@Vroom246 i think you should see it as both sides one can not be responsible for all, Stalin is not responsible for all communist or atheists as Mao wasnt, just as the church is not responsible for all of the christians, we have our humanity to blame for are desperate need for power...
The whole formate of this debate is cheesey, lame, the announcer is a loud annoying douche, to the ring, like a fucking boxing match, waste too much time with people walking to the stupid ring, if they go over you have the douche yelling more, with his hair that looks like a bad toupee'.I am sorry but the craig debater is not worthy of debating people of intelligence, explain evil. How do we know what it is, ooo wait its relative, christians killed native americans, enslaved africans, ?evil?
What W.L.C. cannot grasp is individual humans are the ultimate arbiter of what is evil and what is good based upon they're personal preferences and world view, which are themselves primarily culturally derived.
Than there are just Sociopathic people who seem to have something fucked up in the mind. Its like they were born with a lions mentality, people have cats, love their cats but I would debate Cats are evil, they go around killing for pleasure all the time, yet here on Youtube Cats are beloved cute fully things. Yet they are the mass murders of the world average house cat kills 100 different species for only the pleasure of it, and tend to torture whatever it is first. Craig evil is relative
Craig is such a dumb fucking twit. He really does more I think to turn rational people off whatever he is talking about more than anyone. What is evil, hitler is viewed as being evil by us, here today, but to his Nazi party he was a hero, he was purifying the germans, doing noble things blah blah blah. He did it because he was being a good christian, which is the claim of the neo nazi racist christians today. Evil is relative, people who tend to do bad things have fucked up childhoods
@ASexyChef You're right, good and evil are completely relative. I think stupid people like WLC because he uses big words that they don't understand, but when you really listen to what he says it becomes a big joke.
I love how the atheists keep saying "We do have purpose." and the theists keep saying "well, the atheists keep saying there is no purpose." As if you need god to have a purpose, what a sad, primitive way of life.
@KillaKillaKevvy Craig is a horrible debater, he never really does debate, he has this formulate speach were he poses the questions he claims atheists makes, and answers them, and than ignores or walks away from anything an atheist poses. If all you do is pose your own questions and than answer them, your not debating. But these debates are pointless because you can not Debate the Existence of something thats not supposed to exists in the realm of reality we can measure, or study.
@BPMification Craig is a retard, evil is relative, morality is relative, I not seen a debate were the person debating him, goes after him on this claim of evil. Flat out ask the man, is slavery evil, its evil in todays world, so were the prophets in the old testament evil they had slaves, Jefferson or Washington great american figures evil, no ones going to pose they were evil because they will than go to well at the time it was acceptable, well evil is evil, yet christians had slaves.
Why do we care if the universe has a purpose? Why do theists have the audacity to assume that the great cosmic infinity is centered and designed for them, or essentially has a purpose that they approve of? Does the universe have to have a purpose, or can it just be? Why do we ask question the why, because in this instance the why really matters not at all. All we can do is analyze the how, and appreciate the beauty. Neither requires a deity by the way...
The theistic side was childish at best. They didn't get past the emotional argument of purpose, for which they would not take "no" for an answer. Not a very productive debate.
"Agnostic's claim they cannot know one way or the other. Are you an agnostic?"
Semantics. At the end of the day, there isn't a belief in your god. The arbitrary label that you assign to it doesn't change that fact, or the nature of that disbelief.
There is a cute irony in how you insist that people abide by your description of atheism, as opposed to their self-described definition. We call that a strawman.
Where do you think they get the idea of nothingness? It is based on death. To them, death is the end of all things. If death turns us into nothing, then nothing really is. this is where atheists draw their arguments.
it is not stupid. They dont have to clearly say it. Just by listen what they say on their arguments, I am able to pretty much see the reason why they try to disprove God. Death is an issue for them.
What frustate atheists is a mere fact the death exists. they want to live forever. but why do they want to live forever if they belief they are nothing and nothing exists? why do they want to live for nothing?
@37thecrusader Actually I've never met an atheist who said they wanted to live forever, the idea is quite stupid if one spends even a moment to think about it. Now I have met those who've mused on the relative joys of living a thousand or a million plus years but eternity would bring inevitable boredom. You seem to be projecting your own beliefs onto others; existence is valuable because it is limited, all religions seem to be childlike efforts to avoid the responsibility of dealing with death.
I simply do not understand how people can value evidence solely obtained from speculative reasoning ( William Lane Craig) over logical reasoning via empirical evidence (Dawkins).
can william craig pull his bible out of his righteous bull shit ass and use common sense for once. cause its wedged up his ass so much all i can hear is random holy shit
A man without God has his fate left for another man to decide. Another man cannot save you from death. God can. Hear the voice of the Catholic Church. the Voice in the wilderness calling all into repentance.
@37thecrusader So what you're saying is that a man who doesn't believe in an invisible, angry, giant that lives in another dimension and does magic tricks, like knocking up Palestinian virgins, will have to pay attention to other human beings and won't be zapped into the big playpen in the sky? Even worse, that man won't be able to hear the catholic church?! Oh no! I've always wanted to have a pedophile in a dress whisper sternly at me to repent after I masturbate; I should convert right now!
What people miss is that God is not angry with those who are humble and do not refuse to know their Creator. Because He is Good, He gets angry with those who are against HIm. wouldn't you be angry with those who difame and tell lies about you?
God is justice also. He will avenge those who come against you unjustly. Who dont want to love a God who acts with justice?
@37thecrusader Actually what people miss is that god is not angry because god is fictional. Now if god did exist (he doesn't) and was as wise or good as you bunch insist, he'd never get angry with anyone. People have told lies about and defamed me but one my best days I was not angry with those who had wronged me, the god you propose, apparently can't do better or be a better person than a fourteen year old living in the 90's.
As Christian values are removed more and more from our society, the overall morality of our society will follow suit. Whether or not God exists or religion holds any truth, a lack of consequences will allow for a degradation of the morality of the masses.
@circleofconfusion9 woah, I am open minded about a lot of things, but to say that animals are moral is extremely far-fetched. Give me a few examples and I might accpet that. As for morality before the bible, there were many other religions long before the bible was ever written. It's a common misconception for the mind to drift toward Christianity every time religion is mentioned, but to think that it was the first is far from true.
And what's with the question marks ending your comments?
True. But that doesn't prove God doesn't exist. Since the point is the laws of morality exist because God exist.Therefore, if God has always been, so have the laws of morality always been. And that would mean before religions.
Sure it does. because the only proof you have God exists is from a guy that died 2 thousand years ago, and the bible wasn't written until 60-70 years after his death?
Thats not even evidence? I gave you evidence of morality
I'm not religious, and I never read the bible or even knew what the 10 commandments where until I was in my mid 20s
@ReachDeep1 If I punch you, I can be prosecuted. This is actually in my self-interest as well as yours: neither of us wants to be punched. This is how we spool up ethics and morals in the absence of a Daddy-god telling us what to do. The golden rule doesn't actually contain the word God, and doesn't need one. Neither does the rule of law (that rules are for everyone). I want to live in a world where people practice kindness toward one another, therefore I practice kindness.
So, Dawkins' brain has not a purpose to think? He is absolutely not so dumb as to think there is no God. He is just being evil, brainwashing young people because he hates religion and God.
