Freedomain Radio: To Whom Does God Speak?

[sswildthing2]

Good video

[esalian9]

Don't worry. The tablet gets easier.

[barrywilliamsmb]

I find these conversations very interesting and pertinent to my continuous learning.

And while another commenter may be right in saying your view is not new, it's new to me so keep it up!

[WorBlux]

#2 was joshua

[Bound4NH]

Great. A proselytizing atheist, out to convince the world of The Truth.

(To be honest I don't know if Stephan is an atheist, because I can't make it through more than a couple of minutes of his droning and rambling. It's like social commentary by Hugh Grant, but without the concise clarity of thought.)

Honestly... if someone isn't trying to force their religion on you, why expend so much time trying to convince them their religion is bogus?

[davidngo4415]

because Faith is a disease which destroys the mind. and the individual rational mind is the only thing which prevents the death and carnage caused by collective faith and irrational dogma.

[WorBlux]

Illusion is a tyrant.

[celticlord88]

he is an atheist

[motokeiru]

The problem is that people try to force religion to others they always have.

Religion is like a poison that tricks people to belive in something that isn't real and make people ignorant and fear a god so they can control them.

[gnu11111]

All those arguments about what people said or not said some 5000 years ago... why not focus at the miracles of our times? Disappearing planes, invisible underground headquarters of terrorist organisations, spontaneously collapsing buildings, untraceable weapons of mass destruction... isn't that by far more interesting?

[Bluedragon094]

exactly what's so... supernatural about any of that? None of that constitues as something supernatural or a miracle.

[gnu11111]

I compare it in terms of the "bullshit-factor", and that one's about the same for invisible super-beings and invisible weapons and planes. And there's nothing revolutionary in Stefan's views about religion, it's more or less mainstream in the western world (except for the US maybe). Why fight a battle that is already won? Was there no Age of Enlightenment outside Europe?

[Bluedragon094]

oh... dur dur dur... i totally get it now. Yeah a lot of that is pretty out there. I think most rational thinking people would've gotten the hint that somethings up once the weapons of mass destruction weren't there, but who really didn't see that one coming? Afterall, it's not like Iraq was where Osama was supposed to be. Ah well... that's war and politics for ya.

[adorianvlad]

Still another issue...religion seems to be a way to provide adults as well as children with the "invitation to an improved morality".

What would replace religion, on a global scale, such a "practical invitation"? The education in schools, obviously. Nonetheless, it seems that economically speaking its easier to build a church than to build a school. So is it a better choice to refuse religion to those that don't receive other forms of education? I would say no. There are rich, and poor people.

[t3z2pulm]

What if the standard of perfect behavior for salvation is one of those pieces of information that degrades from the original message?

What if the reason God only speaks to the top person is NOT that He chooses to approach only that person, but rather, God is content to sit back and watch unless asked to intervene, and very few people are able to initiate and effectively channel the contact?

[adorianvlad]

Yeah, that's the ideea t3z2, in most revelations in all religions.

However, it seems to be limited to the very few(the masters, that will share with the profans), according to the folk literature.

Another issue I see about religions, is that the belief itself seems to rather "provide" a "protective shield" from the evil, than to offer the benefits of good.

So, in practical terms, religions seem to be situated around the edge between the good and evil. Now what is good and what is evil?

[t3z2pulm]

Personally I lean towards the idea that good and evil are entirely subjective concepts.

[adorianvlad]

t3z2, wikipedia doesn't seem to clarify this issue of good and evil; in my opinion, one particularity is to consider the emotional intelligence in regard to it. For example, someone sensitive enough would consider picking a flower from a meadow to be "evil" while for others cannibalism seems to (at least in the past in some primitive cultures) be O.K.

Perhaps there is an evolutionary process regarding good and evil, as well.

As humans evolve, their intelligence (emotional, etc) increases

[adorianvlad]

I've got a question regarding religion; in which situation would a greater number of people become "better people then they were"( I mean here more charitable and all the rest of it), if those ppl. were convinced to join a particular religion and thus do good in the name of God, or when they were convinced that morality is good for humanity? P.S. To make my point stronger, I suggest you see this:

watch?v=G5OvBzAItc4 chinese ppl killing using concrete chunks hitting in the head and other body

[adorianvlad]

"than they were" sp.

continuation... parts of some poor folks, the thieves that were stealing a fruit or a cable from the killers, as told by the author taiwanesemobster of the video titled: "

China's Untold Stories - pt. 3" here at youtube, again the link watch?v=G5OvBzAItc4

[GregIsLegend]

Great video

[GregIsLegend]

They're both bloody and primitive.

