Firstly we shouldn't be employing the tactics of the enemy in anything we do. In many cases we can have fellowship despite differences. However, if someone has been taught or is teaching a doctrine that contradicts the core tenants of the faith we have a problem, if they teach salvation by works or the existence of carnal christians we can not have fellowship. Because what they are teaching isn't the gospel.
Too bad that isn't a true statement- war does nothing but kill people - short term you might think you see a benefit - but its never lasting - and never good. All it does is build generational resentment and further hostilities in one shape or another...
You stated "war does nothing but kill people - short term you might think you see a benefit - but its never lasting - and never good. All it does is build generational resentment and further hostilities in one shape or another"
How are relations between America and Japan, Germany,Italy,or even England I doubt there is a war between theese Countries brewing because of past wars!
Once again - you are wrong none - I said 'it makes no difference to ME' - Jesus is the one it makes a difference to - my hope is to help everyone in Him be united in Him - He defines who is in Him in the end.
How can it - since I can't see THEIR HEARTS - you really don't get what I am saying - ONLY GOD KNOWS THEIR HEARTS - I can't assume I know enough about a man to judge him - thats up to GOD>
Several times you say "you people" "dont like that" " you don't want that" "you want to hate" "get over it "get real,man" are you not judging others? Theese are words of rebuke not love
None - actually - they are rooted in love - though I should've been kinder - never-the-less - I see people who have forgotten the love and I have tried to explain it and gotten frustrated - so I explained it more sharply - but its still only for the point that I am praying they find what He has asked us to be - not what they want to be in Him...
Several times you say "you people" "dont like that" " you don't want that" "you want to hate" "get over it "get real,man" are you not judging others? Are you not saying God gave me a message now belive it !
None - yes. I am using scripture to say hey - this is wrong. This is exposing a falsehood against truth. Not once have you bothered to addressed any of the scripture I presented - instead - you did as I said you would - you try to disprove what I shared with Paul's letters - but you aren't hearing what he said - just what you interpret - Yes - God gave it to me - and if no one believes - then oh well - its between them and God.
I did adress the scripture you presented(you know as much because you new Paul said other things on this matter that would not fit your message that is why you gave it as an answer people would give that is simple debatetactics)I know what he said because I am told in scripture 2Timothy 3,16
All scripture is given by inspiration of God,and is profitable for doctrine,for reproof for correction,for instruction in righteousness(Because you can pick scripture out of context if not read as a whole)
I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
John 4 Christ says Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest. And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together. And herein is that saying true, One soweth, and another reapeth. I sent you to reap that whereon ye bestowed no labour: other men laboured, and ye are entered into their labours.
You ask how do you interpret Matthew 13:24-30? Matthew 13
Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn
1 Corinthians 6 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
1 Cor 6 refers to Christians judging civil matters among themselves as opposed to going to a secular court - are you seriously trying to say you are a reaper in accordance to this passage? Dear brother, are you mad?
Continue reading Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
Aye - I read it - but that is not talking about reapers - you are truly distorting this - or I am misunderstanding you. If you are a reaper - then you are to bundling weeds and burning them? Is that your justification?
John 4 Christ says Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest. And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together. That is simple answer to one question. If you can try not to mix them as that is also a debate trick on the unlearned
You should heed the words of Christ and not your own understanding - He actually explained the Matthew 13:24-30 later in the chapter (vs36-43) - and the ANGELS are the reapers. YOU, bro, have been exposed rebuked and corrected.
John 4 Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look on the fields, that they are white for harvest. Already he who reaps is receiving wages and is gathering fruit for life eternal ( How do ANGELS recive wages and reap fruit for life eternal ) As I said you need read more than one Scripture Mabye you "have been exposed rebuked and corrected"
Then he said to his disciples, "The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few.
The harvest John refers to is that of the lost souls waiting being won over into eternal life. The harvest in the parable of Matthew 13 refers to the end of this world. I hope this helps you.
You said if someone is following a false doctrine you see a weak Christian, Paul says
Romans 8
"But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."
Ephesians 4'6
One Lord, one faith, one baptism
1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
Paul rebuked Peter for mostly "peer pressure" Because when he was with the gentiles he ate and lived as they but When certian men came from James he went back to Jewish customs when they we're around A large diffrence between Saying " when I see a brother following a false doctrine he is just a weak Christian" Rember For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
none - so we abandon the weaker - those who have not endured sound doctrine - and declare them hell-bound? We decide - they are weeds needing to be pulled from the wheat - opposing Jesus's teachings? I don't think so.
If you are in a false doctrine you are not a weak Christian They are false
2 John 1:9-11
Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
ahhh - the KJV - the NASB is much more clear here; 9 Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house, and do not give him a greeting;for the one who gives him a greeting participates in his evil deeds.
no no - not semantics - what I am saying is this; Lets say you are right in your support of 'just wars' - does that mean I am not saved because I believe God opposes us favoring war?
none - but mine is NOT opinion - I oppose war and violence based on the words and actions of Jesus and the Apostles - no one - NOT ONE PERSON can dispute this. They all look to the OT - which is the Old Covenant - and refuse to acknowledge the truth of the New. I am not inventing doctrine - I am standing in the words and actions of the NT.
I dispute it Whe're did Christ say it is wrong to defend yourself or others does not the New Testament teach For the authorities are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you like to live without being afraid of the authorities? Then do what is right, and you will receive their approval.For they are God's servants working for your good.
But if you do what is wrong, you should be afraid, for it is not without reason that they bear the sword.
try turn the other cheek - our struggle is not against flesh and blood - endure hardships like a good soldier in Christ - try historical fact that we suffered for God as Christians - not killed for Him - try the fact that there was no such thing as Christians fighting physically until Constantine... this will all be in the video...
You said endure hardships like a good soldier in Christ -
2 Timothy 2
Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ. No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier. (You shoul read more than your point)
What are you talking about - again - you don't understand that verse 4 strengthens my point! We are to please Him - that is God - who calls us to PEACE.
You say try turn the other cheek Crist also said Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it,and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one"
keep reading - 36He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. 37It is written: 'And he was numbered with the transgressors; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment." The swords were so He could be counted among transgressors - notice where Jesus said that - right after He calls them to get swords - and before they say they have two. Also - two
Also - two is enough for 12? And does the New Testament EVER record the Apostles using swords outside of PETER CUTTING OFF THE EAR (Which he was rebuked for as well)? NO. You ignore the whole body of truth in order to try to twist this single passage - and its SICK.