@rockgirl0007 If Dawkins' has the purpose to think, then what is God's purpose to put so much effort to hide him/herself so much that nothing is left of him/her to prove its existence? Can't God stand up without the help of his followers? Is it in God's plan for Dawkins' to be "evil?" How does that even make sense? If God is good, then whence comes evil?
@rockgirl0007 I am not trying to be like the "madman with the lantern...", but just someone who is trying to see why you would brand a good man as "evil." Has he killed people, and murdered innocent children? No. Some of us do not need a God to find the way to goodness and love. Telling me to imagine a kingdom with a loving God is pure fantasizing to me, I'm sorry. Even if we don't believe in God, if good people went to hell for not doing God's will, then how is God loving?
@BPMification God is not hiding. Don't be like the "madman with the lantern...." But the way to find Him is goodness and love. He helps us all the way. You have no idea, what a loving God he is if He wants his creatures to live in his kingdom and live forever with God? Imagine that. It's not God's plan that Dawkins is evil, he is just using his freedom, the free will. Evil is only when we don't do God's will. (Sorry for my English)
@Ronniecob40 "I guess if the so called facts you are referencing are acurate, then that statment would be true". Looks like faithfully "believing" all those ridiculous Bible stories is your only "sure way" of "knowing" God exists.
What are you, 5? We Europeans outgrow fairy tales by the time our baby teeth fall out. That's when YOU still believed in the Tooth Fairie...and Santa Claus. When did YOU outgrow those lies? You believe AND perputuate belief in LIES. That's pathtic and idiotic!
It appears that an Atheist argument against the existence of God primarily involves a hatred of religion, a dislike of a God in religion, or a promotion of the negative impact of religion in society.
@RedStarBelgradefan There is. Atheists, when presented with proof, just deny it's a valid form of proof. For example, there are three standards of proof: logical, scientific and ethical. You cannot prove ethical and logical truths scientifically, nor visa versa. But non convertibility isn't evidence of invalidity. Atheists demand only one kind of proof: scientific, and reject logical proofs. And that's where God's proofs are strongest.
@Imperativism said "And that's where God's proofs are strongest." ie NOT VERIFIABLE. Why not have your "god" actually appear on Earth, like he supposedly did to stupefied peasants thousands of years ago? Oh of course you wouldn't need "faith" then would you?
St Claus represents a man who did exist. Just because you cannot see, it doesnt mean, it doesnt exist. that is where atheists lose. To atheist I dont exist because they cannot see me.
@37thecrusader if you think that the universe that has hundreds of billions of planets with hundreds of billions of galaxies with hundreds of billions of stras you are the one thats important then you are the one who is wrong, everything points to the conclusion that your god does not exist
@37thecrusader if you think that the universe that has hundreds of billions of planets with hundreds of billions of galaxies with hundreds of billions of stras you are the one thats important then you are the one who is wrong, everything points to the conclusion that your god does not exist
@37thecrusader if you think that the universe that has hundreds of billions of planets with hundreds of billions of galaxies with hundreds of billions of stras you are the one thats important then you are the one who is wrong, everything points to the conclusion that your god does not exist
@37thecrusader wow, you're dealing some powerful dumb. Things not seen are confirmed to exist all the time, but if something is not in any way measured then no reasonable person can say it exists, you can be measured by way of youtube comments, ergo you exist. Believers claim that god can't be measured, which means that a responsible person will throw the idea of god right into the garbage.
To a Catholic there are two witnesses. One confirms the other. Reason and Faith are given to us by God to be used. Atheists accept reason and reject Faith. How are they to accept anything which are of Faith? they can't.
True. But has anyone made a case that Santa Clause is real? Are have societies ALWAYS claim, or understood, he is a fictional character.
If anyone has a STRONG case Santa Clause exists outside of TV, films, and costumes, I would like to hear it.
However, William Craig makes a STRONG case that God dose exist. I have always been intrigue at the case naturalists/atheists have made, but I can not accept that nothing can create something.
@jwrsob william craig gives no evidence for a god, he just talks, something as complicated as god could not have been there forever by it self, it had to have simple beginings, you say that nothing cant create something, who created god then?
@jwrsob read the books from lawrence kraus in which he explains how universe could come from literally nothing, scientists know better then me, and you can talk all day that concept of god is not complicated, if something can read your mind answer your prayers punish you and reward you forever it is complicated
@animeisadrugx How about this? The Anthropic Principle in science. Physicists discovered that the laws of nature are so perfectly balanced that ANY change in them makes life in the cosmos IMPOSSIBLE. The odds of this happening by chance are 1 in 10 to the 500th power. For example, if the strong force in an atom were any stronger, stable galaxies therefore planets on which to evolve cannot exist. If it were any weaker, stars couldn't form and therefore life could not evolve. Google it.
It always seems like the religious side doesn't even hear the side of reason. They aren't even arguing the points. They just spout out religious nonsense.
It appears an Atheist's argument against the existence of God, isn't does He exist, but there is a dislike IF He does exist.
Many atheist demonstrate through their dislike of religion (or negative impacts resulting through or in religion) reasons why a God should/would not exist.
I can not say this provides strong evidence a God does not exist.
It appears an Atheist's argument against the existence of God, isn't does He exist, but there is a dislike IF He does exist.
Many atheist demonstrate through their dislike of religion (or negative impacts resulting through or in religion) reasons why a God should/would not exist.
I can not say this provides strong evidence a God does not exist
@CoolGuy18201 because "why" easily leads to an infinite regress, like a little kid who asks his father "why" after every question his father answers. the kid can do this over and over, but it's annoying, leads nowhere, achieves nothing, serves no intellectual purpose and hence: "silly".
@lederereddy Man has the same common ancestor as the chimpanzee. I would not engage with a chimp in the way you describe because we are not the same species. What exactly was the point of that comment? What "falsified information" are you referencing? Are you telling me that homo-sapiens are not apes? That is, an imperfect evolved primate species. Look, if you're going to do the creationist dance, I don't want to hear it. Flat earth believers aren't to be taken seriously, nor are creationists.
@McLarenF1God What comment are you referring to? Flat earth creationists? There's no such thing. Creationists aren't concerned about what people take seriously. They are concerned about what science teaches us about its creator. Your only problem, while you're pounding out the steps that end at the place you will die, is realizing what life's really about and who you're going to give an account to when it ends. Apes don't have mans conscience because they're just animals.
@lederereddy why on earth did evolution waste a mind on you.. you are the smallest ripple on the largest pond you can imagine. you will die just like every other life form that has had the luck to have existed. you will not be taken to task by ghosts of any description. to think otherwise is a total waste of time... but you know this because... that mind evolution wasted on you works. you will come to it sooner or later.
@wondergundy "that mind evolution wasted on you works. you will come to it sooner or later."
Actually, Your statement is a terminal contradiction. You are making evolution out to be God, someone who could waste something on someone. It's a telling statement, indeedy ;) Has there been wasted lives? Wasted lives would not be the product of a subjective reality. But they would be the product an objective reality. Wasted, finite lives? What could it mean, eternally?
@lederereddy I'm saying that belief in a flat-earth is just as ridiculous as belief in creationism. You don't buy the former, yet the latter is perfectly rational to you? Human beings are part of the animal kingdom. Everything you've said is without evidence and specific to one religion. As if the probability of any one religion being true wasn't low enough, the odds that your religion specifically is the only true one is even more unlikely.