[MarshalltheArtist]

Jews used to have an impeccable oral tradition.

Chickens CAN fly (before their wings are clipped).

Otherwise, good vid. 4 stars.

[GregIsLegend]

It's more like hovering

[MarshalltheArtist]

Yeah, well, can you hover, Greg? Can you?

[GregIsLegend]

...no....:(

[ehsanul]

lol, spikebravo, that is also irrelevant to the content of my message, but.. If you are truthful, then bring forth your proof. :)

[Zukaros]

great excellency!

[LumpyRevolution]

how I choose to understand my religion is completely different than the next guy. I like it that way and I don't want anyone up my waszoo about how I practice and I have not much to say about anyone else's beliefs either. Live and let live is a motto I like to try to practice. Thanks for letting me rant. I admire your search for answers!

[ehsanul]

Great argument stefbot, and of course they make great sense when applied to the "scheme of God" you put forward. But I can't help but notice that these arguments don't undermine Islam's "scheme", due firstly to the existence of the Qur'an, and then the fact that it is stated that a man is judged only by what he knows, and is not accountable for that he has no control over. I realize your argument is meant for Christianity, but you seemed to indicate that it was a general problem with religion.

[stefbot]

Do mean that Islam has no commandments that came from Mohammed?

[ehsanul]

Not exactly, that's not my point. One of my points is that the existence of the Qur'an, which is supposed to be the direct speech of God to man (when it says "I" or "We", it's God speaking, and when it says "you", it's referring to the reader), precludes your argument in the first place, for it does not require that God's message be repeated from generation to generation, with the gradual degradation. I'm sure this has happened in history, but the Qur'an is not subject to that, at least not yet.

[stefbot]

But - who wrote down the Koran? Was it never translated? Can it not be misinterpreted? Are there no different schools of Islam? What if a Muslim doesn't speak ancient Arabic?

Thanks! :)

[ehsanul]

If for any of the reasons mentioned, a misunderstanding is made on the part of the Muslim, then he is judged accordingly. One is only condemned after he has full well understood what Islam is and then rejects it. And if the message of Islam fails to reach a man somehow, he is not condemned for not following Islam, and his judgement is solely according to what he does know. So it's not as if God expects one to be fully aware of everything when it's clearly not possible for some people.

[ehsanul]

If for any of the reasons mentioned, a misunderstanding is made on the part of the Muslim, then he is judged accordingly. One is only condemned after he has full well understood what Islam is and then rejects it. And if the message of Islam fails to reach a man somehow, he is not condemned for not following Islam, and his judgement is solely according to what he does know. So it's not as if God expects one to be fully aware of everything when it's clearly not possible for some people.

[VCADD]

how conveniant,you mean some people like infidels

[ehsanul]

Excuse me, I don't think I understood exactly what you meant VCADD. Were you refuting anything I've said?

[VCADD]

for one to full well understand Islam or any religion is insanity.

[stefbot]

I see - so when God says that the punishment for apostasy is murder, once you understand that, you must kill anyone who speaks against islam? But if you don't understand that, you do not have to kill other people? Is that right?

Thanks!

[ehsanul]

Quite funny, you fail on one argument, so you have to make some other sort of attack instead of admitting so? In fact, there's no proper evidence that taking the life of apostates is actually part of Islam. It's a red herring in any case. With regards to the subject of this video, your argument does not hold with respect to Islam, and you have proven it with this last comment, making one of the usual attacks on Islam rather than addressing my point. In any case, a good day to you. :)

[NeonKnight88]

There is no definition of god. But the god of christians doesnt exist, nor does the god of any other organized fundamental religi9on.

[lizonya7]

My church talks about the "Living God", so now, everyone can communicate with the almighty.

[D4Shawn]

That's a pretty rad way to make a video. I'm sure it'll catch on.

[qtronman]

I like the idea of the whiteboard. Very nice.

[VCADD]

mistranslation,dont get me started.Very well covered by Sitchin.

[HC4D]

I loved the arguments being presentented in the video. I got the arguments, but the technology seemed a tad too distracting. Visuals are great, but perhaps using this technology would be better served for a different kind of topic? That's just me though.

[AnarchyInYourHead]

I think you should take over my cartoon website! :)

[marjan15]

No, God is morality.

[sidewaysdragon]

marjan15

well you have me convinced. well maybe if you subtract the comma.

[Nasikabatrachus]

Then why don't you just call it morality instead of "god"?

[marjan15]

No one read Nietzsche here?