of out-of- wedlock births. By disguising those consequences, welfare makes it easier for these girls to make the decisions that will lead to unwed motherhood."
"Current welfare policies seem to be designed with an appalling lack of concern for their impact on out-of-wedlock births. Indeed, Medicaid programs in 11 states actually provide infertility treatments to single women on welfare.(12) I should also point out that, once the child is born, welfare also appears to discourage the mother from marrying in the future."
"Research by Robert Hutchins of Cornell University shows that a 10 percent increase in AFDC benefits leads to an eight percent decrease in the marriage rate of single mothers.(13) As welfare contributes to the rise in out-of-wedlock births and single-parent families, it concomitantly contributes to the associated increase in criminal activity."
Young single women should be rewarded by society for continuing their education and becoming gainfully employed, OR for waiting to become pregnant until they are married and having their children in the context of a solid two-parent home environment.
Single women who are pregnant out of wedlock should be offered free family planning services, free adoption services if they surrender the newborn child to be adoped by a two parent household, or free abortion services. Period. NO welfare payments for bringing fatherless children into the world.
Government support for single mother welfare households only gets us criminal scum like Michael Vick. Society would be better off if his mother had had a free abortion. Political correctness and religious dogma notwithstanding... It's time to FACE THE TRUTH.
BACK UP YOUR LIBELOUS STATEMENT ABOUT RON PAUL, you nakedjackass. PROVE that Ron Paul is anti-semitic. I want FACTS, not empty accusations. Now be the MAN that you claim you are, and back up your accusations, nakedjackass.
Forcing a pregnant woman to go through pregnancy and childbirth against her will is fascistic and cruel. It NEVER works. Women who are pregnant against their will are desperate enough to get rid of it no matter what the rest of society thinks. Watch the movie "Vera Drake" - it depicts this fact very well. To grant a non-conscious xygote more rights than the living, breathing, mother is fascism.
nakedjackass, you are the most ignorant, unimaginative debater I've EVER encountered on youtube - and THAT is saying something. All you can do is copy and paste MY comments about YOU and change your name to mine??? What an IDIOT! You fail to comprenend even ONE statement I've made here. My point about the starving, abused and needy is that we should be doing something about the people who are ALREADY BORN instead of trying to bring every possible xygote to life.
You are either a shameless liar, or such a LOUSY reader that you actually fail to comprehend anything I've written!!! Get a reading tutor, you ignoramus!!! You look like a FOOL - and worse, you look like the insane, mysogynistic bigot you really ARE.
Did you REALLY misunderstand what I said about Terry Schiavo, or are you just afraid to address that moral dilemma, nakedjackass? Do you DISAGREE with all of the doctors who said that she had no consciousness, no self-awareness, and was nothing but a vegetable on life support?
They decided to "let her die" - but what they really did was starve her and allow her to dehydrate until her physical processes stopped. I learned recently that dehydration is a torturous way to die. I wouldn't put a pet dog or cat through such agony. If they thought she REALLY was just a vegetable, why not end her life mercifully? Did they allow her to slowly waste away BECAUSE they thought she was totally unaware of her own existence, and could feel nothing??????
It was very bad, and difficult to watch, but I'd rather have the pitt bulls to attack each other rather than attack children. The less pitt bulls, the better IMHO.
The username HurricaneHeidi is consistent with my own gender, and it does not imply disrespect for the opposite sex, unlike a man using the name: "nakedjanet".
nakedjackass completely misses my point about our need to address the needs of starving, abused and needy people who ARE ALREADY BORN. We do NOT need to force women to endure pregnancy against their will. Fertility clinics throw away unused extra xygotes every single day of the work week. Are THEY murderers???
nakedjanet LIES and MISQUOTES me AGAIN - commiting blatant libel on youtube. HE HAS THE READING COMPREHENSION of a newt, and the integrity of a drive-by shooter.
nakedjanet is a shameless, perverted LIAR who falsely accuses me of advocating the murder of heterosexual men. What a pathetic, desperate, sick, person.
nakedjanet is a shameless LIAR who resorts to misquoting me in his brainless attempt to win an argument using ad hominem attacks rather than logic. Answer the question, nakedjanet: Are fertility clinics commiting murder when THEY throw away unused xygotes, or NOT?
nakedjanet is a male chauvinist pig who chooses a user name which accurately reflects his attitude towards women - something naked for him to leer at and use at his discretion.
It is you who are intolerant, nakedjanet - intolerant of any woman who wants the right to choose whether or not to be pregnant, and when to become a mother. Fertility centers throw away unused fertilized xygotes every day. Why don't you go picket one tomorrow? Call them murderers, too!
Don't you DARE call me an anti-semite, or a liberal, or a feminazi, you shameless LIAR! I am NONE of those things. Abortion does not target jewish people or any other particular ethnic group. YOU ARE SICK. You apparently have no idea what an ad hominem attack IS. Look it up. Educate yourself.
Are your reading comprehension skills REALLY so lacking, nakedjanet? I pointed out that: "There are children and adults and animals ALREADY conscious and living in this world who are abused and/or suffering and/or starving... yet you would insist upon bringing even MORE human beings into this world before helping those already born???"
But YOU have the unmitigated GAUL to claim that I've advocated the murder of children and adults already living who are abused, suffering and/or starving??? Where in the HELL did YOU ever learn to READ???
Traditional, 'god' centered religion is NOTORIOUSLY mysogynistic, paternalistic, and controlling of women. The wholly babble teaches that women should be stoned if they fornicate or commit adultery, and that homosexuals should be killed. Meanwhile, fertility clinics toss away extraneous xygotes every day. Is THAT murder???
Religious fundamentalists always seem to become outraged against secular people who believe in individual rights and who recognize the lack of logic inherent in religion. I smell a male chauvinist. Why would a man choose to call himself "nakedjanet"? A man should not dictate a woman's rights. A man does not HAVE to carry a baby to term for 9 months, and then endure childbirth, and then find some way to feed the child.
More ignorant LIES from nakedjanet. YOU are the ad hominem debater. YOU are the one who labels people who disagree with you rather than using logic or reason. I am NOT a liberal. I am a libertarian. I am also secular. I asked you a question about Terry Schiavo. I asked if you believed that she should have been kept alive in that vegetative state, during which she had no concept of her own existence, and no brain function.
Notice how nakedjanet puts words in my mouth? I want human beings to become the evolved creatures we have the potential to be - that means living in harmony with nature and other living beings - NOT abusing them because we feel privileged due to some deluded religious beliefs that supposedly grant us exclusive status as god's special creation.