@McLarenF1God Animals aren't made in the image of their creator. They're exempt of reason because there's nothing for them to reason about. Where'd you leave your conscience? Go back and get it at all cost, friend. God doesn't take atheists seriously. He doesn't take them at all.
@lederereddy Thats funny. Because last time I checked the human body isn't so perfect. Blind spot in both of your eyes, while reptiles don't have blind spots. An extra organ. Do you honestly believe that the human race has existed for over 100,000 years just for you christians to be "saved"? and everyone is doomed? Some "god"... shows how ignorant you are.. Read up on some hitchens before he comes back from the dead and hitchslaps you
@lederereddy Excuse me? Look, if you're not going to use facts, then we're done here. Everything you've stated is a faith claim. This is white noise. It's my fault for trying to have this discussion on Youtube instead of Reddit.
@McLarenF1God "Excuse me? Look, if you're not going to use facts, then we're done here."
It's a fact that you and I along with several billion other souls abide right here, right now. With that in mind, we cannot venture too far from this planet without great expense and imminent danger. We know that because we are limited to what we can do, how we live, procreate, how long we live, etc. These are specific facts! We can't do what God's done and create our own rules, can we!
@McLarenF1 All these rules that none of us can overcome because of the preset designs of life are evidence that lead right back to the origin of life itself. You don't see it. But not because it's not there! You reject every stitch of legitimate evidence God, in fact, has left for us. How then can you be saved? He calls and you've already decided He doesn't exist. A doubting Thomas is in a far superior place than a total rejection Thomas. You'll lose by default, worse yet, forfeit!
@McLarenF1God Fact: You were not always alive! Fact: you were made alive in your mothers womb but not by your mother or your father. Fact: You will not always be alive! Fact: you do not know what awaits you postmortem. Fact: You knew the difference between right and wrong. Fact: you chose to do wrong Fact: If God Exists and He is just, you will pay for your sins. Fact: Jesus can save you from what you know is true. Fact: You could be passed your time by now, facing eternity alone.
@lederereddy Ok, so Fact you by your logic would say, if Hitler after killing the millions of people he did, and him being a christian and thus believing in Jesus prayed for forgiveness would get into heaven, but all the Jewish people he murdered would still be in hell for denying Jesus. So Fact, the God you believe in is not the one I would ever want to pray too, Fact stop trying to use bullying bullshit christian, well what if it were true. I am an atheist either but Fuck off, with this!
@lederereddy This is the tired ass pastcals wager, how about this for Fact, Jesus never said he was god ever in the Bible, FACT! Jesus never said anything about the Trinity in the Bible, Fact. Almost all the times Jesus references himself as son of God or God being his father, he than tells his followers God is their his father. Fact the trinity is a the construct and Dogma created centuries after Jesus Death. Jesus tells you, your deeds matter but nothing about believing he is God.
Craig has a nasty habit of demanding that the very disbelief of his god claims be proven. He also makes nonsensical statements like: "if atheism is true, then ....."
Craig's slithery debate tact is worn out and transparent. He's mastered the art of toying with terms and definitions. He is the most intellectually dishonest debator on these issues.
one possible argument for proof of creator is that if we're constantly finding the latest origin of the universe. like a function with a limit surely we will do this to infinity and thus eventually once that infinity is over have an answer.
No, Dr. Craig, if there is anything more to the universe than the events that will eventually lead to its impending heat death, then it is up to you to provide the evidence for it. It is not up to your opposition to disprove it.
even if craig is right when he says you cannot live perfectly or with good motivation without believing in god. that doesn't mean you should believe in what isn't true just for that purpose surely.
maybe when they find out whether the universe will inevitably collapse on itself or not that would be proof of intelligent designer. as no inteligent designer would design something to break. even that's quite a weak argument as it might not be unintelligent for it to break. there's no such things as intelligence when related to the universe.
@nocontrol06 I believe you have just committed the logical fallacy of attacking the person. Perhaps I wasn't clear, but I don't affirm that murder ever would be morally right. I was only trying to draw out the extreme logical steps of the evolutionary worldview. May Christ bless you my friend. Good Day.
@LifeBloodMinistries - Your moral compass is already skewed if you do not even recognize the source of morality, which has absolutely nothing to do with religion and has everything to do with scientifically studied psychology.
@nocontrol06 continued Surely you don't believe that truth and or morality is relative? If this is the case, then it doesn't matter if we cause someone pain. So what? Who cares? Who determines what is right or wrong? Public opinion? What if the public decides that it is morally right and pleasing to condone murder? Is that no longer objectively morally wrong? My point is that there is no standard to judge moral issues in an evolutionary worldview. The claims of morality are totally empty.
@LifeBloodMinistries close to being a theist???? you are the dumbest mother fucker ive ever talked to. i just fucking told u where morality comes from are u that fucking retarded?? and how insulting to say
"then it doesn't matter if we cause someone pain. So what? Who cares? Who determines what is right or wrong? Public opinion? What if the public decides that it is morally right and pleasing to condone murder?"
if u cant figure it out on ur own not to murder someone then YOU ARE A PSYCHOPATH
@LifeBloodMinistries@LifeBloodMinistries You're questions are not difficult to answer. Philosophers have been creating moral standards for 2000 years. Read Aristotle, Bentham, Mills, Rawls, etc. The difference is that Philosophers base their morality on reason, while the religious base it on their interpretation of scribbling in an old book. This is why religious morality has been such a confused disaster.
@nocontrol06 continued if evolution is true and we are the results of cosmic chaos, then who cares whether there is good or bad? How can we from this position even claim that good and evil exist? There is no standard by which to judge what is evil. For evil to be, there must be an objective pure perfect standard by which to measure morality from which it has departed. Otherwise pouring hot oil over the head of a child is no more wrong than cannibalism in a nonwestern culture.....
@LifeBloodMinistries You obviously no nothing about biology and altruism. The entire 2 paragraphs of yours that I just read are completely illogical. Go read a biology book. Evolution is a fact. The only thing theoretical about it is Natural Selection, which will never be dis proven. Ignorance is an excuse, stupidity is not.
@nocontrol06 I make one last appeal to you to explain how natural selection a purely physical force void of intelligent being can be the author of the nonphysical. We have made progress towards your becoming a theist though as you have affirmed objective moral truth. Now all that needs to take place is to come to the realization that apart from a transcendent moral agent there is no reason to believe anything is wrong. If evolution/ true, we are simply behaving genes void of a moral compass.
@nocontrol06 How boiling hot oil on your stove top and then pouring it over the head of a child? Is it evil or simply not beneficial to the passing on of genetic information because one person can no longer pass on their DNA? How about Hitlers belief that Jews were genetically inferior? Was the Holocaust evil? He was trying to advance humanity. things of this sort are what I am asking. I don't condone any of these by the way. Because they are objectively wrong.
@LifeBloodMinistries every example you gave relates to the basic natural morals that have been instilled in us through natural selection. If a mother pours hot oil over her childs head it is morally wrong cause it causes pain to another human being. Any action which harms any living being is wrong. If the majority of humans condoned genocide, child abuse, or rape, we would be extinct by now. It is only a small minority that commit such crimes. and the ones that due are sick or god told them to
@LifeBloodMinistries I would not say prostitution is morally wrong. Some women need money to feed there kids and some men are very lonely and are in need of female comfort. I would advise people to do this at there own risk tho because with these actions come consequences like STDs and Drug use.