You said ." The swords were so He could be counted among transgressors - That is not why he was arrested it was never metioned at his trial He was arrested by the high priests and taken to the Romans And it was not illegeal at that time for Jews to carry a sword. He was numbered among the trasgressors when he was crucified between them
t was a transgression until Peter used the sword - this had nothing to do with having one but what Peter did with it. Also - you never answered how was TWO enough for twelve? And when did the Apostles use the sword to defend themselves after this?
Why do you keep asking questions and avoiding answering them - the trial was not the transgression - I mistyped there - it (Peter having a sword) was NOT a transgression UNTIL he used it in assault - and he wasn't arrested because Jesus healed the victim...
You just do not like my answer I did not say the trial was whe're he ws numbered among the transgressors I said the Cross whe're he was crucified between two. They we're their to arrest him before Peter did anything
Matthew 26
And Jesus said unto him, Friend, wherefore art thou come? Then came they,and laid hands on Jesus and took him. And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear
None - just stop - you have no credibility here. They were seeking to arrest Him because they feared Him, His authority, His influence over the people - and the fact that He was the Son of God... Peter transgressed through the assault - and thus Jesus was counted among the transgressors - the two criminals at the cross were also transgressors - but Peter was the first.
at this point - you aren't arguing against me but against the Gospel of Luke - as I said - JESUS said get swords - then spoke of being counted with transgressors - and then said two were enough - ask HIM if you doubt it - also - YOU STILL HAVENT ANSWERED HOW TWO WERE ENOUGH
You don't even understand scripture as testified by your claim to be a reaper as mentioned in the parable of wheat and weeds when the reapers were declared to be angels by Jesus.
I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest. 36 And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.
How do Angels "gathereth fruit unto life eternal" The're are eternal
My credibility is fine You answered They were seeking to arrest Him because they feared Him, His authority, His influence over the people - and the fact that He was the Son of God...It had nothing to do with Peters act of cutting off the ear of a slave of the high priest!
If Peter transgressed through the assult why did Christ not rebuke him as he had before for his actions?
its all here - you were clearly trying to say you were a reaper based on scriptures you posted. When I asked you directly you noted that we are to judge angels (?) - and posted scriptures trying to build your false argument. It was as if you didn't even realize Jesus declared the angels to be the reapers. You can respin it any way you like - your refusal to accept correction and admit error is what really exposes you - not the error itself.
So if someone is raping a woman or trying to murder someone for means of robery or just their own evil amusement you would say accept it do not fight back. So in your view we should disband all law enforcement and millitary and let people do as they will and suffer quietly that is what God wants?
Thats not what I am saying - what I am saying is WE as in Christians have choices - we can run (as Paul did when fleeing from a city seeking his life) or we can allow ourselves to die. The law is governed for the good of the people - but WE as Christians are not called to do anything but follow Him - even if it means suffering as an example of His great mercy.
Sure there are - this is the point I am making though - I believe it is an error for a Christian to be in a position where they may need to kill - but they are STILL CHRISTIANS. We all fall short of the Glory of God... and there is only one sin I know of that causes true death - blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
You see killing as a sin true so according to Paul
What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? So they should quit or leave so they will not be willfully sinning!
Also it says suffer for his sake not just so we can prove how holly we are Paul was fleeing because they sought to kill him for preaching Christ enterily diffrent and does not compare
they do compare - because there were only three actions demonstrated by Christians under persecution in the NT- flee - be imprisoned - or die. Notice FIGHT is not one of the three - and that isn't my OPINION - its fact - and YOU KNOW IT - but you are stiff necked and refuse to acknowledge this.
I am correct Paul was fleeing because they sought to kill him for preaching Christ enterily diffrent and does not compare How does that compare to tell someone if someone wishes to kill you just for evil reasons let them
they sought to kill Paul - someone wishes to kill you - the motivation of the killer is irrelevant - the response of the one who is the target is everything - flee or die - those are the two choices given by the New Testament, and YOU KNOW IT.
It doesn't say it in a single verse- it says it in how we see the actions drawn out - Christians either fleed, allowed themselves to be arrested and imprisoned - or they died - NO WHERE DID THEY EVER FIGHT.
By the by I know no such thing! I Know being a soldier to protect others is a honor to help thoose who need help and protection God would agree we are to help thoose in need of protection I assume you know no such thing
Yes in Afrika the only way people get food in villiages or refugee camps is under guard of armed men many whoom have given their lives to do so. As I said you would not understand safe in surbia U.S.
a soldier for Christ doesn't kill - let me quote your page - "Christians are to promote peace whenever possible. But they must not be afraid to resort to the use of arms when it is called for. Evil must not be allowed to remain unchecked." Please - back this up with scripture.
This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. 13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. 1
I love when people like you use this verse - FIRST - it doesn't say take a life for his friends - it says lay down his life - such as Jesus laid down His life for US - not killing in the name of Jesus - but dying in His name.
Yet it was always with the recognition that peace is the goal to be worked for. Peace is the goal, but when it cannot be achieved without force, force must be used.
You can never have peace with blood on your hands. Violence begets violence. In our modern era, Ghandi achieved liberation and peace for an entire country with out force - yet all the blood shed and people in Africa are still killing for peace.
So since it has not yet been accomplished means it is wrong to try?
Imagiane if we applied that thought to everything nothing ever happens!
By the by most of the local tribes are killing for power or just the fact someone belongs to a diffrent one you should go someday. Mabye you will learn something
India is NOT perfect - but it is free of the English rule - and that was accomplished by peaceful demonstrations - not violence. Are you denying what Ghandi accomplished to?
Look into 1919 Parliament passed the Government of india Act which was designed to organize provincial governments in india. Both major parties of the british National Government were committed to giving more autonomy to the eleven Indian Provinces through the 1935 Government of india Act.
So Ghandi and his peaceful movement has nothing to do with their independence in your opinion. Ghandi didn't obtain MORE autonomy - he obtained independence.
Even though Ghandi was a peaceful man, if he left this world rejecting Jesus Christ he will still suffer the same fate as all others who reject Jesus Christ.