Don't try that transparent tactic of playing the anti-semitism, genocide card on me, nakedjanet. A non-conscious xygote is not yet a person; it has no consciousness and no brain function. It is a potential human being; it is a developing biological process. Just how fundamentalist ARE you, anyway? Did you object to Intra Uterine Devices? They prevented the xygote from attaching to the uterine wall. Do you object to condoms? They prevent the sperm from finding the ovum.
And you are a blatant LIAR, nakedjanet, when you accuse me of urging women to get abortions. I have said NO such thing. You are a LIAR! What I HAVE SAID is that no one should take away a woman's right to choose whether or not to continue a pregancy to term. Your rights end where mine begin. No one should have the right to assert their own rights over mine. That includes an unborn child occupying my body against my will.
There are children and adults and animals ALREADY conscious and living in this world who are abused and/or suffering and/or starving... yet you would insist upon bringing even MORE human beings into this world before helping those already born??? Even against a pregnant woman's will???
You are both ignorant and arrogant when you claim that animals attach no meaning to pain and suffering. Anti-abortionists often point out that a late-term fetus exhibits conscious behaviors like thumb-sucking, and that it flinches when it is torn apart during a late term abortion. I agree, and I do not support late term abortions. A conscious, living animal exhibits AT LEAST that much response to suffering. In fact an animal exhibits conscious FEAR - something a fetus does not.
Animals demonstrate love and affection. They demonstrate loyalty. Animals have often deliberately protected and/or aided their human companions. Watch the program "Animal Miracles" on the Animal Planet channel.
It is the human chauvinism taught by organized religion which has encouraged mankind to separate itself from the rest of nature, and to abuse other creatures, and to damage the eco-systems of this planet. Thinking you are "created in (some imaginary) 'god's' image" and believing that other beings have 'no soul' is what makes you religious people so uncompassionate toward other creatures.
The value of the mother's life - the person who is ALREADY a conscious, sentient, being - overrides the rights of the undeveloped, non-conscious fetus. Every sperm thrown away in a used condom is a potential xygote... and a sperm exhibits more conscious 'awareness' than a xygote does - mysteriously finding its way to the ovum. I submit that once you use the 'potential' child argument, you have trouble drawing the line.
I ACCURATELY describe an early term fetus as a non-conscious bundle of dividing cells. Many PEOPLE who cannot survive on their own are ALREADY conscious, sentient beings... but some are not. Do you think that Terry Schiavo should have been kept "alive" indefinitely? Do you think she should have been starved and dehydrated to death the way they allowed her to die?
I notice from your profile that you are male. Obviously, you will never face the kinds of situations that females who are accidentally or unwittingly pregnant often face. Animals are living, sentient beings, already born, that feel pain and suffering. An early term fetus is not. I do not support abortion of a late-term, already sentient fetus.
I am not a "pro-abortionist" because I do not champion abortion per se. What I DO stand for is prioritizing the rights of the pregnant female (often not even technically a grown woman) who is faced with a pregnancy which can damage her personal life, her health, or her circumstances. SHE is the sentient being, NOT her fetus.
I am pro life. Read what I said. I agree with you. What I am saying is that this will fall on deaf ears, however true that it is. According to the far left, humans are the problem always. They have no logic, you do. However, what Vick did was horrific and he should be 'tarred and feathered' as far as I am concerned. I have heard similiar Conservative voices say the same thing for a week now. All valid. But on this issue they will not see it; unfortunately.
I support the right of a pregnant woman to chose not to undergo pregnancy and childbirth against her will. That is NOT support for murdering children. It is support for the pregnant woman. A first trimester fetus is not a conscious being, or a sentient being - but a living animal IS.
A living animal is a sentient being, already born, and capable of experiencing pain and suffering. A first trimester fetus in utero is not. A pregnant woman is also capable of suffering... and is often driven to desperate measures to end a pregnancy which, for whatever reason, is a traumatic circumstance for her.
Forcing a woman to carry a fetus to term is a violation of that woman's individual rights. The rights of the fetus should not trump the rights of the mother. Once the fetus could survive outside the mother's womb, I think it deserves to be nurtured and put up for adoption... but until it becomes a sentient being, it is a non-conscious bundle of dividing cells.
Those dogs were sentient beings that were forced to suffer by a collection of depraved human scum - without whom society would be better off. The odds are 7 to 3 that Michael Vick was an illegitimate child raised by a single mother in some ghetto. Too bad she couldn't have used birth control.
nakedjanet: do you do press for Lores? you're certainly an adoring and devoted fan. Lores helping to sort it all out for the middle grounders, huh? except she's telling people PETA is putting out hits on M.Vick, not the most reliable info doncha think?
Precisely, it's up to me, like it's up to you what you advocate for, difference is, I'm not being judgmental and self righteous in telling people who or what they should advocate for, I've taken in a black girl who had no home, and do numerous volunteer positions, who are you to judge me anyway?
While your logic is 'politically' expedient, it will lose effect with libs. Michael Vick was evil in his treatment of those precious dogs and I have to think that God has a special hell for those that do these things to HIS creations. Remember with libs, humans are the problem, always. That is why this will fall on deaf ears.
anyone is "allowed" to do anything they want to do, I just don't see the sense of someone who is in a highly powerful group, the pro-lifers (helped elect an American president) begrudge people who are trying to help animals, she can do what she wants, but she should check her facts and not spread lies about PETA being Tony Soprano, ridiculous.
if youre in an argument for pro-life, and you complain that pro-abortion is arguing with you (this is your cause and YOUR argument to make) so you think it's justified that you come to a animals rights argument and espouse your views on abortion? does that make sense to anybody but you? fight and win/lose your own arguments where they pertain and have relevance. I'm not advocating for animals rights on pro/against abortion sites.
I applaud your compassion for you stand on abortion. It's just that my compassion is of a different sort. I guess that's what make's the world go round and "God work's together for all good!" So you do your Right to Life and I'll do the Animal cruelty! Together we can make the World a Better Place to Live! God Bless
rusty, i could not agree more. we can all do our part--including supporting that which is good about what we do (as i support peta's work to protect animals from this kind of evil). God bless you too!
Please, how many times do I have to say I don't "value" animals more then human beings? This is your platform, and you don't seem to be letting anything else in, which makes it very hard to reason with you.