An example of an action in the above situation being morally wrong would be if a customer had an STD and failed to notify the prostitute. That would be harmfull and thus morally wrong.
@nocontrol06 I am speaking of heinous morally deplete actions such as 9/11 which Bin Laden admitted was politically motivated. Berrnie Madeoff is a good examle, is his theft evil or just not beneficial for the advancement of the human race? How about prostitution is simply undesirable or is it morally wrong? It is hard to object that in some cases the species isn't advanced in this case as some children are born through this act. But is it morally wrong even though it might advance humanity?...
Perhaps a quote from Will Provine(a well known atheist) might help solidify the argument. "Let me summarize my views on what modern evolutionary biology tells us loud and clear makes clear... There is no ultimate foundation for ETHICS, no ultimate meaning to life, and NO FREE-WILL either." If this is true then there is no evil, only ppl acting in accord with their genetics. Can we really deny the existence of evil? I think not, but from his own mouth Provine communicate an absence of evil.
@LifeBloodMinistries what do you mean by evil, if you are reffering to the devil then no its does not exist. I want you to be more specific on what evil is, and what is morally wrong
@nocontrol06 Hello again:) I didn't disregard what was said, and I completely understand the argument that put forth. It is precisely because I understand the argument that I can see how it fails logically to believe that a purely physical explanation of existence fails to explain the reality of nonphysical realities such as mathematics, logic, personhood, the conscience that experiences guilt even when we know we have gotten away with it, all evolution can HOPE to explain is the physical...
@nocontrol06 a naturalistic worldview cannot account for such nonphysical realities and yet it presupposes them in order to operate. Theism really is the most logical option, 4 it can account 4 them.
@LifeBloodMinistries it is almost like..... you disregarded every word i said..... I just told you where are morals come from and you dont seem to get it
@nocontrol06, but this only adds to my case that there are nonphysical realities that we affirm and live by, such as values ex. honesty in research, laws of logic, & a uniform nature 4 experiments.
@nocontrol06 my friend, i hope u realize that by implying logic u are grasping at that which is not physical. I affirm logic and reason, these are presuppositions that even scientist must affirm, ...
@nocontrol06 but we know intuitively that such a statement is REALLY wrong. That is the point. it not like choosing your favorite ice cream flavor. There really are actions that are morally wrong.
@nocontrol06... insufficient to produce objective moral truth. Otherwise, someone could argue that they are trying to ensure the survival of humanity by raping a woman, to pass on their genes...
@nocontrol06 my previous statement as well is directed to the same. It is because He does exist that we have a moral foundation. Apart from his existence, all the chem in the world is in sufficient.
@Vroom246 i think you should see it as both sides one can not be responsible for all, Stalin is not responsible for all communist or atheists as Mao wasnt, just as the church is not responsible for all of the christians, we have our humanity to blame for are desperate need for power...
sicakes 11 minutes ago
The whole formate of this debate is cheesey, lame, the announcer is a loud annoying douche, to the ring, like a fucking boxing match, waste too much time with people walking to the stupid ring, if they go over you have the douche yelling more, with his hair that looks like a bad toupee'.I am sorry but the craig debater is not worthy of debating people of intelligence, explain evil. How do we know what it is, ooo wait its relative, christians killed native americans, enslaved africans, ?evil?
ASexyChef 28 minutes ago
What W.L.C. cannot grasp is individual humans are the ultimate arbiter of what is evil and what is good based upon they're personal preferences and world view, which are themselves primarily culturally derived.
TomVodkaCollins 1 hour ago
@sicakes haha, I think you sent this comment to me accidentally, so i won't reply to it, if not then tell me
scienceevolution94 1 hour ago
@scienceevolution94 what did i send to you i forgot...
sicakes 8 minutes ago
Great Craig. Dawkins is a idiot.
StephenDeMille 2 hours ago
@StephenDeMille The scientist out of the two is "a idiot" he says.
CountLorcean 1 hour ago
@StephenDeMille an* idiot. lol
yamenhawit 10 minutes ago
Than there are just Sociopathic people who seem to have something fucked up in the mind. Its like they were born with a lions mentality, people have cats, love their cats but I would debate Cats are evil, they go around killing for pleasure all the time, yet here on Youtube Cats are beloved cute fully things. Yet they are the mass murders of the world average house cat kills 100 different species for only the pleasure of it, and tend to torture whatever it is first. Craig evil is relative
ASexyChef 2 hours ago
Craig is such a dumb fucking twit. He really does more I think to turn rational people off whatever he is talking about more than anyone. What is evil, hitler is viewed as being evil by us, here today, but to his Nazi party he was a hero, he was purifying the germans, doing noble things blah blah blah. He did it because he was being a good christian, which is the claim of the neo nazi racist christians today. Evil is relative, people who tend to do bad things have fucked up childhoods
ASexyChef 2 hours ago
@ASexyChef You're right, good and evil are completely relative. I think stupid people like WLC because he uses big words that they don't understand, but when you really listen to what he says it becomes a big joke.
KillaKillaKevvy 2 hours ago
42:38 Michio Kaku....forever alone
MrHelviti 6 hours ago
37:45-38:20 WINNING
LohenArc 7 hours ago
@LohenArc LOSING! Religion never pretends to answer physics questions. Again and again he is just talking nonsense. :)
rockgirl0007 2 hours ago
Everybody wanna be a philosopher but dont wanna use their brain.
MrWasapenis 9 hours ago
Why does Dr. Dawkins sound like he has a lisp in this?
Surya112 14 hours ago
I love how the atheists keep saying "We do have purpose." and the theists keep saying "well, the atheists keep saying there is no purpose." As if you need god to have a purpose, what a sad, primitive way of life.
KillaKillaKevvy 15 hours ago
@KillaKillaKevvy Craig is a horrible debater, he never really does debate, he has this formulate speach were he poses the questions he claims atheists makes, and answers them, and than ignores or walks away from anything an atheist poses. If all you do is pose your own questions and than answer them, your not debating. But these debates are pointless because you can not Debate the Existence of something thats not supposed to exists in the realm of reality we can measure, or study.
ASexyChef 2 hours ago
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@BPMification Craig is a retard, evil is relative, morality is relative, I not seen a debate were the person debating him, goes after him on this claim of evil. Flat out ask the man, is slavery evil, its evil in todays world, so were the prophets in the old testament evil they had slaves, Jefferson or Washington great american figures evil, no ones going to pose they were evil because they will than go to well at the time it was acceptable, well evil is evil, yet christians had slaves.
ASexyChef 2 hours ago
Why do we care if the universe has a purpose? Why do theists have the audacity to assume that the great cosmic infinity is centered and designed for them, or essentially has a purpose that they approve of? Does the universe have to have a purpose, or can it just be? Why do we ask question the why, because in this instance the why really matters not at all. All we can do is analyze the how, and appreciate the beauty. Neither requires a deity by the way...
PercussiveAndy 18 hours ago
The theistic side was childish at best. They didn't get past the emotional argument of purpose, for which they would not take "no" for an answer. Not a very productive debate.
debenni 18 hours ago
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lederereddy 23 hours ago
@lederereddy
"Agnostic's claim they cannot know one way or the other. Are you an agnostic?"
Semantics. At the end of the day, there isn't a belief in your god. The arbitrary label that you assign to it doesn't change that fact, or the nature of that disbelief.
There is a cute irony in how you insist that people abide by your description of atheism, as opposed to their self-described definition. We call that a strawman.