I dunno - if I had to pick I think I'd like to be like John too - but I can say I have been told I am like Paul alot... particularly by people who really know me like my wife. I am told I am much harsher in writing than face to face... but that I am a marshmallow in person. :)
You said I wasn't claiming Ghandi saved - I was claiming he used PEACE to achieve results something WAR simply doesn't accomplish. So then WW2 was a waste and acomplished nothing
hahaha - still denying Ghandi;s methods worked - and now you're trying to deflect it with WW2 garbage. All WW2 did was make more war - as in the Cold War... and all the battles within that little game.
It really shows a lack of charater to call the WW2 and the Cold war a a GAME I am sure our Jewish brothers don't see WW2 that way or the countries that we're freed when the Berlin wall fell. I really have pity for one who would mwak such a crass comment
Thats all war ever is - a game - but for the record - I didn't call ww2 a game - I called the Cold War a game - and all the battles within it - you see these wars as a battle between good and evil - I see these wars as evil vs evil - conning the good to fight their battles - one way or the other - people are killed - He who lives by the sword dies by the sword...
No - WW2 was more of man's garbage though started by Hitler thats no better... and why do you assume communism is any better than capitalism - neither side favors God - you're arguing for the lesser of two evils - but they are still evil.
WW2 was NOT fought to stop the holocaust - it was fought because of Hitler invading other countries - and for the US - because Japan bombed Pearl Harbor - what a twist of history -your question based on a false premise I think. Additionally - communism isn't perfect - but its no worse for Christians than Capitalism has been.
1) Jesus teaches turn the other cheek - if I had been President - I would've... did America turn the other cheek?
2) I say you are blind to the corrupted version of the Gospel spread in the West and you ignore the attacks on a human spirit in the capitalist way of life.
You say: I say you are blind to the corrupted version of the Gospel spread in the West and you ignore the attacks on a human spirit in the capitalist way of life.
I say you have never set foot in a communist country and made an attempt to spread the Gospel! You have a sanitized american version of The Gospels. Most americans I know who feel their Goverment is so wrong have never lived or experinced another country or culture. And will not they are safe in there.
You're right - never been in a communist country and never spread the Gospel there - and I agree there is a sanitized Gospel in the West - but the word 'sanitized' should be substituted for 'watered down' or 'corrupted'. One such corruptions is the notion of 'Just War' - which wasn't Jesus' teaching - but in fact Augustine of Hippo's (5th century AD). This is a corruption I believe you share with the West and America that you've so dutifully pointed out.
Ist you need a working definition "Capitalism is an economic system in which wealth, and the means of producing wealth, are privately owned and controlled rather than publicly or state-owned and controlled"
Ahh -0 the cleaned up version of the definition - which is also anti-Christ... producing wealth privately owned and controlled... NOTHING is OURS - its ALL God's - do you deny this?
Ghandi-while not being a Christian - read and loved the New Testament and the teachings of Christ - and he proved that peace works - why should I not turn to one of the few examples of someone actually giving peace a chance?
I just find it intersting the only example you could find was a Hindu, AS TO HE READ AND LOVED THE NEW TESTAMENT;
"Hinduism as I know it entirely satisfies my soul, fills my whole being...When doubts haunt me, when disappointments stare me in the face, and when I see not one ray of light on the horizon, I turn to the Bhagavad Gita, and find a verse to comfort me"- Gandhi
This is aparent when one recognizes that Scripture is inspired by God (2 Tim. 3:16). This means that the Old Testament is just as inspired as the New Testament and thus an expression of the will of Christ.
The Old Testament acknowledges that there is "a time to kill" (Eccles. 3:3). At various times in the Old Testament, God commanded the Israelites to defend their nation by force of arms.
You asked Those in need of protection? How fast you are to hide behind that. I wonder - do you support feeding those who are hungry just as vigorously? I suppose you did not like my answer what have you done to get food to starving people
I have donated money - I have given food - I have volunteered - I do what I can as the Lord gives opportunity - and STILL - you answered nothing - lol.
I answered you did not want to here If you serve God you do it when needed not "what I can as the Lord gives opportunity" There is alaways oprotuinty and need
aye - there are always opportunities - but I can't be in all places at all times - and neither can you - thats why it should be a group effort from the entire body of Christ.
I can say that because the fight is God's - we are not called to fight it - we are called to trust HIM - have faith that HE will avenge the wrongs - the WRATH is HIS alone
Christ spoke of suffering for his sake> are you saying people who suffer at the hands of evil people who murder, rape, enslave, or steal are suffering for Christ sake and should accept their fate.
Yep - thats exactly what I am saying - because THIS WORLD AIN'T nothing compared to the next - those who suffer for His sake HERE will be rewarded by God for that suffering -
Lost his life for MY SAKE WILL FIND IT suffer for HIS SAKE Can you say fighting for a right cause might not be for his sake. And how is random violence his sake?
You said those who suffer for His sake HERE will be rewarded by God.
So if someone is raping a woman or trying to murder someone for means of robery or just their own evil amusement you would say accept it do not fight back. So in your view we should disband all law enforcement and millitary and let people do as they will and suffer quietly that is what God wants?
Thats not what I am saying - what I am saying is WE as in Christians have choices - we can run (as Paul did when fleeing from a city seeking his life) or we can allow ourselves to die. The law is governed for the good of the people - but WE as Christians are not called to do anything but follow Him - even if it means suffering as an example of His great mercy.
Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake; 30 Having the same conflict which ye saw in me, and now hear to be in me. ( He was speaking to the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi.
Um - so when Peter, Paul, and the other Apostles were martyred - they actually fought for their lives instead of what Christian history says - which is they died praying for their enemies? Did Stephen fight for his life? Did Jesus? Hmmmm - you are lacking in any substance in this.
They died as marters for their preaching of Christ Again I ask you Suffering for Christ yes suffering simply because someone wants to do you harm Ex. Murder ,Rape is this suffering for " Christs sake"
They died as martyrs? No kidding - so why didn't they fight? Why didn't their followers fight for them? Why didn't their followers fight for themselves? YOU know the answer but refuse it because it means we should NOT be fighting in the flesh. Period.