Well, since youre sitting on the right hand of God, you'd be the one to judge what my moral values are right? I'm so honored to send type to the one who talks for God...please, come down from you exalted place and quit judging, then reason can come into play
That's wonderful that I'm talking to someone who has a private line to God, you and Jerry Falwell have much in common, btw, while youre speaking to him next, ask him if he can do a little something about all these wars and such okay? and tell him hi for me. What arrogance.
I only have two hands, most of do in fact, even with all we do, we can only make a little dent in terms of animals rights, we all gravitate to what we can do best..I don't judge where you put all your efforts, why on earth would you judge me for helping animals? Pro-life has much, much, much more power in this society then animals rights, yet you seem to want all the power and all the contributions...and let the animals fall by the wayside, not very "spiritual" to me.
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@nakedBison69 I understand wy your so angry, If I didn't have sex after getting knocked up at 16 and having to sepend the rest of your younger years raising the children of a man who left you and them. You'll never move on from that, just like you'll never be apart of that sophisticated world you follow around on here. Your just not good enough for anything other then what your doing right now. It's not your fault you got knocked up by a loser, you were 16 and didn't know any better. Still don't
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
Is there no room to oppose both forms of cruelty? Yes, abortion in 99% of cases is, in fact, the murder of helpless, unborn babies. It is the moral shame of our country that we allow such evil. But it is also wrong to be unnecessarily cruel to animals. I would support doing the same acts of violence on Michael Vick, as he has done to those poor dogs. But I also think that those who murder helpless, unborn human babies, deserve the death penalty
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Whats your excuse paylay lmao.
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
I fully support abortion and for alot of reasons for which this bitch clearly doesn't under stand such as world over population. Think abortions bad how about the world government having to kill masses of people against their will because the earth will be at risk of losing all its resources.
Kids getting euthanized every day. I'd say that beats abortion.
Ps what makes any of you think we are better because where human. That's a form of eugenics.
Kevileya 1 year ago
Kevileya should be aborted
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 nakedBison69 should let these ppl know what he responded to them, but he won't because this is the only way he can win any argument, by getting in the last word. But that don't mean much if they don't read it, does it?
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
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@nakedBison69 notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, BUNNIES. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little bunnies too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
stfu
frosk8ter 1 year ago
Because it's her body and her right to privacy.
veganWiccan 1 year ago
but it is not her body, and even pregnant women do not have the right to murder their fellow human beings
nakedBison69 1 year ago
Many feel that the fetus cant feel the pain but I agree that we need to abolish abortion. We have the patch and the shot and the ring and the implant and society just does not need abortion anymore. Get BC in peoples face and you might get your wish. Pro BC all the way.
Vegheadsrock 2 years ago
I'm not suprised! Hell, these people...activists would rather have humanity
eliminated totally. Save the whales, the shrimp, the bees, the ants, whatelse??? Perhaps bedbugs, fleas?!?!
dtwmtl 3 years ago
whoa i thought she meant real babies, not a fetus. The thing is women are really sensetive about their internal organs, i just dont get it but i sure respect it.
I dont know when life begins, but it is definetly after conception and probably before birth but the when is the sticky part.
In terms of trauma, I consider a woman being forced to give up their baby to an orphanage far worse than termination early in pregnancy but onlythe mother can decide as its her responsibility and hers alone.
Treblaine 3 years ago
actually, like begins at conception. that is one of the things one is supposed to have learned in Biology 101. and murdering babies is FAR worse than giving them up for adoption
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Well of course biological-life technically begins at conception, but conscious-life does not begin at fertilisation. The Blastocyst has no functioning brain, not till long after implantation.
When the foetus has reach that "borderline" state of most basic consciousness I think the best judge of this is a medical ethics board and the mother herself, rather than inflexible absolute legislation.
A baby is very different from an unthinking/unfeeling mass of cells.
Treblaine 1 year ago
brainwaves have been detected in the fetus 40 days after conception. based on what you are saying, you would oppose any abortion done from 40 days from conception and onward
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Fleeting Brainwaves =/= true consciousness.
What science can say is consciousness can't begin before Week 20 (5 months) of normal development, lacking neurotransmitters+myelinization.
Activity before that (those fleeting "brainwaves") are much same as found in brain-dead adults.
Only by week 21-22 will a foetus respond to sound, even that isn't much of a sign of consciousness. Medical needs are still paramount; why deliver a fatally malformed foetus for a short and painful life?
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine opposes all abortions done from five months after conception, onward
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Let's go by weeks, I'm in line with UK abortion law that abortion is only legal (with Doctor's approval) before 24 weeks.
Conveniently after 24 weeks the mother's Doctor can attempt an early term delivery, usually for medical reasons, the baby then has a high chance of surviving with modern medicine.
So there is no huge issue in the UK, but it's a compromise.
Treblaine 1 year ago
notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69
I'm not phased by your gruesome rhetoric, I know pre-20 weeks foetal conciousness is impossible. Also, post-20-week abortions are so rare that doctors only enact in the most EXTREME cases, such as if foetus is found to be fatally malformed and any attempt at delivery would be futile and callous for the needless suffering it would cause.
Put it this way: no doctor should abort a 20-24 week old foetus without medically and ethically sound reasons.
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Well how the hell can I respond to that? You speak so harshly against medically necessitated abortion, yet you wish I had been aborted without medical reason. Isn't that hypocrisy?
What do you mean by I have no soul? Do you think I am a robot, just typing these words according to an elaborate algorithm? Am I not conscious? Alive, with feelings, and imagination?
You use the term "soul" in such a flippant way, as if it is nothing but shared empathy. REALLY Consider what I have said.
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine thinks that helpless, unborn babies have no soul, are just robots, without feelings. Treblaine murders helpless, unborn babies in such a flippant way, as if it is nothing but a hangnail. REALLY consider what you are doing when you busy yourself with murdering helpless, unborn babies
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 OK could you explain to me how a foetus can have a soul without a functioning mind? Does a tree have a soul? Does a brain-dead adult still have a soul in their body? Does a sperm have a soul?
How I can have a conscious mind but no soul?
This "soul" you refer to seems to be meaningless.
It is not murder to abort a foetus without a mind, nor a fatally deformed foetus, it IS cruel to deliver a deformed foetus with zero chance of survival & would only begin a life of pain and suffering
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine does not have a functioning mind, and therefore should be aborted ASAP. treblaine is a brain-dead tree. trablaine has no mind and no soul. putting "soul" in "quotes" adds absolutely "nothing" to treblaine's "arguments" or lack of them. treblaine is meaningless. it is not murder to abort treblaine who has no mind. it IS cruel to allow treblaine to continue to murder helpless, unborn babies who would have survived and thrived if not for treblaine's bloodthirsty murder of babies
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 What?