Mathenaut 23 hours ago
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lederereddy 23 hours ago
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lederereddy 1 day ago
Where do you think they get the idea of nothingness? It is based on death. To them, death is the end of all things. If death turns us into nothing, then nothing really is. this is where atheists draw their arguments.
37thecrusader 1 day ago
it is not stupid. They dont have to clearly say it. Just by listen what they say on their arguments, I am able to pretty much see the reason why they try to disprove God. Death is an issue for them.
37thecrusader 1 day ago
What frustate atheists is a mere fact the death exists. they want to live forever. but why do they want to live forever if they belief they are nothing and nothing exists? why do they want to live for nothing?
37thecrusader 1 day ago
@37thecrusader Actually I've never met an atheist who said they wanted to live forever, the idea is quite stupid if one spends even a moment to think about it. Now I have met those who've mused on the relative joys of living a thousand or a million plus years but eternity would bring inevitable boredom. You seem to be projecting your own beliefs onto others; existence is valuable because it is limited, all religions seem to be childlike efforts to avoid the responsibility of dealing with death.
SagaciousNJ 1 day ago
Good fucking God, this moderator was pushy as hell.
Cyllid 1 day ago 4
It was really annoying how they cut off the physicists, especially the physicist who was explaining super-symmetry.
hubomba 1 day ago in playlist Favorite videos
I simply do not understand how people can value evidence solely obtained from speculative reasoning ( William Lane Craig) over logical reasoning via empirical evidence (Dawkins).
hubomba 1 day ago in playlist Favorite videos
@hubomba
What evidence? if atheists says that nothing is what we have?
37thecrusader 1 day ago
can william craig pull his bible out of his righteous bull shit ass and use common sense for once. cause its wedged up his ass so much all i can hear is random holy shit
Bigguy0Bigfun 1 day ago
@Bigguy0Bigfun Be careful,the hatred will destroy you sooner or later. William Lane Craig was the star of the night. :D
rockgirl0007 1 day ago
@Bigguy0Bigfun
A man without God has his fate left for another man to decide. Another man cannot save you from death. God can. Hear the voice of the Catholic Church. the Voice in the wilderness calling all into repentance.
37thecrusader 1 day ago
@37thecrusader So what you're saying is that a man who doesn't believe in an invisible, angry, giant that lives in another dimension and does magic tricks, like knocking up Palestinian virgins, will have to pay attention to other human beings and won't be zapped into the big playpen in the sky? Even worse, that man won't be able to hear the catholic church?! Oh no! I've always wanted to have a pedophile in a dress whisper sternly at me to repent after I masturbate; I should convert right now!
SagaciousNJ 1 day ago
@SagaciousNJ
What people miss is that God is not angry with those who are humble and do not refuse to know their Creator. Because He is Good, He gets angry with those who are against HIm. wouldn't you be angry with those who difame and tell lies about you?
God is justice also. He will avenge those who come against you unjustly. Who dont want to love a God who acts with justice?
37thecrusader 1 day ago
@37thecrusader Actually what people miss is that god is not angry because god is fictional. Now if god did exist (he doesn't) and was as wise or good as you bunch insist, he'd never get angry with anyone. People have told lies about and defamed me but one my best days I was not angry with those who had wronged me, the god you propose, apparently can't do better or be a better person than a fourteen year old living in the 90's.
SagaciousNJ 1 day ago
@SagaciousNJ
This is a perfect example of a person who loves the gifts more than he loves the giver.
37thecrusader 1 day ago
@SagaciousNJ
I meant to say, here is someone who focus on the gifts but refuse to recognize the giver.
37thecrusader 1 day ago
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jwrsob 1 day ago
As Christian values are removed more and more from our society, the overall morality of our society will follow suit. Whether or not God exists or religion holds any truth, a lack of consequences will allow for a degradation of the morality of the masses.
ReachDeep1 1 day ago
@ReachDeep1
morals existed long before any religion?
circleofconfusion9 1 day ago
@circleofconfusion9 Are you sure about that?
ReachDeep1 1 day ago
@ReachDeep1 there's evidence of morals in society before the bible, and we see morality among animals who have no religion?
circleofconfusion9 1 day ago
@circleofconfusion9 woah, I am open minded about a lot of things, but to say that animals are moral is extremely far-fetched. Give me a few examples and I might accpet that. As for morality before the bible, there were many other religions long before the bible was ever written. It's a common misconception for the mind to drift toward Christianity every time religion is mentioned, but to think that it was the first is far from true.
And what's with the question marks ending your comments?
ReachDeep1 1 day ago
@ReachDeep1
we can observe morals among apes. How they share food, and help one another with no reward
also Dogs have morals with there masters, and other Dogs
Theres lots of storys of Dogs saving the lives of other dogs, and there masters
As for the question marks. that's just poor grammar
circleofconfusion9 1 day ago
@circleofconfusion9
True. But that doesn't prove God doesn't exist. Since the point is the laws of morality exist because God exist.Therefore, if God has always been, so have the laws of morality always been. And that would mean before religions.
jwrsob 1 day ago
@jwrsob
Sure it does. because the only proof you have God exists is from a guy that died 2 thousand years ago, and the bible wasn't written until 60-70 years after his death?
Thats not even evidence? I gave you evidence of morality
I'm not religious, and I never read the bible or even knew what the 10 commandments where until I was in my mid 20s
And I always had morals.
circleofconfusion9 16 hours ago
@ReachDeep1 If I punch you, I can be prosecuted. This is actually in my self-interest as well as yours: neither of us wants to be punched. This is how we spool up ethics and morals in the absence of a Daddy-god telling us what to do. The golden rule doesn't actually contain the word God, and doesn't need one. Neither does the rule of law (that rules are for everyone). I want to live in a world where people practice kindness toward one another, therefore I practice kindness.
Why is this hard?
ChollieD 1 day ago
So, Dawkins' brain has not a purpose to think? He is absolutely not so dumb as to think there is no God. He is just being evil, brainwashing young people because he hates religion and God.
rockgirl0007 2 days ago
@rockgirl0007 You're a fucking idiot. Please jump out of a moving car.
Assdafflabaff 2 days ago
@rockgirl0007 he is to smart to believe in god
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@RedStarBelgradefan Not really. Why questions are very important for a sane person. But he is not such a real man as one day to accept he was wrong.
rockgirl0007 1 day ago
@rockgirl0007 you can not prove that he is wrong you can just talk
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@RedStarBelgradefan Of course I can just talk, but doing so I can say the truth.
rockgirl0007 1 day ago
@rockgirl0007 he would say that he is wrong as soon as he sees some evidence for a god, i would too
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@rockgirl0007 brainwashing wtf he is the leader in telling people to think for themselves
lasvagasboy 1 day ago
@rockgirl0007 If Dawkins' has the purpose to think, then what is God's purpose to put so much effort to hide him/herself so much that nothing is left of him/her to prove its existence? Can't God stand up without the help of his followers? Is it in God's plan for Dawkins' to be "evil?" How does that even make sense? If God is good, then whence comes evil?
BPMification 15 hours ago
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rockgirl0007 1 hour ago
@rockgirl0007 I am not trying to be like the "madman with the lantern...", but just someone who is trying to see why you would brand a good man as "evil." Has he killed people, and murdered innocent children? No. Some of us do not need a God to find the way to goodness and love. Telling me to imagine a kingdom with a loving God is pure fantasizing to me, I'm sorry. Even if we don't believe in God, if good people went to hell for not doing God's will, then how is God loving?