When you CHOSE to fight and lose your life - you GIVE your life - you are twisting the scriptures just as you did with the Mt 13 parable and have no credibility with it now. Sorry.
He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it."
Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a mans enemies will be the members of his household.
i really liked this, great points!
bmjesus08 2 years ago
AMEN AND AMEN BROTHER!
RebeccaMichael7 2 years ago
I agree with you to an extent, but not in full.
Firstly we shouldn't be employing the tactics of the enemy in anything we do. In many cases we can have fellowship despite differences. However, if someone has been taught or is teaching a doctrine that contradicts the core tenants of the faith we have a problem, if they teach salvation by works or the existence of carnal christians we can not have fellowship. Because what they are teaching isn't the gospel.
Rhuanjl 2 years ago
Men will wrangle for religion; write for it; fight for it; die for
it; anything but live for it.
..........Charles Caleb Colton
KasparHauser4 3 years ago
TO: KasparHauser4 War kills men, and men deplore the loss; but war also crushes bad principles and tyrants, and so saves societies.
Charles Caleb Colton
NONE654258 3 years ago
Too bad that isn't a true statement- war does nothing but kill people - short term you might think you see a benefit - but its never lasting - and never good. All it does is build generational resentment and further hostilities in one shape or another...
christoferL 3 years ago
You stated "war does nothing but kill people - short term you might think you see a benefit - but its never lasting - and never good. All it does is build generational resentment and further hostilities in one shape or another"
How are relations between America and Japan, Germany,Italy,or even England I doubt there is a war between theese Countries brewing because of past wars!
NONE654258 3 years ago
War is fought on many fronts - one of which is economics - think BIG PICTURE...
christoferL 3 years ago
You are so right about this. I agree 100%. There is no love in condemnation and accusation.
HisEyesHisHeart 3 years ago
Cris you made a statment
"it makes no difference to me - believe what you will - so long as you believe Jesus is your savior - everything else is debatable in my estimation."
But as well you made the statement
Jesus said 'either they are with us or against us' - and the path is narrow
Theese statements are in contridaction to each other!
NONE654258 3 years ago
Once again - you are wrong none - I said 'it makes no difference to ME' - Jesus is the one it makes a difference to - my hope is to help everyone in Him be united in Him - He defines who is in Him in the end.
christoferL 3 years ago
You said I said 'it makes no difference to ME' - Jesus is the one it makes a difference to.
If you follow him it should make a diffrence to you as well.
NONE654258 3 years ago
How can it - since I can't see THEIR HEARTS - you really don't get what I am saying - ONLY GOD KNOWS THEIR HEARTS - I can't assume I know enough about a man to judge him - thats up to GOD>
christoferL 3 years ago
Several times you say "you people" "dont like that" " you don't want that" "you want to hate" "get over it "get real,man" are you not judging others? Theese are words of rebuke not love
NONE654258 3 years ago
None - actually - they are rooted in love - though I should've been kinder - never-the-less - I see people who have forgotten the love and I have tried to explain it and gotten frustrated - so I explained it more sharply - but its still only for the point that I am praying they find what He has asked us to be - not what they want to be in Him...
christoferL 3 years ago
Another excellent message, bro. Your heart for Christ is evident here. God bless you.
linkzoo 3 years ago
Mark 16v16 he that believeth and is baptized is saved, but he that believeth not is damned.
that's all it takes for salvation.
hsleepy97 3 years ago
Several times you say "you people" "dont like that" " you don't want that" "you want to hate" "get over it "get real,man" are you not judging others? Are you not saying God gave me a message now belive it !
NONE654258 3 years ago
None - yes. I am using scripture to say hey - this is wrong. This is exposing a falsehood against truth. Not once have you bothered to addressed any of the scripture I presented - instead - you did as I said you would - you try to disprove what I shared with Paul's letters - but you aren't hearing what he said - just what you interpret - Yes - God gave it to me - and if no one believes - then oh well - its between them and God.
christoferL 3 years ago
I did adress the scripture you presented(you know as much because you new Paul said other things on this matter that would not fit your message that is why you gave it as an answer people would give that is simple debatetactics)I know what he said because I am told in scripture 2Timothy 3,16
All scripture is given by inspiration of God,and is profitable for doctrine,for reproof for correction,for instruction in righteousness(Because you can pick scripture out of context if not read as a whole)
NONE654258 3 years ago
Have you really? Lets break it down then - how do you interpret Matthew 13:24-30? How does that relate to us today?
christoferL 3 years ago
Revelation 2
I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
NONE654258 3 years ago
John 4 Christ says Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest. And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together. And herein is that saying true, One soweth, and another reapeth. I sent you to reap that whereon ye bestowed no labour: other men laboured, and ye are entered into their labours.
NONE654258 3 years ago
You ask how do you interpret Matthew 13:24-30? Matthew 13
Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn
NONE654258 3 years ago
So you believe that you are a reaper?
christoferL 3 years ago
1 Corinthians 6 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
NONE654258 3 years ago
1 Cor 6 refers to Christians judging civil matters among themselves as opposed to going to a secular court - are you seriously trying to say you are a reaper in accordance to this passage? Dear brother, are you mad?
christoferL 3 years ago
Continue reading Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
NONE654258 3 years ago
Aye - I read it - but that is not talking about reapers - you are truly distorting this - or I am misunderstanding you. If you are a reaper - then you are to bundling weeds and burning them? Is that your justification?
christoferL 3 years ago
John 4 Christ says Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest. And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together. That is simple answer to one question. If you can try not to mix them as that is also a debate trick on the unlearned
NONE654258 3 years ago
You should heed the words of Christ and not your own understanding - He actually explained the Matthew 13:24-30 later in the chapter (vs36-43) - and the ANGELS are the reapers. YOU, bro, have been exposed rebuked and corrected.
christoferL 3 years ago
John 4 Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes and look on the fields, that they are white for harvest. Already he who reaps is receiving wages and is gathering fruit for life eternal ( How do ANGELS recive wages and reap fruit for life eternal ) As I said you need read more than one Scripture Mabye you "have been exposed rebuked and corrected"
NONE654258 3 years ago
You are speaking of TWO different harvests - lest you claim there is a contradiction between John and Jesus.
Matthew 9:37
Then he said to his disciples, "The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few.