You don't know what you are talking about, you're not even making any sense.
It seems more like you are just ranting dogma to convince yourself. I'm a tree? I didn't know trees could use a keyboard.
Well, I gave you a fair chance, a reasonable compromise but you aren't interested in reason or logic. Just ranting dogma.
You're convincing no one, it's obvious your rants are only to reaffirm your own inflexible beliefs.
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine has no idea what he is talking about. treblaine makes no sense. treblain is just ranting nazi dogma to convince himself. treblaine is a keyboard using tree. treblaine is allergic to reason and logic. treblaine rants nazi dogma. treblaine has convinced nobody. it is obvious that treblain's parents are only to reaffirm his inflexible insistence on murdering helpless, unborn babies
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Hey, you're the one ranting here saying "he believes this" or "he is that". All you do is turn around every criticism against you, against all logic, or endlessly repeat statement you've already made after I've made arguments against them... you're not facing up to my reasoning, you are blocking it out by endlessly repeating your original position.
And you disrespect the victims of Nazism throwing around "nazi" as such an empty and meaningless attack.
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine is the one ranting here, believing this. treblaine is that. treblaine has no logic, instead endlessly repeating his passion for murdering helpless, unborn babies. treblaine is not facing up to his nazi lack of morality, blocking i tout by endlessly repeating his love of murdering helpless, unborn babies. treblaine has no respect for the helpless, unborn babies he murders. treblaine is empty and meaningless, and needs to be aborted
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Apparently you are a "bunny killer"
Are you hiding something?
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine tortures helpless little rabbits and murders helpless unborn babies
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 I google'd your name and you resort to this childish defence mechanism every time you lose your argument, you just resort to this third person reversal.
You have lost, and you are a terrible terrible loser. Like a toddler having a tantrum.
I suppose your genius comeback will be something like "NO! Treblaine is the toddler having a tantrum".
You lose! No amount of denial will change that.
Treblaine 1 year ago 11
Treblaine spends every waking moment murdering helpless, unborn babies
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 nakedBison69 Says:
Feb 6, 2009 - With all due respect, nakedBison69 considers the ten greatest composers to be the following:1. Mozart (1756)2. Beethoven (1770)3. Bach (1685)4. Haydn (1732)5. Handel (1685)6. Rameau (1683)7. Palestrina (1525)8. Purcell (1659)9. Josquin (1450)10. Vivaldi (1678)
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Yes she is in denial....
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
@Treblaine Google nakedBison69, you will see how much of a loser she is. Also, she killed 3 bunnies.
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
apparently treblaine murders helpless, unborn babies
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 nakedBison69 Says:
Feb 6, 2009 - In a way, it is good that I am such an amateur when it comes to truly great music. Because Haydn's music sounds to me almost indisguishable from that of Mozart, it is as if I have now doubled the amount of Mozart music I can listen to and enjoy. double the pleasure, double the fun, thanks to Haydn!
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 BUNNY KILLER!!!!!! lmao
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
@Treblaine Hello, just tell nakedBison69 she is a "BUNNY KILLER' .... trust me. Have a great day
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
MrRichardKranium abuses helpless little bunnies as part of his campaign in favor of cruelty
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 nakedBison69 is an overweight 21 year old mexican single mother who escape from the reality trolling message boards.
Why is she so angry? She turned all her babies daddy(s) gay.
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69
nakedBison69 December 6, 2010 at 7:59 AM
i do not get it. you got married earlier this year, yet your wife is no longer alive? what happened?
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 I don't know how things are done in the United States but in the UK if a Healthy mother with a Healthy 23-week gestated foetus asks for an abortion, there is no chance in hell she will get any doctor to perform it. The doctor would be struck off for malpractice.
The 20-24 week gap is there for many reasons. The '20 week scan' is there to catch fatal deformities, 4 weeks leeway is needed for a legal abortion. Sub-24-week delivery still is too dangerous (foetal brain damage).
Treblaine 1 year ago
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Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 This is a delicate issue with few absolutes, and throwing around terms like "baby murder" don't help, especially when applied to a Foetus that wouldn't be considered alive if applied to an adult (such as brain-dead from an accident).
Babies are only physically helpless, there are SO MANY laws defending them not to mention the medical ethics boards regulating doctors performing abortions. This isn't about Rights to life/choice/whatever, this is simple objective medical ethics.
Treblaine 1 year ago
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Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 After you've called me a baby murderer in so many words I'd like to re-iterate that if a mother with a foetus that was:
Of gestation to attain consciousness
Of gestation to survive delivery
Healthy enough to survive any reasonable term
HAD to be removed from mother (for whatever reason)
Then I'd consider abortion unethical and early delivery should be attempted instead.
But I don't think it helps having absolute law encroaching on that week-20, just mandate medical ethics approval.
Treblaine 1 year ago
Treblaine is not phased by nakedbison's truthfull words, because treblaine has no soul, thinking nothing of murdering the most helpless among us, that is, murdering helpless, unborn babies. too bad that treblaine's parents did not have the sense to abort treblaine when they had the chance
nakedBison69 1 year ago
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notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 in the UK the "late term abortion limit" is going to either stay or be limited further (down to 20 or 21 weeks) due to several factors:
So rarely does it get to 24 weeks for abortion to be considered.
Only the most extreme cases would Doctors agree to a 24-week abortion.
It is becoming safer and safer for early term deliveries, as early as 20 weeks.
Maybe in the future the UK abortion limit could be as low as 12 weeks ONLY IF doctors can safely deliver a baby at that gestation.
Treblaine 1 year ago
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notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 But I see problems trying to apply this viable-deliver/abortion dilemma as (beyond typical US politics, neither side wanting to compromise) is your rather unique healthcare system.
Early term (20-30 weeks) delivery is only possible with the very best medical care for the baby to survive and be healthy. So Americans who want abortion limit moved back: dig deep and pay for those universal medical services to change those late-term abortions into early-term deliveries!
Treblaine 1 year ago
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@Treblaine Google nakedBison69 and you will see that this is all this loser does with his life.
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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notice how you keep moving the dividing line when it is okay to murder helpless, unborn babies. clever try, but it will not work. sucking the brains out of a little baby too small to defend itself is something worthy of nazis, not civlized human beings
nakedBison69 1 year ago
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@Treblaine nakedBison69 wrote 16 minutes ago Treblaine opposes all abortions done from five months after conception, onward,
Thought you might like to know.
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 You wish you mother made that choice, remember when we talked about that?