BPMification 28 minutes ago
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@BPMification God is not hiding. Don't be like the "madman with the lantern...." But the way to find Him is goodness and love. He helps us all the way. You have no idea, what a loving God he is if He wants his creatures to live in his kingdom and live forever with God? Imagine that. It's not God's plan that Dawkins is evil, he is just using his freedom, the free will. Evil is only when we don't do God's will. (Sorry for my English)
rockgirl0007 1 hour ago
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@Ronniecob40 "I guess if the so called facts you are referencing are acurate, then that statment would be true". Looks like faithfully "believing" all those ridiculous Bible stories is your only "sure way" of "knowing" God exists.
What are you, 5? We Europeans outgrow fairy tales by the time our baby teeth fall out. That's when YOU still believed in the Tooth Fairie...and Santa Claus. When did YOU outgrow those lies? You believe AND perputuate belief in LIES. That's pathtic and idiotic!
thursdaysrecords1 2 days ago
So, let me save you 1:43:28 of your life. The question, as it turns out, is unanswerable. Bummer. Well, back to the UFO vids...
fillyfresh 2 days ago
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fillyfresh 2 days ago
its a far cry from the breezy halls of oxford...
fillyfresh 2 days ago
and that guy is on loads of ufo videos..
fillyfresh 2 days ago
Its in foreign
fillyfresh 2 days ago
It appears that an Atheist argument against the existence of God primarily involves a hatred of religion, a dislike of a God in religion, or a promotion of the negative impact of religion in society.
jwrsob 2 days ago
@jwrsob yep I recon you are right there.
fillyfresh 2 days ago
@jwrsob no, atheist argument is that there not a single evidence suporting the existence of any god
RedStarBelgradefan 2 days ago
@RedStarBelgradefan There is. Atheists, when presented with proof, just deny it's a valid form of proof. For example, there are three standards of proof: logical, scientific and ethical. You cannot prove ethical and logical truths scientifically, nor visa versa. But non convertibility isn't evidence of invalidity. Atheists demand only one kind of proof: scientific, and reject logical proofs. And that's where God's proofs are strongest.
Imperativism 2 days ago
@Imperativism said "And that's where God's proofs are strongest." ie NOT VERIFIABLE. Why not have your "god" actually appear on Earth, like he supposedly did to stupefied peasants thousands of years ago? Oh of course you wouldn't need "faith" then would you?
lewisner 2 days ago
@Imperativism you have no evidence, talking with get you nowhere
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@RedStarBelgradefan and they're right... there isn't. Can you show me evidence?
Dagvalda 2 days ago
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@RedStarBelgradefan and they're right... there isn't. Can you show me evidence?
Dagvalda 2 days ago
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jwrsob 1 day ago
@jwrsob you cant prove that santa claus is not real, it does not mean he is there
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago 5
@RedStarBelgradefan
St Claus represents a man who did exist. Just because you cannot see, it doesnt mean, it doesnt exist. that is where atheists lose. To atheist I dont exist because they cannot see me.
37thecrusader 1 day ago
@37thecrusader if you think that the universe that has hundreds of billions of planets with hundreds of billions of galaxies with hundreds of billions of stras you are the one thats important then you are the one who is wrong, everything points to the conclusion that your god does not exist
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
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@37thecrusader if you think that the universe that has hundreds of billions of planets with hundreds of billions of galaxies with hundreds of billions of stras you are the one thats important then you are the one who is wrong, everything points to the conclusion that your god does not exist
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
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@37thecrusader if you think that the universe that has hundreds of billions of planets with hundreds of billions of galaxies with hundreds of billions of stras you are the one thats important then you are the one who is wrong, everything points to the conclusion that your god does not exist
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@37thecrusader wow, you're dealing some powerful dumb. Things not seen are confirmed to exist all the time, but if something is not in any way measured then no reasonable person can say it exists, you can be measured by way of youtube comments, ergo you exist. Believers claim that god can't be measured, which means that a responsible person will throw the idea of god right into the garbage.
SagaciousNJ 1 day ago
@SagaciousNJ
To a Catholic there are two witnesses. One confirms the other. Reason and Faith are given to us by God to be used. Atheists accept reason and reject Faith. How are they to accept anything which are of Faith? they can't.
37thecrusader 1 day ago
@RedStarBelgradefan
True. But has anyone made a case that Santa Clause is real? Are have societies ALWAYS claim, or understood, he is a fictional character.
If anyone has a STRONG case Santa Clause exists outside of TV, films, and costumes, I would like to hear it.
However, William Craig makes a STRONG case that God dose exist. I have always been intrigue at the case naturalists/atheists have made, but I can not accept that nothing can create something.
jwrsob 1 day ago
@jwrsob william craig gives no evidence for a god, he just talks, something as complicated as god could not have been there forever by it self, it had to have simple beginings, you say that nothing cant create something, who created god then?
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@RedStarBelgradefan
The concept of God is not complicated to everyone.
And before we tackle who created God, demonstrate other than the Big Bang, an event in which nothing created something?
jwrsob 1 day ago
@jwrsob read the books from lawrence kraus in which he explains how universe could come from literally nothing, scientists know better then me, and you can talk all day that concept of god is not complicated, if something can read your mind answer your prayers punish you and reward you forever it is complicated
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@RedStarBelgradefan
Well, I will just leave you with the last response, because most of us know this topic is almost an endless debate.
And I will read Kraus' book.
jwrsob 1 day ago
@jwrsob ok :)
RedStarBelgradefan 1 day ago
@jwrsob Na man,i wish there was a god,there's just no good reason to think there is one.
animeisadrugx 2 days ago
@animeisadrugx How about this? The Anthropic Principle in science. Physicists discovered that the laws of nature are so perfectly balanced that ANY change in them makes life in the cosmos IMPOSSIBLE. The odds of this happening by chance are 1 in 10 to the 500th power. For example, if the strong force in an atom were any stronger, stable galaxies therefore planets on which to evolve cannot exist. If it were any weaker, stars couldn't form and therefore life could not evolve. Google it.
Imperativism 2 days ago
@Imperativism so what if it's that improbable... it happened. And if it didn't, we wouldn't know any better... so what's your point?
Dagvalda 2 days ago
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jwrsob 1 day ago
It always seems like the religious side doesn't even hear the side of reason. They aren't even arguing the points. They just spout out religious nonsense.
Einsteinian99 2 days ago
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jwrsob 2 days ago
Whos side is mr kaku on? The athiest or the thiest?
SudanCarib 2 days ago
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It appears an Atheist's argument against the existence of God, isn't does He exist, but there is a dislike IF He does exist.
Many atheist demonstrate through their dislike of religion (or negative impacts resulting through or in religion) reasons why a God should/would not exist.
I can not say this provides strong evidence a God does not exist.
jwrsob 2 days ago
The structure of this debate:
Coherent arguement
Unfounded babble
Coherent arguement
Unfounded babble
etc....
Polymerabbit 3 days ago
there is a purpose, to be a speaker for existence itself
Redeemer216 3 days ago
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It appears an Atheist's argument against the existence of God, isn't does He exist, but there is a dislike IF He does exist.
Many atheist demonstrate through their dislike of religion (or negative impacts resulting through or in religion) reasons why a God should/would not exist.