The harvest John refers to is that of the lost souls waiting being won over into eternal life. The harvest in the parable of Matthew 13 refers to the end of this world. I hope this helps you.
christoferL 3 years ago
You said if someone is following a false doctrine you see a weak Christian, Paul says
Romans 8
"But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."
Ephesians 4'6
One Lord, one faith, one baptism
1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
NONE654258 3 years ago
none - please see the passages referring to how Paul rebuked Peter - that is how we should rebuke brothers.
christoferL 3 years ago
Paul rebuked Peter for mostly "peer pressure" Because when he was with the gentiles he ate and lived as they but When certian men came from James he went back to Jewish customs when they we're around A large diffrence between Saying " when I see a brother following a false doctrine he is just a weak Christian" Rember For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
NONE654258 3 years ago
none - so we abandon the weaker - those who have not endured sound doctrine - and declare them hell-bound? We decide - they are weeds needing to be pulled from the wheat - opposing Jesus's teachings? I don't think so.
christoferL 3 years ago
If you are in a false doctrine you are not a weak Christian They are false
2 John 1:9-11
Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
NONE654258 3 years ago
ahhh - the KJV - the NASB is much more clear here; 9 Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house, and do not give him a greeting;for the one who gives him a greeting participates in his evil deeds.
christoferL 3 years ago
Semantics You can look to many interpitations to prove any point so you found one more clear to your point of view you think:
Transgress "παραβαίνετε"
to go contrary "a fact or condition incompatible with another" Violate a command
NONE654258 3 years ago
no no - not semantics - what I am saying is this; Lets say you are right in your support of 'just wars' - does that mean I am not saved because I believe God opposes us favoring war?
christoferL 3 years ago
It means it is your opinion not doctrine.
NONE654258 3 years ago
none - but mine is NOT opinion - I oppose war and violence based on the words and actions of Jesus and the Apostles - no one - NOT ONE PERSON can dispute this. They all look to the OT - which is the Old Covenant - and refuse to acknowledge the truth of the New. I am not inventing doctrine - I am standing in the words and actions of the NT.
christoferL 3 years ago
I dispute it Whe're did Christ say it is wrong to defend yourself or others does not the New Testament teach For the authorities are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you like to live without being afraid of the authorities? Then do what is right, and you will receive their approval.For they are God's servants working for your good.
But if you do what is wrong, you should be afraid, for it is not without reason that they bear the sword.
NONE654258 3 years ago
try turn the other cheek - our struggle is not against flesh and blood - endure hardships like a good soldier in Christ - try historical fact that we suffered for God as Christians - not killed for Him - try the fact that there was no such thing as Christians fighting physically until Constantine... this will all be in the video...
christoferL 3 years ago
You said endure hardships like a good soldier in Christ -
2 Timothy 2
Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ. No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier. (You shoul read more than your point)
NONE654258 3 years ago
What are you talking about - again - you don't understand that verse 4 strengthens my point! We are to please Him - that is God - who calls us to PEACE.
christoferL 3 years ago
A little more specific if you will
NONE654258 3 years ago
What I am talking about is answering your points
NONE654258 3 years ago
You say try turn the other cheek Crist also said Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it,and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one"
NONE654258 3 years ago
keep reading - 36He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. 37It is written: 'And he was numbered with the transgressors; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment." The swords were so He could be counted among transgressors - notice where Jesus said that - right after He calls them to get swords - and before they say they have two. Also - two
christoferL 3 years ago
Also - two is enough for 12? And does the New Testament EVER record the Apostles using swords outside of PETER CUTTING OFF THE EAR (Which he was rebuked for as well)? NO. You ignore the whole body of truth in order to try to twist this single passage - and its SICK.
christoferL 3 years ago
Peter was rebuked not for defending Christ but that Christ did not want them to protect him as it was his destiny to go to the Cross for humanity
NONE654258 3 years ago
You said ." The swords were so He could be counted among transgressors - That is not why he was arrested it was never metioned at his trial He was arrested by the high priests and taken to the Romans And it was not illegeal at that time for Jews to carry a sword. He was numbered among the trasgressors when he was crucified between them
NONE654258 3 years ago
t was a transgression until Peter used the sword - this had nothing to do with having one but what Peter did with it. Also - you never answered how was TWO enough for twelve? And when did the Apostles use the sword to defend themselves after this?
christoferL 3 years ago
Where in Scripture or history or the arrest and trial of Christ was this said to be a transgression and why was not Peter arrested.
NONE654258 3 years ago
Why do you keep asking questions and avoiding answering them - the trial was not the transgression - I mistyped there - it (Peter having a sword) was NOT a transgression UNTIL he used it in assault - and he wasn't arrested because Jesus healed the victim...
christoferL 3 years ago
You just do not like my answer I did not say the trial was whe're he ws numbered among the transgressors I said the Cross whe're he was crucified between two. They we're their to arrest him before Peter did anything
Matthew 26
And Jesus said unto him, Friend, wherefore art thou come? Then came they,and laid hands on Jesus and took him. And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear
NONE654258 3 years ago
None - just stop - you have no credibility here. They were seeking to arrest Him because they feared Him, His authority, His influence over the people - and the fact that He was the Son of God... Peter transgressed through the assault - and thus Jesus was counted among the transgressors - the two criminals at the cross were also transgressors - but Peter was the first.
christoferL 3 years ago
at this point - you aren't arguing against me but against the Gospel of Luke - as I said - JESUS said get swords - then spoke of being counted with transgressors - and then said two were enough - ask HIM if you doubt it - also - YOU STILL HAVENT ANSWERED HOW TWO WERE ENOUGH
christoferL 3 years ago
I am not argueing aginst the Scripture only your interpritation I have given other Scripture to show you go back to your interpitation of one.
NONE654258 3 years ago
You don't even understand scripture as testified by your claim to be a reaper as mentioned in the parable of wheat and weeds when the reapers were declared to be angels by Jesus.
christoferL 3 years ago
John 4
I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest. 36 And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.
How do Angels "gathereth fruit unto life eternal" The're are eternal
NONE654258 3 years ago
My credibility is fine You answered They were seeking to arrest Him because they feared Him, His authority, His influence over the people - and the fact that He was the Son of God...It had nothing to do with Peters act of cutting off the ear of a slave of the high priest!