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Thank you Mr. Wizard, Now lets talk about something that isn't redundent.
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
MrRichardKranium is forever redundant
nakedBison69 1 year ago
Pretty stupid, these babies are aborted before you can even see them on ultrasound! There IS a time limit on having an abortion after which the baby is counted as a full human being with full rights. I'm with hurricaneheidi, think of some of the horrible scenarios under which a woman might get pregnant.
Ral5h 3 years ago
so as long as you cannot see the baby being murdered, that somehow makes it okay. is that supposed to make any sense?
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 Wow, we talked about this remember. What I said must have gotten to you. Don't deni the truth about youself.
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
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nakedBison69 1 year ago
You've got great values Lores so I 5 starred your video. Also you are on the radio in Los Angeles. So a woman with your values being on in LA gives extra credit. Being attractive and beautiful is just extra credit!! Ha ha ha ,thanks,I'll be listening.
ThatsmyYokoOno 3 years ago
so very true
nakedBison69 1 year ago
@nakedBison69 who you talking to?
MrRichardKranium 1 year ago
How can animal lovers scream so much about killing animals yet are so willing to kill a baby?
because humans are vile creatures and animals are instinct driven, innocent animals.
TSM9356 3 years ago
Damn straight.
Also, no one has the right to force someone to give birth. If sex were merely for procreation there would be no Trojan.
No one has the right to life at the expense of another person's body.
It's why we don't force people to give up their extra kidney.
Most fetuses are aborted when they can't feel brain or even have a brain. Without a brain they weren't even truly alive under medical terms.
In the words of the GREAT George Carlin, "pro-choice is anti-woman"
I <3 stem cells.
bigalisme 3 years ago
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human beings do not have a right to live? wow, the nazis would be proud of your line of thinking, or lack of it
nakedBison69 1 year ago
We are all instinct driven, our instincts tell us to get food so humans and animals use their logic (or what they have) to get it by foraging, hunting or through civilisation.
Humans are very instinct driven, you don't think hard about driving a car, it's instinct, you learn it just like a tiger cub must learn how to hunt. Their urge to hunt is analagous for us to understand and manipulate our environment.
How are humans vile for understanding their actions and resisting their impusions?
Treblaine 3 years ago
TSM9356 is a vile creature
nakedBison69 1 year ago
damn i like this woman. So smart 4 real
Serg223 4 years ago
SHUT UP!
SpeakFreeTV 4 years ago
Thanks SpeakFreeTV. But, I'll be sure to let you know when I want your advice.
loresrizkalla 4 years ago
lores rizkalla, I am so sorry for the way this speakFreeTv spoke to you. you do not deserve such disrespect, but at least you know that you have won, as he could not come up with any reasonable argument against what you said
nakedBison69 1 year ago
It is not "mental gymnastics" to logically discuss the ramifications of legally or morally considering an undeveloped, non-sentient, non-conscious xygote to have more human rights than a pregnant woman. A religious fundamentalist would expect a woman to bear the seed of her own pedophilic, incestuous father, or the seed of a criminal rapist, or the seed of a man who date-raped her, or a fetus with a birth defect that would render the child less conscious and less functional than a fish.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
The pregnant woman's whole life would be affected. I don't believe that a non-conscious bundle of developing cells should have more rights than a pregnant woman.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Modern society does not welcome illegitimate children. A young pregnant girl faces tremendous criticism and rejection from society as well as her immediate family. Some pregnant teenagers have actually hidden their pregnancies by becomeing overweight and wearing baggy clothes... then killed their own newborn babies - a truly hideous crime.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Such desperation illustrates the double-edged sword of legally denying a pregnant girl/woman the option of discreetly ending her early pregnancy. Such a situation is terribly unfortunate... but it is ONLY the woman who feels any pressure, fear or stress - not an early term xygote. I would NEVER advocate aborting a fetus who has a heartbeat and a developed nervous system.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
I respect Lores Rizkalla for taking a stand against tasteless ad hominem attacks. I apologize for ever having lowered myself to the level of an insult monger. I prefer to discuss the issues rationally. Now we can do that again here without the debate degenerating into obnoxious personal attacks. Thank you Ms Rizkalla.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
You are lying, nakedjanet. You DO insult someone who has not insulted you first:
"nakedjanet (2 days ago)
you clearly value the non-suffering of dogs over the life of human beings. that makes you a moral barbarian. adolf shitler was also for animal rights"
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
In the above comment you clearly insulted me personally, nakedjanet, and at that point, I had NOT insulted you. YOU called me a "moral barbarian" and compared me to Adolf 'Shitler' because I am in favor of animal rights. You insulted me rather than debating the issues in a rational manner.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Lores Rizkalla and I have a difference of opinion, and YOU and I have a difference of opinion, nakedjanet. I agree with scientists and with the Supreme Court, both of which point out that early term xygotes are not yet conscious, sentient, functioning human beings, and cannot, therefore, be accorded more human rights than a pregnant woman, who is ALREADY a sentient human being.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Accusing someone who cares about animal rights of not caring about human beings is a straw man argument. It sets up a false premise - that animal rights activists, by definition, do not care about people. This is not only illogical, it is outright propaganda against animal lovers.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Please substantiate your accusations about wellgoddam, nakedjanet. Lores warned you about unfounded insults and accusations. I see no insults of any kind from wellgoddam. Wellgoddam's comments were calm and founded upon logic and reason. Nothing wellgoddam said was in bad taste. Nothing said by wellgoddam advocates cruelty to animals or favors the murder of babies.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
What wellgoddam said is that he "favors the rights of the living, thinking, functioning, female human being who is already in this world, and whose life may be very negatively impacted by an unwanted pregnancy." Thank you for your reasoned response, wellgoddam. It is unfortunate that many times the future of the undeveloped human xygote hinges upon the circumstances of the mothers' life - but that's just the way it is sometimes.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
The anti-abortionists' unwavering, judgmental, and absolute lack of compassion for the woman who is pregnant and cannot deal with pregnancy and motherhood at the time is what I object to. Wanting to protect the mother's right to choose is NOT the same thing as advocating the murder of children. Not every woman chooses abortion - OBVIOUSLY. But I believe that each woman must be allowed to make her OWN choice in the matter.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
A xygote is NOT yet a child - neither literally nor legally - so say scientists AND the Supreme Court. Therefore, a xygote does NOT have the same rights as a woman. A xygote has no more consciousness than a fertilized hen's egg... no more consciousness than the doctors said Terry Schiavo had when she was allowed to starve and dehydrate to death.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
The legal decision is BETWEEN prioritizing the rights of the unborn, and prioritizing the rights of the pregnant woman. Those of us who believe that the decision has to be granted to the woman are NOT advocating murder. We are prioritizing the rights of the woman. Some black-and-white absolute thinkers cannot seem to tell the difference.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
The judgmental absolute thinkers would have society mandate that a human being with the mental functioning of a vegetable be kept alive for decades, until "natural death"(?!) at the expense of their family, or of the government indefinitely - thereby bankrupting the family or costing the taxpayers money to foster a non-conscious being.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
The judgmental absolute thinkers would force every xygote to be carried to term and call it "murder" to discard one. What should the fertility clinics do, then, huh? Force the biological parents of every xygote created in the fertility process to be carried to term by that biological mother? THINK about what you are saying, and its true ramifications, instead of just shouting "murderer" at everyone who disagrees with you.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
And not everyone who is in favor of abortion gives a shit about animals, either. The connection between a person's concern for the welfare of animals and their stance on a woman's right to choose is unfounded, and is yellow journalism.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
The PETA guy is correct - these are two separate issues. What no one has said here so far is that some of us favor the rights of the woman over the rights of an undeveloped fertilized egg (xygote). THAT is the issue. I favor the rights of the living, thinking, functioning, female human being who is already in this world, and whose life may be very negatively impacted by an unwanted pregnancy.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
I've been watching this debate, and it was YOU, nakedjanet, who first initiated the insults. HH stated her opinion, and you responded with extreme insults rather than calmly and reasonably responding. Unfortunately HH lowered herself to your level soon thereafter, but YOU started it, and YOU escalated the level of insults to EXTREME bad taste, IMO.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
What a joke!! Not everyone that thinks Mike Vick is guilty and that he is a jerk who deserves to go to jail is in favour of abortion. If you want a reality check see the video comment about Vick at off the goal post This is a world wide web dot com address.