I can not say this provides strong evidence a God does not exist
jwrsob 3 days ago
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jwrsob 3 days ago
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jwrsob 3 days ago
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jwrsob 3 days ago
Why is "why" a silly question? That shows me that you don't have a good answer.
CoolGuy18201 3 days ago
@CoolGuy18201 Because it assumes that there is a reason. You might ask "how", but "why" implies reasoning. Why is sphere round?
gellendar420 3 days ago
@CoolGuy18201 because "why" easily leads to an infinite regress, like a little kid who asks his father "why" after every question his father answers. the kid can do this over and over, but it's annoying, leads nowhere, achieves nothing, serves no intellectual purpose and hence: "silly".
bunkopaniczny 3 days ago
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TakeItBySurprise 3 days ago
@lederereddy Man has the same common ancestor as the chimpanzee. I would not engage with a chimp in the way you describe because we are not the same species. What exactly was the point of that comment? What "falsified information" are you referencing? Are you telling me that homo-sapiens are not apes? That is, an imperfect evolved primate species. Look, if you're going to do the creationist dance, I don't want to hear it. Flat earth believers aren't to be taken seriously, nor are creationists.
McLarenF1God 3 days ago
@McLarenF1God What comment are you referring to? Flat earth creationists? There's no such thing. Creationists aren't concerned about what people take seriously. They are concerned about what science teaches us about its creator. Your only problem, while you're pounding out the steps that end at the place you will die, is realizing what life's really about and who you're going to give an account to when it ends. Apes don't have mans conscience because they're just animals.
lederereddy 3 days ago
@lederereddy why on earth did evolution waste a mind on you.. you are the smallest ripple on the largest pond you can imagine. you will die just like every other life form that has had the luck to have existed. you will not be taken to task by ghosts of any description. to think otherwise is a total waste of time... but you know this because... that mind evolution wasted on you works. you will come to it sooner or later.
wondergundy 3 days ago
@wondergundy "that mind evolution wasted on you works. you will come to it sooner or later."
Actually, Your statement is a terminal contradiction. You are making evolution out to be God, someone who could waste something on someone. It's a telling statement, indeedy ;) Has there been wasted lives? Wasted lives would not be the product of a subjective reality. But they would be the product an objective reality. Wasted, finite lives? What could it mean, eternally?
lederereddy 3 days ago
@lederereddy I'm saying that belief in a flat-earth is just as ridiculous as belief in creationism. You don't buy the former, yet the latter is perfectly rational to you? Human beings are part of the animal kingdom. Everything you've said is without evidence and specific to one religion. As if the probability of any one religion being true wasn't low enough, the odds that your religion specifically is the only true one is even more unlikely.
McLarenF1God 3 days ago
@McLarenF1God Animals aren't made in the image of their creator. They're exempt of reason because there's nothing for them to reason about. Where'd you leave your conscience? Go back and get it at all cost, friend. God doesn't take atheists seriously. He doesn't take them at all.
lederereddy 3 days ago
@lederereddy Thats funny. Because last time I checked the human body isn't so perfect. Blind spot in both of your eyes, while reptiles don't have blind spots. An extra organ. Do you honestly believe that the human race has existed for over 100,000 years just for you christians to be "saved"? and everyone is doomed? Some "god"... shows how ignorant you are.. Read up on some hitchens before he comes back from the dead and hitchslaps you
Nick54783 3 days ago
@lederereddy Excuse me? Look, if you're not going to use facts, then we're done here. Everything you've stated is a faith claim. This is white noise. It's my fault for trying to have this discussion on Youtube instead of Reddit.
Peace out bro.
McLarenF1God 2 days ago
@McLarenF1God "Excuse me? Look, if you're not going to use facts, then we're done here."
It's a fact that you and I along with several billion other souls abide right here, right now. With that in mind, we cannot venture too far from this planet without great expense and imminent danger. We know that because we are limited to what we can do, how we live, procreate, how long we live, etc. These are specific facts! We can't do what God's done and create our own rules, can we!
lederereddy 12 hours ago
@McLarenF1 All these rules that none of us can overcome because of the preset designs of life are evidence that lead right back to the origin of life itself. You don't see it. But not because it's not there! You reject every stitch of legitimate evidence God, in fact, has left for us. How then can you be saved? He calls and you've already decided He doesn't exist. A doubting Thomas is in a far superior place than a total rejection Thomas. You'll lose by default, worse yet, forfeit!
lederereddy 12 hours ago
@McLarenF1God Fact: You were not always alive! Fact: you were made alive in your mothers womb but not by your mother or your father. Fact: You will not always be alive! Fact: you do not know what awaits you postmortem. Fact: You knew the difference between right and wrong. Fact: you chose to do wrong Fact: If God Exists and He is just, you will pay for your sins. Fact: Jesus can save you from what you know is true. Fact: You could be passed your time by now, facing eternity alone.
lederereddy 12 hours ago
@lederereddy Ok, so Fact you by your logic would say, if Hitler after killing the millions of people he did, and him being a christian and thus believing in Jesus prayed for forgiveness would get into heaven, but all the Jewish people he murdered would still be in hell for denying Jesus. So Fact, the God you believe in is not the one I would ever want to pray too, Fact stop trying to use bullying bullshit christian, well what if it were true. I am an atheist either but Fuck off, with this!
ASexyChef 2 hours ago
@lederereddy This is the tired ass pastcals wager, how about this for Fact, Jesus never said he was god ever in the Bible, FACT! Jesus never said anything about the Trinity in the Bible, Fact. Almost all the times Jesus references himself as son of God or God being his father, he than tells his followers God is their his father. Fact the trinity is a the construct and Dogma created centuries after Jesus Death. Jesus tells you, your deeds matter but nothing about believing he is God.
ASexyChef 2 hours ago
Did Mr Kaku speak ?
esraretin 3 days ago
@esraretin Yes. Kaku speaks. ~1:06:00
TakeItBySurprise 3 days ago
title is wrong but it's why i clicked it.
TheStfu1000 3 days ago
fuckin time nazi in the house
MrTwelveoclock 3 days ago
Craig has a nasty habit of demanding that the very disbelief of his god claims be proven. He also makes nonsensical statements like: "if atheism is true, then ....."
Craig's slithery debate tact is worn out and transparent. He's mastered the art of toying with terms and definitions. He is the most intellectually dishonest debator on these issues.
MrKeenoRossi 3 days ago
one possible argument for proof of creator is that if we're constantly finding the latest origin of the universe. like a function with a limit surely we will do this to infinity and thus eventually once that infinity is over have an answer.
TheStfu1000 3 days ago
@TheStfu1000 and that's along the same lines as what michio kaku said at the end.
TheStfu1000 3 days ago
No, Dr. Craig, if there is anything more to the universe than the events that will eventually lead to its impending heat death, then it is up to you to provide the evidence for it. It is not up to your opposition to disprove it.
MrKeenoRossi 3 days ago
even if craig is right when he says you cannot live perfectly or with good motivation without believing in god. that doesn't mean you should believe in what isn't true just for that purpose surely.
TheStfu1000 3 days ago
maybe when they find out whether the universe will inevitably collapse on itself or not that would be proof of intelligent designer. as no inteligent designer would design something to break. even that's quite a weak argument as it might not be unintelligent for it to break. there's no such things as intelligence when related to the universe.