If Peter transgressed through the assult why did Christ not rebuke him as he had before for his actions?
NONE654258 3 years ago
Your credibility was lost when you claimed to be a reaper when Jesus declared the reapers to be angels.
christoferL 3 years ago
I was giving scripture of witch I gave others Did I ever claim to be a reaper or did you just contrive it to discredit my point
NONE654258 3 years ago
its all here - you were clearly trying to say you were a reaper based on scriptures you posted. When I asked you directly you noted that we are to judge angels (?) - and posted scriptures trying to build your false argument. It was as if you didn't even realize Jesus declared the angels to be the reapers. You can respin it any way you like - your refusal to accept correction and admit error is what really exposes you - not the error itself.
christoferL 3 years ago
Will you if you can answer my question:
So if someone is raping a woman or trying to murder someone for means of robery or just their own evil amusement you would say accept it do not fight back. So in your view we should disband all law enforcement and millitary and let people do as they will and suffer quietly that is what God wants?
NONE654258 3 years ago
Thats not what I am saying - what I am saying is WE as in Christians have choices - we can run (as Paul did when fleeing from a city seeking his life) or we can allow ourselves to die. The law is governed for the good of the people - but WE as Christians are not called to do anything but follow Him - even if it means suffering as an example of His great mercy.
christoferL 3 years ago
So their are no Christians in the millitary or law enforcement as they are required to kill at times
NONE654258 3 years ago
Sure there are - this is the point I am making though - I believe it is an error for a Christian to be in a position where they may need to kill - but they are STILL CHRISTIANS. We all fall short of the Glory of God... and there is only one sin I know of that causes true death - blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
christoferL 3 years ago
So a Christian is not supposed to kill but it is ok if they do! That is a interisting school of thought
NONE654258 3 years ago
Who said it was ok if they do? You assume SO much - murder is ALWAYS WRONG>
christoferL 3 years ago
You did "I believe it is an error for a Christian to be in a position where they may need to kill - but they are STILL CHRISTIANS"
NONE654258 3 years ago
No - I said they were Christians despite their error - not that their killing was OK - you are completely misunderstanding so much
christoferL 3 years ago
You see killing as a sin true so according to Paul
What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? So they should quit or leave so they will not be willfully sinning!
NONE654258 3 years ago
Sort of don't but if you do it's fine
NONE654258 3 years ago
Also it says suffer for his sake not just so we can prove how holly we are Paul was fleeing because they sought to kill him for preaching Christ enterily diffrent and does not compare
NONE654258 3 years ago
they do compare - because there were only three actions demonstrated by Christians under persecution in the NT- flee - be imprisoned - or die. Notice FIGHT is not one of the three - and that isn't my OPINION - its fact - and YOU KNOW IT - but you are stiff necked and refuse to acknowledge this.
christoferL 3 years ago
I am correct Paul was fleeing because they sought to kill him for preaching Christ enterily diffrent and does not compare How does that compare to tell someone if someone wishes to kill you just for evil reasons let them
NONE654258 3 years ago
they sought to kill Paul - someone wishes to kill you - the motivation of the killer is irrelevant - the response of the one who is the target is everything - flee or die - those are the two choices given by the New Testament, and YOU KNOW IT.
christoferL 3 years ago
Please share with me where Scripture says "flee or die - those are the two choices given by the New Testament"
NONE654258 3 years ago
It doesn't say it in a single verse- it says it in how we see the actions drawn out - Christians either fleed, allowed themselves to be arrested and imprisoned - or they died - NO WHERE DID THEY EVER FIGHT.
christoferL 3 years ago
By the by I know no such thing! I Know being a soldier to protect others is a honor to help thoose who need help and protection God would agree we are to help thoose in need of protection I assume you know no such thing
NONE654258 3 years ago
Being a soldier to protect others? Justification to kill.
Those in need of protection? How fast you are to hide behind that. I wonder - do you support feeding those who are hungry just as vigorously?
christoferL 3 years ago
Yes in Afrika the only way people get food in villiages or refugee camps is under guard of armed men many whoom have given their lives to do so. As I said you would not understand safe in surbia U.S.
NONE654258 3 years ago
You just don't get it. It has nothing to do where I live or have lived -
christoferL 3 years ago
As I said you would not understand safe in surbia U.S.
NONE654258 3 years ago
A true Solder does not desire to kill but he does not cower from it
NONE654258 3 years ago
a soldier for Christ doesn't kill - let me quote your page - "Christians are to promote peace whenever possible. But they must not be afraid to resort to the use of arms when it is called for. Evil must not be allowed to remain unchecked." Please - back this up with scripture.
christoferL 3 years ago
This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. 13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. 1
NONE654258 3 years ago
I love when people like you use this verse - FIRST - it doesn't say take a life for his friends - it says lay down his life - such as Jesus laid down His life for US - not killing in the name of Jesus - but dying in His name.
christoferL 3 years ago
As I said I know many who have given their life to help feed and protect others
NONE654258 3 years ago
you reply I love when people like you use this verse How can one lay down his life without putting himself in harms way for another
NONE654258 3 years ago
One can put themselves in harms way WITHOUT killing the enemy.
christoferL 3 years ago
"a soldier for Christ" When you seperate the spiritual meaning of this from trying to prove your point you will learn a lot
NONE654258 3 years ago
Yet it was always with the recognition that peace is the goal to be worked for. Peace is the goal, but when it cannot be achieved without force, force must be used.
NONE654258 3 years ago
You can never have peace with blood on your hands. Violence begets violence. In our modern era, Ghandi achieved liberation and peace for an entire country with out force - yet all the blood shed and people in Africa are still killing for peace.
christoferL 3 years ago
Never been to India either I see!
So since it has not yet been accomplished means it is wrong to try?
Imagiane if we applied that thought to everything nothing ever happens!
By the by most of the local tribes are killing for power or just the fact someone belongs to a diffrent one you should go someday. Mabye you will learn something
NONE654258 3 years ago
India is NOT perfect - but it is free of the English rule - and that was accomplished by peaceful demonstrations - not violence. Are you denying what Ghandi accomplished to?
christoferL 3 years ago
At a time when the British empire was in decline Study English history then we will discuss England and its decline no it does not prove your point
NONE654258 3 years ago
Look into 1919 Parliament passed the Government of india Act which was designed to organize provincial governments in india. Both major parties of the british National Government were committed to giving more autonomy to the eleven Indian Provinces through the 1935 Government of india Act.