offthegoalpost 4 years ago
i've removed a couple of comments here. please refrain from presuming upon people's private lives! that is totally and completely out of line...and does not help your argument, or whatever it is you're trying to do....even if you do support what i'm saying. all the more reason, i won't tolerate it!
loresrizkalla 4 years ago
I respect you for maintaining standards of decency here, loresrizkalla. I also believe your heart is in the right place. You and I just disagree about a woman's right to choose. I would never support late-term abortion, or any abortion after the fetus has a heartbeat.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
YOU support my description of YOU, nakedjackass, with every idiotic, blowhard comment you make. PROVE THAT I AM ANYONE'S LESBIAN LOVER, YOU LYING JACKASS... AND THEN PROVE THAT RON PAUL IS ANTI-SEMITIC. You can't do it... you lying jackass!!!
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
LOL! What an empty-headed JACKASS!!! ALL this idiotic nakedjackass can do when asked to provide FACTS is copy MY post and replace his name with mine! PUT UP OR SHUT UP, empty headed nakedjackass! GIVE US FACTS to back up your scurrilous, unfounded accusations, or slink away like the blowhard you really are!!!
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
What a FEEBLE EXCUSE for your obvious inability to offer any FACTS to substantiate your empty-headed, libelous, scurrilous accusations about both me and Ron Paul. You are a dogmatic, deluded, fundamentalist blowhard, nakedjackass, who believes in a book written thousands of years ago by ancient Hebrews who offered innocent animals as blood sacrifices to their bloodthirsty imaginary "god". No WONDER you think nothing of abusing innocent, sentient, living creatures.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Guess what? Michael Vick was once one of those innocent little babies..... and it is public record that 70 percent of the black and bi-racial kids born are born to single mothers. Children of single mothers have a greater incidence of becoming criminals. Society would have been much better off if Michael Vick's mother had an abortion.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
htt p: //ww w. cato. org/testimony/ct-wc67. html
"Proof of this can be found in a study by Professor Ellen Freeman of the University of Pennsylvania, who surveyed black, never-pregnant females age 17 or younger. Only 40% of those surveyed said that they thought becoming pregnant in the next year "would make their situation worse."(10)
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
Likewise, a study by Professor Laurie Schwab Zabin for the Journal of Research on Adolescence found Likewise, a study by Professor Laurie Schwab Zabin for the Journal of Research on Adolescence found that: "in a sample of inner-city black teens presenting for pregnancy tests, we reported that more than 31 percent of those who elected to carry their pregnancy to term told us, before their pregnancy was diagnosed, that they believed a baby would present a problem..."
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
"In other words, 69 percent either did not believe having a baby out-of-wedlock would present a problem or were unsure.
Until teenage girls, particularly those living in relative poverty, can be made to see real consequences from pregnancy, it will be impossible to gain control over the problem of out-of- wedlock births. By disguising those consequences, welfare makes it easier for these girls to make the decisions that will lead to unwed motherhood."
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
"Current welfare policies seem to be designed with an appalling lack of concern for their impact on out-of-wedlock births. Indeed, Medicaid programs in 11 states actually provide infertility treatments to single women on welfare.(12) I should also point out that, once the child is born, welfare also appears to discourage the mother from marrying in the future."
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
"Research by Robert Hutchins of Cornell University shows that a 10 percent increase in AFDC benefits leads to an eight percent decrease in the marriage rate of single mothers.(13) As welfare contributes to the rise in out-of-wedlock births and single-parent families, it concomitantly contributes to the associated increase in criminal activity."
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
Young single women should be rewarded by society for continuing their education and becoming gainfully employed, OR for waiting to become pregnant until they are married and having their children in the context of a solid two-parent home environment.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
Single women who are pregnant out of wedlock should be offered free family planning services, free adoption services if they surrender the newborn child to be adoped by a two parent household, or free abortion services. Period. NO welfare payments for bringing fatherless children into the world.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
Government support for single mother welfare households only gets us criminal scum like Michael Vick. Society would be better off if his mother had had a free abortion. Political correctness and religious dogma notwithstanding... It's time to FACE THE TRUTH.