TheStfu1000 4 days ago
'we'll never figure it out. it's about god'. well if you say you can't figure it out, then don't put a name and an explanation on it then!
daveeeed 4 days ago
Esto donde fue y cuando??? es muy bueno !! =D
GuzzMetall 4 days ago
the universe will die a cold death...
daranik 4 days ago
Wow. 19:35, Lame Craig gasping for air. He is scared.
agentssith 4 days ago
William Lane Craig talks nonsense and does not offer facts, just keeps using the word purpose.
NickPaulOates 4 days ago
Craig's logic is a mere tool to satisfy his "Christian" perspective on world. He TALKS A LOT but all he says are bullshit.
ThisIDIsTheLongestID 4 days ago
Atheist and proud!
whitefire1997 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 I believe you have just committed the logical fallacy of attacking the person. Perhaps I wasn't clear, but I don't affirm that murder ever would be morally right. I was only trying to draw out the extreme logical steps of the evolutionary worldview. May Christ bless you my friend. Good Day.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries I do not have the patience Mr Hitchens or Mr Dawkins has
nocontrol06 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries - Your moral compass is already skewed if you do not even recognize the source of morality, which has absolutely nothing to do with religion and has everything to do with scientifically studied psychology.
Critic863 4 days ago
Go Dr William Craig! lolz
SudanCarib 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 continued Surely you don't believe that truth and or morality is relative? If this is the case, then it doesn't matter if we cause someone pain. So what? Who cares? Who determines what is right or wrong? Public opinion? What if the public decides that it is morally right and pleasing to condone murder? Is that no longer objectively morally wrong? My point is that there is no standard to judge moral issues in an evolutionary worldview. The claims of morality are totally empty.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries close to being a theist???? you are the dumbest mother fucker ive ever talked to. i just fucking told u where morality comes from are u that fucking retarded?? and how insulting to say
"then it doesn't matter if we cause someone pain. So what? Who cares? Who determines what is right or wrong? Public opinion? What if the public decides that it is morally right and pleasing to condone murder?"
if u cant figure it out on ur own not to murder someone then YOU ARE A PSYCHOPATH
nocontrol06 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries @LifeBloodMinistries You're questions are not difficult to answer. Philosophers have been creating moral standards for 2000 years. Read Aristotle, Bentham, Mills, Rawls, etc. The difference is that Philosophers base their morality on reason, while the religious base it on their interpretation of scribbling in an old book. This is why religious morality has been such a confused disaster.
chansetwo 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries I'll challenge your success at reasoning with nocontroll against mine with this bag of potatoes... And you will lose.
Prayer and an extensive, severe, consistent, long term dose of harsh reality, comparable to Auschwitz, could get you a distant second.
His soul, being well worth the effort! Gods speed, to you!... Haha!!! If I can get saved anyone can.
lederereddy 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 continued if evolution is true and we are the results of cosmic chaos, then who cares whether there is good or bad? How can we from this position even claim that good and evil exist? There is no standard by which to judge what is evil. For evil to be, there must be an objective pure perfect standard by which to measure morality from which it has departed. Otherwise pouring hot oil over the head of a child is no more wrong than cannibalism in a nonwestern culture.....
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries You obviously no nothing about biology and altruism. The entire 2 paragraphs of yours that I just read are completely illogical. Go read a biology book. Evolution is a fact. The only thing theoretical about it is Natural Selection, which will never be dis proven. Ignorance is an excuse, stupidity is not.
ironlung1028 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 I make one last appeal to you to explain how natural selection a purely physical force void of intelligent being can be the author of the nonphysical. We have made progress towards your becoming a theist though as you have affirmed objective moral truth. Now all that needs to take place is to come to the realization that apart from a transcendent moral agent there is no reason to believe anything is wrong. If evolution/ true, we are simply behaving genes void of a moral compass.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 How boiling hot oil on your stove top and then pouring it over the head of a child? Is it evil or simply not beneficial to the passing on of genetic information because one person can no longer pass on their DNA? How about Hitlers belief that Jews were genetically inferior? Was the Holocaust evil? He was trying to advance humanity. things of this sort are what I am asking. I don't condone any of these by the way. Because they are objectively wrong.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries every example you gave relates to the basic natural morals that have been instilled in us through natural selection. If a mother pours hot oil over her childs head it is morally wrong cause it causes pain to another human being. Any action which harms any living being is wrong. If the majority of humans condoned genocide, child abuse, or rape, we would be extinct by now. It is only a small minority that commit such crimes. and the ones that due are sick or god told them to
nocontrol06 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries I would not say prostitution is morally wrong. Some women need money to feed there kids and some men are very lonely and are in need of female comfort. I would advise people to do this at there own risk tho because with these actions come consequences like STDs and Drug use.
An example of an action in the above situation being morally wrong would be if a customer had an STD and failed to notify the prostitute. That would be harmfull and thus morally wrong.
nocontrol06 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 I am speaking of heinous morally deplete actions such as 9/11 which Bin Laden admitted was politically motivated. Berrnie Madeoff is a good examle, is his theft evil or just not beneficial for the advancement of the human race? How about prostitution is simply undesirable or is it morally wrong? It is hard to object that in some cases the species isn't advanced in this case as some children are born through this act. But is it morally wrong even though it might advance humanity?...
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
my previous comment is intended @nocontrol06
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
Perhaps a quote from Will Provine(a well known atheist) might help solidify the argument. "Let me summarize my views on what modern evolutionary biology tells us loud and clear makes clear... There is no ultimate foundation for ETHICS, no ultimate meaning to life, and NO FREE-WILL either." If this is true then there is no evil, only ppl acting in accord with their genetics. Can we really deny the existence of evil? I think not, but from his own mouth Provine communicate an absence of evil.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries what do you mean by evil, if you are reffering to the devil then no its does not exist. I want you to be more specific on what evil is, and what is morally wrong
nocontrol06 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 Hello again:) I didn't disregard what was said, and I completely understand the argument that put forth. It is precisely because I understand the argument that I can see how it fails logically to believe that a purely physical explanation of existence fails to explain the reality of nonphysical realities such as mathematics, logic, personhood, the conscience that experiences guilt even when we know we have gotten away with it, all evolution can HOPE to explain is the physical...
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 a naturalistic worldview cannot account for such nonphysical realities and yet it presupposes them in order to operate. Theism really is the most logical option, 4 it can account 4 them.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@LifeBloodMinistries it is almost like..... you disregarded every word i said..... I just told you where are morals come from and you dont seem to get it
nocontrol06 4 days ago
@nocontrol06, but this only adds to my case that there are nonphysical realities that we affirm and live by, such as values ex. honesty in research, laws of logic, & a uniform nature 4 experiments.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 my friend, i hope u realize that by implying logic u are grasping at that which is not physical. I affirm logic and reason, these are presuppositions that even scientist must affirm, ...
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 but we know intuitively that such a statement is REALLY wrong. That is the point. it not like choosing your favorite ice cream flavor. There really are actions that are morally wrong.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@nocontrol06... insufficient to produce objective moral truth. Otherwise, someone could argue that they are trying to ensure the survival of humanity by raping a woman, to pass on their genes...
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago
@nocontrol06 my previous statement as well is directed to the same. It is because He does exist that we have a moral foundation. Apart from his existence, all the chem in the world is in sufficient.
LifeBloodMinistries 4 days ago