NONE654258 3 years ago
So Ghandi and his peaceful movement has nothing to do with their independence in your opinion. Ghandi didn't obtain MORE autonomy - he obtained independence.
christoferL 3 years ago
Question America should then still be under British rule because to fight a war for independence would be wrong to you
NONE654258 3 years ago
Yes - we should be - the New Testament tells us NOT to rebel against the authorities - remember?
christoferL 3 years ago
Brother Christofer
Even though Ghandi was a peaceful man, if he left this world rejecting Jesus Christ he will still suffer the same fate as all others who reject Jesus Christ.
He would be cast into the lake of fire.
God bless
Ron
ironcross66106 3 years ago
hmmm - please note - I wasn't claiming Ghandi saved - I was claiming he used PEACE to achieve results - something WAR simply doesn't accomplish.
christoferL 3 years ago
christoferL
I see what your saying.
Brother what Apostle do you remind yourself of?
For myself, I would love to be more like John, but I find I'm more like Peter.
God bless
Ron
ironcross66106 3 years ago
I dunno - if I had to pick I think I'd like to be like John too - but I can say I have been told I am like Paul alot... particularly by people who really know me like my wife. I am told I am much harsher in writing than face to face... but that I am a marshmallow in person. :)
christoferL 3 years ago
You said I wasn't claiming Ghandi saved - I was claiming he used PEACE to achieve results something WAR simply doesn't accomplish. So then WW2 was a waste and acomplished nothing
NONE654258 3 years ago
hahaha - still denying Ghandi;s methods worked - and now you're trying to deflect it with WW2 garbage. All WW2 did was make more war - as in the Cold War... and all the battles within that little game.
christoferL 3 years ago
It really shows a lack of charater to call the WW2 and the Cold war a a GAME I am sure our Jewish brothers don't see WW2 that way or the countries that we're freed when the Berlin wall fell. I really have pity for one who would mwak such a crass comment
NONE654258 3 years ago
Thats all war ever is - a game - but for the record - I didn't call ww2 a game - I called the Cold War a game - and all the battles within it - you see these wars as a battle between good and evil - I see these wars as evil vs evil - conning the good to fight their battles - one way or the other - people are killed - He who lives by the sword dies by the sword...
christoferL 3 years ago
So WW2 was justified then and freeing Eastern Europe from Communisim was not
NONE654258 3 years ago
No - WW2 was more of man's garbage though started by Hitler thats no better... and why do you assume communism is any better than capitalism - neither side favors God - you're arguing for the lesser of two evils - but they are still evil.
christoferL 3 years ago
I was asking you if the cold war freeing people from comunisim was wrong I do not defend communism in any way you should read my Question again!
NONE654258 3 years ago
you really belive that "Thats all war ever is - a game"
NONE654258 3 years ago
yes - its a wicked evil game that does nothing but kill others.
christoferL 3 years ago
You said
" I see these wars as evil vs evil "
So thoose who fought and opposed Hitler to stop him from genocide was IN YOUR STATEMENT EVIL.
And thoose who fought the cold war to free people from communism was IN YOUR WORDS EVIL.
NONE654258 3 years ago
WW2 was NOT fought to stop the holocaust - it was fought because of Hitler invading other countries - and for the US - because Japan bombed Pearl Harbor - what a twist of history -your question based on a false premise I think. Additionally - communism isn't perfect - but its no worse for Christians than Capitalism has been.
christoferL 3 years ago
I will aks what you belive then.
1 Japan bombed Pearl Harbor Americas response was only in your words "evil vs evil"
2 You said communism isn't perfect - but its no worse for Christians than Capitalism has been.
I say you have never set foot in a communist country and made an attempt to spread the Gospel!
NONE654258 3 years ago
1) Jesus teaches turn the other cheek - if I had been President - I would've... did America turn the other cheek?
2) I say you are blind to the corrupted version of the Gospel spread in the West and you ignore the attacks on a human spirit in the capitalist way of life.
christoferL 3 years ago
You say: I say you are blind to the corrupted version of the Gospel spread in the West and you ignore the attacks on a human spirit in the capitalist way of life.
I say you have never set foot in a communist country and made an attempt to spread the Gospel! You have a sanitized american version of The Gospels. Most americans I know who feel their Goverment is so wrong have never lived or experinced another country or culture. And will not they are safe in there.
NONE654258 3 years ago
You're right - never been in a communist country and never spread the Gospel there - and I agree there is a sanitized Gospel in the West - but the word 'sanitized' should be substituted for 'watered down' or 'corrupted'. One such corruptions is the notion of 'Just War' - which wasn't Jesus' teaching - but in fact Augustine of Hippo's (5th century AD). This is a corruption I believe you share with the West and America that you've so dutifully pointed out.
christoferL 3 years ago
So America,England and the allied countries we're as evil as hitler,hirohito and mussolini because they fought aginst evil?
NONE654258 3 years ago
None - the act of killing is evil for any Christian in my opinion - regardless of their nationality
christoferL 3 years ago
Also how has any captialistic country been bad for Christanity?
NONE654258 3 years ago
The very premise of Capitalism - the greed and desire to accumulate wealth -is anti-Christ.
christoferL 3 years ago
Ist you need a working definition "Capitalism is an economic system in which wealth, and the means of producing wealth, are privately owned and controlled rather than publicly or state-owned and controlled"
NONE654258 3 years ago
Ahh -0 the cleaned up version of the definition - which is also anti-Christ... producing wealth privately owned and controlled... NOTHING is OURS - its ALL God's - do you deny this?
christoferL 3 years ago
NOTHING is OURS - its ALL God's - do you deny this? No all that I have is by Gods grace upon me. Do you deny it is wrong to posess wealth?
NONE654258 3 years ago
I still say you have never set foot in a communist country!