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
BACK UP YOUR LIBELOUS STATEMENT ABOUT RON PAUL, you nakedjackass. PROVE that Ron Paul is anti-semitic. I want FACTS, not empty accusations. Now be the MAN that you claim you are, and back up your accusations, nakedjackass.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Forcing a pregnant woman to go through pregnancy and childbirth against her will is fascistic and cruel. It NEVER works. Women who are pregnant against their will are desperate enough to get rid of it no matter what the rest of society thinks. Watch the movie "Vera Drake" - it depicts this fact very well. To grant a non-conscious xygote more rights than the living, breathing, mother is fascism.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
nakedjackass, you are the most ignorant, unimaginative debater I've EVER encountered on youtube - and THAT is saying something. All you can do is copy and paste MY comments about YOU and change your name to mine??? What an IDIOT! You fail to comprenend even ONE statement I've made here. My point about the starving, abused and needy is that we should be doing something about the people who are ALREADY BORN instead of trying to bring every possible xygote to life.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
You are either a shameless liar, or such a LOUSY reader that you actually fail to comprehend anything I've written!!! Get a reading tutor, you ignoramus!!! You look like a FOOL - and worse, you look like the insane, mysogynistic bigot you really ARE.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Did you REALLY misunderstand what I said about Terry Schiavo, or are you just afraid to address that moral dilemma, nakedjackass? Do you DISAGREE with all of the doctors who said that she had no consciousness, no self-awareness, and was nothing but a vegetable on life support?
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
They decided to "let her die" - but what they really did was starve her and allow her to dehydrate until her physical processes stopped. I learned recently that dehydration is a torturous way to die. I wouldn't put a pet dog or cat through such agony. If they thought she REALLY was just a vegetable, why not end her life mercifully? Did they allow her to slowly waste away BECAUSE they thought she was totally unaware of her own existence, and could feel nothing??????
WellGAWDdayaam 4 years ago
Hi, Janet! We meet again!
;)
YGYGYGYGYGYGYGYGYGYG 4 years ago
It was very bad, and difficult to watch, but I'd rather have the pitt bulls to attack each other rather than attack children. The less pitt bulls, the better IMHO.
YGYGYGYGYGYGYGYGYGYG 4 years ago
The username HurricaneHeidi is consistent with my own gender, and it does not imply disrespect for the opposite sex, unlike a man using the name: "nakedjanet".
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Another libelous LIE from nakedjackass! Ron Paul is NOT an anti-semite! Back up that libelous LIE, you nakedjackass!!!
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
nakedjackass completely misses my point about our need to address the needs of starving, abused and needy people who ARE ALREADY BORN. We do NOT need to force women to endure pregnancy against their will. Fertility clinics throw away unused extra xygotes every single day of the work week. Are THEY murderers???
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
nakedjanet LIES and MISQUOTES me AGAIN - commiting blatant libel on youtube. HE HAS THE READING COMPREHENSION of a newt, and the integrity of a drive-by shooter.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
nakedjanet is a shameless, perverted LIAR who falsely accuses me of advocating the murder of heterosexual men. What a pathetic, desperate, sick, person.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
nakedjanet is a shameless LIAR who resorts to misquoting me in his brainless attempt to win an argument using ad hominem attacks rather than logic. Answer the question, nakedjanet: Are fertility clinics commiting murder when THEY throw away unused xygotes, or NOT?
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
nakedjanet is a male chauvinist pig who chooses a user name which accurately reflects his attitude towards women - something naked for him to leer at and use at his discretion.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
It is you who are intolerant, nakedjanet - intolerant of any woman who wants the right to choose whether or not to be pregnant, and when to become a mother. Fertility centers throw away unused fertilized xygotes every day. Why don't you go picket one tomorrow? Call them murderers, too!
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Don't you DARE call me an anti-semite, or a liberal, or a feminazi, you shameless LIAR! I am NONE of those things. Abortion does not target jewish people or any other particular ethnic group. YOU ARE SICK. You apparently have no idea what an ad hominem attack IS. Look it up. Educate yourself.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Are your reading comprehension skills REALLY so lacking, nakedjanet? I pointed out that: "There are children and adults and animals ALREADY conscious and living in this world who are abused and/or suffering and/or starving... yet you would insist upon bringing even MORE human beings into this world before helping those already born???"
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
But YOU have the unmitigated GAUL to claim that I've advocated the murder of children and adults already living who are abused, suffering and/or starving??? Where in the HELL did YOU ever learn to READ???
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Traditional, 'god' centered religion is NOTORIOUSLY mysogynistic, paternalistic, and controlling of women. The wholly babble teaches that women should be stoned if they fornicate or commit adultery, and that homosexuals should be killed. Meanwhile, fertility clinics toss away extraneous xygotes every day. Is THAT murder???
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Religious fundamentalists always seem to become outraged against secular people who believe in individual rights and who recognize the lack of logic inherent in religion. I smell a male chauvinist. Why would a man choose to call himself "nakedjanet"? A man should not dictate a woman's rights. A man does not HAVE to carry a baby to term for 9 months, and then endure childbirth, and then find some way to feed the child.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
More ignorant LIES from nakedjanet. YOU are the ad hominem debater. YOU are the one who labels people who disagree with you rather than using logic or reason. I am NOT a liberal. I am a libertarian. I am also secular. I asked you a question about Terry Schiavo. I asked if you believed that she should have been kept alive in that vegetative state, during which she had no concept of her own existence, and no brain function.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Notice how nakedjanet puts words in my mouth? I want human beings to become the evolved creatures we have the potential to be - that means living in harmony with nature and other living beings - NOT abusing them because we feel privileged due to some deluded religious beliefs that supposedly grant us exclusive status as god's special creation.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Don't try that transparent tactic of playing the anti-semitism, genocide card on me, nakedjanet. A non-conscious xygote is not yet a person; it has no consciousness and no brain function. It is a potential human being; it is a developing biological process. Just how fundamentalist ARE you, anyway? Did you object to Intra Uterine Devices? They prevented the xygote from attaching to the uterine wall. Do you object to condoms? They prevent the sperm from finding the ovum.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
And you are a blatant LIAR, nakedjanet, when you accuse me of urging women to get abortions. I have said NO such thing. You are a LIAR! What I HAVE SAID is that no one should take away a woman's right to choose whether or not to continue a pregancy to term. Your rights end where mine begin. No one should have the right to assert their own rights over mine. That includes an unborn child occupying my body against my will.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
There are children and adults and animals ALREADY conscious and living in this world who are abused and/or suffering and/or starving... yet you would insist upon bringing even MORE human beings into this world before helping those already born??? Even against a pregnant woman's will???