The love of money is the root of all evil not possesing it
NONE654258 3 years ago
err - yeah - I said I've never set foot in a communist country either...
christoferL 3 years ago
Now can we leave Gandi alone suprised you used him as he was not a Christian
NONE654258 3 years ago
Ghandi-while not being a Christian - read and loved the New Testament and the teachings of Christ - and he proved that peace works - why should I not turn to one of the few examples of someone actually giving peace a chance?
christoferL 3 years ago
I just find it intersting the only example you could find was a Hindu, AS TO HE READ AND LOVED THE NEW TESTAMENT;
"Hinduism as I know it entirely satisfies my soul, fills my whole being...When doubts haunt me, when disappointments stare me in the face, and when I see not one ray of light on the horizon, I turn to the Bhagavad Gita, and find a verse to comfort me"- Gandhi
NONE654258 3 years ago
sigh - you are so confused, None
christoferL 3 years ago
This is aparent when one recognizes that Scripture is inspired by God (2 Tim. 3:16). This means that the Old Testament is just as inspired as the New Testament and thus an expression of the will of Christ.
The Old Testament acknowledges that there is "a time to kill" (Eccles. 3:3). At various times in the Old Testament, God commanded the Israelites to defend their nation by force of arms.
NONE654258 3 years ago
yes - the time to kill will come- when Jesus returns - He left us with simple teachings to follow that do not include killing.
christoferL 3 years ago
And even you know that is a poor attement to disguise Eccles. 3:3
NONE654258 3 years ago
no - it isn't an attempt to disguise anything - its an honest look at what Jesus commanded. I will address this in the video too - in all fairness.
christoferL 3 years ago
You asked Those in need of protection? How fast you are to hide behind that. I wonder - do you support feeding those who are hungry just as vigorously? I suppose you did not like my answer what have you done to get food to starving people
NONE654258 3 years ago
I have donated money - I have given food - I have volunteered - I do what I can as the Lord gives opportunity - and STILL - you answered nothing - lol.
christoferL 3 years ago
I answered you did not want to here If you serve God you do it when needed not "what I can as the Lord gives opportunity" There is alaways oprotuinty and need
NONE654258 3 years ago
aye - there are always opportunities - but I can't be in all places at all times - and neither can you - thats why it should be a group effort from the entire body of Christ.
christoferL 3 years ago
and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it."
Lost his life for MY SAKE WILL FIND IT Can you say fighting for a right cause might not be for his sake.
NONE654258 3 years ago
I can say that because the fight is God's - we are not called to fight it - we are called to trust HIM - have faith that HE will avenge the wrongs - the WRATH is HIS alone
christoferL 3 years ago
Christ spoke of suffering for his sake> are you saying people who suffer at the hands of evil people who murder, rape, enslave, or steal are suffering for Christ sake and should accept their fate.
NONE654258 3 years ago
Yep - thats exactly what I am saying - because THIS WORLD AIN'T nothing compared to the next - those who suffer for His sake HERE will be rewarded by God for that suffering -
christoferL 3 years ago
Lost his life for MY SAKE WILL FIND IT suffer for HIS SAKE Can you say fighting for a right cause might not be for his sake. And how is random violence his sake?
NONE654258 3 years ago
Random violence is NOT - our response to it IS... see the martyrdom for Stephen to get the point -
christoferL 3 years ago
So your answer is yes
NONE654258 3 years ago
There is no 'right cause' when it comes to fighting - only man's justification to claim it as 'right' -
christoferL 3 years ago
So in your view we should disband all law enforcement and millitary and let people do as they will and suffer quietly that is what God wants?
NONE654258 3 years ago
Stephen's marterdom has nothing to do with what I asked you
NONE654258 3 years ago
We are not to worry about victims just tell them its God's will this bad thing happened sorry
NONE654258 3 years ago
You said those who suffer for His sake HERE will be rewarded by God.
So if someone is raping a woman or trying to murder someone for means of robery or just their own evil amusement you would say accept it do not fight back. So in your view we should disband all law enforcement and millitary and let people do as they will and suffer quietly that is what God wants?
NONE654258 3 years ago
Thats not what I am saying - what I am saying is WE as in Christians have choices - we can run (as Paul did when fleeing from a city seeking his life) or we can allow ourselves to die. The law is governed for the good of the people - but WE as Christians are not called to do anything but follow Him - even if it means suffering as an example of His great mercy.
christoferL 3 years ago
So we are to let sinners or the lost to protect us. A Christian can never defend themslevs or another.
NONE654258 3 years ago
you said we suffered for God as Christians -
Philippians 1
Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake; 30 Having the same conflict which ye saw in me, and now hear to be in me. ( He was speaking to the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi.
NONE654258 3 years ago
Um - yeah - they were also called to suffer for His sake - your point?
christoferL 3 years ago
Suffering for Christ yes suffering simply because someone wants to do you harm Ex. Murder ,Rape is not suffering for " Christs sake"
NONE654258 3 years ago
Um - so when Peter, Paul, and the other Apostles were martyred - they actually fought for their lives instead of what Christian history says - which is they died praying for their enemies? Did Stephen fight for his life? Did Jesus? Hmmmm - you are lacking in any substance in this.
christoferL 3 years ago
They died as marters for their preaching of Christ Again I ask you Suffering for Christ yes suffering simply because someone wants to do you harm Ex. Murder ,Rape is this suffering for " Christs sake"
NONE654258 3 years ago
They died as martyrs? No kidding - so why didn't they fight? Why didn't their followers fight for them? Why didn't their followers fight for themselves? YOU know the answer but refuse it because it means we should NOT be fighting in the flesh. Period.
christoferL 3 years ago
and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it."
Lost his life for MY SAKE WILL FIND IT Can you say fighting for a right cause might not be for his sake.
NONE654258 3 years ago
When you CHOSE to fight and lose your life - you GIVE your life - you are twisting the scriptures just as you did with the Mt 13 parable and have no credibility with it now. Sorry.
christoferL 3 years ago
He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it."
NONE654258 3 years ago
Matthew 10:34-39
Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a mans enemies will be the members of his household.
NONE654258 3 years ago
As to your point "try the fact that there was no such thing as Christians fighting physically until Constantine"
1 Where is this fact proven?
2 You have expressed your non acceptance of Constantine And most all early Church Fathers so you have a bias correct?
3 The Scripture you quote was put in bible form as you read it by Constantine and other Christians leaders at the First Council of Nicaea.
But there stance on just war was wrong? So they we're somewhat correct except what you reject
NONE654258 3 years ago