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
You are both ignorant and arrogant when you claim that animals attach no meaning to pain and suffering. Anti-abortionists often point out that a late-term fetus exhibits conscious behaviors like thumb-sucking, and that it flinches when it is torn apart during a late term abortion. I agree, and I do not support late term abortions. A conscious, living animal exhibits AT LEAST that much response to suffering. In fact an animal exhibits conscious FEAR - something a fetus does not.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Animals demonstrate love and affection. They demonstrate loyalty. Animals have often deliberately protected and/or aided their human companions. Watch the program "Animal Miracles" on the Animal Planet channel.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
It is the human chauvinism taught by organized religion which has encouraged mankind to separate itself from the rest of nature, and to abuse other creatures, and to damage the eco-systems of this planet. Thinking you are "created in (some imaginary) 'god's' image" and believing that other beings have 'no soul' is what makes you religious people so uncompassionate toward other creatures.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
The value of the mother's life - the person who is ALREADY a conscious, sentient, being - overrides the rights of the undeveloped, non-conscious fetus. Every sperm thrown away in a used condom is a potential xygote... and a sperm exhibits more conscious 'awareness' than a xygote does - mysteriously finding its way to the ovum. I submit that once you use the 'potential' child argument, you have trouble drawing the line.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
I ACCURATELY describe an early term fetus as a non-conscious bundle of dividing cells. Many PEOPLE who cannot survive on their own are ALREADY conscious, sentient beings... but some are not. Do you think that Terry Schiavo should have been kept "alive" indefinitely? Do you think she should have been starved and dehydrated to death the way they allowed her to die?
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
You are an ad hominem debater who resorts to personal attacks when he is unable to support his position with logic.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
I notice from your profile that you are male. Obviously, you will never face the kinds of situations that females who are accidentally or unwittingly pregnant often face. Animals are living, sentient beings, already born, that feel pain and suffering. An early term fetus is not. I do not support abortion of a late-term, already sentient fetus.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
A fetus is not yet a "child"; a xygote is not yet a "child". It is not conscious, it is not a sentient being. It is a potential child.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
I am not a "pro-abortionist" because I do not champion abortion per se. What I DO stand for is prioritizing the rights of the pregnant female (often not even technically a grown woman) who is faced with a pregnancy which can damage her personal life, her health, or her circumstances. SHE is the sentient being, NOT her fetus.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
I am pro life. Read what I said. I agree with you. What I am saying is that this will fall on deaf ears, however true that it is. According to the far left, humans are the problem always. They have no logic, you do. However, what Vick did was horrific and he should be 'tarred and feathered' as far as I am concerned. I have heard similiar Conservative voices say the same thing for a week now. All valid. But on this issue they will not see it; unfortunately.
Regards,
A pro life Conservative
RachTrinity 4 years ago
I support the right of a pregnant woman to chose not to undergo pregnancy and childbirth against her will. That is NOT support for murdering children. It is support for the pregnant woman. A first trimester fetus is not a conscious being, or a sentient being - but a living animal IS.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Anti abortionists have no compassion for the woman who becomes pregnant against her will.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
A living animal is a sentient being, already born, and capable of experiencing pain and suffering. A first trimester fetus in utero is not. A pregnant woman is also capable of suffering... and is often driven to desperate measures to end a pregnancy which, for whatever reason, is a traumatic circumstance for her.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Forcing a woman to carry a fetus to term is a violation of that woman's individual rights. The rights of the fetus should not trump the rights of the mother. Once the fetus could survive outside the mother's womb, I think it deserves to be nurtured and put up for adoption... but until it becomes a sentient being, it is a non-conscious bundle of dividing cells.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
Those dogs were sentient beings that were forced to suffer by a collection of depraved human scum - without whom society would be better off. The odds are 7 to 3 that Michael Vick was an illegitimate child raised by a single mother in some ghetto. Too bad she couldn't have used birth control.
HurricaneHeidi 4 years ago
nakedjanet: do you do press for Lores? you're certainly an adoring and devoted fan. Lores helping to sort it all out for the middle grounders, huh? except she's telling people PETA is putting out hits on M.Vick, not the most reliable info doncha think?
Phidian 4 years ago
Precisely, it's up to me, like it's up to you what you advocate for, difference is, I'm not being judgmental and self righteous in telling people who or what they should advocate for, I've taken in a black girl who had no home, and do numerous volunteer positions, who are you to judge me anyway?
Phidian 4 years ago
While your logic is 'politically' expedient, it will lose effect with libs. Michael Vick was evil in his treatment of those precious dogs and I have to think that God has a special hell for those that do these things to HIS creations. Remember with libs, humans are the problem, always. That is why this will fall on deaf ears.
RachTrinity 4 years ago
Where did I say she said being cruel to animals was a good thing to do?
Phidian 4 years ago
anyone is "allowed" to do anything they want to do, I just don't see the sense of someone who is in a highly powerful group, the pro-lifers (helped elect an American president) begrudge people who are trying to help animals, she can do what she wants, but she should check her facts and not spread lies about PETA being Tony Soprano, ridiculous.
Phidian 4 years ago
if youre in an argument for pro-life, and you complain that pro-abortion is arguing with you (this is your cause and YOUR argument to make) so you think it's justified that you come to a animals rights argument and espouse your views on abortion? does that make sense to anybody but you? fight and win/lose your own arguments where they pertain and have relevance. I'm not advocating for animals rights on pro/against abortion sites.
Phidian 4 years ago
I applaud your compassion for you stand on abortion. It's just that my compassion is of a different sort. I guess that's what make's the world go round and "God work's together for all good!" So you do your Right to Life and I'll do the Animal cruelty! Together we can make the World a Better Place to Live! God Bless
rustygaver 4 years ago
rusty, i could not agree more. we can all do our part--including supporting that which is good about what we do (as i support peta's work to protect animals from this kind of evil). God bless you too!
loresrizkalla 4 years ago
Please, how many times do I have to say I don't "value" animals more then human beings? This is your platform, and you don't seem to be letting anything else in, which makes it very hard to reason with you.
Phidian 4 years ago
Well, since youre sitting on the right hand of God, you'd be the one to judge what my moral values are right? I'm so honored to send type to the one who talks for God...please, come down from you exalted place and quit judging, then reason can come into play
Phidian 4 years ago
That's wonderful that I'm talking to someone who has a private line to God, you and Jerry Falwell have much in common, btw, while youre speaking to him next, ask him if he can do a little something about all these wars and such okay? and tell him hi for me. What arrogance.
Phidian 4 years ago
I only have two hands, most of do in fact, even with all we do, we can only make a little dent in terms of animals rights, we all gravitate to what we can do best..I don't judge where you put all your efforts, why on earth would you judge me for helping animals? Pro-life has much, much, much more power in this society then animals rights, yet you seem to want all the power and all the contributions...and let the animals fall by the wayside, not very "spiritual" to me.
Phidian 4 years ago